Thursday, 2011-02-17

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jmckentyAll: I have to multitask through the POC meeting, unfortunately, IRL I'm having lunch with an advisor.20:59
jmckentyWhich means I'll be cut down to just 0.02, rather than my usual $2.0020:59
jbrycewe'll probably still survive21:00
openstackMeeting started Thu Feb 17 21:00:42 2011 UTC.  The chair is jbryce. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.21:00
* creiht bows21:00
vishyjesse and I only have 1/2 hour as well21:00
vishyso lets go quick :)21:00
jbrycefine with me...agenda is here:
jbryce#topic Image format proposal21:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Image format proposal"21:01
jbryceafter the meeting last week, john circulated some additional comments and clarification on the image format proposal. did you all see that thread?21:02
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jbryceit seems like ewan got his questions answered and the initial scope of the image interchange format is narrowed to interop between openstack clouds21:03
jbryceare there any other outstanding questions or concerns on that proposal?21:03
vishyno it lgtm21:03
dendrobatesme too21:03
jbryceok...let's take a vote on approving it21:04
* creiht doesn't vote as I have no background in this area21:04
* soren is here, too :)21:05
jbrycevishy, jmckenty: any desire to vote?21:05
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vishyoh sorry thought my lgtm counted21:06
jbryceewanmellor: hi ewan...we were just voting on the image format proposal now that john circulated the updated comments21:06
ewanmellorSorry I'm late -- my last call overran.21:06
ewanmellorThat was meant to be a +1 ;-)21:06
ewanmellorBut now it looks like I'm _really_ in favour!21:06
dendrobatesbtw, there had been some licensing concerns about vhd.  RS legal and outside FOSS legal has looked at it and said we are fine21:06
jbryce#agreed ImageFormat proposal approved with 6 approves21:07
ewanmellorGood -- Citrix is already shipping open-source VHD code, so it would be a shame if that wasn't legal!21:07
jbryceall right...moving on21:07
jbryce#topic versioning and minor releases21:07
*** openstack changes topic to "versioning and minor releases"21:07
jbryce#info proposal floated last week was that all projects should line up for the major releases on a fixed time schedule but that individual projects would have the flexibility to do an intermediate release if the core team felt it was needed. the release manager would facilitate the process and work to ensure quality21:08
jbrycethis seems to be the general approach that we are following currently with the one-off for bexar in nova21:09
vishyI'm ok with that, we definitely need a .1 release in nova, there are some pretty nasty bugs21:09
jesse_I like this approach - what does swift thing?21:09
creihtjesse_: it was my idea :)21:09
creiht+1 for me21:09
jesse_sorry, was on a plane last week ...21:10
creihtwe will likely want to do a 1.2.1 release in the near future21:10
jbrycei'm ok with the proposal to give projects the flexibility to do what they need to, but i think it would be good to flesh out some sort of additional plan that makes it a little more clear how we work with downstream distributors21:11
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jbryceso creiht, jesse_, vishy are all on board--do the rest of you have any thoughts on it?21:12
jesse_jbryce: is this something that we can say for the next two releases21:13
dendrobateswe need a plan to support releases21:13
dendrobatescreating releases is easy21:13
creihtdendrobates: yeah that is the next step once we decide that we are going to have point releases21:13
jesse_jbryce: and re-evaluate post-diablo21:13
creihtdendrobates: I think that should be up to the individual projects as well21:13
dendrobatesmaybe, but is there is a combined integrated release, people expect the same support period21:14
jbrycecreiht: i think it would be nice for there to be some consistency at that level across openstack projects. if i'm a user, i would prefer to have at least a general idea of what to expect in terms of ongoing support and patching across all the projects21:14
jbryceespecially in terms of timing...if swift eols every 6 months and nova every 18 months and i'm using them both, that would be a pain21:15
creihtIn my view the point releases would be bug fix/security fixes only21:15
creihtnot features21:15
creihtjbryce: ahh good point21:16
sorencreiht: Certainly.21:16
dendrobatesI agree, but for how long are you going to release bug fixes for a major release?  that is where we need to standardize21:16
sorenI can see why there might be some divergence here.21:16
sorenSwift is way more mature than Nova. Doing bug fix releases further back makes more sense for Swift.21:17
creihtWhat I was thinking for swift is that we would support the last released version21:17
soren...or not :)21:17
sorenOk :)21:17
jbryce3 month eol cycle21:17
creihtI don't see many more big number releases for swift down the road21:17
creihtWe are even stretching to call cactus a 1.3 release for swift21:18
* soren puts that in a Quotes file.21:18
sorenI *know* that will come in handy some day :)21:18
jbryceso...i kind of like jesse_'s idea where we say for the next two release cycles we leave it up to the projects and during that time, come up with a unified plan that will be the default across projects21:18
jesse_around that time is when distros will start playing a major role21:19
dendrobatesI really like the way kvm handled supporting releases when they started out21:19
creihtI expect this to change down the road as all the projects mature more, and as more projects are brought in21:19
jesse_dendrobates: how was that?21:19
dendrobatesthey made the distros do any packporting, until the rate of change slowed21:19
creihtIf nothing else, the backporting/point releases makes it easier for us to manage swift releases to RS21:20
dendrobatessoren did kvm backporting for ubuntu until the started maintaining a stable branch21:20
jbrycewe don't have very broad distribution support right now21:21
sorenNor did kvm :)21:22
dendrobateswe will soon, both fedora and ubuntu21:22
sorenAnd Debian.21:22
creihtWhen that happens, we can re-evaluate :)21:23
jbrycewe seem to already have quite a few users who are not consuming it through a distro21:23
jesse_creiht: +121:23
jesse_as openstack + distro story matures we shoudl re-evalute21:23
dendrobatesand then once the rate of feature change slows we should reevaluate again21:24
jesse_sounds good21:24
jbryce#info revised proposal is to allow project core teams to decide to do point releases, facilitated by the release manager up to the diablo release21:24
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jbryce#info follow up with a unified release plan that takes into accounts division of upstream/downstream labor and support time frames21:25
jbrycecan we vote on the revised proposal?21:26
jbryce#agree revised proposal agreed to with 6 approves21:27
jbryce#action jbryce to document and add to wiki21:27
jbryceso we've only got a couple of minutes before several have to we want to postpone the other items and meet again next week?21:27
jbrycei'm sure jesse and vish agree since they have to leave. = )21:29
jesse_although we might be able to keep going with 2 meetings at once21:30
jbrycesoren, ewanmellor: do you guys want us to try to alternate meeting times to something that's more normal for you?21:30
ewanmellorI'll be in Santa Clara next week.21:31
sorenjbryce: Possibly.21:31
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sorenjbryce: I've tried that a number of times, but it usually just ends up being at dinner time which is way worse than late evening.21:32
jbrycesoren: are you utc+1?21:32
sorenjbryce: At the moment, yes.21:33
sorenFor another month and a half.21:33
ewanmellorsoren: Where are you going?21:33
sorenThe Earth is.21:34
soren(DST change)21:34
jbrycewell...i'm open to whatever as far as the time. i think you two have the biggest offset, so let us know if you want to alternate and make jesse, vish and josh wake up early for a change.21:35
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* jbryce offended jmckenty and he left21:35
jbrycefor now, we'll plan on same time next thursday. i'll send out a note and the leftover agenda items.21:36
jbrycethanks guys!21:36
*** openstack changes topic to "Openstack Meetings: | Minutes:"21:36
openstackMeeting ended Thu Feb 17 21:36:38 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)21:36
openstackMinutes (text):
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