Monday, 2018-08-27

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efried#startmeeting nova-scheduler14:00
openstackMeeting started Mon Aug 27 14:00:03 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is efried. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.14:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'nova_scheduler'14:00
cdento/14:00
takashino/14:00
edleafe\o14:01
alex_xuo/14:01
efried#link agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/NovaScheduler#Agenda_for_next_meeting14:01
tetsuroo/14:01
efried#topic specs and review14:02
efried#link latest pupdate: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2018-August/132852.html14:02
efriedcdent to pick this up again near the PTG \o/14:02
*** openstack changes topic to "specs and review (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)"14:02
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mriedemo/14:02
efried#link reshaper series: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/reshape-provider-tree+status:open14:02
efriedHalf is +A (still blocked by -2 at the bottom). Let's get it merged early this week.14:02
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efriedThere are a few additional barnacle patches fixing nits14:03
edleafeefried: How much of that is placement-side?14:03
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efriededleafe: There are four placement-side patches, I believe.14:03
efriedThe main one, two bug fixes, and a doc fix.14:04
edleafeSo we should be good to freeze after they merge?14:04
edleafeI'm asking because we are just about ready to do the extraction to a new repo14:04
efriedhttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/576927/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/585033/ (both +A), https://review.openstack.org/#/c/596497/ and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/596494/ respectively.14:05
efriedThe latter two still need reviews14:05
efriededleafe: Got a topic for extraction later on: remind me to ask more about the freeze thing.14:06
efriedAny other questions/comments on reshaper series?14:06
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edleafeack14:07
efried#link Gigantor SQL split and debug logging: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/590041/14:07
efriedThis is merging14:07
efriedPlanning/Doing support in nova/report client for:14:07
efried#link consumer generation handling (gibi): https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:consumer_gen+(status:open+OR+status:merged)14:07
efried#link ML thread on consumer gen conflict handling: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2018-August/133373.html14:07
efried#link nested and shared providers for initial & migration (and other?) allocations: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:use-nested-allocation-candidates+(status:open+OR+status:merged)14:07
efried#link Spec: Placement modeling of PCI devices ("generic device management") https://review.openstack.org/#/c/591037/14:08
efriedAnyone have other specs or reviews to bring up?14:09
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* cdent enqueues14:09
efried#topic bugs14:10
efried#link placement bugs: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?field.tag=placement&orderby=-id14:10
*** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)"14:10
efriedanyone have bugs to highlight?14:10
mriedemi need to write a bug at some point,14:10
mriedemfor resize to same host doubling allocations against the same compute RP14:10
mriedemeven though it's different consumers14:11
mriedemthat's going to be a tricky one to fix most likely,14:11
mriedemat least in a non-racy way14:11
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efriedmm14:11
mriedemb/c we swap the instance allocation to the migration record before hitting the scheduler,14:11
efried"greatest common denominator" allocation candidate request14:11
mriedemto find out if the scheduler has selected the same host14:11
efriedor "least superset"?14:12
mriedemsomething like that yes,14:12
mriedem1. am i resizing on the same host14:12
mriedem2. figure out superset of allocations14:12
efriedbut different depending on same vs different host, yah.14:12
mriedem3. put them back on the instance14:12
efriedcan we tell whether resizing to the same host beforehand?14:13
mriedemdon't think so14:13
efriedfun times14:13
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mriedemanyway, just thinking out loud14:13
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mriedemcarry on14:13
efriedDo we have a way to ask for allocation candidates limited to a specific host yet?14:14
mriedemnope14:14
mriedemthat was part of that force_hosts bug14:14
efriedSeems like that's going to be necessary at some point.14:14
mriedemwe talked about as an option14:14
mriedemright for the force_hosts bug, we just remove the limit to GET /allocation_candidates14:14
mriedembut what we really want is GET /allocation_candidates?in_tree=rp_uuid14:14
mriedemor something like that14:14
efriedCause then not only can you solve the force_hosts thing, you can ask for resize candidates in two batches: one with the superset-difference for same host, one for fresh new-size for other hosts.14:15
efriedbut in the meantime, you have to do two separate full requests and then filter them manually.14:15
efriedLemme know when you have that bug written.14:15
mriedemok14:15
efriedmoving on, any other bug-like stuff to talk about?14:16
efried#topic opens14:16
efriedExtraction14:16
efried#link extraction etherpad: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/placement-extract-stein14:16
efried#link extraction ML thread (when should it happen? what should the status/position of the project be?) http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2018-August/133445.html14:16
efriedcdent/edleafe: what's the latest?14:16
*** openstack changes topic to "opens (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)"14:16
efried(I hear the etherpad may be temporarily busted?14:16
efried)14:16
edleafeWe have a working repo14:16
edleafeOnce you apply cdent's PR14:17
edleafe#link https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/pull/314:17
edleafeIOW, tests passing14:17
mriedemso,14:18
cdent#link de-placement-ed nova https://review.openstack.org/#/c/596291/14:18
cdenthas been updated to use the latest pull14:18
mriedemis the proposal to seed the repo with a big pull request rather than a series of changes in gerrit?14:18
mriedemlike,14:18
mriedemcouldn't we extract to a repo and have non-voting CI jobs until the changes that make it work?14:18
mriedemand then make them voting?14:18
edleafemriedem: that would be.... tedious14:19
edleafeMost of the changes I made are from a script14:19
dansmithwe *have* to do that I think14:19
mriedembut it would be correctly using our code review system in openstack14:19
cdentwe're not losing any history by doing it the way the experiments have been done thus far14:19
edleafeThe plan was to get tests passing first, and then push the extracted repo14:19
cdentwe just aren't creating that history in gerrit14:19
dansmithIMHO, we have to extract to a repo, have changes against CI jobs that use the alternate repo instead of the nova stuff,14:19
dansmithand then delete the nova stuff once we're not using it anymore14:19
edleafedansmith: that's exactly what this is14:19
mriedemi'm confused14:20
mriedemhttps://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/pull/3/commits/a7805ca13a98e3a25876285c37d603aee9c65c3f is a github-only change right?14:20
dansmithedleafe: okay I thought you were implying that making the CI jobs work against the split was "tedious"14:20
edleafedansmith: No, I meant doing a small change, pushing to gerrit, doing another small change, etc.14:21
mriedembut that's totally not following our community dev policy14:21
dansmithoh okay, yeah I don't think that can happen14:21
mriedemwhich is reviews in gerrit14:21
edleafemriedem: there isn't a repo to review yet14:21
mriedemit looks to me like this is (1) fork nova repo, (2) remove nova stuff (3) pull request in fixes to make placement tests pass14:21
mriedemwith the eventual plan to (4) seed the openstack/placement repo based on that repo from github14:22
edleafe2) and 3) are intertwined14:22
edleafebut yeah14:22
dansmithI don't think I understand why 2 and 3 are intertwined14:22
cdentmriedem: yes, that's what's been discussed for a few weeks on the (now broken etherpad) and in the several emails and blog posts associated with this stuff. What is your preference?14:22
mriedemso i guess my point is i think the core team should be involved in reviewing these changes14:23
mriedemin gerrit14:23
mriedemnot github pull requests14:23
edleafedansmith: a lot of the test failures come from imports that reference the nova directory structure14:23
cdentmriedem: we can do that if you want, but as most of it is very mechanical it seemed... wasteful?14:23
cdentmriedem: but it sounds like you want (correct me if I'm wrong please):14:24
edleafeIsn't that the point of having tests?14:24
cdent1. use the filter script14:24
cdent2. seed a broken repo14:24
cdent3. incremental review and fix things14:24
mriedemis there more?14:24
cdent4. add some tests at the end14:25
cdenteof14:25
cdents/add/automate/14:25
mriedem4) is also getting tempest-full / devstack working with the placement repo?14:25
cdentyes14:25
mriedem5) drop code from nova?14:25
mriedemthat's more inline with what i was expecting yes,14:25
cdentI was leaving 5 out of the picture entirely for now as it seemed like a "we'll visit that when we get there"14:25
mriedemedleafe's repo was an experimental is my understanding14:26
mriedem*experiment14:26
edleafemriedem: It was more like a work area that we knew would be messy14:26
cdentso the reason we didn't 3 was because of what I said before about mechanical14:26
cdentand messy14:26
mriedemi think messy is ok14:26
mriedemi don't really think "fork into ed's github repo, do stuff, voila here is a thing" is the right way to do this per community norms14:27
edleafemriedem: what exactly do you think a review will entail?14:27
mriedemit goes against (1) our code review system of using gerrit and (2) our core review team14:27
cdentI guess I wasn't really expecting that people would think of it that way, mriedem: the expectation was that people like you would come and look at ed's repo too14:27
mriedemlooking at https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/pull/3 these are individual commits14:27
mriedemso why wouldn't the same be pushed to gerrit?14:27
cdentthey _can_ be. But I thought we were saving some hassle by doing it "outside". Apparently not.14:28
mriedemi was out for a week and don't read all the personal blog posts from everyone, so i'm coming in late,14:28
mriedembut this is my 2 cents14:28
edleafemriedem: There are a couple dozen commits there. The initial commit I pushed has about that many steps. So are you saying that you want to commit at least 2 nova cores to review around 50 patches?14:29
mriedemit looks like the wrinkles have been ironed out in the github repo,14:29
mriedemand could easily be transitioned into a working repo with gerrit14:29
mriedemlook, i'm one person14:29
mriedemi don't like the idea of doing this in github, outside gerrit and our core team, and then using it to seed the official openstack namespaced repo14:30
mriedembut if majority rules and doesn't want to deal with the incremental changes in gerrit, whatever14:30
cdentefried, jaypipes, alex_xu : thoughts?14:31
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edleafeI would think that the core team's time could be better spent14:31
jaypipessorry, I need to read back.14:31
mriedemmelwitt should probably also at least be aware of the direction here and alternatives14:32
edleafemriedem: just to be clear: there are no logical changes being made. Just pathing updates for the updated directory structure14:33
efriedWell, I said a lot of the same things last week, but phrased as questions, and was satisfied with the answers.14:33
edleafeAnd changing some docs to only keep the placement-specific part14:33
edleafe*pars14:33
efriedMy understanding was that the commit history would still be available for anyone to look at.14:34
edleafeefried: yep14:34
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edleafeWhat you won't see is the gyrations needed to restructure placement from the way it is in Nova14:35
efriedso14:35
mriedemwell we have 2 +2s for a reason, so i figure this is no different if it's openstack14:35
mriedemshould i just air out my concerns in the ML thread on this so we can move on or...?14:35
efriedwhat I expressed before was that being able to see, in a gerrit review, the steps from raw to working, would be useful.14:35
cdentso, we can do it in gerrit, just the existing patches14:36
edleafemriedem: I haven't gotten an answer from you on the question of whether you are committing 2 nova cores to review 50 or so patches in a timely fashion?14:36
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mriedemedleafe: i can help, it's not going to be my sole focus day in and out, but i'm sure efried is also going to be on board to help with that14:37
mriedemi can't speak for others really14:37
cdentbut in order to do that we're going to need more concerted help from the entire nova group with regard to the repo setup, understanding zuul, etc. The current style was a shortcut to step into the future without needing to recruit as many people14:37
efriedLike, as a placement core, I would like to be able to approve that initial seed patch by comparing base with PS<N> to see that e.g. 'import nova.api.openstack.placement.foo' was replaced with 'import placement.foo' but the guts of that file weren't changed.14:37
edleafeefried: so the initial commit to openstack/placement would be the full nova code base?14:37
efriedI don't necessarily think we need to deviate much from the current process to make that happen.14:37
efriededleafe: Nah, I think it would be adequate if it was just the selected files, but in their form as they exist in nova initially.14:38
mriedemlike i said,14:38
mriedemnon-voting test jobs until it's passing14:38
efriedi.e. I don't need to see fifty thousand file deletes between base and PS1. But I also don't want to see a couple hundred file adds with no delta context.14:38
mriedemwith the series of incremental changes to get there14:38
edleafeI do feel like this is going to be a major time suck on the cores14:39
efriedwell, I don't think we need to span multiple change sets to go from seed to working.14:39
efriedI think we should do that in one change set.14:39
edleafewait.. what? You want a huge patch?14:39
efriedHeck, I think we could even do it in one patch set.14:39
mriedemthat's gonna be hard to review14:39
edleafetalk about going against the way we do things in openstack14:39
efriedum14:39
efriedsorry, maybe I've been misunderstanding how the repo would get seeded.14:40
efriedWe need an initial change set with all the file adds, no?14:40
efriedit wasn't just going to... spring into existence already populated, with nobody reviewing or approving, was it?14:40
jaypipesFTR, I agree with mriedem and would prefer to review Gerrit patches for this.14:40
edleafeefried: a quick and dirty check showed that the single patch would be 23,000 lines14:41
edleafejaypipes: and will you also commit to reviewing them?14:41
jaypipesedleafe: yes, but as I have repeatedly said on this topic, they will take lower priority to other nova items.14:42
efriededleafe: how many files?14:42
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edleafeefried: 41014:43
edleafejaypipes: This feels like a huge roadblock14:43
jaypipesI was under the impression that cdent and edleafe were experimenting with extraction automation/scripts in the GH repo and that we weren't actually going to be importing said GH repo as "the new placement".14:43
edleafejaypipes: the GH repo was so that we could see what each other was doing14:44
cdentI'm a little confused. Do we have confidence that the placement tests test placement well and represent "the placement functionality"?14:44
jaypipesedleafe: I've been 100% upfront about that since cdent originally began discussing extraction.14:44
edleafecdent: obviously not14:44
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jaypipesedleafe: ack. and I was fine with the GH collaboration/experimentation.14:44
jaypipesedleafe: I just didn't realize the plan was to make that GH repo the seed for a new placement.14:44
efriedSo here's what I would like to see:14:44
efried- One change set.14:44
efried- The initial patch set of that change should be the 410 files from nova in their raw form. I should be able to do a diff -r with nova (with whatever the flaggyflag is to ignore missing files), and get effectively no output.14:44
efried- Then the second patch set of that same change should be the resolved thingy that edleafe and cdent have been working out in the github repo. Now I can diff base with PS2 and see e.g. file renames and changes in import lines but effectively nothing else.14:44
edleafeok, then I'll start working on a step-by-step patch series, starting with the results of the history-preserving extraction script14:45
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mriedemefried: i don't love that14:45
edleafeAnd I agree with Jay that this will all be lower priority, and will most likely languish14:45
efriedperhaps I'm not understanding what you're suggesting, then.14:45
mriedem"The initial patch set of that change should be the 410 files from nova in their raw form. I should be able to do a diff -r with nova (with whatever the flaggyflag is to ignore missing files), and get effectively no output."14:46
jaypipesedleafe: it's not my priority, sorry.14:46
mriedemcool, agree, change 114:46
mriedemthen separate changes to make things work, as i'm seeing in this pull request in githu14:46
mriedem*github14:46
mriedemotherwise there isn't really a point in doing it in gerrit if it's so big i can't review it coherently14:46
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cdentI'm a little confused on whether efried and mriedem are using the same definition of terms for 'patch set' and 'change set'14:46
edleafemriedem: agree that huge patches suck14:47
mriedembefore anyone goes off and doing anything,14:47
cdentI think what we are talking about is a stack of 25-50ish individual reviews14:47
mriedemi would like to first reply on the latest extraction ML thread to clarify understanding and raise the issue14:47
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efriedYeah, see, I don't see the point in multiple *change sets* for the initial seed repo.14:47
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cdentmriedem: if you're inclined, use the thread with "(technical)" in the subject?14:47
mriedemyes that's the one i was going to use14:48
cdentefried: so you're disagreeing with mriedem, or no, still not clear14:48
efriedI.e. I don't get why we need to merge patently broken code initially.14:48
mriedemto sanely review the differences to get to working14:49
mriedemclearly https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/pull/3 is made of individual commits14:49
mriedemfor similar reasons14:49
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mriedemnot just "here is 1 patch with 50 or some logical changes"14:49
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mriedemlooks like it's more around ~30 changes14:50
mriedemgiven ed's 2 here https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commits/master14:50
edleafemriedem: you've also got to take into account my initial push14:50
mriedemisn't that https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commit/e3173faf59bd1453c3800b2bf57c2af8cfde1697 ?14:51
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edleafemriedem: Like I said, there were at least a couple dozen steps from the hsotory filter to that push14:51
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mriedemso you would also post those in gerrit or not?14:52
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edleafeIf the idea is that you want to see what changed from the original files to the placement repo, then yes14:52
edleafeTo clarify, I don't *want* to post them to gerrit14:53
mriedemhttps://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commit/e3173faf59bd1453c3800b2bf57c2af8cfde1697 itself might be ok14:53
edleafeI think this is a huge waste of time14:53
edleafeBut I'm being outvoted14:53
mriedemi was thinking more https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commit/e3173faf59bd1453c3800b2bf57c2af8cfde1697 + https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commit/e984bef8587009378ea430dd1c12ca3e40a3c901 + what's in https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/pull/314:53
efriedBeing able to "see what changed from the original files to the placement repo" is all I care about. But I don't think we get benefit from splitting it into a couple dozen change sets.14:53
edleafeMy first commit was abandoned, and I force pushed the second. Like I said, this was supposed to be a messy work area14:53
cdentmriedem: you understand the change in pull/3 are basically the same as the changes in pull/2 except broken apart so people can have insight into what's going on, yeah?14:54
efriedIMO there's no reason for gerrit to contain "show your work" info.14:54
edleafeefried: So you'd be able to review something like https://github.com/EdLeafe/placement/commit/e3173faf59bd1453c3800b2bf57c2af8cfde1697 ?14:54
mriedemsure, an experimental repo to mess around and see what works is fine, and that's what i thought this was doing; i didn't expect this to eventually be "ok here we go - official placement"14:54
cdent(the main different is that we chose to have some different paths for modules)14:54
cdentit's still a seed14:55
cdentbecause until it is gating it isn't anything14:55
mriedemedleafe: that change is mostly file moves and deleting nova stuff right?14:55
edleafemriedem: we learn as we go. Once we have it figured out, then we re-run the steps and push clean to the openstack repo14:55
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edleafemriedem: and some import pathing changes14:55
mriedemsure that's all pretty trivial to review14:55
edleafethat's the point - it *is* trivial. What needs to be reviewed is the final product14:56
efriedright. So no need to do it in a zillion change sets.14:56
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mriedemedleafe: so how would you expect me to review the final product? pull it down and diff it against the nova repo?14:56
mriedemor just not review it at all and assume that if tests are passing it's good enough?14:57
edleafeOh, I dunno - see that the tests are all there, and that they are passing?14:57
efriededleafe: I would be reviewing such a thing by diffing against nova, yes. And then the next delta I would be able to mostly skim, because it would comprise mostly renames and import changes, and the evidence that it's fully mechanically correct is that it passes tests.14:57
mriedemby that logic i don't need to review any changes ever right?14:57
edleafeUnless you don't have confidence in the tests, of course14:57
mriedemas long as tests pass14:57
cdenti have to leave very soon to get physio on my shoulder. jaypipes was internet contagious. it is also a holiday today for me, so i'm not really coming back today. Can people please be sure that whatever is decided today it gets reflected on the email thread?14:57
efriedyes14:57
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edleafeYeah, I think I'll find something else to occupy myself today14:58
efriedmriedem: Skimming to assure myself that what changed was imports not content, plus tests passing, equals approval in this case, yes.14:58
mriedem"what changed was imports not content" is what i mostly care about14:58
efriedextending that to "any change ever" is obviously spurious14:58
mriedemand why we do reviews14:58
efriedAnd I don't see the point in splitting that across multiple change sets.14:59
mriedemso with <1 minute,14:59
efriedIs that the only thing we're discussing here?14:59
mriedemi can reply with the options to the ML thread14:59
edleafeBe sure to include the load on the nova cores in that post14:59
efried#endmeeting15:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/"15:00
mriedemyou can review my post and include it if i missed something :P15:00
openstackMeeting ended Mon Aug 27 15:00:14 2018 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)15:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2018/nova_scheduler.2018-08-27-14.00.html15:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2018/nova_scheduler.2018-08-27-14.00.txt15:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2018/nova_scheduler.2018-08-27-14.00.log.html15:00
efriededleafe, cdent: I would like to understand the freeze thing, can we continue in -placement?15:00
edleafesure15:00
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