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| holms | ./spice_auto.html: var host, port, password, scheme = "ws://", uri; | 00:27 |
|---|---|---|
| holms | should be wss:// ? :D | 00:27 |
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| holms | https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1259760 | 00:39 |
| holms | nice | 00:39 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1259760 in nova "Spice console isn't working when ssl_only=True is set" [Undecided,New] | 00:39 |
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| dstanek | morganfainberg: you around? | 01:24 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: looking at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60741 now and i have a question when you have a second | 01:24 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, hi | 01:28 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, ask away | 01:28 |
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| dstanek | morganfainberg: are you using self.client.driver.set* because the default timeout is 0? | 01:29 |
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| morganfainberg | correct | 01:29 |
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| morganfainberg | dogpile adds extra arguments into the .set() value | 01:29 |
| morganfainberg | based upon the backend configuration that is | 01:30 |
| dstanek | so you can override that default? | 01:30 |
| morganfainberg | yes. | 01:30 |
| dstanek | should you be explicity with a timeout=0? | 01:30 |
| morganfainberg | well, you provide that option, and then all sets have that extra arg in that case | 01:30 |
| morganfainberg | default for the memcache driver(s) is explicitly 0 | 01:30 |
| morganfainberg | the memcache libs sorry, not drivers | 01:31 |
| dstanek | but if you override that in your config then you may not actually have keys that don't expire right? | 01:31 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, ok hold up | 01:31 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, the base behavior is, do not set an expire time in the cache | 01:32 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, you can pass memcache_expires to the backend, which will specify the TTL in the backend | 01:32 |
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| morganfainberg | if you use this mechanism to specify keys, those keys will not have the TTL of the memcache_expires value | 01:32 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, i guess it would be more straightforward if I lifted that logic up into the proxy memcached backend | 01:33 |
| dstanek | so that config is for the backend layer, leaving the driver default at 0? | 01:33 |
| morganfainberg | (keystone/common/kvs/backends/memcached) | 01:33 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, the memcached_expires option is set in the dogpile memcache implementation (dogpile.memcached) it doesn't affect the basic memcached lib used as "driver.client") | 01:34 |
| dstanek | having worked with memcached before i know the libraries default to never expiring, but i see how it can be confusing for others | 01:34 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, maybe we should lift the magic "make the TTL" arg addition to https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60741/7/keystone/common/kvs/backends/memcached.py instead of the logic i have | 01:35 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: can the backend take a timeout value? | 01:35 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, by backend, you mean which part? :P | 01:36 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, there is... uhm... a lot of things named backend here | 01:36 |
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| dstanek | the dogpile backend so that you don't have to reach into self.driver.client | 01:37 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, this is where the "TTL" set is implemneted https://bitbucket.org/zzzeek/dogpile.cache/src/4cc0af95d626fa89bfc903a6a454191ae0b7a104/dogpile/cache/backends/memcached.py?at=master#cl-176 | 01:37 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, it is a global option, no way to override it when it is set, https://bitbucket.org/zzzeek/dogpile.cache/src/4cc0af95d626fa89bfc903a6a454191ae0b7a104/dogpile/cache/backends/memcached.py?at=master#cl-162 | 01:38 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: well it looks like what i want to do is impossible :-) | 01:38 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, the answer to what you want to do is lift that MemcachedArgs logic up to my memcached.py at keystone.common.kvs.backends.memcached | 01:38 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, and i would agree that would be more clear (so I'm happy to do it) | 01:39 |
| morganfainberg | it would, however, require all "set" logic to call driver.client instead of the dogpile interface =/ | 01:40 |
| morganfainberg | now that i think about it. | 01:40 |
| morganfainberg | at that point, perhaps it's easier to just lift some version of the dogpile.cache.backends.memcached file up into that backend (basically) and not rely on a "proxy-ish" thing | 01:41 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: also is set_multi correct in there? it looks like it is passing a set instead of a dict | 01:41 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, aha, good catch! | 01:42 |
| morganfainberg | and it's showing a gap in test coverage. | 01:42 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: looks like there are some tests missing :-) | 01:42 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, this is why we get things peer reviewed! | 01:43 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: btw, thanks for splitting this up! | 01:43 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, oh of course, dude, 1000 lines is bad enough. when i started having other "requirements" I figured time to split it up. | 01:44 |
| morganfainberg | it is... total about +1700 -700 lines for the whole chain so far. | 01:44 |
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| morganfainberg | i didn't want to make it completely un-reviewable. | 01:44 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, ok i think the right answer is to stop proxying to _actual_ dogpile backends here. Just implement the same-ish logic within keystone with the added no-cache-keys etc | 01:46 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, and that way it'll be easier to write tests for. | 01:47 |
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| morganfainberg | i can make a contrived "test" backend that can be used to validate the extra code-paths. | 01:47 |
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| dstanek | morganfainberg: that sounds interesting | 01:48 |
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| morganfainberg | basically, we'd semi-duplicate the dogpile memcache backends so we can get the same benefit, just with out own set logic, and i'd still use a manager to do the pivot i think. | 01:50 |
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| zyluo | bnemec, ping | 02:05 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek_afk, i think I solved your concern with the backends | 04:51 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek_afk, ended up using a mixin and overrode the set/set_multi functionality so that it all exists in the MemcacheBackend manager and a lightweight wrapper instead of passing those calls down to the actual dogpile backend. | 04:51 |
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| dstanek | morganfainberg: nice, good idea | 04:52 |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60741/8/keystone/common/kvs/backends/memcached.py | 04:53 |
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| morganfainberg | oh crud. dict comprehension... thats not py26 friendly | 04:55 |
| morganfainberg | *goes and fixes* | 04:55 |
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| morganfainberg | dstanek, anyway. thanks for the feedback :) | 05:00 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: np, that's what i'm here for | 05:00 |
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| rohitk | Does anybody have experience of using zeromq with openstack? | 08:06 |
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| kbrierly | Since there's such a big group here i have a quick question. Has anyone been able to get over 3gigabit vm to vm over a bridge in ubuntu 12.04 kernel 3.2??? | 08:19 |
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| d0ugal | Hi, I'm trying to figure out a devstack issue I've got. The syncdb for horizon its hanging. This is part of the log and the postgres activity (at the bottom) which seems to be stuck on "COMMIT" https://gist.github.com/d0ugal/7907142 | 09:08 |
| d0ugal | Any ideas? | 09:08 |
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| ace | what is the best way to get started making a new service? | 09:13 |
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| Teju | hi doron...can u help me with a issue with keystone? | 09:28 |
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| Teju | Hi all....i have an issue with keystone....can anyone help? | 09:37 |
| ace | just ask the question | 09:38 |
| Teju | i have registered services(identity and cinder) with keystone using keystone service-create and I was able to see the services using service-list.But,after few days/changes/reboots,the service-list command is not listing any services | 09:39 |
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| Teju | hi ace...I asked the q...do u know how to fix the issue? | 09:43 |
| ace | i have not seen that happen. | 09:45 |
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| Teju | thanks ace...one more q: the service-list does not list any services,but i am able to log into dashboard and keystone is able to generate tokens...So,keystone is working right? | 09:52 |
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| ace | yes, have you checked the service list in dashboard? | 09:58 |
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| Teju | ace...yes...the services are listed in the dashboard | 10:17 |
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| mflobo | Hi all | 11:10 |
| mflobo | Anyone knows something about this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-cinderclient/+bug/1240497 ? | 11:10 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1240497 in python-cinderclient "Module backports was already imported when runnin cli commands" [Undecided,New] | 11:10 |
| mflobo | I have the same problem https://ask.openstack.org/en/question/8396/keystonclient-upgrade-problems-with-babel/ | 11:11 |
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| Alexei_987 | dhellmann: ping | 15:09 |
| JordanP | Hi, in devstack, i'd like to change the default path for Tempest configuration file (tempest.conf). IMO it should be in /etc/tempest like the other conf files. It seems my patch doesn't integrate well with openstack infrastructure and Q&A (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/61434/) Can someone help me ? I'dont understand the reason of this buildfailure | 15:10 |
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| viktors | dhellmann: hi | 15:25 |
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| dhellmann | Alexei_987: pong | 15:49 |
| dhellmann | viktors: hi! | 15:50 |
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| dolphm_ | is the gate protecting against non-whitelisted ERROR output already? | 15:50 |
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| Alexei_987 | dhellmann: Hi we are discussing my patch with models in ceilometer | 15:50 |
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| Alexei_987 | could you join the ceilometer chat as well? | 15:50 |
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| Alexei_987 | dhellmann: I'm trying to convince jd__ that we need it :) | 15:51 |
| Alexei_987 | dhellmann: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60885/ | 15:51 |
| dhellmann | Alexei_987: looking | 15:51 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, marekd, ping | 15:52 |
| dolphm | stevemar: marekd: what's the consensus on domains? | 15:52 |
| stevemar | just realized, it would suck if your nickname was ping | 15:52 |
| stevemar | marekd has some good comments about domains | 15:53 |
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| stevemar | theres 2 issues here, domains being used in idps, and domains being used in mappings | 15:53 |
| stevemar | though idps and mappigns are related, the issues are different, i think | 15:54 |
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| dolphm | yeah... my impression from the summit was that idp's were going to be peers to domains, sort of | 15:54 |
| dolphm | not have a parent/child relationship with them | 15:54 |
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| dolphm | which i figured would set us up nicely for Domain Users != Ephemeral IdP Users | 15:54 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, yeah, but guang is saying that we need to account for public cloud use cases | 15:55 |
| dolphm | which is different how | 15:55 |
| stevemar | specifically: 1. Domain admin needs to be able to manage IdPs for his domain. 2. Need the ability to restrict IdPs for a given domain. | 15:55 |
| marekd | ok, but what problem would adding domain_id to IdP solve? that I may have multiple independent IdPs managing different domains, MY domains? | 15:55 |
| dolphm | stevemar: "restrict IdPs for a given domain" -- restrict how? | 15:56 |
| stevemar | marekd, it would solve #1 mentioned | 15:56 |
| dolphm | marekd: ++ | 15:56 |
| stevemar | dolphm, yeah, restrict is a loose term | 15:56 |
| stevemar | dolphm: i wasn't sure | 15:56 |
| dolphm | stevemar: we're so far from the "virtual" idp thing, that I don't think we can seriously delegate any sort of idp administration to anyone yet -- beyond *perhaps* mapping | 15:56 |
| stevemar | dolphm, not my comments, gyee's | 15:56 |
| marekd | my question is whether it's common for companies to have many LDAPs for their users..i don't personally know. | 15:57 |
| dolphm | stevemar: but he's not online so i'm asking the messenger :P | 15:57 |
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| stevemar | topol, ping? | 15:58 |
| topol | stevemar, hi | 15:59 |
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| topol | otp | 15:59 |
| stevemar | topol: big generic question -> do most companies have multiple ldaps? | 15:59 |
| stevemar | doh | 15:59 |
| topol | YES!! | 15:59 |
| stevemar | marekd, see above | 15:59 |
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| viktors | dhellmann: as for oslo.db - there is a patch, that removes eventlet tpool form oslo - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60031/ . Can you please look at it | 15:59 |
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| dolphm | marekd: i don't know about "many" but i could see two quite easily (one for employees, one for customers? that | 16:00 |
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| stevemar | dolphm++ | 16:00 |
| marekd | stevemar: dolphm : OK. | 16:01 |
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| dolphm | ... is i think how rackspace does it, actually) | 16:01 |
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| dolphm | but i would treat those as separate federations | 16:01 |
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| dolphm | and probably wouldn't have any interest in making them part of the same domain or anything | 16:01 |
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| marekd | i was not fighting against domains, rather wondering. | 16:01 |
| stevemar | dolphm: you think "Domain admin needs to be able to manage IdPs for his domain" is an invaid argument... since we're not managing idps at this stage? | 16:02 |
| stevemar | beyong the mapping part... | 16:02 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: i think it's a valid use case, but i don't think we can address it in icehouse | 16:02 |
| marekd | i think 'having a one IdP for everyone' is a subset of 'having multiple IdPs' so the use-cases would not collide? :-) | 16:02 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: we have to start with deployers managing idp's first | 16:02 |
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| stevemar | doplhm, okay, i'm reading it as: valid comments, but for next iteration? | 16:03 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: ++ | 16:04 |
| dolphm | stevemar: it's not the simplest use case to solve, let's not get hung up on solving it! | 16:04 |
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| stevemar | okay with me | 16:05 |
| stevemar | dolphm, marekd, still on idps.. | 16:05 |
| stevemar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59846/4/openstack-identity-api/v3/src/markdown/identity-api-v3-os-idp-ext.md | 16:05 |
| stevemar | line 335 | 16:05 |
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| stevemar | thoughts? | 16:06 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: is the mapping extension useful without the idp extension, or vice versa? are either of these extensions at risk to be replaced without affecting the other? | 16:06 |
| stevemar | dolphm, i think they are useless without each other, marekd? | 16:07 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, i think mapping is meant to be generic | 16:07 |
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| marekd | stevemar: i think we must match the saml assertion with the IdP instance and then go directly to mapping that is tied to it. | 16:07 |
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| marekd | otherwise, you would have to merge IdP entities with mapings. | 16:08 |
| dolphm | stevemar: commented | 16:08 |
| stevemar | dolphm, marekd, the comments on line 39 are useful | 16:09 |
| dolphm | marekd: which chadwick did not want at the conference, given his 100 IdP's sharing one standard mapping argument <-- which sounds awesome, btw | 16:09 |
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| stevemar | agreed | 16:10 |
| marekd | dolphm: and that's why i agree the mapping and idp should be separated. | 16:10 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: commented on 39 | 16:11 |
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| dolphm | marekd: separated, but i'm just thinking that after IdP extension lands, we should reconsider adding all the mapping functionality to that same extension | 16:11 |
| dolphm | a plethora of tightly coupled extensions provides no benefit beyond a single extension | 16:12 |
| stevemar | yeah | 16:12 |
| dolphm | and these are so tightly coupled that we're already referencing the mapping extension from the IdP extension, and vice versa | 16:12 |
| stevemar | switch gears to mapping? | 16:12 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: stop trying to get ahead :P | 16:13 |
| stevemar | just trying to keep the train going | 16:13 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: well, i guess i'd like to talk about domains from the mapping side as well... | 16:14 |
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| marekd | dolphm: stevemar: not sure i got it - you want to invert relations between mapping and IdP ? | 16:14 |
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| stevemar | marekd, no, keep as it | 16:14 |
| stevemar | is | 16:14 |
| dolphm | at the summit, jose and i agreed that the *only* attribute you needed to assign users in a mapping was groups | 16:14 |
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| dolphm | the only *authorization* attribute | 16:14 |
| marekd | dolphm: ++ | 16:14 |
| dolphm | stevemar: ++ | 16:14 |
| dolphm | the question we didn't answer is this -- which domain's groups? | 16:15 |
| stevemar | and any authN attributes.. ?, and yes that one | 16:15 |
| viktors | dhellmann: ping? | 16:15 |
| dolphm | or is the answer just group_id's, so domains don't matter (which i kind of like) | 16:15 |
| dolphm | stevemar: ignore authN attributes for now | 16:15 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, so drop domain/user_id and user_name? | 16:17 |
| dolphm | stevemar: i just mean i don't want to talk about them right now | 16:17 |
| stevemar | ha | 16:17 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, okay, so the assertion will get mapped to a group | 16:20 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: ++ group_id? | 16:20 |
| stevemar | dolphm, but groups are domains or projects specific right? | 16:21 |
| dolphm | stevemar: what? | 16:21 |
| stevemar | err, Domains -> a high-level container for projects, users and groups | 16:21 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: yes, that's the definition of a domain (what's your question?) | 16:22 |
| stevemar | dolphm, oh, group_ids are still globally unique | 16:23 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: yeah, which means you can grant ephemeral users authorization into any openstack resource | 16:24 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: i wouldn't mind taking a more conservative approach, and then expand on it later... but i don't know what that would be | 16:24 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, kent folk uploaded a new api spec for which attributes an idp should trust | 16:27 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, and it follows the structure we agreed on, and would land perfectly with our propsed apis | 16:28 |
| dolphm | stevemar: link? | 16:28 |
| stevemar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60489/ | 16:28 |
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| stevemar | dolphm: i'm so pumped that everyone is mostly on the same page | 16:28 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: ++ | 16:29 |
| dolphm | stevemar: this is another one that should just be merged into the same doc lol | 16:29 |
| stevemar | yeah, for sure | 16:29 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: anyway -- i don't recall what the use case for this is | 16:30 |
| dolphm | and there's no bp | 16:30 |
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| stevemar | because an idp can't blindly trust any assertions coming in | 16:31 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: you mean the other way around? | 16:31 |
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| marekd | stevemar: can't you constraint it in the mapping? | 16:31 |
| stevemar | oops, yeah | 16:31 |
| dolphm | stevemar: keystone as a SP can't blindly trust any assertions coming in from an IdP | 16:31 |
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| marekd | dolphm: ++ | 16:31 |
| stevemar | marekd, probably | 16:31 |
| dolphm | marekd: ++ this seems ever so slightly redundant with mapping | 16:31 |
| marekd | dolphm: exactly. | 16:32 |
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| stevemar | dolphm: <dolphm>stevemar: i just mean i don't want to talk about them right now | 16:32 |
| marekd | dolphm: oups, i read that SP can blindly trus assertion - in fact i feel it can, because it TRUSTS this IdP and it validates that assertion comes from that IdP. | 16:32 |
| dolphm | you're doing the same restriction with mapping... the difference in use case must be one is deployer defined (this thing) and the other is idp-defined (mapping) | 16:32 |
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| stevemar | dolphm++ | 16:33 |
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| marekd | dolphm: stevemar if the use-case for this markdown is specyfing what params (and possible values) and IdP will trust and use -> it looks like simpler mapping. | 16:33 |
| dolphm | this smells like something else to pursue in jeorgia | 16:33 |
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| dolphm | hughsaunders: i'm still determined to make this happen ^ | 16:34 |
| stevemar | it doesn't do the full mapping, just specifies what we can trust | 16:34 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: right. but if it's not in the mapping, then it's not trusted and ignored anyway :P | 16:34 |
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| marekd | dolphm: ++ plus we have nice logic expressed with 'any_value_of', 'not_any_of' etc | 16:35 |
| stevemar | but, like you said, different use cases | 16:35 |
| stevemar | dolph, marekd -> back to the big questioN: no mapping any authN attributes? | 16:36 |
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| stevemar | no one gets lunch until we decide on that one | 16:36 |
| stevemar | (or dinner, in mareks case) | 16:36 |
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| marekd | stevemar: haha | 16:37 |
| dolphm | alright fine -- why do we need authn attributes in mapping | 16:37 |
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| stevemar | more info is always good, why don't we want authn in mapping? | 16:39 |
| topol | stevemar, dolphm did you get what you needed from me? | 16:39 |
| topol | morganfainberg, you around? | 16:40 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: more info is usually bad -- it creates expectations for unintended use cases and then we get bugs and more work to do | 16:42 |
| dolphm | and initial constraints can be relaxed later | 16:43 |
| stevemar | topol, yes we did | 16:43 |
| stevemar | dolphm, we're really just talking about domain | 16:43 |
| hughsaunders | dolphm: Jeorgia FTW | 16:44 |
| stevemar | dolphm, to be clear, i don't care if domain goes in or not, but gyee is insistent :) | 16:44 |
| marekd | stevemar: ++ me too :D | 16:45 |
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| marekd | dolphm: you are trying to use just small set of authn attributes, right? and make 'generic' rules for mappings. | 16:45 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: maybe he was in a conversation i was not, but as a result of the whole realms vs domains thing -- we decided on complete separation between IdP's and domains, where IdP's handle authN, domains sort of handle authZ, and mappings create a bridge between the two | 16:46 |
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| dolphm | marekd: frankly, i'd rather not have any authN attributes in mappings, i'd rather not have ephemeral users, and i'd like to remove identity information from tokens | 16:47 |
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| dolphm | the only argument against all of that i've heard is for the sake of auditing, but that's solvable by emitting some sort of auditing log that token X was issued as a result of federated assertions Y | 16:48 |
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| dolphm | no matter what, it seems like you have to trace back to the IdP to get the true identity of a user anyway, in the case of auditing | 16:48 |
| marekd | dolphm: so how do you want to map assertion -> keystone group? i am probably missing something. | 16:48 |
| dolphm | marekd: like, mappings can only assign to group_id's | 16:49 |
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| marekd | yes. | 16:49 |
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| stevemar | i think there is still a disconnect | 16:50 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: probably -- where? | 16:50 |
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| stevemar | or maybe not | 16:51 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, marekd, i think we're done? | 16:54 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, jamielennox made the suggestion that instead of doing , `POST /OS_REVOKE/domain/4bf3d9` and `POST /OS_REVOKE/project/abcdef` I just make a single `POST /OS_REVOKE/abcdef` and pass in the scope-type in the body of the message. I'm not sure I like that either, but I can see the argument that we should not have to have a separate URL for each type we are revoking | 16:58 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: i'll respond to a couple of comments in the idp review regarding domains | 16:58 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: what the hell is that an API for?? | 16:59 |
| ayoung | what is the most consistent URL scheme for revocations with the other API docs? | 16:59 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, revoking something directly | 16:59 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i thought we decided it made zero sense to expose this to the API | 16:59 |
| marekd | stevemar: for now yes, can i now go and eat my dinner? :-) | 16:59 |
| stevemar | have fun :) | 16:59 |
| dolphm | ayoung: all we need to expose is a GET request | 16:59 |
| dolphm | marekd: yes | 17:00 |
| ayoung | dolphm, let me check the etherpad | 17:00 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: either way, it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay out of scope for icehouse | 17:00 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, having a way to revoke externally actually makes the API easier to test stand along | 17:01 |
| ayoung | alone | 17:01 |
| dolphm | ayoung: you want to expose an API to *TEST* shit?! wtf | 17:01 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, more than that, as I suspect we will want to be able to remotely trigger events based on IdP etc operations | 17:02 |
| dolphm | ayoung: which we don't have yet, so it's not a valid use case | 17:02 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, ok, time for you to cut back on the Coffee. | 17:02 |
| dolphm | ayoung: you're trying to get way ahead of yourself! | 17:03 |
| ayoung | dolphm, the idea is that I want to put the revocation API in stand alone, before I tie it in to other backends, as the tie in is the tough thing to get right | 17:03 |
| ayoung | I want a simple way to say "revoke this" | 17:03 |
| dolphm | ayoung: stand alone != crud | 17:03 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: do that through a driver interface, not through HTTP | 17:03 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, I agree that Update or Delete do not make sense, but create does. | 17:07 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: not today | 17:08 |
| ayoung | dolphm, are you hard set against it? If so, I'll remove, just kindof surprised. | 17:08 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: yeah, i'm hard set against it because i talked about it with someone (apologies if it wasn't you -- i thought it was?) but that's part of the reason it's not mentioned in the bp | 17:09 |
| mriedem | looks like a new glance gate failure: https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1259907 | 17:10 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1259907 in openstack-ci "check-grenade-dsvm marked as FAILED - "Failed to upload testbucket/bundle.img.manifest.xml" in n-api" [Undecided,New] | 17:10 |
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| mriedem | markwash: fyi https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1259907 | 17:11 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1259907 in openstack-ci "check-grenade-dsvm marked as FAILED - "Failed to upload testbucket/bundle.img.manifest.xml" in n-api" [Undecided,New] | 17:11 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, OK...I guess we can always add it later if we decide we do want it. Easy to remove. | 17:13 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, how do we do time windows on a request? Like this? GET /OS_REVOKE/events?since=2013-02-27T18:30:59.999999Z | 17:18 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: i think that needs to be URL encoded, but sure -- maybe just make it slightly more specific, e.g. revoked_since ? | 17:21 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, sure...it was the date portion I was concerned with...we specify ISO 8601 in the responses, but I don't know if that works for requests. Was wondering if we had any prior art? | 17:22 |
| dolphm | ayoung: not in keystone that i'm aware of | 17:22 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9581692/recommended-date-format-for-rest-get-api | 17:25 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: cool | 17:29 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i'd rather not make clients handle more than one format anyway | 17:29 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, so ISO 8601 URL encoded? | 17:30 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: ++ your example, just encoded | 17:30 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: also, ++ for a query string as that follows the rest of the v3 API | 17:30 |
| dolphm | (i.e. it's just a filter) | 17:30 |
| dolphm | ayoung: btw, you'll love this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1260015 (and it's already marked as won't fix!) | 17:31 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1260015 in openstack-ci "PKI token contains the string "ERROR"" [Undecided,New] | 17:31 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, wow....wonder what else we'll find encoded that way | 17:33 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, it will look like this revoked_since=2013-02-27T18%3A30%3A59.999999Z | 17:36 |
| dolphm | ayoung: looks right to me | 17:36 |
| ayoung | data = {'revoked_since':'2013-02-27T18:30:59.999999Z'} | 17:36 |
| ayoung | urllib.urlencode(data) | 17:36 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, so just this https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59546/5/openstack-identity-api/v3/src/markdown/identity-api-v3-os-revoke-ext.md | 17:40 |
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| nkinder | markwash: When you get a chance, let me know if my latest changes to the OSSN about image sharing look good to you. | 18:02 |
| nkinder | gyee: ping | 18:02 |
| nkinder | gyee: thanks for your reviews on the KDS API doc | 18:03 |
| openstackstatus | NOTICE: Grenade gate infra issues: use "reverify bug 1259911" | 18:03 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1259911 in openstack-ci "apt.puppetlabs.com connectivity problem from rax breaks grenade job" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1259911 | 18:03 |
| *** ChanServ changes topic to "Grenade gate infra issues: use "reverify bug 1259911"" | 18:03 | |
| nkinder | gyee: I've added some responses there, but it might help to discuss some of them here to prevent the back and forth. | 18:03 |
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| nkinder | gyee: I've been trying to keep the API generic so it can be applicable to various use-cases. | 18:04 |
| nkinder | gyee: This is why some of the specifics of AMQP messaging have been intentionally left out of the API document. | 18:04 |
| nkinder | gyee: There is a separate document about the implementation of KDS and how it is used to secure messages. | 18:05 |
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| notmyname | ttx: note that I backported the sphinx patch that was borking the gate for everyone to milestone-proposed | 18:13 |
| gyee | nkinder, understood, as a reviewer, I need to understand the spec so I can review the code more effectively | 18:13 |
| gyee | thanks for the clarifications | 18:14 |
| nkinder | gyee: I've struggled with how much to put in the API document as well. | 18:14 |
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| gyee | nkinder, my main concern is code review as this is a lot of code | 18:15 |
| nkinder | gyee: I think adding something about authorization for the API around long term keys and groups is a very good thing that you pointed out. | 18:15 |
| gyee | we need to have a good understanding of the spec | 18:15 |
| nkinder | gyee: I think the "MessageSecurity" document will likely need a cleanup pass too. | 18:16 |
| gyee | nkinder, yes, that helps a lot | 18:16 |
| nkinder | gyee: I'm trying to get the API nailed down so the implementation can be changed to match, then we can clean up the implementation document to help reviewers understand it. | 18:17 |
| gyee | nkinder, yeah I agreed, if the reviewer understand the think behind the spec, code review will be much easier | 18:18 |
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| gyee | thinking | 18:18 |
| gyee | this is a lot code :) | 18:18 |
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| luis_ | dhellmann, let me know if you have more comments on these, i'd like to start trying to syncronize with some of the projects, i have done the testing in devstack locally as you requested, and everythig looks good | 18:37 |
| luis_ | https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/oslo-incubator+branch:master+topic:bp/i18n-messages,n,z | 18:37 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, what is your view on uwsgi or gunicorn vs mod_wsgi? | 19:01 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, if you have an opinion | 19:01 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, I'm not familiar with those. | 19:01 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, links? | 19:01 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, i'm slowly working on fixing devstack to deploy keystone (and ceilometer) under httpd as default now. | 19:01 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, sec. | 19:02 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, http://projects.unbit.it/uwsgi/ and http://gunicorn.org/ | 19:02 |
| morganfainberg | was looking at this article and it was making me think it would be nice to have multiple wsgi-managers http://blog.kgriffs.com/2012/12/18/uwsgi-vs-gunicorn-vs-node-benchmarks.html | 19:03 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, my target (after talking with infra folks) is to work on this over the holidays. | 19:03 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, it would be ncie to gate on httpd running keystone instead of eventlet keystone | 19:03 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, in theory, yes, but time is a valuable resource, and right now (until I2) it should be focused on API affecting changes | 19:03 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, this was a going to spend a weekend doing it when i am burnt out on api changes ;) | 19:04 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, because that will happen. | 19:04 |
| ayoung | mod_wsgi is the sensible approach for that. | 19:04 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, and mod_wsgi is target #1, i might try and add the others post i-2 | 19:04 |
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| morganfainberg | depending on the workload | 19:04 |
| morganfainberg | maybe even post i3 | 19:04 |
| morganfainberg | :P | 19:04 |
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| ayoung | morganfainberg, I'm not certain that the 2 links you posted there have enough behind them to justify the effort, relative to where you could spend your time. | 19:05 |
| morganfainberg | just figured i'd bound the thoughts off you now...so when i do look at circling back, we might have another conversation | 19:05 |
| ayoung | I'm not super concerned with clean-wsgi compliance | 19:05 |
| ayoung | I'm more interested in getting certmonger and certmaster part of devstack | 19:06 |
| ayoung | and getting a good X509 strategy in place for all of Open Stack | 19:06 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, right, don't we need to get a maintainer for the deb pacakge? | 19:06 |
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| ayoung | morganfainberg, yes, got someone | 19:06 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, w00t :) | 19:06 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, good deal. | 19:06 |
| ayoung | Timo Aaltonen is working on FreeIPA on the Ubuntu side, and is moving the Certmaster piece on. | 19:07 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, in either case, i expect to burn a weekend somewhere when i need a break from mucking around in API land get mod_wsgi working for devstack cleanly for keystone. | 19:07 |
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| morganfainberg | but thats not today or tomorrow | 19:08 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, that would be awesome | 19:08 |
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| morganfainberg | yes, and i think i also want to make enabling the keystone caching layer an option in devstack as well. | 19:08 |
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| morganfainberg | bug thats more of a side project once we add more caching post-api cleanup | 19:09 |
| morganfainberg | anyway, testing a bug now to see if i need to report it, then off to domain cleanup land for the rest of the week. | 19:09 |
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| morganfainberg | unless massive kvs feedback occurs. | 19:09 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, passing thoughts, neural misfires...worth posing questions to sit on the back burner for future conversations | 19:10 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, caching in devstack doubleplusgood | 19:10 |
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| ayoung | bknudson, gyee dolphm https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59126/13 is critical path for a lot of code. I think we should expedite it in the review process. | 19:12 |
| gyee | ayoung, yes, reviewing it now | 19:13 |
| ayoung | gyee, thanks | 19:13 |
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| ayoung | morganfainberg, I'm going to stay on the KVS stuff until it is in. KVS and Federtion are the 2 killer features for this release, although KVS needs the revocation rework to really be useful. | 19:14 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, sounds good. | 19:14 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, i'm watching those reviews closely to address things going on | 19:14 |
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| ayoung | ++ | 19:15 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, but right now it needs more feedback. | 19:15 |
| morganfainberg | or approvals :) | 19:15 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, there was some reworking of the non-expiry keys last night to address an issue dstanek found. | 19:15 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, i think it's a much better implementation now. | 19:15 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, let me look | 19:15 |
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| ayoung | morganfainberg, I dropped a lot of the API in revocation, too | 19:16 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, nod. i saw the earlier conversation in the backscroll | 19:16 |
| morganfainberg | should make it easier to hi the target | 19:16 |
| dstanek | morganfainberg: cool, i have so many "review this code" emails that i didn't see it fly by | 19:16 |
| gyee | ayoung, morganfainberg, may take an hour or so as this is a lot of code | 19:16 |
| gyee | bare with me | 19:16 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, i apologize, but i strripped it down as much as i could to make it the base implementation | 19:17 |
| morganfainberg | it's a lot of logic to add. | 19:17 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, also, with the non-expiry key change, we can break the need for the memcache client even for testing | 19:17 |
| gyee | understood, just letting you guys know it may take an hour or so before I post the comments | 19:17 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, so it becomes truely optional. | 19:17 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, very good | 19:18 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, once i2 rolls i might do some treatment on the other "optional" stuff | 19:18 |
| morganfainberg | see if we can trim down hard-dependancies | 19:18 |
| ayoung | gyee, no no...bear with me. Bare means to go without clothes. | 19:18 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, bear with bareing with me? | 19:18 |
| morganfainberg | no no lets not do that | 19:19 |
| ayoung | I haint baring nothing | 19:19 |
| gyee | ayoung, my bad :) | 19:19 |
| ayoung | gyee, just glad I didn't subject you to my attempts at Cantonese. | 19:19 |
| gyee | I barely pass ESL | 19:19 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, english idioms... yeah, always fun. | 19:19 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, whats the equivalent in cantonese? if there is one. | 19:19 |
| gyee | bare? | 19:20 |
| morganfainberg | "bear with me"? | 19:20 |
| morganfainberg | or is that so idiomatic...it's non translatable | 19:20 |
| gyee | that I am not sure | 19:20 |
| ayoung | 包涵 | 19:20 |
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| ayoung | But that is Mandarin | 19:20 |
| gyee | bear hug | 19:21 |
| morganfainberg | hehe | 19:21 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, ayoung, gyee, bknudson, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/61419/ | 19:28 |
| ayoung | dolphm, on your "follow the BP" comment, is that just for specifying user_id, project id etc, or is it something else? | 19:28 |
| morganfainberg | ec2token fix | 19:28 |
| morganfainberg | jenkins just said +1 | 19:28 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, is the global key mangler override the local one in kvs section? | 19:28 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, +2 | 19:28 |
| gyee | there are two key mangler options | 19:28 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, the KVS global key mangler option disables all keymangling in all kvs backends | 19:29 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, if the backend has a hard requirement for a specific key mangler, it can be specified (think some crazy backend that can't handle keys outside of a specific format) | 19:29 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, k, just want to make sure the doc is clear on that | 19:29 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, and the last option is passing the keymangler to the configure option, which will be used unless either of the other two scenarios are active | 19:30 |
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| gyee | morganfainberg, so if the global one is false, the others will be ignored? | 19:30 |
| morganfainberg | so, 1) global toggle, backend forced, passed in configured, default | 19:30 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, ^ is the order of resolution | 19:30 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, correct, no key_mangling will occur if the global is toggled off. it's usefule for debugging. | 19:31 |
| gyee | k, sounds good | 19:31 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, gyee morganfainberg https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/KeystonePerformance | 19:34 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, i saw an email thread on this ... last night? this morning? | 19:35 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, yeah, it is our internal Perf team learning how not to be so internal | 19:35 |
| gyee | nice! | 19:36 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, good to know. i had a talk with one of the rackspace guys at the summit regarding some perf testing he did on keystone | 19:36 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, ^ should get what insight form that perf testing where possible added | 19:36 |
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| gyee | perf will be different for different backends | 19:36 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, correct. | 19:36 |
| gyee | would be nice we can *trace* a call, like when it hit the router, how much time it spend in controller, how much time it spend on backend, etc | 19:37 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, i was thinking... does it make sense to not even do a parse_isotime and normalize on datestamps in the kvs backend? just do string comparisons of the isotime_str? eg str > str? | 19:38 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, not sure if that would work as well | 19:38 |
| gyee | typically, I've seen implementations adding timestamps in the headers | 19:38 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, if you are going to compare them, compare them as dates, not strings | 19:38 |
| gyee | they aggregate them to produce a graph | 19:38 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, ok fair enough. i'll continue with the parse_isotime and normalize calls | 19:38 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, since i haven't added the smash token datestamps down code yet (will implement with encrypt/hmac since that needs to json dumps everything anyway) | 19:39 |
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| dolphm | galstrom: i swear i bookmarked it -- but do you have a public link to the performance job you're running? (cc- morganfainberg ayoung) | 19:42 |
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| galstrom | dolphm: let me see if i can find it.. not sure i had a public link | 19:48 |
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| topol | morganfainberg, quick question for you. So MemcachedBackend does not need to subclass api.CacheBackend and dogpile.cache does not care if your new registered backend subclasses api.CacheBackend or not? | 20:01 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, no, it doesn't it's a pivot manager since we have extra logic we're applying. instead of re-implementing the manager code, i figured i'd just leverage what we had. dogpile.cache does care somewhat, but | 20:02 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, the manager passes all method calls to the driver, which is a CacheBackend | 20:02 |
| morganfainberg | topol, it doesn't do isinstance() checks. it just cares the interfaces are sane | 20:02 |
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| topol | morganfainberg, so as long as you implement the expected functions all is well correct? Do most classes not do isinstance() checks. As a former Java guy I need to get more comfortable with this relaxed approach | 20:05 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, i use isinstance a lot more, but this is a ducktype'd language | 20:07 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it might as well be a duck | 20:07 |
| morganfainberg | topol, even if it isn't. | 20:07 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, afaict we care more about interfaces than actual classes. | 20:07 |
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| topol | K, this swan will learn to live with the ducks. :-) Thanks! | 20:08 |
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| topol | Yes, I just have to get more comfortable with that. My problem :-) | 20:08 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, but you'll notice i tend to write a bit more strictly because isinstance can at least guarantee my interfaces are sane. | 20:08 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, it's a fine line to balance on, my take is be as flexible as you can... until you can't be ;) | 20:09 |
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| topol | morganfainberg, excellent. Thanks for the clarifications | 20:09 |
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| gyee | morganfainberg, got a bunch of questions and comments for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59126/ | 20:13 |
| gyee | nothing major | 20:13 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, cool i'll look at them in a moment, thanks! | 20:13 |
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| gyee | morganfainberg, food time here, be back in 30 mins | 20:13 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, cool. have good lunchj | 20:14 |
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| topol | gyee, take 45. you earned it | 20:16 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: ping | 20:17 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, there are a few people working on Federation | 20:17 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, have you seen the API reviews? | 20:18 |
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| hartsocks | nope. I've been out of it for a bit. | 20:18 |
| hartsocks | I'm back full time now. | 20:18 |
| ayoung | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59848/ | 20:18 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, also https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59846/ | 20:18 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, and then SAML is here https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59849/ | 20:19 |
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| hartsocks | We have this: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/vmware-sso-support | 20:19 |
| hartsocks | Which has 3 ways to go as I see it. | 20:20 |
| hartsocks | 1. do something smart with SAML and keystone and vCenter SSO... | 20:20 |
| hartsocks | 2. do something hacky with SAML and the driver | 20:20 |
| hartsocks | 3. do something dumb with some kind of password storage off-line that then generates SAML tokens then does one of the first two things. | 20:21 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, is the VMWare SSO anything vaguelt resembling an open standard? | 20:21 |
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| hartsocks | it's SAML | 20:21 |
| ayoung | Ok, what makes it special? | 20:21 |
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| hartsocks | nothing much other than the tokens are a pain to parse. | 20:22 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: 1 or 2? | 20:22 |
| * hartsocks I didn't say that. | 20:22 | |
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| * hartsocks looks up link to make sure | 20:22 | |
| pcm_ | Anyone: Have a question on the convention for handling REST requests that timeout... | 20:22 |
| hartsocks | #link http://blogs.vmware.com/vsphere/tag/vcenter-sso | 20:22 |
| hartsocks | SAML v2 based on that material | 20:23 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, you are giving me PTSD flashbacks to my time working on vSphere | 20:24 |
| hartsocks | also WS-TRUST | 20:24 |
| hartsocks | heh. | 20:24 |
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| ayoung | http://thinkvirt.com/?q=node/57 | 20:24 |
| hartsocks | well, it's my job to deal with this stuff… I just want to make there's some code to do the right things. | 20:25 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: nice. | 20:25 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, but that was another lifetime | 20:26 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, is there anything in the SAML documents from vsphere that is interesting? YOu guys carry any authorization data in there beyond "users and groups? | 20:26 |
| hartsocks | I helped write the SSO samples for the new API… and we *didn't* write anything demonstrating that. It doesn't mean there isn't anything there though. | 20:27 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, OK, if that is the case, then I would say the the vSphere SAML document is just another SAML integration point. | 20:28 |
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| ayoung | Work with stevemar on getting the SAML and related BPs into order and you'll have what you need | 20:29 |
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| hartsocks | My dream use case is for something like this… | 20:29 |
| hartsocks | * Nova/Cinder drivers pull a SAML token magically from the security context | 20:30 |
| hartsocks | * No passwords in any conf | 20:30 |
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| hartsocks | … if we can do that, I think I'll meet my objectives. | 20:30 |
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| hartsocks | okay, stevemar … https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~stevemar | 20:31 |
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| hartsocks | do I have the dependency tree on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/vmware-sso-support set up right? | 20:32 |
| dolphm | ayoung: keystone would have reason to expose SAML responses to other services though... normally | 20:32 |
| dolphm | ayoung: what do you expect from stevemar? | 20:32 |
| dolphm | keystone wouldn't* | 20:32 |
| ayoung | dolphm, he's working on the SAML/Federation BPs. I expect the world from stevemar, and I know he is capable of producing. | 20:33 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, I would not expect keystone to produce saml | 20:33 |
| ayoung | at least, not in the Icehouse timeframe | 20:33 |
| dolphm | ayoung: yeah, but what exactly? keystone to persist SAML responses and expose them? | 20:33 |
| ayoung | dolphm, and I think hartsocks doesn't quite get that yet | 20:34 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: i'm trying to make the jump from keystone abstracting federation away from the rest of the stack to keystone exposing federation responses to nova/cinder | 20:34 |
| ayoung | dolphm, the vsphere use case is SAML -> Keystone Token just like everyother SAML provider | 20:34 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, unless there is enough information in the SAML token to tell Nova what roles the user should have on a specific project, you can't do SAML direct to Nova | 20:35 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i'm hearing the opposite from hartsocks -- nova/cinder want raw SAML to talk to vsphere | 20:35 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: Well, this is why I felt we should discuss this… that's not what I'm after. | 20:35 |
| hartsocks | So, what I see is... | 20:36 |
| hartsocks | … let me back up ... | 20:36 |
| hartsocks | Let's start at the CLI. | 20:36 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: ++ thanks | 20:36 |
| hartsocks | So from $ nova list | 20:36 |
| hartsocks | in an env like devstack... | 20:37 |
| hartsocks | I've got a username and password stuck up in my shell env. | 20:37 |
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| hartsocks | That username and password are presumably sent as credentials to Keystone. | 20:37 |
| hartsocks | keystone authenticates me (and I presume authorizes me) | 20:37 |
| hartsocks | Next I issue a message of some kind down to the rest of the stack... | 20:38 |
| hartsocks | If I do some kind of ... | 20:38 |
| hartsocks | $ nova boot … blah b.ah | 20:38 |
| hartsocks | then I'm doing that authentication dance again. | 20:38 |
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| hartsocks | This time, however, at some point the Nova Driver for VMware kicks in. | 20:39 |
| hartsocks | At the start of the Driver's operations... | 20:39 |
| hartsocks | it pulls in *another* username and password from another source... | 20:39 |
| hartsocks | which it uses to authenticate again against vCenter. | 20:39 |
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| hartsocks | This new credential set is another identity all together. | 20:39 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, is vCenter going to authenticate as the end user, or as a service user? | 20:39 |
| hartsocks | So… why? | 20:40 |
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| hartsocks | My thought was that it should authenticate against the CLI user… because the "right thing" to do is that the tenant... | 20:40 |
| hartsocks | should have a credential for vSphere anyway. | 20:40 |
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| hartsocks | Basically the idea here is that a vSphere user and a Nova tenant should be the same thing. | 20:41 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: the problem keystone is working to solve right now is to make those the same user... in other words, the end user authenticates with vcenter, and openstack/keystone trusts vcenter that the user has been authenticated. keystone then provides authorization within openstack and the SAML response from vcenter is basically discarded. | 20:41 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: so, how do I make sure I use the CLI -> Keystone authentication token or whatever for the Nova -> vSphere "re-authentication" that has to happen when the Driver opens it's *shudder* SOAP *shudder* connection. | 20:43 |
| hartsocks | ? | 20:43 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: so, nova/cinder wouldn't know the difference between a vcenter user and any other (i.e. a password-based user originating from keystone); nova/cinder also wouldn't have access to any information useful to go talk to vcenter itself | 20:43 |
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| hartsocks | I'd like to hide any work that needs to happen to do that… yes. I *think* if I'm getting this right. | 20:43 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, then the CLI user needs to pass the SAML document that it has to Nova, and nova needs to pass that on to vSphere | 20:44 |
| * hartsocks rereads things | 20:44 | |
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| ayoung | That, of course, assumes that no PKI is done to ensure that the CLI user actually has a private key associated with the SAML document, and that the request is not signed | 20:44 |
| hartsocks | ayoung: yes, that's pretty much it… this is essentially an "acts as" or "proxy granting token" situation. | 20:45 |
| dolphm | ayoung: IF that SAML doc is useful for more than just federation -- and i'm not sure it would be? | 20:45 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, in this case, I suspect that it is essential | 20:45 |
| ayoung | dolphm, the SAML document is specific to vSphere, and implements their authorization model directly | 20:45 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, posted responses, will get a new review up shortly, do have 1 question for you though before i publish the next version (when you're back from lunch) | 20:45 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: sure, but would it not be different than the SAML document that keystone would receive? | 20:46 |
| ayoung | dolphm, it could be identical, no reason to use multiple SAML docs for this | 20:46 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, the ideal for his use case would be to by pass Keystone, and have Nova consume the SAML directly, but then he loses the role/project abstraction | 20:47 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: if that's true ^ then the client merely needs to provide the entire SAML doc in (certain?) requests to nova, and nova/cinder just needs to try to use it (validation will presumably be performed by vsphere) | 20:48 |
| * hartsocks reads carefully | 20:48 | |
| dolphm | ayoung: i don't think nova needs to "consume" the SAML doc at that point, just pass it along | 20:48 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung, dolphm: I've not dug far enough on this yet but I was hoping from Nova we could write code that was essentially… context.getToken(node_name) … or something like that. Which hopefully conceals most of this and preserves roles between Keystone->Nova->vSphere | 20:49 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, one potential approach would be for you to write a SAML emitter from Keystone, that takes the same data that is in the Keystone tokens, and puts it into a SAML document. THen, on the nova side, modify auth_token middleware to accept a SAML document instead of a token. The SAML assertion would be the superset of Keystone and vSPhere attributes | 20:49 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: vsphere wouldn't trust that | 20:50 |
| dolphm | that's literally forging assertions | 20:51 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, no, you just need to tell vSphere that Keystone assertions are to be trusted | 20:51 |
| ayoung | dolphm, It might even be possible to embed the original SAML assertion inside the Keystone one | 20:51 |
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| ayoung | the assertion would be pretty big, though. THink we are already hitting header max size limits as it is. | 20:52 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, back | 20:53 |
| hartsocks | hmm… I wrote some samples with vCenter's SSO that cached a token on the file system for multiple uses from the CLI… does that help? | 20:53 |
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| gyee | topol, you are so generous, if you are my manager, I'd ask for a mini vacation right now :) | 20:53 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, I don't see how. | 20:54 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, on the _register_backends, should the logic be in _register_backends to do nothing or a simple if logic around the call to register_backends? | 20:54 |
| hartsocks | heh. well, this goes with one of the "less smart" approaches | 20:54 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59126/13/keystone/common/kvs/core.py | 20:55 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, the backends are statically configured in keystone.conf right | 20:55 |
| hartsocks | ayoung, I definitely need to refresh my memory on how these tokens work then. | 20:55 |
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| gyee | can do do the registration on import? | 20:55 |
| gyee | can we | 20:55 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, they are analogues to SAML assertions. They are a CMS signed JSON document that contains user role assignments | 20:56 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: did you say earlier that you were storing user's vcenter passwords in conf? | 20:56 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, ... maybe... i have concerns about that because config isn't always in a perfect state on import (note: testing) | 20:56 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: in nova conf? | 20:56 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, up to you, not a showstopper | 20:56 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: at the moment, yes. It's a bad solution. The username and pass are plain text. | 20:57 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, i think i'd rather do the imports when KVS is instantiated instead just to give more leeway for config being in a happy state. | 20:57 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, i'll leave that one as is for now. other than that, i'll get the other changes lined up here today | 20:57 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, that's fine | 20:57 |
| morganfainberg | once i write a repro script for a bug i'm filing. | 20:57 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: we could make things a bit better by doing some simply encryption on the conf file. We could make things a bit better again by figuring out how to do holder-of-key tokens we pull from somewhere... | 20:58 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: I suppose I'm trying to work out how to preserve the identity of the user between all calling layers. | 21:00 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: but you're only using one username + password, i assume... irrelevant of the API user? | 21:04 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: Just did some digging, the samples I wrote over a year ago were acquiring a holder of key token by user credentials supplied at the CLI… then storing this HoK token on the file system for re-use based on a file system level cache. That seemed to work fine. Why wouldn't we do do something like that in Keystone? | 21:05 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: why is the burden not on the client to provide SAML docs generated by vsphere? (rather than the user handing over credentials to nova?) | 21:07 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: yes, this use-case would pair the username + password supplied at Horizon or at the CLI with the identity used at the vSphere level. That is, to create a tenant a VI admin would actually create an LDAP entry to generate a vSphere user. | 21:07 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: I'm not sure I follow. | 21:08 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: i.e. users normally don't want to hand over their credentials to system A over to system B, so that system B can hijack the user's account on system A | 21:09 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: as a user, i'd rather authenticate with vsphere myself, and then present nova with the results of that authentication so that nova can go do work for me | 21:09 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: okay, so how would that look? | 21:10 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: (same pattern as users authenticating with keystone and then presenting nova with a token as proof) | 21:10 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: as a nova user knowing that nova needs to talk to vsphere for me, i'd go get a SAML doc from vsphere myself (never giving my vsphere credentials to nova), hand the SAML doc over to nova, and then nova can use that to do work on vsphere | 21:11 |
| dolphm | so, the burden is mostly client-side | 21:11 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: unless i'm misunderstanding the end goal, which is always likely :) | 21:12 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, I think I understand it the way you just described it as well | 21:12 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: sure… so if I follow… the flow looks like... | 21:12 |
| hartsocks | login vCenter *some how* get SAML document | 21:13 |
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| hartsocks | hand SAML document *some how* to Nova | 21:13 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: would you call this federation? because i don't think (in this scenario) nova cares about the contents of the user's SAML doc... nova would just pass it back to vsphere and then vsphere accepts/denies it's own SAML assertions | 21:14 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: ++ the first *some how* is entirely between the client and vsphere | 21:14 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I'm assuming other openstack components come in to play, otherwise, why bother with nova. Just do vSphere and be done with it | 21:14 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: the second somehow is *probably* a header, or if this is always a POST request to nova, it could just be another attribute in the request | 21:15 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: my understanding is that vSphere's SSO isn't proprietary, so i really only have to know how to authenticate with my IdP and speak OpenStack beyond taht | 21:16 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: I was really thinking this would be something to do with the security context … that you would populate that *somehow* with an attribute I could pull out and hand to the SOAP conversation Nova was having with vSphere. | 21:16 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: it could be a one-liner middleware to pull some header out of hte request and add it to context | 21:17 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: my samples are in Java… we do a lot of backflipping to pull XML elements out of headers … the token object itself is an XML Element object (not that this matters too much for any reason other than the pain it's giving me to read this). | 21:19 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: I'm sure this won't be nearly as much work in Python. | 21:20 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm, ayoung: from the last few lines here, this doesn't sound so much like it's a part of federation … but more like some kind of proxy thing… am I thinking in the right direction here? | 21:22 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, there are 2 parts. One is Keystone, in which SAML is part of Federation. THat will let you use the SSO to communicate with Glance etc. THe other is Nova talking to vSphere, and that is not Federation, it just means passing SAML through to Nova | 21:23 |
| hartsocks | ayoung: So I'm interested in doing things the right way… but the second case is *really* what the people who sign my paychecks care about for icehouse. | 21:24 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, it is a custom Nova plugin, nothing to do with Keystone | 21:24 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: by the end of Icehouse we will likely have a glance, cinder, and nova vSphere driver that will all talk to vCenter's authentication mechanisms… | 21:28 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: I was hoping this would be one effort. | 21:30 |
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| ayoung | hartsocks, I'm not really certain what that means | 21:31 |
| ayoung | hartsocks, if you are going to replace auth_token middleware with SAML, fantastic | 21:31 |
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| hartsocks | ayoung: I'm interpreting your statement to mean I need to modify Nova, Cinder, etc. | 21:32 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: i don't think it'd be replacing, more so just supplementing | 21:32 |
| ayoung | otherwise...I think they are all going to have the same problem: how does the end user pass the SAML assertion to Glance such that Glance can fetch an image out of vSpheres image store | 21:32 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I know, I can dream, though | 21:32 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: if openstack is entirely acting as a proxy though, it's viable to drop keystone entirely as another system is handling all the authn/authz already | 21:33 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: you could pass the saml doc in X-Auth-Token, auth_token could be replaced with something that just passes it along rather than validates anything about it | 21:34 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: so… we're back to Federation after a fashion? | 21:37 |
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| hartsocks | I'm going to go read some Keystone code… hopefully that will help me be less dumb. | 21:41 |
| hartsocks | It looks like I should look at the various client code bits as well. | 21:42 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: no no, i think your immediate use case is distinct from what we're pursing as "federation" | 21:48 |
| dolphm | hartsocks: i thought ayoung explained the distinction pretty well | 21:49 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm, ayoung: okay, so I'm thinking we have 2 types of integration here then. The federation case is lower priority for solving some immediate problems on my plate… I would like to pursue this … what to call it… SAML proxying? but I'll have to do that as an extracurricular. I should probably code up something to make sure I've got my head around this properly. | 22:16 |
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| dolphm | hartsocks: it sounds like whatever you're doing in nova/cinder today should simply be moved over to the client, and the result passed to nova/cinder | 22:28 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: yeah, they're being pretty dumb right now... | 22:31 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: every time the driver is called they open a new network connection and use the credentials again. | 22:31 |
| hartsocks | dolpm: so there's got to be a number of *smarter* things to do. | 22:32 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: I would like to mask this behind some central call they could do so that way the RightThing(™) happens automatically to authenticate the Keystone user against vSphere or any other lower level service... | 22:33 |
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| hartsocks | dolphm: I would hope this could simplify the authentication part of driver development for all projects if done properly… | 22:34 |
| hartsocks | dolphm: what troubles me is that I have *two* identities for one user… I would like to at least be able to get rid of that. | 22:35 |
| hartsocks | I may have to build something to properly understand what I'm asking. | 22:36 |
| hartsocks | either way, it looks like I have more work to do and I don't get to piggy back on anything currently in development. | 22:36 |
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| pmathews | termie: ping | 22:42 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, new patchset posted. | 22:48 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: I'm adding clarification to the KDS doc on the way group membership is handled, and I really don't like it. | 22:52 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: I think we should just bite the bullet and handle defining group membership explicitly instead of comparing the party name to the group name. | 22:53 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: what do you think? | 22:54 |
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| gyee | nkinder, ++, much easier to grasp the concept with explicit membership | 22:54 |
| simo | nkinder: -- | 22:54 |
| simo | massive management overhead for queues | 22:55 |
| simo | with certain endless issues for admins | 22:55 |
| nkinder | simo: sorry, let me clarify. I think it should support matching. | 22:55 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, I wonder how the KVS locking mechanism hold up in a multi process environment | 22:55 |
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| simo | nkinder: and it should be the default | 22:55 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, the memcache bit or the weakref locking one? | 22:55 |
| nkinder | simo: I just think that a "member" is a rule that is used for matching the same way you use the group name now. | 22:56 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, those are both basically what dogpile.cache uses natively. just slightly modified to fit our usecase | 22:56 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, the weakref locking is only useful in threaded envs | 22:56 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, the keyvaluestorelock | 22:56 |
| nkinder | simo: so a group named "schedulers" would have a member rule of "scheduler.*" (or something similar) | 22:57 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, it should hold up. afaict from where it's based on. | 22:57 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, and we're not leveraging it in a ton of places, it's very limited, so impact should be minimal | 22:57 |
| nkinder | simo: for our use case, you would have the group named as "scheduler" just as your example, but the membership rule would be explicit. | 22:57 |
| simo | nkinder: as long as the KDS adds that rule by default for now I am fine | 22:58 |
| simo | nkinder: there is *no other* user for now, why do we need to add APIs we have no need to ? | 22:58 |
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| simo | this is just feature creep for some idealistic desire | 22:58 |
| nkinder | simo: well, we wouldn't have to change it in the future | 22:59 |
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| simo | nkinder: BS, unused stuff is broken stuff, by the time someone come to use it, we'll find we need to "fix" something | 22:59 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, i'm happy to rework it if needed though (any advice on direction would of course be welcome) | 23:00 |
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| gyee | morganfainberg, no need, we just have to deal with it later when the stuff is used outside of eventlet | 23:01 |
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| gyee | I mean if there's problem with locking | 23:02 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, fair enough. this appears to be eventlet/non-eventlet agnostic | 23:02 |
| morganfainberg | and _should_ work in either case afaik | 23:02 |
| morganfainberg | hopefully we don't run into a landmine there :) | 23:02 |
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| sdague | markwash: I also sent this to the list - http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-December/021983.html - but wanted to make sure to flag it to you as well. | 23:06 |
| ayoung | nkinder, I agree: explicit group membership | 23:06 |
| sdague | right now glance is changes can't merge until that requirements fix is handled | 23:06 |
| sdague | but lots of glance core are +Aing things into the gate | 23:07 |
| nkinder | ayoung: so we're all at a disagreement | 23:07 |
| sdague | which are just gumming it up for everyone else | 23:07 |
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| ayoung | nkinder, yep. So lets punt on groups altogether | 23:07 |
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| nkinder | ayoung: so no support for group messaging at all? | 23:08 |
| ayoung | nkinder, In order to do groups correctly we need PKI. I think anything short of that is broken | 23:08 |
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| ayoung | Well, groups would work fine, but topics, which is what we really need, would be broken: we need to know who posted to the topic | 23:09 |
| markwash | sdague: thanks | 23:09 |
| morganfainberg | markwash, you're also going to need https://github.com/openstack/keystone/blob/master/tox.ini#L8 (that line) in your tox.ini for the pin to work right | 23:09 |
| morganfainberg | markwash, iirc | 23:10 |
| ayoung | nkinder, am I wrong? | 23:10 |
| markwash | sdague: the auto full-update doesn't work for us quite yet, we're not ready for some of the hacking changes there yet | 23:10 |
| * ayoung has to make a run to the store, back in a bit | 23:10 | |
| markwash | sdague: so I made this https://review.openstack.org/#/c/61600/ | 23:10 |
| markwash | morganfainberg: ah, hmm lemme look | 23:10 |
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| morganfainberg | markwash, i think that resolves the 1.2b3 < 1.2 according to pip issues | 23:10 |
| sdague | markwash: sure, however you manage to get past the sphinx issue | 23:10 |
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| sdague | and like morganfainberg says, you need that tox change as well (not for the gate, but for anyone to run locally) | 23:11 |
| markwash | sdague: cool, just wanted to make sure there wasn't something I was missing in the more limited patch. thanks! | 23:11 |
| morganfainberg | markwash, ^ yes for local not gate :) | 23:11 |
| sdague | markwash: yeh, I think that should be sufficient | 23:11 |
| morganfainberg | markwash, sorry wasn't clear on that :) | 23:11 |
| nkinder | markwash: do you have a moment to do a last quick check on my image sharing OSSN? | 23:11 |
| nkinder | simo: any thoughts on ayoung's comments to punt on groups completely? ^^^ | 23:11 |
| nkinder | ayoung: will we get any adoption of KDS for point to point messaging if we punt on groups? | 23:12 |
| markwash | nkinder: sure, can you send me another link? | 23:12 |
| nkinder | markwash: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ossn/+bug/1226078 | 23:12 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1226078 in ossn "Glance allows user to create images and add other tenants as members (CVE-2013-4354)" [Medium,In progress] | 23:12 |
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| simo | nkinder: yes queues needs groups | 23:15 |
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| markwash | morganfainberg: I guess I have a janky setup for building docs locally. . how do you do it with tox in keystone? | 23:17 |
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| clarkb | tox -evenv -- python setup.py build_sphinx is what the jenkins jobs do | 23:18 |
| morganfainberg | markwash, ^ clarkb with the assist (and not letting me look terrible by giving the wrong info) | 23:18 |
| morganfainberg | clarkb, :) | 23:18 |
| markwash | clarkb: thanks | 23:19 |
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| clarkb | zul indicated that if we use sphinx-build the distutils problem forcing us to cap sphinx goes away, but then I think we lose the ability to do some of the magic that happens in setup.py around doc builds | 23:20 |
| clarkb | when mordred has an internet connection we should probably talk about that | 23:20 |
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| dstufft | distutils worst utils | 23:22 |
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| nkinder | ayoung: I think groups should be left in. It's better than what we have now, and we just need to clearly spell out the limitations of the current approach. | 23:26 |
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| jamielennox | nkinder, ayoung: even though groups is a long way from perfect it's lacking without it | 23:34 |
| jamielennox | i tend to think groups will be one of the major uses | 23:35 |
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| jamielennox | i'm unfortunately not really familiar with how messaging works in the rest of OS, as to how much you address a message to a server but anything that is doing HA would need to be in a group right? | 23:36 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: ok, we're on the same page then. I think that there is value in the current implementation. | 23:36 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: there's some detail here on the way queues are used - http://docs.openstack.org/developer/nova/devref/rpc.html | 23:38 |
| nkinder | jamielennox: I'm just not a fan of the way membership is defined, but I'll leave it as is. | 23:39 |
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| jamielennox | nkinder: neither, but reading the start of the doc page you can see why group membership being defined as the part before the first . makes sense | 23:40 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: yep. About to push an updated review. | 23:44 |
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| jamielennox | nkinder: ok, i had a quick look at some of the comments earlier, i'll go through them again and see if there is anything i need to specifically comment on | 23:45 |
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| nkinder | jamielennox: ok. I think simo and I covered the comments pretty well. | 23:46 |
| jamielennox | nkinder: if you want to add a POST /v1/keys that will auto-generate a key for a host i'm fine with that - it's a really simple addition | 23:46 |
| jamielennox | and i can see it being useful | 23:46 |
| nkinder | jamielennox: I'll leave it alone for now | 23:47 |
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