Thursday, 2011-02-24

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jbrycenot sure we're going to have enough to do it today21:00
jbrycewe can give everybody a few minutes21:01
jbrycedid you get a chance to look at the temporary release proposal in the wiki?21:01
dendrobatesno, I didn't.  Looking now21:03
jbrycejust wanted to make sure i captured everything correctly21:04
dendrobateswhere is it?21:05
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jbryceInterrante: hey, mark! we're waiting to see if we're going to have enough show up today--i had a couple say they would be unavailable21:06
InterranteOk. Makes sense21:06
vishyjesse is trying to connnect21:07
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anotherjesse`/msg nickserv identify another121:09
dendrobateshappens to the best of us  :)21:10
openstackMeeting started Thu Feb 24 21:10:44 2011 UTC.  The chair is jbryce. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.21:10
jbryceagenda located at
jbryce#topic Google Summer of Code21:11
*** openstack changes topic to "Google Summer of Code"21:11
vishyI liked termie's suggestion, which was to skip GSoC this year21:12
jbryce#info Ewan wanted us to discuss participation (or non-participation) in GSOC21:12
vishyI don't think we have anyone with enough time to mentor atm21:12
jbrycei believe that was dendrobates preference as well21:12
anotherjesseI agree .. I'd love to participate21:12
anotherjessebut timing21:12
dendrobatesyes, and that half-assing it would be detrimental21:13
vishyme too, i think it would be really fun but I am stretched too thin21:13
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jbryceok. so it sounds like our recommendation is to skip it this year.21:13
InterranteSkip is my preference21:14
jbryce#agreed Skip participation (with our regrets) in Google Summer of Code this year due to lack of resources availability21:14
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jbryce#topic Incubation/new project process21:15
*** openstack changes topic to "Incubation/new project process"21:15
jbrycewe had a proposal a couple of weeks ago to open up the new project/incubation process to a more organic, community driven method21:16
anotherjessejbryce: is there a summary of the proposal?21:16
dendrobatesI think we need criteria for inclusion, at least21:16
vishywe can start with just a wiki page for related projects21:16
anotherjessedendrobates: the projects naming can't be "openstack FOO" until done with incubation21:17
vishythen draft a incubation proposal process21:17
anotherjessedendrobates: what criteria would you propose?21:17
dendrobatesI mean what is the scope of openstack.    What is appropriate to be part of openstack at all.21:18
anotherjessedendrobates: something being in incubation needs to not imply that it is "part of openstack"21:18
dendrobatesbut it does imply that it could be21:18
anotherjesseit is more "affiliated with openstack" and a statement from the incubated project that they want to be part eventually21:18
jbrycevishy: anyone could do a wiki already. i think people who are looking at including their projects are looking for that incubation process21:18
anotherjessebut they have to earn it21:18
anotherjessedendrobates: I kinda like the idea of how plugins happen to rails/django/...21:19
jbrycethe other part we had discussed was a style directory that would give some indication about the quality/popularity of the projects21:19
anotherjessehaving a large community and when projects get enough momentum/support they can be migrated into core21:20
dendrobatesI don't think popularity is a good measure21:20
Interrante+1. On django style approach21:20
dendrobatesI'm not familar with how django does it21:20
dendrobatesmy other concern is about killing a healthy ecosystem by choosing one member to be official.21:22
anotherjessedendrobates: right - that is my concern as well21:22
anotherjessedendrobates: my hope is that our process is more of a community process21:23
anotherjessewhere people decide that using X + Y + Core is a good deploy of openstack21:23
dendrobatesanotherjesse: I agree, but I think we need to publish some guidelines21:23
anotherjessedendrobates: part of the idea is that things need to live in the community for a period (3+ months?) and get community adoption before it is decided to be added to core21:24
anotherjessewe can separate the discussion about the requirements for incubation and becoming an official part of openstack21:25
jbryceincubation isn't really incubation then, though. it's just a directory of related software.21:25
dendrobatesunless there is a path out, then it is incubation.21:26
jbrycethings are incubated to make it to an end state. and it involves actions along the way21:27
anotherjessethe path exists, it is just not formal ;)21:27
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dendrobatesmaybe there are multiple paths, one to become part of core, and one to some other state, i.e. affiliated21:28
anotherjessethe idea of having a directory of related pojects21:29
anotherjesseis probably generally agreeable21:29
anotherjesseand in the end probably becoming part of openstack == POC vote?21:29
jbrycei don't think there's much to agreeing that we should have a listing of software related to openstack. anyone can do that--list in the wiki or otherwise. i think the difficult part is how do things move to being more officially "openstack" and that's what people want to have us give direction on21:30
vishyi don't know if there is much "discussion" possible here21:32
vishysomeone needs to just come up with a basic proposal that we can straw-man against21:32
anotherjessethe idea that in the end it is a POC vote - agreeable?21:32
anotherjesseif so, we can figure out the middle :)21:33
dendrobatesanotherjesse: yes21:33
jbryce#agreed A directory would be a useful way of exposing related projects21:33
jbryce#agree to become an official openstack project requires a POC vote21:34
jbryce#todo determine the process and criteria by which the POC would evaluate and vote on a project for inclusion21:34
jbrycevishy: i did lay a strawman out back in october or whenever. do we want to start there or start from scratch?21:35
vishywe can start there21:35
jbryceok...i'll send that around again and we can discuss how to improve21:36
jbryce#topic Standards body activity21:36
*** openstack changes topic to "Standards body activity"21:36
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anotherjessestandards are good - let's go shopping!21:36
anotherjesseerr, hard21:37
dendrobatesI think the standards bodies are distractions21:37
jbrycebret piatt has been talking with most of these standards bodies and put together a proposal to form a committee of people who wanted to participate in these on openstack's behalf (rather than him continuing to do it alone)21:38
vishyproposal seems fine21:38
vishyas long as i don't need to be on the comittee21:38
jbrycei'd propose it be volunteer driven21:38
anotherjessethat's what speakphone + mute is for21:38
anotherjessejbryce: ya21:39
jbrycewe've lost mark--that puts us down to only 421:41
anotherjessejbryce: we should probably require that the members don't speak on behalf of openstack21:41
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vishymy battery is toast21:41
vishyi'll look over jesse's shoulder21:41
dendrobatesI think the goal should be to follow the stds and report back to the community, while advocating for openstack21:42
anotherjessedendrobates: my only concern is that if it is any volunteer, they could mis-represent openstack21:43
dendrobatesanotherjesse: I agree21:43
jbrycefollowing and reporting back shouldn't present problems21:43
dendrobatesand those organizations tend to be very political21:43
anotherjessemight be too corporate -- but we could have a statement on the website that "opinions from community members may not reflect those of openstack"21:44
jbrycewhat if there's something that it would be good for openstack to be represented (not mis-represented on)21:45
dendrobateswell than what opinions do represent openstack?21:45
jbryceperhaps the committee chair should be approved by the POC and be responsible for laying out the official positions/opinions that the members are supposed to propagate?21:46
dendrobatessince we all have different opinions I don't know what official openstack opinions are.21:47
jbryceok. i'll toss this back to bret and see if he has a suggestion21:48
anotherjessedendrobates: I think that is healthy21:48
dendrobatesI think we need to avoid the appearance of openstack opinions == rackspace opinions21:48
dendrobatesanotherjesse: me too21:48
anotherjessedendrobates: just as long as an individual's opinion is not interpretted as the openstack standard21:48
dendrobatesI don't want fox news style talking points21:48
jbryce#topic next meeting time21:49
*** openstack changes topic to "next meeting time"21:49
dendrobatessame bat time, sams bat channel?21:50
jbrycewe're missing several, so we'll probably move this to the mailing list, but i'm traveling next thursday. so we can go ahead and let someone else chair, move to a different day next week, or skip21:50
anotherjesse13 days from now? (a wednesday)21:50
Interrante13 good for me21:51
anotherjesseMar 7th21:51
anotherjesseerr, Mar 9th21:51
jbryceif we push that far, any reason not to just do it on thursday the 10th in our regular time?21:52
dendrobatesnope, wfm21:52
anotherjesse1pm PDT is hard for vish & I21:52
anotherjesseif we did it an hour earlier it would work better21:53
anotherjesse(vish & I have sprint planning at 1:30pm PDT)21:53
dendrobatesprobably better for ewan and soren too21:53
jbrycefine with me. i'll send a note out to the list21:53
anotherjessejbryce: email about noon PDT thursday march 10th21:53
InterranteGood for me21:53
jbryceanyone have anything else?21:53
jbrycethanks for the time21:54
*** openstack changes topic to "Openstack Meetings: | Minutes:"21:54
openstackMeeting ended Thu Feb 24 21:54:48 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)21:54
openstackMinutes (text):
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