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| kgriffs | o/ | 15:01 |
|---|---|---|
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| flaper87 | #startmeeting Zaqar | 15:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 6 15:01:37 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is flaper87. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zaqar' | 15:01 |
| flaper87 | #topic roll call | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:01 | |
| flaper87 | who's here? | 15:01 |
| flaper87 | I'm not | 15:02 |
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| kgriffs | o/ | 15:02 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: cpallares vkmc | 15:02 |
| flaper87 | so, vkmc is traveling, I guess she's not joining | 15:03 |
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| flaper87 | zhiyan: ? | 15:03 |
| cpallares | o/ | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | aaaaaaaaaaaaaanyway, lets move on | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | This is our agenda for today: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Zaqar#Agenda | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | #topic Actions from previous meetings | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from previous meetings (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:04 | |
| flaper87 | so, there are no actions from previous meetings | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | LOL, that was short, easy and painless | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | #topic What is our release plan for v1.1? Is it frozen? (kgriffs) | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "What is our release plan for v1.1? Is it frozen? (kgriffs) (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:04 | |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: floor is yours | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I promise, you'll have breakfast after this | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | heh | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: speak, don't be afraid | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | so, I just wanted to talk about our plans around finalizing v1.1 of the api | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | afaict, it's pretty much complete now and what we wanted to do on it, it's done | 15:06 |
| flaper87 | I think we can go ahead and freeze it | 15:06 |
| kgriffs | are all the pooling things stable now? | 15:07 |
| flaper87 | yeah, there are some patches with fixes but I think it's fine to accept bug fixes | 15:07 |
| flaper87 | no new features or changes to the public semantics should be needed | 15:07 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: the 2 patches I mentioned add `links` to the returned document for pool and flavor | 15:08 |
| flaper87 | there's nothing else as far as I remember | 15:08 |
| kgriffs | what is the strategy for dealing with "additive" changes, such as returning a couple more values in the queue stats response | 15:08 |
| kgriffs | i can't remember if we have a guideline in the API that says clients must ignore extra fields they don't recognize - in other words, don't break if the response has more things in it | 15:09 |
| flaper87 | as long as they don't change the existing semantics (meaning they don't break backwards compatibility) I think it's fine | 15:09 |
| flaper87 | exactly | 15:09 |
| kgriffs | "Unrecognized protocol elements received from the server should simply be ignored. This includes JSON object properties, link relation types, media types, etc." | 15:10 |
| kgriffs | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zaqar/specs/api/v1.1#Resource_Media_Types | 15:10 |
| flaper87 | +2 | 15:10 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: is there anything left we need to get into the final Icehouse release so that if someone deploys that, they can be sure that it will support the entire v1.1 API as spec'd? | 15:11 |
| flaper87 | mmh, Icehouse? | 15:12 |
| flaper87 | you meant Juno ? | 15:12 |
| kgriffs | oops, yeah | 15:12 |
| * flaper87 confused | 15:12 | |
| flaper87 | ah ok | 15:12 |
| kgriffs | juno | 15:12 |
| flaper87 | then no, I think the whole spec is covered | 15:13 |
| flaper87 | we can do a sanity check this week | 15:13 |
| flaper87 | and I'll write down a notice announcing v1.1 is frozen | 15:13 |
| flaper87 | I think even the client has full support for v1.1 now | 15:13 |
| kgriffs | ok. related, perhaps we can get this on today's agenda too - smoke testing both v1.1 and v1.0 with "recommended" production deployment configurations | 15:13 |
| kgriffs | that should uncover any minor things that we may have missed | 15:14 |
| flaper87 | #action flaper87 and kgriffs to sanity check that v1.1 is fully implemented as written in the spec | 15:14 |
| flaper87 | #action flaper87 to write a note announcing v1.1 is frozen if the previous action is indeed complete | 15:14 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: want to do it right away ? | 15:14 |
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| flaper87 | #topic smoke test v1.1 and v1.0 | 15:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "smoke test v1.1 and v1.0 (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:14 | |
| zhiyan | Hi, sorry I'm still in holiday, but for 1.1 Api stuff May I do a double check here? | 15:15 |
| flaper87 | zhiyan: that'd be great | 15:15 |
| flaper87 | lets talk when you're back | 15:15 |
| flaper87 | I'll point you to the right places | 15:15 |
| zhiyan | Ok | 15:15 |
| zhiyan | Actually just want to make sure the extra queue stat what I proposed in last meeting | 15:16 |
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| zhiyan | If it could be added in 11 or four should do it in 20 | 15:17 |
| flaper87 | zhiyan: sure, we can talk about that further in a bit if you're still around | 15:17 |
| flaper87 | I think v1.1 is fine, it's an addition to the stats dict | 15:17 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: around? smoke test? | 15:17 |
| kgriffs | yep | 15:17 |
| kgriffs | so, I'd like us all to be confident that someone deploying juno in production won't find any bad bugs | 15:17 |
| zhiyan | Ok. I talked that with kgriffs and flwang, they think these two items are ok | 15:18 |
| kgriffs | therefore, I propose standing up some clusters and banging on them manually - using curl, the client, whatever | 15:18 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: would something like this help? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/125562/4 | 15:18 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: we can make that job run for zaqar too | 15:18 |
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| flaper87 | I'm adding it to zaqarclient first | 15:18 |
| flaper87 | so we can test it | 15:18 |
| flaper87 | but we could make it vote in zaqar and that'd be like our tempest++ test | 15:19 |
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| flaper87 | it'd ensure we're not breaking the client and that we're not breaking the server | 15:19 |
| flaper87 | that patch runs all the client functional tests | 15:19 |
| kgriffs | i think that definitely helps. but before each big release I think we need to do some manual testing and against clusters that are outside devstack. | 15:19 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: fair enough | 15:19 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: any idea how we can automate this? I know you said manual but we need some scripts that would help on making this process easier | 15:20 |
| kgriffs | mmm, good point | 15:20 |
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| kgriffs | i was just going to say | 15:22 |
| kgriffs | you can't automatically verify that error messages are helpful/make sense | 15:22 |
| kgriffs | but then to test that we would need to force error conditions | 15:22 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: mmh, ok, then lets organize a test-day | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | actually, we should do that anyway - like force a master failover and stuff | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | but anyway | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | Lets write down a list of tests we want to do | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | it may not be as much "manual" as "real production deployment and simulating failures" | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | then organize a test day and call for volunteers | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | and ask each of them to take just 1 task | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | and also "requests from a type of client we don't normally test" | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | we can share this info in openstack-dev and even #rdo | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | test day sounds good | 15:24 |
| flaper87 | But I think we first need to work on the list of things we want to test | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | the biggest amount of work is setting up the test cluster(s) | 15:24 |
| flaper87 | Make sure it's broad enough to cover a real production environment | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: yep | 15:24 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I can help you with that | 15:24 |
| flaper87 | also, I think we need the test cluster for some tests | 15:25 |
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| flaper87 | but other tests can also be run manually in each volunteer's laptop | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | Like verify the usefulness of error messages | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | well, actually, the test cluster makes everything easier | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | #action kgriffs and flaper87 to work on a list of pre-release tests for test day | 15:26 |
| kgriffs | sounds like a plan | 15:26 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: awesome, thanks for bringing this up | 15:26 |
| kgriffs | sure thing | 15:26 |
| flaper87 | #topic Where are we from a durable/reliable perspective? | 15:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Where are we from a durable/reliable perspective? (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:26 | |
| flaper87 | So, I'm not going to get much into detail here but I did want to bring this up | 15:26 |
| flaper87 | I think we need to do a deep dive and analize where we're standing w.r.t durability, reliability and scalability | 15:27 |
| flaper87 | I'm not talking about performance testing but deployment architectures | 15:27 |
| flaper87 | for example: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/125938/ | 15:27 |
| flaper87 | I started working on that documentation | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | It helped me to clear out where the mongodb driver is standing w.r.t the above | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | and it'll also help deployers to understand what each driver is useful for | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | I think we also need to do that for the redis driver | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | the actual documentation is here: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/125938/4/zaqar/queues/storage/mongodb/__init__.py,cm | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | Basically, what I'd like us to do is to work on defining what the recommended deployment scenario is from the bottom up | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | I'm sure more experienced dev/ops will show up and prove us wrong but until then lets provide at least a starting point | 15:30 |
| kgriffs | should we come up with a set of things that should be documented for each driver? | 15:30 |
| cpallares | flaper87: ++ | 15:30 |
| flaper87 | now, easy question to make but hard to answer: Who volunteers for the redis driver? | 15:30 |
| kgriffs | like, "here is how you get HA" | 15:30 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I started working on this: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zaqar-storage-requirements | 15:31 |
| kgriffs | and "here is how you scale up and out" | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | that's kinda something drivers must provide but also a starting point for these docs | 15:31 |
| kgriffs | and "performance tips" | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: +1 for performance tips | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | all those things are useful | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | I think the main 3 things that must be documented are in that etherpad. We can have custom sections per driver if needed | 15:32 |
| kgriffs | ok | 15:32 |
| flaper87 | obviously, feel free to edit that etherpad | 15:33 |
| flaper87 | it's a work in progress for this patch: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/125658/ | 15:33 |
| flaper87 | ok, that's it from me for this topic | 15:33 |
| kgriffs | ok | 15:33 |
| kgriffs | real quick | 15:33 |
| flaper87 | shoot | 15:33 |
| kgriffs | I know everyone is all keen on "scale-out" but there are some "scale up" things that make sense too | 15:34 |
| kgriffs | for example, use SSDs in your mongo box | 15:34 |
| flaper87 | indeed there are, I think we have to mention those | 15:34 |
| flaper87 | mongo docs mention some scale-up tips | 15:35 |
| kgriffs | I was just thinking it would be good to just mention a few things like that, or at least link to some docs or books people can reference to learn more | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | and it's fair to point people there | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: ++ | 15:35 |
| kgriffs | kewl | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | I'm also thinking about adding a note in mongo docs saying: I've no idea how sharding works so it'll probably blow up | 15:35 |
| * flaper87 is obviously kidding | 15:36 | |
| flaper87 | ... about the note | 15:36 |
| kgriffs | lol | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | aaanyway | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | moving on | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | #topic Design Sessions (flaper87) | 15:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Design Sessions (flaper87) (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:36 | |
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| flaper87 | sooooooooooo, design sessions https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-zaqar-summit-topics | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-zaqar-summit-topics | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | I'd like to organize more than 4 sessions. We'll have room for 4 and then just pod sessions | 15:37 |
| flaper87 | but I'd like to give our pod discussions some schedule | 15:37 |
| flaper87 | just to make sure we know when to be there | 15:37 |
| flaper87 | that said, I'd like to reserve the design sessions for topics other projects may be interested on | 15:37 |
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| flaper87 | so far I have "v2 kick-off" and "persistent transports" | 15:38 |
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| flaper87 | the summit is less than a month away and we need to sort this out | 15:38 |
| flaper87 | please, dedicate some time to this and add ideas there | 15:38 |
| flaper87 | that's it | 15:38 |
| flaper87 | anything else? anyone? | 15:39 |
| flaper87 | ok | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | um | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | wait | 15:39 |
| * flaper87 waits | 15:39 | |
| kgriffs | when are Zaqar's 4 slots scheduled? | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | Tuesday | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | I have to admit, I've been a bit out of the loop lately | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | all incuabted projects are scheduled on Tuesday | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | along with workshops and cross-project things | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | oic | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | tuesday morning or afternoon? | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | is this posted somewhere? | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | #link http://kilodesignsummit.sched.org/ | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | both | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | 2 in the morning and 2 in the afternoon | 15:41 |
| kgriffs | oic | 15:41 |
| kgriffs | for some reason I thought we weren't using sched this year | 15:41 |
| kgriffs | oic, we are using it, just the topics are TBD | 15:41 |
| flaper87 | yup | 15:42 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: want to add something else? | 15:43 |
| flaper87 | :D | 15:43 |
| kgriffs | I'm just trying to think of what other things would be good to use the room for vs. the pod | 15:43 |
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| kgriffs | do we want to meet up with horizon and heat? | 15:43 |
| flaper87 | we can do it this week and decide next week | 15:43 |
| kgriffs | ...and swift | 15:44 |
| flaper87 | probably heat, I gotta talk with them and see if they want to do that | 15:44 |
| kgriffs | ok | 15:44 |
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| flaper87 | moving on | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | #topic Make FIFO optional (flaper87) | 15:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Make FIFO optional (flaper87) (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:45 | |
| flaper87 | first, we obviously don't have to decide now | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | :D | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/125986/ | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | I submitted that, lets make sure we give it enough discussion | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | lets comment on the spec and decide there | 15:45 |
| flaper87 | but lets do it before the summit since that'll be part of the v2 discussion and probably other discussions | 15:46 |
| flaper87 | OMFG, I just dicovered something | 15:47 |
| flaper87 | #link http://docs-draft.openstack.org/86/125986/1/check/gate-zaqar-specs-docs/5292dc3/doc/build/html/ | 15:47 |
| flaper87 | if the docs gate passes you can go to the rendered docs by clicking on the job link | 15:47 |
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| flaper87 | I had no idea | 15:47 |
| kgriffs | #link http://docs-draft.openstack.org/86/125986/1/check/gate-zaqar-specs-docs/5292dc3/doc/build/html/specs/kilo/fifo-optional.html | 15:47 |
| kgriffs | pretty | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | damn, you beat me | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | ok, lets think about it and also consider what kgriffs wrote here https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zaqar-design-constraints | 15:48 |
| kgriffs | ok, so comment on the RST file directly for the discussion | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | everything must be taken into account | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yup | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | kewl, we've 10 mins left | 15:49 |
| flaper87 | anything else on this topic? | 15:49 |
| kgriffs | I'm good | 15:49 |
| flaper87 | #topic open discussion | 15:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 15:49 | |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I saw you commented on the sentinel patch | 15:50 |
| flaper87 | lets see if it gets udpated soon enough | 15:50 |
| flaper87 | otherwise, we should do it | 15:50 |
| flaper87 | I'd like to talk with ttx about the rc2 asap | 15:50 |
| kgriffs | yeah, looks like no new patchsets since we talked about it last week | 15:51 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: ok, I'd say feel free to update it | 15:51 |
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| kgriffs | ok, if someone sees prashanth please let him know | 15:52 |
| flaper87 | I will look for him tomorrow morning! | 15:52 |
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| flaper87 | ok, that's all folks | 15:53 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: | 15:53 |
| kgriffs | wait | 15:53 |
| * flaper87 waits | 15:53 | |
| kgriffs | what else should go in RC2 | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:53 |
| kgriffs | are you keeping a list of things to backport? | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/123750/ | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | yes | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | just 2 patches | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | sentinel's and that one | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | I'll move bugs to rc2 as soon as I have a milestone for it | 15:53 |
| kgriffs | what about | 15:54 |
| flaper87 | I gotta talk with ttx | 15:54 |
| kgriffs | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/123626/ | 15:54 |
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| kgriffs | and | 15:54 |
| kgriffs | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/123462/ | 15:54 |
| flaper87 | yeah, those 2 are rc2 worth it. I wasn't *that* worried because they are not release blockers and can be backported even after the release | 15:55 |
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| flaper87 | wherease the sentinel thing is indeed release blocker | 15:55 |
| flaper87 | but since we'll have rc2, we can backport all these patches | 15:55 |
| flaper87 | that should give us a cleaner release | 15:55 |
| kgriffs | ok | 15:55 |
| kgriffs | that's it from me | 15:55 |
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| flaper87 | sweet :D | 15:56 |
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| flaper87 | phew, we covered quite some things | 15:56 |
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| flaper87 | ok, that's all folks, for realz this time! | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | tty all next week | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | have a great week | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | #endmeeting | 15:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:57 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 6 15:57:16 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2014/zaqar.2014-10-06-15.01.html | 15:57 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2014/zaqar.2014-10-06-15.01.txt | 15:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2014/zaqar.2014-10-06-15.01.log.html | 15:57 |
| * flaper87 is sad, vkmc is not here to take care of the minutes | 15:57 | |
| * flaper87 will do it | 15:57 | |
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