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| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/bifrost master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552741 | 05:23 |
| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/ironic-python-agent master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552756 | 05:31 |
| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/ironic-tempest-plugin master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/551489 | 05:31 |
| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/networking-baremetal master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/551519 | 05:40 |
| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/networking-generic-switch master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/551521 | 05:41 |
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| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/ironic-ui master: Imported Translations from Zanata https://review.openstack.org/552798 | 06:24 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ironic-python-agent master: change python-libguestfs to python-guestfs for ubuntu https://review.openstack.org/551833 | 07:08 |
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| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/networking-baremetal master: Avoid tox_install.sh https://review.openstack.org/550587 | 10:18 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: Abstract away the virtualization management interface https://review.openstack.org/523321 | 11:17 |
| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: documentation on simulators added https://review.openstack.org/523445 | 11:18 |
| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: OpenStack cloud driver added https://review.openstack.org/523879 | 11:21 |
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| dtantsur | morning/afternoon ironic | 11:26 |
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| etingof | dtantsur, o/ | 11:35 |
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| sambetts | o/ | 11:36 |
| dtantsur | o/ | 11:37 |
| dtantsur | wanna some nova fun? https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1755602 | 11:37 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1755602 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "Ironic computes may not be discovered when node count is less than compute count" [Medium,In progress] - Assigned to Dan Smith (danms) | 11:37 |
| dtantsur | tl;dr cells attack again \o/ | 11:37 |
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| sambetts | le sigh. | 11:38 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sam Betts proposed openstack/ironic-lib master: [WIP] Use udevadm instead of hexdump to get mbr disk id https://review.openstack.org/552890 | 12:13 |
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| Sasha_ | etingof Hi, Ilya! I'mSasha. I want to become an intern in Outreachy program in redfish. How I can start? | 12:32 |
| dtantsur | lucas-hungry: hey! could you please move https://launchpad.net/sushy-tools to ironic-drivers team? | 12:36 |
| dtantsur | Sasha_: hi! I'm not Ilya, but I see that he has a bug open for taking: https://bugs.launchpad.net/sushy-tools/+bug/1751134 | 12:37 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1751134 in Sushy Tools "[RFE] Add unit tests" [Undecided,New] | 12:37 |
| etingof | Sasha_, hey, welcome! ;) You should first pass the https://www.outreachy.org/apply/eligibility/ test, then follow the project contribution guidelines -- https://www.outreachy.org/2018-may-august/communities/openstack/#extend-redfish-hardware-provisioning-tooling-for-p | 12:39 |
| dtantsur | etingof: also check if there is some work to be done on the ironic side (e.g. for inspection) | 12:40 |
| dtantsur | oh, and someone can introduce redfish support into the standalone CI job | 12:40 |
| dtantsur | I was planning to do it.. but.. free time... :) | 12:40 |
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| Sasha_ | dtansur: Thank you, I've looked at sushy project,but didn't look at sushy-tools. | 12:45 |
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| Sasha_ | etingof, I passed the test and read about redfish project itself. | 12:46 |
| etingof | dtantsur, well, that probably depends on how strong the intern(s) turn out to be | 12:46 |
| etingof | Sasha_, now you need to pick a bug at LP tagged 'outreachy' and work on it. also you should officially apply for the project internship at Outreachy web site | 12:48 |
| * dtantsur thought it starts in May.. | 12:50 | |
| Sasha_ | etingof, OK, sure | 12:51 |
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| openstackgerrit | Harald Jensås proposed openstack/ironic master: Set dhcp option boot-file-url if IPv6 https://review.openstack.org/552897 | 12:58 |
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| Sasha_ | etingof, shoud I assign this bag myself or i'll be assigned automatically, when I upload code to review? | 13:03 |
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| lucasagomes | dtantsur, sure! | 13:07 |
| lucasagomes | dtantsur, done :-) | 13:08 |
| etingof | Sasha_, you should assign the bug on yourself | 13:09 |
| Sasha_ | etingof, thanks | 13:10 |
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| radez | bfournie: ping, could I get a bit of you time today? I'm still not able to get ironic to deploy on the overcloud, I've tried a few different ways with and with out containers and seem not to be able to get that pxe container to start up | 13:26 |
| dtantsur | thanks lucasagomes | 13:26 |
| radez | I wasn't sure if the ironic-inspector container was supposed to be running too? | 13:27 |
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| dtantsur | radez: ironic-inspector is not needed for deployment | 13:31 |
| radez | dtantsur: thx | 13:34 |
| jroll | morning ironic | 13:34 |
| radez | dtantsur: is neutron the one to handle the dhcp offers for the node? I don't have tftp up but I'm also not getting a dhcp offer for the node | 13:34 |
| bfournie | radez: are you seeing a dhcp discover from the node in the qdhcp netns | 13:36 |
| bfournie | ? | 13:36 |
| radez | yup | 13:36 |
| bfournie | radez: and no offer? | 13:36 |
| radez | I see the bootp packets on the ctlplane interface on the control node but no offer is returned | 13:36 |
| radez | otoh, would there be a diffenet interface to listen on otther than the ctlplane's interface? | 13:37 |
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| radez | I didn't look for the ip from the provisioning network that I'm creating | 13:38 |
| bfournie | radez: you should run tcpdump in the qdhcp netns | 13:38 |
| radez | ah, k lemme do that... | 13:39 |
| radez | sec, I'm recreating my overcloud giddy up for the new ironic node right now | 13:39 |
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| bfournie | radez: sudo ip netns exec qdhcp-<id> tcpdump … | 13:41 |
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| radez | bfournie: thx, not quite there yet, but I'd would have had to refresh my brain on that syntax :) | 13:42 |
| bfournie | radez: I can get on your system and look too, but it won't be for about an hour, we had 2 feet of snow yesterday and I need to dig out to get to office | 13:42 |
| bfournie | radez: also, to get netns id use "sudo ip netns" | 13:43 |
| radez | hehe, np, I think I may have borked my undercloud, I did all the configuring for the overcloud on the undercloud and I'm trying to clean it out now | 13:43 |
| radez | I'll let you know when I get to the tcpdump | 13:43 |
| bfournie | radez: ok thanks | 13:44 |
| radez | actually I think I'll just abandon the UC and redelpoy it next time I need to redeploy the overcloud | 13:44 |
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| rpioso | Good morning, ironicers. | 14:00 |
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| radez | dtantsur: ping, iconic on the overcloud... IronicNetwork defaults to ctlplane, but cltplane isn't attached to ovs for the packets to get to the qdhcp | 14:22 |
| dtantsur | radez: let's wait for bfournie please | 14:22 |
| * dtantsur is overloaded now | 14:22 | |
| radez | dtantsur: np | 14:22 |
| openstackgerrit | Sam Betts proposed openstack/ironic-lib master: [WIP] Use udevadm instead of hexdump to get mbr disk id https://review.openstack.org/552890 | 14:23 |
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| TheJulia | Good morning | 14:44 |
| dtantsur | morning TheJulia | 14:45 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: you spoke of this free time thing? I thought it was a myth ;) | 14:45 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia: I keep hearing about it. maybe it's real. or maybe it's kind of a modern religion? | 14:46 |
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| openstackgerrit | Shivanand Tendulker proposed openstack/ironic master: Fix ``agent`` deploy interface to call ``boot.prepare_instance`` https://review.openstack.org/499050 | 15:03 |
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| rloo | Happy Pi Day everyone, including dtantsur, TheJulia, radez, jroll. May we all have lots of pie! | 15:11 |
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| dtantsur | hey rloo | 15:12 |
| dtantsur | I'm having a lot of tripleo debugging, does it count? | 15:12 |
| radez | cheers rloo :) | 15:12 |
| rloo | dtantsur: undercloud pi and overcloud pi? :) | 15:13 |
| dtantsur | mistral and tempest :) | 15:13 |
| * rloo gives dtantsur a fresh apple pie with ice cream | 15:14 | |
| dtantsur | do we have human-friendly docs documenting https://github.com/openstack/ironic/blob/master/devstack/lib/ironic#L2358-L2433 ? | 15:18 |
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| dtantsur | TheJulia, jlvillal ^^^ | 15:18 |
| openstackgerrit | Julia Kreger proposed openstack/ironic-specs master: Add Rocky Priorities https://review.openstack.org/550174 | 15:26 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: afaik, no | 15:27 |
| dtantsur | okay, writing | 15:27 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: thanks | 15:27 |
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| NobodyCam | Good Morning Ironic'ers | 15:35 |
| NobodyCam | Happy PiDay | 15:35 |
| NobodyCam | rloo: :) and a happy Pi day to you | 15:36 |
| rloo | NobodyCam: good morning, and thx! :) | 15:37 |
| NobodyCam | :) | 15:37 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ruby Loo proposed openstack/python-ironicclient master: [doc] Add 'openstack create' command to command reference https://review.openstack.org/552932 | 15:45 |
| dtantsur | morning NobodyCam | 15:46 |
| NobodyCam | Good morning dtantsur :) | 15:46 |
| openstackgerrit | Dmitry Tantsur proposed openstack/ironic-tempest-plugin master: Add example configuration for running our tests with nova https://review.openstack.org/552934 | 15:49 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia ^^^ | 15:49 |
| dtantsur | ideally we need to verify it, but it's at least some start | 15:49 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: Yeah, I feel like it is missing explicit instructions on how to execute it | 15:52 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: I guess the case is someone trying to run it against a deployment as a validation tool? | 15:52 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: added system boot mode support https://review.openstack.org/526101 | 15:56 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: added system boot mode support https://review.openstack.org/526101 | 16:03 |
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| rloo | sambetts, vdrok: is this a problem still? https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1599836 | 16:08 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1599836 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "Booting Ironic instance, neutron port remains in DOWN state" [Medium,Confirmed] | 16:08 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia: for the former, we need to update https://docs.openstack.org/ironic-tempest-plugin/latest/usage.html#running | 16:09 |
| dtantsur | for the latter - yes | 16:09 |
| TheJulia | ack, thanks | 16:09 |
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| TheJulia | Anyone curious in doing the project onboarding session in Vancouver | 16:15 |
| TheJulia | ? | 16:15 |
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| dtantsur | I'm curious in one in Berlin :) | 16:17 |
| sambetts | rloo: if the environment hasn't loaded the networking-baremetal driver then they'll still see that | 16:19 |
| TheJulia | I expected that :) | 16:19 |
| rloo | sambetts: :-( we don't have that documented anywhere. | 16:19 |
| rloo | sambetts: or do we? i will look... | 16:19 |
| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: OpenStack cloud driver added https://review.openstack.org/523879 | 16:20 |
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| TheJulia | rloo: I _feel_ like we changed the docs towards the end of queens | 16:22 |
| rloo | TheJulia: yeah, i see it mentioned for flat network interface. | 16:23 |
| rloo | TheJulia: and we have a general 'recommend' to use it | 16:24 |
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| rloo | sambetts: so should the bug be closed, since the solution is to use the networking-baremetal plugin? | 16:25 |
| TheJulia | rloo: I feel like the bug is fix released | 16:25 |
| TheJulia | rloo: and likely worth noting in the docs that there is the dependency | 16:25 |
| TheJulia | s/docs/comments | 16:25 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: added system boot mode support https://review.openstack.org/526101 | 16:28 |
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| TheJulia | lucasagomes: pas-ha: w/r/t ironic-staging-drivers... is there any desire to also just move that over to storyboard? | 16:30 |
| * dtantsur votes yes | 16:30 | |
| lucasagomes | TheJulia, I guess so, I think we should follow the rest of the ironic projects | 16:31 |
| dtantsur | etingof: see my question on https://bugs.launchpad.net/sushy-tools/+bug/1751133 | 16:31 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1751133 in Sushy Tools "[RFE] Implement integration tests" [Undecided,Incomplete] | 16:31 |
| lucasagomes | even tho it's not part of the umbrealla | 16:31 |
| TheJulia | Yeah, It kind of makes sense for to provide project grouping level visibility, maybe we would create two boards, official/unofficial | 16:31 |
| * TheJulia is unsure at the moment | 16:31 | |
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| etingof | dtantsur, yes, responded | 16:37 |
| dtantsur | etingof: so, s/integration/functional/ ? | 16:38 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia: would be handy, since we have more unofficial projects, like vendor libs | 16:38 |
| TheJulia | anyone want admin rights on my storyboard instance to play around? I can fire off import of a few other things so we can play with boards | 16:39 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: rloo ^^^ | 16:39 |
| rloo | TheJulia: nah, let's just pull the switch and use it | 16:40 |
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| * TheJulia likes rloo's view of this | 16:40 | |
| jroll | TheJulia: this action item at the bottom, do you know if that's referring to deploy steps or something else? https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ironic-rocky-ptg-beyond-the-qcow2 | 16:40 |
| etingof | dtantsur, reworded | 16:40 |
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| TheJulia | jroll: looking | 16:41 |
| jroll | specifically "Further decompose what the actual most usable parts are" | 16:42 |
| TheJulia | jroll: I believe that is referring to deploy steps | 16:42 |
| jroll | thought so, thanks for confirming | 16:42 |
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| dtantsur | thanks etingof | 16:43 |
| dtantsur | jroll: hey, have you seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1755602 already? | 16:43 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1755602 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "Ironic computes may not be discovered when node count is less than compute count" [Medium,In progress] - Assigned to Dan Smith (danms) | 16:43 |
| rloo | sambetts: ok, i 'closed' (made invalid) that nova bug. | 16:44 |
| openstackgerrit | Pavlo Shchelokovskyy proposed openstack/networking-generic-switch master: Avoid tox-install.sh https://review.openstack.org/552974 | 16:44 |
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| TheJulia | jroll: yeah, we've had specs propose things like generic tftp configuration writing interfaces, and if we further decomposed things that could open the gate for crazy things like deploying lightbulbs, switches, raspberry pi's. But the thought is truly further down the road | 16:45 |
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| dtantsur | pas-ha: hey, have you checked that doc/requirements.txt will be correctly updated by the bot? | 16:45 |
| pas-ha | dunno for sure, this is what's happening / happened in other projects already | 16:46 |
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| jroll | TheJulia: totally, just thought it was in an odd spot | 16:46 |
| jroll | dtantsur: yes, saw your link this morning | 16:46 |
| TheJulia | jroll: yeah, downside of thinking like 5 steps away is I might end up typing things like that | 16:47 |
| pas-ha | dtantsur: http://codesearch.openstack.org/?q=reno&i=nope&files=doc%2Frequirements.txt&repos= | 16:47 |
| jlvillal | dtantsur, No docs that I know of for the ironic_configure_tempest function besides the comments. | 16:48 |
| pas-ha | dtantsur: and here https://review.openstack.org/#/q/file:doc/requirements.txt+owner:%22OpenStack+Proposal+Bot%22 | 16:49 |
| pas-ha | so it seems to work | 16:49 |
| dtantsur | pas-ha: TIL! | 16:49 |
| dtantsur | we need the same for other projects then | 16:49 |
| dtantsur | jlvillal: https://review.openstack.org/552934 | 16:50 |
| patchbot | patch 552934 - ironic-tempest-plugin - Add example configuration for running our tests wi... | 16:50 |
| pas-ha | yep, would shave some time on gate tests, and local ones as well | 16:50 |
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| jlvillal | dtantsur, thanks | 16:51 |
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| dtantsur | jlvillal: actually, gimme a minute, I need to clarify one more thing | 16:51 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dmitry Tantsur proposed openstack/ironic-tempest-plugin master: Add example configuration for running our tests with nova https://review.openstack.org/552934 | 16:53 |
| dtantsur | jlvillal: now ^^^ | 16:53 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/sushy-tools master: documentation on simulators added https://review.openstack.org/523445 | 16:56 |
| pas-ha | dtantsur: btw there's a similar patch to networking-baremetal, tests are passing https://review.openstack.org/#/c/550587 | 16:56 |
| patchbot | patch 550587 - networking-baremetal - Avoid tox_install.sh | 16:56 |
| dtantsur | cool | 16:56 |
| TheJulia | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/550587 seems like a bad idea in terms of integration to me | 16:59 |
| patchbot | patch 550587 - networking-baremetal - Avoid tox_install.sh | 16:59 |
| TheJulia | because our master could end up trailing with queens neutron for some time until a release is made, which ultimately means cross project gating and CI feedback would have release related delays | 17:00 |
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| jroll | that's a good point | 17:01 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ironic-python-agent master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552756 | 17:01 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ironic-lib master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552755 | 17:01 |
| TheJulia | If we think we fight breaking changes now, we'll never be able to release on time if breaking changes we don't understand appear in pypy suddenly | 17:02 |
| jroll | yeah, agree | 17:02 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia: won't upper-constraints protect us? | 17:03 |
| jroll | dtantsur: the problem is u-c won't be updated until late in the cycle when neutron makes a release | 17:03 |
| TheJulia | only if everything is gating together and no new constraints change gets in that breaks integration | 17:03 |
| jroll | or even until the final release | 17:03 |
| dtantsur | oh, yeah.. | 17:03 |
| TheJulia | so then we're talking about T* release supporting only Rocky neutron | 17:04 |
| dtantsur | but I'm not sure we're the ones to make this decision, to be honest | 17:04 |
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| TheJulia | I feel like this move is a side effect of other desires for pypi packaging of services, and that there are appropriate places for it, and there are places where it is a bad idea | 17:05 |
| jroll | I'm sure the same thing will come up for other neutron plugins, they should have similar concerns | 17:05 |
| dtantsur | yep | 17:05 |
| jroll | sambetts: ^^ you aware of the larger effort going on? | 17:05 |
| dtantsur | in any case, what we used to do will no longer work | 17:05 |
| jroll | dtantsur: why not? | 17:06 |
| dtantsur | jroll: tox_install.sh seems to be broken by it | 17:06 |
| dtantsur | I recall it was only usable for dependencies that are not in g-r/u-c | 17:06 |
| * TheJulia suspects openstack just shot itself in the foot | 17:06 | |
| clarkb | no no | 17:07 |
| sambetts | I remember there being a conversation about it, I believe zuulv3 handles the intergration thing by reading the requirements and working out the siblings of the projects | 17:07 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia: isn't it what openstack is about? | 17:07 |
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| dtantsur | :) | 17:07 |
| clarkb | the test setups are built to handle it | 17:07 |
| sambetts | this ^ | 17:07 |
| jroll | O_o | 17:07 |
| clarkb | if you use the tox siblings (and I believe devstack has similar handling for it) require projects on jobs will get installed from source | 17:07 |
| jroll | does zuul just do a sed as needed on those? | 17:07 |
| clarkb | but otherwise you can accurately represent your dependencies in the dependency listing tools | 17:07 |
| clarkb | jroll: its more involved than that for tox in particular because virtualenvs | 17:08 |
| TheJulia | clarkb: do you have a good example you can point us to? | 17:08 |
| sambetts | jroll: the zuul jobs install them into the tox env manually, and that satifies the pip install | 17:08 |
| clarkb | jroll: it actually does an install of everything in vanilla mode then goes back over and overwrites using source installs as instructed | 17:08 |
| jroll | clarkb: I see, thanks | 17:08 |
| jroll | TheJulia: +1, I'm also curious how it knows which ones to install from source | 17:09 |
| clarkb | it uses the required-projects list as specified in the zuul job | 17:09 |
| clarkb | so anything you list as a required source project will get installed from source | 17:09 |
| dtantsur | magic and ponies.. | 17:09 |
| sambetts | http://logs.openstack.org/90/552890/2/check/openstack-tox-py27/d4f98f4/job-output.txt.gz#_2018-03-14_14_31_50_745023 | 17:09 |
| TheJulia | I guess there is actually value in this in that it would help enforce n-1 compatibility from the consumption standpoint... | 17:09 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: lots of magic | 17:09 |
| sambetts | that is an example ^ | 17:09 |
| TheJulia | dtantsur: possibly my little pony levels | 17:10 |
| clarkb | devstack is a little trickier because I think it will install test requirements too for reasons and also installs services from source | 17:10 |
| clarkb | so I'm not entirely sure how it will pan out there yet | 17:10 |
| clarkb | but it already has tooling for editing constraints to handle source installs of the python-*client libs | 17:11 |
| jroll | so I guess I worry a bit about people running tests locally, and that varying from what we do in CI | 17:11 |
| clarkb | so I expect that will just get applied to neutron now too | 17:11 |
| TheJulia | jroll: it might just need to be something that there is visibiity/knowledge to... :\ | 17:12 |
| jroll | TheJulia: that really sucks from a dev standpoint, honestly | 17:12 |
| TheJulia | 3rd party ci could also be another major issue.... | 17:12 |
| clarkb | yes there has always been tension on that front | 17:12 |
| TheJulia | if they have their own initiators | 17:12 |
| jroll | part of the reason we have the PTI is so tooling and humans both have a standard way to run tests | 17:12 |
| jroll | (AIUI) | 17:12 |
| clarkb | I don't think we've ever found a great answer to it. FWIW openstack has for a long long time explicitly not tested libs against master by default and instead tests their releases | 17:13 |
| clarkb | then the libs are expected to in their own tests check compatibility | 17:13 |
| clarkb | which is how we've dealt with this particular issue. So CI is doing a very specific set of testing to check for that but should also be run in the local mode too | 17:13 |
| TheJulia | except plugins shouldn't be treated like libraries | 17:13 |
| clarkb | plugins can only ever be installed from source? | 17:15 |
| clarkb | or rather don't have specific releases? | 17:15 |
| sambetts | plugins should be written against a stable API from the main project, and should declare their support for a particlar version, tracking master is impossible because they can break you at any time | 17:15 |
| jroll | sambetts: so we should expect plugins to be a cycle behind? | 17:16 |
| sambetts | jroll: not nessesarely, we start working on the next release as soon as the beta release for the next release of neutron is made | 17:17 |
| TheJulia | and still possibly break or be broken during release week | 17:17 |
| jroll | sambetts: so x.y.z.b1 and such are on pypi? | 17:18 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: that implies that we track every piece of work and change going into the other project, or that they have CI testing that provides them feedback that htey are not breaking the plugin | 17:18 |
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| openstackgerrit | Pavlo Shchelokovskyy proposed openstack/networking-generic-switch master: Avoid tox-install.sh https://review.openstack.org/552974 | 17:18 |
| clarkb | TheJulia: ci feedback that they are not breaking plugins (or generally any other consumable api) is I think the intent | 17:18 |
| clarkb | TheJulia: and is generally how we structure things | 17:18 |
| TheJulia | clarkb: except then we have to get projects to take such tests... I've already stated this intent with horizon at-least | 17:19 |
| sambetts | TheJulia: the exact opposite actually, pinning to a particular neutron version means we actively have to change the version and therefore find out things we need to fix, instead of being silently broken by changes | 17:19 |
| sambetts | or running ci on every neutron patch | 17:19 |
| TheJulia | CI on every neutron patch would be ideal, because that would provide visibility that they are making a breaking change and from there teams can negotiate and work together | 17:20 |
| clarkb | sambetts: yes neutron if it is going to be reconsumable and explicitly on pypi for this purpose should have testing to ensure they don't break things all the time | 17:20 |
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| TheJulia | I will quite literally table flip if our CI is dead for all plugins the week of release. | 17:20 |
| clarkb | this doesn't necessarily mean integration testing with every plugin but maybe a representative set along with unittests and functional tests that exercise the apis | 17:20 |
| jroll | TheJulia: the cycle-trailing model may be a reasonable solution | 17:22 |
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| TheJulia | clarkb: that is a good point, an "intergration unit test" would catch that soft of break quickly | 17:22 |
| TheJulia | jroll: to prevent mass table flipping, likely | 17:22 |
| jroll | yes :) | 17:22 |
| sambetts | jroll: its the only model that we've found that works for networking-cisco, trying to track every change in neutron is impossible, so we wait for the churn to stop and then fix what we need to | 17:23 |
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| * TheJulia wonders if anyone has a video or picture of an office of flipped tables | 17:23 | |
| jroll | or if it just is an independent release model, just release when ready | 17:23 |
| TheJulia | jroll: I feel that doing this would eventually mutate to that for all of openstack | 17:24 |
| jroll | TheJulia: https://media.giphy.com/media/1hiVNxD34TpC0/giphy.gif | 17:24 |
| jroll | TheJulia: the independent model? I would approve of that for all of openstack :) | 17:25 |
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| TheJulia | there just wouldn't be able to be a single coordinated release, but there could be explicit integration mappings that could be considered a release.... I guess.... | 17:25 |
| clarkb | in places where there are explicit external contracts (largely libraries, think oslo and python-*client) the solution to this exact problem is constructing tests on the library side (in this case neutron) to do its best to prevent merging changes that would break consumers of those apis | 17:25 |
| clarkb | this way you don't have to track every single change, the api is kept stable and it works on the next release | 17:26 |
| openstackgerrit | Ilya Etingof proposed openstack/virtualbmc master: Migrate CLI to cliff https://review.openstack.org/548594 | 17:26 |
| clarkb | and when gaps are found and something breaks part of fixing the break is adding sufficient testing to prevent it from breaking in the future | 17:26 |
| TheJulia | clarkb: so who is expected to put that sort of testing in to place to prevent such breaking changes? | 17:27 |
| sambetts | TheJulia: its the neutron driver API, so neutron are | 17:28 |
| jroll | clarkb: agree, we've just never really done this for plugins, and I expect we'll have some "learning experiences" | 17:28 |
| clarkb | TheJulia: aiui the library side has typically done the initial setup so for new oslo project they add a job or two for it and some unittests | 17:28 |
| clarkb | TheJulia: then when gaps are found its usually combo of people that were broken and the library adding tests to prevent it in the future | 17:28 |
| TheJulia | I guess this means that unit tests will need to be such that all integration is not mocked out to be emulated in the unit testing and actually extends across the barrier | 17:31 |
| jroll | I was thinking more that neutron is the "library" in this case | 17:31 |
| sambetts | this ^ | 17:31 |
| jroll | it has a public python API for plugins, that API should be tested | 17:31 |
| jroll | just like a library | 17:31 |
| sambetts | +1000 | 17:31 |
| clarkb | jroll: yup | 17:31 |
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| jroll | we can't 100% prevent breakages without every plugin adding its integration tests to neutron's gate, but good unit tests can get close | 17:32 |
| TheJulia | except individual consumers need to actually test that | 17:32 |
| clarkb | and if we aren't going to make that assertion having neutron in global requirements is probably not a great idea (granted we don't have that ssertion from many external deps either but we should be able to do better here) | 17:32 |
| TheJulia | it can't be entirely contained to neutron's library | 17:32 |
| TheJulia | nor can the library consuming mock out everything that it would normally talk to across that api | 17:33 |
| jroll | TheJulia: yes, plugins will need integration tests, but we can't run integration tests for hundreds of plugins on every neutron change | 17:33 |
| jroll | could do a nightly job or something, maybe, dunno | 17:33 |
| TheJulia | jroll: agree, perhaps a bot that posts the gif you pasted into irc channels of impacted projects | 17:34 |
| * TheJulia is attempting to be silly | 17:34 | |
| sambetts | honestly from experience this is basically how we've been operating netowkring-cisco anyway | 17:35 |
| sambetts | we leave neutron master UTs non-voting, and test against the latest stable until the first neutron beta comes out | 17:36 |
| sambetts | then we add a new CI job with neutron pinned to that version | 17:36 |
| sambetts | which starts of non=voting | 17:36 |
| sambetts | then once we've fixed everything we make it voting | 17:36 |
| TheJulia | Yeah, and just thinking about it all down the road this will greatly reduce the ability to have a whole integrated release because it is going to cascade into other projects | 17:37 |
| * TheJulia forsees release model changes | 17:38 | |
| clarkb | fwiw oslo seems to do a reasonable job without having needed to drastically change how we release things | 17:39 |
| sambetts | it does anyway, we've only just nailed down this process and its actually made it so that we can release sooner with the rest of OpenStack, before we spent so many dev cycles fixing stuff we ended up trailing a whole release | 17:39 |
| clarkb | yes things break but not all the often and we tend to catch them and fix them | 17:39 |
| TheJulia | clarkb: except olso is a central point and thus can't really be used as a good example of impact | 17:39 |
| clarkb | not sure I understand? oslo is effectively neutron in this case | 17:39 |
| clarkb | lots of things consume oslo and they don't break every release | 17:40 |
| clarkb | lots of thing want to consume neutron, we just have to be careful but should be able to achieve not breaking them constantly either | 17:40 |
| sambetts | for what its worth (all except neutron moving stuff into neutron lib) the neutron ml2 driver API has been stable since mitaka | 17:40 |
| TheJulia | so neutron will effectively commit to never break or change it's api moving forward? | 17:40 |
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| clarkb | TheJulia: I can't speak for them on that. What I am saying is if they want to be listed in global requirements then they need to do something along those lines | 17:40 |
| sambetts | networking-cisco (with some shims for the neutron-lib stuff) supports mitaka to queens for all our ml2 drivers | 17:40 |
| clarkb | otherwise they shouldn't go in global requirements imo as they aren't fit to be consumed that way | 17:40 |
| sambetts | TheJulia: or if they are going to break they should give a decent deprecation warning | 17:41 |
| TheJulia | clarkb: ahh, I see | 17:41 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: yeah, except for a minimally maintained stable thing, sudden visibility at g-r bump is going to be frustrating.... then again, it might be the only way | 17:41 |
| sambetts | TheJulia: the deprecation warning should have been around a decent amount of time before a g-r bump that breaks that thing | 17:42 |
| sambetts | and they cover all over the UTs | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: but that implies someone actually sees the warnings on a stable project | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | and also implies that they raise awareness | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | unless we have some sort of automated deprecation hunting thing | 17:43 |
| sambetts | release notes is a thing | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | still requires someone to read and grok it | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | and then act | 17:44 |
| sambetts | thats no different to our stance on the REST api right | 17:45 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: what do you mean? | 17:46 |
| sambetts | actually ignore that, I was thinking of something else | 17:46 |
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| TheJulia | heh | 17:46 |
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| dtantsur|afk | o/ | 17:47 |
| sambetts | o/ | 17:47 |
| TheJulia | I just have the recent neutron->neutron-lib code changes in mind where the deprecation note was burried deep in the code, no warning, etc | 17:47 |
| TheJulia | goodnight dtantsur|afk | 17:47 |
| TheJulia | granted, I believe the note went in before release notes were even a thing | 17:48 |
| sambetts | TheJulia: most of the deprecation with the neutron-lib stuff output big warnings in the UTs for at least a cycle | 17:48 |
| TheJulia | "most" :) | 17:48 |
| sambetts | yeah... they weren't so good at that at first, but then again neutron-lib is them moving to a stable API for drivers from an undefined API | 17:49 |
| TheJulia | regardless, I guess all we can really do is wait and see | 17:49 |
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| sambetts | +1 | 17:51 |
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| TheJulia | Oh, well, we can also drink beer in preparation | 17:58 |
| sambetts | haha yup | 17:59 |
| jroll | clarkb: I guess I assumed neutron would only be updated in g-r only after the final release, that's my primary concern, only updating and learning of breakages every 6 months. if we can target the milestone releases in g-r it seems much less impactful | 17:59 |
| TheJulia | lots.. and lots... of beer | 17:59 |
| clarkb | jroll: constraints auto updates whenever things get released (still has to be reviewed but those tend to mostly just be formality) | 18:00 |
| TheJulia | That is true, all teams with integration points might need to budget for that hit.. which I guess means for us try and wrap the cycle a week earlier than before... | 18:01 |
| jroll | clarkb: yep, though I don't think it uses pre-releases? | 18:01 |
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| clarkb | hrm ya it wont see those | 18:02 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ironic-inspector master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552754 | 18:04 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ironic master: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/552753 | 18:05 |
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| rloo | i want to approve this RFE; need another core to ack: https://bugs.launchpad.net/virtualbmc/+bug/1752911 | 18:44 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1752911 in VirtualBMC "[RFE] Rebase VirtualBMC to cliff" [Wishlist,In progress] - Assigned to Ilya Etingof (etingof) | 18:44 |
| jroll | rloo: +1'd | 18:45 |
| rloo | jroll: thx! | 18:45 |
| jroll | np :) | 18:45 |
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| openstackgerrit | Julia Kreger proposed openstack/bifrost master: Define ironic_db_password default https://review.openstack.org/553036 | 20:04 |
| openstackgerrit | Julia Kreger proposed openstack/bifrost master: Update to fedora-27 for testing https://review.openstack.org/547119 | 20:06 |
| rloo | TheJulia: backport to pike. is it OK? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/552515/ | 20:21 |
| patchbot | patch 552515 - ironic (stable/pike) - Introduce keystoneauth adapters for clients | 20:21 |
| rloo | TheJulia: author sez it is to address https://bugs.launchpad.net/ironic/+bug/1755164 | 20:21 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1755164 in Ironic "iLO driver generates public tempurls for vmedia" [Medium,Triaged] | 20:21 |
| rloo | TheJulia: and someone else said it was to address a security issue (which didn't make sense to me) | 20:21 |
| TheJulia | uhh.. interesting | 20:23 |
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| jroll | rloo: TheJulia: I would prefer they fix that directly on stable, rather than backporting the keystone auth thing | 20:26 |
| TheJulia | Yeah... | 20:26 |
| jroll | that backport isn't to address a security issue, but rather that it's a dependency for the patch in master that addresses the security issue | 20:26 |
| TheJulia | ++ | 20:26 |
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| rloo | jroll: ok, please comment :) why does a fix in master need a patch in stable. i am guessing they want to backport the fix... | 20:27 |
| jroll | rloo: suspect the fix doesn't apply at all without that backport | 20:28 |
| * jroll comments | 20:28 | |
| rloo | thx jroll. TheJulia, did we make jroll a stable-maint-person yet? | 20:28 |
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| TheJulia | I commented/ | 20:31 |
| TheJulia | as well | 20:31 |
| TheJulia | And I think we should give jroll some time to breath ;) | 20:32 |
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| rloo | TheJulia: :) | 20:33 |
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| jroll | :P | 20:37 |
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| rloo | jroll: i wrote a sep spec for the deploy step framework cuz i didn't want to lose the bigger questions in the original spec :) | 21:11 |
| jroll | rloo: yeah, I saw that after commenting, fine with me :) | 21:11 |
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| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/networking-generic-switch master: Avoid tox-install.sh https://review.openstack.org/553077 | 21:15 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ruby Loo proposed openstack/ironic master: Add descriptions for config option choices https://review.openstack.org/553101 | 23:49 |
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