Wednesday, 2015-08-05

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rhallisey#startmeeting kolla16:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Aug  5 16:00:31 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is rhallisey. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.16:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'kolla'16:00
rhallisey#topic rollcall16:00
*** openstack changes topic to "rollcall (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:00
SamYapleo/16:00
rhalliseyhello16:00
jasonsbhi16:00
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akwasniehi16:00
sdakeo/16:00
pbourkehi16:01
echoingumeshhi16:01
jpeelerhey16:01
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rhalliseylooks like that's everyone, but I'll give it another moment16:01
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rhallisey#topic Announcements16:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:02
rhalliseyk go ahead sdake16:02
sdakeso if you dont mind i'll handle this section rhallisey16:02
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sdake#1: kolla has been accepted by TC vote into the big tent https://review.openstack.org/#/c/206789/16:03
sdakethis is all because of our fantastic community16:03
pbourkewoohoo16:04
rhalliseywoo grats everyone!16:04
inc0Long live kolla:) as TTX said16:04
sdakei've buit 3 rockstar teams in openstack - first heat then magnum then kolla - really exciting for me16:04
pbourkeand fantastic PTL *ahem* :p16:04
sdakeptl is just a facilitator :)16:04
sdakealthough I do a bunch of technical work as well :)16:04
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sdakeso give me credit for that, atleast 12% credit ;)16:04
SamYaple11%16:05
SamYaplebest i can do16:05
sdakejoke from the avengers movie16:05
SamYaplejoke from pawn stars16:05
rhalliseyhaven't seen it :)16:05
sdake#2 - we ar ein charge of our own schedule and releases for the moment but we will still follow the upstream schedule16:05
sdakewhat this means is our deadline is end of July (iirc) for liberty-316:06
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sdakethen there is a 3-4 week FFE period (feature freeze exception)16:06
sdakewhere the absolutely critical things that aren't finished can be done16:06
sdakebut ideally we should be feature frozen whenever the pstream schedule is16:06
inc0end of July is in -6 days;)16:06
rhalliseyAugust16:06
sdake#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Liberty_Release_Schedule16:07
rhallisey-6 days lol16:07
sdakeya aug 416:07
sdakewe have until september 4th (another month) to close out the release and fix any problems with it16:08
sdakei'd expect we will llock down somewhere in the middle of the rc period except for critical bug fixes16:08
sdake#3 - samyaple changed his affiliation in stackalytics so our diversity is more accurate as a result - and looks even more fantastic16:08
sdakehe changed it to what it really was ;)16:09
SamYapleupdated*16:09
sdakeso its not like he is gaming the system or something16:09
sdakeya updated16:09
SamYaplestackalytics just never trackedit correctly16:09
sdakeok thanks thats it go ahead rhallisey16:09
rhalliseycool16:09
rhalliseywell nice work everyone lots of exciting news after being accpeted into the big tent16:09
rhalliseyand nice work on the l2 release16:10
rhalliseyonward!16:10
sdakeoh ya that should have been i na nnoucnements ;)16:10
rhallisey#topic Liberty-3 planning16:10
sdakegrats on l2 releease folks!16:10
*** openstack changes topic to "Liberty-3 planning (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:10
rhallisey#link https://launchpad.net/kolla/+milestone/liberty-316:10
rhalliseyso we have a lot of BPs here16:11
rhallisey9 are still open16:11
inc0I can take on logs stuff16:11
rhalliseyand 2 open that are essential16:11
inc0if noone objects16:11
rhalliseyinc0, ok assign yourself16:11
rhalliseyhttps://blueprints.launchpad.net/kolla/+spec/ansible-swift16:11
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rhallisey#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/kolla/+spec/ansible-swift16:11
sdakewe hav emore that need to be filed as wlel I think16:11
rhalliseyanyone wana take on swift?16:11
rhalliseysdake, I think so16:12
sdakeI'd like a core reviewer to take on each ansible blueprint as well16:12
rhalliseyI want to at least get coverage for critical and high16:12
sdakeso every core reviewer understands how the ansible code works16:12
rhalliseyanyone core that doesn't have an ansible wana take on swift?16:12
sdakedoing one (takes 4-8 hours) will teach you the whole system16:12
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* sdake points at pbourke16:12
SamYaplepbourke knows the ansible code16:13
pbourkeI'll take it, but16:13
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pbourkejust be aware I think there's a little more work in Swift than some of the others16:13
sdakewell its jsut that yu sort of did swift containers already16:13
pbourkebut yeah agree it makes sense16:13
sdakemaybe you can get someone to help?16:13
rhalliseyI can ask jmccarthy16:14
rhalliseyif you don't want to16:14
pbourkewell I sit beside him ;)16:14
sdakeya maybe you guys can team up on it16:14
rhalliseynice16:14
sdakethat leaves gnocchi and zaqar16:15
rhalliseyanother that is high16:15
rhallisey#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/kolla/+spec/ansible-ceilometer16:15
sdakewhich are sort of ancillary services16:15
rhalliseydoes ceilometer offically work? I haven't tried it16:15
rhalliseysdake, + ceilo16:15
sdakei think its coming along but haven't tried it as well16:15
sdakeya agree rhallisey16:15
sdakemaybe we can get jpeeler or mandre to take that one16:16
sdakealthough i think jpeeler is doing ironic16:16
sdakeand we need ansible for ironic16:16
rhalliseyya wfm16:16
sdakejpeeler can you tackle ironic ansible codebase?16:16
sdakeif so, i'll send an emai to mandre about ceilometer16:16
jpeeleri guess that fits since i was already working on it16:17
SamYapleanycahnce anyone wants to do Trove?16:17
SamYaplei really want to to land but so far no work has begun16:17
rhalliseySamYaple, I'm going to get ceph going then I'll try for trove16:17
SamYaplerhallisey: awesome16:17
SamYaplewe can do external ceph right now with kolla and ansible, would be nive to have containers16:17
sdakerhallisey samyaple has a ref implementation of ceph in his yodu repo16:17
sdakecheck that out16:17
rhalliseythe current cinder should work with a ceph cluster16:17
rhalliseyjust needs some addition config16:18
sdakeyes I'd like to go completely to ceph16:18
sdakerhallisey coolsvap did cinder container and i thhink it does ceph support with ansible16:18
sdakenot cinder container but ansible support for cinder contianer16:18
SamYapleyea its just config things16:18
rhalliseyusing tgt is more setup work that actually using external ceph16:19
rhalliseyso I expect it to work16:19
SamYapleway more work16:19
rhalliseyya16:19
rhalliseybut it's good to have internal storage around16:20
rhalliseybut it should be lvm16:20
sdakeits configurable iirc16:20
SamYaplerhallisey: i can work with you on ceph containers. the procedure for inital cluster is hardest16:20
rhalliseyya it is16:20
sdakesamyaple has actually done a thorough review16:20
SamYapleif you do the containers i can do the ansible stuff quickly16:20
rhalliseykk16:20
rhalliseyI just wanted to draw attention to another BP real quick16:20
rhallisey#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/kolla/+spec/containerize-dependencies16:20
sdakeso sounds like we need a blueprint for ceph then16:20
sdakecan someone file that?16:20
SamYaplewe have one sdake16:20
rhalliseysdake, I think we do16:20
SamYaplerhallisey: is assigned16:21
pbourkewas the templating discussed at all?16:21
SamYaplewait16:21
SamYaplecan we jump back to logging for a second16:21
SamYaplecan we clarify what we are planning with that.16:21
rhalliseySamYaple, ya I just wanted to make sure your review gets attention16:21
rhallisey#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/208451/16:21
SamYaplewe _need_ logging to files, but are re requiring central logging?16:21
rhalliseySamYaple, ok go ahead16:22
SamYapleare we calling ELKStack or central logging essential for l316:22
rhallisey#topic Logging16:22
*** openstack changes topic to "Logging (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:22
sdakewhat I'd like to see is per-node data container logging to files, with a logstash thing that forwards to a central logging16:22
sdakei realize this is imperfect16:22
SamYaplelogstash stashes16:22
sdakebecause some services cant store to files16:23
sdakei thought logstash forwarded16:23
SamYaplewhat is this central logging you are refering to16:23
sdakeor was part of that16:23
SamYaplesomething we implement?16:23
SamYapleor just "optional"16:23
sdakewell we are not goign to implement syslog or anything ike that16:23
SamYaplelike we dont have a contaienr, but you can build your own thing16:23
sdakebut we should try to have an intgrated soution for the problem16:23
jasonsbi thought it was optional16:23
SamYapleit has to be optional16:23
sdakeya optional is fine16:23
sdakebut we should provide some mechanism of logging that is coherent16:24
SamYapleok so we just need logging to be rounded up on each node and optionally be forwarded somewhere16:24
sdakebecause what we have now is a charlie foxtrot ;)16:24
jasonsbmaybe this will be motivation for oslo.log to work correctly16:24
sdakei think that makes sense16:24
SamYapleok thats fine with me16:24
SamYapleso the central logging bluebrint can stay in discussion16:24
dimsjasonsb: please log a bug against olso.log? :)16:25
sdakeoslo.log is fine16:25
SamYapleand the logging blueprint will be unifying the logs and then optionally allowing them to be forwraded16:25
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rhalliseyok cool16:25
sdakethe problem is some service s outside openstack dont' even log to files16:25
jasonsbsdake: maybe there was just a miscommunication between oslo and nova while back16:25
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SamYaplesdake: yea thats fine, rsyslog still has to exist in the logstash stuff16:26
sdakejasonsb well file a bug - wasn't aware there was conflict  between nova and oslo.log ;)16:26
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SamYaplesdake: log everything to resyslog and spit it to the disk, then optionally forward it16:26
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jasonsb+16:26
SamYaplethats what the midcycle agreed to and that covers everyone16:26
jasonsb+116:26
sdakeok wfm16:26
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rhalliseycool sounds good16:27
rhalliseyok we'll move on16:27
rhallisey#topic gating16:27
*** openstack changes topic to "gating (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:27
SamYaplewoo16:27
sdakeactually rhallisey16:27
sdakecan you #undo that16:27
sdakeand go to templating first16:27
rhallisey#undo16:27
openstackRemoving item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Topic object at 0x951eb90>16:27
sdakepbourke had a topic on it he wanted to discuss16:27
rhallisey#topic templating16:27
*** openstack changes topic to "templating (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:27
rhalliseypbourke, go ahead16:28
pbourkejust wanted to see what the plans were for it, as I kind of need it yesterday :p16:28
sdakethere is an etherpad with an example prototype implementation of keystone available16:28
sdakesec let me fidn it16:28
pbourkeah that's right I saw that16:28
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sdakehttps://blueprints.launchpad.net/kolla/+spec/dockerfile-template16:29
SamYaplei believe coolsvap|away was leading that16:29
SamYaplewhats the progress?16:29
sdakei think we need to come to conclusion if that example is acceptable to evereyone16:29
inc0akwasnie, did you start with coolsvap|away ?16:30
pbourkebp is asigned to akwasnie atm, akwasnie are you taking over ?16:30
sdake#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kolla-dockerfile-template16:30
inc0pbourke, they'll cooperate16:30
sdakeI don't recall coolsvap|away taking ownership on that16:30
akwasnieinc0: yes16:30
SamYaplesdake: i discussed that with him and akwasnie16:30
sdakeoh roger16:31
SamYaplethey said they would take lead16:31
pbourkeinc0: akwasnieL sounds good guys16:31
sdakewell you are on different tz then me :)16:31
SamYaple:)16:31
sdakeso folks can we get agreement on the tempalte format16:31
sdakeI'mg ood with it16:31
sdakei thikn its a little overcomplicated but should be fine16:31
SamYaplewe shoudl get the base template out for that ASAP akwasnie16:31
SamYaplethat way if anyone disagress they can say so16:31
pbourkeit would be nice to have a little more discussion later16:31
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pbourkeon the ins and outs16:31
akwasnieagree16:31
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SamYapleyea i think the base example should allow for that conversaiont pbourke16:32
pbourkea WIP, even better16:32
pbourkecool16:32
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sdakealso i'd like the filesystem layout documented in the etherpad16:32
akwasniei will send base example in 2 days max, i think16:32
* rhallisey still reading16:32
SamYapleakwasnie: on16:32
SamYapleok*16:32
sdakeakwasnie if yo ucan add the filesystem layout to the etherpad that would rock ;-)16:32
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rhalliseyI'm ok with adding this as a discussion for our next meeting16:33
sdakeakwasnie also are we putting these ina new directory?16:33
akwasniewhere would you like me to place those templates in kolla dir tree?16:33
rhalliseythis does change the template a bit, but I think we need it16:33
sdakeoh i see right there "docker_templates"16:33
sdakeits right in the etherpad16:34
sdakemy bad16:34
SamYapleyes sdake, thats been confirmed and everyone is on the same page for that16:34
inc0rhallisey, next meeting might be hard as its after midnight for us16:34
SamYapleakwasnie: yes right beside the docker folder16:34
SamYapledocker_templates16:34
akwasnieok16:34
sdakei'd like to see the child directories as well16:34
rhalliseyinc0, ok let's do what we can now16:34
sdakein the etherpad16:34
SamYaplehow about i submit a base structure patch with the skel structure sdake16:35
sdakewfm16:35
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rhalliseyI think we can have more discussion on this soon16:35
pbourkethe main thing the existing example is missing is some mechanism for custom snippets16:35
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SamYaplepbourke: yea easy to add. will do16:36
pbourkeawesome16:36
SamYaplewe have a linked bluebrint for that16:36
sdakewe need to be able to handle rhel16:36
SamYaplei think we all understand the concerns at this point16:36
sdakeand that has some special logic to register the os16:36
SamYaplewe can discuss more after some code lands16:36
rhalliseysince inc0 and akwasnie won't be around next Wed we can push it back possibly or have the discussion in #kolla16:36
SamYapleeveryone ok with that?16:36
rhalliseySamYaple, agreed16:36
pbourke+116:36
sdakewfm16:36
sdakegetting ready to lose network - lets move on :)16:36
rhalliseyya I think as we get to see me we can chat about it in #kolla16:37
akwasnie+116:37
inc0lets get some prototype and dicuss it early next week16:37
rhallisey#topic gating16:37
*** openstack changes topic to "gating (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:37
SamYaplewoo16:37
rhalliseyjpeeler, has been away getting married congrats!16:37
SamYaplewoo16:37
rhalliseyjpeeler, I was wondering if you were still looking at this?16:37
inc0we've lost a good collegue16:37
akwasnie+116:38
inc0may God have mercy on his soul16:38
rhalliseylol16:38
sdakelol inc016:38
jpeelerheh thanks16:38
jpeelerwhich part are we talk about exactly?16:38
sdakewell we need to improve the gate16:38
rhalliseyjpeeler, just a status16:38
jpeelerbefore i left, i was working to get the new builder in the gate16:38
sdakeoen thing is build.py gating16:38
rhalliseyor any opinion16:38
jpeelerbut "the gate" ncludes smoke testing, tempest, and more16:39
jpeeleri'm assigned the blueprint to get tempest going too16:39
jpeelerlots to do16:39
rhalliseyalways is16:39
sdakesomeone suggested rally for testing16:39
sdakei kind of dismissed it but  then remembered I dont really know what rally is16:40
jpeeleri was just going to ask that16:40
jpeelersdake: you mean rally instead of tempest?16:40
rhalliseydon't either16:40
sdakeso maybe that is something we should investigate16:40
sdakeI dont know I kind of dismissedi t16:40
sdakebut some people at the midcycle seemed pretty keen on it16:40
SamYaplerally for testing would be nice but i dont think it matters atm16:40
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sdakeand I realized I made a mistake by dismissing without eval16:40
SamYaplei always thought it was good for larger scale16:40
pbourkeright now anything that gates images not building and starting up would save major time16:40
sdakeagree we need an ansiblegate16:41
SamYaplesingle node in the gate well it doesnt seem like rally would be the right choice16:41
pbourkesometimes I feel like im QA16:41
sdakesofirst step to that is build.py gating16:41
pbourkewith building and testing patches16:41
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sdakenext step is aio ansible deploy or docker in docker deploy16:41
jpeelerright, build.py in the gate is first. and there are necessary logging changes before that can occur16:41
sdakei think sam was going to work on docker in docker deploy16:41
SamYaplesdake: got a partiol script16:42
SamYapleshould be drop in16:42
jpeelerdocker in docker? interesting16:42
SamYaplejpeeler: ill tell you about it!16:42
sdakecool so if sam finishes up the partial script i'll handle gtting the gate rollling on that16:42
rhalliseyDinD16:42
jpeelerthatrock16:42
rhalliseycool thanks jpeeler for the status16:43
sdakehow does docker in docker work in a 3 minute breakown samyaple16:43
sdakejust so folks understand what we are doing16:43
rhalliseyimagine putting a little box into a bigger box16:43
SamYaplewhats in the box....16:43
sdakea dead cat16:43
SamYapleso quick run down16:43
pbourkean inception dvd16:44
rhalliseydead cat16:44
rhalliseylol16:44
SamYaplewe have a single gate, we need multinode testing16:44
SamYaplenormally that would mean vms, that is not going to work in the gate16:44
SamYapleso we can do docker in docker, which is just what it sounds like16:44
SamYaplehave a super docker container running on the host16:44
SamYapleand dokcer running in that container, running hte kolla services16:44
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SamYaplethat allows us ot have several super docker contaienrs simulating nodes16:45
sdakethe docker running in the container running the kolla services gets its own ip address?16:45
SamYapleyes16:45
sdakecool16:45
inc0SamYaple, I'm wondering if we hit problems with host-network16:45
pbourkeare we realy the first project to need multi node testing?16:45
SamYapleinc0: thats the best part, no16:45
pbourkes/testing/gate16:45
SamYaplethe only way out of the docker contaienr will be an l2 veth pair16:45
sdakepbourke no trileo does it but they have their own gating system with hardware they provide to the foundation16:45
inc0we'll use docker proxy16:45
SamYaplewith that in mind we can properly test multinode on a single node16:45
jpeeleri'd be really surprised if the gate didn't support multiple VMs somehow, but we don't need VMs with docker in docker16:46
SamYaplejpeeler: it does but is a pita16:46
SamYapleand it makes gating take forever to scheduler16:46
jpeeleri mean, yeah not saying we should do that anyway16:46
SamYapleanyway DinD means we can do multinode on a single node reliably16:46
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jpeelerdocker in docker has the added benefit of easy dev env16:47
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SamYapleit also has the benefit of testing deploying with a private registry on "fresh" hosts that havent had the containers bbuilt on them16:47
SamYaplewe build on the host and push into the regirsty then pull into the contaienrs16:47
SamYaplevery real world like16:47
SamYaplewe can also test destructively in this method which is awesome16:47
SamYaplethe time limit on the gate will determine what test  we can run16:48
rhalliseynice16:48
SamYaplebut i thin kwe can run alot of tests16:48
SamYaplethats about it from me16:48
jpeelerone ?16:48
rhalliseythanks SamYaple :)16:48
sdakecool can't wait to see that running ;)16:48
jpeelerhow many interfaces does it require?16:48
SamYaplejpeeler: just one :D16:48
jpeeleryay!16:49
SamYaplei use a veth pair for the second interface in the container16:49
SamYapleon the host i just setup a bridge16:49
SamYaplesimulated l2 network16:49
SamYaplethe contaienr has two interfaces, the host needs only one16:49
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rhalliseynice excited to see it working16:49
rhalliseylast order of business..16:50
rhallisey#topic Open Discussion16:50
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: kolla)"16:50
rhalliseyanyone got any cool stuff to talk about?16:50
rhalliseylike DinDinD16:50
sdakesounds like we have a mountain of work to do16:50
rhalliseyfor sure16:51
rhalliseyok well looks good everyone16:51
SamYaplebut we had that for L2 as well16:51
sdakewe have approximately 4-8 weeks :)16:51
SamYapleand we handled it16:51
rhalliseygot a month until l316:51
SamYaplebefore L2 we had no config-external or ansible16:51
inc0DinDinD sounds like an alarm which should turn on every time you add unnexessary abstraction layer16:51
rhalliseyexcited for another great release :)16:51
sdakeya lets try to get hte major changes out of the way for l3 plz :)16:51
rhalliseyinc0, infinte D16:51
SamYaplerhallisey: pointed to it before, but i have a review up for contaienred dependencies for ansible16:52
SamYapleso the host only required docker and docker-py16:52
SamYapleno other deps are needed16:52
rhalliseyya thanks for bring that back up16:52
SamYapleit is verified working, btu the current patchset is broken16:52
sdakeya that should be rockin16:52
rhalliseycheck out sams patch it will make things a lot easier to setup on your host16:52
SamYapleplease all review it because this is a big thing and what we are going is a bit wierd16:52
sdakelet me know when it works samyaple and i'll give it a spin16:52
jpeelersame16:53
SamYapleit should be good tomorrow16:53
sdakeok they aer kicking me off the internets16:53
SamYaplehad it working earlier but applied some pbourke changes and it broke16:53
sdakeI gotta jet16:53
SamYapleneed to clean up some syntax16:53
rhalliseycool. Nice job everyone good meeting!16:53
SamYapleby sdake16:53
SamYaplebye*16:53
pbourkegood luck16:53
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rhallisey#endmeeting kolla16:53
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"16:53
openstackMeeting ended Wed Aug  5 16:53:47 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)16:53
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kolla/2015/kolla.2015-08-05-16.00.html16:53
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kolla/2015/kolla.2015-08-05-16.00.txt16:53
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/kolla/2015/kolla.2015-08-05-16.00.log.html16:53
rhalliseythanks everyone!16:54
akwasniebye16:54
inc0cyas16:54
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rockygo/20:00
jokke_o/20:00
rockyglog-wg or log_wg20:01
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rockyg??20:01
rockyg#startmeeting log_wg20:02
openstackMeeting started Wed Aug  5 20:02:30 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is rockyg. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.20:02
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: log_wg)"20:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'log_wg'20:02
bknudsonhi20:02
rockygthat looks right20:02
rockygHey! bknudson20:02
jokke_yeah20:03
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rockygAgenda:  Old bidness; ops meetup; new bidness20:03
rockyg#topic old business20:04
*** openstack changes topic to "old business (Meeting topic: log_wg)"20:04
rockygrequestID spec:  looks like it is on its final round of review before acceptance.  Time to jump in and catch anything that breaks logging sanity20:05
rockygUnfortunately, I'm on my own 'puter so don't have the review number, but its under openstack, no other project20:06
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rockygAny other comments about that?20:06
jokke_no I think it's getting there20:07
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rockygmoving on, bugs.  Any we highlighted or need to?  (or other reviews)20:07
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rockygok.  Moving on.20:08
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rockyg#topic ops meetup20:08
*** openstack changes topic to "ops meetup (Meeting topic: log_wg)"20:08
rockygI'll be there and will have a working session.  Plan on working on Error Code spec (hopefully just review comments from ops side if I get it the rest of the way)20:09
jokke_good20:09
jokke_try to get the folks joining to these meetings as well20:10
rockygI also hope to review and summarize past etherpads and get specs or bugs out for open items20:10
rockygAnd, yeah, recruit, recruit, recruit20:10
jokke_nice ... that's next week?20:10
rockygweek after.  I have a week to collect up stuff.  Anyone with bugs they want discussed, lemme know.  Or reviews for specs, bps, etc.20:11
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jokke_ok, puuh I was afraid already that time flew that badly ;)20:12
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rockygAnd the meeting is day 1, so might get input written up from others for discussion day 220:12
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jokke_sounds good ... we probably skip that week's meeting or?20:13
rockygI'm thinking maybe focusing on everyone's favorite error message "no valid host" for getting comments, bugs, etc20:13
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rockygYeah.  Most likely skip.  Good idea.20:13
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rockyg#info no meeting week of 8/17/201520:14
jokke_you and Doug are there20:14
rockygYay!20:14
rockygbknudson, anything we should highlight from keystone, or your view of support on logging?20:14
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bknudsonrockyg: nope... we've got lots of known problems already20:15
jokke_:D20:15
bknudsonmight be interesting to know if there's anything they're concerned about from a security perspective20:15
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rockygany top one you want solved, or at least documented as needs to be solved?20:15
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rockygCool.  Security.  Yeah.  Ops have much better idea about the real security issues of logs than most20:16
bknudsonwe were asked to get the request IDs in the keystone logs, so would be nice to get that fixed20:16
jokke_was that bug tag log or logs?20:16
bknudsonalso, the logs are useless in general20:16
rockygSo, too general, or wrong message, or missing specific info?20:17
bknudsonthey don't contain the right information to figure out what the problem might be.20:17
rockygcan you shoot me a half page to page write up (actually, put it on wiki) on problems:  a) how it is now b) what would be helpful20:18
bknudsonI don't have time for that.20:19
rockygOK.20:19
bknudsontoo busy trying to fix things20:19
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rockygHow about one instance in form or bug, or a pointer to an already existing bug?  Any chance you have that?20:19
bknudsonI don't.20:19
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rockygok.  If you happen to stumble on something when firefighting, cut and paste into a bug and cc me, maybe?  I'll have ops who specifically *aren't* on the front lines to help dig and maybe we can check one problem off for you.20:21
jokke_rockyg: I think good work topic would be probe if the rest of the ops agrees and are willing to if not fix the logging issues, at least give few detailed bugs what would help keystone20:22
rockygGreat idea20:22
rockyg#action generate bugs that help fix keystone logs20:22
rockygAnd, those might span multiple projects, so we can also cross post20:23
jokke_logging is such a nice topic they are easy low hanging fruits and generally straight forward to fix ... identifying the issues in details is the problematic part20:23
jokke_and ops if any should be able to give those pointers20:23
rockygYes, and until we have details, no dev will touch them20:23
bknudsonjust try things yourself and see if the logs are adequate20:23
jokke_https://bugs.launchpad.net/glance/+bug/1450209 this is nice from glance end ;)20:24
openstackLaunchpad bug 1450209 in Glance "Glance API logs a never ending stream of 404 tracebacks from glance-registry " [Medium,Confirmed] - Assigned to GB21 (geetika791)20:24
rockygWow.  Tracebacks.  Jeez.20:24
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rockygWell, I'll be well armed at least.20:24
jokke_the registry client traces every time registry returns 404, which is for example always if the user does not have rights to view, list etc.20:25
rockygbknudson, is debug mode useful, or still bad for logging?20:25
rockygjokke_, is that in debug mode or?20:26
bknudsonwell, you're not supposed to require debug mode to diagnose issues20:26
jokke_rockyg: nope :P20:26
bknudsonon top of that, debug mode generally doesn't help much.20:26
jokke_bknudson: ++ debug should be level needed _only_ by devs20:27
rockygbknudson, yeah, but if just one or a few dbug msgs turned into error msgs would help, changing levels is easy fix20:27
bknudsonthat's not it. keystone needs to be rearchitected so that the info needed in the logs is available.20:27
rockygAh.  The crux of the matter.  If debug can't debug, then even bigger problem.20:27
rockygOh.  Gotcha.  So, it's likely a set of ops user stories, or a spec that calls out what needs to be readily available info for normal ops20:28
jokke_we should move whole openstack to waterfall mode for 3 cycles so projects would have opportunity to rewrite the dong that has been cumulating ;)20:29
bknudsonyep, rewrite the dong.20:29
rockyg++20:29
rockyglol20:29
rockygso, that's an issue I'll bring up to product wg20:30
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jokke_biggest problem with agile/test driven development ... it becomes bubblegum holding together tripvire wrapped in duct tape and never possible to rewrite for cleanup :(20:31
rockygfrom what I can tell, OS could use a top to bottom rewrite with an eye to separating infrastructure management from user space management20:31
rockygI've been thinking of trying to get a friend to speak at a summit on agile QA.20:31
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rockygAnyway.  Sounds like enough about meetup20:32
rockyg#topic new business20:32
*** openstack changes topic to "new business (Meeting topic: log_wg)"20:32
rockygany new business?20:32
rockygFYI.  I was at OSCon and ran into an Intel engineer who was escorting 7 high schoolers around20:34
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rockygAll of them were openstack committers, which is why Intel was footing their bills20:34
rockygI think they would be great for going through and adding the error codes to logging calls.20:34
jokke_oh20:34
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jokke_cool20:34
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rockygSo, something to think about.20:35
jokke_that's pretty cool on both ways. Those kids actually contributing and Intel taking the effort to bring them in20:36
* jokke_ likes20:36
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rockygYeah.  Intel also sponsors the big science fair here in the states.  It's amazing what high school kids can do20:36
rockygtwenty years ago they were building scanning electron microscopes in their garages20:37
jokke_how old are your high school kids?20:38
jokke_;)20:38
rockygAnyway,  I think I should close this out.  I think the key take away is get some focus on keystone logs and glance traces20:38
bknudsonI doubt it's just keystone...20:39
rockygUh, lessee, I think they were 14-1820:39
jokke_++ thanks both of you!20:39
bknudsonit's just that keystone is the only thing I look at.20:39
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rockygkeystone is kinda key.  Security plus laced through everything else.20:39
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rockygMaybe I'll get the ops folks to rank the projects from best to worst on logging.  Great exercise, I think.20:40
rockyg#action Ops to rank projects best to worst on logging.20:40
rockyg#action also get Ops to rank highest priority to lowest20:41
rockygThose are two actionable user stories.  We get that, we have a test pilot project to focus improvement.20:42
rockygIt also provides us some traction.  thanks for the brainstorming!20:42
jokke_cheers20:42
rockyg#endmeeting20:42
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"20:42
openstackMeeting ended Wed Aug  5 20:42:54 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)20:42
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/log_wg/2015/log_wg.2015-08-05-20.02.html20:42
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/log_wg/2015/log_wg.2015-08-05-20.02.txt20:42
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/log_wg/2015/log_wg.2015-08-05-20.02.log.html20:43
rockygThanks for taking the time bknudson20:43
rockygand jokke_20:43
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