| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: Add paste service https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/798400 | 00:07 |
|---|---|---|
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: Add opendev paste server https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/799736 | 00:26 |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/system-config master: Add infra-service-deploy-paste to deploy pipeline https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800579 | 01:27 |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/zone-opendev.org master: paste: add missing trailing dot for acme https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/800586 | 03:21 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/zone-opendev.org master: paste: add missing trailing dot for acme https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/800586 | 03:33 |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/system-config master: lodgeit: add robots.txt https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800587 | 04:16 |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/system-config master: lodgeit: add robots.txt https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800587 | 04:17 |
| *** ykarel|away is now known as ykarel | 04:27 | |
| *** bhagyashris_ is now known as bhagyashris|ruck | 05:25 | |
| *** ysandeep|away is now known as ysandeep | 05:27 | |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/system-config master: lodgeit: add robots.txt https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800587 | 06:31 |
| *** amoralej|off is now known as amoralej | 06:51 | |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/system-config master: lodgeit: add robots.txt https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800587 | 07:11 |
| *** ysandeep is now known as ysandeep|lunch | 07:34 | |
| *** rpittau|afk is now known as rpittau | 07:39 | |
| *** ykarel is now known as ykarel|lunch | 08:47 | |
| *** ysandeep|lunch is now known as ysandeep | 08:54 | |
| *** dmellado_ is now known as dmellado | 09:25 | |
| *** ykarel|lunch is now known as ykarel | 10:11 | |
| *** dviroel|out is now known as dviroel | 11:20 | |
| *** amoralej is now known as amoralej|lunch | 12:19 | |
| opendevreview | Ronelle Landy proposed zuul/zuul-jobs master: DNM - Testing rpm update from compose - iptables https://review.opendev.org/c/zuul/zuul-jobs/+/800629 | 12:39 |
| *** ricolin_ is now known as ricolin | 12:48 | |
| *** amoralej|lunch is now known as amoralej | 13:13 | |
| *** ysandeep is now known as ysandeep|away | 14:23 | |
| *** ykarel is now known as ykarel|away | 14:24 | |
| opendevreview | Ronelle Landy proposed zuul/zuul-jobs master: DNM - Testing rpm update from compose - iptables https://review.opendev.org/c/zuul/zuul-jobs/+/800629 | 15:16 |
| *** mgoddard- is now known as mgoddard | 15:27 | |
| clarkb | efoley: not sure if you saw https://bugs.chromium.org/p/gerrit/issues/detail?id=14776 but I think I narrowed down the root cause of being able to move your openid from an old account to a new account in the gerrit code | 15:29 |
| clarkb | efoley: doesn't help us fix it, but good to undertand it for the future I guess. Also ianw seemed happy to try the fixup in the downtime. I'm hoping to test that on the server we've staged up in the next day or two. Then hopefully you can test a login on that server and make sure it all looks good (I'll check in tomorrow with an update) | 15:30 |
| efoley | clarkb: ack, thanks for the update | 15:35 |
| *** marios is now known as marios|out | 16:02 | |
| *** rpittau is now known as rpittau|afk | 16:23 | |
| *** amoralej is now known as amoralej|off | 16:30 | |
| clarkb | corvus: hi | 17:15 |
| corvus | clarkb: o/ | 17:15 |
| clarkb | corvus: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/gerrit-upgrade-2021 is the planning doc | 17:15 |
| corvus | clarkb: is the idea to make #13 work? | 17:17 |
| clarkb | corvus: yes | 17:17 |
| clarkb | I think we can change that to be while zuul is off, force merge the dns update change in review02, then manually pull and run the playbook on bridge | 17:17 |
| corvus | clarkb: yeah, there's so much that's happening while zuul is off anyway, that doesn't seem a big deal to me | 17:18 |
| corvus | that also means you can discard steps 10 and 12 | 17:18 |
| clarkb | this is definitely a source of awkwardness. we ran into similar chicken and egg issues when upgrading the zuul schedluer itself | 17:19 |
| corvus | clarkb: can you be more specific? | 17:19 |
| corvus | i'm not sure how the gerrit connection configuration relates to upgrading the zuul scheduler | 17:20 |
| clarkb | corvus: specifically needing a working zuul system to update zuul and dns. Working zuul system may not be the case without first updating zuul and dns | 17:20 |
| clarkb | not the gerrit connection config. But coordinating changes in the system when the system depends on itself | 17:20 |
| clarkb | ianw was trying to use an escape hatch for that in this case. Unfortunately, that doesn't do what we expected for depends-on | 17:21 |
| corvus | clarkb: i believe you could perform a zero-downtime move of gerrit if gerrit were an HA system | 17:21 |
| corvus | and i believe gerrit can be run in that manner, but we haven't invested in doing so | 17:22 |
| corvus | in such a circumstance, it's understandable that there will be some thing we can't do without downtime | 17:22 |
| corvus | as for upgrading the zuul scheduler, that's specifically what the 5.0 work is about. when we reach 5.0, we should be able to do similar work on zuul without any downtime or awkwardness. | 17:23 |
| clarkb | I don't think downtime is the issue as much as needing to make manual changes | 17:23 |
| corvus | clarkb: they are equivalent in this case | 17:23 |
| corvus | feel free to s/downtime/manual changes/ in my text and i think it still applies | 17:23 |
| clarkb | in any case updating zuul to do what we'd like here and reverting both require we restart zuul. In that case I think reverting wins since we should be able to workaround it manually as mentioned previously | 17:24 |
| tosky | out of curiosity: if in the meantime I change the patch to Depends-On on the gerrit ID, like back in the days, shouldn't that work? | 17:24 |
| clarkb | Unless you feel really strongly about wanting to update zuul then we could do that | 17:24 |
| corvus | clarkb: i don't think it's worth updating zuul | 17:24 |
| corvus | it appears to require a very minor change in the plan to run the dns change manually (along with all the other stuff that's done manually) | 17:25 |
| corvus | clarkb: you doing a revert commit? | 17:27 |
| opendevreview | Clark Boylan proposed opendev/system-config master: Talk to review.o.o instead of review01.o.o https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800694 | 17:29 |
| clarkb | corvus: yup sorry | 17:29 |
| clarkb | I think we don't want a full revert because the way the ssh known_hosts are set up now is good? Just need to revert the config connection setting I think | 17:29 |
| corvus | clarkb: yep, that's what i was thinking too. +3 | 17:31 |
| opendevreview | Clark Boylan proposed opendev/system-config master: Add warning to inventory about zuul gerrit server config https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800699 | 17:34 |
| clarkb | That is a followup to add a warning in the code to hopefully avoid this in the future. | 17:34 |
| clarkb | "good" news is that we can restart with the fix for that elif conditional in the zuul that produces a bunch of unwanted logging :) | 17:34 |
| clarkb | should we do something like #status notice Depends-On using https://review.opendev.org are currently not working. This was due to a config change in Zuul that we are reverting and will be restarting Zuul to pick up. | 17:39 |
| corvus | clarkb: i think that's a good idea | 17:39 |
| clarkb | #status notice Depends-On using https://review.opendev.org URLs are currently not working. This was due to a config change in Zuul that we are reverting and will be restarting Zuul to pick up. | 17:40 |
| opendevstatus | clarkb: sending notice | 17:40 |
| -opendevstatus- NOTICE: Depends-On using https://review.opendev.org URLs are currently not working. This was due to a config change in Zuul that we are reverting and will be restarting Zuul to pick up. | 17:40 | |
| clarkb | tosky: I expect that will workaroudn this for you, but I hope we'll get zuul restarted more quickly than a round trip of your tempest jobs :) | 17:43 |
| clarkb | I'm going to take a break while we wait for that revert to merge. Back in a bit and can do zuul restart then prep for the meeting | 17:46 |
| *** zbr is now known as Guest681 | 17:50 | |
| opendevreview | Vishal Manchanda proposed opendev/puppet-translation_checksite master: Remove 'django_openstack_auth' reference from ``local.conf.erb`` https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/puppet-translation_checksite/+/800702 | 17:55 |
| opendevreview | Clark Boylan proposed opendev/zone-opendev.org master: Reduce review.o.o TTL to 300 seconds https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/800705 | 18:09 |
| clarkb | previously ^ wasn't important but I think it is now | 18:09 |
| tosky | clarkb: eheh, right, thanks, it's better to wait | 18:44 |
| tosky | and thanks clarkb and corvus for the prompt investigation and (soon) resolution | 18:44 |
| clarkb | the change should be merging soon (it is in the gate) then we wait for the deployment playbook to run then we can do a restart | 18:46 |
| clarkb | hopefully by the time the infra meeting is over we'll be in a good spot to restart | 18:46 |
| ianw | ... interesting. that's a side-effect i hadn't considered :/ | 18:58 |
| clarkb | ya I dind't think of it either | 18:58 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: Talk to review.o.o instead of review01.o.o https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800694 | 19:10 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/zone-opendev.org master: Reduce review.o.o TTL to 300 seconds https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/800705 | 19:20 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: Add warning to inventory about zuul gerrit server config https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800699 | 19:21 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: lodgeit: add robots.txt https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800587 | 19:36 |
| opendevreview | Merged opendev/system-config master: Add infra-service-deploy-paste to deploy pipeline https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800579 | 19:36 |
| clarkb | corvus: ianw: the zuul deploy job for https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/800694 is yet to even start but it looks like the hourly job just finished for zuul and I think that actually pulled in current master and updated teh config for us | 19:42 |
| clarkb | it also looks like we haev up to date images on zuul02.o.o. Does anyone else want to verify the config and the images and then I can save queues, stop zuul, start zuul, restore queues? | 19:44 |
| corvus | clarkb: confirmed zuul.conf looks good | 19:44 |
| corvus | clarkb: i find it easier to just run the pull playbook; it takes seconds | 19:45 |
| corvus | (and can be run before starting the restart playbook) | 19:45 |
| clarkb | corvus: ok I'll do that | 19:45 |
| ianw | lgtm too | 19:45 |
| clarkb | pull completed successfully | 19:46 |
| clarkb | just getting the commands together for queue saving and the restart playbook | 19:47 |
| clarkb | ianw: corvus: I'm ready, any reason to not restart now? | 19:48 |
| corvus | clarkb: release team? | 19:49 |
| clarkb | I have notified them (about an hour ago and just now that we're likely to proceed) I don't see any release jobs either | 19:49 |
| corvus | cool, sounds good tehn | 19:49 |
| clarkb | I think we are good on that front | 19:49 |
| clarkb | alright I'm proceeding | 19:50 |
| clarkb | queues have been saved and the restart playbook is running | 19:50 |
| clarkb | playbook is done, just waiting for zuul to reload its configs then I can restore queues | 19:51 |
| clarkb | it complained about some of the ansible collections repos that are required projects on system-config-run-base-ansible-devel not sure if that is expected | 19:54 |
| clarkb | Unknown projects: github.com/ansible-collections/ansible.posix, github.com/ansible-collections/ansible.netcommon, github.com/ansible-collections/community.crypto, github.com/ansible-collections/community.general, github.com/ansible-community/ara | 19:54 |
| clarkb | oh I bet this is loading system-config in a tenant other than openstack | 19:55 |
| clarkb | so ya probably expected | 19:55 |
| clarkb | ianw: before I looked at zuul things I made that git clone and checkout in /tmp on review02 if you want to see what it looks like. It is different... | 19:57 |
| clarkb | tenants are loaded I'm restoring queues now | 19:59 |
| ianw | clarkb: cool, just poking now. i've chowned /home/gerrit2 correctly. i'm 99.99% certain that was because i mounted the LVM there before ansible ever ran, as i wanted to make sure it created everything on the lvm | 20:01 |
| clarkb | makes sense | 20:02 |
| clarkb | ianw: I've found the easiest way to navigate the externalids is via git grep | 20:03 |
| clarkb | the hashes are deterministic but not the level of nesting from what I can tell so far | 20:04 |
| clarkb | you basically hceck no nesting, one level, two levels, and so on until you find your hashed path | 20:04 |
| clarkb | git grep cheats and just tells you what the path is | 20:04 |
| clarkb | but I think we basically sync up review02, fetch refs/meta/external-ids, edit them, push back with gerrit off, reindex accounts and groups, then can start review and have efoley test login there if we like | 20:05 |
| clarkb | ianw: if you want to work through that with me today I'm game :) | 20:05 |
| clarkb | reenqueue complete | 20:05 |
| ianw | ok, sure. let me first pull the latest gerrit images and run an rsync on review02 | 20:06 |
| ianw | i have a root screen open | 20:06 |
| clarkb | ianw: sure no rush either I need to eat some lunch and I expect you need some breakfast | 20:06 |
| clarkb | we can sync back up in an hour or two? | 20:06 |
| ianw | ++ yep | 20:07 |
| clarkb | fyi I have put https://review.opendev.org/c/zuul/zuul/+/800683 and https://review.opendev.org/c/zuul/zuul/+/800684 back in zuul's check queue to double check depends-on behavior | 20:07 |
| clarkb | They should both fail the pep8/linters jobs | 20:07 |
| clarkb | if 684 passes then we may still have depends on problems | 20:07 |
| corvus | #status log restarted all of zuul on commit f9bfac09dd47e7065cd588287706b6965baaae37 to fix depends-on error and pick up result event handler fix | 20:08 |
| opendevstatus | corvus: finished logging | 20:08 |
| clarkb | oh thanks | 20:09 |
| clarkb | Successful failure "2021-07-13 20:11:20.541703 | ubuntu-focal | ERROR: linters: commands failed" now I will eat lunch | 20:11 |
| clarkb | ianw: added a note to the etherpad about openid logins since you had a question about that | 21:10 |
| clarkb | I guess let me know when you want to do review02 things and I'll context switch. Just going to work on reviews now | 21:12 |
| ianw | clarkb: yeah, i think we should pre-figure out the ssh version to merge the change, seems safest | 21:28 |
| ianw | happy to poke at the user updates | 21:29 |
| clarkb | wfm. I think you escalate your privs to bootstrappers, then apply the +2 Verified, +2 Code-Review and +1 Workflow. Then push the submit button. All of that should be doable via ssh and I agree sorting out the commands first is a good idea | 21:30 |
| clarkb | ianw: ok, I guess we want to start with a sync and an image update? | 21:30 |
| clarkb | or have those been done? | 21:30 |
| ianw | i have done that in a root screen running on review02 | 21:30 |
| ianw | sent 6,036,696 bytes received 13,159,906,090 bytes 17,636,895.90 bytes/sec | 21:30 |
| ianw | total size is 15,174,572,983 speedup is 1.15 | 21:30 |
| clarkb | ok cool. let me attach to that and we can look at All-Users. | 21:31 |
| clarkb | ianw: you ok with me driving in the screen a bit? | 21:31 |
| ianw | yep, go for it | 21:32 |
| clarkb | I've started a new buffer (not sure if it switches to new buffers for all attached ro not) | 21:32 |
| ianw | so is 64/ or 74/ the incorrect one? or does it not matter | 21:34 |
| clarkb | ianw: one is the old legacy openid that launchpad used and the other is the new current ubuntu one url | 21:37 |
| clarkb | 64/ is gone now and can be ignored. 74/ is the one we need to update. This was actaully the clue I used to sort out how this happened | 21:38 |
| ianw | ah right, launchpad.net v ubuntu.com | 21:38 |
| clarkb | if gerrit updated the external ids in place then I would've expected 64/ to remain but it was gone. That implied to me that it had actually been deleted and that seems to have been the case | 21:38 |
| clarkb | oops it seems you were in scrollback mode? I think I broke that? let me know when I can proceed | 21:38 |
| ianw | ahh go ahead was just checking out the orignal commands | 21:39 |
| *** dviroel is now known as dviroel|out | 21:41 | |
| clarkb | ianw: that git push command look right to you? | 21:44 |
| ianw | yep, so we've checked out the refs/meta/external-ids branch, updated the id in question and now push it back | 21:45 |
| clarkb | yup | 21:46 |
| clarkb | ianw: I think we can reindex now as that should be all that is necessary? | 21:47 |
| clarkb | then if we start gerrit efoley should be able to attempt to login ? may need to edit /etc/hosts on efoley's side but ya | 21:48 |
| ianw | agree, there should be a command to paste in the etherpad | 21:48 |
| clarkb | looking | 21:48 |
| clarkb | I'll do that in another buffer as it needs root and will do lots of scrolling | 21:49 |
| clarkb | ianw: that looks good to you? | 21:49 |
| ianw | yep. i think i played with the threads arg and it didn't make any difference | 21:50 |
| ianw | to overall time | 21:50 |
| clarkb | it is running now | 21:51 |
| ianw | so in summary we found <user> via grep in All-Users, giving us XX/<sha> for their settings. then checked out external-refs and edited the note for XX/<sha> to reflect the new address/old userid. push that back and re-index | 21:52 |
| clarkb | ianw: close, we fetched refs/meta/external-ids then checked out FETCH_HEAD. Then found them via grep | 21:53 |
| clarkb | but then yes, find the external ids for the user. Grepping by accountId is the easiest way to do that. But you can hash the external id directly too. Let me try that in the git repo buffer | 21:54 |
| clarkb | as an example | 21:54 |
| clarkb | er -e isn't the flag is it | 21:55 |
| clarkb | ianw: does what I put in the screen buffer help? | 21:56 |
| ianw | yeah i think so | 21:56 |
| ianw | so gerrit gets back the login.ubuntu.com URL, hashes it, looks it up in external-ids, then essentially logs you in as the uid listed in there | 21:57 |
| clarkb | ianw: what I found difficult about the hash method is often you don't actually know what the external id value is. but if you start with accountId you can grep that directly. The hash method is more important if you are adding a new entry rather than modifying | 21:57 |
| clarkb | ianw: yup | 21:57 |
| clarkb | ianw: its really simple in implemetnation but then the details make it super clunky/annoying as we've found :( | 21:59 |
| clarkb | ianw: efoley is in an european timezone aiui. Maybe you can coordinate at the end of your day or I can coordinate at the beginning of mine tomorrow to test it | 22:02 |
| clarkb | I think we want efoley to login and verify the accound id shown on the settings page is the one we want (the one we switched the external id to) then also maybe double check the external id contents to make sure gerrit didn't edit them in an unexpected way | 22:02 |
| ianw | ok, i can send a mail | 22:03 |
| clarkb | and that can't happen until we've finished reindexing and are happy with gerrit starting up. But I expect that will all go fine | 22:03 |
| clarkb | then sunday we just repeat the steps we took (because the sync will overwrite us) and we should be good | 22:04 |
| ianw | does the URL returned https://login.ubuntu.com/+id/XXX have a name? is it your handle? | 22:11 |
| clarkb | ianw: it is your openid id | 22:12 |
| clarkb | I think in the protocol fields it is called openid.identity | 22:12 |
| clarkb | sorry I think I broke your scroll buffer in screen again | 22:14 |
| clarkb | I was double checking the new account didn't have anymore external ids. It doesnt' appear to | 22:14 |
| clarkb | ianw: reindex is done. Have you been starting it up after this point to check on it? | 22:19 |
| ianw | clarkb: yep | 22:20 |
| clarkb | ianw: did you want to do that now? | 22:20 |
| ianw | what's with the mailto: external-id's ? is that from authenticating email addresses? | 22:20 |
| ianw | sure, i can | 22:20 |
| clarkb | ianw: those are what you get when you add additional email addresses to your accounts in gerrit | 22:20 |
| clarkb | you can go into the gerrit settings and add a bunch of those. And ya gerrit is supposed to authenticate those as well | 22:20 |
| ianw | real 28m2.880s | 22:21 |
| ianw | that's a lot faster than i saw before, i think i was recording 50+ minutes | 22:21 |
| clarkb | ianw: it may go faster if you have an existing index it can build on | 22:21 |
| ianw | ahh, indeed, it was probably totally fresh | 22:21 |
| ianw | i just docker-compose up -d'd and it should be coming up | 22:22 |
| clarkb | yup I see it now. Have you tried logging in to see what the behavior is? I suspect you are right athat we need to set a local /etc/hosts entry to point at review02 for this server name (because our config says the canonical name is review.opendev.org) | 22:23 |
| ianw | you have to make sure to hit httpS://review02.opendev.org or you get redirected, but it's up for me | 22:23 |
| clarkb | excellent. We should be able to test things with efoley then. Thanks for the help on this | 22:24 |
| ianw | clarkb: yeah, i have tried but it was a while ago and iirc i overrode hosts | 22:24 |
| ianw | i'm just finihsing up the notes on account update in the etherpad | 22:24 |
| clarkb | ianw: you can even rebase my existing change if you want I think | 22:29 |
| clarkb | and just push it again | 22:29 |
| clarkb | but redoing it is also easy | 22:29 |
| clarkb | I should be around for that part of the move too so I can help with bits like this | 22:30 |
| ianw | ++ | 22:30 |
| ianw | i just got to school run, but then i'll sort out the dns steps | 22:31 |
| ianw | then i'll tidy up the checklist and we can do a final review of the steps | 22:31 |
| clarkb | sounds good. I'm going to context switch back to zuul reviews after a short break. Let me know if I can help with anything else | 22:31 |
| ianw | did we loose the gerrit bot? | 22:32 |
| clarkb | ianw: the irc server I'm talking to says it is still here | 22:35 |
| ianw | yeah, it seems very quiet though | 22:35 |
| clarkb | I've detached from the screen on review02 in case you decide you don't want it anymore | 22:41 |
| clarkb | infra-root how does https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/BTdvOeY2lEiWtR2kQUHg for notifying people not to delete emails from their accounts? | 23:27 |
| clarkb | *how does that look | 23:27 |
| clarkb | I know that won't get in front of everyone but it seems betterthan nothing | 23:28 |
| ianw | clarkb: the bit about the reason we can't fix it easily is maybe a little in-depth for a general announcement | 23:35 |
| clarkb | ianw: fair. I wanted to avoid a bunch of why cn't you just fix it questions but we can do that in followups | 23:37 |
| clarkb | ianw: rewritten to be a bit less detail heavy | 23:39 |
| clarkb | I can send that out tomorrow morning when it is more likely to get eyeballs | 23:42 |
| ianw | looks good. one other thing to call otu might be openid == ubuntu just so people are clear | 23:44 |
| clarkb | good idea | 23:44 |
| opendevreview | Ian Wienand proposed opendev/zone-opendev.org master: Update review.opendev.org to review02.opendev.org https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/798244 | 23:46 |
| corvus | clarkb: are we giving up on service-announce as a thing? i ask because your etherpad is "to: all the lists" | 23:47 |
| clarkb | corvus: In this situation I think it is warranted bceause almost no one is subscribed to the announce list as far as I can tell. If people ignore the announce list for things like downtimes I don't really care that much | 23:48 |
| clarkb | but in this case we are actually trying to get as many people to read this as possible and service-announce doesn't seem to do that? | 23:49 |
| corvus | clarkb: if it's not useful for sending out announcements related to the service, we should probably shut it down then. that's unfortunate. | 23:49 |
| clarkb | ianw: https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/zone-opendev.org/+/798244 doesn't seem to actually update the cname fwiw | 23:49 |
| corvus | clarkb: tbh, i would prefer not to have stuff like that go to zuul-discuss | 23:49 |
| corvus | so it's unfortunate that it isn't working | 23:50 |
| clarkb | corvus: well I think there is a difference in what we are trying to achieve here. In the cas eof say planned maintenance its not my problem you aren't subscribed to the announce list and that is what you should read. But if you want as broad a reach as possible to impact user behavior then sending it to as many lists as possible makes sense to me | 23:50 |
| opendevreview | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/project-config master: Use publish-to-pypi-stable-only template for deprecated repo https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/project-config/+/800558 | 23:51 |
| clarkb | I agree more people shouldbe subscribed to that list | 23:51 |
| corvus | clarkb: i guess i understood anything going to service-announce as being relevant to users of the service. i think that means downtime notifications and changes (or alerts) to the service. | 23:51 |
| corvus | i get that the fact that no one is subscribed to the list makes it unsuitable for that | 23:51 |
| corvus | no argument there | 23:52 |
| clarkb | I think I'm arguing it is still suitable for that in the case where it is on the user if they don't read it. But in this case gerrit is causing an incredibly broken unexpected behavior with no out for the user. | 23:52 |
| corvus | but i guess i'm saying we should either make it be so, or discontinue it. because i'm not sure a downtime announcement is any less important than this. also, it looks like ianw has been sending downtime announcements to "all the lists" as well. | 23:53 |
| clarkb | and it makes sense for us to try and communicate that as broadly as possible | 23:53 |
| clarkb | If I send that email to the announce list it won't help any users avoid the gerrit bug. Our responses can be a) sorry you get a new account because you didn't read email b) wait for $time until we can take downtime to fix it or c) wait until we fix the db and can fix it online. None of those seem great and preventing it in the first place | 23:54 |
| clarkb | vs its too bad you didn't account for an hour of downtime | 23:54 |
| clarkb | for that reason to me they are different, but I agree it is unfortunate that people aren't subscribing to that list | 23:55 |
| clarkb | corvus: if you don't want it sent to the zuul-discuss list how do you suggest I get the message in front of zuul developers? | 23:55 |
| clarkb | corvus: do we need to do a seprate push to get people subscribed to hte announce list? | 23:56 |
| corvus | clarkb: for me, i see "this will affect your work" for both things, and both are equally important. it's okay, i don't think it's important that we convince each other. :) | 23:56 |
| clarkb | and then take the hard position of "sorry you get a new account" if the message is missed | 23:56 |
| clarkb | corvus: well I think one creates work for me and the other doesnt | 23:56 |
| clarkb | its not my problem if a developer loses an hour to planned outages they didn't read for. But fixing the convoluted notedb has been my problem for months :/ | 23:57 |
| clarkb | and I'm slowly making progress but it isn't fun or interesting or rewarding | 23:57 |
| corvus | clarkb: i'm sorry, i'm not expressing myself well. i'm not trying to create work for you. i'm trying to say they are both important. and every developer needs to see both | 23:57 |
| corvus | clarkb: let's put it another way: you see two classes of severity, low and high. i only see high. :) | 23:57 |
| clarkb | got it | 23:57 |
| clarkb | In that case I think it is worth reevaluating if we can convince people to join the announce list | 23:58 |
| clarkb | and if not consider alternatives | 23:58 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.2 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!