Thursday, 2014-12-04

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bloganping sbalukoff05:43
bloganand he's not here05:43
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bloganping sbalukoff05:48
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sballeblogan: ping15:39
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dougwigmorning all15:47
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sballedougwig: I am suddenly drawing a blank on how Neutron LBaaS V2 is working. Is it using the lbaas-agent the same way it was used in lbaas v1? Which mean that it can be placed on any node and doesn't have to be on the network node?15:51
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dougwigthe lbaas-agent is only used by the haproxy driver.  lbaas itself runs on the neutron node, the lbaas agent can go anywhere.   and v2's haproxy ref driver will be similar, unless it's octavia.15:52
sballedougwig: thanks for confirming this.15:53
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RamaKrishnaHi mlavalle_16:44
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: hi, looking at your email right now. Give me a few minutes16:44
RamaKrishnaSure and Thanks mlavalle_16:48
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mlavalle_RamaKrishna: you are getting a 404, which means the Neutron API didn't find the resource you are trying to do a POST against. You are trying to create a member of the loadbalancer. It is the member resource that it is not finding16:58
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: this can be due to either of 2 reasons:16:58
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: you loadbalancer environment is not set up properly in devstack. I don't think this is the case, though, because by the moment the test fails, you already created a loadbalancer, a health monitor and a pool17:00
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: the other reason is that ther was a change in the api. I think this is the most likely explanation. I recommend checking with the dev team the latest version of the api17:01
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: please remeber that I finished work on this script in mid-August, so I am pretty sure things have changed since then17:03
RamaKrishnaThanks mlavalle17:03
RamaKrishnaAppreciate your help17:03
mlavalle_RamaKrishna: if you get the documentation of the lastest version of the api, and it indeed changed, I will walk you through the process of changing the rest client in tempest to support the change17:04
RamaKrishnaOk. Meanwhile I will try to run the API's manually to see if all of them work and as per specs.. then we can debug17:05
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RamaKrishnaHi mlavalle21:34
bloganping sbalukoff22:14
sbalukoffWhat up, yo?22:14
bloganhappen to read my comments on reviews?22:15
sbalukoffI saw you commented, am planning on responding, but my day is going somewhat slowly.22:16
blogani know the feeling22:16
bloganexcept my brain is going somewhat slowly as well22:16
sbalukoffAnyway, later this afternoon / evening, I anticipate responding there, unless there's something you need resolved immediately?22:17
blogannah thats fine, the other one is
bloganbut i expect you'll respond to all that you can22:17
sbalukoffOh, I will.22:25
* sbalukoff cackles maniacly.22:25
sbalukoffDang, I can never spell that correctly.22:25
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dougwigi'd encourage y'all to make time for flavors before monday (the meetup).22:29
sbalukoffWorking on that right now, actually.22:32
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xgermandougwig I was making time to celebrate the spin-off22:38
xgermanbut flavor , oh well, if that's the way you want us to have fun :-)22:39
dougwigthere's two flavor specs now.  i especially need operator input on the second.22:39
xgermanthey multiplied...22:40
xgermanok, I -1'd the first one...22:40
dougwigsaw that, thanks.22:41
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openstackgerritTrevor Vardeman proposed stackforge/octavia: Creation of Octavia API Documentation
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dougwigcan someone take a peek at my driver spec?  it's short.
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dougwigxgerman: ty23:04
dougwigxgerman: hacky?  hacky!?  :-)23:05
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dougwigsbalukoff: there's the anal probe commentary that i've been missing!23:37
sbalukoffWow, that bad, eh?23:37
sbalukoffI'm sorry23:37
sbalukoffBut yes, once again (and this should  be no surprise): I'm an asshole.23:38
dougwignah, that was exactly the dialogue I wanted in the open.23:40
blogansounds like lbaas needs extensions23:45
dougwigthe problem i'm trying to solve is the customer that's willing to place a multi-million dollar order "if you let my end users select whichever SSL cipher they want, but only within the next two months." (timeline too short for the community and/or tiny obscure feature)  or the fact that I would like to let operators turn on DDoS in front of their LB's, but23:46
dougwig*there is no open-source solution for that*, and won't be for some time (no open-source alternative.)  the crap I have to resort to today helps no one, least of all the operators.23:46
sbalukoffdougwig: I agree. We need you to be able to do that.23:47
blogani understand it and I have concerns that sbalukoff put much more eloquently than i could have23:47
sbalukoffI just want some guidance on where the line is drawn...23:47
dougwigheh, me too.  :)23:47
sbalukoffI expect new features to always be exposed by vendors in the manner you've described first, but eventually many of those should make it into the base feature seet.23:47
dougwigi just know the line isn't at either extreme.23:47
bloganand one reason for neutron's extensions is this isn't it? some extensions enable attributes/feature through the API that some drivers cant do23:48
dougwigsbalukoff: i agree.  how do we word that in a way that makes everyone comfortable?  the second proposal is really just better integration hooks, and who doesn't like integration hooks?23:49
sbalukoffdougwig: Agreed.23:49
sbalukoffIt might be worth saying that you expect new features will get added by vendors quickly after they become market-viable... and that as more vendors (and especially open-source solutions) support these new features fully, the expectation is that these will be rolled into the base feature set for the service, through community development and support.23:50
sbalukoffAnd to emphasize this, perhaps we should make it rule that if the base feature set covers a certain functionality, then vendors shouldn't duplicate this using the flavor metadata extension you're describing.23:51
sbalukoffAs a best practice.23:51
sbalukoffAnd, as German pointed out somewhere, that anything defined in the base feature set trumps anything set via extension.23:51
sbalukoffThat would make me more comfortable. What do you think?23:51
dougwigi certainly agree with that last.  for the first, i'd expect that user demand should drive what we/the community devs prioritize for adding to the community bucket, right?23:52
dougwigthat last being the 'best practice' thing.23:52
sbalukoffdougwig: Well, yes... but there needs to be an open-source alternative for it to become part of the base feature set in any case.23:52
sbalukoffThat's sort of an OpenStack mantra, right?23:52
sbalukoffThat all the base features are completely open source?23:53
dougwigi'd be happy listing german's recommendation as an rfc style *SHOULD*.  there's a technical limitation in that the driver gets to pick which it prefers, and the drivers aren't always completely in tree.23:53
sbalukoffI'm OK with that.23:54
dougwigsbalukoff: of course.  but it could have an open source alternative that no one wants; do we add it just because some vendor/operator might do it somewhere?  i'd think not.  if there's demand, then absolutely.23:54
sbalukoffI think you and I are violently agreeing on this, dougwig.23:54
dougwigi think we mostly are, but i'm trying to suss out how to word this in a way that doesn't get the reaction you just had.  a reaction that *equally* applies to the original flavor proposal (the question of exposing unsupported features is in both; the second just allows another set of them in.)23:55
sbalukoffYou're right, it does apply to both... hmmm...23:56
sbalukoffWell, again, I think lampshading the problem and explaining the intentions of our decision here, and how we expect it to play out practically are key here.23:57
sbalukoffAnd you can do that by saying directly, that the trade-off we're trying to solve is the ability for vendors to add new features / extensions quickly versus vendor lock-in.23:57
dougwigwe should focus on the philosophy of that in the first spec; the second is really just a tweak (IMO).23:57
sbalukoffThat this seems like the best alternative we can go for with the recommendation that popular features get rolled into the base service feature set.23:58
sbalukoffdougwig: That's fine with me.23:58
sbalukoffIf you have time to write that up, I'll review it whenever you let me know. I know time is of the essence here with the Neutron mid-cycle meet-up next week.23:58
dougwigthis blurb wasn't clear enough?  "The first alternative is to do nothing.  This results in what many vendors are23:59
dougwig172+  doing today, which is to brew up proprietary neutron solutions in order to23:59
dougwig173+  expose more advanced features.  This results in inconsistent solutions for23:59
dougwig174+  operators, more difficulty tracking trunk, and vendor lock-in."23:59
sbalukoffIt wasn't, per se: I'd like to see acknowlegements of this particular solution's short-comings, and explanation that these are "less bad" than the short-comings of the alternatives, and that's why we're going with this.23:59

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