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| sheeprine | huats: here? | 14:06 |
|---|---|---|
| huats | I am ! | 14:06 |
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| sheeprine | Sergio: lvdongbing: ? | 14:07 |
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| sheeprine | We'll wait a little bit then. We were supposed to have a meeting about CK's arch. | 14:07 |
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| sheeprine | Ok, we'll move it to next week then. | 14:22 |
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| huats | ok sheeprine :( | 14:35 |
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| sc` | #startmeeting openstack_chef | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Jul 11 16:00:31 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sc`. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack_chef)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_chef' | 16:00 |
| sc` | hi o/ | 16:01 |
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| sc` | jklare: you there? anything from your end? | 16:12 |
| jklare | sc` oh hi | 16:12 |
| jklare | :D | 16:12 |
| sc` | :D | 16:12 |
| jklare | sc` not really, thanks for the style and unit patches again | 16:13 |
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| jklare | i am currently focussing on upgrading our production deployments to mitaka | 16:13 |
| jklare | so more using the cookbooks than working on them :D | 16:13 |
| sc` | i've started working on openstackclient and identity v3. it's incrementally going | 16:14 |
| jklare | sounds good | 16:14 |
| sc` | haven't gotten it to a point of convergence yet | 16:16 |
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| jklare | i think v3 will take some time | 16:18 |
| jklare | i still try to get everything to work with it | 16:18 |
| jklare | e.g. the dashboard :D | 16:18 |
| sc` | :D | 16:18 |
| jklare | i will push some patches as soon as i figure out all the options needed | 16:18 |
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| sc` | cool | 16:21 |
| sc` | i'll try to separate openstackclient and identity v3 if i can, to make the patches smaller | 16:23 |
| jklare | +1 | 16:24 |
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| jklare | sadly it looks like we are down to 2 active ppl right now.. | 16:25 |
| jklare | i mean mark is still doing some reviews | 16:25 |
| sc` | that it does | 16:25 |
| sc` | per the survey, the demand for chef is dropping, and it shows in our community involvement | 16:28 |
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| jklare | yeah i guess there are enough tools out there to install some services and apply configuration | 16:29 |
| jklare | so everybody can choose and chef is not the most fancy ;) | 16:29 |
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| sc` | everyone's happy to run their own forks i suppose | 16:30 |
| jklare | yep | 16:30 |
| jklare | the only question is were we wanna head with the project | 16:31 |
| jklare | i do not see any reason to switch to another deployment tool | 16:31 |
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| sc` | i just had that discussion in my own team, and the decision was to stick with chef | 16:31 |
| jklare | so i think we can just use the "official" project as our very own fork :D | 16:32 |
| jklare | which works for me | 16:32 |
| sc` | i think the focus should be on the production deployments. chef-provisioning has been scaled back in scope, so no sense in extending that too much | 16:33 |
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| sc` | the hows and should nots, etc. | 16:33 |
| jklare | yeah, but i guess the biggest part of that is kind of company specific | 16:34 |
| jklare | and should be solved in wrappers | 16:34 |
| sc` | it is, in some ways | 16:34 |
| sc` | it's about making things easy to consume in such a manner | 16:34 |
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| sc` | which from talking with you at the summit, it sounds doable in code already\ | 16:35 |
| jklare | yeah, i think the cookbooks right now are quite easy to wrap | 16:36 |
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| jklare | and i think one can maintain them with very few ppl | 16:37 |
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| jklare | but of course we can only maintain the distros we are using | 16:37 |
| jklare | which is not ideal | 16:38 |
| jklare | but i guess there is no way around that | 16:38 |
| sc` | we can only support the distros we use | 16:38 |
| jklare | and thats why i think if nobody but us two cares and patches the cookbooks, these will become our very own forks :) | 16:39 |
| jklare | but as i said, thats fine with me | 16:39 |
| sc` | while i like others just fine, i can't feasibly support something i can't test | 16:39 |
| sc` | the only good thing about being the only ones left is there's nobody to say no. i think if we don't make it too hard for orgs to adapt, they can keep up at their own pace | 16:41 |
| jklare | yeah | 16:42 |
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| sc` | we'll need to see about kidnapping someone from the community to review code should it just be you and i left | 16:47 |
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| jklare | i think we can just decide that +2 is enough | 16:48 |
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| sc` | but then who would be doing the workflow? | 16:48 |
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| sc` | okay. i haven't had enough coffee | 16:53 |
| sc` | yeah. that's fine | 16:53 |
| jklare | :) | 16:53 |
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| jklare | but i guess we can try to avoid that and just motivate some of our coworkers to help out | 16:53 |
| jklare | lets see how that goes | 16:54 |
| sc` | perhaps. coworkers are busy with mitaka as well | 16:54 |
| sc` | so everyone's focus would be on stable/mitaka and not master | 16:54 |
| jklare | which is probably fine | 16:55 |
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| jklare | if ppl wanna work on more stabilisation of mitaka | 16:55 |
| jklare | why not | 16:55 |
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| jklare | we can still push mitaka patches to master and then backport them | 16:55 |
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| sc` | i'm fine with that | 16:55 |
| jklare | usually the fixes that are good for mitaka will also work for master or newton | 16:55 |
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| jklare | so focussing on a stable release is not a bad thing imo | 16:56 |
| jklare | makes testing and patches a bit easier | 16:56 |
| jklare | since ppl are acutally using the code | 16:56 |
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| jklare | not just pushing stuff that only ever runs on jenkins nodes until the release :) | 16:57 |
| sc` | sure | 16:57 |
| jklare | 3mins left | 16:58 |
| jklare | :) | 16:58 |
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| sc` | 2 :) | 16:58 |
| jklare | i guess we can continue our discussion in the channel if needed ;) | 16:58 |
| jklare | maybe there are more ppl there | 16:58 |
| jklare | or not | 16:58 |
| jklare | :D | 16:58 |
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| sc` | i think we've said enough for now. there isn't really much more traffic there either :D | 16:59 |
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| sc` | alright. calling it. have a good one | 16:59 |
| jklare | same | 16:59 |
| sc` | #endmeeting | 16:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ops_guide)" | 16:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Jul 11 16:59:57 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_chef/2016/openstack_chef.2016-07-11-16.00.html | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_chef/2016/openstack_chef.2016-07-11-16.00.txt | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_chef/2016/openstack_chef.2016-07-11-16.00.log.html | 17:00 |
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| devananda | hello ironicers! | 17:00 |
| devananda | #startmeeting ironic | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Jul 11 17:00:47 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is devananda. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| vdrok | o/ | 17:00 |
| mjturek1 | hellooo o/ | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ironic' | 17:00 |
| ifarkas | o/ | 17:00 |
| TheJulia | o/ | 17:00 |
| mariojv | o/ | 17:00 |
| lucasagomes | o/ | 17:00 |
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| lazy_prince | o/ | 17:01 |
| xavierr | o/ | 17:01 |
| alineb | o/ | 17:01 |
| sambetts | o/ | 17:01 |
| davidlenwell | o/ | 17:01 |
| rloo | o/ | 17:01 |
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| devananda | #topic announcements | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "announcements (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:01 | |
| rpioso | o/ | 17:01 |
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| dtantsur | o/ | 17:01 |
| Sukhdev_ | hi | 17:01 |
| aarefiev | o/ | 17:01 |
| devananda | #info jroll and nobodycam are out / missing the meeting today, and asked me to run it | 17:02 |
| jlvillal | o/ | 17:02 |
| devananda | of course, our agenda is at the usual place in the wiki, for those who are new, it's here: | 17:02 |
| devananda | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Ironic | 17:02 |
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| davidlenwell | who said they were allowed to have a vacation ? | 17:02 |
| JayF | o/ | 17:03 |
| rloo | davidlenwell: who said they were on vacation? :) | 17:03 |
| devananda | JayF: welcome back :) | 17:03 |
| JayF | :D | 17:03 |
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| davidlenwell | rloo: touche | 17:03 |
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| devananda | I don't have any announcements other than that, and didn't get a chance to touch base with jroll yet this week | 17:03 |
| devananda | anyone else have announcements? | 17:03 |
| lucasagomes | rloo, hah | 17:03 |
| rloo | i think dtantsur mentioned that we released ironic-lib? | 17:04 |
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| dtantsur | yep | 17:04 |
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| vdrok | newton 2 is this week | 17:04 |
| dtantsur | we've actually released everything today, except for ironic itself | 17:04 |
| lucasagomes | and IPA as well no? | 17:04 |
| dtantsur | yes, IPA as well | 17:04 |
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| dtantsur | jroll wants to hold ironic release until we get networking in | 17:05 |
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| TheJulia | Which I believe is reasonable and I suspect will take the bulk of the meeting discussing | 17:05 |
| devananda | #info newton-2 milestone is this week | 17:05 |
| devananda | #info nova feature freeze is behind us now, and nova midcycle is next week | 17:06 |
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| rloo | how does newton-2 milestone affect ironic (or does it?) | 17:06 |
| thiagop | OneView CI is passing for some troubles since the enablement of tempest job for agent driver | 17:06 |
| devananda | rloo: it doesn't directly affect us -- we release independently of those | 17:06 |
| thiagop | I'm debugging it right now | 17:06 |
| dtantsur | rloo, not directly, it just served us a reminder to check if we need a release | 17:06 |
| rloo | devananda: ok. but nova FF does; the console feature won't get in until Ocata. | 17:06 |
| dtantsur | so we took this chance and release some cool stuff :) | 17:06 |
| devananda | rloo: right | 17:06 |
| rloo | dtantsur: cool is good :) | 17:07 |
| devananda | ok, moving on | 17:07 |
| devananda | #topic subteam status reports | 17:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "subteam status reports (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:07 | |
| devananda | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IronicWhiteBoard | 17:07 |
| dtantsur | oh, one more thing to announce: https://review.openstack.org/340335 | 17:07 |
| JayF | rloo: devananda: Same with rescue; going to miss until ocata | 17:07 |
| dtantsur | we're applying for a couple more tags based on our new shiny grenade testing | 17:08 |
| JayF | couldn't get the spec reviewed on the ironic side quick enough to even get the code going well :( | 17:08 |
| dtantsur | namely, supports-upgrade and follows-standard-deprecation | 17:08 |
| rloo | dtantsur: nice! (and finally)! | 17:08 |
| devananda | starting around line 80 in that 'pad, if you're responsible for one of the subteams and haven't already updated it, please do so now | 17:08 |
| devananda | dtantsur: oh! awesome | 17:08 |
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| mgould | o/ | 17:08 |
| devananda | dtantsur: is the grenade job now voting/gating? | 17:08 |
| dtantsur | devananda, it is | 17:09 |
| vdrok | yup | 17:09 |
| JayF | has been for a couple of weeks now, I think? We landed the voting before I left | 17:09 |
| jlvillal | Grenade for Inspector? Or Ironic? | 17:09 |
| jlvillal | I know Ironic is voting. Not sure if Inspector job is up and running or not. | 17:09 |
| dtantsur | jlvillal, ironic | 17:09 |
| dtantsur | jlvillal, inspector one is running and NOT voting yet | 17:09 |
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| dtantsur | jlvillal, we also have to fix grenade to be able to run our tests at all; currently it does not pick tempest plugins | 17:09 |
| devananda | dtantsur: that's awkward ... | 17:10 |
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| dtantsur | devananda, see https://review.openstack.org/337372 | 17:10 |
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| devananda | heh | 17:11 |
| rloo | lucasagomes: i added something to the enhanced root device hints subteam report | 17:12 |
| lucasagomes | rloo, heh I was about to write something similar | 17:12 |
| lucasagomes | so thanks :D | 17:12 |
| rloo | lucasagomes: :D | 17:12 |
| mariojv | notifications report has been updated. not much to report, just needs reviews, rebased it again today | 17:12 |
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| devananda | JayF: on the rescue work, can we land all the ironic parts during Newton at least? | 17:13 |
| rloo | dtantsur: wrt py 3.5. Do you know if any/all of the ironic stuff runs in py 3.5? | 17:13 |
| JayF | devananda: I can't land anything until I get more reviews on the spec :( | 17:13 |
| dtantsur | rloo, we don't run on any pythons 3 yet | 17:13 |
| rloo | dtantsur: OH. I thought we ran on py 3.4. :-( | 17:13 |
| dtantsur | rloo, in a production sense of "run" ofc.. | 17:13 |
| devananda | rloo, dtantsur: fwiw, the services work in py35 on xenial (that's my current dev env) | 17:13 |
| devananda | however the client does not | 17:14 |
| rloo | dtantsur: should we open bugs against those or something? | 17:14 |
| JayF | devananda: the code is essentially done, just needs to be put up when the spec lands. The Nova changes are trivial enough to potentially get in post-freeze too, but right now the trajectory is that it'll be done around T :P | 17:14 |
| vdrok | rloo: that;s unittests | 17:14 |
| rloo | vdrok: I thought it was more than unit tests. | 17:14 |
| dtantsur | devananda, do you have a bug for this 3.5 problem with client? | 17:14 |
| lucasagomes | rloo, for now it's only the unittests... maybe in the future we can add some functional ones on py3 as well | 17:14 |
| devananda | dtantsur: haven't filed it yet | 17:14 |
| rloo | wrt the work for py 3.5 then, we should track it somehow. is it an RFE? | 17:15 |
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| devananda | rloo: I'd say it's just bugs. no need for an RFE, we should just put up CI jobs and fix things until they pass | 17:15 |
| dtantsur | I think it's a bug | 17:15 |
| lucasagomes | ++ | 17:15 |
| dtantsur | so, we have the unit test jobs for Py35, they seem green | 17:16 |
| rloo | ok, a bug then. Someone want to volunteer to file one unless we have already? | 17:16 |
| JayF | the difference between an RFE and a non-RFE bug are borderline trivial at this point anyway :) | 17:16 |
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| devananda | JayF: exactly | 17:16 |
| devananda | and we don't need a bug to track that we have bugs ;) | 17:16 |
| JayF | rloo: I'd suggest the initial bug would be: Ironic should run integratino tests in a py35 environment | 17:16 |
| dtantsur | rloo, everyone who finds an issue should file a bug ;) | 17:16 |
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| JayF | when those tests are done, we should file bugs about anything that makes them fail | 17:16 |
| rloo | so what i'm looking for is a list of tasks/things-to-do so we are py35. | 17:16 |
| dtantsur | JayF, it's not a great bug, until the whole openstack has it... | 17:16 |
| dtantsur | has = has it reported and working on it | 17:17 |
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| devananda | seems like we've got all the status updates now, so, moving on | 17:18 |
| vdrok | rloo: so I see unittests for both ironic and client are green | 17:18 |
| vdrok | and we don't have any functional/integration tests on py3 | 17:19 |
| rloo | vdrok: thx | 17:19 |
| devananda | thanks everyone for your work on / reporting status of all the subteams! | 17:19 |
| devananda | #topic is network_interface a hardware type | 17:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "is network_interface a hardware type (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:20 | |
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| rloo | so is it? :) | 17:20 |
| devananda | rloo: this is your topic, however, sambetts and Sukhdev_ and I were also discussing it in the meeting just before this one | 17:20 |
| rloo | devananda: and ...?? | 17:20 |
| TheJulia | I don't think it is, because it can vary based on the environment | 17:20 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, any consensus ? | 17:20 |
| TheJulia | but the desire was to keep it similar to minimize confusion | 17:20 |
| rloo | my concern is that keeping it similar, might cause more confusion. | 17:21 |
| rloo | or at least, they are different, and we need to be clear to show the difference. | 17:21 |
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| devananda | TheJulia raised a good point that volume connector interface is going to be similar to network interface, in that it doesn't necessarily depend on the server or its OOB management device | 17:21 |
| TheJulia | and that is a possibility, and I do agree with you, however we need to decide and move forward since this also came up during the midcycle | 17:21 |
| dtantsur | but it also *might* depend on hardware type... | 17:22 |
| vdrok | is the deploy interface similar too then? | 17:22 |
| devananda | dtantsur: indeed, it might | 17:22 |
| TheJulia | Yes, and only the deploying operator will know that | 17:22 |
| dtantsur | yeah, like with deploy and inspect interfaces | 17:22 |
| dtantsur | I'd prefer we treat the volume interface the same, but I'm fine with treating the network interface differently | 17:22 |
| TheJulia | +1 | 17:23 |
| sambetts | I personally think that a hardware_type should have some interfaces which can have defaults and some that can't but can list support for interfaces | 17:23 |
| sambetts | e.g. volume_connector and network_interface don't have sane defaults but a hardware_type can say I support X, y and Z | 17:24 |
| devananda | dtantsur: aiui, the driver composition reform says that each hardware interface can specify a default, but doesn't allow for the operator to set a system wide default. if it did, would that solve this issue? | 17:24 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: that sounds reasonable | 17:24 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: but the hardware_type can't restrict the choice of the user | 17:24 |
| dtantsur | devananda, kind of. operator-driver defaults will increase inconsistency between clouds; and then for network_interface there is no vendor default | 17:24 |
| vdrok | TheJulia: the spec says it can iirc :) | 17:24 |
| dtantsur | it can and will ;) | 17:25 |
| TheJulia | vdrok: :( | 17:25 |
| devananda | sambetts: without allowing for a hardware / vendor default, then the operator is forced to supply a choice -- the exact same choice, in many cases -- for every Node they enroll | 17:25 |
| sambetts | devananda: right, so thats the problem with that solution | 17:25 |
| sambetts | but it would remove all the confusion around those interfaces | 17:26 |
| TheJulia | vdrok: dtantsur: well, I guess a user could always define a new hardware type :) | 17:26 |
| rloo | well, it restricts the possible choices, but the user/operator can specify the actual interface implementation (one of the possible choices) for a particular node | 17:26 |
| dtantsur | TheJulia, of course :) | 17:26 |
| devananda | if the operator is allowed to set a config-level default for those *_interfaces, it would improve usability | 17:26 |
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| devananda | for cases where ironic is running in a homogeneous environment (eg, all nodes should use Neutron for the network_interface) | 17:26 |
| sambetts | devananda: what if they configure a default not supported by a particular hardware_type they support | 17:26 |
| dtantsur | devananda, but then users can no longer rely on vendor-provided defaults, right? because in every cloud an operator could override them | 17:26 |
| dtantsur | so enrolling a node with only providing "ilo-gen8" can mean different things on different clouds | 17:27 |
| sambetts | we'd have to validate that default against all the hardware types | 17:27 |
| sambetts | to ensure its a validate fall back too | 17:27 |
| sambetts | valid* | 17:27 |
| dtantsur | sambetts, good point | 17:27 |
| TheJulia | what if there is no default, we only offer a default for those who choose or need the capability | 17:28 |
| rloo | it seems like we have two cases: 1. use vendor-provided default or disabled if not specified; 2. use vendor-provided default or if not provided, use system-wide config default. | 17:28 |
| vdrok | are we talking about all the interfaces or some particular like network | 17:28 |
| devananda | vdrok: I'm thinking specifically of network and volume interface right now | 17:28 |
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| TheJulia | rloo: I think #1, although I could see #2 being part of someone shipping a pre-configured/tested physical product | 17:29 |
| dtantsur | ah, so you only want this to affect these 2 interfaces, not things like "power" etc? | 17:29 |
| devananda | because, in most cases, these do not depend on the Node or its BMC | 17:29 |
| dtantsur | even though if we do it for "volume", I see point in doing the same for "deploy" | 17:29 |
| vdrok | while this brings inconsistency, that makes sense | 17:29 |
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| sambetts | another solution I highlight in my comment in on spec, are that we make Ironic smart enough to try and validate via the validate function each of the interfaces that hardware_type lists until you get one that validates successfully | 17:29 |
| devananda | dtantsur: as far as enrollment behaving differently on different clouds -- we're debating whether to expose that difference to the operator doing the enrollment or not | 17:30 |
| sambetts | and we make the validate functions smart enough to realise if they'll work in that environment or nto | 17:30 |
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| dtantsur | sambetts, sounds very complex | 17:30 |
| dtantsur | devananda, hmm, how? | 17:30 |
| devananda | dtantsur: eg, in one cloud, I may need to pass network_interface=flat while in another cloud I will need to pass network_interface=neutron -- for every node | 17:30 |
| JayF | it's almost like we have a hardware_type | 17:30 |
| vdrok | by renaming the field I guess :) | 17:30 |
| JayF | and an environment_type | 17:30 |
| JayF | because those are essentially the two axis that the drivers pivot on | 17:31 |
| devananda | dtantsur: OR I use the same enrollment code in each case, because the CONF is different in each cloud, and there is a default that works in each environment | 17:31 |
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| dtantsur | devananda, ah yeah. I was asking because I assumed you propose operator defaults for all interfaces, not only volume/deploy/network | 17:31 |
| dtantsur | (do you?) | 17:31 |
| TheJulia | JayF: agreed, although some nodes may not have x environmental capability do to some $reason, so they can't be expected to apply against everything in inventory | 17:31 |
| dtantsur | JayF, OH :) it makes sense, but I'm scared to imagine how it might look like in the end | 17:32 |
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| devananda | dtantsur: I'm suggesting we only do this for, as JayF has termed it, environment_types, because it doesn't make sense to me for the ilo_gen8 hardware type to dictate what sort of network provider I use with it | 17:32 |
| JayF | You'd almost have to have ops define environment_types in the API or in a config file for something like that to work | 17:32 |
| sambetts | Well Ironic can calculate the environment right? | 17:32 |
| JayF | It just seems like those terms can help us talk about it more sanely, right? | 17:32 |
| sambetts | e.g. hit keystone, see if neutron is there | 17:32 |
| TheJulia | sambetts: not entirely, there could be invisible physical constraints | 17:33 |
| vdrok | sambetts: also ensure we're admin there? | 17:33 |
| TheJulia | or planned architectural constraints | 17:33 |
| devananda | sambetts: the keystone service list won't indicate whether neutron is configured with admin access to the TORs | 17:33 |
| dtantsur | so, we're going to end up with 2 kinds of *_interface fields, right? a new group will contain volume, deploy and network, IIUC | 17:35 |
| dtantsur | and this new group will use operator default, not vendor default, right? | 17:35 |
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| rloo | dtantsur: can't the vendor_default value be 'use-operator-default'? | 17:35 |
| devananda | to boil this down to a concrete suggestion for the thing we're currently blocking the neutron integration work on -- should we add an operator-settable default value for network_interface? | 17:35 |
| sambetts | so this is what I mean by using the validate function, e.g. flat network will validate in that case because it does need any extra info to opertate, but neutron interface won't validate because it requires local link information to validate so Ironic trys to validate the interface, and picks flat because it valdiates | 17:35 |
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| dtantsur | rloo, I think it's a bit of overkill | 17:36 |
| JayF | devananda: IMO it's easy to say "no" now and add it later, but hard to say "yes" now and go back on that later | 17:36 |
| TheJulia | devananda: I think it can be added later on as an iterative change | 17:36 |
| JayF | devananda: so that means my vote would be no; but it's a very mild preference | 17:36 |
| dtantsur | JayF, then what happens when a user enrolls a node without network_interface? | 17:36 |
| rloo | if we don't have an operator-settable default value (via a config), does it mean it (network stuff) isn't useable? | 17:37 |
| vdrok | no, we infer it from dhcp provider for now | 17:37 |
| vdrok | but if someone writes a custom network interface implementation, they will have to set it in every node they need | 17:37 |
| sambetts | Perhaps the solution should be this: network_interface and volume_connector interface, are part of the hardware_type but don't have vendor set default, those defaults are opertator set, and when the conductor loads the operator set default is validated against all the loaded hardware_types to make sure they all support it, so we can guarentee a lowest common denominator functionality | 17:38 |
| rloo | for me, whether we have the config or not, i want to make sure we think (or don't think) network interface is part of the set of hardware type interfaces. because if it isn't, we should rename it all so it doesn't have 'interface' in their names, etc. | 17:38 |
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| devananda | rloo: network (and volume, etc) are python interfaces, loaded bu the Node's driver object | 17:39 |
| rloo | is it possible that a particular hardware_type might actually want to specify a network_interface or volume_connector interface? Ie, do we want to disallow vendor from setting a default? | 17:39 |
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| devananda | rloo: I'm not sure how the distinction you're pointing out warrants renaming them | 17:40 |
| sambetts | hardware_types need to list supported interfaces for network/volume_connector | 17:40 |
| rloo | devananda: yes, but in the wording etc, we use 'interface'. if we think they shouldn't be part of hardware type interfaces, we might be better off calling them 'drivers'. | 17:40 |
| dtantsur | "hardware_types need to list supported interfaces for network" <- that's what I'd love to avoid | 17:40 |
| rloo | devananda: the distinction/wording (to me) is important to be able to clearly talk/describe about these things. | 17:40 |
| sambetts | e.g. I have a hardware specific network_interface, that won't work on other peoples hardware, so I want to list it as a supported interface | 17:40 |
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| JayF | rloo: +1 that's part of why I suggested the environment/hardware split | 17:41 |
| TheJulia | rloo: potentially except I think that would "look" awesome to a vendor, but to an operator it might be a headache | 17:41 |
| devananda | sambetts has an interesting point | 17:41 |
| vdrok | sambetts: dtantsur devananda maybe have not-supported instead? :) | 17:41 |
| TheJulia | rloo: w/r/t distinction, I agree, although clear, concise documentation could also help reduce potential confusion | 17:41 |
| devananda | in some cases, the network_interface _is_ dependent on the phys hardware, and that list of supported network interfaces should be defined by the hardware driver / vendor | 17:41 |
| dtantsur | devananda, yeah, in the same fashion is deploy interface: it's generic for all in-tree hw types, but may be vendor-specific too | 17:42 |
| lazy_prince | provided they are available upstream.. | 17:42 |
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| devananda | vdrok: we can not define the set of not-supported | 17:42 |
| sambetts | vdrok: if you do that then every hardware_type except my own will have to list my interface, which is horrible and won't work for out of tree | 17:43 |
| vdrok | yeah, that;s a bad idea | 17:43 |
| rloo | which is why i was suggesting that network_interface is a hardware_type interface, but that we allow HardwareTypeFoo to specify default_network_interface as 'foo-net-impl' or 'use-operator-setting' | 17:43 |
| rloo | or 'None' for disabled | 17:43 |
| TheJulia | rloo: That is an interesting possibility, and could be done later as to not block the current work, at least I think it could be done later | 17:44 |
| vdrok | rloo: I don't think we should allow to disable network interface, we have noop.. | 17:44 |
| sambetts | rloo: then all my nodes depending on hardware_type will either have to be manually overidden or not | 17:44 |
| devananda | as i see it, most servers (and thus their HardwareType class) won't have any opinion on the current set of NetworkInterfaces (noop, flat, neutron) | 17:45 |
| devananda | they'll all work | 17:45 |
| devananda | except for specific hardware (eg, blades, some cisco things, etc) that will only work with their specific NetworkInterface class | 17:45 |
| sambetts | if hardware_types just list supported_network_interfaces = [] and then we have an operaotr default which is validated to by the lowest common denomintor of all loaded hardware_types we should be fine right? | 17:45 |
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| rloo | where 'use-operator-setting' is get the value from a config option. | 17:46 |
| devananda | heads up, I'm going to time box this discussion in 5 minutes, so there's room for open discussion too | 17:46 |
| vdrok | I think sambetts suggestion is good | 17:47 |
| TheJulia | I also think it would be good from a validation standpoint | 17:47 |
| lazy_prince | can we recap what we decided..? | 17:47 |
| dtantsur | ++ for a recap | 17:47 |
| devananda | sambetts: can you recap for us? | 17:47 |
| dtantsur | also everyone is free to propose an amendment to the driver composition spec ;) | 17:47 |
| TheJulia | I can see some possibile issues of it though, but I think for most cases it will work, and for the cases where it might not, the operator likely has an ironic expert on-hand | 17:47 |
| * rloo didn't think anything was decided | 17:48 | |
| * TheJulia thinks we have different things we are talking about | 17:48 | |
| devananda | I do not think we've reached a concensus here, but a couple ideas seem possibly good | 17:48 |
| TheJulia | (or different primary concerns rooted in the same place) | 17:48 |
| vdrok | AIUI: leave the field as network_interface, allow hardware types to not set default_network_interface and use the config option, validating that this value is in supported_network_interfaces? | 17:49 |
| devananda | TheJulia: yea, and that concerns me a bit | 17:49 |
| * dtantsur would prefer a patch to the spec | 17:49 | |
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| lazy_prince | possibly recap and continue on mail... | 17:49 |
| devananda | ok | 17:49 |
| lucasagomes | lazy_prince, ++ | 17:49 |
| devananda | I'll review this and post a summary to the ML shortly | 17:50 |
| TheJulia | thank you devananda | 17:50 |
| vdrok | thx devananda | 17:50 |
| * rloo thinks a short voice meeting would be useful after recap/ML if ML doesn't move fast enough. | 17:50 | |
| * TheJulia agrees | 17:50 | |
| * TheJulia actually perfers voice at this point | 17:50 | |
| rloo | i don't want this holding up the network stuff for too long | 17:50 |
| * lazy_prince too agrees.. | 17:50 | |
| devananda | agreed | 17:50 |
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| devananda | #action devananda to post a summary of this discussion to the ML, since we didn't reach any consensus here, with possible voice meeting to follow | 17:51 |
| devananda | #topic open discussion | 17:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:51 | |
| TheJulia | rloo: there does seem to be some consensus with keeping the name at least and no longer blocking | 17:51 |
| * Sukhdev_ likes the last few statements :-) | 17:51 | |
| sambetts | My suggestion is this: hardware_types list supported_network_interfaces = [], but no default network_interface, there is a default network_interface in the config file, validated on conductor load to be supported by all loaded hardware_type, node created by with overriding the network interface will fall back to this interface, but operators can still override a specifc node to a different | 17:51 |
| sambetts | network_interface as long as its supported by the hardware_type and enabled | 17:51 |
| mariojv | i have a topic related to ironic notifications that i'd like to bring up for open discussion | 17:51 |
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| mariojv | for context, ironic will optionally send notifications about certain events like node provision state and power state changes over the message queue when the code for it lands https://github.com/openstack/ironic-specs/blob/master/specs/approved/notifications.rst | 17:51 |
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| mariojv | when someone wants to add a new notification, should they go through the spec process, just make an RFE, or neither (just put up code)? | 17:51 |
| mariojv | perhaps it should depend on the number of notifications that would be put on the queue during relatively normal operation | 17:51 |
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| rloo | mariojv: is it configurable which notifications are emitted? | 17:52 |
| Sukhdev_ | devananda sambetts: can we take a vote for what time works for folks for the voice call so that we can get these patches merged? | 17:52 |
| devananda | sambetts: good summary! so close to my topic change, sorry about that | 17:52 |
| mariojv | somewhat; they're not configurable on a per-notification basis, but each notification has a priority | 17:52 |
| mariojv | rloo: you can configure the minimum priority of notifications you'd like to see | 17:52 |
| mariojv | rloo: so if you set the config option to error, you only get error and critical notifications | 17:52 |
| mariojv | rloo: if you set to debug, you get all notifications | 17:53 |
| JayF | mariojv: I think just like anything else, it'd depend on the size/intensity of the change. I want us to think of notifications more like log messages than anything else; and as long as we manage the levels/priorities properly, it shouldn't have a major impact on folks | 17:53 |
| mariojv | JayF: agreed. i think it's one of those "not a problem until it becomes a problem" type things | 17:53 |
| devananda | Sukhdev_: that's going to take up more meeting time. I'll add a doodle to the mail, but it'll have to be responded to quickly so we can set it up w/in the next two days | 17:53 |
| rloo | mariojv: so a new notification seems like a smallish feature. if it isn't configurable, they will show up. so it needs a reno? which means small RFE/bug. (no spec). My thinking. | 17:53 |
| mariojv | true, maybe a reno would be good | 17:53 |
| rloo | devananda: let's set up the meeting for tomorrow. we need to move fast :) | 17:53 |
| lucasagomes | rloo, I think we have a v2 meeting tomorrow already, no? | 17:54 |
| TheJulia | mariojv: I agree with JayF, it is entirely dependent upon the size of the change and should likely be determined in the review process | 17:54 |
| rloo | lucasagomes: not all of us would attend both meetings. should be ok. | 17:54 |
| devananda | mariojv: I would like to treat them like LOG messages | 17:54 |
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| rloo | devananda: if LOG messages, then just a bug. | 17:55 |
| devananda | rloo: exactly | 17:55 |
| mariojv | this sounds like a good enough consensus to me. thanks | 17:55 |
| devananda | "ironic doesn't LOG when $thing happens" // "ironic doesn't emit a notification when $thing happens" | 17:55 |
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| mjturek1 | don't want to interrupt too much, but quick FYI krtaylor wanted to ask for comments from Ironic driver owners on https://review.openstack.org/330270 so if you're a driver owner please take a look!! | 17:55 |
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| devananda | mjturek1: thanks - it's open discussion time! you're not interrupting :) | 17:56 |
| mjturek1 | :) | 17:56 |
| rloo | mjturek1: do you know if kurt sent out email about that patch? might be useful to do so. | 17:56 |
| mjturek1 | rloo: not sure if he did, I'll recommend it tho | 17:56 |
| devananda | sambetts ^ cisco driver is mentioned in there | 17:56 |
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| sambetts | pretty sure I already adding the Cisco ones to there | 17:57 |
| sambetts | I did they are @L3120 | 17:58 |
| sambetts | krtaylor: ^^ | 17:58 |
| rloo | something i wanted to ask but forgot. apart from the networking stuff, is there anything we might want in better shape before the nova midcycle next week? | 17:59 |
| lucasagomes | we will need to continue at #openstack-ironic | 18:00 |
| JayF | Also, I'll be there along with jroll, so if you all have something nonobvious you want mentioned at the Nova mid-cycle, lmk | 18:00 |
| lucasagomes | time's over here | 18:00 |
| devananda | thanks for the discussion everyone - we're just about out of time. | 18:00 |
| vdrok | thanks! | 18:00 |
| mariojv | thanks \o | 18:00 |
| devananda | see you next week! | 18:00 |
| lucasagomes | see ya | 18:00 |
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| devananda | #endmeeting | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ops_guide)" | 18:00 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Jul 11 18:00:43 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:00 |
| davidlenwell | o/ | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2016/ironic.2016-07-11-17.00.html | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2016/ironic.2016-07-11-17.00.txt | 18:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2016/ironic.2016-07-11-17.00.log.html | 18:00 |
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| sambetts | o/ | 18:00 |
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| flwang1 | #startmeeting zaqar | 18:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Jul 11 18:01:40 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is flwang1. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zaqar)" | 18:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zaqar' | 18:01 |
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| flwang1 | anybody around? | 18:02 |
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| flwang1 | i'm going to cancel this meeting if there is no showup in 5 mins | 18:04 |
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| flwang1 | #endmeeting | 18:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ops_guide)" | 18:18 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Jul 11 18:18:53 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:18 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2016/zaqar.2016-07-11-18.01.html | 18:18 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2016/zaqar.2016-07-11-18.01.txt | 18:18 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2016/zaqar.2016-07-11-18.01.log.html | 18:18 |
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