| *** makowals has quit IRC | 00:15 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 00:27 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 00:39 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 01:18 | |
| *** ricolin_ has quit IRC | 01:38 | |
| *** ricolin_ has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 01:38 | |
| *** dixiaoli has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 01:47 | |
| *** yamahata has quit IRC | 01:50 | |
| *** iyamahat has quit IRC | 01:52 | |
| *** dixiaoli_ has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 02:04 | |
| *** dixiaoli has quit IRC | 02:07 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 02:36 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 02:39 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 02:54 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 03:23 | |
| *** dixiaoli has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 03:38 | |
| *** dixiaoli_ has quit IRC | 03:39 | |
| *** dixiaoli has quit IRC | 03:49 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 03:56 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 04:08 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 04:18 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 04:24 | |
| *** jrist has quit IRC | 04:33 | |
| *** LanceHaig has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 04:38 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 04:41 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 05:01 | |
| *** LanceHaig has quit IRC | 05:14 | |
| *** dixiaoli has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 05:17 | |
| *** zaneb has quit IRC | 05:29 | |
| *** zaneb has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 05:29 | |
| *** amotoki_away is now known as amotoki | 05:35 | |
| *** LanceHaig has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 06:10 | |
| *** LanceHaig has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 06:10 | |
| *** rarcea has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 07:27 | |
| *** zaneb has quit IRC | 07:36 | |
| *** rarcea has quit IRC | 07:44 | |
| *** aarefiev_pto is now known as aarefiev | 07:44 | |
| *** markvoelker_ has quit IRC | 07:47 | |
| *** ralonsoh has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 07:48 | |
| *** zaneb has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 07:48 | |
| *** markvoelker has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 09:48 | |
| *** kongwei has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 09:58 | |
| *** kongwei has quit IRC | 10:00 | |
| *** dixiaoli has quit IRC | 10:00 | |
| *** iyamahat has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 10:01 | |
| *** iyamahat has quit IRC | 10:17 | |
| *** markvoelker has quit IRC | 10:22 | |
| *** rarcea has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 10:45 | |
| *** markvoelker has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 11:20 | |
| *** markvoelker has quit IRC | 11:53 | |
| *** LanceHaig has quit IRC | 12:04 | |
| *** felipemonteiro_ has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 12:08 | |
| *** felipemonteiro__ has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 12:09 | |
| *** felipemonteiro_ has quit IRC | 12:12 | |
| *** markvoelker has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 12:19 | |
| *** marst has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 14:31 | |
| *** lrensing has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 14:57 | |
| portdirect | o/ | 15:00 |
|---|---|---|
| jayahn | o/ | 15:00 |
| *** mattmceuen has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:00 | |
| v1k0d3n | o/ | 15:00 |
| *** srwilkers has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:01 | |
| lrensing | o/ | 15:01 |
| mattmceuen | o/ | 15:01 |
| srwilkers | #startmeeting openstack-helm | 15:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Jul 11 15:01:33 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is srwilkers. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_helm' | 15:01 |
| srwilkers | morning | 15:01 |
| jayahn | morning | 15:01 |
| portdirect | evening jayahn :) | 15:02 |
| jayahn | and evening | 15:02 |
| jayahn | :) | 15:02 |
| srwilkers | hope everyone had a good holiday last week | 15:03 |
| srwilkers | if you celebrated, that is | 15:03 |
| srwilkers | heres the etherpad for today's agenda -- its noticeably sparse | 15:03 |
| *** iyamahat has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:03 | |
| srwilkers | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-helm-meeting-2017-07-11 | 15:03 |
| srwilkers | feel free to place anything you'd like to discuss today, as i imagine it'll mostly be an open discussion as we add to the list | 15:04 |
| *** StaceyF has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:06 | |
| *** gagehugo has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:06 | |
| srwilkers | #topic Specs for OSH | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs for OSH (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:07 | |
| srwilkers | since this has a few items on the agenda, i wanted to bring this up and get opinions on the approach forward | 15:07 |
| portdirect | I think specs makes sense for some things, eg logging, networking backends | 15:08 |
| srwilkers | agreed | 15:08 |
| portdirect | long as we keep it approprately scoped - and dont go into the world of process for processes sake | 15:08 |
| srwilkers | ++ | 15:08 |
| lrensing | items that introduce a new paradigm should have a spec to discuss and gain community backing | 15:09 |
| srwilkers | im really fond of the feedback mechanism it provides versus just seeking feedback in patchsets for things that make sense | 15:09 |
| lrensing | that's my thought atleast | 15:09 |
| v1k0d3n | ++ on that srwilkers | 15:09 |
| jayahn | ++ | 15:09 |
| srwilkers | its easy to miss a patchset | 15:09 |
| portdirect | though a spec would be in the form of a ps? | 15:10 |
| portdirect | unless I'm missing something | 15:10 |
| srwilkers | during drafting, sure | 15:10 |
| mattmceuen | What types of scope would not be kicked off via a spec? | 15:10 |
| srwilkers | but it still lives and persists in the repo | 15:10 |
| srwilkers | something to point back to | 15:10 |
| *** StaceyF has quit IRC | 15:10 | |
| portdirect | roger - though by the time its merged its not a fb mechanism - but a mandate | 15:10 |
| srwilkers | whatever you want to call it | 15:11 |
| portdirect | an important distinction to note | 15:11 |
| lrensing | with regards to the deliverable of a spec, should it just land in the repo as a doc? | 15:11 |
| portdirect | lrensing: thats the normal approach | 15:11 |
| srwilkers | yeah, we'll get a spec directory in teh repo | 15:11 |
| srwilkers | and direct them there | 15:11 |
| v1k0d3n | ++ | 15:11 |
| srwilkers | any other feedback here? | 15:12 |
| mattmceuen | Question - what scope (other than bug fixes) would not be kicked off via a spec | 15:13 |
| portdirect | mattmceuen: the types of things that would not require a spec - new services | 15:13 |
| portdirect | though they may well be driven by the spec | 15:13 |
| portdirect | eg you would not need a spec to add a fluentd chart | 15:13 |
| portdirect | but for it to have value it should be writtent to follow a logging spec | 15:14 |
| mattmceuen | ok | 15:15 |
| srwilkers | #topic chart values format | 15:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "chart values format (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:16 | |
| srwilkers | its a pretty good tie in to the next item | 15:16 |
| srwilkers | floors yours lrensing | 15:16 |
| v1k0d3n | is alanmeadows around by chance | 15:16 |
| lrensing | so as the agenda says, there was a request for our charts to have a consistent values format across every service | 15:18 |
| alanmeadows | I am here | 15:18 |
| portdirect | we are 90% of the way there | 15:18 |
| portdirect | though the keys are not in any standardised order | 15:18 |
| lrensing | it's something we have always looked to keep consistent, and we've done a good job of doing misc refactors to make it consistent | 15:18 |
| lrensing | but it would be great to define a preset values tree skeleton for all charts moving forward so that developers andn operators have a consistent experience between services | 15:19 |
| portdirect | +1 | 15:19 |
| v1k0d3n | just as a thought here. | 15:19 |
| v1k0d3n | wouldn't docs explain the consistent approach...meaning, does it really _have_ to be alphabetical? | 15:20 |
| v1k0d3n | so my thoughts... | 15:20 |
| alanmeadows | I thought one of the original goals was a document providing "a tutorial on a day in the life of constructing a chart" | 15:20 |
| portdirect | ++ | 15:21 |
| alanmeadows | essentially a walk through on creating a fictitious chart from the ground up - "This chart relies on the blah service, so I am going to add these fields in values to ensure that its up before my application launches" | 15:21 |
| alanmeadows | so on and so forth down the line | 15:21 |
| v1k0d3n | some values are more commonly changed than others...like images, replica counts, etc. configs can ultimately be very large in custom installs, and it's nice having that towards the bottom. | 15:21 |
| portdirect | v1k0d3n: if you could provide fb on my ps here it would be great: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/481964/ | 15:21 |
| portdirect | the devault values is just a reference - i dont think many people will be modifying them (though I may be wrong) | 15:22 |
| v1k0d3n | i am going to, but wanted to discuss since the topic is open | 15:22 |
| portdirect | hence why I felt that removing any subjectiveness was the best approach | 15:22 |
| v1k0d3n | yeah, i see your point. | 15:23 |
| v1k0d3n | i'm not wildly opposed to it...just that the docs reflect positioning already. | 15:23 |
| portdirect | i dont think they do? | 15:24 |
| v1k0d3n | so it's going to be a lot of work and PS for little value in the end other than aesthetics. it seems to put aesthetics over function. | 15:24 |
| portdirect | they ref the sections - but now how they are potitioned relative to each other in the default values.yaml | 15:25 |
| v1k0d3n | the sections where sort of in like to positioning at one point...may not be as much now. but that's not my main point anyway. | 15:25 |
| portdirect | just takes 5 seconds to sort a yaml tree - though it takes a lot longer to manually earch for a section (say network) when they are in a diff place for each service | 15:26 |
| portdirect | so whatever method we settle on - i really think there should be a uniform standard across all charts | 15:26 |
| mattmceuen | agree. both approaches make sense. So I guess it's a little bit of an open question how frequently people will actually modify the values yaml. How frequently do you think folks will refer to it? Would a logical (aesthetically pleasing) order be handy for that? | 15:28 |
| srwilkers | i think having a uniform standard is the goal, regardless of how it's all ordered. maybe there'd be value in getting someone whos working on getting up to speed with our charts to take this on and identify what makes it easier from their perspective. maybe alraddarla? | 15:29 |
| v1k0d3n | a standard would be really great. | 15:29 |
| lrensing | i agree portdirect, this was an item that has been tossed around amongst the group for a long time and at the time of it's original inception, the values files didn't have much of a structure or consistency amongst them. a lot of the work you've done with adding functions to helm toolkit has forced some structure across charts which is a good first step | 15:30 |
| portdirect | yeah - we now have the same keys in each values.yaml - and I've kulled the dead ones | 15:30 |
| portdirect | the only think left is putting those keys into some sort of order | 15:30 |
| v1k0d3n | this is a good approach. | 15:31 |
| v1k0d3n | i just like the sections to be in relation to some form of frequency or function over alphabetical for aesthetics | 15:31 |
| v1k0d3n | because aesthetics don't really matter honestly when we can make them whatever we want anyway :) | 15:32 |
| portdirect | alphabetical is def not asthecticly pleasing | 15:32 |
| v1k0d3n | :) true that. | 15:32 |
| portdirect | i dont think i can express my logic any clearer than the commit message https://review.openstack.org/#/c/481964/ | 15:32 |
| v1k0d3n | i really, really like having replicaas and images towards the top...it's an instant eyeball snapshot of what the deployment looks like. | 15:33 |
| v1k0d3n | you did. all good there man. i said my part so i'm good. | 15:33 |
| srwilkers | the key takeaway is that theres consensus we'd like a standard -- thats a great start for me. i think we can hammer down the specifics of what that looks like as we go | 15:34 |
| srwilkers | but we should definitely leave feedback on portdirect's patchset | 15:34 |
| v1k0d3n | ++ | 15:34 |
| srwilkers | and transition that to a spec at some point | 15:34 |
| *** alraddarla has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 15:34 | |
| alraddarla | o/ | 15:34 |
| alraddarla | sorry im late | 15:34 |
| portdirect | yeah - and larry has volunteered to write a spec :) | 15:34 |
| v1k0d3n | sounds good. all comments on the ps/spec | 15:35 |
| lrensing | and after today i expect a lot of discussion on it :) | 15:35 |
| srwilkers | awesome. | 15:36 |
| srwilkers | think we can move on then? | 15:36 |
| srwilkers | #topic helm chart orchestrators | 15:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "helm chart orchestrators (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:36 | |
| srwilkers | all you portdirect | 15:36 |
| portdirect | so we have a ps in flight: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/481234/ | 15:37 |
| portdirect | that should add an armada spec for a simple os-h deployment | 15:37 |
| portdirect | once Tim and the crew have finished it - I'd like us to drop the two node gate and replace it it with another three node - but running armada | 15:38 |
| v1k0d3n | huge fan of this | 15:38 |
| v1k0d3n | great to see it starting to be discussed. | 15:39 |
| portdirect | yeah - After this meeting I'm gonna give them a hand trying to work thorugh some issues they have had | 15:40 |
| jayahn | skt is currently using landscape to deploy full ha openstack. we promised to put our landscape setting to upstream repo, then we are having "re-visit to issue" discussion. (you can read etherpad for more detail) | 15:40 |
| jayahn | landscaper.. not landscape.. | 15:41 |
| jayahn | anyway | 15:41 |
| portdirect | yeah - would be great to get your experiences | 15:41 |
| portdirect | theres aslo a few other tools I've heard noises about on the horizon | 15:41 |
| srwilkers | yeah, thatd be great. if there's long-term support there for it, id like to see that included as well. | 15:41 |
| jayahn | yeah, i will do. long story short, when landscaper start influencing how developer test each individual chart, we really started discussing around its value. | 15:42 |
| jayahn | and shortfalls | 15:42 |
| * portdirect sad face | 15:42 | |
| jayahn | probably my "upcoming" feedback will include how this deployment tool will affect "development" process, how it is influencing each other.. | 15:43 |
| jayahn | and love to get feedback on this issue from you guys as well | 15:43 |
| srwilkers | of course. we'd be happy to provide whatever we can | 15:44 |
| portdirect | yeah - one of the reasons I've been pushing so hard for this recently is so we can ensure that armada works perfectly with os-h, while not limiting any other deployment method. | 15:44 |
| portdirect | I'd really like to see support for gerrit PSes for one :D | 15:44 |
| v1k0d3n | it would be nice to see something like armada end up in kubernetes incubator too. | 15:45 |
| v1k0d3n | i know this isn't exactly the place for this topic, but it's something that was discussed a while back. although...to that point...several options were discussed including putting it in OS. | 15:45 |
| v1k0d3n | i think though, to your point portdirect putting it over the fence to kubernetes may be a nice way to show the projects working together (OSH in OS, and a tool that can deploy it in kube-incubation). | 15:46 |
| srwilkers | yeah, would be nice to see it land somewhere. at least showing what it's capable of in a three node gate would be a solid first step to that end i think | 15:46 |
| v1k0d3n | good point. agreed. | 15:47 |
| v1k0d3n | nice way to test the stack | 15:47 |
| srwilkers | #topic logging/monitoring | 15:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "logging/monitoring (Meeting topic: openstack-helm)" | 15:47 | |
| portdirect | srwilkers: ++ | 15:47 |
| srwilkers | i threw this up. similar to the chart values format, i plan on getting a spec in flight today for the logging and monitoring approach for OSH | 15:48 |
| srwilkers | have been working on it over a week or so, and would be nice to get it up for some proper feedback/discussions | 15:48 |
| portdirect | srwilkers: the sooner the better :D | 15:48 |
| srwilkers | portdirect: yep | 15:48 |
| portdirect | would really help when it comes to working out what we need to do | 15:49 |
| portdirect | from both an output sense, but also what we can do with that output | 15:49 |
| portdirect | once we have a spec in draft I would be great to get input from as many sources as possible | 15:50 |
| portdirect | jayahn, v1k0d3n and our ondercloud team should really get pulled in as much as poss | 15:50 |
| portdirect | *undercloud | 15:50 |
| alanmeadows | The aspect that is currently missing is tieing it all together--putting on an operations hat and saying yes, what happens out of the box has what I need in terms of visibility | 15:50 |
| portdirect | ++ | 15:51 |
| alanmeadows | The building blocks are coming together | 15:51 |
| srwilkers | alanmeadows: i agree. the operations hat is one i dont have much experience with thus far | 15:51 |
| alanmeadows | What we can do is dedicated a part of the spec to some use cases | 15:51 |
| alanmeadows | and extract these from our own operations folks, i.e. what is it they are trying to see, and manually fetch today | 15:52 |
| alanmeadows | and make sure that our out-of-the-box views account for these | 15:52 |
| jayahn | alanmeadows: ++ | 15:53 |
| srwilkers | yep, works for me | 15:54 |
| alanmeadows | same thing for alarming, we can assemble what we're currently monitoring today, that can drive what prometheus alarms can potentially do again out of the box | 15:54 |
| alanmeadows | at least as a starting place | 15:54 |
| jayahn | that would be really good value we can collect together. | 15:54 |
| v1k0d3n | agreed | 15:55 |
| alanmeadows | We may want to split it up into two specs, one would be more platform/foundational (where I think you are thinking Steve) - another would be what default behavior we inject into this Logging-Monitoring-Alerting platform to provide value to real operators? | 15:55 |
| v1k0d3n | starting to gather requirements for our ops team and would like to share thoughts once i get more settled in. these past coupleof weeks have been crazy. | 15:56 |
| *** aarefiev is now known as aarefiev_afk | 15:56 | |
| srwilkers | alanmeadows: i think that would make more sense the more i think about it | 15:57 |
| alanmeadows | they obviously play together, as the platform needs to support the injection of said operator needs | 15:57 |
| alanmeadows | in either case just throwing that idea out there | 15:57 |
| alraddarla | +1 alanmeadows | 15:58 |
| srwilkers | works for me. ill get them started today and call attention to them once they're in | 15:59 |
| srwilkers | ill go ahead and wrap up since we're hitting time | 15:59 |
| srwilkers | we can carry anything else over to openstack-helm | 16:00 |
| srwilkers | #endmeeting | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Jul 11 16:00:06 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-07-11-15.01.html | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-07-11-15.01.txt | 16:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_helm/2017/openstack_helm.2017-07-11-15.01.log.html | 16:00 |
| *** krtaylor_ has quit IRC | 16:00 | |
| *** krtaylor has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 16:01 | |
| *** amotoki is now known as amotoki_away | 16:14 | |
| *** gagehugo has left #openstack-meeting-5 | 16:21 | |
| *** sshank has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 16:27 | |
| *** ralonsoh has quit IRC | 16:30 | |
| *** sshank has quit IRC | 17:02 | |
| *** iyamahat has quit IRC | 17:15 | |
| *** jmenke has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 17:24 | |
| *** krtaylor has quit IRC | 17:30 | |
| *** iyamahat has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 17:31 | |
| *** lrensing has quit IRC | 17:34 | |
| *** yamahata has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 17:47 | |
| *** ricolin_ has quit IRC | 17:48 | |
| *** lrensing has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 17:50 | |
| *** sshank has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 18:11 | |
| *** yamahata has quit IRC | 18:14 | |
| *** yamahata has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 18:15 | |
| *** krtaylor has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 18:16 | |
| *** jmenke has quit IRC | 18:26 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 18:44 | |
| *** sshank has quit IRC | 18:44 | |
| *** lrensing has quit IRC | 18:45 | |
| *** krtaylor has quit IRC | 18:48 | |
| *** krtaylor has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 18:56 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 19:11 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 19:41 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 19:45 | |
| *** rarcea has quit IRC | 19:56 | |
| *** marst has quit IRC | 20:08 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 20:17 | |
| *** krtaylor has quit IRC | 20:46 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 21:20 | |
| *** makowals has quit IRC | 21:45 | |
| *** sshank has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 21:56 | |
| *** felipemonteiro__ has quit IRC | 22:04 | |
| *** markvoelker has quit IRC | 22:16 | |
| *** markvoelker has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 22:17 | |
| *** makowals has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 23:27 | |
| *** krtaylor has joined #openstack-meeting-5 | 23:51 | |
| *** sshank has quit IRC | 23:54 | |
| *** mattmceuen has quit IRC | 23:58 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.3 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!