Tuesday, 2023-08-01

*** elodilles_pto is now known as elodilles06:35
*** dmellado17042088 is now known as dmellado09:51
fungiapparently there's been a lengthy (and ongoing) outage for the matrix bridge to the libera irc network: https://libera.chat/news/deportalling-delay12:46
fungiseems it's related to making bridging opt-in per channel there12:48
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: DNM force mm3 failure to hold the node  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/85529213:52
ildikovHi OpenDev community15:48
ildikovI'm reaching out with a few questions about Matrix.15:49
fungiask away15:50
ildikovThe StarlingX community is getting ready to move over to Matrix from IRC. If I know correctly, the OpenDev team is running a server, which is where we would like to have our rooms as well.15:50
JayFThis change should be relatively seamless; IRC and Matrix protocols are both already served up by oftc.net15:50
fungiwe have a dedicated opendev.org matrix homeserver which is hosted by ems15:51
JayFSo it's just a matter of users who desire changing their clients from matrix to IRC15:51
ildikovI was looking for docs with regards to how to set up rooms on the OpenDev server15:51
JayFfungi: Do we bridge over our OFTC channels to the Opendev matrix server?15:51
fungiJayF: all irc channels in oftc are bridged to matrix15:51
JayFI guess I'm confused about what "opendev.org matrix homeserver" means, then15:52
fungiit's not anything we're doing specifically. that's handled between the oftc.net and matrix.org folks15:52
fungiJayF: the zuul:opendev.org matrix channel is hosted on the opendev.org matrix homeserver15:52
JayFfungi: so it's not accessible, generally, from IRC?15:52
fungirather than being an oftc irc channel bridged to matrix15:52
funginot accessible via irc, nop15:53
fungiildikov: i'm looking up whether we've documented things, but it will take me a few minutes15:53
ildikovfungi: thanks!15:54
fungibut the short answer is that one of us needs to log into the homeserver's admin interface and create whatever channels are desired15:55
ildikovWe've also been thinking about creating rooms for project teams, StarlingX has 11 of those, plus a 'general' channel. Do you all know if it would make sense to create a 'space' to group those rooms?15:55
ildikovI'll dig up the Matrix docs, I was more wondering if anyone has experience?15:55
fungia "space" might make sense if it's hard to keep track of all the rooms, i'm not sure since we've not added one before15:55
ildikovok, cool, I'll dig a bit more too15:56
fungiinfra-root: i validated the e-mail address on the admin account for our matrix homeserver, it seems either it was never done or became a new requirement since the last time anyone logged in16:01
fungii think that was the billing interface16:05
fungiturns out you can list rooms from there but need to log into the homeserver separately to add rooms16:06
fungiyeah, looks like i can create rooms, and also spaces16:09
fungiildikov: so we don't have any documentation specific to our matrix homeserver, general matrix documentation applies. probably the only relevant bit of detail is that our homeserver is called "opendev.org" and the opendev sysadmins can create rooms on that homeserver (and presumably also spaces, though we should discuss that in today's meeting)16:12
fungimatrix is a federated protocol, so users from any homeserver, e.g. matrix.org, can join rooms hosted on our homeserver16:12
fungiwe don't provide general user accounts on our homeserver, since our discounted hosting plan limits us to a very small number of accounts which we use primarily for chatbots (gerritbot mainly at the moment)16:14
fungiif you're looking for general documentation about using matrix, the zuul community publishes some about connecting to their channel which could be copied and adjusted by the starlingx folks for their community: https://zuul-ci.org/docs/zuul/latest/howtos/matrix.html16:15
fungialso this is my first time in the admin interface for matrix, it's possible i'm not 100% clear on the room creation workflow so am hoping to confer with the other sysadmins during our meeting later16:17
fungiat the moment i'm assuming adding rooms on our homeserver requires assistance of our admins, but it's possible i'm wrong about that16:18
ildikov@fungi yeah, joining rooms on the opendev server, etc seems to be easy16:19
fungiwith (what i think is) a normal user account i also have the ability in the element interface to create new rooms, and to specify an address for those rooms, but i'm not sure if there are access controls which would prevent a normal user from adding a room on the opendev.org homeserver (presumably so)16:20
ildikovWith regards to room creation, did I understand it correctly that a sysadmin is needed?16:20
ildikovTo create a room on the opendev server16:20
fungii'm assuming so, but i can't say for certain until i confer with others who have done this before16:21
ildikovok, got it16:21
fungii plan to bring it up at the end of our 19:00 utc meeting during open discussion16:22
fungisince i seem to probably be the only one around at the moment16:22
ildikovI'll try to join, thank you!16:22
ildikovwhich channel is the meeting in?16:22
fungi#opendev-meeting on the oftc irc network16:23
ildikovgreat, I'm in!16:36
fungiildikov: also, channels that want gerritbot present in them need to be added to this file: https://opendev.org/opendev/system-config/src/branch/master/playbooks/roles/matrix-gerritbot/files/gerritbot.yaml16:52
fungiand channels that you want a published html log of on meetings.opendev.org need to be added to the list here: https://opendev.org/opendev/system-config/src/branch/master/playbooks/roles/matrix-eavesdrop/templates/config.yaml16:52
ildikovoh cool, thanks!16:52
fungii'll try to collect some of this into usable documentation after i get clarification in the meeting16:53
ildikovthat sounds great, let me know if I can help16:56
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Use magic domain guessing in Mailman 3  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/86798718:41
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Upgrade to latest Mailman 3 releases  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/86921018:41
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: DNM force mm3 failure to hold the node  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/85529218:41
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Pin importlib_resources<6 in mailman images  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/89022018:41
clarkbfungi: adding rooms on our homeserver does required admin access. But it should be as simple as creating the room, making it public, and possibly adding a specific user with slightly privileged rights (I think we've decided to leave our admin account as the actual room admin though and zuul's room should reflect that)18:54
clarkbprivate rooms can optionally be encrypted but since these would all be public it simplifies things quite a bit18:55
fungii fumbled around and thought that's what it looked like. i guess anyone can create new channels on matrix.org but for opendev.org it's limited to our admin account?18:55
clarkblooks like we didn't give anyone additional privs in zuul18:55
fungialso, if starlingx is talking about adding ~20 rooms, does adding a "space" for those make sense?18:56
clarkbmaybe? I'm of the opinion that having 20 rooms or even 4 rooms is probably a bug18:56
fungiand i guess we'll want them to pick a consistent room name prefix like #starlingx-whatever or #stx-whatever18:57
clarkbyes that would b egood18:57
fungiif you have concerns with the channel proliferation, i suppose it would be good to get them to articulate/justify that design choice18:57
fungithough i suspect if we push back on that they'll just create them on matrix.org instead (which is probably also fine)18:58
clarkblooks like spaces are homeserver specific. So we woud have to create one for our users unless they want a matrix.org spcae (or similar) that aggregates for opendev.org18:58
clarkbfrom a homeserver perspective I think channel proliferation is fine. From a user and collaborator perspective I find it frustrating because it means people never end up in the right channel and get bounced around18:58
fungiwhen you say "spaces are homeserver specific" you mean only users with accounts on that homeserver would see the space? or that only rooms on that homeserver can be grouped in that space?18:59
clarkbif you have few options the correct one is more apparent and more people will theoretically be active in the available options making them more responsive18:59
clarkbfungi: I mean that a space is hosted by a specific homeserver. I think rooms from any homeserver can be collected in a space hosted by any other homeserver18:59
clarkbbut it implies an opendev admin would have to create a space for stx if we want to host the space at opendev.org19:00
fungigot it. and users of any homeserver can see the space19:00
clarkbya I suspect that is a private/public setting though19:00
clarkbbut we would make it public and it would be globally visible in the fedreated space19:00
fungiright, but not necessarily restricted to accounts on the same homeserver the space is created on19:01
clarkbI personally always saw spaces as an indivual organization thing not a organization level organization thing19:02
clarkbbecause I don't want to join all 100 openstack rooms for example19:02
fungiyeah, i've joined the osism "space" for example, but only specific channels in that space19:03
corvusildikov: this is zuul's documentation about using matrix: https://zuul-ci.org/docs/zuul/latest/howtos/matrix.html20:02
corvuswe don't actually point new users to that; that's mostly for people who have questions about using it; honestly, it's more helpful for people coming from irc than completely new users.  on the project homepage we just directly link to the room on matrix.org and that's enough to get new users there.20:03
ildikovoh cool, that's good to know!20:03
fungiso this has turned out to be rather fragile in the face of base image updates: https://opendev.org/opendev/system-config/src/branch/master/playbooks/roles/mailman3/tasks/main.yaml#L19420:54
fungii wonder if there's a convenient way to make that python-version-agnostic so we're not redundantly embedding the python version in that test20:55
fungidocker exec doesn't seem to support globbing20:55
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Use magic domain guessing in Mailman 3  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/86798720:58
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Upgrade to latest Mailman 3 releases  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/86921020:58
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: DNM force mm3 failure to hold the node  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/85529220:58
opendevreviewJeremy Stanley proposed opendev/system-config master: Make mailman3 DB migration check PyVer-agnostic  https://review.opendev.org/c/opendev/system-config/+/89025320:58
fungiyay! that finally got me a working held node again and i've prepped it with the django sites and mail domains so that i can hopefully start a new round of test imports tomorrow22:29

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