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| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o openstack | 15:12 | |
| jd__ | aaahhhhh | 15:13 |
|---|---|---|
| jeblair | jd__: all yours | 15:13 |
| jd__ | #startmeeting ceilometer | 15:13 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Aug 22 15:13:08 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is jd__. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:13 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:13 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ceilometer' | 15:13 |
| jd__ | awesome thansk jeblair | 15:13 |
| jeblair | np | 15:13 |
| jd__ | #topic Review Havana-3 milestone | 15:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Havana-3 milestone (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:13 | |
| terriyu | o/ | 15:13 |
| thomasm | o/ again =] | 15:13 |
| jd__ | #link https://launchpad.net/ceilometer/+milestone/havana-3 | 15:13 |
| dragondm | Whee :> | 15:13 |
| sileht | o/ | 15:13 |
| llu-laptop | o/ | 15:13 |
| jd__ | so there's only 2 weeks left to propose your patches | 15:13 |
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| jd__ | and seeing how long and hard it is to get patches merged, you shouldn't wait for last minute clearly | 15:14 |
| jd__ | we're in good shape I think now, eglynn's coming with some patches as soon as it comes back from vacation | 15:14 |
| jd__ | terriyu made terrible progress on her blueprint | 15:14 |
| gordc | :) | 15:14 |
| terriyu | what? | 15:14 |
| jd__ | terrible as in awesome | 15:15 |
| terriyu | phew | 15:15 |
| jd__ | (not sure that was clear? :) | 15:15 |
| jd__ | sorry, french-ism | 15:15 |
| terriyu | I hope that's not a joke on my name :) | 15:15 |
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| jd__ | haha, no I didn't notice | 15:15 |
| jd__ | well, and the other blueprint are either low or needing code reviews | 15:15 |
| terriyu | yes, I'm working on the group by API blueprint | 15:16 |
| jd__ | we have a long patch queue right now, it'd be good to have more review btw | 15:16 |
| terriyu | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+spec/api-group-by | 15:16 |
| terriyu | I'll try to keep the blueprint up-to-date | 15:16 |
| terriyu | so far I wrote the storage tests and jd did the SQL Alchemy implementation | 15:16 |
| jd__ | and terriyu's patches are a good start for review indeed :) | 15:16 |
| terriyu | I just did the MongoDB implementation | 15:16 |
| maksimov | o/ | 15:16 |
| gordc | will start reviewing again now that i got my patch passing tests | 15:16 |
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| terriyu | so all that's left is the API implementation | 15:17 |
| terriyu | might need your guys help on understanding the API | 15:17 |
| llu-laptop | I'm supposed to have more time for reviewing next week, since not many nova guys are reviewing our patches there. :( | 15:18 |
| jd__ | no problem terriyu | 15:19 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: cool, somehow | 15:19 |
| gordc | llu-laptop: our review page is pretty good once you look at nova's | 15:19 |
| jd__ | yeah | 15:20 |
| * dragondm will contribute +1's ;-> | 15:20 | |
| herndon | but no -1's right? :p | 15:20 |
| llu-laptop | gordc: I just counted nova's reivew page, there are more than 400 pendings | 15:20 |
| dragondm | heh those too, as needed. | 15:20 |
| gordc | llu-laptop: another project branched off nova? | 15:20 |
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| dragondm | nova's sortof an amoeba, keeps dividing. | 15:21 |
| dragondm | but gets bigger again afterword :> | 15:21 |
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| * sileht participes for the first time to the openstack freeze, the zuul queue and the reviews numbers is amazing | 15:22 | |
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| jd__ | #topic Open discussion | 15:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:22 | |
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| llu-laptop | jd__: about the hosts configuration in the pipeline.yaml in patch #link https://review.openstack.org/43072 | 15:23 |
| jd__ | yes, I didn't think it through yet | 15:23 |
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| jd__ | I think it's on the good way but I don't like it as it is, I'd like something more generic if possible | 15:24 |
| jd__ | and if I can't think about something, having another YAML file would be an option I guess | 15:24 |
| llu-laptop | since those hosts configuration is only used by hardware agent, and is kind of independent of pollsters, i don't know how to put it into pipeline.yaml more nicely. | 15:24 |
| llu-laptop | I'm ok with another yaml file, it was my first thought. | 15:25 |
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| sileht | llu-laptop, jd__ I prefer a other file too | 15:25 |
| gordc | llu-laptop: is there a list of hardware metrics that we are targeting? i have some ppl interested in hardware metering | 15:25 |
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| llu-laptop | I'm doing the upstream work based on the code Toni implemented, currently there are only a few metrics there, e.g. cpu utilizations, memory, disk, net, etc. | 15:27 |
| gordc | llu-laptop: ok, so whatever you have so far and we'll add stuff later if needed. | 15:28 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: what we may need is a new filter in pipeline for 'resource' so you can request some meter only for a particular resources | 15:29 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: that'd allow to use it to define which meter you want for which hosts | 15:29 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: now, for the inspectors to use for each host, I don't know how to / if we can put that into the pipeline | 15:29 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: ah we could use an URL scheme for resources indicating the inspector maybe? | 15:30 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: like I want the 'cpu' meter on resources 'snmp://foobar' | 15:30 |
| * jd__ throws ideas | 15:30 | |
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| llu-laptop | jd__: so you're saying adding parameters to the meter part of the pipeline? | 15:32 |
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| jd__ | llu-laptop: 'resources' could be at the same level as 'meters' | 15:33 |
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| llu-laptop | jd__: sorry, I don't catch what your mean by defining 'resources', what does it used for? | 15:35 |
| jd__ | llu-laptop: indicating the host you want to poll for via, e.g. snmp | 15:35 |
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| jd__ | ok I think I'll close the meeting if nobody has anything to say | 15:39 |
| llu-laptop | jd__: so does this mean we coudl use only one YAML file? But this may requires change the PublisherContext. | 15:39 |
| jd__ | we can continue with llu-laptop on #openstack-metering | 15:39 |
| jd__ | llu-laptop: yes that would allow us to have one file indeed | 15:39 |
| llu-laptop | jd__: ok, let's continue on ceilometer channel. | 15:40 |
| jd__ | #endmeeting | 15:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:40 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Aug 22 15:40:32 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:40 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-08-22-15.13.html | 15:40 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-08-22-15.13.txt | 15:40 |
| jd__ | thanks guys :) | 15:40 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-08-22-15.13.log.html | 15:40 |
| thomasm | Thanks! | 15:41 |
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| kgriffs | Python3 meeting going on today? | 16:09 |
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| kgriffs | anybody here for the Python3 mtg? | 16:11 |
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| kgriffs | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings#Python3_Compatibility_Team_meeting | 16:11 |
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| kgriffs | hmm, guess not. :p | 16:12 |
| cppcabrera | I'm here for that meeting, kgriffs. :P | 16:12 |
| kgriffs | I was hoping to get a status update, and see what the Marconi team could do to help | 16:12 |
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| cppcabrera | woot | 16:13 |
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| mtreinish | startmeeting qa | 17:00 |
| mtreinish | #startmeeting qa | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Aug 22 17:00:51 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mtreinish. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'qa' | 17:00 |
| mtreinish | hi who's around for the meeting? | 17:01 |
| mlavalle | I am | 17:01 |
| afazekas | hi | 17:01 |
| tkammer | hi | 17:01 |
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| mtreinish | ok let's get started then | 17:01 |
| mtreinish | here's the agenda: | 17:01 |
| mtreinish | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/QATeamMeeting | 17:01 |
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| mtreinish | So i'm up first on the agenda | 17:02 |
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| mtreinish | #topic testr-status | 17:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "testr-status (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:02 | |
| mtreinish | So I've been working through some of the bugs on parallel tempest | 17:02 |
| mtreinish | we're in the home stretch | 17:02 |
| mtreinish | right now all that's left are the 3 bugs from last week | 17:03 |
| mtreinish | and neutron doesn't work at all in parallel right now | 17:03 |
| mtreinish | but once I sort out the neutron fail we might be able to greenlight this | 17:03 |
| mtreinish | if we hit too many random fails we can alway just pull it out and go back to serial | 17:03 |
| afazekas | Yes there is many nova-neutron "race" issue .. | 17:04 |
| mtreinish | but we've pretty much reached the point where this won't go any further unless we start gating on it | 17:04 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: well right now we don't run with tenant isolation on neutron | 17:05 |
| mtreinish | and also the neutron smoke run hits resource name conflicts and fails | 17:05 |
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| afazekas | mtreinish: I would be very surprised if those would be tenant isolation related things .. (may be some of them) | 17:05 |
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| mtreinish | afazekas: I don't think the resource conflict is a tenant isolation thing. But we need it for the non neutron specific tests to pass | 17:06 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: yes | 17:06 |
| mtreinish | ok does anyone else have anything else about testr parallel? | 17:07 |
| mtreinish | ok then before I move on I was just curious how many people are running with parallel? | 17:07 |
| mtreinish | or at least tried it | 17:07 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: sooner or later I try to split the test to more devstack node, can I add tox entry for that if it is necessary ? | 17:08 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: I'm not following. Split which tests? | 17:08 |
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| afazekas | AFAIK the subunit is able to distribute the test cases to multiple node, sooner or later I will try is it working with tempest | 17:09 |
| dkranz | Here. Sorry I was in the wrong channel :( | 17:09 |
| afazekas | I think it will require multiple similar system to be installed | 17:10 |
| mtreinish | oh, yeah that's something we can look into down the road, but for right now we need to concentrate on getting parallel single node working | 17:10 |
| afazekas | ok | 17:10 |
| mtreinish | ok then does anyone have anything else to add on testr parallel? | 17:11 |
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| mtreinish | ok then moving on. | 17:12 |
| mtreinish | #topic stress test status | 17:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "stress test status (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:12 | |
| mtreinish | mkoderer told me he can't make today's meeting | 17:12 |
| mtreinish | so does anyone else have something they want to bring up about stress tests | 17:12 |
| mtreinish | otherwise we'll move on | 17:12 |
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| mtreinish | ok then let's move on | 17:14 |
| mlavalle | mtreinish: I want to report on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/fix-gate-tempest-devstack-vm-quantum-full | 17:14 |
| mtreinish | #topic Other blueprint status | 17:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Other blueprint status (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:14 | |
| mtreinish | mlavalle: ok go ahead | 17:14 |
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| mtreinish | we really should add neutron testing status to the agenda for next week | 17:14 |
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| mlavalle | mtreinish: achieving progress. Right now I am working on this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/tempest/+bug/1182384 | 17:15 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1182384 in nova "SecurityGroups Tests : invalid id must be valid uuid " [High,In progress] | 17:15 |
| afazekas | #action Add the neutron status to the next meeting Agenda | 17:15 |
| mlavalle | last night I added a comment to this bug. I would like feedback from the team on that | 17:15 |
| mlavalle | it doesn't have to be in this meeting, but I need it to move ahead | 17:16 |
| mtreinish | mlavalle: ok looking at the bug it's more of the response code differences between nova network and neutron | 17:16 |
| mtreinish | or is there something more too it? | 17:16 |
| mlavalle | no, it is the response codes. | 17:17 |
| mtreinish | mlavalle: ok we can move this on to the qa channel after the meeting because I think there is a more detailed discussion to be had about this | 17:18 |
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| sileht | /17 | 17:18 |
| mlavalle | that's what I want | 17:18 |
| mtreinish | mlavalle: :) | 17:18 |
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| mtreinish | ok is there anything else on neutron? | 17:19 |
| mlavalle | not on my side | 17:19 |
| mtreinish | ok then does anyone else have a blueprint they'd like to bring up | 17:19 |
| mtreinish | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/havana | 17:19 |
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| mtreinish | ok let's go to the next topic then | 17:21 |
| mtreinish | #topic critical review | 17:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "critical review (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:21 | |
| mtreinish | Does anyone have any reviews that they would like to bring up | 17:21 |
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| dkranz | mtreinish: It would be nice to get https://review.openstack.org/#/c/36367/ in | 17:22 |
| afazekas | In the heat topic I have 3 | 17:22 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: Heat stuff waiting for +A | 17:22 |
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| dkranz | OK, wait for next topic. | 17:23 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: ok I'll take a look after the meeting | 17:23 |
| mtreinish | I really don't have much experience with heat though | 17:23 |
| afazekas | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/36367/ this is good according to the jenkins | 17:23 |
| afazekas | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/36367/ this will run with new job | 17:23 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: that doesn't get run with jenkins right now | 17:24 |
| mtreinish | because we exclude the slow tag | 17:24 |
| afazekas | there is two change set | 17:24 |
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| dkranz | mtreinish: I don't either. | 17:25 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: you pasted the same link as dkranz twice | 17:25 |
| afazekas | the auto-scaling is not running as it submintted now | 17:25 |
| afazekas | sorry copy paste issue :) | 17:25 |
| afazekas | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/34866/ | 17:25 |
| mtreinish | well this segways into the next topic, so before that does anyone else have any non-heat related reviews to bring up? | 17:26 |
| mtreinish | ok lets move on to the heat topic | 17:27 |
| mtreinish | #topic Heat test merge | 17:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Heat test merge (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:27 | |
| mtreinish | afazekas: take it away | 17:27 |
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| afazekas | So there is 2 very old heat rlated changeset which is not merged since long, and did not get negative response as well | 17:28 |
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| mtreinish | afazekas: those are the 2 you pasted before? | 17:29 |
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| afazekas | yes | 17:29 |
| afazekas | and there is tox related change from dkranz | 17:29 |
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| dkranz | mtreinish: I am going to mark that last one not WIP. | 17:30 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: well I'd like to see dkranz get in before anything that uses the slow tag | 17:30 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: The issue was where we put the slow heat tests to be recognized . | 17:30 |
| mtreinish | so we can add a nonvoting (at first) slow tag job on the check queue | 17:30 |
| afazekas | dkranz: Imho you should remove the '\.orchestration' from the regexp | 17:30 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: I am going to push all the stuff for the slow heat job tomorrow. | 17:31 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: ok | 17:31 |
| dkranz | afazekas: But then we will get non-heat tests that happen to be marked slow | 17:31 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: do we have any of those? | 17:31 |
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| dkranz | mtreinish: Not yet, but we don't want the slow heat job to start picking up new stuff by accident. | 17:32 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: I think we should put the slow heat scenario tests in their own subdir of scenario. | 17:32 |
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| afazekas | dkranz: will be on the slow job, I am not sure we want to prevent this in this way. Now non of the other test cases has the slow tag . | 17:32 |
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| mtreinish | well, I'm just wondering even if we have non slow heat jobs do we really want that to be a separate run | 17:32 |
| mtreinish | sorry, slow non-heat tests | 17:33 |
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| afazekas | dkranz: the auto-scaling test case not submited into the scenario/orchestration | 17:33 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: It is a problem to have a job that runs all slow tests that happen to show up. | 17:33 |
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| dkranz | afazekas: I know. I'm suggesting we change that. | 17:33 |
| dkranz | afazekas: sbaker was OK with that. | 17:33 |
| dkranz | afazekas: And then leave the regexp as is. | 17:34 |
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| dkranz | I can't see any harm in that. | 17:34 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: ok, I'm fine with splitting it out as heat specific. We can always revisit the discussion when/if we have a non-heat slow test | 17:34 |
| afazekas | dkranz: for me both cases is ok, I just would like to see some progress | 17:34 |
| dkranz | And it dosn't leave bombs for the future. | 17:34 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: the other thing I suggest is that we default it to be parallel | 17:34 |
| mtreinish | I don't think we should add new jobs that aren't parallel | 17:35 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: OK. | 17:35 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: I'm still a slight bit concerned that tests only have to pass once in parallel to become part of the gate. | 17:35 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: But I guess that's where we are at this point. | 17:35 |
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| mtreinish | dkranz: yeah, I mean once we move everything to parallel we'll have 3 runs of parallel | 17:36 |
| mtreinish | but it's an issue | 17:36 |
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| mtreinish | which is why I want to get things merged soon(liek end of this week, first thing next week) for parallel | 17:36 |
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| dkranz | mtreinish: OK, I will change my regexp off of WIP, submit the slow test job stuff, and get sbaker to move the test to orchestration subdir. | 17:37 |
| mtreinish | dkranz: ok sounds good | 17:37 |
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| afazekas | dkranz: I am also concerned about this kind of issues does not gets higher priority https://bugs.launchpad.net/tempest/+bug/1205344 | 17:37 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: There is already a slow job in api so it will run | 17:37 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1205344 in nova "mkfs error in test_stamp_pattern" [High,Confirmed] | 17:37 |
| mtreinish | ok is there anything else to talk about on this topic? | 17:38 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: Don't think so. | 17:39 |
| mtreinish | ok then let's move on | 17:39 |
| mtreinish | #topic Devstack independent tempest usage | 17:39 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Devstack independent tempest usage (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:39 | |
| mtreinish | afazekas: this one is yours too | 17:39 |
| dkranz | afazekas: Is this Tal's script? | 17:39 |
| dkranz | afazekas: The topic? | 17:39 |
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| afazekas | Long time ago we discussed would be nice to add something for help use tempest for non-gating, with a not devstack installed openstack | 17:40 |
| afazekas | dkranz: yes | 17:40 |
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| afazekas | Tal stated a script for helping https://review.openstack.org/#/c/42920/ | 17:41 |
| afazekas | I would like craftily some details how to move forward | 17:41 |
| tkammer | s/Tal/tkammer :) | 17:41 |
| dkranz | afazekas: Why did you +1 instead of +2? | 17:41 |
| afazekas | dkranz: I just wanted to discuss it first :) | 17:42 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: so I'm confused by the script it takes a tempest.conf to configure openstack? Isn't that the opposite of what we talked about before? | 17:42 |
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| afazekas | mtreinish: it creates users for testing | 17:43 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: it will get options for more use cases | 17:43 |
| mtreinish | tempest already does that with tenant isolation | 17:43 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: does it in every case now ? | 17:44 |
| tkammer | mtreinish, it uses both the tempest.conf file for "default" parameters such as the username/password (and more in the future if needed), and for other stuff it updates that conf file for later use of Tempest itself | 17:44 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: everything but keystone which needs some work | 17:44 |
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| afazekas | mtreinish: the script has options, and can be extended with more automation, or make optional some unwanted behavior | 17:45 |
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| mtreinish | afazekas: ok, I'll need to take a more detailed look to get a better idea of what it's doing. | 17:46 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: So the question is , is the script in this form got for merge and extending with futures when it is needed, or it should do little more ? | 17:46 |
| mtreinish | afazekas: well, I'm not exactly sure what it's doing now so I can't really answer that. | 17:47 |
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| mtreinish | how about we defer this till next week so everyone can get a chance to look at it in detail? | 17:48 |
| mtreinish | (or maybe just me :) ) | 17:48 |
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| afazekas | mtreinish: I think it should do just basic things first and evolve | 17:48 |
| afazekas | mtreinish: ok :) | 17:49 |
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| mtreinish | #action review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/42920/ for discussion during next week's meeting | 17:49 |
| mtreinish | ok then let's move on | 17:49 |
| mtreinish | #topic Adding test plans for new features into the tempest repo | 17:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding test plans for new features into the tempest repo (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:50 | |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: this is you | 17:50 |
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| mkollaro | so, I was wondering if we could add test plans for the new features in some nice .rst or .md format to the tempest repo | 17:50 |
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| mkollaro | would that be a problem? | 17:51 |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: what do you mean by test plans? | 17:51 |
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| mkollaro | mtreinish: test #1, upload file to swift; test #2, remove file from swift | 17:51 |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: so you mean human readable descriptions of the tests? | 17:52 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: we are currently writing these kinds of test plans for the havanna release and we want to share them on upstream | 17:52 |
| notmyname | mkollaro: hopefully a little more detailed than that :-) | 17:52 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: yes, but only of new stuff (I wouldn't want to document those ~800 existing tests) | 17:52 |
| mkollaro | notmyname: of course :D | 17:52 |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: oh, so if it's only new tests then I'd say a blueprint is the right place for it | 17:53 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: yeah, but the interface to them sucks | 17:53 |
| mtreinish | you can link the blueprint to a wiki page and include as much detail as you want on that | 17:53 |
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| mkollaro | mtreinish: git has a history and it's easy to work with multiple people | 17:53 |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: so do wikis | 17:54 |
| mkollaro | well, if you can recommend some place, sure...but simple .md files could be parsed and put into some systems that would make my manager happy :D | 17:54 |
| mkollaro | wikis are a bit harder to parse | 17:54 |
| mkollaro | test plans are just pseudo code, it's better to use git for them | 17:55 |
| mtreinish | that's fair, but our procedure for this kind of plan documentation is blueprints and if more detail or collaboration is needed we put it on the wiki | 17:55 |
| mtreinish | but you can link to a git repo with your plan in .md | 17:56 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: what procedure? I barely ever see any test plans written in upstream | 17:56 |
| mtreinish | I'm just don't think this kind of thing should live in the tempest repo | 17:56 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: nobody wants to use that and so nobody uses that | 17:56 |
| mkollaro | mtreinish: yeah, if tempest doesn't want it we'll put it into a separate github repo, but I guess it would be nicer to have it in tempest | 17:57 |
| mtreinish | mkollaro: so we're almost out of time (~3min) can we take this discussion to the -qa channel after the meeting | 17:57 |
| mkollaro | ok | 17:57 |
| mtreinish | #topic open discussion | 17:57 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:57 | |
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| mtreinish | so in the last ~2min does anyone have anything else? | 17:57 |
| dkranz | mtreinish: Nothing from me. | 17:58 |
| * afazekas nothing from my side, I will not be here after the meeting | 17:58 | |
| *** thomasbiege2 is now known as thomasbiege | 17:58 | |
| mtreinish | ok then I guess we'll end it here today | 17:59 |
| mtreinish | thanks everyone | 17:59 |
| mtreinish | #endmeeting | 17:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Aug 22 17:59:27 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-08-22-17.00.html | 17:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-08-22-17.00.txt | 17:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-08-22-17.00.log.html | 17:59 |
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| bdpayne | #startmeeting OpenStack Security Group | 18:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Aug 22 18:00:40 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is bdpayne. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_security_group' | 18:00 |
| bdpayne | hi OSSG | 18:01 |
| bdpayne | who's here today? | 18:01 |
| thomasbiege | hey! | 18:01 |
| bpb | hi | 18:01 |
| rellerreller | hello | 18:01 |
| bdpayne | excellent, let's get started | 18:02 |
| thomasbiege | btw, review.openstack.org seems to be down | 18:02 |
| anteaya | it was restarted | 18:02 |
| thomasbiege | ah, ok | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | I only have a few things for the agenda, so let me know if you have others | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | I have: | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | 1) discussing the new wiki page | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | 2) discussing addressing security review requests | 18:03 |
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| bdpayne | 3) discussing ongoing projects | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | 4) discussing the logo effort | 18:03 |
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| bdpayne | what else would people like to talk about? | 18:04 |
| thomasbiege | maybe there is an open action item from our ML | 18:04 |
| bdpayne | ? | 18:04 |
| thomasbiege | the common state of security slide deck is open AFAIK | 18:04 |
| bdpayne | oh, yes | 18:04 |
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| malini1 | greetings | 18:04 |
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| thomasbiege | hi malini1 | 18:05 |
| bdpayne | hi, we're just discussing agenda items | 18:05 |
| bdpayne | ok, I think I'm organized over here | 18:06 |
| bdpayne | we can begin :-) | 18:06 |
| bdpayne | #topic new wiki page | 18:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "new wiki page (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:06 | |
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| bdpayne | https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TmygsnqU2MeHMYf_mqIV_dZpDaeLEzR7mGSE9n9SWKk/edit?usp=sharing | 18:06 |
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| bdpayne | I've still been receiving nice feedback on the page. | 18:06 |
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| bdpayne | Or rather the content that I want to put up | 18:06 |
| bdpayne | Is there anyone that hasn't seen it / commented yet? | 18:07 |
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| bdpayne | ok, I'll take that as a no | 18:07 |
| joel-coffman | I've looked through it a couple of times, and it looks good to me | 18:07 |
| bdpayne | so, here's my plan on this | 18:07 |
| bdpayne | #action bdpayne will move ahead with making some edits and posting the wiki page this week | 18:08 |
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| bdpayne | Since it is a wiki, we can always work together to improve it over time as well | 18:08 |
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| bdpayne | and getting something up as a starting place is useful | 18:08 |
| sriramhere | hello all - sorry i was in the wrong channel. | 18:08 |
| joel-coffman | agreed | 18:09 |
| bdpayne | hi sriramhere, welcome and glad you made it | 18:09 |
| malini1 | :)Good work on the page | 18:09 |
| bdpayne | ok, I think that's all about the wiki page | 18:09 |
| bdpayne | so I'll move foward | 18:09 |
| bdpayne | #topic security slide deck | 18:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "security slide deck (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:09 | |
| bdpayne | malini1 you had volunteered to work on this, any updates? | 18:09 |
| malini1 | I have a confession -- got started on it, checked the email thread, started, but not enough progress to share this week | 18:10 |
| malini1 | was distracted by other deliverables at this end, sorry | 18:10 |
| bdpayne | np, understandable | 18:10 |
| sriramhere | malini1 - if you want an extra hand on that, i can help. would like to contribute | 18:10 |
| malini1 | :-) will rope you in sriramhere | 18:11 |
| sriramhere | thx | 18:11 |
| bdpayne | excellent | 18:11 |
| bdpayne | @action @malini1 to continue work on slide deck, and will get help from sriramhere | 18:12 |
| malini1 | late in the day question, how does one get from IM name to email? | 18:12 |
| sriramhere | my email is sriram@sriramhere.com if it is easier for u. WHOIS might help | 18:12 |
| malini1 | never mind sriramhere, have your email contact from a message from bdpayne | 18:13 |
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| bdpayne | #topic security review requests | 18:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "security review requests (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:13 | |
| malini1 | :)I did a couple of those! | 18:14 |
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| bdpayne | Question for the group… are you on the openstack-security mailing list? | 18:14 |
| thomasbiege | yes :) | 18:14 |
| joel-coffman | yes | 18:14 |
| bpb | yes | 18:14 |
| bdpayne | groovy | 18:14 |
| rellerreller | yes | 18:14 |
| bdpayne | so, if anyone is not please join http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-security | 18:15 |
| malini1 | yes | 18:15 |
| bdpayne | the volume is relatively low | 18:15 |
| sriramhere | are we tagging [ossg] to the subjects still? | 18:15 |
| bdpayne | as you guys have seen, we do get pinged semi-regularly for security review help | 18:15 |
| sriramhere | in the emails i meant | 18:15 |
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| bdpayne | [OSSG] can go in subject on emails to openstack-dev, but not necessary on the openstack-security list | 18:16 |
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| bdpayne | fwiw, if you put [OSSG] in subject on opentack dev, my email client treats it as higher priority ;-) | 18:16 |
| sriramhere | :) | 18:16 |
| thomasbiege | I unsubscribed from openstack-dev | 18:16 |
| bdpayne | yeah, it's pretty high volume | 18:17 |
| bdpayne | anyway, my point is this | 18:17 |
| bdpayne | we are being asked to review stuff | 18:17 |
| bdpayne | and often we are not following through | 18:17 |
| bdpayne | I would argue that these security reviews may be the single most useful thing we can do for the openstack community | 18:17 |
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| bdpayne | and it's a great way for people to get involved | 18:17 |
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| sriramhere | ok, n00b question - are the emails to openstack-security list our way to communicate such requests to the groups? | 18:18 |
| bdpayne | so… any suggestions for how we can encourage more to take part in this process? | 18:18 |
| sriramhere | or do we track them as bugs? | 18:18 |
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| thomasbiege | maybe involve developers with interest in security. I don't have any python knowledge | 18:18 |
| bdpayne | sriramhere not sure I understand your question, but emails are sent to openstack-security mailing list when someone files a security bug or when someone marks a review as having securityimpact | 18:19 |
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| bdpayne | more developers would be good | 18:19 |
| malini1 | i will spread the word about the list at Intel to get my colleagues to participate. Some in China wanted to join this meeting, but it is hard, so i represent our team here | 18:19 |
| joel-coffman | anyway to find all Gerrit reviews that include "SecurityImpact" | 18:19 |
| bdpayne | OSSG has actually grown quite a bit | 18:19 |
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| sriramhere | ok that answers my question. thx | 18:19 |
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| thomasbiege | maybe some person are well known for their security knowledge, maybe calling for help on the next summit would help | 18:20 |
| bdpayne | we actually have 74 people that are members of OSSG on launchpad | 18:20 |
| thomasbiege | and only 20% are active I assume | 18:20 |
| bdpayne | and we tend to have about 5-8 in the weekly meetings | 18:20 |
| bdpayne | right | 18:20 |
| joel-coffman | based on some that I've seen, what we really need are developers who are already familiar with the project *and* have an interest in security | 18:20 |
| bdpayne | so, I'd like to explore tapping into that interest a bit more | 18:21 |
| bdpayne | joel-coffman I agree | 18:21 |
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| joel-coffman | I'm not familiar with enough of the code to be much good sometimes | 18:21 |
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| bdpayne | I'm not sure, but I wonder how many people that are members of the group fit into that category | 18:21 |
| bdpayne | perhaps a simple email to the group would help | 18:21 |
| bdpayne | specifically to the launchpad group | 18:21 |
| thomasbiege | what about goiing back to openstack-dev with the review request and asking for help there | 18:21 |
| * joel-coffman will try to review more as time allows | 18:21 | |
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| bdpayne | going back to openstack-dev is kind of circular | 18:22 |
| thomasbiege | ;) ok | 18:22 |
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| bdpayne | they are basically the ones asking use for security help | 18:22 |
| rellerreller | I think it would be better to be involved in the design phase then the code review. | 18:22 |
| bdpayne | yes, this is true too | 18:22 |
| thomasbiege | yes, but maybe to the wrong ppl :) | 18:22 |
| rellerreller | That way if you don't know the code then it is easier to participate | 18:22 |
| joel-coffman | rellerreller: agreed | 18:22 |
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| bdpayne | the design phase is hard with openstack | 18:23 |
| bdpayne | lots of back room discussions | 18:23 |
| malini1 | that means tag blueprints as security-impact | 18:23 |
| rellerreller | +1 | 18:23 |
| bdpayne | malini1 is that possible? | 18:23 |
| thomasbiege | malini1: good idea | 18:23 |
| sriramhere | +1, but not sure if that would slow the design discussions | 18:23 |
| malini1 | not today, but we could ask the Gods of opnestack to add such an alert?/tag? | 18:23 |
| bdpayne | slow is sometimes good | 18:23 |
| joel-coffman | also need to ensure sufficient information regarding the design is available | 18:23 |
| bdpayne | ok, so I see a few separate things here | 18:24 |
| joel-coffman | three line blueprint with SecurityImpact won't be much help | 18:24 |
| bdpayne | first, we should email the launchpad group to see if there are people wanting to help with code reviews | 18:24 |
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| bdpayne | perhaps after the wiki page is posted | 18:24 |
| bdpayne | so we can refer people there | 18:24 |
| bdpayne | #action bdpayne to email launchpad group to attempt to spark interest in code reviews | 18:25 |
| thomasbiege | ome of my colleagues do code reviews that have sec impact… maybe I could ask them to get more invovled | 18:25 |
| bdpayne | second, we should see if there's a way to get a security impact tag on blueprints | 18:25 |
| malini1 | joel-coffman -- 3 lines is another discussion, there was commentary on openstack mailing list about how sometimes code born first before blueprint (like a checkbox done) | 18:25 |
| thomasbiege | ome=some | 18:25 |
| bdpayne | thomasbiege that would be helpful, thanks | 18:25 |
| sriramhere | bpayne - whom to ping on adding new tag to bps? | 18:25 |
| joel-coffman | yes, just pointing out the difficultly given the *current* state of affairs | 18:26 |
| bdpayne | I'm not sure who to ask about the blueprint tagging | 18:26 |
| sriramhere | @annegentle? | 18:26 |
| malini1 | let us try theirry for tagging | 18:26 |
| bdpayne | perhaps start with Theirry | 18:26 |
| bdpayne | yeah | 18:26 |
| bdpayne | anyone want to take that on? | 18:27 |
| sriramhere | ok, i can take that | 18:27 |
| sriramhere | #action sriramhere to ping Theirry on adding new security tag to blueprints | 18:27 |
| bdpayne | #action sriramhere will talk with Theirry about getting a SecurityImpact tag added to blueprints… net affect should be that it emails the openstack-security mailing list | 18:27 |
| bdpayne | heh, yeah that! | 18:27 |
| sriramhere | ok | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | third, of course, is to encourage better blueprints | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | this is where I was making a reference to backroom discussions, and code before design and such | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | I think that there isn't too much we can do here | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | but, one suggestion, is to be a little more strategic with how we attend the upcoming summit | 18:28 |
| thomasbiege | related to this, is there a howto to write blueprint? | 18:29 |
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| sriramhere | i was about to chime on that - when bps get reviews, we can raise security impact there | 18:29 |
| bdpayne | we should coordinate to get good coverage of the design sessions and report back to OSSG on how we should engage with new ideas | 18:29 |
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| bdpayne | thomasbiege there is, but I don't have it handy…see the openstack how to contribute guide | 18:30 |
| malini1 | bdpayne -- excellent idea on coverage at summit | 18:30 |
| bdpayne | #topic Final Words | 18:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Final Words (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:30 | |
| thomasbiege | bdpayne: ok | 18:30 |
| bdpayne | look at the time… we're about done here | 18:30 |
| bdpayne | one more quick note | 18:30 |
| thomasbiege | too bad | 18:30 |
| e-vad | blueprints - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Process#Creating_Blueprints | 18:30 |
| thomasbiege | thx | 18:30 |
| bdpayne | I have an artist lined up for working on the OSSG logo | 18:30 |
| malini1 | WOW!!! | 18:30 |
| sriramhere | woohoo, skulls/ eye patches :) | 18:31 |
| joel-coffman | great! | 18:31 |
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| bdpayne | waiting on approval from the openstack people on the intial design before moving ahead with that | 18:31 |
| thomasbiege | cool | 18:31 |
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| bdpayne | so, hopefully I'll have something pretty to share next week | 18:31 |
| bdpayne | stay tuned | 18:31 |
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| bdpayne | thanks eveyone, feel free to continue these and any other discussions on openstack-security mailing list | 18:31 |
| malini1 | bye | 18:32 |
| sriramhere | thanks | 18:32 |
| rlp | bye | 18:32 |
| thomasbiege | cya | 18:32 |
| bpb | thanks | 18:32 |
| e-vad | bye | 18:32 |
| bdpayne | #endmeeting | 18:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:32 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Aug 22 18:32:11 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:32 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-08-22-18.00.html | 18:32 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-08-22-18.00.txt | 18:32 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-08-22-18.00.log.html | 18:32 |
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| harlowja | #startmeeting openstack-state-management | 20:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Aug 22 20:00:11 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is harlowja. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack-state-management)" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_state_management' | 20:00 |
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| harlowja | hola | 20:00 |
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| jlucci | (: | 20:00 |
| harlowja | \o/ | 20:00 |
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| harlowja | | | 20:00 |
| harlowja | /\ | 20:00 |
| changbl | hi there | 20:01 |
| melnikov | hi there | 20:01 |
| harlowja | hiii | 20:01 |
| adrian_otto | o/ | 20:01 |
| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/StateManagement#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 20:01 |
| harlowja | so lets get started! | 20:02 |
| harlowja | #topic status | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "status (Meeting topic: openstack-state-management)" | 20:02 | |
| harlowja | anything anyone wants to say about status items that they might be doing | 20:02 |
| harlowja | i've been in alot of meetings @ y! and am trying to rework a little of the cinder code i did, splitting it up into more files for easier maintaince for them | 20:02 |
| harlowja | and readjusted the persistence layer and am updating the resumption logbook code to use it | 20:03 |
| harlowja | thats currently it from me, watching code reviews and helping there to :) | 20:03 |
| harlowja | and talking to other people about integration | 20:03 |
| jlucci | Yeah, I'm actually currently trying talk trove integration in their IRC | 20:04 |
| jlucci | heh | 20:04 |
| jlucci | They're having a task scheduler meeting | 20:04 |
| harlowja | :) | 20:04 |
| jlucci | That got postponed until about another 15 min, so that will wait a bit | 20:04 |
| jlucci | haha | 20:04 |
| jlucci | But mostly I've been working on trove integration | 20:05 |
| harlowja | ya, same with me and glance, trying to do doulble-meetings, not so easy, ha | 20:05 |
| kebray | hi, I'm present. | 20:05 |
| jlucci | Ah, yeah | 20:05 |
| harlowja | hi kebray | 20:05 |
| harlowja | melnikov and anastia i think are busy helping out make taskflow core be really good | 20:06 |
| melnikov | i've been working on pattern/engines stuff with akarpinska; then taskflow decorators came in the way, and i refactored them a bit | 20:06 |
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| harlowja | sweet | 20:06 |
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| jlucci | Yeah - I really liked your git-review for that melnikov | 20:06 |
| jlucci | Forgot to comment on it and what not though. :x | 20:06 |
| changbl | I read through the code in examples, and plans to read the persistence code when it is done by harlowja. Also people in my group are working a cloud QoS project and are very interested in taskflow .We probably will use the library. | 20:06 |
| harlowja | awesome! | 20:07 |
| harlowja | thx changbl ! | 20:07 |
| jlucci | :D | 20:07 |
| changbl | np ~ thanks for making this great library, folks | 20:07 |
| harlowja | it will be super great soon to! | 20:08 |
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| harlowja | changbl anything u think dislike/like maybe u have some thoughts on to, maybe can discuss later | 20:08 |
| harlowja | the more feedback (good, bad, sucky) is useful always | 20:08 |
| kebray | anytime someone pulls TaskFlow into a project, and if it's a positive experience, I'd love to see a shout out for it on the dev mailing list, or a link to a video demo showing the integration or a link to a blog article about how it's helped. just saying :-) | 20:09 |
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| jlucci | videos! | 20:09 |
| jlucci | haha | 20:09 |
| jlucci | I just wow'd the trove room with my video. They're thinking about making a sock puppet version | 20:09 |
| harlowja | lol | 20:09 |
| harlowja | +2 | 20:09 |
| jlucci | haha | 20:09 |
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| jlucci | But yeah, +1 kebray. Happiness everytime someone pulls in taskflow. :P | 20:10 |
| harlowja | +1 | 20:10 |
| changbl | +1 kebray | 20:10 |
| harlowja | coolness this flows into a good next topic, unless other status anyone has? | 20:11 |
| kebray | topic: vote for presentation? | 20:11 |
| harlowja | #action harlowja make sock puppet video of taskflow too | 20:11 |
| changbl | right now in the examples, i feel a bit awkward to specify tasks: provides, requires, __call__, not sure how we can make it simpler, though. I will take a deep look at harlowja 's create_volume code in cinder | 20:11 |
| harlowja | changbl yes, its a known contention point, the way to establish dependencies between tasks | 20:12 |
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| harlowja | i'm not sure if melnikov wants to change that, or wait for that change, unsure | 20:12 |
| harlowja | lets hold on this discussion though | 20:12 |
| harlowja | kebray lets jump into one more topic before yours | 20:12 |
| harlowja | #topic coordination | 20:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "coordination (Meeting topic: openstack-state-management)" | 20:12 | |
| ekarlso- | I use billingstack :) | 20:13 |
| harlowja | ekarlso- +1 | 20:13 |
| ekarlso- | with TF | 20:13 |
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| harlowja | so with the ongoing work integrating and awareness of taskflow, and dev<->dev communication, its picking up steam, which is great | 20:13 |
| harlowja | i'm just wondering if we want to designate a person to do this nearly full-time, like talk to glance folks, talk to others about not recreating taskflow, but integrating with it instead | 20:14 |
| harlowja | and getting concepts that they have that taskflow doesn't have (and which make sense) in taskflow | 20:14 |
| harlowja | sorta like a integration person if u will | 20:14 |
| harlowja | looking for volunteers, i don't mind trying to do it also, but that means less time coding | 20:14 |
| harlowja | i just think the importance of reach-out is getting more important, trove, glance and others i think are recreating there own mini-task thingies | 20:15 |
| harlowja | and if we educate/interact with them we can likely redirect there energy instead of creating there own | 20:15 |
| harlowja | thoughts? | 20:15 |
| harlowja | i know we have docs, but not everyone reads them (so thats where the interaction comes into play) | 20:16 |
| harlowja | kebray adrian_otto maybe u have some thoughts releated to this, since u guys have more experience here | 20:16 |
| harlowja | *more experience than me | 20:16 |
| kebray | harlowja I think we spread the work for now.. and, use this meeting to coordinate reach-out-efforts. I spend most of my week on Heat. adrian_otto has a bunch of other things he regularly works on.. but, we can all help. | 20:17 |
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| harlowja | ok, maybe thats ok for now to | 20:18 |
| adrian_otto | ok | 20:18 |
| kebray | If you can make it your FT job, awesome! FWIW, jlucci is 100% TaskFlow... so, I can help her connect with others too. | 20:18 |
| adrian_otto | (reading scrollback) | 20:18 |
| harlowja | lets see, i'm not sure about FT integration person yet, but maybe :) | 20:19 |
| harlowja | if i need to do that, i will :-P | 20:19 |
| * kebray thinks harlowja and jlucci will connect best with the other devs... and, myself can connect best with other engineering managers and product managers. | 20:19 | |
| adrian_otto | Documentation should be out top priority | 20:19 |
| adrian_otto | s/out/our/ | 20:19 |
| harlowja | agreed, still though, people just don't read it, ha | 20:19 |
| kebray | i.e. make it simple. | 20:19 |
| harlowja | k | 20:20 |
| adrian_otto | I'm happy to carry the evangelism role, which I intend to continue at the HKG summit | 20:20 |
| adrian_otto | but if the docs are not awesome, it's going to fall to the devs with the first hand knowledge of the code | 20:20 |
| harlowja | i think kebray is a good idea, 2 types of evanagelism i think | 20:20 |
| harlowja | agreed, adrian_otto the docs should be awesome | 20:20 |
| harlowja | i think i might spend a piece of my day tommorow scanning through them for improvements | 20:21 |
| adrian_otto | in terms of answering the full time role, I doubt that's practical for this particular project | 20:21 |
| harlowja | #action harlowja scan through wiki, adjust and make better | 20:21 |
| harlowja | adrian_otto well not full time, until critical mass though reachout seems like it would be a fulltime thing | 20:21 |
| harlowja | but maybe not | 20:21 |
| adrian_otto | I would prioritize making the solution compelling and helpful, and producing docs to match | 20:21 |
| adrian_otto | all of the most successful open source projects had great documentaion | 20:22 |
| adrian_otto | because docs scale, where handholding does not. | 20:22 |
| harlowja | sure, maybe we can just continue managing both, code and docs and reachout, i think we've been doing it pretty well so far | 20:22 |
| harlowja | agreed, handholding doesn't in the end | 20:22 |
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| adrian_otto | we should offer handholding to key groups in the beginning | 20:23 |
| harlowja | well not just key groups, anyone and everyone i think :) | 20:23 |
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| adrian_otto | particularly those projects that can really benefit from using the library | 20:23 |
| harlowja | sure | 20:23 |
| adrian_otto | well, adoption is important, but having it adopted where it makes a meaningful difference counts more. | 20:24 |
| jlucci | FYI guys - in the middle of trove IRC convincing them taskflow is awesome. If you need me, just @ me | 20:24 |
| harlowja | hmmm, that brings in the definition of 'meaningful' | 20:24 |
| adrian_otto | yes, indeed. | 20:24 |
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| adrian_otto | that means that users of the end solution get something as a result… like a new feature, better performance **better relaibility**, crash recovery, etc. as a result of using Taskflow | 20:25 |
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| adrian_otto | the story needs to be more than "I wrote less code using Taskflow" | 20:25 |
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| harlowja | ah, gotcha, i think i misread your line above | 20:25 |
| harlowja | yes, that makes sense | 20:25 |
| adrian_otto | but that "I got crash recovery, and would never have attempted it otherwise" | 20:26 |
| adrian_otto | that's what I eman when I refer to "meaningful" | 20:26 |
| harlowja | kk | 20:26 |
| adrian_otto | s/eman/mean/ | 20:26 |
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| harlowja | as long as 'meaningful' doesn't mean only the core projects of openstack, i think thats fine | 20:26 |
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| harlowja | just say no to discrimantion, ha | 20:26 |
| adrian_otto | of course. Adoption is an indication of success, and we should enable it as best we can. | 20:27 |
| harlowja | sounds good, so for now, i think we can continue our reachout and coding and integration, as long as its not causing anyone problems | 20:28 |
| adrian_otto | Making OpenStack more resilient and reliable is a huge advancement, and one I think can be enabled with what we have started on here. | 20:28 |
| adrian_otto | that meets my criteria of meaningful | 20:28 |
| harlowja | sure | 20:28 |
| adrian_otto | parting thought on this subject: lets all kick up our effort level on docs by at least one notch. | 20:29 |
| harlowja | agreed | 20:29 |
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| adrian_otto | that should pay off in spades | 20:29 |
| harlowja | sounds good, lets try to do that also | 20:30 |
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| harlowja | #topic vote-for-presentation | 20:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "vote-for-presentation (Meeting topic: openstack-state-management)" | 20:30 | |
| harlowja | so kebray what were u thinking of | 20:31 |
| kebray | making sure everyone has voted :-) | 20:31 |
| kebray | Anyone active in this channel right now not voted for the presentation? | 20:31 |
| * kebray searches around for link. | 20:32 | |
| changbl | let me vote, link to the talk? | 20:32 |
| harlowja | ah, that vote | 20:32 |
| harlowja | gotcha | 20:32 |
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| kebray | #link http://www.openstack.org/rate/Presentation/taskflow-an-openstack-library-that-helps-make-task-execution-easy-consistent-and-reliable | 20:33 |
| harlowja | thx kebray , u found it before me | 20:33 |
| harlowja | don't forget to vote folks, ha | 20:33 |
| * harlowja durn why is picture still not there | 20:33 | |
| kebray | and tell your friends. | 20:33 |
| harlowja | yup, and tell your friends friends | 20:34 |
| harlowja | ok, lets open up for any further discussion | 20:34 |
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| harlowja | #topic open-discuss | 20:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open-discuss (Meeting topic: openstack-state-management)" | 20:35 | |
| harlowja | so changbl back to the question about provides/requires, melnikov are u still around | 20:35 |
| melnikov | yup | 20:35 |
| harlowja | melnikov are u thinking about adjusting how that works, or not yet | 20:36 |
| harlowja | provides/requires connect into the concept of dependency chaining and how tasks transfer 'memory' | 20:36 |
| harlowja | changbl would u prefer a more manual way of connecting them | 20:36 |
| harlowja | *explicit | 20:36 |
| harlowja | i think there is room for improvement, yes of course | 20:37 |
| changbl | basically what I can want is that i write very few and natural code when using the library | 20:38 |
| harlowja | agreed | 20:38 |
| changbl | right now, i think there are some overlap between declaring provides/requires and __call__ | 20:38 |
| harlowja | yes, there is, __call__ args can be examined to find what is required | 20:39 |
| melnikov | as for __call__, akarpinska wanted to use simple execute(...) method instead | 20:39 |
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| melnikov | i tend to agree, execute/revert make nice simmetry | 20:39 |
| changbl | harlowja, yes, examining __call__ to find out what is required would be better | 20:40 |
| changbl | __call__ => execute, just renaming? | 20:40 |
| melnikov | changbl, as a first step | 20:40 |
| changbl | melnikov, any more planned changes? | 20:41 |
| harlowja | so the provides one are the weird part changbl, that one is hard to automatically determine, i think we could just switch to args examination (except if someone uses *args, **kwargs) | 20:41 |
| jlucci | Hey guys - I have to run to my puppy class, but the Trove guys are definitely interested | 20:41 |
| harlowja | kk | 20:41 |
| harlowja | thx jlucci | 20:41 |
| jlucci | Sorry for the interruption - I'll look back over the meeting notes later tonight. :D | 20:42 |
| harlowja | np | 20:42 |
| changbl | harlowja, ok, at least we can remove one overlap | 20:42 |
| harlowja | sure | 20:42 |
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| harlowja | although i think provides might be able to be somewhat removed also, it ties into the question of how much inference is useful/possible | 20:42 |
| harlowja | the nice thing about the inference is that it allows us to easily reconnect all tasks on failure of whatever was running them | 20:43 |
| harlowja | although if u think of a raw engine, u might not need the inference at all, the engine will just have enough state to continue running, not caring about the reconnect | 20:43 |
| harlowja | ex, a car engine doesn't care about the surronding system, it just will run if provided gas, something else gets the gas to it (gas == flow) | 20:44 |
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| harlowja | car engine analogy ftw | 20:44 |
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| harlowja | something to think about maybe :-P | 20:45 |
| changbl | not sure of the analogy on engine, melnikov is working on the engine code now? I can take a look | 20:45 |
| melnikov | yup, i'm working on separating flows on patterns and engines -- there's blueprint for that | 20:46 |
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| harlowja | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/taskflow/+spec/patterns-and-engines ? | 20:46 |
| melnikov | the code will be on review later, idk tomorrow or next week, stay tuned;) | 20:46 |
| harlowja | thx melnikov | 20:47 |
| changbl | ok, thanks melnikov | 20:47 |
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| harlowja | so changbl i think it will get a little easier soon, i believe | 20:47 |
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| melnikov | harlowja, yes, that bp | 20:47 |
| changbl | harlowja, that's great | 20:47 |
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| harlowja | it will be a balance though, making it to easy, and it just gets us back into writing python and the library doesn't offer what we are saying it, offer/change to much and it gets hard to use | 20:48 |
| harlowja | *saying it does | 20:48 |
| harlowja | ekarlso- yt | 20:48 |
| changbl | harlowja, right, we should get more feedback from other users | 20:48 |
| harlowja | agreed | 20:48 |
| harlowja | ekarlso- and i were talking about how async tasks can work in a flow | 20:49 |
| harlowja | which slightly connects into https://review.openstack.org/#/c/34488/ being a potential way to do this | 20:49 |
| harlowja | although maybe after melnikov work we can revisit how this can be done | 20:49 |
| harlowja | i think ekarlso- wanted to fire off something, then have dependent tasks not activate until whatever that was fired returned | 20:50 |
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| harlowja | although i'm unsure of the reverting condition for such an async activity, is the revert fired after a timeout, idk | 20:51 |
| changbl | threaded graph flow is a great idea | 20:51 |
| harlowja | i think its useful for these types of situations (although one greenthread per-thread might start taxing the python memory usage) | 20:52 |
| harlowja | greenthread per-task i mean | 20:52 |
| changbl | why are you unsure of reverting condition? got a bit confused | 20:53 |
| harlowja | hmmm, maybe there isn't any problem now that i think about it | 20:54 |
| harlowja | i'll continue working with ekarlso- to understand what his usage is about | 20:54 |
| harlowja | in a typical linear flow, if one task blocks, then all do | 20:55 |
| changbl | harlowja, all right | 20:55 |
| changbl | Btw, do we have any status update on getting taskflow integrated into other openstack projects? | 20:55 |
| harlowja | threaded flow, only those that have dependencies on the blocking task will block up | 20:55 |
| harlowja | trove is underway via jessica, cinder i'm continuing with, also starting conversations with glance | 20:55 |
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| harlowja | and i think a few others are popping up, ekarlso- is doing billingstack | 20:55 |
| harlowja | glance i think could be another user, we'll see how the timelines match up | 20:56 |
| changbl | ok, cool. Very promising | 20:56 |
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| harlowja | yup, cool | 20:57 |
| harlowja | alright, any other stuff, 3 minutes! | 20:57 |
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| harlowja | if not #openstack-state-management is where you'll find us (most of the time) | 20:57 |
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| harlowja | ok, thx for showing up folks :) | 20:58 |
| harlowja | till next week | 20:58 |
| harlowja | #endmeeting | 20:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Aug 22 20:58:26 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_state_management/2013/openstack_state_management.2013-08-22-20.00.html | 20:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_state_management/2013/openstack_state_management.2013-08-22-20.00.txt | 20:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_state_management/2013/openstack_state_management.2013-08-22-20.00.log.html | 20:58 |
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| russellb | #startmeeting nova | 21:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Aug 22 21:00:19 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is russellb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:00 |
| russellb | Hello, everyone! | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova' | 21:00 |
| mikal | Morning | 21:00 |
| dansmith | yo | 21:00 |
| mriedem | hi | 21:00 |
| russellb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Nova | 21:00 |
| bnemec | o/ | 21:00 |
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| russellb | #topic havana-3 | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "havana-3 (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:00 | |
| russellb | #link https://launchpad.net/nova/+milestone/havana-3 | 21:00 |
| russellb | we have reached the feature proposal freeze | 21:00 |
| russellb | feature freeze (merge deadline) is in 2 weeks | 21:01 |
| russellb | there is a _lot_ of stuff to review | 21:01 |
| mikal | Have we defined an exception process for the proposal freeze? | 21:01 |
| russellb | so, i'll go ahead and assume that everyone here would really like review attention on something :-) | 21:01 |
| russellb | yes | 21:01 |
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| russellb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/FeatureProposalFreeze | 21:01 |
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| russellb | if someone requests an exception, they, or someone, will probably have to make sure i see it | 21:01 |
| russellb | given the volume of stuff we have | 21:01 |
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| mikal | That's fair | 21:02 |
| cyeoh | hi | 21:02 |
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| russellb | other than "please please review my stuff", does anyone have any questions, or topics around havana-3 that you would like to go over? | 21:02 |
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| mrodden | is the crazy amount of weird gate failures going to affect any release timeline dates? | 21:03 |
| russellb | my notes on the freeze from this morning: | 21:03 |
| russellb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-August/014114.html | 21:03 |
| russellb | mrodden: doubtful | 21:03 |
| mrodden | oh, didn't see that | 21:03 |
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| russellb | mrodden: the turbulance and risk approaching the freeze is pretty much expected | 21:04 |
| russellb | if something really really bad happens *right* before the freeze, it could get extended a day or something | 21:04 |
| russellb | but i wouldn't expect any extensions | 21:04 |
| mrodden | ok | 21:04 |
| russellb | just remember the next release is only 6 months later, not forever :-) | 21:04 |
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| russellb | any other havana-3 related questions or concerns? | 21:05 |
| russellb | ok | 21:06 |
| russellb | #topic sub-team reports | 21:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "sub-team reports (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:06 | |
| russellb | any subteams have updates they'd like to provide? | 21:06 |
| hartsocks | \0 | 21:06 |
| russellb | hartsocks: go for it | 21:06 |
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| johnthetubaguy | nothing much from xenapi, smokestack getting closer to being a gate, and progress towards a tempest gate | 21:07 |
| hartsocks | We've got our 6 *priority* BP we're pushing for reviews amongst ourselves. | 21:07 |
| russellb | johnthetubaguy: thanks! | 21:07 |
| hartsocks | Then I mail the list when we get things ready for core-review. | 21:07 |
| hartsocks | We're just getting our CI stuff running but ... | 21:07 |
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| hartsocks | we're not ready to publish results just yet. | 21:08 |
| hartsocks | Soon. | 21:08 |
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| russellb | plan is to eventually make it public though right? | 21:08 |
| hartsocks | Definitely. | 21:08 |
| russellb | what would be most awesome is acting like smokestack does today | 21:08 |
| russellb | a 3rd party system providing test votes in gerrit | 21:08 |
| hartsocks | In the interim while the CI team is nailing that down… we may post a −1 and a link to a cut-and-paste log. | 21:08 |
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| russellb | sure, that works too | 21:09 |
| russellb | baby steps :) | 21:09 |
| dansmith | that's awesaome | 21:09 |
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| hartsocks | Hopefully, we won't do that for long. | 21:09 |
| dansmith | er, awesome even | 21:09 |
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| dims | nice | 21:09 |
| russellb | definitely | 21:09 |
| hartsocks | Yep. | 21:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 sounds good | 21:09 |
| russellb | test all the things! | 21:09 |
| hartsocks | That's the big news for us. | 21:09 |
| russellb | great thanks! | 21:09 |
| russellb | any others? | 21:09 |
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| russellb | #topic open discussion | 21:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:10 | |
| russellb | figured it might be quick today, busy review rush right now | 21:10 |
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| russellb | anything for open discussion? | 21:10 |
| bpb | russellb: Cinder volume encryption is no longer blocked by Cinder change, so can the priority be moved back to high? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/encrypt-cinder-volumes | 21:10 |
| cyeoh | I typed too slow earlier - just wondering if you consider adding api samples for the v3 api to be a new feature or not? | 21:10 |
| shanewang1 | russellb: regarding the timeline dates, we should have enough time when the patches are reviewed by nova cores, right? | 21:11 |
| mikal | cyeoh: I think missing API samples sounds like a bug... | 21:11 |
| russellb | yeah i think tests are fine ... | 21:11 |
| russellb | bpb: *looking* | 21:11 |
| cyeoh | mikal, russellb: cool :-) | 21:12 |
| russellb | shanewang1: honestly, not everything is going to make it. it's too much right here at the end. it's not going to be possible. | 21:12 |
| bpb | russellb: Thanks! | 21:12 |
| russellb | bpb: done! | 21:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | cyeoh: +1, well sounds like docs and that quite good to do post feature freeze, I guess? | 21:12 |
| russellb | bpb: really happy to see this progress | 21:12 |
| russellb | bpb: and your nova patch got reviewed by vish already, that's great | 21:12 |
| russellb | so should make it seems like | 21:12 |
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| bpb | russellb: Yes, lots of work and also support from others | 21:13 |
| russellb | bpb: ndipanov would be another good nova-core guy to review this | 21:13 |
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| cyeoh | johnthetubaguy: I hope so, worst case we do something unofficial out of tree first for the v3 api first, but of course I'd prefer it merged asap. | 21:13 |
| bpb | russellb: thanks | 21:13 |
| russellb | bpb: i added ndipanov to the review, i'll see if i can talk to him about reviewing it | 21:14 |
| bpb | russellb: great! | 21:14 |
| shanewang1 | yeah, I am worrying that there is no enough time to revise the patches. Only 2 weeks left. hopefully I am wrong, or the freeze date doesn't work if the patches are under revising:) | 21:14 |
| russellb | shanewang1: ideally it's close to ready and won't need much revising | 21:15 |
| russellb | if so, won't make it | 21:15 |
| shanewang1 | ok | 21:15 |
| russellb | honestly, with or without a freeze, only leaving a couple weeks is a really high risk | 21:15 |
| russellb | i have code at risk too :-) | 21:15 |
| russellb | i'm just trying to set realistic expectations here | 21:15 |
| shanewang1 | because my patch was there and has never been reviewed by cores, hopefully they are not a surprise to everyone:) | 21:16 |
| shanewang1 | I understand. | 21:16 |
| * russellb nods | 21:16 | |
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| russellb | which one | 21:16 |
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| shanewang1 | https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:bp/ubs,n,z | 21:17 |
| shanewang1 | and https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:pci-passthrough-enhancement,n,z, the latter looks better. | 21:18 |
| russellb | ah yes | 21:18 |
| shanewang1 | some cores are interested in them. | 21:18 |
| russellb | any other topics? otherwise we'll get back to hacking/reviewing | 21:18 |
| mriedem | jan/feb meetup in minneapolis! | 21:18 |
| mriedem | dead of winter! | 21:19 |
| russellb | haha | 21:19 |
| bnemec | lol | 21:19 |
| mriedem | c'mon | 21:19 |
| russellb | no promises on location | 21:19 |
| russellb | i have a potential offer for hosting | 21:19 |
| russellb | i won't out them yet | 21:19 |
| russellb | but it'll be based on where we can get free space to do it | 21:19 |
| mikal | Hawaii! | 21:19 |
| hartsocks | +1 | 21:19 |
| mikal | Beaches are free | 21:19 |
| russellb | mikal: that would be amazing, i've never been :-) | 21:19 |
| yjiang5 | +1 for Hawaii | 21:19 |
| mikal | I am sure VMWare has an office in Hawaii... | 21:19 |
| yjiang5 | it will be better if Havana release in Hawaii | 21:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | lol, took the works out of my keyboard | 21:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | doh, words | 21:20 |
| russellb | if you're wondering what we're talking about | 21:20 |
| hartsocks | If there's a VMware office in Hawaii it's a secret. | 21:20 |
| russellb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-August/013930.html | 21:20 |
| russellb | please indicate your interest in a mid-cycle meetup there ^^^ | 21:20 |
| russellb | i'm trying to get a rough feel if planning for ~100 people or less is sufficient | 21:20 |
| russellb | seems like it so far | 21:20 |
| yjiang5 | how to define ATC? | 21:21 |
| russellb | Active Technical Contributor | 21:21 |
| russellb | for nova it means, have you submitted patches that have been accepted | 21:21 |
| yjiang5 | great, so I am :) | 21:22 |
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| russellb | the same rules used to define whether you're able to vote in nova elections | 21:22 |
| dansmith | yjiang5: objects contributors will get an extra prize | 21:22 |
| russellb | the nova PTL election, or TC elections | 21:22 |
| shanewang1 | cool | 21:22 |
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| yjiang5 | dansmith: lol | 21:22 |
| mriedem | dansmith: how about objects bug fixers? :) | 21:22 |
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| russellb | we'll all be objects bug fixers soon enough, amiright? | 21:23 |
| dansmith | mriedem: sure, but powervm maintainers are penalized by funding the prize pool, so it's a wash for you :( | 21:23 |
| mriedem | damn | 21:23 |
| mrodden | lol | 21:23 |
| russellb | alright, thanks for coming by everyone | 21:23 |
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| russellb | feel free to continue chatting in #openstack-nova, as always | 21:23 |
| russellb | #endmeeting | 21:23 |
| mikal | Laters | 21:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:23 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Aug 22 21:23:57 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:23 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-08-22-21.00.html | 21:24 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-08-22-21.00.txt | 21:24 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-08-22-21.00.log.html | 21:24 |
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| yjiang5 | does anyone know if we really need copy right at empty file? See https://review.openstack.org/#/c/39892/ I got a -1 from Sean Dague for has copy right, I remove it, then I got a -1 from Boris for w/o it. | 21:32 |
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| clarkb | yjiang5: I believe current consensus is that empty fiels should not have a license or copyright header | 21:33 |
| clarkb | as there is ntohing there to license or copyright | 21:33 |
| yjiang5 | thanks! | 21:33 |
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| dims | russellb, objects should get into oslo :) | 21:36 |
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