Thursday, 2012-08-16

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openstackMeeting started Thu Aug 16 16:00:25 2012 UTC.  The chair is nijaba. Information about MeetBot at
nijaba#meetingtopic Ceilometer16:00
nijaba#chair nijaba16:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:00
openstackCurrent chairs: nijaba16:00
nijabaHello everyone! Show of hands, who is around for the ceilometer meeting?16:00
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nijabahello dhellmann16:01
nijabajust started the meeting16:01
nijabahey jgriffith!16:01
jgriffithnijaba: Hello!16:01
nijaba#topic actions from previous meeting16:01
*** openstack changes topic to "actions from previous meeting (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:01
nijaba#topic jaypipes to create ceilometer cookbook16:01
*** openstack changes topic to "jaypipes to create ceilometer cookbook (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:01
nijabajaypipes does not seem to be around...16:02
gmbHi folks.16:02
nijaba#action  jaypipes to create ceilometer cookbook16:02
nijabahello gmb16:02
nijaba#topic nijaba to do a second thouroughness check on API and report next week16:02
*** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to do a second thouroughness check on API and report next week (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:02
nijabaSo, here is what I found in terms of discrepencies:16:03
nijaba1. GET /v1 should return detailed information about this specific version of the API.16:03
nijaba2. GET /v1/extensions has not been implemeted yet16:03
nijaba3. GET /v1/sources does not seem to have an equivallent16:03
nijaba4. GET /v1/LIST/  I am not sure how one would know about the components that would be instrumented.  Would that be part of /v1/resources?16:03
nijaba5. GET /v1/LIST/<COMPONENT>/METERS same as above to get a list of meters per component16:03
nijaba6. GET /v1/LIST/METERS same as above regarding a list of all meters16:03
nijaba7. There does not seem to be any summary API left (ie: /]USERS/<USER_ID>/<METER>/VOLUME or /DURATION)16:03
nijaba8. It does not seem possible to specify start_time and end_time as parameters of the queries16:03
nijabaThat's all I could find, but I may have missed a few...16:03
dhellmannstart and stop times are going to be GET parameters instead of part of the URL16:04
nijabadhellmann: sounds fine to me, just was not present on the desc when I did the comparison16:04
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dhellmannyeah, I haven't added that yet :-)16:05
dhellmannlet's go in order...16:05
dhellmann1. what "information" should be returned?16:05
nijabadhellmann: the version of the API16:05
dhellmannso a list of version numbers?16:06
nijabadhellmann: subversion that is16:06
nijabadhellmann: look at what nova does16:06
dhellmann2. I will need to look into extensions, too16:06
dhellmann3. I missed that, will add16:06
dhellmann4. I don't know what "components" this means. like nova & quantum, or something else?16:07
dhellmannhow does "component" differ from source?16:07
nijaba5. nova/quantum/cinder/swift/etc... was the intent16:07
dhellmannok. we aren't currently recording that anywhere in the meter data, so I will have to think about a source for the info16:08
nijabadhellmann: source could be 2 different deployments16:08
dhellmannaha, ok16:08
dhellmannso that needs to be config value16:08
dhellmann5 and 6 are clear now16:08
dhellmann7 isn't done yet, but we'll be doing some work on that as we do our integration work during this current sprint16:09
nijabaso I guess you answered on all items16:09
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nijabado you want to mark some actions?16:09
dhellmannI'll copy these notes into the comment in that file for reference later, but I don't know which pieces we'll be implementing, yet, so I'd rather hold off on commitments beyond that16:10
nijabasounds good to me16:11
nijabashall we move on?16:11
nijaba#topic nijaba to write description of component responsibility16:11
*** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to write description of component responsibility (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:11
nijabaI unfortunately did not get as much time as I wanted to work on this the past week, so I am re-assigning this to me for next week16:11
nijaba#action nijaba to write description of componet responsibility16:11
nijabaI guess that's it for last week's actions...16:12
nijabaWe did not seem to have any other topic on the agenda.16:12
nijaba#topic Open Discusssion16:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discusssion (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)"16:12
dhellmannI have a couple16:12
nijabaplease shoot :)16:12
dhellmannfirst, we should coordinate on a presentation for the summit16:12
dhellmannat least one16:12
nijabaI have proposed a talk for the summit16:13
dhellmannoh, good, I hadn't seen that yet16:13
nijabaand I think we need to session as part of dev track16:13
nijabaone on ceilometer's future in general16:13
dhellmannis your proposal for a dev session or for the "conference" part?16:13
dhellmannor is that all the same thing this year?16:14
nijabaone on the possible heat transfer of the load balancing tool16:14
nijabano, there is still a dev and a conference part16:14
nijabathe talk I proposed already is for the conf part16:14
dhellmannok, good16:14
nijabathe 2 session is for the summit16:14
dhellmannI agree, we need to cover both16:14
nijabaI have not seen the call for summit sessions yet16:15
nijabadid I miss it?16:15
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dhellmannoh, maybe it's not open yet16:15
dhellmannI thought i saw something, but maybe that was for the conference16:15
nijabathe only one I saw so far was for the conf16:15
dhellmannso I thought I would propose a "this is ceilometer" session for the dev sessions16:16
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dhellmanncover the architecture, status, etc.16:17
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dhellmannhow do you feel about collaborating on the presentation portion, nijaba ?16:17
nijabaI am ALL open :)16:17
dhellmannok, let's talk about that by email16:18
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nijabaany other topic?16:18
dhellmannwe need more reviewers!16:19
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nijaba#action dhellmann and nijaba to work on sessions for summit via email16:19
dhellmannwe've had some people say they would be more involved, is anyone looking for ways to help?16:19
nijabagmb: would you like to join as a reviewer?16:19
dhellmannI mean anyone here at the meeting?16:19
gmbnijaba: I'd be happy to.16:20
nijabadhellmann: should we grant gmb some +2 powers?16:20
nijabaHis python is much sharper than mine....16:20
* dhellmann maps irc id to person...16:20
dhellmannok, sounds good!16:21
nijabagmb: manager of the OpenStack team at Canonical (the one he is recruiting for as we speak)16:21
gmbYes, it's all the fun of programming exercises and technical interviews here at the moment.16:21
nijaba#action nijaba to give core reviewer rights to gmb16:21
dhellmanncool, welcome aboard, gmb!16:22
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gmbThanks dhellmann16:22
dhellmannnijaba: we should see about jtrans, too, if he has time16:22
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nijabaI agree, but we'd need his ok first16:22
nijabado you want to check with him via email?16:23
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dhellmann#action dhellmann to ask jtrans about interest in reviewer status16:23
nijababtw, did zul (chuck short) fix his commit?16:23
zulnijaba: not yet16:23
nijabahey zul!16:24
nijabaseem like just one typo away...16:24
zulnijaba: yeah i have other priorities right now ill get back to it today16:24
nijabacool, thanks16:24
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nijabaany other topics?16:25
* dhellmann is done16:25
nijabacalling once...16:26
nijabaok, that seems like a wrap16:27
dhellmannthanks for a quick meeting, everyone!16:27
nijabathanks a lot everyone.16:27
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meeting channel. See for schedule and for meeting logs"16:27
openstackMeeting ended Thu Aug 16 16:27:23 2012 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:27
openstackMinutes (text):
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davidkranzAny one here for QA meeting?17:03
dwalleckhere here!17:03
dwalleckThey finally let me out of my cage17:03
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davidkranzJay doesn't seem to be around.17:03
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davidkranzdwalleck: Do you know what is happening with the "fuzz testing"?17:04
davidkranzdwalleck: Is any one working on it?17:04
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dwalleckI missed out on that whole conversation I believe17:04
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dwalleckI saw that the original clients were renamed as fuzz clients, so all this is news to me17:05
davidkranzOK, I will check with jaypipes17:05
dwalleckI'm in the middle of porting xml requests/responses from my local suite into Tempest17:05
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Ravikumar_hpdwalleck: I thought we are supporting only Json not xml17:06
dwalleckMy intention has always been to support both, especially after Vish's email last friday17:06
Ravikumar_hpdwalleck: for Nova - every one is for json17:07
davidkranzYes, I think there was agreement that the XML that is there needs to be maintained and tested.17:07
Ravikumar_hpno one preferred xml17:07
dwalleckI have the backend code running such that I run Tempest locally using either, so I'd like to port that back into JSON17:07
davidkranzMuch less agreement about adding any more xml.17:07
Ravikumar_hpwe need to align with their decision17:07
dwalleckMy dev team is concerned about both, so I've implemented it. If the Tempest community is not interested in that code, I can move on to other things17:07
davidkranzSome one has started posting xml-related changes. Daryl, are you coordinated with that guy in any way?17:08
dwalleckI just wanted to make sure the offer to help was made17:08
Ravikumar_hpwe do run both formats internallu at hp17:08
davidkranzdwalleck: I think the Tempest community is definitely interested in your xml code.17:08
rohitkdavidkranz: +117:08
Ravikumar_hpsure - +117:09
dwalleckokay, I was just confused for a moment then. Still running low on sleep here :)17:09
davidkranzWe have to find a way for companies to put there testing code into the public repositiories just like they do for other code.17:09
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davidkranzI am not sure why that doesn't happen, especially given that there is no benefit of "differentiation" based on tests!17:10
rohitkdavidkranz: actually, at NTT we're putting a concentrated effort towards that17:10
dwalleckMy goal has always been to get all the code I have locally into Tempest, but I can only do that in places where we all can come to a concensus17:11
dwalleckThat's the real trick17:11
davidkranzdwalleck: Perhaps that burden it too high. All tests that run reliably are good tests.17:12
davidkranzPerhaps we should have a "contrib" area in tempest where code can be part of a nightly run until/if it goes into tempest proper.17:12
davidkranztempest proper is necessarily limited in runtime anyway so we will have to do it.17:12
davidkranzThe code review process for contrib could  be less severe as well.17:13
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davidkranzThis is already happening de facto by being spread across different companies.17:13
davidkranzBy tempest proper I mean "gating".17:13
dwalleckdavidkranz: These are things we need to figure out. Even the whitebox and smoke tests created while I was out are un-usable by me because they assume one is running the tests on a machine where Nova is installed17:13
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dwalleckWhile that's realistic for developers, it's not for everyone17:14
davidkranzdwalleck: I thought the whitebox tests have extra configs so you can be outside the openstack cluster and run. If not it is a bug.17:14
dwalleckThis is probably a good time to put our heads back together and come up with a good solid direction and goals before grizzly17:15
dwalleckdavidkranz: The smoke tests require them as well17:15
dwalleckSo it makes it very difficult for me to port code when it has to run in an environment I don't natively have17:16
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dwalleckI can work it out, but in addition to running against Devstack, we should be able to run Tempest against a HP, TryStack, or RAX deployment as well (I would like to anyway)17:17
davidkranzdwalleck: I agree about doing some brainstorming. I don't think any tempest tests should require nova to be installed. Do you have a problem with requiring nova-client?17:17
dwallecknova-client is totally fine. It's just the requirement of the nova or glance libs that really hurt for me17:17
davidkranzdwalleck: I run tempest agains our own clusters but have not turned on the whitebox tests.17:17
davidkranzWe've lapsed about creating an agenda before the meeting. Are there any other topics?17:19
dwalleckdavidkranz: I've gotcha. I just want to make sure the test suite is available and usable for all. Exceptions for things such as whitebox tests I can totally agree with17:19
dwalleckNot from me, just mostly heads down getting back into reviews and looking at this XML port17:20
davidkranzdwalleck: I think the whitebox tests should work too, with just the requirements of network connectivity to the cluster nodes and credentials.17:20
devanandadavidkranz: if this is the right forum, i'd like to bring up this bug:
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1037354 in tempest "a broken can lead to silent failures" [Undecided,New]17:21
davidkranzdevananda: This is the right forum.17:21
devanandadevstack-gate was basically not running tempest tests for a week because of that17:22
dwalleckthis would be a good question for jaypipes...I haven't been involved at all in the gating job17:22
devanandathe fix looks simple, but i don't know what the expected behaviour is, or why it's suppressing errors at that point17:22
dwalleckI'd need to look at the auto-config script he's using to understand that17:22
dwalleckI know he was very specific about adding detailed logging during configuration, so I'm sure it's not intentional17:23
devanandawe've fixed it in devstack so that, at least for now, all the tests are running again17:23
devanandaso it can probably wait for jaypipes to take a look17:23
davidkranzI think the real question at this point is why this is skipping rather than failing the test.17:23
devananda^ yes17:24
uvirtbotdevananda: Error: "yes" is not a valid command.17:24
davidkranzI guess we need to ask Jay.17:24
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dwalleckYeah...I'm looking at this now, and this is code I've never seen before17:25
dwalleckWe should probably raise an exception about having an invalid configuration with details17:25
dwalleckIt looks like it's logging the error as the reason for the skipped test17:25
davidkranzdwalleck: Tests should not log errors and then act like they passed...17:26
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dwalleckWell, they shouldn't act like they passed. From what I see, they should be skipped17:27
dwalleckWhich is neither a failure or success17:27
davidkranzLet's see what Jay was thinking.17:28
dwalleckyeah, agreed17:28
davidkranzAnything else?17:29
davidkranzI will send a summary of the meeting to qa-list.17:29
dwallecknope, all done here17:29
dwalleckSorry about the absence. I'll be back in the swing of things now17:30
davidkranzdwalleck: Are you in contact with the guy submitting xml changes?17:30
davidkranzWe don't want competing submissions.17:30
dwalleckdavidkranz: I'm not sure who that is17:30
dwalleckTo Tempest?17:30
davidkranzLook at the top of,n,z17:30
dwalleckI mean, I emailed out last week about that, but I never saw a reply from someone else17:30
dwalleckNo....did not see that17:31
dwalleckWell crap....don't know what to do there then. This is very different than how I have it implemented17:32
dwalleckI'll figure out something17:32
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davidkranzBye all.17:33
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jkffHey, time for OpenStack LBaaS meeting!19:03
jkffThis is Eugene Kirpichev from Mirantis.19:03
jkffHere's what's new on our side:19:03
jkff* Work is in progress on the F5 driver.19:04
jkff* A new scheduler (device allocator) similar to Nova's FilterScheduler is ready for master (though not pushed to the public repo at the moment)19:04
jkff* We had some communication with LB vendors and with Dan from Quantum about LBaaS/Quantum integration, and identified some key questions. Dan already sent a link to a wiki page about that (though there's not much there now).19:05
jkffThere are going to be several design sessions on LBaaS and Quantum integration at the Summit.19:06
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ogelbukhjkff: I think we'll be able to provide some kind of proposal for integrating lbaas (and possibly other network services) with quantum before summit19:10
jkffogelbukh: Right; we'd like to start the discussion as early as possible. Do you have a tentative date for when a first draft will be ready?19:11
ogelbukhthe end of next week, if all goes well19:11
ogelbukhat least we'll be ready to put something to ML to start the discussion19:12
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ogelbukhunfortunately, quantum team seems to be busy preparing for release..19:14
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jkffGreat, thanks19:17
jkffOk, I guess this is it. I'll post notes to the ML.19:18
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openstackMeeting started Thu Aug 16 21:01:07 2012 UTC.  The chair is vishy. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.21:01
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vishy#topic Role Call21:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Role Call"21:01
vishywho is here?21:01
markmcme, me, me21:01
vishywelcome everyone21:02
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vishylets get started!21:02
vishy#topic F3 milestone-critical bugs review21:02
*** openstack changes topic to "F3 milestone-critical bugs review"21:02
ttxso are those all blocking F3 ?21:03
vishylooks like we have three bugs for backport21:03
vishyttx: i think so21:03
ttxI see one that merged in master and needs to be backported...21:04
vishydprince: it looks like your fix merged?21:04
ttx(bug 968696)21:04
vishydid it merge after milestone split?21:04
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 968696 in keystone ""admin"-ness not properly scoped" [Low,Confirmed]
ttxthe others still need to land21:04
vishyi think you mean bug 925731 ?21:04
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 925731 in nova "GET on key pairs gives 500" [Low,In progress]
russellbthe keypairs one halfway landed, there were 2 patches, right dprince?21:04
dprincevishy/russellb: Yes.21:05
vishyah i see the other one21:05
dprinceThe presence of one without the other won't break anything though.21:05
russellbI +2d the second one, vishy you +2d last rev21:05
dprinceThat was a patch series.21:05
dprincecool then21:05
russellbso can probably quickly approve21:05
vishyttx: i will get those into milestone proposed once they land today21:06
vishyttx: shouldn't be too hard21:06
ttxvishy: oh, you set to FixCo bug 968696.. it's probably in the branch already. Will mark FixRel21:06
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 968696 in keystone ""admin"-ness not properly scoped" [Low,Confirmed]
vishyttx: although i'm not absolutely sure there isn't more we need to do in nova it is sorta vague21:06
vishyI created a new bug for a specific issue in nova21:07
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1037786 in nova "nova admin based on hard-coded 'admin' role" [Critical,Triaged]21:07
ttxok so that's three bugs as far as F3 is concerned21:07
vishyfixed-released i think is good for the existing one21:07
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ttxbug 92573121:07
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 925731 in nova "GET on key pairs gives 500" [Low,In progress]
vishyttx: we have reviews in for all of them, so I think it will be no problem to get those done in the next couple of hours21:07
vishythe second fix is going into master right now, will backport21:08
russellbshall we assign reviewers to each thing to make sure it gets done?21:08
ttxvishy: ok, will push them to milestone-proposed in the morning if you don't complete it by then21:08
russellb(things that still need a review)21:08
vishyttx: excellent21:08
vishyrussellb: I reviewed Marks patches, they all seem sane21:08
vishyI also looked at eglynn. That one is the big one21:08
ttxSo those are all blocking and in good progress to be fixed today21:08
vishyso if someone wants to go in and give marks a quick check21:09
russellbok, well i'll go through mark's patch series that you looked at21:09
* markmc will look at per-user quota revert21:09
vishywe should probably spend extra time with eglynn's21:09
eglynn needs a +1 to get it over the line (from vek or comstud?)21:09
vishycomstud: can you also keep an eye on that one: ^^21:09
markmcprobably worth a few of us looking at it21:09
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ttxall: if there is anoything that needs to be backported, make sure it's targeted against F321:09
vishymarkmc: agreed21:09
vishyok ready for FFE discussion?21:10
ttxso that I know I need to hold21:10
vishy#topic Feature Freeze Decisions21:10
*** openstack changes topic to "Feature Freeze Decisions"21:10
vishy# link
vishyso that one snuck in just after FF21:11
vishywe need to officially grant an exception or propose a revert21:11
mikalDid we see anything from them before the freeze?21:11
ttxalready in, and I think it's not disruptive21:11
mikalIt seemed very sudden21:11
vishymikal: they have been working on it for 6 months21:11
vishymikal: same with bare metal provisioning21:11
markmcit does seem self-contained, and it's restoring something we took out21:11
mikalvishy: sure, but they haven't been sending patches for six months...21:11
markmcmakes sense to me21:11
vishyjust in feature branches21:11
ttxFFE is about how much disruption you introduce and how late you do it21:12
markmcvishy, were the feature branches publicised, though?21:12
mikalvishy: ahhh, ok, so its cause I wasn't paying attention?21:12
vishymikal: note the wiki:
ttxhere it just adds surface and is completed early enough, so +1 from me21:12
vishyhey had weekly meetings, etc. Perhaps they could have done a big more communication on the ML specifically asking for people to look at.21:13
vishy* they21:13
mikalvishy: yeah, fair points.21:13
mikalvishy: I withdraw my objection21:13
markmcthink this makes sense, but a general approach of "develop huge patch on feature branch, propose shortly before feature freeze" isn't workable21:13
russellbtouches no core code21:13
russellbyes, this was the day before21:13
russellbthat's insane21:13
russellband it's a giant patch21:13
dprinceand its a revival!21:13
vishymarkmc: agreed we need to give people a cutoff for large feature branches that is much earlier21:13
ttxmarkmc: I'm considering reintroducing a FeatureProposalFreeze21:14
ttxwe used to have that21:14
ttxone week before the cut21:14
russellbmaybe even 2 weeks ...21:14
markmcttx, as in, first rev of the patch?21:14
russellbfor bigger stuff, need some time to digest it21:14
vishy+1 for two weeks21:14
ttxfood for Grizzly21:14
russellbeven 2 weeks is pushing it, depending on what the review brings up21:15
mikalI do feel like a 2,000 line patch the day before puts a lot of pressure on reviewers to just say yes21:15
russellblike ... "where should we put the database" types of things.21:15
eglynnyep, also need time for regressions to pop up21:15
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dprincettx: I like that... food21:15
ttxIs there any way we could mark Hyper-V as experimental ?21:15
ttxas in... brand new ?21:15
russellbi don't like expiremental much :(21:15
vishyttx: I don't know exactly what that would mean. As in we may not backport fixes?21:16
russellbif it's expirmental, it should be baking in another branch probably21:16
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vishyttx: or just warning people that there may be bugs?21:16
ttxno ,as in we have no idea if it actually works.21:16
markmcexperimental is a nice warning for folks21:16
vishyttx: how would we mark it, in code?21:16
markmckernel is a good analogy, stuff gets marked as experimental when it first goes in21:16
vishyttx: in release notes?21:16
dprinceWe could do it similar to deprecation warnings...21:16
ttxvishy: we did it before in release notes21:16
markmcvishy, release notes would be good, cfg support in grizzly would be better21:17
vishyin that case we should do the same for tilera and vmware imo21:17
dprinceLog a message once per process if enabled.21:17
ttxcan be as simple as "Folsom sees the first release of the new Hyper-V support"21:17
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markmcagree on tilera and vmware21:17
maoy+1 for experimental on vmware, hyper-v, bare-metal21:17
markmcwe know that libvirt and xenapi are the two that are actively maintained21:17
markmcthat is useful information for users21:17
ttxanyway, that's a bit orthogonal to the FFE decision21:17
vishymarkmc: I think that makes sense21:18
russellbis hyper-v not going to be actively maintained?21:18
russellband bare-metal?21:18
vishyyes lets keep going through the FFE stuff21:18
vishyand come back to this21:18
russellbit's kind of making them 2nd class citizens ...21:18
ttxso +1 on hyper-V ?21:18
comstudsorry, on a call21:18
comstudbut here now21:18
comstudvishy: ya, will keep an eye on user quota thing21:18
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vishy#vote Grant a Feature Freeze Exception to Hyper-v Driver? yes, no, abstain21:18
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markmc#vote yes21:19
russellb#vote yes21:19
ttx#vote yes21:19
vishy#startvote Grant a Feature Freeze Exception to Hyper-v Driver? yes, no, abstain21:19
openstackBegin voting on: Grant a Feature Freeze Exception to Hyper-v Driver? Valid vote options are yes, no, abstain.21:19
comstud#vote yes21:19
openstackVote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.21:19
maoy#vote yes21:19
eglynn#vote y21:19
dprince#vote yes21:19
openstackeglynn: y is not a valid option. Valid options are yes, no, abstain.21:19
eglynn#vote yes21:19
lzyeval#vote yes21:19
russellb#vote yes21:19
mikal#vote yes21:19
vishyforgot the start :)21:19
ttx#vote yes21:19
vishy#vote yes21:19
dprince#vote yes21:19
markmcwe don't need to vote :)21:19
openstackVoted on "Grant a Feature Freeze Exception to Hyper-v Driver?" Results are21:19
openstackyes (9): ttx, vishy, maoy, eglynn, russellb, lzyeval, mikal, comstud, dprince21:19
markmcno-one was disagreeing21:19
ttxmarkmc: +121:19
vishymarkmc: i suppose. Just wanted a record21:19
vishyok next one21:19
russellbbut voting is so much fun21:19
markmcvishy, sure :)21:19
ttxAnd if I -1 it you better convince me rather than outnumber me21:20
mikalrussellb: it makes me feel I've achieved something21:20
dprincerussellb: it really is.21:20
markmcnetwork-create can go in with a small tweak to the API21:20
markmcowner seems resistant, tho21:20
markmcmaybe I should just jump in and do it21:20
vishyI think the tweak mark wants is simple and code should go in with the change21:20
ttxHow useful is this ?21:20
vishyi believe they are resistant because they would have to rewrite their tool21:21
vishyttx: people can stop using nova-manage to create networks so imo very useful21:21
russellbso it's going to take an exception and a volunteer to finish the code ... :-/21:21
vishymarkmc: do you want to make the change?21:21
markmcvishy, yeah, it'll be in the morning tho21:21
ttxI'm fine with a one-week exception.21:21
vishy#info FFE granted to Hyper-V driver21:22
ttxmarkmc: no hurry21:22
vishyok lets go with it21:22
* markmc will do it in a week's time then21:22
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vishy#info FFE granted to os-api-network-create21:22
russellbmarkmc: such a team player!21:22
ttxmarkmc: it won't be in F3, just needs to be in soon [tm]21:22
markmcttx, you gave me a week, can't take it back! :-P21:22
markmcthis one's scary21:23
vishyok this one was mostly my bad, it has been under review for a while and I just totally missed adding it to the list for people to review.21:23
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ttxisn't that a bug ?21:23
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vishyjust for information, RAX has a patch in to serialize all create requests on the compute node to avoid this race21:23
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dprincevishy: doesn't run for SmokeStack...21:23
vishyttx: it is, but I thought it might need an FFE because it is kind of a large change21:23
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* ttx looks21:24
vishydprince: that is good to know. so it sounds like it is not quite there21:24
markmcttx, it's a bug fix, but involves a fairly significant arch change21:24
vishyI really dislike the idea of shipping folsom with a nasty race.21:24
markmcvishy, did essex have it too?21:24
vishymarkmc: I believe so21:25
vishymarkmc: nodes get overprovisioned in certain situations21:25
markmcvishy, yeah21:25
vishymarkmc: I would guess you notice it a lot more if you use fill-first21:25
markmcone the one hand - would be really nice to have it21:25
vishywhich most deployers are not using, but rax is.21:25
dprinceAs a work around one could always under allocate the compute hosts right?21:25
markmcon the other hand - seems sane to only take these kind of risks for regressions vs the last release21:26
russellbguess they should stop that then :-)21:26
vishyrussellb: :)21:26
mikalCould we just go with serializing requests for now?21:26
vishycomstud: how nasty is the patch for serializing requests?21:26
ttxvishy: how far is it ?21:26
vishyttx: from being ready? I thought it was good, but dprince says it breaks smokestack so apparently not quite.21:27
vishylets give comstud a minute and come back to this one21:27
dprincevishy: I commented on the review about it. Its this right:
vishy#info returning to this one in a bit21:28
vishydprince: yes21:28
* dprince will dig into it later21:28
vishyso this is definitely not quite ready21:28
ttxI -1ed this one21:29
ttxit impacts existing supposedly-working code21:29
vishyThey've put a lot of work into this so it is sad, but I think we have to delay this one21:29
ttxand looks like it could benefit from further discussion21:29
vishyany other opinions?21:29
russellbseems like a case of showing up fairly late, and unfortunately hitting too many issues in review to get resolved in time21:29
markmcgrizzly isn't far away, and there's really useful discussion on how it might be re-worked21:29
russellbyeah, so -1 on ffe21:30
markmceven simple stuff like all the binaries it adds to bin/bm_* gives me pause21:30
markmcwould be nice to discuss stuff like that, rather than rush it in21:30
vishy#info FFE denied for general-bare-metal-provisioning-framework21:30
ttxyay, one down21:30
vishy#info shuld be reworked for Grizzly21:31
vishythis is a very useful feature, but it just isn't quite there21:31
markmcyeah, looks like you found a bunch of issues with it21:31
ttx-1 from me. A bit invasive, and looks like it needs a bit too much time21:32
vishymarkmc: I was trying to get the functionality without having to modify the driver interface21:32
vishyi'm -0 on this one21:32
vishyi could see -1 or giving it a week to try and get it cleaned up21:32
dprinceI somewhat like that we use the word 'rebuild' for this BP. 'rebuild' in the OSAPI is destructive.21:32
ttxI don't really like introducing new API calls after F321:32
ttxsince it breaks QA people21:32
vishydprince: * dislike?21:32
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dprinceSorry. Maybe I misphrased that....21:33
markmc-1 ... issues found during review, came in late, only a "nice to have", invasive, ...21:33
vishyttx: well it is adding a new admin action, but if the patch is small enough then deployers can grab it if they need it.21:33
vishyis anyone +1 ?21:33
ttxThe less we have, the more we can focus on the ones we grant21:34
vishy#info FFE denied for rebuild-for-ha21:34
dprincenot me. I'm agnostic. -0 on it though.21:34
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vishy#info Great feature but not quite ready. Should be shrunk down so it is easy for deployers to cherry pick it if needed.21:34
markmcdprince, let's keep religious beliefs out of this21:34
vishyalso seems to be a very useful feature21:35
* dprince is totally misunderstood21:35
vishyalmost made it in21:35
vishymarkmc: you had some concerns but they didn't seem to be strong enough for you to -121:35
markmcyeah, +1 - it's got a bunch of good feedback, people seem to want it21:35
markmcvishy, I don't like the API modelling here, but it's consistent with other APIs21:35
ttxSounds like the typical corner feature, but it touches plenty of core code...21:35
markmcvishy, so, no objection on that front21:36
eglynnI kinda like it21:36
* markmc just had a nitpick after a shallow review21:36
ttxI'll let nova-core assess how disruptive it actually is21:36
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ttxvishy: how much time does it need ?21:36
markmceglynn, the feature or the API modelling? :)21:36
vishyI'm +1 on this one. It is an extension but it seems useful21:36
eglynnmarkmc: the feature21:36
comstudvishy: which serializing requests?21:36
comstudvishy: ah, for scheduler.  it's easy21:37
vishycomstud: you told me you were serializing build requests to avoid scheduler races21:37
markmceglynn, thought so :) take a look at add_tenant_access action, could be a subcollection21:37
comstudbut the current code is extremely inefficient for large # of instances21:37
comstudbecause we have to instance_et_all21:37
comstudand add up usage21:37
comstudTHis new patch eliminates all of that21:37
vishycomstud: so it is both an efficiency problem and a race21:37
vishycomstud: hold a sec we'll get back to that one21:37
vishyttx: I don't think it will take long21:38
comstudgot it (sorry, trying to multitask... on a phone call too)21:38
vishyttx: just marks minor nit and i think it is good to go.21:38
* ttx reverts -1 to +021:38
vishyok do we need to vote?21:38
* russellb prefers -021:38
dansmithwhy not get really precise and just use some fractions here?21:38
vishyor are we agreed to give it a week?21:38
ttxrussellb: that's you seeing glasses half empty.21:38
ttxone wee kmax21:38
russellbtypical me21:39
ttxI want API locked down asap21:39
ttxeven extensions21:39
* dprince consulted wife (english major) now understands context which agnostic can be used21:39
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markmcwe're still on project-flavors?21:39
vishyI'm going to mark it granted unless anyone complains21:39
markmcor scheduler-race?21:39
vishymarkmc: still on flavors21:39
russellbproject flavors21:39
markmcah, grand21:39
ttxvishy: go for it21:39
dprince+1. not agnostic21:39
vishy#info FFE granted to project-specific-flavors21:40
vishy#info needs to merge ASAP. One week max.21:40
vishyone more before the scheduler race21:40
vishyso we are reverting that one21:40
vishydo we give it a FFE to get fixed and back in?21:40
vishyor do we ship without it?21:41
markmchow broken is it?21:41
russellbis there a fixed version in progress?21:41
ttxdo we have an assignee or an ETA ?21:41
markmcbit strange this, it was in gerrit for 2 months21:41
vishywe have neither21:41
eglynnI'm off on vaction for the next two weeks, but would be happy to fix it up after that21:41
eglynntoo late?21:41
ttxvishy: then -221:41
vishyeglynn: too late21:41
russellbooh -221:41
vishyttx is using his powers to block this one.21:41
vishyper user quotas will have to come back in grizzly21:42
ttxvishy: not time now to look for assignees21:42
ttxunless someone takes it now...21:42
vishyttx: I was going to toss it back at the original author21:42
vishyttx: but you're right someone in core probably has to own it21:42
vishyanyone feel like owning it?21:43
ttxI'm happy to revert to -1 if someone takes it :)21:43
russellbhow about pwning it21:43
markmcis the original author on irc?21:43
markmcanyone had interaction with the author other than gerrit?21:43
markmc(goes to how likely he/she is to turn it around)21:43
markmc-1 from me too, then21:44
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vishyk going with denied21:44
ttxbut frankly we have enough exceptions granted not to add uncertain ones.21:44
vishy#info FFE denied for per-user-quotas21:44
vishy#info needs to be fixed and reproposed for grizzly21:44
ttxevery exception we grant is less effort spent on bugfixing21:44
vishyok back to the other one21:44
vishycomstud: still here?21:45
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markmcttx, that's a point worth repeating21:45
ttxit's not just being sadistic. Though that's an added benefit21:45
vishyso comstud has stated that they want to use this in production, so they will be happy to solve any issues that come up21:46
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comstudvishy: So, ya... right now in larger deployments, there's a problem with race conditions in the scheduler... even in single process nova-scheduler.  It's worse if you try to run 2 for HA purposes.21:46
vishyit does seem like a nasty bug21:46
russellbyes, i was about to say, that's the one thing that gives me some confidence that this will get worked out ...21:47
ttxvishy: I'm +0 on this. This is a bug, so it's nova-core decisoin to assess if the proposed change is too disruptive at this point in the cycle21:47
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dprinceI'm +1 for it going in... once it works though...21:47
maoyI'm +1 on this.21:47
vishymy vote would be to put it in, and if we uncover major issues we can still revert21:47
comstudvishy: It's even more of a problem because we need to run serializing build requests... and the scheduling of builds is slow due to having to instance_get_all()21:47
comstudSo this fixes a couple of problems21:47
ttxbasically it's not a FFE thing... It's just a review thing21:47
vishyttx: so decision is it doesn't need an ffe?21:48
comstudvishy: We'll be using this in prod within a week of it landing in trunk...21:48
comstudvishy: and we won't be tolerating bugs with it, so they'll certainly get fixed.21:48
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russellbso if we can get it in asap, should have time to have it solid by release ...21:48
markmc<ttx> every exception we grant is less effort spent on bugfixing21:48
maoythat sounds great21:48
ttxvishy: that's my view... but that doesn't prevent you from discussing if it's wanted at this point21:48
comstudThis is one that will get great exercise by us (rackspace)21:48
markmci.e. the time fixing regressions in this could be spent fixing other things21:48
vishymarkmc: I think this one is pretty important so I'm ok with that21:49
vishymarkmc: are you -1?21:49
maoymarkmc: IMO there is always things to fix. this one is important enough..21:49
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ttxif the worst case scenario is that we get Essex behavior... I think it might not be worth it21:49
markmcvishy, just based on instinct, haven't review too carefully, -021:49
comstudEither way, we'll be running this patch soon21:50
markmcttx, worst case scenario is regressions21:50
comstudwhether it's in trunk or not21:50
eglynnI'm thinking worth risking also21:50
dprincecomstud: see my comment on the review. I can't boot an instance on XenServer w/ SmokeStack using that patch.21:50
comstuddprince: yep, we need to look @ it21:50
dprincecomstud: once it actually works I'm cool w/ it though.21:50
ttxmarkmc: right, that's worst case scenario if you accept it. Worst case scenario if you don't is.. get Essex behavior21:50
markmcttx, ah, right - yes21:51
ttxI think the regression risk can be discussed in the review21:51
ttxand be used as a reason to delay it21:52
comstudNote that this has been up for review for months with everyone overlooking it21:52
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markmccomstud, yes, that's sad21:52
comstudnot everyone, but21:52
comstudit points out a problem nonetheless21:52
markmcthat's a good reason to take the risk actually21:52
markmcour (nova-core's) bad for not reviewing it21:52
ttxvishy: should be tracked as bug, not blueprint ?21:53
russellbi haven't reviewed it, but with comstud saying they'll be using it asap and committing to fixing issues, +1, as it does seem important21:53
russellb(once smokestack issues are resolved of course)21:53
markmci.e. reject stuff that came in late to teach submitters to submit earlier, accept stuff that came in early and wasn't review to teach reviewers to review earlier :)21:53
russellbheh, bad reviewers.21:54
mikalYeah, it sounds like RAX is happy to stand behind this one, which makes it feel a lot safer21:54
vishyttx: there is a bug as well21:54
russellbneed more incentive not to review low hanging fruit :)21:54
vishyttx: i targeted it21:54
dprinceoh the shame :(21:54
comstudRAX is committed to making sure it is solid for release21:54
vishy#info scheduler-resource-race is a bug not a feature so it doesn't need a specific FFE. Will be tracked in a bug21:54
comstudwhether it's in trunk or not :)21:54
vishylets move on :)21:55
ttxvishy: I'd advocate removing the blueprint from folsom/f3, and treat it as a normal bug with a normal review.. only with potential regressions in mind :)21:55
comstudparty on.21:55
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russellbtrunkify it!21:55
*** openstack changes topic to ""21:55
vishy#topic Exception Needed?21:55
*** openstack changes topic to "Exception Needed?"21:55
vishybad copy paste21:55
markmcttx, isn't that a bit processy? it's a big change, the blueprint has useful info, seems worth keeping the bp21:56
vishythis merged already, but it involved a minor rpcapi change:
ttxmarkmc: don't really want to set a precedent that large bugfixes ALSO need a blueprint21:57
markmcare we worried about rpcapi changes posted f-3?21:57
vishyI guess the question is, do bugfixes that modify rpcapi or add minor features to drivers need an FFE?21:57
markmcttx, bps for arch changes are worthwhile IMHO21:57
russellbi think rpcapi changes that are backwards compat are safe any time21:57
markmcvishy, not imo21:57
vishyok good, so lets move on21:58
vishy#topic XML support in Nova21:58
*** openstack changes topic to "XML support in Nova"21:58
vishyjust wanted to update status21:58
vishydansmith has been doing work to get tempest to have xml tests21:58
vishyit is going well but he's having trouble with people giving reviews21:58
ttxvishy: as long as they are motivated by a bugfix, I'm fine with them21:58
dansmithwell, there's a bit more21:59
ttx(about previous topic)21:59
dansmithDaryl was surprised to see the patches in gerrit today21:59
vishyttx cool21:59
dansmithand I thought I was toast21:59
markmcOTOH removing XML support didn't appear to be at all controversial - maybe we should just do it21:59
* markmc runs21:59
vishy#info small backwards compatible changes to rpcapi or drivers do not need FFEs21:59
* vishy slaps markmc21:59
dansmithbut he seems to think that we've got more than he did, or more working, or something.. anyway, he's going to drop his stuff and review ours21:59
dansmithso far, we haven't found anything that doesn't work as advertised with the xml interface, FWIW22:00
vishyI also have some work on xml verification going on here:
dprincedansmith: good to know. Thanks for doing this.22:01
vishymy stuff is specifically trying to get real tested working samples for but it has the side effect of actually testing xml end-to-end. If people like my approach I could use some help extending it to all of the apis and extensions.22:01
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dansmithvishy: on that subject,22:01
markmcvishy, nice!22:01
vishydansmith: i think we will start seeing a lot more errors when we get into the extensions22:01
dansmithI think addSecurityGroup is missing from both xml and json22:01
dansmithvishy: yeah, we're just getting to those22:01
* ttx goes to bed22:01
vishynight ttx22:01
markmcnight ttx22:01
dprincenight ttx22:02
dansmither, missing from the API examples on the website I mean22:02
comstud'night ttx22:02
vishy#info if anyone wants to help with xml support talk to dansmith or vishy22:02
russellbnighty night ttx22:02
vishywe are basically out of time, so lets jump to the last topic real quick22:02
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vishy#topic Bug Stragegy22:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Bug Stragegy"22:03
vishy#topic Bug Strategy22:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Bug Strategy"22:03
* vishy can't type22:03
markmcpersonally, I'd like to do more bug triaging and never seem to get to it22:03
russellbwe should fix some of them22:03
russellbi've been trying to triage some this past week22:03
vishyit sounds like we have a small set of FFE stuff so that should give us lots of time for bugs22:03
russellbit's exhausting sometimes ... lots of junk issues in there :(22:03
markmcweekly nova bug triage day?22:04
markmcmoral support for each other?22:04
eglynnidentifying dups important too to avoid wasted effort22:04
russellbmarkmc: yeah, that would have helped.  i kept wanting to rant :)22:04
vishyi think the most important thing is finding the important bugs and targetting them22:04
vishywe need to know what is critical for release22:04
mikalMaybe we should be talking more about them in IRC?22:04
dprinceYeah. I'm seeing dups for sure. There were actually 2 bugs file for the Keypairs API Get thing that just went in today...22:04
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markmcvishy, that's what triaging is all about :)22:04
russellbneed to get through as many as possible, or searching through gets harder and harder22:04
dprinceI'd actually like to see us *jump* on them rather than let them pile up and have a bug fest.22:05
dprincegotta dig out of the hole sometime though22:06
vishydprince: that is what the next three weeks is for!22:06
markmc3 weeks, is that all?22:06
vishy#info nova-core: stop working on features and focus on bugs!22:06
* markmc looks at the schedule again22:06
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vishymarkmc: might be 5 I can't remember :)22:06
markmcfirst RC is sept 622:07
vishymarkmc: although usually grizzly opens after rc1 which distracts people22:07
markmcweek of sept 622:07
russellbgeez, it is soon22:07
russellbso wait longer to open grizzly?22:07
* markmc repeats himself22:07
vishymarkmc: I'm ok with that22:07
* markmc directs vishy's "I'm ok with that" to russellb 22:08
russellbooh a proxy22:08
russellbso, closer to final RC?22:09
vishyok lets revisit that next week once we see how things are shaping up.22:09
russellbmore than enough bugs to stay busy until then22:09
vishy#info Discuss when to open grizzly at next weeks meeting22:09
russellbas long as we have a support group22:09
vishyanything else?22:09
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comstudit's always a good time to open a grizzly22:09
russellbanother productive meeting, thanks!22:09
dprincegrizzly is hungry!22:10
markmcyeah, these meetings rock22:10
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meeting channel. See for schedule and for meeting logs"22:10
openstackMeeting ended Thu Aug 16 22:10:18 2012 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)22:10
russellbit can hibernate a little longer22:10
openstackMinutes (text):
comstudrussellb: i need a support group22:10
russellbcomstud: :)22:10
filerussellb, you do know I am always available for ranting and/or raving22:11
russellbfile: yessir!22:11
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