| * fungi wonders if he's in the right place | 17:00 | |
| spotz | #staartmeeting diversity-wg | 17:01 |
|---|---|---|
| spotz | #startmeeting diversity-wg | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Mar 1 17:01:07 2021 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is spotz. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: diversity-wg)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'diversity_wg' | 17:01 |
| spotz | #topic Roll Call | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: diversity-wg)" | 17:01 | |
| fungi | ahoy | 17:02 |
| spotz | Hey we get to use the new chhannel! | 17:02 |
| spotz | One thing in the agenda | 17:03 |
| spotz | #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/diversity-wg-agenda | 17:03 |
| spotz | megheisler: where are you! | 17:04 |
| megheisler | I' | 17:04 |
| megheisler | Im here! | 17:04 |
| spotz | Sweet | 17:05 |
| spotz | #topic Bylaws Audit | 17:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bylaws Audit (Meeting topic: diversity-wg)" | 17:05 | |
| spotz | #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/diversity-legal-audit | 17:06 |
| spotz | So Meg started on this during our last meeting and I went through the bylaaws last week using the same method she was using but adding in the # of times the word in question was used in that section | 17:07 |
| spotz | If we can get this finished today I have saved a spot at the Board meeting tomorrow | 17:08 |
| megheisler | I dropped the ball on that one, I forgot to write it in my to do list. I'm happy to help to get it finished | 17:09 |
| fungi | looks like a reasonably short list of edits, that's reassuring | 17:09 |
| spotz | SO I focused on Chairman whether as Chairman or Vice Chairman and then continued with his including mentions of his or her | 17:09 |
| spotz | Well my question for not saying we're done is can anyone think of any other words? | 17:10 |
| fungi | any of the problem words we brainstormed for the inclusivity work | 17:10 |
| fungi | though my guess is none of those are present | 17:11 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Diversity/Inclusivity | 17:11 |
| spotz | We could check for manpower,manned or native but I don't think they're there. The others I really doubt | 17:13 |
| spotz | Manpower and manned not in the mail page | 17:14 |
| spotz | Neither is native | 17:14 |
| megheisler | I just did a ctrl+f for all and didn't see them either | 17:14 |
| spotz | Teah that's how I was doing it. Did you check appendices yet? | 17:15 |
| spotz | Ok it looks like we're good on those too | 17:16 |
| megheisler | going through those now, 2-4 are good | 17:16 |
| megheisler | oh ok great | 17:16 |
| fungi | yeah, i didn't expect to find any of those, but it's good to double-check, since those are our recommendations after all | 17:16 |
| spotz | Is there anything else we feel needs to be done here? | 17:17 |
| fungi | but nice to know that our bylaws are already using inclusive terminology otherwise. perhaps we need to mention gendered pronouns on the inclusivity list as well (and "chairman"), as an outcome of this exercise? | 17:17 |
| megheisler | I agree Fungi | 17:18 |
| spotz | We're recommending chairperson, and then if it says his then their, and the few places where it's multiple change like his or her to his, her, or their | 17:19 |
| fungi | i can take care of that shortly, if nobody beats me to it | 17:19 |
| fungi | but it's a wiki, so anybody feel free to update the list | 17:19 |
| spotz | Oh duh, thought you meant here. Yeah we need to update the wiki | 17:19 |
| spotz | here being the bylaws. Haven't had coffee yet:( | 17:20 |
| fungi | no worries | 17:20 |
| spotz | I still have the page up I'll grab t | 17:20 |
| fungi | just figured a byproduct of the bylaws exercise was that we identified terms therein which were less inclusive, and proposed replacements, so it's a good fit to update the inclusivity recommendations with as well | 17:21 |
| spotz | Yep | 17:21 |
| fungi | thanks! | 17:21 |
| spotz | Or not I'm not seeing an edit on the page | 17:21 |
| spotz | NM | 17:22 |
| fungi | logged in? ;) | 17:24 |
| spotz | Yeah I was looking at the parts not the top of the page | 17:24 |
| spotz | Ok how does the bottom look - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Diversity/Inclusivity | 17:24 |
| megheisler | I'm trying to figure out how to invite but not sure, I'm using freenode so that may be my issue | 17:24 |
| spotz | Besides not being bolded | 17:24 |
| spotz | Invite? | 17:25 |
| megheisler | the top of the agenda eather pad, Lisa says the channel is asking for an invite | 17:25 |
| fungi | is she trying to join the wrong channel? | 17:25 |
| spotz | Yeah just add channel | 17:26 |
| megheisler | got it | 17:26 |
| *** SWDevAngel has joined #openinfra-diversity | 17:26 | |
| spotz | Hey! | 17:26 |
| SWDevAngel | ahhhh | 17:26 |
| spotz | Ok fixed the bolding. Let me know if that reads ok on the pronouns entry | 17:27 |
| fungi | SWDevAngel: see http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openinfra-diversity/%23openinfra-diversity.2021-03-01.log.html if you want to catch up on the discussion so far | 17:27 |
| spotz | And I added some ors:) | 17:28 |
| megheisler | yeah, spotz I think that reads well | 17:29 |
| spotz | Ok | 17:29 |
| spotz | We'll give SWDevAngel a few minutes to catch up | 17:30 |
| SWDevAngel | I'm reading eavesdrop! :) | 17:30 |
| fungi | actually dropping the .html off that url gives a more current (raw) feed of the channel logs, the pretty html version only gets refreshed every ~20 minutes | 17:30 |
| fungi | http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openinfra-diversity/%23openinfra-diversity.2021-03-01.log | 17:31 |
| SWDevAngel | Okay cool. I was reading the page while I was not able to connect and I also didn't see anything you didn't already catch. | 17:34 |
| SWDevAngel | I like "chair" but I'm not a lawyer or judge so maybe "chairperson" is better. | 17:35 |
| spotz | Ok good. SO tomorrow I'll present our findings to the board. Well we can definitely make it either in our recommendation | 17:35 |
| spotz | Wiki edited for tht | 17:35 |
| spotz | Ahh unlesssomeone is also green we already have the 2 options on the etherpad | 17:36 |
| spotz | So anything else on the bylaws and/or wiki? | 17:37 |
| SWDevAngel | I like the "ors" I think that works well | 17:37 |
| fungi | just be prepared that edits to different parts of the bylaws and appendices need approval from different sets of people, so they might not all get updated at the same times | 17:37 |
| SWDevAngel | So.... this may be a stupid question, but... it's still called the OpenStack Foundation? I thought they changed that? | 17:37 |
| spotz | Right we're just giving our findings. SOme can just be made, others require a vote depending on section | 17:38 |
| spotz | It is Open Infrastructure Foundation but the new pages aren;t up | 17:38 |
| fungi | the openstack foundation is still the current legal entity, as far as i understand. it has filed a "doing business as" open infrastructure foundation, to give legal documents and contracts time to be switched | 17:38 |
| SWDevAngel | Ahhh okay. Yeah.... as mentioned before... I'm not a lawyer. Don't even play one on tv | 17:39 |
| fungi | at some point in the (hopefully not terribly distant) future, it will officially become the open infrastructure foundation | 17:39 |
| spotz | Which is why we're just giving recommendations of our findings | 17:39 |
| megheisler | I had no idea how any of the naming works with the foundation, that's interesting to know | 17:39 |
| fungi | yeah, you basically need to have both names be legal for some period of time | 17:39 |
| spotz | So much legal! | 17:39 |
| fungi | these transitions take months, sometimes years, depending on the size of an organization | 17:40 |
| spotz | Oh and this version of the bylaws doesnt have Silver Members yet | 17:40 |
| fungi | publicly it's the open infrastructure foundation, but ni an official legal sense both names are valid for a while | 17:41 |
| SWDevAngel | Okay. interesting. | 17:41 |
| spotz | Ok we have 20 minutes left. Anything on this? | 17:42 |
| megheisler | are there other sets of bylaws going to other members that need to be reviewed, or will changing this one cover it? | 17:42 |
| spotz | These are the bylaws, we did vote and change Corporate Sponsors to Silver Members but everything but name is staying the same | 17:43 |
| megheisler | Ok great | 17:43 |
| spotz | Ok declaring the topic closed for now:) | 17:45 |
| spotz | #topic Open Discussion | 17:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: diversity-wg)" | 17:45 | |
| spotz | If anyone has any non-bylaw topics. Ideas for what to do next, etc? | 17:46 |
| fungi | ptg is coming up, worth thinking about if we want to schedule some time once the dates are announced | 17:47 |
| spotz | fungi: Should we give a timeline for retiring the old channel? We should probably look aat the WG and and WoO wiki pages first and update them | 17:47 |
| fungi | spotz: yeah, we could probably do a wiki search and codesearch for the old channel name just in case we missed anywhere less obvious | 17:48 |
| SWDevAngel | Has there been talk of doing ANY meetings (or anything) in person in 2021? I see that the CNCF still has KubeCon NA listed as a hybrid event in Los Angeles. I'll be SHOCKED if that happens, but we'll see. | 17:48 |
| spotz | Yeah I always grab us a block, maybe we could do a progress check on how folks are doing on stance related changes? | 17:48 |
| spotz | Open Source Summit EU in Dublin end of September is still there, NA was cancelled. | 17:49 |
| fungi | i believe diablo_rojo is planning to kick everyone remaining out of the old channel in a couple more weeks, but the forward to the new channel will exist indefinitely | 17:49 |
| spotz | OIF was working on making Summit virtual if they can push the Berlin contract another year | 17:49 |
| spotz | Hrm if anyone wants to put a talk in for Dublin let me know, I could get my trainer to ride my pony:) | 17:51 |
| spotz | Have not heard anything on GHC yet | 17:51 |
| fungi | yeah, unofficially, i have no expectation the openinfra summit will be in-person in 2021. travel logistics for so many prospective attendees will be uncertain for too long still | 17:51 |
| spotz | Yeah I was surprised they were still talking about Dublin | 17:52 |
| fungi | local-hybrid events seem to be gaining interest, so no idea if we'll try to do something along those lines | 17:52 |
| fungi | and things like user groups organizing keynote viewing parties | 17:53 |
| SWDevAngel | I have another general question. Is there a "job board" or an "I'm hiring" section of either IRC or the OIF/OpenStack web pages? I'm hiring in my DevRel team for a Tech Evangelist at the moment. Not with OpenStack or Infra experience specifically though. More like Javascript/Typescript and of course containers (pref K8s)... but there's overlap with communities, so I'll post it if we have a place. | 17:53 |
| spotz | Yeah so my recommendation would be don't plan on it especially if not vaccinated but that's just my unoffical feelings on all conferrences for 2021 | 17:53 |
| SWDevAngel | Also - if you know of anyone who would be interested, send them my way! ;) | 17:53 |
| megheisler | oh that's an interesting approach, I hadn't heard of viewing parties but makes sense | 17:53 |
| spotz | There is an OpenStack job board but think it needs to be OpenStack related | 17:54 |
| SWDevAngel | And yeah Amy, I was pretty bummed about last EU OSS summit. I actually had a talk accepted, AND I've never been to Dublin! Would have loved to check it out. :) | 17:54 |
| fungi | SWDevAngel: there's https://www.openstack.org/community/jobs/ but yeah the foundation is working on a complete redo of that idea to something a little more modern | 17:54 |
| spotz | SWDevAngel: let me know if you want to team up on something | 17:55 |
| fungi | they have some interesting ideas on how to put together a more effective matchmaking service for prospective employers and people who are looking for something in our specializations, but i don't think they've entirely worked out what yet | 17:55 |
| SWDevAngel | Sure let's do it! When's the CFP due? | 17:56 |
| spotz | 6/13 | 17:56 |
| SWDevAngel | (I now have my official OSS speaker's badge! I guess they liked the talk. :) (For whatever that's worth) | 17:56 |
| spotz | fungi yeah I'd recommended someone post an OpenStack job there once I dont think it got much traffic | 17:57 |
| spotz | Ok as we've gone off D&I except for submitting a talk I'm going to close the log | 17:57 |
| spotz | #endmeeting | 17:57 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Mar 1 17:57:42 2021 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/diversity_wg/2021/diversity_wg.2021-03-01-17.01.html | 17:57 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/diversity_wg/2021/diversity_wg.2021-03-01-17.01.txt | 17:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/diversity_wg/2021/diversity_wg.2021-03-01-17.01.log.html | 17:57 |
| spotz | Thanks for setting up the new channel and bot fungi | 17:57 |
| SWDevAngel | Okay. If I recall correctly, the CNCF has a "jobs board" for members to post stuff. I've never used it so I'm not sure how effective it is, but might be worth taking a look at how they do that and trying to do something like that (if it has proven to be effective). | 17:58 |
| fungi | my pleasure! | 17:58 |
| spotz | I think people know they're there to be honest plus they don't get updated often so hard to tell what's new and what's still open | 17:59 |
| spotz | don't know | 17:59 |
| SWDevAngel | Yes, thanks @fungi for setting up the new channel... thanks @spotz for sending out the email reminders, and thanks @megheisler for pinging me with the solution! I know, I know... "you can lead a horse to water..." | 18:00 |
| spotz | hehe | 18:01 |
| spotz | Thanks for coming everyone.nI'll put PTG planning as our next active project | 18:01 |
| SWDevAngel | And I thought this was going to be the week I log on with NO drama! I even jumped in early to make sure. DUH!!!! <facepalm? | 18:01 |
| megheisler | Thanks all! | 18:01 |
| fungi | SWDevAngel: yeah, the cncf job board is more or less what the openstack foundation community jobs board is too, but i think we've come to realize that to be especially effective we need to provide a more curated solution and a means to incorporate potential applicants into the process. basically some utility but little value in a laundry list of job postings which may or may not even be active | 18:03 |
| fungi | still. real value would be in connecting people who have desirable skills with employers who are looking to hire people with that background, with a particular focus on employers who want to contribute effort back into the project communities with those positions | 18:03 |
| fungi | so you could say we have a position where we want to hire someone who's been contributing upstream to openstack/nova for a while, and then the service can get you in touch with people who meet those criteria and are looking for new employment | 18:05 |
| spotz | I like that fungi | 18:08 |
| fungi | yeah, the tricky party is that people need to be able to confidentially say they're looking for work, and you have to be careful to only connect them with vetted potential employers who also aren't their current employer | 18:10 |
| fungi | er, tricky part | 18:10 |
| fungi | though i suppose it could be a tricky party too | 18:10 |
| SWDevAngel | Yeah, there'd have to be a way to post stuff and let people apply on their own but then you lose that vetting process. But maybe that's okay if the hiring manager has an internal recruiter who can do that. | 18:17 |
| spotz | Well if they're vetting going into the system, either Gerrit reviews or COA for example and employers can only see the people looking not everyone in the system? | 18:19 |
| SWDevAngel | I just caught one more thing for the bylaws. In Section V there's "he" ... Do you want me to add it to the etherpad? | 18:23 |
| SWDevAngel | @spotz @fungi @megheisler are we okay going from 'he' to 'they' ? I'll update the etherpad. | 18:27 |
| spotz | SWDevAngel: Yes please | 18:28 |
| megheisler | yes, nice catch | 18:28 |
| spotz | Sorry finally had time to make coffee before next meeting | 18:28 |
| spotz | PTG dates - April 19-23, 2021 | 18:31 |
| spotz | Breakfast was good, fresh eggs yum:) | 18:36 |
| SWDevAngel | It's actually kinda tricky with "he" ... because he is goes to they are, but he has goes to "they have" ... so I'm trying to make detailed notes. It shows up a lot in sections 5 and 10. I'm still making notes but need to jump on camera for a meeting so I'll get back to it in a bit. Amy - when do you need this locked and loaded to submit? | 18:37 |
| SWDevAngel | (And yeah, "he" was a pain to catch cuz if you do a search for it you get EVERY instance... the, their, they, other, etc..... you get the idea. You kinda had to read every word. But I just KNEW it had to be there somewhere.... and it was! ;) | 18:39 |
| SWDevAngel | Okay, I think I'm done with comments and they should all be on the etherpad now. I went through the Appendix's also but there wasn't much there that wasn't already listed. (One extra he and she that needs to be corrected in the Code of Ethics on Appendix 5. | 20:23 |
| SWDevAngel | @Spotz you should be good to go (submit) now. :) | 20:23 |
| spotz | SWDevAngel: Thanks | 20:27 |
| spotz | I've sent the link and will present tomorrow quickly. As not a lawyer will just say we found all this and suggested these changes or however legal needs to do it for the same result | 20:31 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.2 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!