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| kgriffs | #startmeeting marconi | 19:05 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Feb 14 19:05:02 2013 UTC. The chair is kgriffs. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:05 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 19:05 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'marconi' | 19:05 |
| kgriffs | Hey folks | 19:05 |
| kgriffs | let's get this party started | 19:05 |
| kgriffs | #topic Review actions from last time | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review actions from last time (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 19:05 | |
| kgriffs | So, did anyone learn about PATCH support in major web servers? | 19:05 |
| kgriffs | I'm not seeing wkharold in the room | 19:06 |
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| cppcabrera | wkharold left this link last time: http://weblog.rubyonrails.org/2012/2/25/edge-rails-patch-is-the-new-primary-http-method-for-updates/ | 19:06 |
| cppcabrera | "Yes, it should. I have personally tried Apache, nginx, Phusion Passenger, Unicorn, Thin, and WEBrick. They all understood PATCH requests out of the box." - from the link, Feb. 25, 2012 | 19:07 |
| kgriffs | rock on | 19:07 |
| kgriffs | sounds like we are good on that front, then | 19:07 |
| flaper87 | ₥e got here a bit late | 19:08 |
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| flaper87 | and forgot to use the / in the last message | 19:08 |
| kgriffs | #note PATCH is well-supported in servers, client libs TBD | 19:08 |
| flaper87 | ^^ | 19:08 |
| cppcabrera | You haven't missed much. We just started. :) | 19:08 |
| flaper87 | cool | 19:08 |
| kgriffs | I'd be surprised if we had issues with any of the common HTTP client libs. | 19:09 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: requests supports all that | 19:09 |
| kgriffs | sweet. I <3 Requests | 19:09 |
| * flaper87 loves it too | 19:09 | |
| kgriffs | httpie is pretty awesome too | 19:10 |
| kgriffs | anyway... | 19:10 |
| flaper87 | so, what were we discussing? | 19:11 |
| kgriffs | #topic API - Post Messages | 19:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "API - Post Messages (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 19:12 | |
| kgriffs | https://etherpad.openstack.org/queuing-api | 19:12 |
| kgriffs | so, last time we left off talking about what the body of a message should be | 19:12 |
| kgriffs | As long as it is valid JSON and within some max size (say, 64K), I think we should allow it. | 19:13 |
| kgriffs | Any objections? | 19:14 |
| * kgriffs watches a tumbleweed roll by | 19:15 | |
| cppcabrera | Sounds good to me. The max size sounds like a good parameter to leave to configuration time. | 19:15 |
| flaper87 | no | 19:15 |
| flaper87 | no objections, I mean | 19:15 |
| treeder | +1 | 19:15 |
| kgriffs | #agreed Allow arbitrary bodies, as long as it is valid JSON and under a certain size. | 19:16 |
| treeder | cppcabrera: i think the restrictions have to be set | 19:16 |
| treeder | as part of the api | 19:16 |
| kgriffs | OK. Max size? | 19:16 |
| treeder | +1 on 64k | 19:16 |
| ametts-atl | Now that we've confirmed PATCH is widely supported, is there anything we need to re-review from last week? | 19:17 |
| flaper87 | 64kb sounds reasonable | 19:17 |
| cppcabrera | +1 on 64KB, as well. | 19:17 |
| kgriffs | so, that's about 16K messages per GB | 19:18 |
| kgriffs | If clients max out the size | 19:19 |
| kgriffs | seems like most messages would be a lot smaller | 19:19 |
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| kgriffs | #agreed Specify max message size as part of the API, make it 64 KiB | 19:20 |
| kgriffs | OK, so one more thing on this before we move on... | 19:20 |
| kgriffs | When a client posts a message, the server decorates it with some metadata, such as an ID. | 19:22 |
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| kgriffs | so, nesting the "body" element in the post document mirrors the nested structure of the message when it is retrieved | 19:23 |
| kgriffs | We could get rid of the nesting for POSTs, but I'm not sure how much it matters either way. | 19:23 |
| kgriffs | Actually, maybe we should, because the way the spec is written now would imply that a client could include, e.g., "id" if they wanted, but the server should generate that IMHO. | 19:25 |
| cppcabrera | I think eliminating the nesting would be cool to avoid having to do something like: msg['body']['content'] vs. msg['content'] from a json parsing POV. | 19:25 |
| kgriffs | Any objections to hoisting "body" up one level. | 19:25 |
| kgriffs | (in the POST) | 19:25 |
| cppcabrera | No. | 19:25 |
| kgriffs | let me edit the etherpad | 19:25 |
| treeder | looking... | 19:25 |
| flaper87 | mmh | 19:26 |
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| treeder | Are you saying just post the content directly with no wrapper? | 19:27 |
| kgriffs | almost. The only wrapper is an array. | 19:27 |
| treeder | oh, i see | 19:28 |
| treeder | my only concern is it doesn't leave much room for improvement | 19:28 |
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| treeder | can't add new features or anything to the messages | 19:29 |
| kgriffs | Or we could say, it has to be an array of objects | 19:29 |
| kgriffs | good point | 19:29 |
| treeder | and i'm a big fan of future proofing api's | 19:29 |
| kgriffs | +1 | 19:29 |
| flaper87 | I think it, as it's in the wiki, is good | 19:30 |
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| kgriffs | #agreed We say it is an array of these objects and we can even have a JSON schema that we validate against, and technically this is a different media type that what you get back from a GET. | 19:31 |
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| flaper87 | one thin, tho | 19:31 |
| flaper87 | thing | 19:31 |
| kgriffs | shoot | 19:31 |
| flaper87 | in that example, what does event and backupId mean? | 19:31 |
| flaper87 | just random parameters used for the example? | 19:32 |
| kgriffs | correct | 19:32 |
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| kgriffs | could be anything that's valid JSON | 19:32 |
| flaper87 | we should maybe create some context around those examples | 19:32 |
| flaper87 | ok | 19:32 |
| flaper87 | what I wanted to be sure is that those paremeteres werent part of a, lets say, header for that body | 19:33 |
| kgriffs | yeah, this spec isn't great documentation; I imagine we'll have something a lot friendlier for devs to reference. | 19:33 |
| flaper87 | like content-length or whatsoever | 19:33 |
| kgriffs | oic | 19:33 |
| flaper87 | because, imho, that wouldn't be consistent with having a "body" key in the root dict | 19:33 |
| kgriffs | yep | 19:34 |
| kgriffs | OK, so anything else for posting messages? | 19:35 |
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| flaper87 | nopoe | 19:37 |
| kgriffs | #topic API - Get Messages | 19:37 |
| flaper87 | arg | 19:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "API - Get Messages (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 19:37 | |
| kgriffs | question, comments, rude remarks? ;) | 19:38 |
| kgriffs | One thing that probably isn't clear is why marker is decoupled from message IDs. | 19:39 |
| kgriffs | The reason is that it provides more options for storage implementations | 19:39 |
| kgriffs | We can chat about it more in a future meeting, when we start talking storage drivers. | 19:40 |
| cppcabrera | +1 for the decoupling effort. | 19:41 |
| kgriffs | Of course, marker may be a message ID, but client's shouldn't know any better. | 19:41 |
| treeder | why the userAgent in response? | 19:41 |
| kgriffs | is it helpful to know what client sent the message? | 19:42 |
| treeder | hmm, not sure | 19:42 |
| treeder | also, href is sort of redundant in the message | 19:43 |
| flaper87 | mmh, don't think that's useful | 19:43 |
| kgriffs | Actually, if we add message signing eventually, it would be necessary to know who signed it to look up the public key | 19:43 |
| cppcabrera | Hmmm.. what if the user-agent was just embedded in a message? Leave it up the application to generate it and include it? | 19:44 |
| kgriffs | How about taking out userAgent for now and adding it back later if needed? | 19:44 |
| cppcabrera | Sounds good to me. | 19:44 |
| treeder | +1 | 19:45 |
| flaper87 | +1 | 19:45 |
| flaper87 | makes more sense | 19:45 |
| kgriffs | #agreed Drop userAgent in message header, revisit later if needed | 19:45 |
| ametts-atl | Is there a potential race condition between getting messages and claiming them? Would you typically get first, then claim, or vice-versa? Do we need an option to do both in one operation? | 19:45 |
| flaper87 | lets try not to overthink from the beggining | 19:45 |
| kgriffs | You would claim first | 19:45 |
| flaper87 | we're doing a good job so far | 19:45 |
| kgriffs | claim actually returns a list of affected messages | 19:46 |
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| kgriffs | doing a regular GET would be more for pub-sub or an auditor | 19:46 |
| treeder | Get Messages and Claim should be pretty much the same functionality, but claim "claims" them right? | 19:47 |
| ametts-atl | Does claim include the message content, or just the ids? | 19:47 |
| kgriffs | Same as GET, you get the whole enchilada | 19:48 |
| ametts-atl | gotcha - ok | 19:48 |
| flaper87 | lol @ enchilada | 19:48 |
| * kgriffs missed lunch today | 19:48 | |
| treeder | hehe | 19:48 |
| flaper87 | that explains everything | 19:48 |
| flaper87 | :P | 19:48 |
| treeder | I think that should be part of the spec | 19:48 |
| kgriffs | so, let's finish up with GET | 19:49 |
| flaper87 | treeder: enchilada ? | 19:49 |
| flaper87 | :P | 19:49 |
| treeder | ya | 19:49 |
| treeder | ;) | 19:49 |
| treeder | re: href: seems redundant? | 19:49 |
| cppcabrera | enchilada - cloud queuing for those that missed the free lunch. | 19:49 |
| treeder | haha | 19:50 |
| flaper87 | hehe | 19:50 |
| kgriffs | So, I'm OK with dropping the per-message href, assuming the URI template for getting a single message is defined somewhere, maybe in a home document. | 19:51 |
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| treeder | you have Get a Specific Message endpoint | 19:52 |
| kgriffs | yes | 19:52 |
| treeder | user already has queue name and message id, so easy to make that href | 19:52 |
| kgriffs | yep | 19:52 |
| kgriffs | Any RESTafarians in the room who object? | 19:52 |
| kgriffs | #agreed Drop per-message href field | 19:53 |
| kgriffs | Anything else for "Get Messages"? | 19:54 |
| flaper87 | nope | 19:54 |
| treeder | nope | 19:54 |
| kgriffs | moving on... | 19:54 |
| kgriffs | this will be our last topic for today. | 19:55 |
| kgriffs | #topic API - Claim Messages | 19:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "API - Claim Messages (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 19:55 | |
| flaper87 | so, basically the claim is a patch with a clain action in it | 19:58 |
| flaper87 | op* | 19:58 |
| kgriffs | right, the client patches x messages with a "claim" and the server filters any messages that already have a claim. | 19:59 |
| flaper87 | seems to make sense | 20:01 |
| kgriffs | As long as all workers use this method rather than GET, it works. | 20:01 |
| kgriffs | Of course, an auditor or debugger or whatever could use GET to watch things go by | 20:01 |
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| kgriffs | well, looks like we are out of time. You guys want to sleep on this one and pick up the discussion next week? | 20:02 |
| kgriffs | maybe go have some enchiladas… | 20:03 |
| cppcabrera | Any new action items? We've still got the three pending on Trello. | 20:03 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yeap, I'd like to think a bit more on it | 20:03 |
| flaper87 | and also, should complete my zmq part (I was out of office) | 20:03 |
| treeder | ya, sounds good | 20:03 |
| treeder | i'm getting hungry. ;) | 20:03 |
| kgriffs | oic | 20:03 |
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| flaper87 | treeder: if kgriffs missed his lunch you should do the same | 20:04 |
| * flaper87 runs away | 20:04 | |
| flaper87 | hehe | 20:04 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: I'd appreciate your thoughts on how to abstract out the protocol in the implementation (make it pluggable). Maybe could be it's own blueprint. | 20:04 |
| kgriffs | what was the trello link again? | 20:05 |
| treeder | https://trello.com/board/openstack-marconi/511403287d138cd6200078e0 | 20:05 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: sure, I've that queued, sorry I didn't make it for this meeting | 20:05 |
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| kgriffs | no worries, man. Really appreciate your help. Also, it would be cool if you could help me start brainstorming about storage drivers. | 20:07 |
| kgriffs | (specifically, what backend is a good first target) | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yep, we could make that in a new wiki page | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: my first thought is mongodb | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | but we can dig that a bit more | 20:08 |
| kgriffs | Sure thing. | 20:08 |
| kgriffs | I'll schedule it for a future meeting. | 20:08 |
| flaper87 | +1 | 20:08 |
| kgriffs | OK guys, let's wrap it up. | 20:09 |
| kgriffs | next week, same time, same bat-channel. If we can get enough done, we can go back to twice a month chats. | 20:10 |
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| kgriffs | #endmeeting | 20:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings (alternate) || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 20:10 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Feb 14 20:10:30 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:10 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2013/marconi.2013-02-14-19.05.html | 20:10 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2013/marconi.2013-02-14-19.05.txt | 20:10 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2013/marconi.2013-02-14-19.05.log.html | 20:10 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: cool | 20:11 |
| flaper87 | thanks guys | 20:11 |
| flaper87 | ++ for everyone | 20:11 |
| cppcabrera | Take care, everyone. :) | 20:11 |
| kgriffs | tchuss | 20:11 |
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