Thursday, 2020-01-16

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abhishekk#startmeeting glance14:00
openstackMeeting started Thu Jan 16 14:00:44 2020 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is abhishekk. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.14:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: glance)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'glance'14:00
abhishekk#topic roll call14:00
*** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: glance)"14:00
abhishekk#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-team-meeting-agenda14:01
abhishekko/14:01
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rosmaitao/14:01
jokke_o/14:01
abhishekkit's 3 musketeers14:02
rosmaita:D14:02
jokke_:)14:02
abhishekklets start14:03
abhishekk#topic release/periodic jobs update14:03
*** openstack changes topic to "release/periodic jobs update (Meeting topic: glance)"14:03
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abhishekkWe still have oslo job failure14:04
abhishekkI have added workaround on the patch14:04
abhishekk#link https://review.opendev.org/#/c/701580/14:05
jokke_That' the one I think that we have patch up from Stephen as well14:05
jokke_but the Stephen's patch were just removing registration of some options14:05
abhishekkI am not able to find out root cause yet though, but added workaround and my understanding on the patch14:06
rosmaitathanks for working on that14:06
abhishekkjokke_, yes, I have added my suggestion there14:06
jokke_yeah cool14:06
abhishekkIf we are good with that, then I can go ahead and update the patch with proper commit message14:07
jokke_will need to look into it14:07
abhishekkack14:07
abhishekkUssuri milestone 2 - 5 weeks to go14:08
rosmaitathat really is weird, your guess does seem to make sense, though14:08
abhishekkrosmaita, yes14:08
abhishekkwe need +2 from smcginnis on multiple import and copying specs to get those merged14:08
abhishekkif he is around kindly ping him14:09
abhishekkNeed to release from stable train and stein branches14:09
abhishekkI will propose release patches tomorrow my time14:09
jokke_yeah, I think we should have everything merged in stable branches, right?14:10
abhishekkjokke_, yes14:10
abhishekkOnly question I have here is do we need to propose separate release notes to stable branches?14:10
jokke_abhishekk: I can do it today or we can push it to Monday, no Friday releases :P14:10
jokke_abhishekk: I have done that in past if the patches has not contained renos14:11
abhishekkjokke_, cool, if possible for you kindly propose the patches :D14:11
jokke_kk14:12
abhishekkthank you14:12
abhishekkmoving ahead14:12
abhishekk#topic Multiple store import plugins14:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Multiple store import plugins (Meeting topic: glance)"14:12
abhishekkmultiple import specs14:12
abhishekk#link https://review.opendev.org/66920114:13
abhishekkCopying existing image specs14:13
abhishekk#link https://review.opendev.org/#/c/694724/14:13
abhishekkwe need smcginnis to review and +2 these specs14:13
jokke_ok14:13
abhishekkBoth are reviewed by other cores and have +2 from each of us14:14
abhishekkyebinama is not around, but he has patch up which is working find14:14
abhishekks/find/sine14:14
rosmaitathat's good14:15
abhishekkOnly notification and documentation related changes are remaining now14:15
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abhishekksame thing for copying patch, only functional tests and documentation is remaining14:15
jokke_yeah, I'll update my client patches once we have got the specs merged so we have tools to access these as well14:15
jokke_and test them locally14:16
abhishekkjokke_, great14:16
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abhishekkif you guys get some time, then kindly have a look at those patches and give your initial thoughts14:17
abhishekkmoving ahead14:17
abhishekk#topic Delete image from single store14:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Delete image from single store (Meeting topic: glance)"14:17
jokke_So we have some wording disagreements around comments, response messages and renos14:18
abhishekkimplementation,  https://review.opendev.org/69804914:18
rosmaitai feel pretty strongly about not mentioning 'location' to end users14:18
rosmaitawe don't recommend that they be exposed14:18
rosmaitaso we should speak about 'image data' and 'store'14:18
abhishekkok, I didn't get enough time to have a look at the new patch14:19
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abhishekkI will go through it tomorrow my time14:20
rosmaitawe don't have naything else on the agenda ...14:20
abhishekkrosmaita, no14:21
rosmaitakey thing woudl be to look at images.py14:21
rosmaitawould be good to get this out of the way now (though it is probably pretty late your time)14:21
abhishekkLet me have a look14:21
jokke_and I'm fine with that but I do feel quite strongly about consistency and specifically when we are responding of a same condition from multiple places. Thus like I already said, I'd rather keep the messages consistent and have discussion about what we return from our API to user as separate discussion outside of this review. That way we can update the responses where we need and be consistent14:21
rosmaitaordinarily i would agree, but this is a new resource (/v2/stores) so we can treat it properly and then bring the rest into sync14:22
jokke_Also we need to think how we communicate it so everyone understands what we are talking about. The "location" is very established term when we talk about images for long time already before multistore14:23
rosmaitai disagree ... pretty much nobody understands locations14:24
rosmaitaand the default config doesn't expose them14:24
rosmaitawe're talking about end users here14:24
jokke_default does not, I'd say around 68% (or what ever the ceph adoptation was on last survey) of deployments does14:25
rosmaitadoesn't matter, this is about stores14:26
jokke_Like I said, I totally agree we should get away from it, but we need to do it consistently and not just somewhere and then forget everything else for few cycles14:26
rosmaitaso we should talk about stores14:26
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abhishekkI went through the comments14:28
rosmaitayou are going to have to put your foot down, because erno and i are not going to agree about this14:29
abhishekkAs we are talking about possibility of removing image from single store, it will be good to add messages which reflects the same14:30
abhishekkthis is my honest opinion14:30
rosmaitawhat release are we going to make enabled_backends mandatory?14:31
abhishekkrosmaita, it is not decided yet, but most probably from V release14:32
jokke_I think original plan was this one, but I don't see it happening that fast14:32
jokke_as I think we slipped already one cycle stabilizing it14:32
abhishekkyes14:33
rosmaitawell, it does seem to be coming together nicely14:33
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abhishekkTo make enabled_backends mandatory we need to make changes devstack as well :D14:35
rosmaitathat is always an adventure14:35
rosmaitarelated to that, what's the status of making private visibility the default?14:35
jokke_not gonna happen14:35
abhishekkNope, I have one patch up for the same which configures multiple file backends for us14:35
abhishekk#link https://review.opendev.org/68910414:36
jokke_rosmaita: effectively the QA stance is that we need to call it images api v3 to change any default values14:36
abhishekkyes14:37
jokke_rosmaita: the other option would be stop gating tempest :P14:38
abhishekklol14:38
rosmaitabummer14:38
abhishekkI will add my comments on the patch, but I think we should talk about the 'store' specifically instead of location14:40
abhishekkjokke_, no offense :D14:40
jokke_please, do then I have something to point out when people start nagging about inconsistencies saying "it wasn't me" and that's fine :P14:41
abhishekkI have one item for Open Discussion, should we move ahead14:41
abhishekk:D14:42
jokke_so there is still the last sentence of the release note14:42
jokke_should I just remove it as it seems like there is no agreement on that either14:43
jokke_?14:43
abhishekkjokke_, looking14:44
abhishekkI am fine with current wording here14:45
rosmaitai just thought it a bit weird to be saying "hey, stuff might disappear, then you can use this new feature"14:46
abhishekkwill add my comment there as well14:46
rosmaitadoesn't seem like a good message14:46
rosmaitabut maybe i misread it14:46
jokke_rosmaita: so let me explain my thinking on that.14:47
rosmaitasure14:47
jokke_Specially with the edge growing bigger and bigger with really small footprint sites. I'm expecting that lots of deployments won't have redundant storage across their sites. They count on edge site having failure, to rebuild that site clean14:48
jokke_They will have like redundant central store and perhaps single glance node with file store at the edge14:49
jokke_those edge sites will some point start failing and leaving data to the db which is just expected to be cleaned (and likely utilizing the async copy job) restored from central14:50
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jokke_I would never expect admin going willy nilly deleting data and not clening the mess behind them, but I would expect hw failures that might not have been backed up multiple times per day and restored to the pre failure state14:51
abhishekkmakes more sense14:52
rosmaitaok, i understand.  it's just that "image data has for some reason disappeared from the store" seems a bit disconcerting14:52
jokke_And I really don't want to throw our admins under the bus stating in the release notes that our expectation is, if you don't find your data in the store someone (admin) deleted it and forgot to tell you about it :)14:53
rosmaitayeah, but we also don't want to give the impression that our software is so crappy that stuff can disappear from the store14:53
rosmaita:)14:53
jokke_no, but the hw is14:54
jokke_and that just happens14:54
abhishekkLast 6 minutes14:54
jokke_ok, lets move on to abhishekk's open topic he had waiting14:54
rosmaitasure14:54
abhishekkI will add my topic to next weeks discussion14:54
jokke_sorry for taking that long14:54
abhishekkjust to give idea14:54
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abhishekkwe have a CLI tool for cleaning cache if it increases which is called glance-cache-pruner14:55
abhishekkMy opinion is unlike cache-prefetcher, we should run this also as a periodic job14:55
jokke_you mean like prefetcher?14:56
abhishekkI will write a lite spec for the same14:56
rosmaitawhat's the advantage of cache pruning rather than just letting the ejection algorithm handle it?14:56
abhishekkjokke_, now we have added prefetching as a periodic job14:56
abhishekkrosmaita, I need to understand the existing tool, never used it14:58
jokke_I think I have the same question as rosmaita14:58
rosmaitaiirc, our ejection algorithm was most-recently-used for a while, maybe that's why the tool was added14:58
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rosmaitayes, that's not a typo14:58
rosmaitawe were kicking out the newest image14:58
rosmaitaso you really did need to prune the cache to get anything to stick!14:58
abhishekkbut IMO instead of running it using cron job in deployments we should give this facilities to run as a periodic job14:58
rosmaitai am pretty sure that actually happened14:58
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jokke_so in my understanding the cli tool was there for admin to make a call for what they want to throw out rather than letting the algo handle it14:59
abhishekklast minute14:59
abhishekkyes14:59
jokke_Like I can't remember us running that in cron14:59
rosmaitayeah, and a periodic job wouldn't know what to do in that case?14:59
jokke_that's admin tool not periodic one iirc14:59
abhishekkI am not sure there is any algo which is doing this14:59
abhishekkOK, we can discuss this in next meeting15:00
abhishekkthank you all15:00
jokke_ok, we're out of time, I'll have a look into that as well15:00
rosmaitasure, have a good evening15:00
jokke_thanks all!15:00
abhishekk#endmeeting15:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/"15:00
openstackMeeting ended Thu Jan 16 15:00:21 2020 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)15:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-01-16-14.00.html15:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-01-16-14.00.txt15:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-01-16-14.00.log.html15:00
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