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openstackgerrit | Kurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Update hacking version and fix new violations https://review.openstack.org/100727 | 00:13 |
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kgriffs | ok, I'm out | 00:16 |
kgriffs | we should be able to get that patch finalized tomorrow | 00:16 |
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vkmc | o/ | 00:28 |
vkmc | take care! | 00:28 |
openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/99033 | 00:42 |
openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/python-marconiclient: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/99093 | 00:47 |
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openstackgerrit | Fei Long Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Make sure msgpack-python version >= 0.4.2 https://review.openstack.org/100745 | 02:12 |
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openstackgerrit | peng fei wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 02:15 |
norman | all, I'd delivered my first review , and I'd tried to be careful , anyway still make some mistake that included some unrelated changes, what can I do now? | 02:25 |
norman | deliver a following changeset to revert the changes ? | 02:30 |
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openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 02:48 |
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norman | had amend the commit with other's help | 02:53 |
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vkmc | thanks norman! | 02:55 |
vkmc | I'll review it soon :) | 02:56 |
norman | vkmc: thanks a lot | 02:56 |
norman | it make me a little nervous since it's my first one , haha | 02:56 |
norman | vkmc: if I found some typo in the code, do I need to create a bug to deliver the code ? | 03:00 |
openstackgerrit | Fei Long Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Make sure msgpack-python version >= 0.4.0 https://review.openstack.org/100745 | 03:03 |
flwang | norman: did you mean found typo in Marconi repo? | 03:04 |
norman | flwang: yes | 03:04 |
flwang | norman: if so, you can just submit a ps with/without filing a bug | 03:04 |
norman | ok, thanks | 03:05 |
flwang | norman: thanks for working on Marconi/Naav | 03:05 |
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vkmc | norman, you did great... just some minor nits, but the core looks good! | 03:30 |
norman | vkmc: thanks ,I will modify them soon | 03:31 |
norman | vkmc: you said Lines length in the commit messages should be >=72, but it should be <=72, right? | 03:38 |
norman | go for lunch .... | 03:38 |
vkmc | norman, right :) | 03:39 |
vkmc | that's why I added the link | 03:39 |
vkmc | I cannot trust myself at this hours | 03:39 |
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vkmc | ok... so kgriffs|afk patchset is not merged yet and this one is passing https://review.openstack.org/#/c/99033/ | 03:50 |
* vkmc lost | 03:50 | |
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vkmc | ttfn o/ | 03:58 |
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openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 05:46 |
openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 05:46 |
openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 05:48 |
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openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 05:58 |
openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Expose pymongo's SSL cert options https://review.openstack.org/100746 | 06:01 |
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norman | flwang: Hi Feilong ,there? | 06:04 |
flwang | norman: hi | 06:04 |
norman | flwang: what do you mean for the comment : And as for the requirements change, you need to submit a separate patch against requirements project firstly. | 06:05 |
norman | which project it is you mentioned | 06:05 |
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flwang | you can take this https://review.openstack.org/#/c/100745/ as an example | 06:06 |
norman | flwang: Ok got it ,thanks | 06:08 |
norman | and btw ,I'd fixed your comments about the whitespace | 06:08 |
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flwang | norman: ok, awesome | 06:09 |
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norman | flwang: PS for requirements project submitted | 06:34 |
flwang | cool | 06:34 |
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openstackgerrit | Peng Fei Wang proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Correct the rtype in the function docstrings https://review.openstack.org/100793 | 06:56 |
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flaper87 | flwang: ping | 08:55 |
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openstackgerrit | Flavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Rename shards to pool https://review.openstack.org/96463 | 08:57 |
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openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/marconi: Rename shards to pool https://review.openstack.org/96463 | 09:47 |
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openstackgerrit | Flavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Add flavors support to mongodb https://review.openstack.org/98793 | 11:44 |
openstackgerrit | Flavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Start scratching Queue Flavors api https://review.openstack.org/98777 | 11:44 |
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openstackgerrit | Flavio Percoco proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Add flavors support to mongodb https://review.openstack.org/98793 | 12:11 |
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vkmc | g'morning all! | 12:38 |
sriram | good morning vkmc :) | 12:38 |
vkmc | sriram, how are you today? :) | 12:38 |
sriram | Tired, but doing good :) | 12:39 |
sriram | marathon tennis session yesterday :P | 12:39 |
vkmc | w00t! you mean it when you said you wanted to start exercising haha | 12:40 |
vkmc | thats great | 12:40 |
sriram | yeah, will start some training for 5k soon, need to get stamina up before that :) | 12:41 |
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abettadapur | kgriffs | 13:32 |
abettadapur | kgriffs| | 13:32 |
abettadapur | kgriffs|afk: ping | 13:32 |
abettadapur | that typing thing.... | 13:32 |
flaper87 | vkmc: sriram abettadapur gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood morning | 13:36 |
flaper87 | it's so depressing when you ninja-approve a patch and it fails because of a merge conflict | 13:37 |
flaper87 | it breaks the power of that approval | 13:37 |
vkmc | flaper87, heeeeeeeeey :) | 13:37 |
abettadapur | goodmorning :) | 13:37 |
vkmc | abettadapur, good morning! | 13:38 |
abettadapur | vkmc: how are you doing today? | 13:39 |
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vkmc | abettadapur, a bit sleepy -.- but good, and you? | 13:41 |
sriram | hey hey hey | 13:42 |
sriram | goood morning flaper87 :) | 13:42 |
abettadapur | pretty good, but i can't wait for lunch | 13:42 |
abettadapur | hard to work when you are hungry | 13:43 |
abettadapur | :D | 13:43 |
flaper87 | sriram: good morning to you, sir! I heard you're doing excersice for both of us. Keep it up! :) | 13:44 |
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vkmc | true that! | 13:44 |
flaper87 | erm, exercise | 13:44 |
sriram | flaper87: haha. :P | 13:44 |
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abettadapur | flaper87: i responded to your comment | 13:49 |
abettadapur | does that make sense, or should it be done differently? | 13:49 |
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AAzza | good day all) | 13:50 |
alcabrera | hey, all. o/ | 13:50 |
sriram | hey alcabrera good morning :) | 13:52 |
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vkmc | morning AAzza, alcabrera o/ | 13:52 |
alcabrera | I'm so sleepy today. I've gotten my sleep schedule flipped so that I'm waking up around midnight. >.> | 13:53 |
sriram | thats bad :/ | 13:53 |
flaper87 | abettadapur: I proposed 2 different options in reply to your comment. I'd prefer the later. Assume it'll be set and skip if not | 13:53 |
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* flaper87 wishes he could say that | 13:53 | |
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flaper87 | Waking up around midnight means I went to bed before midnight | 13:53 |
flaper87 | I don't remember the last time that happened | 13:54 |
flaper87 | but I'm happy there's responsible people like alcabrera that take care of having a good sleep schedule | 13:54 |
* flaper87 should learn how to do these things | 13:54 | |
flaper87 | damnit | 13:54 |
alcabrera | lol | 13:55 |
sriram | flaper87: I had installed a sleep monitoring app before, but I uninstalled it after it kept saying I'm not getting enough sleep :P | 13:55 |
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abettadapur | flaper87: ok, I did it the second way. I didn't realize superclasses could access subclass attributes | 13:57 |
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AAzza | i defend my master thesis) yahhooo) | 13:57 |
abettadapur | python continues to surprise me | 13:57 |
sriram | AAzza: congratulations!! | 13:58 |
AAzza | sriram: thanks) | 13:58 |
malini1 | AAzza: Congratulations!! | 13:59 |
vkmc | congrats AAzza! :) | 14:00 |
alcabrera | nice, AAzza! :D | 14:01 |
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openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/99033 | 14:04 |
flaper87 | AAzza: CONGRATTTTTTTTSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! | 14:04 |
AAzza | hahaha, thanks) | 14:05 |
malini1 | Tht is real serious congratulation!! | 14:06 |
malini1 | I will remember tht next time :) | 14:06 |
cpallares | AAzza: Congrats! :) | 14:10 |
openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/100913 | 14:13 |
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openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/100913 | 14:20 |
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openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/marconi: Make storage.utils.keyify py3k compatible https://review.openstack.org/100084 | 14:40 |
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kgriffs | rebasing... | 15:09 |
kgriffs | :p | 15:09 |
flaper87 | kgriffs: I hear you | 15:17 |
openstackgerrit | Kurt Griffiths proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Update hacking version and fix new violations https://review.openstack.org/100727 | 15:22 |
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kgriffs | sriram: i think we can use that benchmarking tool to do some localhost testing when working on perf changes, but we also need to have it running for every patch submitted to gerrit, on a dedicated benchmarking cluster | 15:25 |
kgriffs | I think getting that in place should take priority over another iteration on the benchmarking tool | 15:26 |
kgriffs | I was thinking of something like this: | 15:26 |
kgriffs | 1. get basic producer-consumer merged | 15:26 |
kgriffs | 2. set up performance gate | 15:27 |
kgriffs | 3. add to producer-consumer a measure of how long it takes, on average to post a message and then consumer it on the other hand (end-to-end clock) | 15:27 |
kgriffs | 4. add benchmarks for some other messaging patterns | 15:27 |
kgriffs | sriram: what do you think? | 15:27 |
sriram | hey kgriffs, just saw the messages. | 15:28 |
sriram | makes sense | 15:28 |
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sriram | kgriffs|afk: what do you mean by another iteration though? like adding oslo.config? | 15:46 |
flaper87 | sriram: kgriffs didn't we agree to call it `bench` ? | 15:50 |
sriram | kgriffs: flaper87: sure, I can rename it. :) | 15:50 |
flaper87 | sriram: oh, I'm asking because I probably missed something | 15:51 |
flaper87 | .... and because I prefer bench MUAHAHAHHA | 15:51 |
flaper87 | (just kidding) | 15:51 |
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sriram | flaper87: no, I started out the patch before we had the conversation and I forgot about changing it. :P | 15:51 |
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flaper87 | malini: hey :) | 15:53 |
flaper87 | malini: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2014-June/001370.html | 15:53 |
flaper87 | are you subscribed to the os-infra mailing list? | 15:53 |
flaper87 | There's some talk to get f20 in with mongo >=2.4 | 15:53 |
flaper87 | and Eoghan mentioned Marconi as well | 15:53 |
flaper87 | If you can, it would be nice to chime in there too. | 15:54 |
flaper87 | otherwise, I'll try to do it | 15:54 |
sriram | bbl lunch | 15:57 |
sriram | kgriffs, flaper87: we can discuss a bit more on marconi-bench when I'm back :) | 15:57 |
kgriffs | sriram: no, not oslo.config. I just mean just generally speaking adding more features to benchmarking | 15:57 |
sriram | flaper87: thanks for the comments on the review. | 15:58 |
sriram | kgriffs: gotcha | 15:58 |
flaper87 | np | 15:58 |
flaper87 | I think we should clean up the one we have without adding new features | 15:58 |
sriram | I'll work on the suggestions and have another patch in. | 15:58 |
flaper87 | let it land and add more things later | 15:58 |
flaper87 | yeah, just what kgriffs said :P | 15:58 |
* flaper87 likes re-stating kgriffs | 15:58 | |
sriram | :P | 15:58 |
openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/100913 | 16:07 |
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vkmc | flaper87, saying hi AMQP style http://paste.openstack.org/show/84405/ | 16:15 |
vkmc | I'm digging into the transport layer | 16:15 |
flaper87 | vkmc: ohhh, AWESOME! | 16:16 |
flaper87 | vkmc: how's that going? | 16:17 |
flaper87 | any trouble so far? | 16:17 |
flaper87 | vkmc: did you look into Azure's documentation? | 16:17 |
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vkmc | flaper87, good so far... there are some headers we use that may require some thinking to add to amqp, so I'm checking that out | 16:18 |
vkmc | flaper87, I did yeah! | 16:18 |
flaper87 | vkmc: anything interesting? | 16:19 |
flaper87 | I've no idea how they did it | 16:19 |
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vkmc | flaper87, there is not much to take from there | 16:22 |
vkmc | at least in this early stages | 16:22 |
vkmc | well... the interaction with the Service Bus using Proton gives us a good idea of how the clients would use it | 16:24 |
vkmc | so I'm doing reverse engeneering to implement a similar behavior from Marconi :) while keeping our ways of course | 16:26 |
* kgriffs is setting up a new, hardened ZNC box | 16:27 | |
kgriffs | flaper87: I'm curious: any python-based IRC bouncers you know of? | 16:27 |
kgriffs | or Rust-based. :D | 16:27 |
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vkmc | s/engeneering/engineering | 16:29 |
flaper87 | kgriffs: lol @ rust based :P | 16:31 |
flaper87 | mmh, wasn't there something written using twisted ? | 16:31 |
kgriffs | no idea | 16:31 |
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flaper87 | vkmc: re reverse engineering. That sounds perfect :P | 16:31 |
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flaper87 | let me know as soon as you've something up | 16:31 |
flaper87 | I'm curious | 16:32 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87, kgriffs: available to talk about high throughput apis? | 16:32 |
kgriffs | flaper87, vkmc: IronPython FTW! | 16:32 |
flaper87 | (plop) | 16:33 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: sure, kgriffs ? | 16:33 |
kgriffs | yep | 16:33 |
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vkmc | kgriffs, Python for .NET? | 16:33 |
* vkmc hides | 16:34 | |
keith_newstadt | as we discussed - we're building a high throughput message queue as input to stream processing | 16:35 |
keith_newstadt | using kafka | 16:35 |
keith_newstadt | we need a layer on top to enforce keystone auth and multitenancy, and are considering different types of streaming apis | 16:36 |
keith_newstadt | but we'd also like the functionality marconi provides | 16:36 |
keith_newstadt | and would like to build it in a way that it would useful to the community | 16:37 |
keith_newstadt | sounds like you all have been talking about similar requirements and scenarios | 16:37 |
keith_newstadt | kgriffs: how would you want to start the discussion? | 16:37 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: I think we should first know what the requirements are in terms of throughput | 16:38 |
keith_newstadt | btw, we've identified engineers for this task. not looking for a free ride. :) | 16:38 |
flaper87 | it'd also be interesting to know what kind of semantics you guys are interested in | 16:39 |
flaper87 | is the current API good enough? (in terms of semantics) | 16:39 |
keith_newstadt | throughput requirements - we've got an internal customer that is currently doing about 400,000 messages/sec in their legacy, non-openstack environment | 16:39 |
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keith_newstadt | so we need to support that at least, and we expect the throughput from that customer to grow over time | 16:40 |
keith_newstadt | as well as other customers to use the service as well | 16:40 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: how many nodes? (If you can share) | 16:40 |
flaper87 | I don't think that's a 1 node thing, is it? | 16:40 |
keith_newstadt | you mean messaging service / kafka nodes? definitely not a 1 node thing | 16:41 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: yeah kafka nodes. | 16:41 |
keith_newstadt | we've got initial PoC that does about a 40,000 on three kafka VMs | 16:42 |
flaper87 | awesome, we're very interested in that kind of numbers | 16:42 |
keith_newstadt | we still need to do performance tuning and hardware tuning | 16:42 |
flaper87 | because we're currently working on benchmarking marconi | 16:42 |
keith_newstadt | cool. we'd be happy to collaborate on testing tools and methodologies as well | 16:43 |
flaper87 | awesome, awesome, awesome. | 16:43 |
flaper87 | now, what about the API? | 16:43 |
keith_newstadt | as for api semantics, we need to support multiple producers and multiple consumers | 16:43 |
flaper87 | It's very different from Kafka, as it's right now. | 16:43 |
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keith_newstadt | and consumers need to be able to pull from the queue at independent places/times | 16:44 |
flaper87 | ok, that we can do | 16:44 |
flaper87 | erm, Marconi | 16:44 |
flaper87 | :P | 16:44 |
keith_newstadt | cool | 16:44 |
keith_newstadt | regarding the api, we're primarily looking at how to get throughput and performance | 16:44 |
flaper87 | I think the first step would be doing a similar benchmark on Marconi | 16:44 |
keith_newstadt | e.g. open up a single connection and push many messages through it | 16:45 |
flaper87 | and see how close (<- me being optimistic) we are to the required performance | 16:45 |
flaper87 | Having a kafka store driver sounds... sexy :P | 16:45 |
keith_newstadt | seems like it would be hard to be comparable with the overhead of a rest based api | 16:46 |
flaper87 | The thing is that I believe we'll have the same issues we had with AMQP | 16:46 |
keith_newstadt | what issues did you have? | 16:46 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: mostly mapping the existing API with AMQP. | 16:46 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: I listed some here: http://blog.flaper87.com/post/53a09586d987d23f49c777bf/ | 16:47 |
keith_newstadt | cool, thanks, i'll read it offline | 16:47 |
flaper87 | TL;DR: Kafka API (and AMQP's) are stream-based | 16:47 |
flaper87 | it's quite hard to map the feed semantics of Marconi's API to them | 16:48 |
flaper87 | Note that I've just read papers and docs about kafka. I've never used it before. | 16:48 |
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keith_newstadt | i might be oversimplifying, so set me right if i am... | 16:48 |
flaper87 | so, if I'm wrong, feel free to send me a gentle STFU and I will :P | 16:48 |
keith_newstadt | i was thinking that there would be a set of streaming apis (http streaming, long polling, web sockets...) that would live alongside the existing marconin ones | 16:49 |
keith_newstadt | and no reason why you couldn't use both | 16:49 |
keith_newstadt | e.g. producer uses existing APIs, but a consumer gets them on a stream | 16:49 |
keith_newstadt | or is your concern that it woudl be difficult to support the existing marconi apis on kafka? | 16:50 |
kgriffs | I think we may be conflating two things | 16:50 |
kgriffs | there is the protocol and the semantics | 16:50 |
kgriffs | the 1.x API semantics are what may be difficult or impossible to map | 16:50 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: what kgriffs said | 16:51 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: we can support different transmission protocols, but the api semantics remain the same. | 16:51 |
keith_newstadt | impossible to map to streaming, or to kafka? | 16:51 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: your blog post might help bring me up to speed on this | 16:52 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: I highlighted some of the most crutial issues we had, there are definitely others. If they are not true for kafka, then lets talk about it :) | 16:53 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: it'd be impossible to map to a "pure-streamed" API. | 16:53 |
keith_newstadt | i see you discuss this in the post. let me catch up, and we'll talk more again later. | 16:54 |
keith_newstadt | let's also say in touch on benchmarking | 16:54 |
keith_newstadt | where are you at in that process? | 16:54 |
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flaper87 | keith_newstadt: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/98875/ | 16:55 |
flaper87 | sriram: is working on that small tool. We'll start benchmarking prod/con | 16:55 |
flaper87 | with different loads | 16:55 |
flaper87 | I'm very interested in knowing what tests you guys did | 16:55 |
flaper87 | we can try to replicate them on marconi | 16:56 |
keith_newstadt | so far our tests have been based on our specific customer data | 16:56 |
keith_newstadt | we're working on more generic tests that we can share | 16:56 |
keith_newstadt | they are also using the kafka protocol directly, which we'd like to move away from | 16:56 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: could some of your engineers take a look at that patch and share some thoughts? | 16:57 |
flaper87 | that'd be amazing | 16:57 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: i'll see what i can share from what we have | 16:57 |
keith_newstadt | sure | 16:57 |
flaper87 | awesome | 16:57 |
flaper87 | so, I gotta run now but I'll be back in a bit | 16:57 |
keith_newstadt | no problem. they'll be interested to see it as well | 16:57 |
keith_newstadt | me too. you're on vacation for the next few days? | 16:58 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: yes^Wconference | 16:58 |
keith_newstadt | cool. have fun, will reach out when you're back. | 16:58 |
flaper87 | feel free to ping me on email/irc/phone/twitter/etc | 16:58 |
keith_newstadt | will do! | 16:59 |
flaper87 | I'll be on-line, just with limited internet access | 16:59 |
flaper87 | kk, gtg now... for realz | 16:59 |
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sriram | flaper87: last we discussed, did we want bench to be a part of the marconi package? | 17:27 |
sriram | kgriffs: ^ | 17:28 |
kgriffs | um | 17:28 |
kgriffs | I don't remember | 17:29 |
kgriffs | let's see | 17:29 |
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sriram | let me checkout the logs of the prior meeting. | 17:30 |
sriram | I think we discussed it there. | 17:30 |
kgriffs | i think it is simplest to say, just pip install marconi and you get marconi-server and marconi-bench | 17:30 |
kgriffs | as a developer, that would be nice. I can just "pip install -e marconi" and then as I change stuff I can benchmark it | 17:31 |
sriram | yes that is what I have it doing now, but I made bench a part of marconi's package. | 17:31 |
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kgriffs | flaper87 may have had a good reason to make it a separate package, though still same repo/project | 17:31 |
sriram | cool | 17:31 |
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kgriffs | flaper87: but I can't think of what the benefit is to make it separate | 17:32 |
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tjanczuk | keith_newstadt, flaper87: interesting kafka discussion. are you online? | 18:20 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: i'm here | 18:22 |
flaper87 | sriram: kgriffs I wouldn't mind packaging it as part of marconi | 18:25 |
flaper87 | FWIW, you get redis-bench when you install redis | 18:25 |
flaper87 | so go for it | 18:26 |
sriram | yeah, that was going to be my argument as well :P | 18:26 |
sriram | flaper87: \m/ | 18:26 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: tjanczuk: I am now but I'll have to go in a bit | 18:26 |
tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: I am curious about your goals for Kafka in the context of Marconi. In particular, would you want to expose Kafka transport directly to apps, or put it behind the Marconi APIs? | 18:27 |
tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: what is the best way to connect besides IRC here? | 18:27 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: goals - high throughput as a feed in/out of Storm-based stream processing as a service | 18:28 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: we are currently exposing kafka in our very early environment, but don't want to do that in production or as we take on more internal customers | 18:29 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: we also need MQ as a service in general, outside of stream processing | 18:29 |
flaper87 | I don't think exposing kafka would be a good idea in this context | 18:29 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: 100% agree | 18:30 |
keith_newstadt | we also need auth, multi-tenancy, and TLS | 18:30 |
keith_newstadt | and so using marconi is our first choice | 18:30 |
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keith_newstadt | we just need to make sure we can get the throughput we need | 18:30 |
tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: so you expect Marconi to provide a protocol abstraction over Kafka? Or do you expect Marconi to *replace* Kafka while offering the same perf charactestics? | 18:31 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: email: keith_newstadt@symantec.com / twitter: @knewstadt | 18:31 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: we expect to build or help build the capability and contribute it | 18:32 |
flaper87 | IIUC, any of those options work for keith_newstadt | 18:33 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: marconi on top of kafka is my initial thought, but the requirements are primary over the implementation | 18:33 |
flaper87 | am I right? | 18:33 |
flaper87 | I mean, as long as you get the throughput you need, you're fine with marconi | 18:33 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: throughput, durability, and multiple consumers, yes | 18:34 |
flaper87 | (side note: Pls, keep me in the loop of any off-line discussion. Thanks) | 18:34 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: absolutely | 18:34 |
flaper87 | (side note2: I'd prefer to keep them all in the open, if possible) | 18:34 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: right | 18:34 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: I think Marconi can provide all that | 18:34 |
flaper87 | and well, as we said before, we should first benchmark it | 18:34 |
flaper87 | I mean, I've real doubts about its current performance | 18:35 |
flaper87 | but I'm sure that whatever the output is, it can be improved | 18:35 |
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flaper87 | that said, the kafka driver is a really sexy idea | 18:35 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: do you think the current api can do on the order of 10K req/sec? | 18:35 |
flaper87 | and we should add it to the evaluation of possible drivers | 18:35 |
keith_newstadt | per node that is | 18:35 |
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tjanczuk | I think it would be a challange for Marconi to provide perf on par with Kafka without a connection-oriented transport. | 18:35 |
keith_newstadt | i agree | 18:36 |
* flaper87 agrees | 18:36 | |
flaper87 | I mean, not in the current state but I'd like to know where we are | 18:36 |
flaper87 | before doing any changes | 18:36 |
keith_newstadt | what kinds of changes do you have in mind? | 18:36 |
flaper87 | Just to make sure the plans we make are oriented in the right direction | 18:37 |
tjanczuk | On that note, I did some experiments with WebSockets on top of AMQP 0.9 at http://github.com/tjanczuk/narconi. The implementation is in Node not Python. I was able to get ~6000 msg/s out of a single connection. | 18:37 |
tjanczuk | Without any tuning. | 18:37 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: A new transport with persistent connection is something we've discussed. | 18:38 |
flaper87 | tjanczuk: did you see my websocket hack? | 18:38 |
flaper87 | well, mine was on top of marconi | 18:38 |
tjanczuk | I saw it. | 18:38 |
flaper87 | anyway, that said, I think we should first see how we can tune the existing transport/API/storage and wok on something else in parallel | 18:38 |
tjanczuk | I did not make the cut for me because I wanted full fidelity with the connection-oriented nature of the backend. Which I expect an implementation on top Kafka would also need. | 18:38 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk, flaper87: we built a long polling solution that did around 14K/sec on a physical server, written in C | 18:39 |
flaper87 | What I'm trying to say is that I think our current implementation can do better, regardless the possibility of adding new transports | 18:39 |
flaper87 | transports/storage/etc | 18:39 |
keith_newstadt | do you have a sense of what you'd be shooting for yet? if we think the upper end of the current implementation is good enough, then it's a good route to pursue | 18:40 |
keith_newstadt | but if we think it's low enough to warrant a streaming approach, perhaps it's something to pursue in parallel? | 18:40 |
tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: what do you mean by "streaming approach"? connection oriented transport or message access semantics? | 18:41 |
keith_newstadt | would the durability requirement require a new engine regardless? | 18:41 |
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keith_newstadt | i'm thinking in terms of the api performance - so a single connection of some type, one authorization, tenancy enforcement, and then pushing the messages through | 18:43 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: durability is enforced by the storage layer. As of now, mongodb is our recommended solution for production environemnts and it provides durability | 18:43 |
tjanczuk | I am fully with you. Fully. | 18:43 |
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flaper87 | keith_newstadt: some history: | 18:43 |
tjanczuk | Do you care about web-friendliness of the protocol? | 18:43 |
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flaper87 | Through the last year we've talked about websocket, raw tcp, amqp (still tpc) and zmq as possible transport drivers | 18:44 |
flaper87 | The one we've been leaning towards to is websocket because of it's web capabilities | 18:44 |
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flaper87 | And it's possible to do websocket connections from libraries too. | 18:44 |
flaper87 | s/it's/its/ | 18:45 |
flaper87 | s/it's/its web capabilities/ | 18:45 |
flaper87 | zmq is out of discussion for now | 18:45 |
flaper87 | and there's an on-going research on the amqp side ( vkmc ) | 18:45 |
flaper87 | but again, I think we need to becnhmark the current version and see where the bottleneck is | 18:46 |
flaper87 | and where we should be focusing efforts | 18:46 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: makes sense | 18:46 |
flaper87 | That said, I do think a persistent transmission protocol will happen in the future | 18:47 |
flaper87 | for sure | 18:47 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: ideally web-friendly, but that's a p2 or p3 | 18:47 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: sounds encouraging | 18:47 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: let's continue the conversation when you're back, and how we can put our engineers to work on it | 18:48 |
tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: Performance aside, does the semantics of the current Marconi HTTP APIs satisfy your requirements? | 18:48 |
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flaper87 | keith_newstadt: sure, we can also follow-up on email since the clock for juno is ticking really fast | 18:49 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: let me put together more formal/clearer requirements and i'll share | 18:49 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: i think so, but i will verify | 18:50 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: btw, thanks a lot! It was a great discussion and I'm happy to know you're interested in the project | 18:50 |
flaper87 | huge welcome to you and your team :) | 18:50 |
keith_newstadt | flaper87: thanks :) | 18:51 |
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tjanczuk | keith_newstadt: I would be curious about your thoughts on the HTTP/WebSocket API prototype at https://github.com/tjanczuk/narconi. With this POR I was trying to enable using connection oriented backends and optimize for performance level that I don't think can be achieved with standard HTTP. Some of the problems this POR solves are outlined in the AMQP 0.9 investigation (most of which I expect to apply to Kafka as well): http://lists.openstack.or | 18:58 |
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flaper87 | kgriffs: hey, can I get your review on the queue flavors patches ? | 19:39 |
kgriffs | thanks for the reminder. I need to do a bunch of reviews today | 19:40 |
keith_newstadt | tjanczuk: thanks for the link. i will take a look | 19:41 |
flaper87 | keith_newstadt: thank you for the reviews :) | 19:41 |
flaper87 | erm, kgriffs ^ | 19:43 |
flaper87 | :P | 19:43 |
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* flaper87 should use 2 letters tab, instead of 1 letter tab | 19:43 | |
* kgriffs stops playing with arch linux and goes to do some reviews | 19:44 | |
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flaper87 | kgriffs: archlinux rocks | 19:46 |
flaper87 | erm, I mean, fedora | 19:46 |
* flaper87 hides | 19:46 | |
flaper87 | :P | 19:46 |
kgriffs | LOL | 19:47 |
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sriram | gunicorn 19.0.0 seems to be broken, cant serve marconi with it. 18.0 works though, is it the same for everyone? | 20:13 |
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kgriffs | I haven't tried it | 20:32 |
kgriffs | what is the error? | 20:32 |
kgriffs | flwang: can you sanity-check this an merge if it looks OK? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/100727/ | 20:34 |
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kgriffs | malini: or could you merge it? ^^^ | 20:57 |
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* kgriffs wonders where everyone is? | 21:00 | |
kgriffs | flwang: ping | 21:01 |
vkmc | *crickets* | 21:02 |
flwang | kgriffs: pong | 21:06 |
flwang | I saw your patch, will take a look soon | 21:07 |
flwang | kgriffs: wow, seems now you're really good at playing with whitespace | 21:10 |
flwang | and blank lines :D | 21:10 |
kgriffs | yep. all kinds of "fun". | 21:10 |
flwang | kgriffs: looks good for me, and I believe you're an expert on whitespace now | 21:12 |
flwang | approved | 21:12 |
* kgriffs puts on "Expert Whitespacer" badge | 21:12 | |
kgriffs | thanks! | 21:12 |
flwang | kgriffs: btw, as for this patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/100745/ | 21:13 |
flwang | kgriffs: we need to pin the msgpack version | 21:13 |
kgriffs | oh | 21:13 |
flwang | I have submitted a patch for requirements project and it's merged now | 21:13 |
kgriffs | ah, that was my next question. :D | 21:14 |
flwang | ok | 21:14 |
flwang | should we wait for the robot to sync it? | 21:14 |
flwang | flwang: what's your question? | 21:14 |
kgriffs | already happening, looks like: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/100913/3/requirements.txt | 21:15 |
kgriffs | so you can abandon https://review.openstack.org/#/c/100745/ | 21:15 |
flwang | cool | 21:15 |
kgriffs | nice catch, thanks for taking care of that! | 21:16 |
flwang | my pleasure :) | 21:16 |
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openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/marconi: Update hacking version and fix new violations https://review.openstack.org/100727 | 21:34 |
openstackgerrit | A change was merged to openstack/marconi: Updated from global requirements https://review.openstack.org/100913 | 21:34 |
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kgriffs | FYI: first draft of reviewer's guide, including proposed comment prefixes | 22:14 |
kgriffs | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Reviewer_Guide_(Marconi) | 22:14 |
kgriffs | this is linked from the home page | 22:15 |
flwang | in case you guys interested in http://www.redhat.com/enovance/?utm_content=buffer24e09&utm_medium=social&utm_source=plus.google.com&utm_campaign=buffer | 22:16 |
kgriffs | eeenteresting | 22:21 |
flwang | kgriffs: Reviewing ang being reviewed I think it should 'and', right? | 22:24 |
kgriffs | yeah | 22:26 |
kgriffs | nice nice catch | 22:26 |
flwang | I have fixed it | 22:26 |
flwang | just wanna confirm | 22:26 |
kgriffs | rock on | 22:26 |
flwang | kgriffs: btw, I like the prefixes you posted | 22:27 |
flwang | kgriffs: though I need some time to be used to | 22:27 |
kgriffs | thanks. I just brainstormed a starting list and we can refine them as we try them out | 22:27 |
flwang | yep, it can make the review more efficient | 22:28 |
flwang | as for the redhat+enovance, seem redhat is aim to be the giant of Openstack | 22:29 |
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