Thursday, 2014-01-23

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openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Add a _config_options function to Marconi
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openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Don't use `override_time` but mock instead
openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Don't use `override_time` but mock instead
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openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Sync oslo-cache from oslo-incubator
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kgriffsflaper87: ping13:23
flaper87kgriffs: 'sup buddy?13:23
flaper87good morning13:23
kgriffsyo yo13:23
kgriffsso you did some work on oslo messaging, right?13:24
flaper87that's correct13:24
kgriffsso, the Barbican guys were strong-armed into using it instead of celery13:24
kgriffsI was just talking to a guy from their team yesterday13:24
kgriffsthey said they have to patch it so it will work for them13:24
kgriffsI was thinking maybe you and he could sync up and see how the oslo lib might be improved13:25
flaper87absolutely, what did they have to patch? is that something we should have in oslo.messaging?13:25
kgriffsi know that they need HA RabbitMQ or something. that may be it, but I'm not 100% sure13:26
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flaper87oh well, yeah! But they'd have needed that anyway for celery13:26
kgriffsso, a little later today, maybe you can ping jraim / jraim_i___13:26
kgriffsah, not sure13:26
flaper87celery is just a task scheduler that relies on other message brokers13:26
flaper87well, more a task processor than scheduler13:27
flaper87sure, I'll ping him13:27
kgriffsanyway, it brought up two points13:27
flaper87or actually, let him know he can ping me whenever he wants too. I just don't trust my memory13:27
flaper87and this seems important13:27
kgriffs1, that is silly that OpenStack is recommending using a home-grown solution over something that is battletested and used in the broader python community13:27
kgriffsand 2. that they aren't able to use oslo lib as-is13:27
kgriffsflaper87: yep, will do.13:28
kgriffsI will also introduce via email13:28
kgriffsthank you sir!13:28
flaper87number 2. is really important! As for 1) I remember the discussion was quite long. IIRC, I was part of it13:28
flaper87you know I'm not always the kind of guy that says: USE OUR STUFF OR DIE13:28
kgriffsone more point13:28
flaper87but in the case of celery, it's not as straightforward as it seems13:29
flaper87it's a good lib, battletested but it has different requirements13:29
flaper87for instance, it's not (semi-)p2p as oslo.messaging is13:29
kgriffs3. We need to, as an OS community, break down silos and get into the habit of discussing these things in the open in a pragmatic way13:29
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flaper87celery requires you to have a celery node running and consuming your tasks13:29
flaper87which adds more complexity to the whole infrastructure13:29
kgriffsflaper87: so, understood. Then why, if cellery was perfect for their use case are we making them shoe-horn into the oslo lib?13:30
kgriffs(learns to spell)13:30
kgriffsanyway, let me get you two in touch13:31
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flaper87in this case, I believe oslo.messaging can be perfect for their use case (I might be wrong) but besides that, I think oslo.messaging removes some complexity that celery would've added13:31
flaper87which is different than...... pecan vs falcon13:31
flaper87the former doesn't seem to simplify marconi's implementation nor bring anything better to it13:32
flaper87we still need to verify that13:32
flaper87we already have an opinion (code|style)-wise13:32
kgriffsit isn't like oslo is inherently a bad idea13:33
kgriffsit's just being abused right now13:33
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flaper87kgriffs: for example, some guy from the community made me note that there's a very good caching library out there (can't remember the name now) and I was all for dropping oslo.cache in favor of that library13:34
kgriffsoh yeah?13:34
kgriffsso where did that end up?13:34
flaper87so, the plan now is to see how we can use that library from oslo.cache or if necessary just drop oslo.cache13:34
flaper87we're working on that13:34
kgriffsoh, good to know!13:34
flaper87he's just been quite busy in a keystone mid-cycle mini-summit13:35
kgriffsJesse Noller will be proud of you13:35
flaper87and ..... the gate13:35
flaper87hehehe :)13:35
kgriffslet me know how that goes - I will hold off implementing redis backend13:35
flaper87I just wish I'd have known that before13:35
kgriffsyeah, well13:35
flaper87I'd have saved a lot of time and discussions on the cache API13:35
flaper87I'm proud of the work we did in oslo.cache13:35
kgriffsyou walk away with a better understanding of caching13:35
flaper87the library doesn't seem to have an API as nice as oslo.cache's13:36
flaper87lets see how we can improve it13:36
kgriffsgood to know13:36
kgriffskk, gotta run13:36
flaper87let me find it13:36
flaper87kgriffs: kk13:36
flaper87found it13:37
flaper87it basically has support for memcached, redis, file, memory and other backends13:37
flaper87What it's missing is a dict-like API13:38
flaper87anyway, we'll see13:38
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alcabreraGood morning. :)14:22
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mpanettamornin alcabrera14:31
alcabrerampanetta: o/14:33
mpanettaHave you seen the ustream live feed from the ukraine? heh14:33
alcabreranot at all. The only thing I've seen on Ukraine is the commentary that happened on a pull request to Symphony2, which I believe is a PHP web framework. :P14:37
mpanettaThings are a bit violent there right now heh.14:38
mpanettayesterday things were on fire, today it looks like things have calmed down a bit... No molotov cocktails flying around heh14:39
alcabrerait sounds pretty terrible.14:40
alcabreraI think this news article I just read captures part of the problem.14:40
alcabrera"The government has no one but a mob to negotiate with, although this is a situation they have created themselves." "14:40
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mpanettaYeah :(14:43
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flaper87kgriffs_afk: alcabrera there are some nice patches waiting for you :D16:04
alcabreraflaper87: hehe, I'm going to take a look in an hour. :)16:06
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kgriffsflaper87: I'm going to be going through patches shortly16:21
kgriffsalcabrera, flaper87: a simple one here:
flaper87kgriffs: cool, thanks!16:21
flaper87kgriffs: You know, I reviewed that one yday16:21
flaper87then got distracted16:21
flaper87and never commented16:21
kgriffsflaper87: wrt oslo.cache (our earlier discussion) it is a tried-and-tested pattern to put an adapter interface on top of another component/lib16:21
kgriffsyou do it to improve the interface and to make it less disruptive if you need to swap out the underlying thing later for any reason16:22
kgriffsflaper87: heh, k16:22
flaper87kgriffs: exactly, This guy that pingged me seems to know dogtail quite well so, lets see what his thoughts are16:24
kgriffssounds good16:24
flaper87I'll wait until next week before jumping into memcached backend updates16:24
kgriffsi think the key is that oslo should be a good citizen wrt the broader python community16:24
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kgriffsit doesn't mean we won't still write stuff, but we also contribute to--and leverage--other projects as much as possible16:25
flaper87re that review: I'm a bit worried about the 2 secs sleep, TBH. I mean, it's not patch blocker. What I want to say is that I would really like to find a better way to launch the server and not having to wait16:25
kgriffsflaper87: agreed. So, I'm not totally sure it is going to block there...16:26
kgriffsit is a bandaid16:26
kgriffsthing is, I'm not sure how to repro16:27
kgriffsI guess I could have a script to run the test a ton of times in a row16:27
flaper87kgriffs: totally agree w.r.t oslo. It's not that it is a bad citizen, though. We've rejected many patches in favor of existing libraries out there. For isntance, the migration to alembic is also part of that support. The rejection of custom SSH wrappers as opposed to contributing to paramiko16:27
kgriffsflaper87: good push back, btw!16:27
kgriffsflaper87: cool, glad to hear that16:27
flaper87it could be better16:28
flaper87I'm sure about that16:28
kgriffswell, let's keep the discussion going16:28
kgriffsi've talked to others who feel the same16:28
flaper87yeah, I thinks these kind of things should be also discussed in the mailing list. I've failed myself a couple of times to find solutions around the python community, the cache lib is one of those. But, IMHO, it's never too late to switch, perhaps more painful but never too late16:30
flaper87A good way to do that would be with some examples of where the process is failing16:31
flaper87there are many things about the incubator that could be improved. I mean, the whole process16:31
flaper87not talking just about code16:31
flaper87but that's happening now. The first step is the graduation of some of the libraries that have been stable16:32
flaper87that will reduce the burden from copying so many things around16:32
jbernardflaper87: do these runtime requirements look correct?
jbernardflaper87: (ignoring versions)16:32
flaper87kgriffs: alcabrera|afk not sure if I tould you this but jbernard is creating Marconi's RPM :D16:32
jbernards/is/attempting to/16:33
kgriffsjbernard: thanks d00d16:33
jbernardno problem16:33
* kgriffs gives jbernard a box of Pop-Tarts™16:33
flaper87kgriffs: can we drop the dependency on msgpack ?16:34
flaper87it doesn't make sense to depend on it just because those 3 lines16:34
flaper87to be precise16:34
flaper87actually 216:34
kgriffsheh, for sure16:34
flaper871 is an import and the other one a comment16:34
flaper87kk, i'll do that16:34
kgriffswe can bring it back in later if we want to add msgpack support to the API16:34
flaper87kgriffs: agreed16:35
kgriffsflaper87: I've got a talk tonight at the Austin Web Python meetup16:35
flaper87kgriffs: Marconi ?16:35
kgriffsgoing to be talking about falcon, philosophy, and Marconi will get a mention16:35
kgriffsI was asked to talk on Falcon16:35
kgriffsI am going to propose a marconi talk for next time I speak16:36
flaper87awesome, awesome awesome! :D16:36
flaper87jbernard: looks good, you can get rid of msgpack16:36
flaper87well, no16:36
flaper87that would make your tests fail16:36
kgriffsflaper87: let me dig into that sleep thing16:37
flaper87lets do this, keep it there, I'll submit the patch16:37
jbernardlol what tests? :)16:37
kgriffsI am going to remove it from that patch16:37
kgriffsstand by16:37
flaper87if it lands before you submit the package then ok16:37
flaper87kgriffs: kk, thanks! :D16:37
kgriffsjust saw the 2014.1.b2 tag16:37
flaper87kgriffs: IIRC, that should be called just once!16:38
flaper87I think there's 1 service for all functional tests16:38
flaper87unless it dies16:38
flaper87I can't remember how the heck I implemented that stuff16:38
flaper87damn it!16:38
kgriffssounds about right16:38
flaper87jbernard: no tests at all, I'm just pretending there are! you know, WE ARE ALL FOR TDD!16:39
kgriffsflaper87: what do you use as a difftool, btw16:39
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kgriffsI need a new one16:40
kgriffskdiff3 makes me sad16:40
flaper87if it's not in git, I use meld16:40
flaper87but that's linux only unless you use macports or soemthing16:40
wirehead_You could write your own, kgriffs, call it kdiffs16:40
flaper87oh no, wait, I think it made it into brew at some point16:40
kgriffsthis one?16:40
flaper87wirehead_: LOL16:40
kgriffswirehead_: heh16:40
flaper87kgriffs: yup16:40
wirehead_I mean, if John Hopper can name Atom Hopper after himself...16:40
kgriffssure, why the heck not?16:41
flaper87kgriffs: or vimdiff, but it's more painful, I admit it!16:41
kgriffsah, vimdiff16:41
flaper87diffs are already painful, why should I make them worse16:42
* alcabrera catches up16:42
kgriffsI wonder if sublime has a plugin16:42
* kgriffs loves brew16:42
alcabreraso much catching up, so lively on here today16:42
* kgriffs makes live worth living on a Mac16:42
alcabrerajbernard: thanks for the RMP package!16:42
alcabrera+1 for dropping the msgpack dependency16:43
flaper87kgriffs: agreed, I used to `brew` all the things16:43
* alcabrera has never used a Mac16:43
flaper87I'll tell you a couple of things about Macs when we meet!16:43
flaper87things that I can't drop in a public channel /server16:43
alcabreralooking firward to it16:44
kgriffsflaper87: I think I'd run linux if someone happened to buy me one of these -
* kgriffs needs a benevolent patron16:46
mpanettakgriffs: That is a lot like my asus.16:47
kgriffsof course, I would promptly replace ubuntu with something more tasteful16:47
mpanettasmaller screen though, and my asus can supposedly handle 32G of ram16:47
kgriffsmpanetta: they have a 17 inch version16:48
kgriffsbut that is too big for me16:48
alcabreraso much ram. :P16:48
kgriffsmpanetta: just run arch. then you only need like 4 MB16:48
kgriffsof course, if you actually wanted to *do* anything, you would have install a few more things...16:49
* kgriffs is compiling meld16:49
flaper87kgriffs: man, you'll make me say things I shouldn't say! :D16:50
mpanettameh I like compiling kernels, that likes ram ;)16:51
mpanettawell and compiling entire distros for embedded things...16:52
kgriffsmpanetta: me, I prefer to compile everything on my rpi. It's super fast. Only takes a day or two.16:53
kgriffsflaper87: do you think a reddit-style site for OS would be useful in lieu of the mailing list? </random-idea>16:54
flaper87mmh, not sure it would be easier to navigate but it would be more organized for sure!16:57
flaper87I mean, It would have to have good search support16:57
flaper87easy navigation through threads and stuff16:57
kgriffsmeld is not happy. I may need to log out to get XQuartz fully installed. aaaanyway16:58
flaper87ah yeah, you need xqartz16:58
kgriffsflaper87: yeah, I actually find ML to be pretty ugly and messy in general16:58
flaper87kgriffs: that's my thought for emails in general16:58
kgriffsI prefer IRC when I can get the people in the same channel16:58
kgriffsflaper87: +116:58
kgriffssome startup needs to fix email16:58
kgriffsit is totally broken16:59
kgriffsI've seen a few try, but nobody has succeeded yet imho16:59
alcabreraemail is a tough problem16:59
flaper87IMHO, emails came out because it was cheaper and safer than sending pigeons around the world16:59
kgriffsvery tough16:59
flaper87and by that time, international calls and messages where like carzy expensive or whatever16:59
kgriffsyeah. well, it also replaced the paper memo17:00
flaper87kgriffs: ah yeah, that too!17:00
kgriffsit was a big part of the "paperless office" movement17:00
flaper87wait, what?17:00
flaper87is there such a thing?17:00
kgriffsthere was17:00
flaper87my bank keeps sending me papers17:00
flaper87I was like: I don't want paper,s end me an email17:00
kgriffspoor trees17:01
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flaper87and they where: Dude, we have ATMs, that's already too much for us17:01
alcabrerathat's what I told my bank, and my insurance, and like 4 other entities. Most of them listened, tahnkfully. Paperless. <317:01
kgriffswait, here's an idea17:01
balajiiyersince my father is in the paper industry, Im always torn between being green and let my father have his job.17:01
kgriffslet's burn really old, dead trees and plants to make electricity that we can then use to send bits around the world17:02
kgriffsthat's better.17:02
kgriffsWhile we're at it, let's avoid using oil to make plastic and instead use oil to make fertilizer to grow corn to make plastic.17:03
kgriffs"who's the marketing genius who came up with that one?"17:03
kgriffsback on topic... :p17:05
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malinikgriffs: monsanto is also planning to collect data from farmer fields to 'help them increase productivity'17:06
alcabreraI'd love to see 3d printing become more common. If there was a 3d printer situated within a few miles of every house, I'd love to see someone replace shipping of printed books with delivery of the digital instructions to reconstruct the book at a 3d printer17:08
* alcabrera clicks malini's link17:08
alcabreramalini: I love that picture - planting the ethernet!17:09
mpanettakgriffs: It was gubmnt marketing :P17:09
flaper87this is what I think of when I read "Monsanto"
openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: fix: Move decorator out of class definition since it is static
alcabreraflaper87: looks tasty. :)17:15
kgriffsflaper87: lol!17:33
kgriffsnow that's a much better monsanto17:34
kgriffsflaper87: what do you think about adding pylint into our regular tox run?17:34
kgriffsjust with -E17:34
kgriffsalcabrera: ^^^ would like your thoughts too17:34
openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: chore: Fix pylint errors
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alcabrerakgriffs: with only -E enabled, I think it's pretty powerful. There's little noise, in that case.17:36
alcabreraI also like how the pylingt project is growing, so I think it stands to get even better over time.17:37
alcabreraI'm favorable towards this.17:37
alcabreraso would it look like...17:37
alcabreratox -e pylint17:37
kgriffswe can run it as part of the default too17:39
kgriffsmaybe tox -e lint17:39
alcabrera+1 for '-e lint'17:39
alcabreraI'd like to figure out something on that, too17:40
alcabreraby default, I believe that'll run pylint-2.x17:40
alcabreraI'd also like to be able to do pylint-3.x17:40
alcabrerasince they capture different errors17:40
alcabreratox -e lint; tox -e lint317:40
alcabrerasomething like that17:40
kgriffsare they different packages?17:41
kgriffsi mean, won't virtualenv pip install the right one?17:41
alcabrerathey're the same package, but I think virtualenv, by default, with execute 'python'17:42
alcabrerawhich is usually python 2.x17:42
alcabrera*with -> will17:42
kgriffsoh, right17:43
kgriffsmmm, anybody know the config option of hand for choosing the python version in a testenv?17:44
alcabrerakgriffs: -p17:45
alcabreraalso, --python17:45
kgriffsin tox.ini I think it may be basepython17:45
alcabrerakgriffs: yup, just confirmed17:48
kgriffspython is the depracated name for basepython17:48
alcabreranow we know the story. :)17:49
alcabreraso, I'm +1 for getting pylint into our tox,17:49
flaper87+1 for -elint17:49
alcabrerahow about -elint3, flaper87? :)17:50
flaper87that too :D17:50
alcabreraI'll submit the patch17:50
kgriffsI'm on it17:50
alcabrerasince I just tested out the ideas on another project17:50
alcabreranevermind then17:50
alcabrerakgriffs is the fastest17:50
alcabrerano worries. :)17:50
kgriffsdon't mean to steal fun work17:50
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kgriffsis that different from pylint17:51
* kgriffs looks17:51
alcabrerathere's so much fun work to do, I'm not concerned about some of it getting done by someone else. :D17:51
* kgriffs facepalm17:51
kgriffs-e lint17:51
* kgriffs blushes17:52
kgriffsi have lint2 and lint317:52
kgriffsis that cool?17:52
flaper87kgriffs: btw, we need yo announce Marconi 2014.1.b2, you've the honors :)17:53
kgriffson the ML?17:54
alcabrerasure seems like Twitter and #openstack-marconi are the official announcement channels for marconi, so far, given that we tweeted about Marconi 2014.1.b2 on both earlier. ;D17:54
alcabreraflaper87, kgriffs: ^17:55
flaper87mmh, I think it should be announced in the announces list17:55
openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Drop msgpack dependency
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flaper87kgriffs: alcabrera ^17:57
flaper87kgriffs: marocni was not mentioned there17:58
kgriffsasking in #openstack-dev18:00
alcabreraflaper87: +218:00
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flaper87alcabrera: thanks :D18:07
flaper87alcabrera: one left:
flaper87and now kgriffs has to go through reviews18:07
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openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: chore: Add pylint envs
kgriffsflaper87: yes, that I do18:10
kgriffsflaper87: ETA on memcached backend landing?18:11
flaper87kgriffs: at least 1 or 2 weeks18:12
flaper87I want to talk with Morgan (IIRC that's his name) about dogtail first18:12
kgriffsOK, just want to make sure that we are all set by the time i-3 rolls around18:12
flaper87kgriffs: small nit
alcabrerakgriffs: -1 with comments. :)18:13
flaper87kgriffs: we will, one way or another we'll have it18:13
kgriffsflaper87: do you mean, adding lint2 and lint3 in envlist?18:14
kgriffsthing is, there are some outstanding errors18:14
flaper87ah fuck, I can't even click on the right line18:14
kgriffsI suppose I could fix those. :p18:14
flaper87mmh, I never run $tox18:14
flaper87I always pick an env18:15
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: Drop msgpack dependency
flaper87not sure what other folks do18:15
kgriffswhat does gate do?18:15
kgriffsdoes it run each explicitly?18:15
flaper87depends on the gate18:15
flaper87py27 tox -epy2718:15
flaper87and so on18:15
flaper87TBH, I don't even use tox anymore18:15
kgriffsah, so perhaps this wouldn't  break the gate if I add it to envlist18:15
flaper87$ ctrl+r testr18:16
flaper87concurrency 418:16
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openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: chore: Add pylint envs
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alcabrerakgriffs: +218:26
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: Sync oslo-cache from oslo-incubator
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: Don't use `override_time` but mock instead
kgriffsflaper87: rebase me baby one more time -
* kgriffs loses some man points for quoting Britney Spears18:30
kgriffsalcabrera: another quick one for you - thanks!
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openstackgerritFlavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Add a _config_options function to Marconi
flaper87kgriffs: ^18:32
kgriffsflaper87: this one may need to be rebased - not sure -
flaper87damn, I would rather rebase the other 3 patches than this one18:32
flaper87lesse what happens18:33
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: Add a _config_options function to Marconi
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: fix: Move decorator out of class definition since it is static
alcabreraI feel like this is the most merging we've done in months!18:36
alcabreraFeels good.18:36
alcabreraI miss this pace. :D18:36
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openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: chore: Fix pylint errors
kgriffsalso, i rebased the other patch19:12
kgriffsalcabrera: ^^19:12
alcabrerakgriffs: +219:12
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/marconi: chore: Add pylint envs
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openstackgerritKurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: fix(wsgi): Cleanup limit config options
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