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| v1k0d3n | #startmeeting openstack-helm | 15:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue May 23 15:01:53 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is v1k0d3n. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_helm' | 15:02 |
| v1k0d3n | welcome team | 15:02 |
| v1k0d3n | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-helm-meeting-2017-05-23 | 15:02 |
| jaugustine | o/ | 15:02 |
| v1k0d3n | or those of you who have some items you wish to add to theagenda, please add them. | 15:02 |
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| portdirect | ಠ‿ಠ | 15:02 |
| alraddarla | 0/ | 15:03 |
| alraddarla | o/4 | 15:03 |
| SamYaple | o/ | 15:03 |
| alraddarla | i give up | 15:03 |
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| korzen | hello | 15:03 |
| lrensing | o/ | 15:03 |
| dulek | o/ | 15:03 |
| v1k0d3n | hey SamYaple good to have you | 15:03 |
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| SamYaple | im my own person | 15:03 |
| alanmeadows | \o/ STEVE HOLT. | 15:04 |
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| v1k0d3n | ok, sorry...just getting started. | 15:07 |
| v1k0d3n | mostly some checks on where we're at with bugs and long standing reviews. | 15:08 |
| dulek | 1692834 - I've checked this on Helm 2.3, it's fine. But I guess it's good to have 2.4 issues listed, right? | 15:08 |
| v1k0d3n | unless people have other things that they want to add | 15:08 |
| v1k0d3n | dulek: https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-helm/+bug/1690863 ? | 15:09 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1690863 in openstack-helm "Helm 2.4.0 Issues with Openstack-Helm" [High,New] | 15:09 |
| v1k0d3n | sure, it's general. maybe we should get more specific in that launchpad bug? | 15:09 |
| dulek | v1k0d3n: Yeah, but this isn't listing the issues at all. | 15:09 |
| dulek | I'm fine with closing my bug and expanding description of 1690863. | 15:09 |
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| v1k0d3n | this was really a placeholder. i thought that some folks were working against this issue. i'm completely fine with more details, and however the team wants to address doing that is fine with me. | 15:10 |
| v1k0d3n | do we want to close 1690863 in favor of more detailed helm 2.4 related bug issues? | 15:10 |
| srwilkers | yes | 15:10 |
| v1k0d3n | (assuming that's a bit better). | 15:10 |
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| v1k0d3n | cool. done. so srwilkers are you aware of other 2.4 issues that could open launchpad bugs against? | 15:11 |
| v1k0d3n | the 1690863 was really just a place holder to let users know that 2.3 is still recommended. | 15:12 |
| srwilkers | not that im aware of, but if there are any, id rather see a verbose description of bugs | 15:12 |
| portdirect | the only one I'm aware of is the hard failure of gotpl rendering errors | 15:12 |
| srwilkers | launchpad bugs aren't really appropriate for pinning to a helm version | 15:12 |
| srwilkers | should just be noted in the docs | 15:12 |
| anticw | i'm using 2.4 and wondering what the issue is | 15:12 |
| v1k0d3n | sure, as long as we can recommend to users that for now the recommendation is to use 2.3 until we're able to resolve and work against them. | 15:12 |
| portdirect | lack of ceph secrets in helm-toolkit | 15:13 |
| portdirect | anticw: ^^ | 15:13 |
| portdirect | renders fine if they are present | 15:13 |
| v1k0d3n | right. +1 related to ceph issues. | 15:13 |
| srwilkers | 2.3 is noted in the all-in-one docs and the multinode, so we should be good | 15:13 |
| v1k0d3n | (in etherpad). | 15:13 |
| v1k0d3n | ok, i'll close out the general 1690863. dulek can you mention using 2.3 in your issue until resolved? | 15:14 |
| portdirect | v1k0d3n: i dont think we should close out 1690863? | 15:15 |
| v1k0d3n | ok | 15:15 |
| dulek | v1k0d3n: I've commented. | 15:15 |
| v1k0d3n | thanks dulek. next then. | 15:15 |
| v1k0d3n | are there really any other ceph issues than what's already been described? anticw i thought you may have run into issues, or was that only networking? | 15:16 |
| v1k0d3n | (my brain is all over the place atm) | 15:16 |
| alanmeadows | portdirect: really its the entire conversion of the ceph chart to the modern way -- from ceph.conf templates, secrets, to dependency checking | 15:17 |
| lrensing | +1 alanmeadows | 15:17 |
| v1k0d3n | good point alanmeadows. +1 | 15:17 |
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| portdirect | alanmeadows: agreed (I think) though did you mean to direct that at me? | 15:18 |
| portdirect | I'm 100% on the same page that it needs redone, but thought somone else was on it | 15:18 |
| alanmeadows | i volunteered anticw, but just mentioning for awareness to all, ceph issues more then just the helm 2.4 secrets | 15:19 |
| portdirect | :) yeah - in addition the the points you raise we should also have a set of snae defaults for diff size clusters | 15:19 |
| portdirect | s/snae/sane | 15:20 |
| anticw | portdirect: oh, i have some stuffs there | 15:20 |
| portdirect | nice :) | 15:20 |
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| anticw | longer-term we should split multinode to mutinode.rst and largescale.rst | 15:21 |
| portdirect | +1 | 15:21 |
| v1k0d3n | ok, moving on. networking issues. i think anticw has been working some of these as well. SK has some interest as well. | 15:21 |
| anticw | but we don't know what the latter should really look like except in an abstract sense | 15:21 |
| alanmeadows | To finish off your question, there is probably a long list of ceph issues, but I think many of them can simply be summed up with the fact that the first priority is modernizing the chart and bring it inline with the rest of openstack-helm--you can't override anything, you must set the proper environment variables before running sigil (huh), and you need to | 15:22 |
| alanmeadows | have magic stuff in helm-toolkit/secrets | 15:22 |
| portdirect | (plug) I think we should explore using the way i did secret gen for the upstream chart? | 15:23 |
| portdirect | eg: https://github.com/ceph/ceph-docker/blob/master/examples/helm/ceph/templates/jobs/configmap.yaml | 15:24 |
| portdirect | which removes the req for having anything installed on the host | 15:24 |
| anticw | v1k0d3n: the 'networking issue' i think is the choice if IPs again in ceph.conf magics | 15:24 |
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| alanmeadows | worth a look, sure -- I'm frankly happy with starting simple, because this is a pain point for many -- static 'secrets' defined in values.yaml might be the best place to start that advanced users can override | 15:25 |
| v1k0d3n | +1. most of the issues that i hear about are related to preparing the environment for ceph (in BM installations). | 15:26 |
| v1k0d3n | easing this would be a huge win. | 15:27 |
| portdirect | an alternate to condsider may be passing this off to a plugin - which is what i do for my personal lab: https://github.com/portdirect/marina#quckstart | 15:28 |
| v1k0d3n | @alanmeadows we have all of the items we want on the roadmap for ceph, right? | 15:28 |
| v1k0d3n | perhaps we can get these items in as individual blueprints to work against. | 15:28 |
| alanmeadows | This is the full issue list that was created: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1uY8U1DZgGa-IT40fYmqNlpLqUnWGC0_CbwH_n2n21Aw/edit?usp=sharing | 15:29 |
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| alanmeadows | It needs to likely work its way into blueprints | 15:29 |
| v1k0d3n | ok. i will get with the right folks, and work on getting these in. | 15:30 |
| v1k0d3n | we can move on. | 15:30 |
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| portdirect | is jayahn about? | 15:30 |
| * portdirect must be too late over that side of the big blue ball... | 15:31 | |
| portdirect | korzen did some great work putting together an etherpad: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-helm-meeting-neutron-multibackend | 15:32 |
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| portdirect | I think that jayahn was wanting to do the linuxbridge backend | 15:32 |
| portdirect | and in my own time I'd be very keen to do OVN, as I've worked on this quite a bit (and my old openstack-on-k8s was built around it) | 15:33 |
| SamYaple | always pushing an agenda this one | 15:33 |
| v1k0d3n | for each of these items that get worked, can we make sure there are blueprints for them? | 15:34 |
| v1k0d3n | that would help the community keep track of what's outstanding and who's working it. | 15:34 |
| portdirect | yeah - what we really ned to determine is the path of least evil.. | 15:34 |
| portdirect | lines 30:32 | 15:34 |
| alanmeadows | I saw him sipping coffee from an OVN mug. | 15:34 |
| anticw | i want coffee | 15:34 |
| korzen | I have published some draft: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/466293/ | 15:34 |
| portdirect | we discussed this quite a bit at the summit - but we need to prototype some things i think so determine the best path | 15:35 |
| korzen | LB can be incorporated in neutron chart | 15:35 |
| v1k0d3n | i think @alanmeadows should probably weigh in on that etherpad | 15:35 |
| portdirect | oh sweet nice korzen :) | 15:35 |
| alanmeadows | I think the network node concept was something missing from the beginning, that is a welcome addition | 15:35 |
| portdirect | +1 | 15:35 |
| portdirect | means we can prob get rid of that ovs labeling weirdness | 15:36 |
| korzen | other SDNs need to have their separate charts | 15:36 |
| korzen | and labeling to mark which node should operate which Neutron backend seems like a solution | 15:36 |
| alanmeadows | well, you still have the need to get ovs both on compute nodes, and now network nodes | 15:36 |
| portdirect | yeah - just that it could now be loosedned up a bit and made more generic | 15:37 |
| portdirect | ie: sdn-agent or similar | 15:37 |
| alanmeadows | so the same conundrum still exists, but with different names | 15:37 |
| alanmeadows | sure, openvswitch label becomes something more palatable | 15:37 |
| alanmeadows | but same requirement for that multi-category label, unless someone has better ideas | 15:38 |
| portdirect | we could just make it that the sdn runs on compute and network nodes? | 15:38 |
| portdirect | and dump it altogether | 15:38 |
| korzen | sdn can have separate labels | 15:40 |
| alanmeadows | thats what we do today, with a third label, to have it scheduled to two separate labels, we would have to get more fancy then nodeSelector | 15:40 |
| alanmeadows | which sounds fine to me, I just couldn't be bothered | 15:40 |
| portdirect | lol - i think that should be a twenty min fix :P | 15:41 |
| * alanmeadows starts the clock. | 15:41 | |
| * portdirect suspects that will bite him | 15:41 | |
| portdirect | :) | 15:41 |
| v1k0d3n | so maybe the best approach alanmeadows is to weigh in on that etherpad? | 15:42 |
| alanmeadows | i will, but with this etherpad | 15:42 |
| alanmeadows | did this group work out whether they feel all of these options listed here, which are pretty wide reaching | 15:42 |
| alanmeadows | from calico, to (open)contrail to ovs | 15:42 |
| portdirect | not yet its still a wip | 15:42 |
| alanmeadows | whether they can be handled in a single neutron chart | 15:42 |
| alanmeadows | or whether neutron-foobar would be inevitable | 15:43 |
| portdirect | nope - thats the fundimental question at this stage | 15:43 |
| alanmeadows | ok so more workthrough/attempts need to be done | 15:43 |
| alanmeadows | for us to answer that question | 15:43 |
| portdirect | at the summit we agreed that we would prototype both approaches in PS's and then determin the most paletable path forward | 15:43 |
| alanmeadows | okay | 15:44 |
| portdirect | lines 34:47 are where korzen has done a great job of highlighting most of the areas we need to consider | 15:44 |
| v1k0d3n | 15 minutes til top of the hour folks. | 15:45 |
| v1k0d3n | let's talk aboutu these neutron improvements in the openstack-helm channel. | 15:46 |
| v1k0d3n | one thing that i think may be creeping up are cinder issues. | 15:46 |
| v1k0d3n | i've heard a couple of folks mention this. can anyone go a bit deeper? anticw ? | 15:47 |
| anticw | v1k0d3n: couple of issues, the default endpoint | 15:47 |
| anticw | and secondly it doesn | 15:47 |
| anticw | gah stupid ' button | 15:47 |
| anticw | do not work | 15:48 |
| anticw | the endpoint is an easy fix, we get obscure 500s without it | 15:48 |
| anticw | do not work = tries to use iscsi in nova-compute for unknown reasons | 15:48 |
| SamYaple | anticw: you cant do iscsi in network namespace for kernel reasons | 15:49 |
| v1k0d3n | anticw: are these things you have fixes for that could be submitted/reviewed, or are you still in the process of testing through? | 15:49 |
| anticw | v1k0d3n: just local becuase i aren't sure if it's me or something larger | 15:49 |
| anticw | SamYaple: don't want iscsi ... it should be using ceph | 15:50 |
| SamYaple | ah sorry misread that anticw | 15:50 |
| anticw | https://pastebin.com/5Uvjk7hR | 15:50 |
| anticw | SamYaple: fwiw, i think we could get iscsi working as most of that stuff seems to run in the host namespace | 15:51 |
| anticw | (but that's OT) | 15:51 |
| v1k0d3n | anticw: let me redeploy a bare metal install, test and see if i get some of the same. i can reach out and we can work through them if you want/have time? | 15:51 |
| anticw | v1k0d3n: no | 15:51 |
| anticw | err, yes | 15:52 |
| SamYaple | anticw: iscsi runs in the host namespace fine, there is a kernel bug for running in network namespaces | 15:52 |
| v1k0d3n | :) haha | 15:52 |
| v1k0d3n | 8 mins left | 15:52 |
| portdirect | SamYaple: the only thing that jumps out at me is this: https://github.com/openstack/openstack-helm/blob/master/nova/values.yaml#L322 | 15:52 |
| portdirect | but that should not effect volume attach right? | 15:52 |
| alanmeadows | that should be how nova stores ephemeral disks | 15:53 |
| anticw | cinder-api is giving cinder-volume some json which it's not dealing with right, unclear which end is to blame | 15:53 |
| anticw | we can talk about this over <- there later if you like | 15:53 |
| v1k0d3n | that works anticw | 15:53 |
| anticw | portdirect: really easy to repro if you have 5 mins | 15:54 |
| v1k0d3n | one last thing too. i think SamYaple and alanmeadows: you guys are still exploring rootwrap use...is that correct? | 15:54 |
| v1k0d3n | or have you guys come to some form of agreement? maybe we should stand up an etherpad so we can take it offline? | 15:54 |
| v1k0d3n | (unless there already is one). | 15:55 |
| SamYaple | the summation is i say rootwrap.conf is a config (hence why it is in /etc/) and it is not in the LOCI images | 15:55 |
| SamYaple | the fear is it is image specific stuff, which i dont agree with that | 15:55 |
| portdirect | +1 | 15:55 |
| alanmeadows | I have been going through OOTB rootwraps trying to discover something that would end up being quite image-centric | 15:55 |
| SamYaple | for glance and cinder if you use ceph you dont even NEED rootwrap, so its also a greater attack surface | 15:56 |
| SamYaple | the deploy tool would be able to limit that attack surface but it must control the rootwrap files | 15:56 |
| portdirect | for cider you do for backup I think? | 15:56 |
| SamYaple | i dont think so, but i oculd be wrong | 15:56 |
| SamYaple | i could be wrong about ALL of this, but i havent seen anything to suggest i am | 15:56 |
| SamYaple | so this is really pending more info | 15:56 |
| alanmeadows | I have not been able to find an example yet, so I am willing to concede on bringing these into the fold of OSH, provided we come up with a path to customize not only rootwrap.conf, but allow injection of additional rootwrap.d files | 15:56 |
| SamYaple | im happy to come back to it once/if an issue is found | 15:57 |
| alanmeadows | to be honest, the main reason it was skipped for configuration overrides | 15:57 |
| alanmeadows | was it was a substantial amount of work | 15:57 |
| srwilkers | alanmeadows, i can tackle that | 15:57 |
| SamYaple | yea sure alanmeadows, but to be fair it can be wholesale copied over at first | 15:57 |
| SamYaple | maintenance on a straight copy is insigificant | 15:57 |
| SamYaple | any paramaterized rootwrap is a thing that comes later | 15:58 |
| alanmeadows | well, but I mean if we're going to own it, we have to give end users the ability to do things with it (templates) | 15:58 |
| portdirect | they are pretty well commented atm - should just be a case of wrapping in conditionals i think | 15:58 |
| alanmeadows | if we own it, and then jam it in, we've done a disservice | 15:58 |
| alanmeadows | in fact, I think because this is not oslo-gen capable | 15:59 |
| SamYaple | 'dont let perfect be the enemy of good' | 15:59 |
| SamYaple | but im with you, i dont want it to sit in there | 15:59 |
| alanmeadows | the function introduced with the cinder stuff, namely the helm-toolkit "toIni" function (casing correction needed) | 15:59 |
| SamYaple | that doesnt mean it cant sit in there AT FIRST | 15:59 |
| alanmeadows | may be perfect for rootwrap.conf | 15:59 |
| SamYaple | reminder, openstack config files are not ini. that is all | 16:00 |
| SamYaple | i think rootwrap follows ini still though | 16:00 |
| v1k0d3n | we unfortunately have to wrap up. | 16:00 |
| alanmeadows | its standard [HEADER] item=foo | 16:00 |
| v1k0d3n | sorry that the meeting took a while today. | 16:00 |
| v1k0d3n | alanmeadows and SamYaple...want to continue in #openstack-helm? | 16:01 |
| SamYaple | sure i think we are basically done though | 16:01 |
| v1k0d3n | sounds good. | 16:01 |
| v1k0d3n | ok calling the meeting folks. thanks everyone for coming and contributing! | 16:01 |
| alanmeadows | I think we can close with saying srwilkers can own this, just an etherpad with some comments to start out a trial on this | 16:01 |
| SamYaple | o/ | 16:01 |
| srwilkers | bai | 16:01 |
| v1k0d3n | #endmeeting | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:02 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue May 23 16:02:00 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:02 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-05-23-15.01.html | 16:02 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-05-23-15.01.txt | 16:02 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-05-23-15.01.log.html | 16:02 |
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