Tuesday, 2011-10-11

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nati2no ci meeting today?19:41
mtaylornati2: sorry - I got caught up in some other stuff19:42
nati2gotcha :)19:42
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znsAre we meeting? THe wiki said Tue Oct 12th. I have seen evidence that it's Oct 11th today…20:01
devcamcari thought we were ...20:03
devcamcarnm just saw a message from jbryce in my inbox20:03
devcamcartoday is cancelled20:03
markvoelkerzns: I think everyone is still hung over^H^H^H^H^H^H^H unpacking from the summit. =)20:03
pvoI'm here if we are20:06
jk0looks like we're skipping this week20:06
pvoI don't think my PPB emails are forwarding correctly20:06
znspvo: What's a PPB email?20:06
pvothe ppb list that jonathan sends to.20:06
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znsI didn't know there was one. Does he manage it or do I need to join it?20:06
pvomay need to be added: openstack-poc@lists.launchpad.net20:06
znsLooks like we've been added. Tx.20:07
znsmarkvoelker: there were some great parties...20:08
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bcwaldonttx: I'm standing in for jaypipes today21:00
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ttxbcwaldon: I know.21:00
glencI'm standing in something, too, but I'd rather not say what21:00
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bcwaldonttx: just making sure ;)21:00
ttxzns, vishy, devcamcar: around ?21:00
ttxok, let's start, hopefully zns will catch up21:01
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openstackMeeting started Tue Oct 11 21:02:01 2011 UTC.  The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.21:02
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.21:02
ttxWelcome everyone... Today's agenda is at:21:02
ttx#link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/TeamMeeting21:02
ttxPlease all make liberal use of #<command> for a richer meeting summary:21:02
ttxlink (for links), info, idea (for notes), action (for TODOs), and help (for calls for help)21:02
mtaylor#agreed everyone should use #<command> for a richer meeting summary21:02
mtaylor#info link (for links), info, idea (for notes), action (for TODOs), and help (for calls for help)21:03
ttxmtaylor: actually, only the chair can use agreed :P21:03
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ttx#topic Design Summit feedback21:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Design Summit feedback"21:03
Vekhaha :)21:03
ttxSo, last week we had the Design Summit21:03
ttxI hope mostly everyone made it back home now21:03
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comstudhome but still hung over.21:04
ttxWe didn't have a closing feedback session, mostly due to the start of the Conference21:04
ttxWhile memories are still fresh, do you have any comment ?21:04
anotherjessettx: I feel that sessions more on "bugs" / issues would be useful - in addition to forward looking blueprints (although that might be an issue of misuse of blueprints?)21:04
* mtaylor thought that the Design Summit was rather productive this time21:04
mtayloranotherjesse: actually, I think that's the RIGHT use of blueprints21:04
anotherjessettx: the ec2 api session was an example of one that was very tactical21:04
ttxanotherjesse: some people propsoed that we have a pre-event that is more backward looking21:05
patelnawe should create a bluerprint for bugs21:05
ttxbut still technical21:05
bcwaldonanotherjesse: really? It was basically a discussion around why we support EC2 at all. I don't think it hit it's original purpose of the feature gap21:05
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ttxanotherjesse: something where we would present technical stuff so that most attendees are up to snuff when the design summit starts21:05
westmaasI think a session on how to handle a room full of 80 people, where 20 of those people want to talk, may be useful.21:05
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ttxDo you think we should run a SurveyMonkey thing to gather more precise feedback ?21:06
anotherjessettx: yes, that was another comment - that while core developers know roughly how everything works, outsiders don't have context to join21:06
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mtaylorI think we're getting to the point where more sessions, in more parallel that are smaller in scope would be helpful (getting closer to uds style)21:06
westmaasttx: survey monkey would be good21:06
mtaylorand if we're at the point where there are 8 folks who need to be in all of the sessions, perhaps that's a good incentive for more delegation21:07
patelna#idea - survey monkey...good one21:07
anotherjessebcwaldon: I didn't see it that way - I thought it was about "we use ec2 api, why does it have bugs" - beside the point though21:07
ttx#action ttx to set up some survey monkey for summit feedback21:07
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ttx#idea more sessions, in more parallel that are smaller in scope would be helpful21:08
ttx#idea pre-event that is more backward looking21:08
medberry+1 on more smaller sessions21:08
mchow#idea some context setting session at the begining for newcomers21:08
ttxvishy: since you were the critical path, do you think you can handle more parallelization ?21:09
comstudwe need to work on human cloning?21:09
vishyi think breaking out the working groups will help21:09
patelnahahahaha like that one21:09
vishylike block storage, etc.21:10
ttx#action ttx to ask powers that be about next design summit location plans21:10
mtaylor#idea have a week long design summit without conference co-location21:10
glencI like that y'all created an index of etherpad pages, but it would have been nice to have had that in advance so that people unable to attend could follow along.21:10
comstudmtaylor +121:10
mtaylorglenc: +121:10
rjhwhere is said index?21:10
ttxglenc: actually, the wifi was so bad etherpad was a bit difficult21:11
anotherjesse#idea internet is important for a tech conference21:11
KumarKR_HP#are these sessions recorded?21:11
mtayloralso, uds carries an IRC room for each topic on the agenda and has that irc room on one of the projectors in the room so that people can attend rooms remotely as well21:11
mtayloranotherjesse: ++21:11
ttxanotherjesse: hopefully next time we can get rid of the conference pairing, which should allow to go to some lab or university, which have generally good coverage21:11
devcamcarworst conference wifi ever21:11
vishyglenc: we had serious connectivity issues for the conference21:12
ttxdevcamcar: I had worse.21:12
mtaylornot to keep talking about UDS ... but the uds guys apparently ensure that all locations they use have at least a 45 meg connection that they can be handed21:12
mtaylorand then they run their own wifi on top of that connection21:12
ttxmtaylor: they arrive 10 days before the event to set it up21:12
ttxmtaylor: you propose to do that ?21:12
mtaylorit might not be a terrible idea to just use hotels that we know uds has been at before, so we can steal their research :)21:12
anotherjessemtaylor: if you like how they do it so much, why don't you go there ...21:12
bcwaldon#idea copy uds wifi setup21:12
anotherjesseas well ;)21:12
mtaylorttx: sure. being in a place for a week without proper internet is kind of crappy21:13
mtayloranotherjesse: I will!21:13
medberryUDS folks tell the hosting venue that each participant will consume 6 wifi connections and to plan accordingly.21:13
ttxok, that's good feedback21:13
medberry(and then we bring our own wifi gear as well.)21:13
pvoI guess I shouldn't have torrented the whole time21:13
ttxwill do surveymonkey for more21:13
mtaylormedberry: ++21:13
mtaylormedberry: you wanna set up our venue for us? :)21:13
mtaylorttx: I know we can't actually co-locate with uds because of timing21:14
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medberrymtaylor, my mifi isn't going to handle that load either. :^)21:14
ttxready for next topic ?21:14
* medberry was tethered all week though21:14
mtaylorttx: but what if we went to the same venue they were about to go to just a few weeks earlier ... and then figure out if we can share the setup costs for the infrastructure with canonical21:14
mtaylorthat way the venue would only have to outfitted once21:15
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ttxmtaylor: they basically set up their own, separate from the hotel.21:15
mtaylorit would be like, I don't know - collaboration!21:15
mtaylorttx: I know21:15
mtaylorttx: we could rent it from them or something21:15
ttxmtaylor: don't want to be the one that asks elmo to come 3 weeks early.21:15
mtaylorttx: I'll do it :)21:15
ttxok, next topic21:15
ttx#topic EssexReleaseSchedule final discussion21:15
*** openstack changes topic to "EssexReleaseSchedule final discussion"21:15
ttxBased on the session we had at the Design Summit, I updated the page at:21:15
ttx#link http://wiki.openstack.org/EssexReleaseSchedule21:16
ttxThe main change from Diablo is that we have a "RC at will" period starting after the last milestone...21:16
ttx...where each project produces release candidates until one is deemed good enough for release (and open the next cycle)21:16
ttxCompared to the summit chart I adjusted things a bit (only 4 milestones)21:17
ttxPlease doublecheck and let me know if you're OK with it21:17
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ttxbcwaldon: I know jaypipes is fine with it, but your input is welcome21:17
bcwaldonttx: thanks :)21:17
ttxIt's 4 balanced milestones, E4 on March 1st, with 5 weeks at the end for stabilization work and production of Release Candidates21:17
patelnathat's good...to see stablization work is included now21:18
anotherjessettx: lgtm21:18
pvoI like it21:18
bcwaldonttx: yep, works for me. I know glance is planning to release our RC 1 week ahead of time21:18
ttxWe expect keystone and glance to use the very beginning of that last period, and nova / dashboard to use the late part21:18
bcwaldonttx: not sure if we want to document that somewhere21:18
ttxdevcamcar, zns, vishy: ack ?21:19
anotherjessevishy said ack21:19
bcwaldonttx: maybe just the milestones listed in launchpad are good enough21:19
ttxbcwaldon: one week ahead of nova, actually.21:19
ttxwhich still falls after E4 in the "RC at will" period21:20
devcamcarttx: yes, that's what we're planning on as well21:20
markmcttx, RBP isn't listed on the schedule? I can't remember whether there was a conclusion about branching vs freezing trunk21:20
ttxok, will make it "official" then21:20
ttxmarkmc: RBP will actually happen when the RC is deemed "good enough"21:21
ttxthat's when F will open21:21
markmcttx, k, thanks21:21
ttxsince the PTLs want people to focus on RCs until one is "good enough"21:21
ttxOK, let's go to project status, in roughly the dependency order...21:21
ttxis zns around ? or anyone else from keystone ?21:22
anotherjessettx: I will agree for ziad21:22
ttxanotherjesse: but can you replace him for Keystone status ?21:22
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ttxLet's start with Glance and give him a chance to join21:23
ttx#topic Glance status21:23
*** openstack changes topic to "Glance status"21:23
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ttxbcwaldon: So is a plan coming together for Essex in Glance ?21:23
ttxor is it for Glance in Essex ?21:23
bcwaldonttx: definitely21:24
ttx(No Swift this week since nobody replaces John, who is in vacation)21:24
* Vek glances at essex21:24
bcwaldonBe sure to check out https://bugs.launchpad.net/glance/+milestone/essex-1 for everything we have targeted at the first Essex milestone. Currently we're looking at one blueprint and 23 bugs.21:24
bcwaldonJay also asked me to mention that he sent a summit summary email to the list highlighting what we are going to focus on in Glance during the Essex release. It outlines some major changes planned for the HTTP APIs and how we are going to make Glance more robust. Any questions I cannot answer today regarding anything in that email I will make sure to relay to him.21:24
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ttxLooks good. Did you start filing blueprints for the remaining stuff mentioned in that email ?21:25
bcwaldonttx: I haven't but I am assuming Jay will21:25
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ttxok. Questions on Glance ?21:26
bcwaldonttx: I think some already exist that aren't yet targeted21:26
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ttxbcwaldon: ideally you set the "Series goal" to Essex21:26
ttxand then they all appear in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/glance/essex21:26
bcwaldonttx: ok, I'll leave that up to the *offical* ptl21:26
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ttxready to be milestoned to a specific one21:26
ttxNo other Glance question ?21:27
ttx#topic Nova status21:27
*** openstack changes topic to "Nova status"21:27
ttxvishy: o/21:27
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ttxvishy: How is the Essex plan coming up for Nova ?21:28
pvovishy: you'd mentioned pulling Core together to try to figure out priorities?21:28
vishybunch of people just showed up in the office21:29
vishyso I haven't made a huge amount of progress since friday since I took yesterday off21:29
vishyi'm trying to collect all of the plans here: http::etherpad.openstack.org/essex21:30
vishyand convert relevent ones into blueprints21:31
ttxvishy: fwiw I filed the rootwrapper and targeted to Essex already.21:31
vishyso if anyone has items to add, I could use some help21:31
ttxfeel free to unset the series goal if you don't want it21:31
patelna@Vishy - is there a plan to open up a branch for fixes to D4?21:31
vishyttx: yes I was just looking over the existing blueprints filed and trying to map them21:31
vishypatelna: no, there is a separate group working on that21:32
ttxDaviey: any news on the sru group setup ?21:32
patelnapointers to that team???21:32
PhilDayI added my two etherpads to the wiki , and was planning to supply blueprints to go with them (VM State Managment and Nova Image Cache Management)21:32
vishyi'm not sure where it is going to live yet21:32
ttxpatelna: they should send an email to ask people to join the group. Probably this week21:32
patelnaGot it...thanks21:33
ttxpatelna: group does not exist yet afaik21:33
ttxpatelna: ping Daviey on IRC during European office hours21:33
meng-hp@ttx who is PTL for D4 maintenance group?21:33
vishyI'd like to organize a meeting for nova-core to prioritize and target blueprints21:34
ttxmeng-hp: no PTL, a workgroup will equally handle it21:34
vishypvo: any preference for timing for that?21:34
pvonot tuesdays. : )21:34
pvoother than that, no21:34
pvosoonish, obviously21:35
vishyThursday maybe?21:35
ttxyes, would be good.21:35
pvodefinitely maybe21:35
ttx<-- not nova-core :)21:35
pvoafternoon is clear21:35
vishyI will try for thursday at this time.  I will send out a message to the ml today21:35
ttxvishy: anything else ?21:36
glenc<-- not nova-core :)21:36
* Vek suggests #action'ing that21:36
ttx#action vishy to invite nova-core for a planning discussion21:36
ttxVek: on my way21:36
markmcttx, I'll have a first cut proposal on the stable branch tomorrow21:36
vishymeanwhile if anyone has anything to add regarding blueprints add them to the blueprints page above21:36
ttxmarkmc: cool ! I expect Dave to be a bit busy this week.21:37
ttxQuestions on Nova ?21:37
ttx#topic Dashboard status21:37
*** openstack changes topic to "Dashboard status"21:37
ttxdevcamcar: o/21:38
ttxDid you change the name, btw ?21:38
ttxor rather, did you select a cool code name ?21:38
devcamcarttx: we didn't get to do the lightning talk for the naming ceremony21:38
devcamcarwe'll be taking it to the list for a final decision this week21:38
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devcamcarwe now have a diablo friendly branch available on git21:39
ttx#info We are after the Design Summit, so now the first step is to get your feature plan filed as Launchpad blueprints, and set the "Series goal" to Essex21:39
vishy#info collecting plans/blueprints for nova on http://etherpad.openstack.org/essex21:39
vishy#action vishy to schedule nova blueprint prioritizing meeting for Thursday and send an email to the list21:39
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devcamcari'll be adding blueprints from the essex roadmap discussion this week as well21:39
ttxdevcamcar: In the end that should give you a nice subset of blueprints at:21:39
ttx#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-dashboard/essex21:39
devcamcarttx: yep21:39
ttx(All members of ~dashboard-drivers are able to confirm the series goal)21:40
ttxdevcamcar: I'll also need you to set the "Maintainer" at https://launchpad.net/openstack-dashboard to ~openstack-admins21:40
ttxshould avoid having to add extra people to ~dashboard-drivers for admin reasons21:40
devcamcarwill do21:40
ttx#action devcamcar to set "Maintainer" at https://launchpad.net/openstack-dashboard to ~openstack-admins21:40
ttxthat's all I had. Is it reasonable to try to get an Essex plan to present by next week meeting ?21:41
devcamcaryes i'll have it21:41
ttxdevcamcar: anything else on your mind ?21:41
ttxall: Questions on Dashboard ?21:41
devcamcarnot today! mostly just admin stuff21:42
ttxzns: around now ?21:42
ttx#topic Incubated project news21:43
*** openstack changes topic to "Incubated project news"21:43
anotherjessettx: I can give a broad summary of the summit stuff if not21:43
ttxanotherjesse: ok, will do after that topic. Thanks21:43
ttxdanwent: news ?21:43
danwentslides, etherpads, notes from netstack sessions at the summit are at: http://wiki.openstack.org/NetstackEssexSummit21:43
ttxdanwent: when do you push other projects to join you in incubation ? You're a bit lonely :P21:43
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ttx#link http://wiki.openstack.org/NetstackEssexSummit21:44
danwent#info based on discussions at summit, donabe will no longer be handled within netstack.  debo sent email to list about scheduling separate donabe meetings21:44
danwentttx:  i'll just have to talk with myself :)21:44
ttxfor some reason the network guys had a working network and could use etherpad.21:44
danwentother than that, we had an unconference session to identify priorities, will be writing up blueprints this week.21:44
Vekhaha :)21:44
tr3buchetthat's lucky21:45
danwentthere's no nestack meeting today…. just write blueprints21:45
* medberry guesses network guys had a 3G laptop21:45
danwenthaha, we bring our networks with us :)21:45
medberryor 4g21:45
danwentthat is all21:45
danwentany questions?21:45
ttxdanwent: nice summary page21:45
danwentttx: thanks21:45
ttxdanwent: would be great if all track leads had such a page, but that sounds a bit unfair to vishy.21:46
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danwentyes, i had it pretty easy21:46
ttxok, back to keystone21:46
ttx#topic Keystone status21:46
*** openstack changes topic to "Keystone status"21:46
ttxanotherjesse: quick design summit summary ?21:46
anotherjessettx: we had several sessions on the auth protocol - the major open question is whether we do:21:47
anotherjessescoping by more than just a tenant21:47
anotherjessemore capabilities into the identity service or not21:48
anotherjessewe had good discussions from folks at hp and other locations - we will be talking about scope of keystone in essex on the mailing list21:48
anotherjessebut try to nail down the api very early in the cycle21:49
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patelnathat's good Jesse...21:49
ttxanotherjesse: so the essex plans are not settled yet, right, still needs a bit more discussion ?21:49
anotherjessettx: that is correct21:49
ttxanotherjesse: yes, I'd like to freeze the APi by E321:49
ttxto avoid any bad surprise21:49
ttxeven if that means having a keystone RC early and open F for keystone earlyt21:50
ttxcompared to everyone else21:50
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ttxanotherjesse: did you have anything else ?21:51
anotherjessettx: good for now - if there are any questions feel free to ask here or in dev21:51
ttxok then21:51
ttx#topic Open discussion21:51
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion"21:51
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bcwaldonI mean comment!21:52
bcwaldonI wanted to bring to everyone's attention the email I sent to the list proposing the removal of OSAPI v1.0 from Nova. I think it's a really important decision we need to make and I want as many people involved as possible. In favor of not wasting anybody's time here, if anybody does have any comments, please share them on the mailing list.21:52
ziyadbI might as well ask what would be a great starting place for a new contributor, myself.21:52
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ttxbcwaldon: do you think you can reach consensus, or does it look like the sort of discussion we should have had last week ?21:53
* ttx admits not having read the whole thread21:53
anotherjesseziyadb: I think getting everything running and working on low hanging fruit is good for getting started … we hope to be finished with a script that helps with that (devstack) and email the list tomorrow21:53
bcwaldonttx: I'm referring to a second email. The conventions email is a separate discussion21:53
anotherjesseziyadb: and there is a "low hanging fruit" tag in the bug list21:53
bcwaldonttx: we can definitely reach consensus around removal ov v1.021:54
medberryanotherjesse, is devstack.org broken atm?21:54
bcwaldonmedberry: it's up for me21:54
anotherjessemedberry: ask in #dev21:54
anotherjesseit is github21:54
ziyadbanotherjesse: excellent, I'll start there. Although I must comment, a "getting started" page for new devs, aside from that which includes information regarding joining projects and signing the CLA, would be great.21:55
bcwaldonttx: is that something you or stef can tackle?21:55
anotherjesseziyadb: ahh, that is on the wiki I think - one sec21:55
westmaasanotherjesse: #dev?  did you mean a diff channel?21:56
anotherjesseziyadb: the top right corner of  http://wiki.openstack.org/ talks about contributing, ...21:56
ziyadband I'm not sure how the dev ecosystem is, would I for instance be able to work with other individual contributors to contribute a particular feature in an ad-hoc fashion?21:56
anotherjessewestmaas: sorry, meant #openstack-dev21:56
ziyadbanotherjesse: thanks, I'll have a look.21:56
ttxbcwaldon: not sure how we can help, the discussion seems to stay on track. Do you mean it needs outsiders to sum it up and help it making progress ?21:57
glenc#action someone needs to update the "How to Contribute" page; it's a bit out of date21:57
bcwaldonttx: sorry, I was referring to ziyadb's request for a jumping off point on the wiki21:57
bcwaldonttx: ignore me ;)21:57
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ttxglenc: I'll take it21:57
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ttx#action ttx to update the "How to Contribute" page21:58
ttxok then, I think I filled my bag of TODOs for the week.21:58
ziyadbah, I suppose I'll start with the low hanging fruit and work my way up to triaged bugs.21:58
ziyadbthanks for the information.21:58
ttxziyadb: I'll try to update the page -- if you have any doubt, ping me21:59
anotherjesse#action add dashboard & keystone to wiki.openstack.org overview21:59
ttxthe wiki definitely needs some love21:59
ziyadbttx: as I will, thanks.21:59
anotherjesselots of change in essex - probably a lot of things need updated :)21:59
anotherjesseerr - diablo21:59
ttxok, let's close it and leave the room for the netstack folks21:59
Vekwell, same will be true of essex, I'm sure.21:59
*** openstack changes topic to "Openstack Meetings: http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2011/"22:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Oct 11 22:00:01 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)22:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2011/openstack-meeting.2011-10-11-21.02.html22:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2011/openstack-meeting.2011-10-11-21.02.txt22:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2011/openstack-meeting.2011-10-11-21.02.log.html22:00
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ttxThanks everyone ! danwent: room is yours22:00
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ziyadbuh oh, no low hanging fruit. https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack/+bugs?orderby=-importance&field.status:list=NEW&field.status:list=CONFIRMED&field.status:list=TRIAGED&field.tag=low-hanging-fruit22:00
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ttxziyadb: i'll make sure that list is not empty.22:00
danwentttx:  thanks, actually, there's not netstack meeting today, but thanks anyway :)22:00
soren21:45 < danwent> there's no nestack meeting today…. just write blueprints22:00
danwentyeah, we're slackers22:01
ttxYou just ruined my perfect timing22:01
ttxWe could have continued to list all the outdated wiki pages.22:01
danwentsorry to disappoint.  I can spin up the meetbot just for kicks if it makes you feel better ;)22:01
medberrythe timing is blown now, you'll never get that minute back.22:01
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ziyadberr, ttx22:02
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rmkDoesn't seem like it's possible to be explicit about which zone you want to boot an instance into.23:04
rmkIs that correct?23:04
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*** dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates23:55

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