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| garyk | you guys around for the scheduling meeting? | 15:01 |
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| garyk | MikeSpreitzer: hi | 15:01 |
| garyk | alaski: you around | 15:01 |
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| MikeSpreitzer | hi | 15:01 |
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| alaski | garyk: yes, but finishing up a call atm | 15:02 |
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| garyk | ok. cool | 15:02 |
| garyk | i guess we can start | 15:02 |
| garyk | #startmeeting scheduler | 15:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 15:02:36 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is garyk. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:02 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:02 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: scheduler)" | 15:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'scheduler' | 15:02 |
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| garyk | the schedule is out for the summit | 15:03 |
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| MikeSpreitzer | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/ ? | 15:03 |
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| llu-laptop | Seems I don''t see the scheduler performance session. Boris didn't do that? | 15:04 |
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| garyk | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/overview/type/nova#.Um_OgiSInns | 15:04 |
| garyk | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/cde73dadfd67eaae5bf98b90ba7de073 | 15:05 |
| garyk | rethinking scheduler design - http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/cde73dadfd67eaae5bf98b90ba7de073 | 15:05 |
| garyk | smartter placement for work loads - http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/57775e21d82cf716d435f02c9185db1e | 15:05 |
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| garyk | metrics - http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/630d65c8879935f7bc085833f47bb537 | 15:05 |
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| garyk | instance groups api - http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/b23505a1c59fa2e9e5f94e9467b5a76a | 15:05 |
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| garyk | russellb has been really generous and nearly the whole of wednesday is scheduling | 15:06 |
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| garyk | he has also scheduled a number of unconference sessions | 15:07 |
| MikeSpreitzer | glad to see it | 15:07 |
| garyk | in a sec i will post the link - people can register for 10 minute slots | 15:07 |
| MikeSpreitzer | Already? Or when we get there? | 15:08 |
| Yathi | are there specific unconference sessions for scheduler, | 15:08 |
| alaski | right. There are Nova specific unconferences so there should be a fair number of slots to bring up unscheduled topics | 15:08 |
| garyk | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/NovaIcehouseSummitUnconference | 15:08 |
| Yathi | or for Nova in general | 15:08 |
| russellb | feel free to sign up this week | 15:08 |
| garyk | Yathi: it is specifically for Nova. | 15:08 |
| russellb | and if others don't sign up, you can have more time | 15:09 |
| garyk | at the moment myself and a few colleagues have registered a topic on resource tracking | 15:09 |
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| russellb | the one on tuesday might be better for wednesday now that scheduling sessions got moved to wednesday | 15:09 |
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| garyk | russellb: correct - i'll move it to weds | 15:10 |
| russellb | ok | 15:10 |
| garyk | the sessions are going like hot cakes :) | 15:11 |
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| garyk | are there any issues that we would like to discuss today? | 15:12 |
| Yathi | Should we make the scheduler related unconference sessions on Wednesday as well ? I thought it will be overloaded for Wednesday hence submitted one for Tuesday | 15:14 |
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| garyk | Yathi: that is what russellb suggested above | 15:14 |
| MikeSpreitzer | I think those of us advocating optimization approach would like it to be in the minds of those in the "rethinking" session | 15:14 |
| MikeSpreitzer | but "rethinking" comes before the Wed unconference. | 15:15 |
| garyk | regarding demo's there are also opnetsakc unconference sessions where you can register on the day and then get a slotted time | 15:15 |
| MikeSpreitzer | 10 min also? | 15:15 |
| garyk | those sessions will also be to folks who may not be on the nova track | 15:15 |
| garyk | MikeSpreitzer: yes, i think so | 15:15 |
| garyk | MikeSpreitzer: in the past there was a board that people could write their topics. It is a good place to show demos etc. | 15:16 |
| MikeSpreitzer | Bird in the hand and all that | 15:17 |
| MikeSpreitzer | OK if I sign up for a Nova unconference until I get a general one? | 15:17 |
| alaski | sure, if you have a topic sign up. If you change later then someone else can use the slot | 15:18 |
| MikeSpreitzer | OK, that's my plan | 15:18 |
| garyk | i guess that if there is an overflow then the PTL may intervene and prioritize | 15:19 |
| russellb | of unconference sign-ups? yeah, if i have to | 15:19 |
| russellb | would rather just let it be open and first come first serve :) | 15:20 |
| garyk | i guess that if we are having scheduling discussion on wednesday then maybe we can all get together for drinks or lunch on tuesday - put faces to names | 15:20 |
| MikeSpreitzer | sounds good | 15:20 |
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| garyk | russellb: cool. thanks for arranging everything. | 15:20 |
| Yathi | have some initial discussions and plans before the session | 15:20 |
| Yathi | Tuesday get together sounds good | 15:21 |
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| garyk | so how about tuesday lunch? we can sync the meeting time in the morning | 15:22 |
| MikeSpreitzer | Huh? Lunch time is indicated in the schedule | 15:22 |
| garyk | i think 1 − 2 is free for lunch. so maybe we can meet next to the nova room at 1pm and then go and get a table together | 15:23 |
| MikeSpreitzer | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/ says 12:45 — 1:20 | 15:23 |
| garyk | so lets make it 12:50 at the nova room. | 15:24 |
| MikeSpreitzer | +1 | 15:25 |
| garyk | that will give people a chance to attend lightening talks if they wish | 15:25 |
| garyk | do we have any other topics to talk about of should we all go to planning our etherpads? | 15:26 |
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| Yathi | you mean etherpads for the session | 15:26 |
| Yathi | sorry it is my first summit.. | 15:27 |
| garyk | russellb: on question - in neutron there was talk of not having presentations but just using etherpads for the sessions. will this be the same for nova? | 15:27 |
| Yathi | will need to work with you all | 15:27 |
| russellb | yes, please | 15:27 |
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| MikeSpreitzer | Hmm, I was hoping to show templates, screen shots, etc | 15:27 |
| russellb | it should be primarily discussion, and only using etherpad seems to be working best | 15:27 |
| russellb | having some reference info available is ok ... but just know it's not supposed to be a presentation | 15:28 |
| russellb | it's not like materials are forbidden, just not typically used in the sessions that go the best | 15:28 |
| russellb | IMO | 15:28 |
| MikeSpreitzer | OK. But we're debating API, so concrete examples are really good | 15:28 |
| russellb | that's fine | 15:28 |
| PhilD | How about always havign an Etherpad (its a great way to capture feedback, etc) - but allow a few slides to be shown if it helps illustrate a specific point | 15:28 |
| russellb | yes that makes sense | 15:28 |
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| MikeSpreitzer | particularly if what you want to show has a URL that can go in the etherpad, I suppose | 15:29 |
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| garyk | at times a picture/diagram is very important as it helps capture an idea. but we also need to have the dicussion and engage one another | 15:31 |
| MikeSpreitzer | right, that's the whole point | 15:31 |
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| Yathi | we have a few documents being written up with the ideas | 15:33 |
| Yathi | they will be good reading material for the sessions | 15:33 |
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| garyk | Yathi: i think that we should share the ideas before and then discuss things. the etherpads whould have the links to the documents. the etherpads will later be used as part of the BP's or tracking | 15:34 |
| MikeSpreitzer | Yes, I was confusing session with demo. For session, writeup beforehand is good. | 15:34 |
| MikeSpreitzer | reading beforehand is even better | 15:34 |
| Yathi | garyk: But what I am worried is there might be a lot of suggestions overlapping views, etc. how to coordinate | 15:35 |
| Yathi | and manage on a etherpad | 15:35 |
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| garyk | Yathi: from past experience what has worked is a short introduction with diagrams and maybe flows and then discussion. | 15:35 |
| Yathi | garyk: ok | 15:36 |
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| Yathi | garyk: for the Instance group API work - can I create a new blueprint - or use the old one ? we have newer model, newer apis, etc.. | 15:37 |
| garyk | Yathi: i think that we can use the existing BP. I think that we just need to make sure that it is updated to contain the latest details | 15:37 |
| Yathi | Ok. I will add some links there.. with the latest doc, etc | 15:38 |
| garyk | Yathi: thanks! | 15:38 |
| garyk | i really think that it is important that we try and get things in in the first or maximum second milestone. that is the only way we may get this through in icehouse | 15:39 |
| garyk | timing is of the essence | 15:39 |
| Yathi | the discussions I am seeing in the mailing list, everyone wants the whole thing to solved at once | 15:41 |
| garyk | i hope that we can convey the ideas in the session that we have. this will certainly help move it forwards | 15:41 |
| garyk | :) | 15:41 |
| Yathi | but we should realize that we should start simple | 15:41 |
| MikeSpreitzer | I am thinking in a roadmap fashion | 15:41 |
| Yathi | and that is the attempt to get it started within Nova | 15:41 |
| MikeSpreitzer | But I do not want to lose sight of the goal. | 15:41 |
| garyk | yup, i agree with the simple. we need it to be robust so that we can build on it | 15:42 |
| Yathi | agreed. | 15:42 |
| garyk | MikeSpreitzer: it is a process and without stable foundations we will find it hard to get anything done. | 15:42 |
| MikeSpreitzer | garyk: agreed | 15:42 |
| garyk | i am hoping that we will get to speak about this all at the summit. it is the best place for people to voice their reservations and more importnatly they can express ideas which can help us achieve a common goal | 15:43 |
| Yathi | at the summit, we should finalize what can be done in the icehouse time frame | 15:43 |
| garyk | agreed | 15:43 |
| Yathi | some of the discussions may take a few more summits to implement | 15:43 |
| MikeSpreitzer | that being the primary purpose of a summit, right? | 15:43 |
| garyk | correct. | 15:44 |
| garyk | first we crawl, then walk and hopefully one day run | 15:44 |
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| garyk | for the development cycle we also need to make sure that the patches can be reviewed - that is posting one huge patch is not a good idea. we need to do small and coherent iterations that can be viewed as pieces in the puzzle... | 15:46 |
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| garyk | sorry for babbling on | 15:46 |
| Yathi | garyk: please go on | 15:46 |
| Yathi | it helps | 15:46 |
| Yathi | for new comers | 15:46 |
| garyk | i hope that at the summit we can break down all of the pieces, assign them to interested parties and then try and sync our work along the way. | 15:47 |
| MikeSpreitzer | I think the existing Instance group work provides a model | 15:47 |
| MikeSpreitzer | it was broken down into several pieces | 15:47 |
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| garyk | MikeSpreitzer: yup, that was the plan. hopefully we can continue with that model moving forwards | 15:47 |
| Yathi | garyk: I am not able to update that blueprint. I would like to add details and change the owners | 15:48 |
| garyk | one thing i think is very importnat for the community is for us to try and let everyone know where we are in the cycle of development and what is current done, being done and what needs to be done | 15:48 |
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| garyk | Yathi: i think russellb or a core reviewer may be able to change the owner | 15:49 |
| MikeSpreitzer | good point. Seeing the whole roadmap is good, not just what's been done so far | 15:49 |
| garyk | unless we get senhau to come and work with us again :) | 15:49 |
| Yathi | :) | 15:49 |
| Yathi | Senhua is not in our team anymore | 15:49 |
| russellb | yeah | 15:50 |
| MikeSpreitzer | A blueprint could include in its whiteboard a roadmap, right? | 15:50 |
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| Yathi | russelb: Can you please make me the drafter? and assignee, and let me edit details for this blueprint - https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/instance-group-api-extension | 15:50 |
| russellb | just tell me the blueprint and who to assign it to | 15:50 |
| russellb | anyone on the nova-drivers launchpad team has the necessary permissions | 15:50 |
| Yathi | my full name - Yathiraj Udupi if you search for it | 15:51 |
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| Yathi | how to join nova-drivers launchpad team ? | 15:51 |
| garyk | Yathi: i think that you need to be nova core | 15:52 |
| garyk | that is kind of like running the comrades marathon and finishing in a top ten place :) | 15:52 |
| Yathi | garyk: I am aiming high | 15:52 |
| garyk | :) | 15:52 |
| Yathi | some day in the future I hope | 15:53 |
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| garyk | anything else to be discussed? | 15:53 |
| Yathi | I guess this week will not be very productive. preparing for the summit travel, etc. and wrapping up other things | 15:54 |
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| garyk | ok. so looking forwards to having fruitful discussions. | 15:56 |
| MikeSpreitzer | I hope we can continue some discussion in the ML for a couple more days. | 15:56 |
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| garyk | travel safe and see you guys on Tuesday | 15:56 |
| MikeSpreitzer | be seeing you | 15:56 |
| Yathi | see you all at the summit .. | 15:56 |
| Yathi | signing off until then | 15:56 |
| garyk | #endmeeting | 15:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 15:56:54 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-29-15.02.html | 15:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-29-15.02.txt | 15:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-29-15.02.log.html | 15:57 |
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| boris-42 | Hi all | 17:00 |
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| boris-42 | seems like Rally meeting=) | 17:01 |
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| boden | hi boris-42... here | 17:01 |
| harlowja | \o/ | 17:02 |
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| boris-42 | could we start ?) | 17:02 |
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| harlowja | sure | 17:03 |
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| boris-42 | Hehe not so popular meeting=) | 17:03 |
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| harlowja | whatttt, the most important people in openstack are here | 17:04 |
| geekinutah | meetings are never popular | 17:04 |
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| boris-42 | Okay there are few topics that will be nice to cover next topics | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | what was done | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | what we are going to do | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | answer on question why we need Rally when we have tempest | 17:05 |
| boris-42 | and answer on any other question that you have | 17:05 |
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| boris-42 | Current state: | 17:05 |
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| boris-42 | We have multimode devstack based deployer | 17:06 |
| harlowja | boris-42 did u want to use the meeting bot?? | 17:06 |
| boris-42 | sure | 17:06 |
| boris-42 | #startmeeting Rally | 17:06 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 17:06:49 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is boris-42. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:06 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:06 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'rally' | 17:06 |
| boris-42 | #topic what was done | 17:07 |
| jaypipes | o/ | 17:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "what was done (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:07 | |
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| boris-42 | Okay let's start one more time | 17:07 |
| geekinutah | :-) | 17:07 |
| boris-42 | There are few parts of Rally | 17:07 |
| boris-42 | Deployer, cloud verifier, and benchmark engine | 17:07 |
| boris-42 | So Deployer consists of 2 parts | 17:08 |
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| boris-42 | Things that deploy, and things that provider servers/vms or so on | 17:08 |
| boris-42 | current state is next | 17:08 |
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| boris-42 | we have 2 deployers | 17:08 |
| boris-42 | DummyEngine - just return endpoints of existing cloud | 17:08 |
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| harlowja | cool | 17:09 |
| boris-42 | DevstackEngine - use devstack to deploy multinode openstack cloud | 17:09 |
| boris-42 | And we have 3 providers | 17:09 |
| boris-42 | DummyProvider - returns list of servers (virtual servers) that already exist | 17:09 |
| boris-42 | VirshProvider - create VMs on specified server (remote) | 17:10 |
| boris-42 | LxcProvider - use any of this providers to create LXC containers inside | 17:10 |
| harlowja | neat, boris-42 what does the devstack engine run on (where does it deploy?) | 17:10 |
| boris-42 | DevStack engine use one of provider to get servers | 17:10 |
| boris-42 | and then deploy on these servers | 17:10 |
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| harlowja | k | 17:10 |
| boris-42 | as any other engine | 17:11 |
| boris-42 | *future* | 17:11 |
| harlowja | k, so it could use virshprovider to bootstrap devstack, which would then get your babycloud going | 17:11 |
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| harlowja | *just made up 'babycloud' | 17:11 |
| boris-42 | baby cloud going?) | 17:11 |
| boris-42 | DevStack based engine will deploy cloud on provided servers | 17:12 |
| boris-42 | or any other engine | 17:12 |
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| boris-42 | So the next steps are here: | 17:12 |
| akscram | the devstack engine just install devstack on the remote host via ssh | 17:12 |
| harlowja | k, bootstrapping the cloud using an existing provider | 17:12 |
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| boris-42 | okay so next step are more providers & engines | 17:13 |
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| harlowja | seems more straightfoward than the tripleOOO thing (or at least what i know about it) | 17:13 |
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| boris-42 | OpenStackProvider <- that will use existing cloud to provider VMs | 17:13 |
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| harlowja | ya +1 for that | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | LXCEngine - that will use LXCProvider and any other engine to make deployment rappid | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | so we will install only one compute node | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | and then just copy paste containers | 17:14 |
| harlowja | cool | 17:14 |
| boris-42 | it works really fast=) | 17:14 |
| boris-42 | with zfs | 17:14 |
| harlowja | def | 17:14 |
| harlowja | is ZFS in modern kernels ? (can't remember) | 17:14 |
| boris-42 | it could be done!=) | 17:15 |
| geekinutah | it's not | 17:15 |
| boris-42 | we done on ubuntu=) | 17:15 |
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| geekinutah | you can use user mode zfs though | 17:15 |
| harlowja | agreed, it just might make it harder for others if the default is ZFS (and its not everywhere) | 17:15 |
| harlowja | *just a thought* | 17:15 |
| boris-42 | Yeah but even without zfs it is still faster | 17:16 |
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| harlowja | k | 17:16 |
| boris-42 | then install every time | 17:16 |
| harlowja | agreed | 17:16 |
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| boris-42 | So next step is Verification of cloud | 17:16 |
| giulivo | boris-42, sorry just a question but I haven't looked at the code | 17:16 |
| boris-42 | giulive sure | 17:17 |
| boris-42 | giulivo* | 17:17 |
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| giulivo | I assume this will make use of multinode deployments, am I right that is stuff which should be implemented at the level of the engine? | 17:17 |
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| boris-42 | giulivo could you explain what you mean by "this"? | 17:18 |
| giulivo | yes again please sorry as I haven't looked at the code, I was trying to figure which pieces are pluggable as I was interested in how the multinode deployment takes place | 17:19 |
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| giulivo | as currently devstack isn't an option for that | 17:19 |
| boris-42 | Okay I understand the question | 17:19 |
| boris-42 | DeployEngines and Providers are plugable | 17:20 |
| boris-42 | DeployEngine should be subclass of DeployFactory and implement 2 methods, deploy() and cleanup() | 17:20 |
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| harlowja | #action harlowja make AnvilDeployEngine | 17:21 |
| boris-42 | deploy() get on input config file (every engine has own configuration) | 17:21 |
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| boris-42 | and deploy() should return endpoints of cloud | 17:21 |
| boris-42 | server provider should be able just to create_vms, and destroy_vms() | 17:21 |
| giulivo | boris-42, oh great, I see it now, thanks! | 17:21 |
| boris-42 | giulivo so if you have own private cloud | 17:22 |
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| boris-42 | giulive you will be able to make special provider and use rest part of Rally | 17:22 |
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| boris-42 | without any problem | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | giulivo or if you are Anvil fanatic you can build even you special deploy engine for Rally and use existing providers and rest of rally | 17:23 |
| giulivo | yeah this is the scenario I had in mind, thanks | 17:23 |
| boris-42 | okay so let's speak now about verification part | 17:23 |
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| harlowja | anvil fanatic, ha | 17:23 |
| boris-42 | #action CLoud Verification | 17:23 |
| harlowja | ^ topic ? | 17:23 |
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| boris-42 | #topic Cloud Verification | 17:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Cloud Verification (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:24 | |
| harlowja | :) | 17:24 |
| boris-42 | Okay at this moment we use for that cases part of fuel-ostf-tests | 17:24 |
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| boris-42 | it is the wrong approach because we have tempest -) | 17:24 |
| boris-42 | sdague ^ | 17:24 |
| harlowja | i guess i question this, it depends on what is being verified | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | So I would like to switch to tempest, and this is open task | 17:25 |
| harlowja | is it the correct thing to do? | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | harlowja that your cloud works properly=) | 17:25 |
| harlowja | ok, so i guess tempest is good fit then? | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | perfect | 17:25 |
| harlowja | k | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | except few things | 17:25 |
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| boris-42 | I don't know how to run tempest with specific config | 17:25 |
| harlowja | no --config XYZ ? | 17:26 |
| boris-42 | except put config to /etc/tempest.config | 17:26 |
| boris-42 | yes there is no --config | 17:26 |
| harlowja | hmmm, odd | 17:26 |
| boris-42 | because we are running tempest through tester | 17:26 |
| boris-42 | testr* | 17:26 |
| giulivo | boris-42, I can suggest https://github.com/pixelb/crudini for this | 17:26 |
| giulivo | as the conf is just an ini formatted file | 17:27 |
| harlowja | giulivo thats fine as long as u aren't running more than one tempest | 17:27 |
| harlowja | idk if boris-42 is planning on, 1 ini file is gonna be problematic if thats the case | 17:27 |
| boris-42 | harlowja yeah we would like to be able to run multiple tempest for different clouds in the same time | 17:27 |
| dkranz | boris-42: RIght now tempest uses TEMPEST_CONFIG_DIR and TEMPEST_CONFIG shell vars for dir/file | 17:27 |
| harlowja | ya, so then 1 static config not gonna work out so well | 17:27 |
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| boris-42 | dkranz nice | 17:28 |
| boris-42 | dkranz this seems slow the problem almost=) | 17:28 |
| harlowja | slow? | 17:28 |
| boris-42 | solve* | 17:28 |
| harlowja | k | 17:28 |
| boris-42 | dkranz do you know somebody that could help to migrate to tempest?) | 17:29 |
| dkranz | boris-42: Not sure. Many people are just learning about it. | 17:29 |
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| boris-42 | dkranz about tempest?) | 17:29 |
| dkranz | boris-42: No, about rally | 17:29 |
| boris-42 | lol | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | dkranz okay it should be quite easy if you are tempest expert | 17:30 |
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| boris-42 | dkarnz there is the method that is run with endpoints of cloud | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | Okay if somebody will be interested to help I will be really happy=) | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | okay let's move | 17:31 |
| boris-42 | #TOPIC benchmark engine | 17:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "benchmark engine (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:31 | |
| boris-42 | What was done | 17:31 |
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| boris-42 | First of all how we should take a look at one of the simplest benchmark | 17:32 |
| boris-42 | run VM / stop VM | 17:32 |
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| boris-42 | https://github.com/stackforge/rally/blob/master/rally/benchmark/scenarios/nova/servers.py#L24-L29 | 17:32 |
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| boris-42 | so how this stuff work | 17:33 |
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| harlowja | cool | 17:33 |
| boris-42 | You should create subclass of rally.benchamrk.base.Scenario | 17:33 |
| boris-42 | and add any method | 17:33 |
| boris-42 | like boot_and_delete_server | 17:34 |
| boris-42 | first 2 parameters cls and context are always required | 17:34 |
| boris-42 | other parameter are your | 17:34 |
| boris-42 | so how to call this method using rally? | 17:34 |
| harlowja | magic | 17:34 |
| harlowja | ! | 17:34 |
| boris-42 | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Rally/BenchmarkScenarios#boot_and_delete_server | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | you should put such configuration | 17:35 |
| harlowja | nice | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | at input | 17:35 |
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| boris-42 | flavor_id, image_id will be putted as a params | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | to method | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | this method will be called 50 times | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | in 10 threads | 17:35 |
| boris-42 | 50 times is total amount of calls* | 17:36 |
| harlowja | all of those scenarios would form a common 'scenario' set that people can reuse right? | 17:36 |
| boris-42 | ?) | 17:36 |
| boris-42 | If you write any method in subclass of base.Scnearion you are getting new benchmark | 17:36 |
| harlowja | so u can imagine rally providing a common set of scenarios (these config files) | 17:37 |
| boris-42 | (benchmark scneario) | 17:37 |
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| harlowja | *maybe it already does (not sure) | 17:37 |
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| boris-42 | what means "common" ?) | 17:37 |
| harlowja | like in rally there would be a scenario/ folder with lots of config files for the standard use cases to test | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | yes | 17:38 |
| harlowja | k | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | ecxactly | 17:38 |
| harlowja | cool | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | and then you are able to build a really pretty config | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Rally/HowTo#Prepare_your_config_file | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | like this one | 17:38 |
| harlowja | is that json? | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | it will make 2 benchmarks | 17:38 |
| boris-42 | yes json | 17:38 |
| harlowja | hmmm | 17:38 |
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| harlowja | json doens't allow comments in the files | 17:39 |
| harlowja | comments would seem nice to have | 17:39 |
| boris-42 | yes it doesn't allows=) | 17:39 |
| boris-42 | json is better then xml=)) | 17:39 |
| harlowja | comments very useful to describe scenario and reasons why | 17:39 |
| harlowja | yaml? | 17:39 |
| harlowja | yaml allows comments | 17:39 |
| akscram | yaml is a good alternative ;) | 17:39 |
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| harlowja | ya, i'd prefer that, cause i think comments in these config files will be pretty important | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | hmmm | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | I don't use them=) | 17:40 |
| harlowja | https://github.com/openstack/requirements/blob/master/global-requirements.txt#L79 | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | but Ok this is good advice=) | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | harlowja makes sense=) | 17:40 |
| harlowja | k | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | okay we should discuss it also | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | but in openstack-rally | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | =) | 17:41 |
| harlowja | ok dokie | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | so you are able to call your methods with different parameters of benchmark engine | 17:41 |
| akscram | in the case of YAML we need to come up with validation of configs | 17:41 |
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| harlowja | akscram why just in the case of yaml, seems like in the case of any input :-/ | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | times, concurrent you already saw | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | there are two new params | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | tenants and user_per_tenant | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | so benchmark engine will create Real openstack tenants and users | 17:42 |
| kylichuku | JSON + JSON schema for configs sounds like the easiest approach | 17:42 |
| akscram | harlowja: for JSON it's already done with jsonschema | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | and use them to make all actions) | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | kylichuku +1 | 17:42 |
| harlowja | kylichuku akscram i'd disagree, u can use jsonschema with yaml, in fact i've created such a thing for cloudinit | 17:43 |
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| boris-42 | fight fight =) | 17:43 |
| harlowja | let me locate the cloudinit code | 17:43 |
| harlowja | jsonschema just cares about basic types, not that the source is json | 17:44 |
| harlowja | anyways | 17:44 |
| boris-42 | hmm | 17:44 |
| akscram | harlowja: right | 17:44 |
| boris-42 | jsonschema cares about a lot of thing=) | 17:44 |
| kylichuku | let's discuss important things, not about formats :) | 17:44 |
| boris-42 | =)) | 17:44 |
| boris-42 | okay important thing | 17:44 |
| akscram | it's just validate a dict by a dict | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | akscram in openstack-rally discuss this thing=) | 17:45 |
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| boris-42 | What are our plans aournd current benchmark engine | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | We are able to run only "constant" load | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | so we are doing always fixed number of scenearios | 17:46 |
| boris-42 | and what we need is periodic functionallity | 17:46 |
| boris-42 | e.g. run this method every 2 minutes or every random(0,10) mintues | 17:47 |
| boris-42 | Another parameter is duration | 17:47 |
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| boris-42 | so instead of times, set run this benchmark 2hrs | 17:47 |
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| boris-42 | so at this moment we have open discussion about new format | 17:48 |
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| boris-42 | https://docs.google.com/a/mirantis.com/document/d/1oodJqWLY06ZPUO9ar-Fz-IF4ujRIxEpSwVFftQ6Fjvs/edit | 17:48 |
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| boris-42 | Goals are next, keep config simple as possible | 17:49 |
| boris-42 | and add new functionallity | 17:49 |
| dkranz | boris-42: The whole format, dirver, config part is very similar to https://github.com/openstack/tempest/tree/master/tempest/stress | 17:49 |
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| dkranz | If there is to be a discussion about rally/tempest you should look at that. It is not a lot of code. | 17:50 |
| boris-42 | dkranz actually | 17:50 |
| boris-42 | dkranz you don't support noise and simultaneously running of N scnearios | 17:50 |
| boris-42 | noise that is crated by other scnearios | 17:51 |
| dkranz | boris-42: I did not say it is feature-to-feature exactly the same. | 17:51 |
| dkranz | boris-42: But the similarity is why the subject of tempest came up I think. | 17:51 |
| boris-42 | dkranz probably at this moment it is quite similiar | 17:51 |
| boris-42 | dkarnz but use cases are different | 17:52 |
| dkranz | boris-42: And the question was whether one framework could support both stress and performance tests | 17:52 |
| dkranz | boris-42: I am not actually claiming to know the answer to that question | 17:52 |
| kylichuku | both tempest and rally formats are way too simplified | 17:52 |
| boris-42 | dkranz actually I would like to clean situation | 17:52 |
| boris-42 | dkranz the goal of tempest is next | 17:53 |
| dkranz | kylichuku: Yes, and they would both evolve | 17:53 |
| kylichuku | even for the same scenario different users in different tenants will have slightly different workflow | 17:53 |
| boris-42 | Very fast stress test main OpenStack functionality | 17:53 |
| boris-42 | to be able to work inside gate | 17:53 |
| boris-42 | and ensure that our patches don't hurt performance of cloud | 17:53 |
| dkranz | boris-42: Sure | 17:54 |
| boris-42 | So if you are concentrating on tool that should work fast and in gate it is one set of scenarios and special engine | 17:54 |
| boris-42 | And Rally has another goal | 17:54 |
| giulivo | boris-42, would you see any possibility to concatenate simple tests into a scenario (using the config file) and define threads and loops as a global parameter? | 17:54 |
| kylichuku | something that I would be happy to see is a separation of workflow definition and load specification | 17:55 |
| boris-42 | giulivo threads and loops shouldn't be in one place, at least at that format | 17:55 |
| boris-42 | giulive let me show some sample | 17:55 |
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| giulivo | boris-42, yeah I get that but I was thinking about concatenating simple tests into a more complex scenario from just the config file | 17:56 |
| giulivo | so that one could "make up" a scenario from a set of simple tests | 17:56 |
| boris-42 | giulivo http://pastebin.com/j9BREqE9 | 17:56 |
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| giulivo | in that case I'd just expect the tests to be executed in a sequence and threads and loops would be global | 17:56 |
| boris-42 | giulivo this is another thing | 17:57 |
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| kylichuku | for example, workflow could be "Provision VM, keep it alive for 15 minutes, generate some work on it, snapshot, shutdown" with a separate specification of VM params (# of vCPUs, RAM and attached storage) multiplied by usage pattern (N tenants, M users per tenant, # of runs per hour) | 17:57 |
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| boris-42 | giulivo we are going to make it possible to run multiple scenarios in the same time | 17:57 |
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| kylichuku | all these 3 thing should be described in declarative fashion with underlying framework knowing how to combine these rules into workfload profile | 17:57 |
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| giulivo | kylichuku, that would be great yes, I think that explains better what I had in mind yes | 17:58 |
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| boris-42 | kylichuku hmm and where you see problem now?) | 17:59 |
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| boris-42 | kylichuku you are specifying all these parameters, like image, flavor and how much time to run, and concurrency?) | 17:59 |
| kylichuku | boris-42 both tempest and rally formats describe only 3rd set of params | 17:59 |
| stevemar | dolphm: o/ | 17:59 |
| kylichuku | boris-42 while workflow is embedded into the test (written in python) and VM specification is outside of equation | 18:00 |
| joesavak | o/ : ) | 18:00 |
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| dolphm | o/ | 18:00 |
| stevemar | joesavak \o | 18:00 |
| boris-42 | we should end meeting=) | 18:00 |
| stevemar | maybe :) | 18:01 |
| giulivo | boris-42, not to bother but yeah mainly I think it'd be nice to move the workflow out of the test and more in the config | 18:01 |
| topol | o/ | 18:01 |
| fabiog | o/ | 18:01 |
| boris-42 | giulivo okay let's move to openstack-rally | 18:01 |
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| gyee | \o | 18:01 |
| stevemar | topol, they let you out of your meetings? | 18:01 |
| dstanek | o/ | 18:01 |
| boris-42 | #endmeeting | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 18:01:47 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2013/rally.2013-10-29-17.06.html | 18:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2013/rally.2013-10-29-17.06.txt | 18:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2013/rally.2013-10-29-17.06.log.html | 18:01 |
| dolphm | boris-42: sorry for interrupting! | 18:01 |
| giulivo | anyway, this was interesting, thanks guys | 18:02 |
| topol | dude... worst day ever | 18:02 |
| stevemar | topol, will hong kong beer make it better? | 18:02 |
| topol | YES most certainly | 18:02 |
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| dolphm | #startmeeting | 18:03 |
| openstack | dolphm: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee' | 18:03 |
| dolphm | #startmeeting keystone | 18:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 18:03:51 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dolphm. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 18:03 |
| dolphm | openstack: thanks for the tips | 18:04 |
| dolphm | \o/ | 18:04 |
| joesavak | keystone dance! | 18:04 |
| bknudson | hi | 18:04 |
| stevemar | marking meeting... psssh | 18:04 |
| stevemar | marketing* | 18:04 |
| gyee | \o\ | 18:04 |
| dolphm | i haven't prepared much of anything for this meeting, as i mostly have my head in the summit | 18:04 |
| joesavak | gross. | 18:04 |
| stevemar | /o/ | 18:04 |
| dolphm | seriously | 18:04 |
| dolphm | #link http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/overview/type/keystone | 18:04 |
| ayoung | dolphm, kick-a$$ job on that BTW | 18:04 |
| topol | same here | 18:04 |
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| dolphm | this is the current summit schedule ^ | 18:05 |
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| gyee | you need to prepare for the summit? | 18:05 |
| dolphm | we're still seeing some scheduling flux as we discover conflicts | 18:05 |
| ayoung | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/adam.m.young | 18:05 |
| ayoung | :) | 18:05 |
| dolphm | so if you notice one, stab me or ttx asap and we'll look for a solution | 18:05 |
| topol | so this time we are spread out over some days, correct | 18:05 |
| dolphm | topol: yes! | 18:05 |
| stevemar | topol yep | 18:05 |
| bknudson | wasn't there a security track last time? | 18:05 |
| dolphm | we have an entire DAY for the client | 18:05 |
| dolphm | an entire DAY for federation | 18:06 |
| ayoung | the dev conf and maion conf are on two different schedules | 18:06 |
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| gyee | dolphm, the keystone sessions starting at 4:30pm | 18:06 |
| gyee | ? | 18:06 |
| bknudson | we can sleep in | 18:06 |
| ayoung | gyee, and go until we are done | 18:06 |
| dolphm | the first and last days are a bit mixed, but the theme is that the first day is largely keystone-internals, and the last day will largely have stakeholders from outside keystone | 18:06 |
| topol | when will the schedule be finalized | 18:06 |
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| dolphm | gyee: yeah, we're afternoon everyday at the moment | 18:06 |
| gyee | 4:30pm usually nap time | 18:06 |
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| ayoung | topol, after the summit | 18:06 |
| dolphm | topol: next tuesday? | 18:06 |
| ayoung | topol, we are going to have a session at the summit where we finalize the schedule for the summit. THat session is on Friday at 4 PM | 18:07 |
| dolphm | #topic icehouse summit schedule | 18:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "icehouse summit schedule (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:07 | |
| dolphm | bknudson: there was a security track last time, yes | 18:08 |
| topol | K,, I need to attend some heat and ceilometer so trying to plan this time | 18:08 |
| dolphm | also, if everyone hasn't noticed yet... there are TWO schedules | 18:08 |
| dolphm | the design summit: http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/ | 18:08 |
| dolphm | and the conference: http://openstacksummitnovember2013.sched.org/ | 18:09 |
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| dolphm | apologies if you want to attend both | 18:09 |
| joesavak | that's not confusing | 18:09 |
| ayoung | joesavak, not at all | 18:09 |
| dolphm | recommend importing both into your ical or something to look for conflicts / keep one schedule | 18:09 |
| topol | Im just happy if I see a final design summit schedule. Thats where all the cool people are | 18:10 |
| dolphm | for the most part, those who attend talks don't have much interest in attending open discussions, and vice versa | 18:10 |
| topol | dolphm, agreed | 18:11 |
| ayoung | topol, even when it is final, expect it to change somewhat. Last year (San Diego) had changes right up to the hour before. Semper Gumby | 18:11 |
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| bknudson | probably good to have stakeholders at the open discussions | 18:11 |
| dolphm | i trust that those who are interested in both are fully capable of juggling calendars already | 18:11 |
| ayoung | Last year they had a smartphone app. Wonder if that wil deal with both, or just the Main summit | 18:12 |
| dolphm | with regard to unconference sessions, we've never had a great way to coordinate attendance, as they're generally last minute | 18:12 |
| topol | design has a smartphone app | 18:12 |
| topol | installed it today. dont know how accurate it is | 18:12 |
| dolphm | i'm curious as to how ya'll would like to be informed of unconference sessions, beyond being expected to skim the unconference whiteboard a few times a day | 18:12 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, the app will be split like the schedules. | 18:12 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, likely | 18:12 |
| stevemar | looking at the whiteboard works | 18:13 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, (don't hurt me) twitter? | 18:13 |
| gyee | dolphm, us that bird thingy | 18:13 |
| dolphm | topol: you can also just import a calendar feed from sched.org | 18:13 |
| gyee | I think they call it twitter | 18:13 |
| * morganfainberg almost feels dirty recommending it. | 18:13 | |
| stevemar | almost? | 18:13 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, i am waiting for it to sink in. | 18:14 |
| stevemar | i think we're all sync'ed up in twitter for the most part | 18:14 |
| * dolphm shrugs | 18:14 | |
| dolphm | works for me | 18:14 |
| topol | gonna miss not seeing termie. I assume hes not coming | 18:14 |
| dolphm | topol: i wouldn't bet against him | 18:14 |
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| gyee | topol, which part? the beard? | 18:14 |
| dolphm | gyee: mustache? | 18:15 |
| gyee | yeah that :) | 18:15 |
| stevemar | he's unpredictable, maybe he'll just show up | 18:15 |
| topol | the part when he tells me he will crush my soul... then buy me a beer | 18:15 |
| morganfainberg | topol, he's been lurking around in irc again... | 18:15 |
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| morganfainberg | topol, hehe | 18:15 |
| joesavak | lol | 18:15 |
| topol | really, cool | 18:15 |
| topol | making fun of my old laptop... the whole megillah | 18:16 |
| joesavak | new topic for next meeting - termie recovery anonymous | 18:16 |
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| dolphm | #topic open discussion | 18:16 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:16 | |
| stevemar | joesavak, topol will chair that group :P | 18:16 |
| gyee | anybody trying running keystone tests in mac os 10.9? | 18:16 |
| gyee | oslo config failed me | 18:16 |
| bknudson | if people have time to review changes, they're starting to pile up. | 18:17 |
| gyee | 124 test failures | 18:17 |
| morganfainberg | lots of test cleanup, dstanek is awesome (among other people jamielennox) for working on it. just wanted to give props to him on that. | 18:17 |
| ayoung | termie, stated that he was coming back when HK was announced as the Venue. His input, while caustic online, is surprisingly valuable when delivered in person | 18:17 |
| dolphm | gyee: 10.9 worked for me for about 48 hours and then i upgraded xcode tools i think | 18:17 |
| * dstanek blushes | 18:17 | |
| dolphm | gyee: now i'm going to wipe my laptop and install 10.9 fresh | 18:17 |
| ayoung | dolphm, jaypipes wanted to talk regions | 18:17 |
| gyee | dolphm, oslo config failed to read some files at the end | 18:17 |
| dolphm | ayoung: cool | 18:17 |
| gyee | I still haven't been able to pinpoint the problem yet | 18:17 |
| dolphm | ayoung: unconference? | 18:17 |
| dolphm | ayoung: or here? | 18:17 |
| gyee | I am using homebrew python and everything | 18:17 |
| ayoung | dolphm, it was about the id thing...here I think | 18:17 |
| dstanek | if you guys get a chance take a look at the test reviews ... i'd like to get them in sooner rather than later since they'll be a pain to keep rebasing | 18:18 |
| ayoung | should be a short discussion. | 18:18 |
| topol | gyee is out of the groove... | 18:18 |
| dolphm | gyee: me too | 18:18 |
| ayoung | jaypipes posted a review, and the question was whether a region needed a UUID based Id. I suspect that it does not | 18:18 |
| dolphm | ayoung: id vs name? | 18:18 |
| ayoung | dolphm, right | 18:19 |
| ayoung | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/54215/ | 18:19 |
| gyee | man we should really think about organizing catalogs into trees | 18:19 |
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| dstanek | gyee: you may need to up your file descriptors per process | 18:19 |
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| gyee | similiar to LDAP DIT | 18:19 |
| gyee | catalog is made for that | 18:19 |
| joesavak | gyee +1 | 18:20 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i suggested the other day that user's specify a region name, and the system define the region ID based on the name such that id == urlencoded(name) | 18:20 |
| gyee | lookup will be super easy | 18:20 |
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| gyee | you can filter it anyway you want | 18:20 |
| dolphm | ayoung: in practice, it might be better to do if name != urlencoded(name): raise BadRequest | 18:20 |
| dolphm | ayoung: so id == name | 18:20 |
| gyee | dstanek, good point! | 18:20 |
| morganfainberg | for the test reviews: | 18:20 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I think that is the right approach, too. | 18:20 |
| morganfainberg | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/keystone+branch:master+topic:fix-all-the-tests,n,z | 18:21 |
| gyee | dstanek, I remember someone mentioned it was leaking file descriptors | 18:21 |
| dstanek | gyee: i have a patch that dramatically reduces used file descriptors during a test run :-) | 18:21 |
| dstanek | gyee: i should be able to get that up today too | 18:21 |
| gyee | dstanek, you are the wind beneath my wings | 18:21 |
| joesavak | ... | 18:22 |
| joesavak | gyee, i think you killed the meeting | 18:23 |
| dolphm | dstanek: morganfainberg: thanks | 18:23 |
| gyee | oh damn | 18:23 |
| dolphm | dstanek: where was the leak?? | 18:23 |
| dstanek | gyee: awkward... | 18:23 |
| dolphm | dstanek: i've been on the lookout for that for like a year | 18:23 |
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| dstanek | dolphm: two leaks; one was the inprocess server leaking sockets and the other was handles to the tmp database | 18:24 |
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| ayoung | gyee, I see you havebeen disregarding the Pythagorean Maxim | 18:24 |
| gyee | oslo basically said it can't find keystone.conf.sample after some test runs | 18:24 |
| dolphm | i always assumed there was an issue with the tmp database, but couldn't figure it out | 18:25 |
| dstanek | dolphm: i just ran the full test quite and was checking it periodically with lsof | 18:25 |
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| dolphm | gyee: i may have heard someone else complain of the same | 18:25 |
| gyee | dolphm, I think it was termie | 18:25 |
| gyee | I just can't remember if was fixed | 18:25 |
| dstanek | gyee: try raising your fd limit to 1024 and run the tests again | 18:25 |
| dolphm | gyee: oh! what i'm thinking of might have been yesterday lol | 18:26 |
| dolphm | gyee: and it was a fd limit issue | 18:26 |
| gyee | wow | 18:26 |
| dolphm | gyee: oslo.config was suppressing the error on open() and replacing it with 'file not found' | 18:26 |
| dolphm | i opened a bug against oslo for that | 18:27 |
| morganfainberg | if i can start running tests natively on mac, i'll be even happier. i should set that up | 18:27 |
| gyee | dolphm, yep, that's what I was seeing | 18:27 |
| dolphm | https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo/+bug/1244674 | 18:27 |
| * jaypipes doesn't care which way... just wants a decision. :) | 18:27 | |
| dolphm | jaypipes: can we start with `if name == urlencoded(name): id = name; else: HTTP 400` | 18:28 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: that is pretty much what I submitted. jamie did not like that. | 18:28 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: urllib.quote(name, safe='') | 18:29 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: link? | 18:29 |
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| jaypipes | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/54215/2/openstack-identity-api/v3/src/markdown/identity-api-v3.md | 18:29 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: ^^ | 18:29 |
| * topol jaypipes needs to show up in Hong Kong and demand a decision... | 18:29 | |
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| ayoung | jaypipes, in general I think I am OK with the patch as is. Let me give it another close read through, but I think you addressed all of my concerns | 18:33 |
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| ayoung | Since creating a region is an admin task, and a rare one at that, I think autogenerated UUIDs are not called for | 18:34 |
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| stevemar | ayoung: does anything else exist in keystone that doesn't have a UUID as an id? | 18:35 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, LDAP backed Identity | 18:35 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, ldap backed assignment | 18:36 |
| stevemar | morganfainberg, i meant keystone entities (as far the api spec is concerned) | 18:37 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, sorry, feeling a little punchy | 18:37 |
| stevemar | morganfainberg, i figured ;) | 18:37 |
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| morganfainberg | stevemar, no, but we do support username and project name in lieu of the id in cases. | 18:37 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, same with domain | 18:37 |
| topol | morganfainberg needs a vacation | 18:37 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: posting some comments in a minute, let me know if you have questions | 18:37 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, it isn't a massive departure, and i think in this case, name == id is more friendly/usable | 18:38 |
| stevemar | ayoung: awaiting your input on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/51980/7 btw | 18:38 |
| topol | morganfainberg +1 | 18:38 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: on patchset 3 | 18:38 |
| stevemar | morganfainberg, i'm cool with name == id for this case, was just playing devil's advocate :) | 18:38 |
| morganfainberg | no reason to overload having multiple ways to handle regions since they will be (as ayoung said) not made as often as projects... or instances even. | 18:38 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, fair enough :) | 18:39 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: i played around with the idea of project & user id's being based on the name ... that's difficult with URL encoding & domain scope | 18:40 |
| dolphm | i don't have a good solution at all | 18:40 |
| dolphm | service name can be id | 18:40 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, i would actually like that if it can be viable. | 18:40 |
| dolphm | domain name can be id | 18:40 |
| morganfainberg | id based on name that is (project/user) | 18:40 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: me too, but encoding get's nasty | 18:40 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: or you need to reserve a character as a seperator | 18:40 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, it's the issue we are trying to handl with DNs as IDs ;) | 18:41 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: and there's unicode support | 18:41 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, yeah. *shudder* unicode an py27. it makes me sad (and longing for full py3k support) | 18:41 |
| dolphm | i'm totally ready to switch lol | 18:42 |
| morganfainberg | still doesn't solve urlencoding though. | 18:42 |
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| jamielennox | ... sorry i'm late - i miss anything particular for me? | 18:42 |
| ayoung | LDAP user ids are going to be a tricky. I had thought we weould use the DN, but even there we are not going to be globally unique | 18:42 |
| ayoung | Ids should ideally embed the domain in them | 18:42 |
| ayoung | @ sign is the defacto standard | 18:43 |
| ayoung | jamielennox, yeah | 18:43 |
| gyee | ayoung, huh? | 18:43 |
| ayoung | jamielennox, we are discussing naming and the regions patch | 18:43 |
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| gyee | DNs are meant to be globally unique | 18:43 |
| dolphm | ayoung: @ is not url friendly | 18:43 |
| ayoung | gyee, @ sign is what people expect for username and domain | 18:43 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I know | 18:43 |
| ayoung | I am just pointed out that it is typically how this is done, not that it works for us | 18:43 |
| dolphm | user%40domain | 18:44 |
| ayoung | dolphm, and it also breaks if people are using email addresses as usernames, very common practice | 18:44 |
| dolphm | you almost have to encode twice to be able to avoid reserved chars and allow predictable decoding, e.g. encode(encode(user_name) + '@' + encode(domain_name)) | 18:45 |
| jaypipes | so... back to the region name vs. region ID thing... | 18:45 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, not fun. | 18:45 |
| ayoung | I don't have a good answer, unfortunately. the LDAP approach os DN=ayoung,CN=redhat,CN=com | 18:45 |
| bknudson | DC=redhat,DC=com | 18:45 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, are there reserved characters in LDAP DNs? | 18:45 |
| morganfainberg | eg. things that can't go in them? | 18:46 |
| ayoung | right, right | 18:46 |
| bknudson | , is reserved! | 18:46 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: follow up question? | 18:46 |
| jaypipes | any way we can get back on track here? :) | 18:46 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: it's open discussion ;) | 18:46 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, no, we love it in the weeds | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, haha if only that was more helpful ;) | 18:46 |
| jaypipes | I noticed ;) | 18:46 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, short of it is, I think that region names can be user assigned | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | jaypipes, join us in the weeds. | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | (you know you want to) | 18:46 |
| ayoung | and id == name is a good rule | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung ++ | 18:46 |
| jaypipes | ayoung: as opposed to assigned by The Creator? | 18:47 |
| ayoung | I don't think UUID region IDs buys us anything | 18:47 |
| jamielennox | i know i probably missed this, but if id == name, why do i want both? | 18:47 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, as opposed to assigned by the server... | 18:47 |
| jaypipes | ayoung: there was actually nothing in the original proposal that said anything about UUIDs, but whatevs :) | 18:47 |
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| jaypipes | ayoung: OK, so shall I remove the entire notion of region ID then, and just say region name must be unique within a deployment and be URL-safe? | 18:48 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, hey, I am pulling this out of long term memory...I wasn't the one that Red Xed the original proposal. | 18:48 |
| jaypipes | ayoung: yes, I know :) | 18:48 |
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| dolphm | jaypipes: you'll still have a region ID in the spec, per API Conventions | 18:49 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: all resources have an 'id' attribute | 18:49 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: OK... so is there a reason to have name then? | 18:49 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, why not name be the segment, and ID be the full path? | 18:49 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, didn't that break down with filtering and moving regions around? | 18:49 |
| morganfainberg | i might be mis-remembering | 18:49 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: per convention, names are specified by the client, and id's are specified by the service | 18:50 |
| jaypipes | morganfainberg: correct, though I think a better reason not to do that is just for simplicity's sake | 18:50 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: if the client is going to specify the ID directly, i think it should be a PUT on the final resource location | 18:50 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: not a POST with an id attribute | 18:50 |
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| ayoung | morganfainberg, I am a fan of immutable objects...but, yeah, there was a sense that region ID was like INODE and region name was like dentry | 18:51 |
| morganfainberg | jaypipes, i'll buy doing it for simplicity as a means to an end (and avoid the other issues as a byproduct) | 18:51 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: ok, so my proposal as it stands right now would work for you, then? both an ID and a name field, with the ID being generated rfom the name, with name being unique within a deployment? | 18:51 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, too long since we had the original conversation | 18:51 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: yes | 18:51 |
| bknudson | can I change the name? | 18:51 |
| dolphm | bknudson: good question | 18:51 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, yah. | 18:52 |
| dolphm | bknudson: id's are immutable, i forgot about that | 18:52 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, is moving a region around in the hierarchy an essential feature? | 18:52 |
| dolphm | ayoung: seems like a simple feature - why do you ask? | 18:52 |
| dolphm | PATCH to parent_region_id | 18:52 |
| morganfainberg | jaypipes, would it make more sense to be able to move other objects to another region vs change a region? | 18:52 |
| ayoung | dolphm, then the ID needs to be separate from the name | 18:52 |
| jaypipes | morganfainberg: the only other object to move to another region is a another region | 18:53 |
| bknudson | SQL queries of hierarchical data are typically slow... requires looping | 18:53 |
| morganfainberg | maybe even support a "redirect" concept "oh that object is now in region <blah>" instead of "renaming" the region itself. | 18:53 |
| jaypipes | bknudson: nested set model. | 18:53 |
| dolphm | ayoung: because why? i don't follow | 18:53 |
| morganfainberg | jaypipes, right | 18:53 |
| jaypipes | bknudson: single non-looping query over the (small) dataset | 18:53 |
| jaypipes | bknudson: can return descendants of any level | 18:53 |
| bknudson | a small dataset makes it easier. | 18:54 |
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| dolphm | bknudson: it'd be easier to construct it in python and cache the result in dogpile :) | 18:54 |
| dolphm | bknudson: i.e. select all from sql, then build a deep dict in python | 18:54 |
| jaypipes | ok, so back to the name vs ID thing... | 18:54 |
| ayoung | dolphm, say a region has 13 endpoints. If you want to move that reqion with all the endpoints around in the hierarchy, you need to maintain the id to maintain the relationships...or update each individual record. THere was some problem with the latter as I recall | 18:54 |
| dolphm | what jaypipes said | 18:55 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: you just need update one region to achieve that | 18:55 |
| gyee | jaypipes, looks like I can create a circular reference with the current spec? parent_region_id pointing to a child region id? | 18:55 |
| dolphm | ayoung: and it doesn't require mutable ID's | 18:55 |
| dolphm | gyee: ++ | 18:56 |
| jaypipes | gyee: sure, I can add a note about that. | 18:56 |
| bknudson | gyee: that's another problem with moving subtrees, can get disconnected. | 18:56 |
| dolphm | gyee: impl should maybe validate that on POST ? | 18:56 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, nice catch | 18:56 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: yes. | 18:56 |
| morganfainberg | no circular deps please ;) | 18:56 |
| morganfainberg | or references... | 18:56 |
| jaypipes | but can we make a decision on the ID vs. name thing? | 18:56 |
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| gyee | well, impl will have to fix that | 18:57 |
| ayoung | dolphm, if I move a region from one parent region to another, I am, in effect creating a new region object, and moving all of the endpoints. Assuming an endpoint has a link to its region, the endpoint objects need to be updated. So, yeah, region is technically immutable, but due to a lot of copying etc | 18:57 |
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| ayoung | jaypipes, ^^ is the heart of the problem | 18:57 |
| jaypipes | ayoung: wouldn't be a problem if ID were a UUID. | 18:57 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: is anyone opposed to id == name per http://pasteraw.com/hh7sz3rfnk6fyn9zes1wcahqcov0o7j | 18:57 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, the easiest solution is uuid | 18:57 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, do we need an immutable id in order to move regions around? | 18:57 |
| dolphm | ayoung: but you don't have to create a new region object to do that | 18:58 |
| jaypipes | ayoung: yes. at least, without some code gymnastics | 18:58 |
| dolphm | endpoint objects don't need to be updated | 18:58 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: they would if the ID changed. | 18:58 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: which would happen if the name == ID. | 18:58 |
| ayoung | dolphm, they do if they contain a link to their region, which is what i am trying to ascertain | 18:58 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: immutable name and address it later? | 18:59 |
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| jaypipes | dolphm: ? | 19:00 |
| ayoung | dolphm, server assigned ID, UUID, is probably most appropriate. Ugly, but it matches how people need to think about regions | 19:00 |
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| jaypipes | ayoung: it also matches every other resource in the Keystone API. | 19:00 |
| ayoung | jaypipes, I'll add ^^ to the reveiw request so we don't lose this logic again | 19:00 |
| jaypipes | that said, I wouldn't mind going with jamielennox's suggestion of "display_name" instead of just "name" | 19:00 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, unless region "names" aren't fully qualified. more like a linked list. but i think that is an ugly approach. uuid is least resistance | 19:00 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, and makes the most sense in this context. | 19:01 |
| jamielennox | i'm not sure i see the usecase for moving regions | 19:01 |
| jamielennox | why would someone want thatt? | 19:01 |
| dolphm | jaypipes: in all your examples, you're duplicating the parental relationship in the region names themselves, right? | 19:01 |
| bknudson | earthquake? | 19:01 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: that's a definite region deletion | 19:02 |
| jamielennox | time guys | 19:02 |
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| dolphm | jamielennox: say an entire rack was upgraded to SSD's, it now belongs in a different sub region? | 19:02 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: ah, thanks | 19:02 |
| dolphm | #endmeeting | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:02 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 19:02:52 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:02 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-29-18.03.html | 19:02 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: yes, but that's just accidental... | 19:02 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-29-18.03.txt | 19:02 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-29-18.03.log.html | 19:02 |
| clarkb | o/ | 19:03 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 19:03 |
| fungi | infra team assemble! | 19:03 |
| jaypipes | dolphm: and yes, your example above is axactly the use case | 19:03 |
| clarkb | with our powers combined we are captain planet^H^H^H^H^H^H infra | 19:03 |
| fungi | #startmeeting infra | 19:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 19:03:45 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:03 |
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| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting | 19:04 |
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| fungi | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:04 | |
| fungi | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-22-19.01.html | 19:04 |
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| fungi | #action clarkb decommission old etherpad server eventually (after the summit) | 19:05 |
| fungi | #action jeblair move tarballs.o.o and include 50gb space for heat/trove images | 19:05 |
| fungi | carrying forward ;) | 19:05 |
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| fungi | i suspect some of the topics on the agenda are stale, but you can tell me | 19:06 |
| fungi | #topic Trove testing (mordred, hub_cap) | 19:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Trove testing (mordred, hub_cap) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:06 | |
| clarkb | SlickNick has a change up to enable trove testing | 19:06 |
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| pleia2 | cool | 19:06 |
| fungi | ooh, link? | 19:06 |
| clarkb | well a prereq | 19:06 |
| clarkb | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53972/ | 19:06 |
| hub_cap | hey fungi, im blocked on any work currently wrt this | 19:07 |
| clarkb | Trove needs dib images and to do that cleanly the dib things need to go in their own repo | 19:07 |
| fungi | hub_cap: no worries. i think it's on the agenda perpetually so we remember to give you a hard time or something | 19:07 |
| clarkb | the bits are slowly falling into place | 19:07 |
| hub_cap | yes feel free to scream at me at the summit :) | 19:07 |
| fungi | hub_cap: i'll scream with you instead | 19:08 |
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| clarkb | we need soundproof rooms we can just yell :) | 19:08 |
| fungi | sounds like good stress relief | 19:08 |
| fungi | so anything else on this topic since last week? | 19:08 |
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| clarkb | doesn't look like it | 19:09 |
| fungi | #topic Tripleo testing (lifeless, pleia2) | 19:09 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Tripleo testing (lifeless, pleia2) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:09 | |
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| pleia2 | I'm continuing to work through setting up iteration 2 here: | 19:09 |
| pleia2 | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-test-cluster | 19:09 |
| hub_cap | fungi: sounds good :) | 19:10 |
| pleia2 | got a little of the networking stuff set up for the test instance, now just working through leveraging existing tripleo scripts to set it up, from there I might need some help with specific portions (particularly the gearman bit) | 19:10 |
| pleia2 | that's about it, making progress | 19:10 |
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| fungi | sounds awesome | 19:11 |
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| fungi | questions? comments? applause? | 19:12 |
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| clarkb | excited to have more testing | 19:12 |
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| fungi | testing good. regressions bad | 19:12 |
| * fungi applauds and moves on to... | 19:13 | |
| fungi | #topic Wsme / pecan testing (sdague, dhellman) | 19:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Wsme / pecan testing (sdague, dhellman) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:13 | |
| dhellmann | o/ | 19:13 |
| * dhellmann hopes sdague has something in mind... | 19:13 | |
| fungi | stale topic on the agenda? or are there updates? i saw a review just pop up earlier today for something related | 19:13 |
| clarkb | I believe most of the bits are in place, but we reverted the change that added the jobs to zuul | 19:14 |
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| clarkb | because we were gating nova on wsme and vice versa which wasn't desired | 19:14 |
| dhellmann | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/54333/ | 19:14 |
| dhellmann | that runs tox tests for pecan against wsme, ceilometer, and ironic | 19:14 |
| fungi | yeah, that's the one i was looking for | 19:15 |
| dhellmann | I assume sdague and clarkb have the (a)symmetric gating thing in hand | 19:15 |
| clarkb | dhellmann: I believe sdague planned to propose a change that used different tests to avoid symmetric gating | 19:16 |
| fungi | i always like to assume that. helps me sleep easier at night | 19:16 |
| dhellmann | clarkb: makes sense | 19:16 |
| dhellmann | clarkb: the jobs in ^^ run the unit tests, but integration tests would be good, too | 19:16 |
| fungi | quick aside, unrelated, but i think the d-g changes just broke gating | 19:16 |
| clarkb | fungi: :( | 19:17 |
| * fungi seems very much red all over the zuul status screen | 19:17 | |
| dhellmann | d-g? | 19:17 |
| fungi | devstack-gate | 19:17 |
| dhellmann | ok | 19:17 |
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| clarkb | fungi: I think the lack of early enough reexec bit us | 19:17 |
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| fungi | yeah | 19:19 |
| fungi | anything else on pecan/wsme? | 19:19 |
| fungi | i'll move this along while we troubleshoot | 19:20 |
| dhellmann | nothing from me | 19:20 |
| fungi | #topic New etherpad.o.o server and migration (clarkb) | 19:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "New etherpad.o.o server and migration (clarkb) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:20 | |
| clarkb | nothing new here really. | 19:20 |
| fungi | i'm guessing this one is probably no longer needing to stay on the agenda. we still have the action item | 19:20 |
| pleia2 | still seems to be running well | 19:20 |
| clarkb | the new server continues to be fine according to cacti | 19:20 |
| clarkb | and no yelling from users despite getting use before the summit | 19:21 |
| fungi | great | 19:21 |
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| fungi | #topic Retiring https://github.com/openstack-ci | 19:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Retiring https://github.com/openstack-ci (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:22 | |
| fungi | who's was this? | 19:22 |
| fungi | #link https://github.com/openstack-ci | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | oh yes | 19:23 |
| pleia2 | so someone found that the other day and was confused | 19:23 |
| fungi | dead stuff and a placeholder saying we went -> that way | 19:23 |
| pleia2 | looking at it, I think we should get together next week and delete it | 19:23 |
| pleia2 | or delete everything except for the -> that way | 19:23 |
| fungi | perhaps. there may still be old articles and things floating around the 'net, so the we-have-moved sign might be warranted. i'm on the fence there | 19:24 |
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| pleia2 | maybe we just chat about this next week and see if it's still on the agenda the following | 19:25 |
| pleia2 | this is just a cleanup thing anyway | 19:25 |
| clarkb | ++ | 19:26 |
| clarkb | I asked that it be put on here because it is the sort of thing I think we need consensus on | 19:26 |
| clarkb | next week consensus should be easy | 19:26 |
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| fungi | sounds good | 19:28 |
| fungi | #topic Savanna testing | 19:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Savanna testing (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:28 | |
| fungi | SergeyLukjanov: was this yours? | 19:28 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, yep | 19:29 |
| SergeyLukjanov | hi | 19:29 |
| fungi | welcome! you have the floor | 19:29 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I just would like to share some our problems/options for testing | 19:29 |
| SergeyLukjanov | btw we have a design track session in savanna topic to discuss CI approach | 19:29 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | the main problem is that we need to test MapReduce job working at Hadoop cluster deployed at instances provisioned at OpenStack | 19:30 |
| SergeyLukjanov | it could be one instance for the simplest tests | 19:30 |
| SergeyLukjanov | but it'll not work for more complex tests | 19:30 |
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| fungi | can multiple instances run on the same virtual machine for testing multi-instance? or is it one per vm? | 19:31 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: today we can only do single node tests, I know that we would like to have the option to do multinode (and have for a while) but the work to make that happen hasn't been done yet (there are tricky bits around networking) | 19:31 |
| SergeyLukjanov | one per vm | 19:31 |
| SergeyLukjanov | but it could be many vms per host | 19:31 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: you can hook into the simple single node stuff today by creating a job that runs on the devstack-gate nodes | 19:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | oh, I'm afraid that I write incorrect | 19:32 |
| fungi | well, tripleo bare metal aside, we don't control any real hosts (though our devstack vms act as hosts for some basic tests, but the cirros vms on top of them are nearly unusable for real workloads) | 19:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I mean that we will need several OpenStack instances, not compute nodes | 19:32 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, and that's really a problem | 19:33 |
| SergeyLukjanov | we need at least one instance with 1 vCPU, 1 GB RAM | 19:33 |
| clarkb | and probably actual virt | 19:34 |
| clarkb | not qemu | 19:34 |
| SergeyLukjanov | and some prev. tests show that we need actual acceleration | 19:34 |
| SergeyLukjanov | yeah | 19:34 |
| clarkb | though, if you can get by with qemu or containers the d-g nodes should suffice | 19:34 |
| clarkb | they are 8GB 4VCPU nodes | 19:34 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | Hadoop starts several hours on qemu and jobs aren't working on it after start ) | 19:34 |
| fungi | do you need more than novaclient et cetera access to a tenant on a openstack cloud, or do you need actual administrative control over the openstack parts under those vm instances? | 19:34 |
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| fungi | like control of the computer nodes themselves | 19:35 |
| fungi | gah, compute nodes | 19:35 |
| SergeyLukjanov | we need only access to the keystone's service acc to check tokens and all other ops done using user's token | 19:35 |
| SergeyLukjanov | we'reusing trusts to support some long-term ops | 19:36 |
| fungi | just wondering if you're able to, say, run this sort of work through a public cloud you don't own. in which case it sounds like you're looking for multi-node testing we've been talking about | 19:36 |
| SergeyLukjanov | as for the services, we're using nova, glance and optionally cinder and neutron | 19:36 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | we're looking now only for simple CI (one or several instances on one-node devstack is enough) | 19:38 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | am I right that qemu used for gating? | 19:40 |
| fungi | okay, so if you can run what you want initially with devstack in an 8gb flavor vm on ubuntu 12.04 lts (precise) 64-bit in hpcloud or rackspace, then it might be pretty easy to implement (for some definitions of "easy") | 19:40 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: yes | 19:40 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, it should be enough for the most tests | 19:40 |
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| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: however you could in theory use containers if that buys you the ability to run hadoop in a semi performant way | 19:40 |
| SergeyLukjanov | the only problem is acceleration | 19:40 |
| fungi | if your initial needs deviate from that, then there's some more substantial engineering required | 19:41 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I think that we should start from the testing Hadoop on the gating node to understand how it'll work there and which tests could pass | 19:42 |
| SergeyLukjanov | at least it could be used to check integration with other projectss | 19:42 |
| clarkb | ++, I think you should get something in place and put it in the experimental pipeline | 19:42 |
| fungi | that sounds like a great first step | 19:43 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: I wouldn't start by adding it to all of the projects (just because we have found that usually a lot of iteration is needed on the project being tested first) | 19:43 |
| SergeyLukjanov | is it the right behavior to add savanna testing job and add it to the experimental pipeline? | 19:43 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: that is what I would suggest | 19:43 |
| SergeyLukjanov | oops, reading too slow, jet lag strikes back after two weeks :( | 19:43 |
| fungi | to test the waters first, yeah | 19:43 |
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| clarkb | once you sort out the major issues that you will inevitably run into we can move you to the silent queue or check/gate | 19:44 |
| SergeyLukjanov | agreed, we need to make such test stable before adding them to other projects | 19:45 |
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| fungi | if they're "stable enough" that they pass most of the time and you want to collect more data, we could move it to a non-voting job before making it enforced in the gate, as an additional stepping stone | 19:46 |
| SergeyLukjanov | so, to summarize, I'll start from adding job for savanna in experimental pipeline to test how it'll work | 19:46 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: yup and you can look at the pbr integration test as an example | 19:46 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, yeah, it sounds good | 19:46 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | one more question | 19:46 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | is it possible to access some gating worker w/o job to check how hadoop will run there? | 19:47 |
| fungi | the pbr integration test might actually be a little severe. it doesn't really use devstack at all (not sure if you plan to use any of devstack, like where it gets the services set up for you at least) | 19:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | or some specific cloud/flavor/dc coordinates | 19:47 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: rackspace and hpcloud 8GB 4VCPU nodes | 19:47 |
| clarkb | SergeyLukjanov: running ubuntu precise with latest updates | 19:48 |
| SergeyLukjanov | clarkb, got it, thx | 19:48 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, I'll take a look at the pbr tests | 19:48 |
| SergeyLukjanov | btw savanna could be installed by devstack now, so, looks like job will not be very different | 19:48 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | there are no more questions from my side, thank you guys! | 19:49 |
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| fungi | SergeyLukjanov: some of this walkthrough might also help with emulating our setup manually... https://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/devstack-gate/tree/README.rst#n100 | 19:49 |
| fungi | #link https://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/devstack-gate/tree/README.rst#n100 | 19:49 |
| fungi | anyone else have comments on this topic? | 19:50 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | return back on summit and/or after it :) | 19:50 |
| fungi | #topic Design summit Infra track etherpads (fungi) | 19:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Design summit Infra track etherpads (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:50 | |
| fungi | (last-minute agenda addition, chair's perogative) | 19:50 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Summit/Icehouse/Etherpads#Infrastructure | 19:51 |
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| clarkb | abusing the system ;) | 19:51 |
| fungi | basic announcement | 19:51 |
| fungi | clarkb said he thought jeblair was done finalizing our schedule, so i threw those together | 19:51 |
| fungi | take a look if you get time, make sure they're sane | 19:51 |
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| zaro | why bunch them all on thurs? | 19:52 |
| clarkb | zaro: the slots are more spread out this time | 19:52 |
| zaro | opps forgot monday is dead | 19:53 |
| clarkb | but tend to clump a bit so that we can avoid conflicts with other sessions we want to be in | 19:53 |
| fungi | previous summits we were in the process track and mostly all on one day | 19:53 |
| clarkb | I have a lot more single session slots this time around, overall very happy about that | 19:53 |
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| fungi | but i don't specifically know the reasons for particular slots there, just that there was a lot of jockeying to make sure related topics between tracks didn't overlap so people would be more likely to be able to attend where needed | 19:54 |
| fungi | #topic Open discussion | 19:55 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:55 | |
| fungi | with our last five minutes... what else is going on? | 19:55 |
| pleia2 | for those of us going to LCA, call for sysadmin miniconf talks ends this friday http://lists.lca2014.linux.org.au/pipermail/chat_lists.lca2014.linux.org.au/2013-October/000012.html | 19:55 |
| fungi | anybody break anything fun lately? | 19:55 |
| pleia2 | I submitted one about how we manage our whole puppet configs in the open + hiera (instead of just releasing generic modules) | 19:56 |
| fungi | we do that? excellent! | 19:56 |
| pleia2 | haha | 19:56 |
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| clarkb | nothing from me. I need to run | 19:57 |
| pleia2 | I'm also writing a "Code Review for Systems Administrators" article for USENIX logout (bi-monthly, digital-only companion to the more serious/academic ;login: magazine they have for members: https://www.usenix.org/publications/login), mostly based on my OSCON talk but less about infrastructure, more sysadmin benefit side | 19:57 |
| clarkb | cool | 19:57 |
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| fungi | clarkb: have a good run | 19:57 |
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| fungi | very neat | 19:57 |
| zaro | i just returned from jenkins conf with a jenkins bobblehead. | 19:58 |
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| pleia2 | zaro: hooray! | 19:58 |
| zaro | clarkb really enjoyed it. | 19:58 |
| pleia2 | hehe | 19:58 |
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| fungi | representin' | 19:59 |
| fungi | okay, that's all for this time. join us next week... IN HONG KONG!!!! (echo, echo echo) | 20:00 |
| fungi | #endmeeting | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 20:00:21 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-29-19.03.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-29-19.03.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-29-19.03.log.html | 20:00 |
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| ttx | PSA: No TC meeting this week. We'll discuss the design summit at the release meeting in one hour. | 20:00 |
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| * russellb preemptively waves ... o/ | 20:59 | |
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| ttx | o/ | 20:59 |
| devananda | \o | 20:59 |
| gabrielhurley | \o | 20:59 |
| dansmith | -o- | 20:59 |
| ttx | dhellmann, dolphm, notmyname, jd__, markwash, jgriffith, stevebaker, markmcclain, dtroyer, SergeyLukjanov, annegentle, sdague, lifeless, hub_cap, jeblair, kgriffs: around ? | 20:59 |
| markwash | o/ | 20:59 |
| sdague | o/ | 20:59 |
| notmyname | hellow | 20:59 |
| markwash | darnit! didn't beat roll call | 20:59 |
| annegentle | hola | 21:00 |
| ttx | rollcall was admittedly slightly too early | 21:00 |
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| ttx | #startmeeting project | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 21:01:35 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'project' | 21:01 |
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| ttx | A "design summit special" today... | 21:01 |
| ttx | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/ProjectMeeting | 21:01 |
| ttx | Should be short. | 21:01 |
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| ttx | #topic Design Summit Q&A | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Design Summit Q&A (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:02 | |
| ttx | By this time next week we'll be in the middle of the Icehouse Design Summit in Hong-Kong | 21:02 |
| stevebaker | here! | 21:02 |
| ttx | #info General information about the Design Summit lives here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Summit/Icehouse | 21:02 |
| ttx | including travel tips | 21:02 |
| ttx | Does anyone have questions, before we all go dark in travel plans ? | 21:02 |
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| * russellb doesn't see travel tips! | 21:03 | |
| russellb | nm. | 21:03 |
| sdague | it's linked | 21:03 |
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| ttx | There is a "dress fancy in restaurants" advice there | 21:04 |
| ttx | ok, so summit is crystal clear to everyone ? | 21:04 |
| jgriffith | o/ | 21:04 |
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| ttx | #topic Last minute Design Summit scheduling issues | 21:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Last minute Design Summit scheduling issues (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:04 | |
| ttx | #info Design Summit schedule is up at http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/ | 21:04 |
| annegentle | Octopus card ftw | 21:05 |
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| markwash | note, an octopus cannot be substituted for an octopus card | 21:05 |
| ttx | do not eat octopus cards | 21:05 |
| annegentle | markwash: ttx: noted | 21:05 |
| ttx | I'd like to abuse this meeting to solve all last minute session swaps so that we can start advertising the schedule more broadly | 21:06 |
| ttx | So if you have any remaining conflicts that we can live-solve, please shout now | 21:06 |
| markwash | ttx: I have one project-y note | 21:06 |
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| ttx | markwash: we'll have open discussion afterwards, if it's not schedule related | 21:06 |
| markwash | ttx: fine, thanks | 21:06 |
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| russellb | schedule must be perfect | 21:07 |
| annegentle | me and Doug had one where Docs is taking the 9:00 am Friday Oslo slot, what do you need for that ttx? | 21:07 |
| dolphm | russellb: ++ | 21:07 |
| ttx | in particular, if you're giving a talk in the conference side, please check that it's not at the same time as one design session you need to attend | 21:07 |
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| russellb | my only problem is the inability to be in more than 1 place at the same time | 21:07 |
| sdague | jgriffith: only wanted to highlight that you put the cinder live upgrade at the same time as the gating live upgrades bit in qa track | 21:08 |
| devananda | russellb: cloning is the answer. | 21:08 |
| jgriffith | sdague: I believe that's been changed | 21:08 |
| sdague | ok | 21:08 |
| ttx | annegentle: and the Oslo slot would go to Monday ? | 21:08 |
| russellb | we're doing monday now? :-p | 21:08 |
| jgriffith | sdague: and I'd say "qa" put it in the same time as me :) | 21:08 |
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| sdague | jgriffith: we published first :) | 21:08 |
| jgriffith | sdague: :) | 21:08 |
| lifeless | ttx: o/ | 21:09 |
| ttx | annegentle: or Doug just donates one slot to you ? | 21:09 |
| russellb | i still haven't used my friday 5pm slot if anyone wants it ... | 21:09 |
| dolphm | everyone: be sure to check for design session conflicts against the conference schedule as well! http://openstacksummitnovember2013.sched.org/ | 21:09 |
| markwash | russellb: I know you're not as concerned about this, but is there a good time on Tuesday i can run the "image state consistency" session so that I can hope nova-api folks will attend without it being too disruptive? link to follow | 21:09 |
| markwash | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/c84a3a460b9c90fc611cab7f37cb17e7#.UnAj85R-SDc | 21:10 |
| annegentle | ttx: I think it was a donation. What's Doug's IRC handle, dhellmann? | 21:10 |
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| ttx | annegentle: it is | 21:10 |
| annegentle | dhellmann: yeah there you are! | 21:10 |
| markmcclain | o/ | 21:10 |
| ttx | annegentle: Doug has scheduled an open slot there -- continuation of any needed talks | 21:10 |
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| ttx | http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/event/9316cfc42612494a19e7fe904154df97 | 21:11 |
| russellb | markwash: 2pm we have unconference, so that'd probably be the best time | 21:11 |
| annegentle | ttx: cool | 21:11 |
| markwash | russellb: thanks | 21:11 |
| ttx | annegentle: if you need an extra slot, you can take one at 5pm on Friday (at the same time as the "Future of Design Summits" discussion | 21:11 |
| lifeless | russellb: thats for drinking heavily, right? | 21:11 |
| lifeless | russellb: (5pm) | 21:11 |
| annegentle | ttx: I'll take that 9 am Fri | 21:11 |
| russellb | lifeless: or napping | 21:12 |
| ttx | annegentle: what I'm saying is... Doug seems to have scheduled something osloic there | 21:12 |
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| sdague | annegentle: actually, where the first QA session is is actually a take over of the neutron slot (we cross scheduled to make sure we'd have everyone in the same room), so the QA room will be open then | 21:13 |
| annegentle | ttx: right, understood | 21:13 |
| annegentle | sdague: which time is that? | 21:13 |
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| sdague | 11:15 wed | 21:14 |
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| * ttx looks into moving the "release schedule" and the "future of design summit" discussions to larger rooms | 21:15 | |
| russellb | ttx: can take the nova room | 21:16 |
| russellb | ttx: 5pm is unused, and the slot before it probably doesn't need a big room | 21:16 |
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| annegentle | sdague: ttx: sticking with 9 am Friday, but thanks. | 21:16 |
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| ttx | russellb: hmm, tempting | 21:17 |
| russellb | ttx: well up to you, but it's fine with me | 21:18 |
| ttx | russellb: ok, will make the room swaps later | 21:19 |
| ttx | annegentle: Still not sure I follow -- Doug currently scheduled something for Oslo there. Should I remove what he put and assign that slot to Doc ? | 21:19 |
| ttx | Any other needed move ? Or is the schedule OK for everyone present ? | 21:20 |
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| * SergeyLukjanov have some intersects due to the afternoon savanna design track, but not many | 21:22 | |
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| SergeyLukjanov | with one release session | 21:22 |
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| annegentle | ttx: I'd like to confirm with dhellmann but I think that's the intent, for Doug to give an oslo slot to doc | 21:22 |
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| ttx | SergeyLukjanov: so... if you prefer to miss "future of design summits" rather that "release schedule", we could move that 4:10 slot to 5:00 in savanna (keep 4:10 empty and have a session at 5:00 instead) | 21:23 |
| russellb | ttx: annegentle looks like that 9am slot is just a placeholder for oslo, not a real oslo session right now | 21:23 |
| dhellmann | sorry I'm late | 21:24 |
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| ttx | russellb: yes, that's my understanding, just don't want to steal Doug's property | 21:24 |
| ttx | ah, here he comes | 21:24 |
| dhellmann | yes, that session can go to anne, that's just a placeholder | 21:24 |
| annegentle | ttx: dhellmann: thanks! | 21:24 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: should I unschedule it, or can you clear it? | 21:24 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, looks like both of them are mostly informational for me, so, no need to move sessions | 21:25 |
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| ttx | dhellmann: please unschedule (to make sure you don't accidentally push it again), and I'll clear it | 21:25 |
| devananda | jgriffith: did you sort out the conflict with cinder-ironic session? | 21:25 |
| SergeyLukjanov | someone from savanna team will attend it instead of me | 21:25 |
| jgriffith | devananda: I did thanks to dolphm and ttx | 21:25 |
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| devananda | great | 21:25 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: ack | 21:25 |
| devananda | there are no other conflicts with ironic sessions that i'm aware of | 21:25 |
| annegentle | ttx: I have a blueprint I can put in there, do you need it in summit.openstack.org? https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Blueprint-os-api-docs | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | ttx: done | 21:26 |
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| ttx | annegentle: yes, use http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/create to add it | 21:27 |
| annegentle | ttx: will do | 21:27 |
| ttx | annegentle: ok, slot added to Doc | 21:27 |
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| dansmith | I just noticed a potential conflict | 21:28 |
| russellb | dansmith: rawr | 21:28 |
| ttx | annegentle: once you add the session, approve and schedule it in that slot | 21:28 |
| dansmith | sdague: the rolling upgrades qa session overlaps with an apparent cinder one on cinder live upgrades | 21:28 |
| sdague | dansmith: yep, read scrollback | 21:28 |
| dansmith | oh, sorry, I'm only half paying attention | 21:28 |
| sdague | :) | 21:28 |
| sdague | jgriffith is on it | 21:28 |
| dansmith | cool | 21:29 |
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| russellb | wish we had time for an upgrade day | 21:29 |
| russellb | where we're all in the same room at the same time | 21:29 |
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| lifeless | russellb: +1 | 21:30 |
| dansmith | yeah | 21:30 |
| russellb | instead of all these sessions with different groups | 21:30 |
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| russellb | alas | 21:30 |
| ttx | russellb: try to remember that feedback for the "future of design summits" discussion | 21:30 |
| sdague | russellb: yeh, mordred and I were talking similar things the other day | 21:30 |
| dansmith | if we can just start a UaaS project, then we can dedicate a day to it, right? :D | 21:31 |
| sdague | nice :) | 21:31 |
| ttx | russellb: if we move towards separate events, we'll recover the "plenary" times and could set up cross-project sessions (upgrades, APi design etc) | 21:31 |
| russellb | ttx: ok, cool ... i guess more generally, how to best handle cross project issues | 21:31 |
| russellb | yeah that'd be good | 21:31 |
| russellb | all hands design summit sessions | 21:31 |
| russellb | may be tough with that many people in the room though ... oh well | 21:31 |
| russellb | we'll figure something out | 21:31 |
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| ttx | OK, so if the schedule works for everyone, we'll start to more aggressively promote it | 21:32 |
| dolphm | russellb: interesting idea | 21:32 |
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| russellb | ttx: does future of design summits have a potential impact on the schedule? | 21:32 |
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| dhellmann | at pycon there are some invitation-only events scheduled before the conference. that doesn't fit so well with our model, but if the "invitation" was +2 that would cut the size of the crowd down | 21:32 |
| russellb | ttx: as in, should the schedule session go last then? | 21:32 |
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| russellb | dhellmann: yeah, but ... we'll get flamed hard for that | 21:33 |
| ttx | russellb: it's unlikely to affect the NEXT summit that much | 21:33 |
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| russellb | ttx: ok ... happen to know when the next one is already? :) | 21:33 |
| dhellmann | russellb: yeah, would be a tough sell | 21:33 |
| ttx | russellb: I have a pretty good idea yes | 21:33 |
| dhellmann | russellb: the other trick is to give the sessions such boring names that no one attends ;-) | 21:33 |
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| russellb | dhellmann: we got a lot of pushback on ATC-only for the design summit (used to be that way IIRC) | 21:33 |
| russellb | dhellmann: there ya go | 21:34 |
| russellb | ISO-9001 certification | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | haha | 21:34 |
| ttx | russellb: hint: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IcehouseReleaseSchedule | 21:34 |
| sdague | heh | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | wait, no, that would draw the wrong crowd entirely | 21:34 |
| ttx | russellb: still need to have confirmation for exact design summit dates though | 21:34 |
| russellb | ttx: perfect | 21:34 |
| russellb | i think i will still make it then! \o/ | 21:34 |
| lifeless | query sdague | 21:35 |
| lifeless | bah | 21:35 |
| ttx | #topic Open discussion | 21:35 |
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| ttx | Anything anyone wants to discuss ? | 21:35 |
| ttx | Vim modelines ? | 21:35 |
| dansmith | haha | 21:35 |
| russellb | lol. | 21:35 |
| stevebaker | ttx: What does the fox say? | 21:35 |
| russellb | periods in the first line of the commit message | 21:35 |
| rockyg | {chuckle} | 21:35 |
| jgriffith | russellb: grrrrr | 21:35 |
| lifeless | ttx: yes, lets discuss vim modelines | 21:35 |
| lifeless | :P | 21:35 |
| ttx | stevebaker: it asks whether you solved your conflict with the main schedule | 21:36 |
| jgriffith | geesh... | 21:36 |
| jgriffith | somebody just remove them already and let's move on | 21:36 |
| markwash | pbr bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/pbr/+bug/1245676 | 21:36 |
| rockyg | +1 | 21:36 |
| * russellb chuckles | 21:36 | |
| stevebaker | ttx: working on it, waiting for the presenters to +1 their new slot | 21:36 |
| markwash | just wanted to draw attention to that, I can confirm some folks trying to pip install python-glanceclient are running into it | 21:36 |
| ttx | stevebaker: if all else fails there are a few slots left on friday afternoon, at the same time as the release sessions everyone wants to attend | 21:36 |
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| ttx | stevebaker: see https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmUn0hzC1InKdDdPRXFrNjV4SW91SWF5N2gwYnRHYWc&usp=drive_web#gid=1 | 21:36 |
| annegentle | stevebaker: evil earworm that fox | 21:37 |
| * ttx looks up marwash's pbr bug | 21:37 | |
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| stevebaker | ttx: it looks like the IBM heat presentation is moving to Friday 3:10 | 21:38 |
| stevebaker | annegentle: meep meep HONK | 21:38 |
| ttx | stevebaker: perfect | 21:38 |
| * russellb shoots the fox | 21:38 | |
| russellb | he says NOTHING | 21:38 |
| annegentle | stevebaker: hatchee-hatchee-hatchee-ho | 21:38 |
| ttx | markwash: interesting | 21:39 |
| ttx | mordred: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/pbr/+bug/1245676 | 21:39 |
| markwash | yeah I haven't repro'd it myself, but someone in my org has | 21:39 |
| jgriffith | I have dogs for foxes like that | 21:39 |
| sdague | markwash: this is because pip is old, right? | 21:40 |
| clarkb | mordred is aware of the bug btu can reproduce. He has asked several people running into it to try and reproduce so that we can get to the bottom of it | 21:40 |
| dhellmann | markwash: what version of setuptools is involved there? | 21:40 |
| clarkb | *but can't | 21:40 |
| markwash | sdague: oh, maybe? it was whatever they got from apt in ubuntu 12.04 for the folks I was talking to | 21:40 |
| sdague | we have to do crazy pants stuff in devstack because of that where we forcably upgrade pip first | 21:40 |
| stevebaker | ttx: btw, it looks like there is no "state of the project" presentation for each PTL like there was in Portland. Is that correct? | 21:40 |
| dhellmann | clarkb: boris-42 was having some issues with installing pbr through requirements.txt earlier today, could be related | 21:40 |
| * markwash does not comment on using sudo for pip but pip for glanceclient | 21:41 | |
| ttx | stevebaker: no, it will be done as a webinar afterwards, iirc | 21:41 |
| sdague | markwash: yeh, that's probably the root issue. Probably worth taking to -dev or -infra | 21:41 |
| lifeless | and glanceclient for <thing>... ? | 21:41 |
| markwash | lifeless: well that too | 21:41 |
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| markwash | s/sudo/apt/ | 21:41 |
| markwash | ugh | 21:41 |
| ttx | clarkb: could be that you run Ubuntu's pip which fails to install pbr but still updates pip, then second run has a sane piip | 21:42 |
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| * sdague thinks this topic isn't really project meeting material | 21:43 | |
| ttx | ok, if nobody has anything left, we'll adjourn | 21:43 |
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| ttx | counting 1 | 21:43 |
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| ttx | 2 | 21:43 |
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| ttx | 3? | 21:44 |
| russellb | 4! | 21:44 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:44 | |
| dolphm | \o/ | 21:44 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 21:44:12 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:44 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-29-21.01.html | 21:44 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-29-21.01.txt | 21:44 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-29-21.01.log.html | 21:44 |
| ttx | See you all next week! | 21:44 |
| hub_cap | thx ttx | 21:44 |
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| julim | hi there | 22:01 |
| rdopieralski | hi | 22:01 |
| lsmola_ | hello | 22:01 |
| mrunge | o/ | 22:01 |
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| david-lyle | hi everyone, I saw Gabriel earlier, but not now, if here's not here in a couple minutes I'll start the meeting | 22:02 |
| lblanchard | hi all! sounds good david-lyle | 22:02 |
| jpich | Thanks david-lyle | 22:02 |
| lsmola_ | david-lyle, thank you :-) | 22:02 |
| lcheng | hello | 22:02 |
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| david-lyle | #startmeeting Horizon | 22:04 |
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| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 29 22:04:16 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is david-lyle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'horizon' | 22:04 |
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| david-lyle | Hello everyone, I jumping in | 22:05 |
| jpich | o/ | 22:05 |
| lblanchard | o/ | 22:05 |
| lsmola_ | o/ | 22:05 |
| mrunge | great, thank you david-lyle | 22:05 |
| david-lyle | I wasn't expecting to do this today, so free form | 22:05 |
| david-lyle | #topic general | 22:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "general (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:06 | |
| david-lyle | The summit is next week, so I expect this to be a short meeting | 22:06 |
| david-lyle | But I'd like to make sure everyone's set | 22:06 |
| lblanchard | I wanted to let everyone know that I've started a thread around improving the Horizon Overview section: | 22:07 |
| lblanchard | http://ask-openstackux.rhcloud.com/question/59/improvements-to-horizon-overview/ | 22:07 |
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| david-lyle | The design summit session plans are finalizing, and I don't think the Horizon sessions to move | 22:07 |
| david-lyle | are likely to | 22:07 |
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| lsmola_ | lblanchard, great | 22:07 |
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| david-lyle | hopefully everyone is aware of http://icehousedesignsummit.sched.org/ | 22:08 |
| jpich | We probably should start adding etherpads links for the horizon sessions to https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Summit/Icehouse/Etherpads | 22:08 |
| julim | there's also a thread around improving the Information Architecture at http://ask-openstackux.rhcloud.com/question/1/openstack-ui-information-architecture/ | 22:09 |
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| david-lyle | jpich: do the session proposers want to do that or just want me to? | 22:09 |
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| mrunge | jpich, good suggestion. that's still missing. | 22:09 |
| david-lyle | at least the starting page | 22:09 |
| jpich | This was a general comment for the session leaders | 22:09 |
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| mrunge | is there a template? | 22:09 |
| jpich | I should do the same :-) | 22:09 |
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| lblanchard | I won't be able to attend this summit so I would much appreciate being able to follow along on the etherpads :) | 22:10 |
| david-lyle | ok, let's go with, if you proposed a session please add one, if any get missed, we'll add them by the time the session begins | 22:10 |
| mrunge | +1 | 22:10 |
| julim | +1 | 22:10 |
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| mrunge | who can change the wiki page linking to the pads? | 22:11 |
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| jpich | mrunge: I think the etherpads remain pretty free form in general, as long as people can follow. The wiki page suggests ordering by project and session day otherwise | 22:11 |
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| mrunge | ok, what about ordering the overview page e.g alphabetically? | 22:12 |
| mrunge | after project, I mean? | 22:12 |
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| david-lyle | rather than by time/date? | 22:14 |
| jpich | mrunge: The advice at the top of the wiki suggests chronologically, which sounds reasonable to me | 22:14 |
| david-lyle | +1 | 22:14 |
| mrunge | well, tbh. that's nonsense | 22:14 |
| mrunge | horizon will have at least three days | 22:15 |
| mrunge | where do you order Tuesday and Tuesday? | 22:15 |
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| david-lyle | down below | 22:15 |
| mrunge | (Given, two projects have sessions on Tuesday) | 22:15 |
| david-lyle | each day for each project is listed out | 22:15 |
| david-lyle | by time | 22:15 |
| mrunge | I meant, to order projects | 22:16 |
| mrunge | nevermind. | 22:16 |
| david-lyle | ah, I see. I think first come first serve was the rule there | 22:16 |
| david-lyle | that would make sense | 22:17 |
| david-lyle | though | 22:17 |
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| mrunge | ok, then we should take our time to be the last on the page? ;-) Just to have it easier to find our sessions? | 22:17 |
| mrunge | ;-) | 22:17 |
| jpich | I don't think that matters much, unless someone feels up to reorganising the whole page :-) | 22:17 |
| mrunge | ok, some more serious to add here? | 22:18 |
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| david-lyle | Other than getting ready for the summit and making sure we log things well in the etherpads, does anyone have anything to address? | 22:20 |
| david-lyle | noting your previous comments julim | 22:20 |
| david-lyle | and lblanchard | 22:20 |
| rdopieralski | I'm not sure this is the right place, but I have a blueprint that I would like to get into horizon... | 22:20 |
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| david-lyle | good a place as any :) | 22:21 |
| jcoufal | sorry I am late. All makes sense for me | 22:21 |
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| jcoufal | Hi everybody :) | 22:21 |
| lsmola_ | :-) | 22:21 |
| lsmola_ | hello | 22:21 |
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| david-lyle | hi jcoufal | 22:21 |
| rdopieralski | I'm not sure what I should do to start a discussion on it | 22:21 |
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| david-lyle | rdopieralski: proposing the blueprint is probably the best place to start | 22:22 |
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| david-lyle | in launchpad and we can use that as a talking point | 22:22 |
| rdopieralski | david-lyle: it's here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/horizon/+spec/formset-data-table | 22:22 |
| jpich | rdopieralski: A mail to the dev list is usually a good way to start a discussion. If you're looking for getting it accepted into icehouse, make sure to set the "Milestone proposed" field and the PTL will review it | 22:22 |
| jpich | Milestone all set, cool :-) | 22:22 |
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| david-lyle | looks good. I think with the summit coming up we (I) haven't been spending as much time looking through the blueprints, yours looks like a good starting point | 22:23 |
| rdopieralski | It's something that doesn't have an immediate use in horizon itself, but we do use it in tuskar-ui | 22:24 |
| rdopieralski | ok, so I just need more patience, thanks | 22:24 |
| david-lyle | and reviews posted too | 22:24 |
| david-lyle | yeah, post release haze :) | 22:24 |
| david-lyle | I would like to make sure we make a little advertisement time in the early sessions for the OpenStack-UX unconference session that jcoufal will be scheduling | 22:26 |
| jcoufal | reading rdopieralski's post, we really need to separate and clearly distinguish between Horizon and OpenStack Dashboard :) | 22:26 |
| david-lyle | I know mrunge agrees with you | 22:26 |
| mrunge | hahaha | 22:26 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: I should go as the second in the row, so I can self-advertise :) | 22:27 |
| david-lyle | true | 22:27 |
| david-lyle | but yes the projects state to have very different goals | 22:28 |
| david-lyle | I also wanted to point out the toshi posted a WIP for a wizard in Horizon, a component I think we're sorely missing | 22:29 |
| jpich | Nice! | 22:30 |
| mrunge | jupp, great! | 22:30 |
| jcoufal | yeah, I already spoke with rdopieralski who was interested in this one | 22:30 |
| lblanchard | yes, this would be an awesome addition! | 22:30 |
| david-lyle | I haven't gone through it and he considered it rough, so not sure the effort to get it finished, but a nice starting point either way | 22:31 |
| david-lyle | I'd really like to see some beginner use cases simplified with wizards | 22:31 |
| lsmola_ | david-lyle, to be honest, i would rather see something like angular.js going in, rather than jquery validate plugin, but otherwise it looks like a good start | 22:32 |
| david-lyle | lsmola_: I think that's something we need to address at the summit, how much do we need to maintain the non-js experience in the code base going forward | 22:33 |
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| david-lyle | may end up being a hallway conversation | 22:33 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: +1000 | 22:33 |
| rdopieralski | a clear policy on the use of js would be a big help | 22:33 |
| lsmola_ | david-lyle, with angular.js there can be functional non js + proper client side layer | 22:33 |
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| lsmola_ | david-lyle, +1002 to talks about that :-D | 22:34 |
| david-lyle | Well, we'll make a point of it then. | 22:34 |
| david-lyle | anyone in the meeting other than lblanchard not able to make it to the summit? | 22:35 |
| lsmola_ | david-lyle, i am not coming either :-( | 22:35 |
| rdopieralski | me, but I'm not important | 22:35 |
| lblanchard | lol | 22:35 |
| david-lyle | you're here, thus you're important | 22:36 |
| david-lyle | :) | 22:36 |
| lsmola_ | david-lyle, I will try to hack some web cam in the hallway though :-) | 22:36 |
| rdopieralski | lsmola_: mount it on a quadcopter | 22:36 |
| lsmola_ | rdopieralski, hehe | 22:36 |
| jcoufal | lsmola_: if you give me a picture of you and I can introduce you ;) | 22:36 |
| david-lyle | well, then I want to make sure we include you in the conversation somehow | 22:36 |
| lblanchard | lsmola_: you could take the less creepy route and do a google hangout :) | 22:36 |
| jcoufal | s/and// | 22:36 |
| lsmola_ | rdopieralski, sure you are important, you have to make my code right :-D | 22:37 |
| david-lyle | perhaps a blueprint as a starting point | 22:37 |
| jcoufal | yeah, I think blueprint + mail to ML | 22:37 |
| david-lyle | we'll have to see what the IT infrastructure is like this time | 22:38 |
| lsmola_ | jcoufal, lol | 22:38 |
| rdopieralski | lsmola_: I'm just interested in the final decision, whatever it is is fine by me | 22:38 |
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| david-lyle | alright, any other discussion topics? | 22:38 |
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| david-lyle | ok, well no Horizon meeting next week of course. and we'll see how well the networking is working to attempt remote inclusion beyond the etherpads. | 22:40 |
| lblanchard | david-lyle: thanks!! | 22:40 |
| lsmola_ | telepathy? :-D | 22:40 |
| david-lyle | I'm looking forward to seeing those who can make it next week. | 22:41 |
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| david-lyle | Let's call it a short meeting. | 22:41 |
| david-lyle | #endmeeting | 22:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:41 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 29 22:41:26 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:41 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-29-22.04.html | 22:41 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-29-22.04.txt | 22:41 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-29-22.04.log.html | 22:41 |
| lsmola_ | thank you, have a good night | 22:41 |
| rdopieralski | thank you and a goodnight | 22:41 |
| jcoufal | looking forward to see all of you guys, see you in less than week | 22:41 |
| lblanchard | thanks all! Safe travels to all headed to HK. Talk to you next week. | 22:41 |
| jcoufal | thanks, good bye | 22:42 |
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| jpich | Thanks | 22:42 |
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