Tuesday, 2016-11-22

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hongbin#startmeeting zun03:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 03:00:04 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.03:00
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openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.03:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zun)"03:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'zun'03:00
hongbin#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2016-11-22_0300_UTC Today's agenda03:00
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hongbin#topic Roll Call03:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: zun)"03:00
shubhamsShubham Sharma03:00
mkrai_Madhuri Kumari03:00
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hongbinWelcome to join the meeting shubhams Namrata mkrai_03:01
hongbin#topic Announcements03:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: zun)"03:01
hongbinI have no announcements, anyone else has?03:01
hongbinsudipto_: hey, thanks for joining03:01
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sudipto_It's not an announcement per say, but then mfedosin yesterday - had requirements for zun...that we had a chat on the meeting room.03:02
hongbini knew several people cannot join the meeting today, so it will be a short meeting03:02
hongbinsudipto_: ack03:02
hongbintrinaths: welcome to the zun meeting03:02
hongbinsudipto_: will discuss that in open discussion03:03
hongbin#topic Review Action Items03:03
sudipto_hongbin, sure thing.03:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: zun)"03:03
hongbin1. hongbin add k8s bp to weekly meeting agenda (DONE)03:03
hongbin#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2016-11-22_0300_UTC03:03
trinathshongbin: I'm new to Zun, but would like to know ways to contribute for Zun.03:03
hongbintrinaths: sure03:03
hongbintrinaths: will talk to you later in open discussion :)03:03
hongbin#topic Container image store (mkrai)03:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Container image store (mkrai) (Meeting topic: zun)"03:03
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/glance-integration The BP03:04
hongbinmkrai_: ^^03:04
mkrai_The glance integration bp is completed now03:04
mkrai_I have submitted one patch to store docker images in glance while downloading03:04
mkrai_But seems it is not good to do so.03:04
hongbinyes, i don't think it is a good idea as well03:05
mkrai_For that, we can have push image APIs03:05
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mkrai_And I will resubmit my patch to implement the new API03:06
mkrai_That's all from my side.03:06
mkrai_Any questions?03:06
mkrai_If no, shubhams please update03:06
hongbinmkrai_: the push API is in server or client?03:06
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mkrai_hongbin: Both03:06
hongbinmkrai_: en...03:07
shubhamsFrom my side there is not much update as I was out for last week/ Will finish this week03:07
hongbinshubhams: ack03:07
hongbinmkrai_: i am not sure if it makes sense to push images from server to glance as well....03:07
hongbinmkrai_: it makes more sense to push from client to glance ....03:08
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hongbinmkrai_: i just think in a nova way: nova never push image from hypervisor to glance03:08
mkrai_Oh I am not sure whether its good to support any feature in clients that doesn't exist in server03:08
trinathsyes, in all the other projects, also the images are pushed via client03:09
mkrai_Because not everyone uses clients03:09
trinathsmkrai_: true said, but using client is in sync with other implementations03:10
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mkrai_hongbin: trinaths Do you know reason why nova is not pushing from server?03:11
sudipto_why are we thinking about pushing images from zunclient to the glance server btw?03:11
trinathsmkrai_: beacause they are independant projects03:12
mkrai_sudipto_: For users, not having access to internet03:12
hongbinmkrai_: i am not sure exactly03:12
sudipto_mkrai_, users without internet access, - how do they get the image in the first place?03:12
sudipto_can't they directly store it in glance?03:13
AlagarIam trying to integrate openstack with xen03:13
Alagari have installed openstack using devstack script top of xen hypervisor, in this open stack as a virtual machine.03:13
Alagarwhen i create instance in openstack,   the instance should create in xen hypervisor.  but its not happening.03:13
AlagarSome one could you please guide me please03:13
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sudipto_Alagar, there's a meeting ongoing at the moment :)03:13
sudipto_you may try another channel. Like openstack-nova.03:13
hongbinsudipto_: i think the pattern of using glance is like using a private docker registry03:13
mkrai_mkrai_: They can create their own images or download from docker for later use03:13
mkrai_But yes it makes sense to me, if they directly store images in glance03:14
sudipto_hongbin, understood, but they could just then store the image in glance and create that repo, no?03:14
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hongbinsudipto_: the pattern is 1) client pull from docker hub, 2) client push to private docker registry 3) server pull from private docker registry03:14
hongbinsudipto_: yes03:14
hongbinsudipto_: so, they can do that without any support from zun, just a command: glance upload ...03:15
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sudipto_hongbin, ok and the analogous flow here would be? 1) client has the image via a gz file 2) uses the glance client to upload it to glance 3) zun pulls it from glance while deploying03:15
hongbinsudipto_: i guess yes03:15
sudipto_yeah that i agree, i guess you are talking about the glance client not the zunclient...03:15
sudipto_however, there is already a support like that in glance, is that not sufficient you mean?03:16
hongbinsudipto_: yes, so maybe this feature is not in zun at all03:16
mkrai_sudipto_: Does it support the case specified by hongbin ?03:16
mkrai_Downloading from docker/URL?03:17
sudipto_hongbin, the case being? Pulling from docker hub? NO.03:17
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hongbinsudipto_: 1) pull from docker hub , OR , docker build03:17
hongbin2) push to glance03:17
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hongbinsudipto_: these two steps can be done without zun03:18
sudipto_hongbin, ok - now i understand the use case. Yes, the support does not exist today and I think, it's ok to do it without zun.03:18
mkrai_Yes not necessarily have to be in zun03:18
hongbinmkrai_: then maybe don't worry the push api at al03:19
sudipto_Remember, you can only push a tar.gz file into docker - so i am not sure even if we want to do it within zun, how do we do it?03:19
mkrai_I am ok if we don't want to support it03:19
sudipto_typo - i meant push into glance.03:19
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mkrai_sudipto_: We download a tar file from docker and upload it to glance03:20
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sudipto_mkrai_, how do you download the tar though?03:20
sudipto_usual way to generate that tar is to do a docker export on the running container pipe it and save it as a tar.gz03:20
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sudipto_(unless they have done something new)03:20
mkrai_sudipto_: Sorry we are not storing it now in glance from zun03:20
mkrai_Users manually have to do it.03:21
mkrai_But we download image from glance to be used while creating container03:21
sudipto_mkrai_, no i mean - when you develop the feature...03:22
sudipto_you will have to have a way to convert the image into tar.gz before you can store it in glance...03:22
sudipto_my question was - how would you do that from an implementation per say.03:22
sudipto_if you have to develop that feature in zun.03:22
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mkrai_sudipto_: There is an API get_image in docker that returns you the image data03:23
sudipto_mkrai_, ah i see.03:24
mkrai_sudipto_: YOu can see the implementation here03:24
mkrai_#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/398792/1/zun/image/docker/driver.py03:24
mkrai_Line 7003:24
sudipto_mkrai_, are you sure that pulls the image in tar.gz format?03:25
sudipto_anyway i think we can talk on this later as well.03:25
mkrai_sudipto_: No it is not in tar.gz format03:25
mkrai_It is the image content03:25
sudipto_yeah - so it's a layered filesystem, that you need to convert to a tar format before you can store it in glance - was my point.03:26
mkrai_sudipto_: Not exactly, we can read this response from HTTP and directly upload in glance03:27
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sudipto_mkrai_, ok.03:27
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sudipto_i just thought glance only accepted the gz format. Anyway i might be wrong.03:28
sudipto_mkrai_, http://docs.openstack.org/developer/glance/formats.html03:28
sudipto_we can park it for later.03:28
mkrai_sure sudipto_03:29
hongbinok, advance topic03:29
hongbin#topic Container network (hongbin)03:29
*** openstack changes topic to "Container network (hongbin) (Meeting topic: zun)"03:29
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/neutron-integration The BP03:29
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/365754/ The proposed spec (merged)03:29
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/396896/ The patch Part 103:29
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/399248/ The patch Part 203:29
hongbinI split the driver into two: the pure docker driver, and a nova-docker driver03:30
hongbinhope everything is more clear right now03:30
sudipto_hongbin, i just had a minor doubt, once we implement the sandbox, what will happen to lib network?03:30
sudipto_in a more crude term, what happens to the IP allocated by docker on the container?03:30
hongbinsudipto_: i am not sure exactly (i just coped everything from nova-docker :)03:31
hongbinsudipto_: from what i undertand from nova-docker code, they did custom container networking (disable libnetwork)03:31
sudipto_hongbin, ok - the time nova-docker was written - was different than the time we are in right now...but maybe that works.03:32
trinathssudipto_: my doubt: the networking is managed by neutron here?03:32
sudipto_trinaths, that's what we are proposing.03:32
hongbinsudipto_: they just did something like: 1) create a veth pair, 2) plug one end to neutron bright, 3) plug another end to container nanemspace03:32
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trinathssudipto_: then the IP given by docker must hide.03:33
sudipto_hongbin, ok yeah - that's how docker does it too - but i wonder how they disable the docker networking.03:33
hongbinsudipto_: by passing an option: netmode=none03:33
sudipto_hongbin, ah i see.03:33
hongbinsudipto_: however, we can integrate with libnetwork later if we ant03:34
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sudipto_so even though we have the docker0 bridge, it's basically of no use or do we disable that bridge as well?03:34
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hongbinsudipto_: per my understanding, the answer is "yes"03:34
sudipto_hongbin, alright.03:34
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hongbinsudipto_: however, again, we are free to change it later03:35
* sudipto_ fiddling with the lib network code, hence got curious.03:35
trinathsas a thought, user must have the provision to enable/disable this.03:35
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sudipto_enabling/disabling may have implications...03:36
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hongbintrinaths: i guess nobody want to get a container with no networking.... so disable it might not make sense03:36
sudipto_the IP addressing then goes out of scope for openstack and that again is a challenge to manage...03:36
trinathshongbin: true said, agree. But the decision is between container networking  or networking from neutron. may be i'm wrong03:37
hongbinok, that is all from the sandbox proposal03:37
hongbin#topic Open Discussion03:37
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: zun)"03:37
sudipto_I saw a clear containers BP owned by mkrai_ - can we talk about that a bit?03:38
hongbintrinaths: since zun is an openstack project, so networking is always from neutron, i am afraid there are no other choice03:38
mkrai_Yes but I haven't started it yet03:38
trinathshongbin: okay03:38
mkrai_Do you have any specific question on it sudipto_ ?03:38
sudipto_mkrai_, just wanted to know - is clear containers a part of the docker apis now?03:38
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mkrai_It uses the same docker APIs03:39
sudipto_mkrai_, any link would be great...03:39
sudipto_mkrai_, basically the github link i had was based on the exec driver in docker, that no longer exists...03:39
mkrai_Need to look03:39
sudipto_Ok, no problem.03:40
hongbinok, no other topic?03:40
mkrai_sudipto_: I will share later03:41
mkrai_Is that fine?03:41
sudipto_mkrai_, yup that would be great.03:41
mkrai_Ok will do that03:41
sudipto_Another thing quickly hongbin is the interest in zun from mfedosin and his company03:41
hongbinsudipto_: go ahead03:41
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sudipto_they wanted to host something like NFV workloads in containers and were evaluating if it's possible to use zun. Practically, i think we are a bit far from providing that functionality - but i asked him to contribute03:42
mkrai_sudipto_: here https://github.com/01org/cc-oci-runtime/wiki/Installing-Clear-Containers-on-Ubuntu-16.0403:42
hongbinok, that is a good response :)03:42
sudipto_mkrai_, thanks :)03:43
hongbinyes, i know other nfv folks who also interests in zun03:44
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hongbini guess they want something that is lighter than vm, so they look into container projects03:45
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sudipto_yeah i guess that's what he was stating too. More than lighter, they wanted better performance.03:46
hongbini see03:46
hongbinzun definitely has potential to solve the nfv use cases03:46
hongbinlet's work hard for that :)03:47
sudipto_Sure :)03:47
mkrai_+1 :)03:47
trinaths+1 :)03:47
hongbinok, all, thanks for joining the meeting03:47
mkrai_Thanks all!03:47
sudipto_Thank you!03:47
hongbintrinaths: i remembered you were looking for tasks? i can help you in zun channel03:47
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"03:48
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 03:48:03 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)03:48
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-22-03.00.html03:48
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-22-03.00.txt03:48
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-22-03.00.log.html03:48
trinathshongbin: okay. sure03:48
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hongbintrinaths: join #openstack-zun03:48
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trinathshongbin: im from india, will ping you once I reach office. Its already late here for me. sorry for the inconvience.03:49
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hongbintrinaths: ack03:49
trinathshongbin: thank you. :)03:50
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kota_eranrom may be late a few minutes08:01
kota_hello akihito08:02
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kota_akihito: do you know something about takashi?08:03
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akihitosorry. I don't know..      I am in a different place.08:04
kota_akihito: k, no worries08:04
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takashi_kota_: hi08:05
akihitotakashi was troubleshooting until the morning.08:05
takashi_sorrry for my late reaction.08:05
kota_takashi_: hello08:05
takashi_It seems that eranrom will come a little late08:05
takashi_kota_: hi08:05
kota_#startmeeting openstack-storlets08:05
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 08:05:45 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is kota_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.08:05
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.08:05
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: openstack-storlets)"08:05
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'openstack_storlets'08:05
kota_k, let get started08:06
takashi_It seems that eranrom already created agenda for today's meeting https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets08:06
kota_#link  https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets08:06
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kota_the first item looks about PTG08:07
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takashi_kota_: yes08:07
kota_i think eranrom has been working to propose the slots to discuss in the PTG08:07
kota_and unfortunately, it cannot make in Mon-Tue but Wed-Fri.08:07
kota_so completely over the Swift PTG.08:08
takashi_it seems that we need to be allocated from Wed-Fri, because we are currently proposing storlets vertical (not cross-project horizonal) session08:08
kota_yeah, not cross-project08:08
takashi_is there any schedule already available now?08:08
kota_I'm feeling it's a bug of ptg, if we consider to work a couple of projects, the schedule constraint completely make us bad to work for both.08:09
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takashi_kota_: yes08:09
kota_takashi_: i don't think so08:09
takashi_it seems we can not find any more detailed information... :-( http://www.openstack.org/ptg08:10
kota_we can see the project names which are available to attend in ptg08:10
kota_anyway, eranrom is asking a couple of ways we can make the storlets slots08:11
kota_A. in parallel with swift or B making a place for storlets in the Swift ptg08:11
kota_how do you think of?08:12
takashi_kota_: IMO, to avoid schedule collision against swift schedule, which may be a big problem for us,B makes sense08:12
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takashi_eranrom: hi08:12
kota_hi, eranrom08:12
eranrom#startmeeting storlets08:12
openstackeranrom: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress.  Use #endmeeting first.08:12
takashi_eranrom: it is already started!08:13
eranromHi, Sorry I am late08:13
kota_no worries08:13
takashi_eranrom: np :-)08:13
eranromThanks for starting08:13
kota_oh, do I have to set the meeting name as storlets? I did openstack-storlets08:13
eranromThat's fine.08:13
takashi_eranrom: we are following your agenda, and just talking about ptg stuffs08:14
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eranromLooking for the logs...08:15
kota_takashi: i'm with you, at the this time, we could manage our spaces into swift ptg rather than locate different spaces08:15
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kota_takashi: because it could make difficult to work together with swifters08:15
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takashi_kota_: yes. I'd like to ask eranrom's opinion, but it seems better to me to ask notmyname to allow us to allocate storlets session in swift session timeframe.08:18
takashi_to work with swift community08:18
kota_and i think, Swift ptg will work as well as past design summit (or mid-cycle) so we can manage our time to discuss storlets in the swift slots08:18
takashi_kota_: just thinking the same thing08:19
kota_or I'm wondering if we could place concatenated room for such collaborate prjects :/08:19
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eranromOriginally, I also thought that we should work with Swift this time, however, acoles told me that given the shorter period of PTG compared to the previous mid cycle08:20
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eranrom3 days instead of 508:20
eranromIts going to be very busy08:20
eranromI can ask John though08:20
kota_eranrom: exactly08:21
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kota_or if we could make *un-official* slots in Mon-Tue?08:21
kota_tc may not want to do that though :/08:22
eranromYou mean just be there, and look for a room.08:22
eranromSounds lije a good idea to me.08:22
kota_eranrom: sure08:22
kota_for this time, I'm going to be in the whole week there.08:23
takashi_kota_: same for me08:23
eranromI guess we need to choose between two non optimal choices:08:23
kota_and probably not so busy in Mon-Tue.08:23
eranrom1. Do this Mon/Tue unofficially.08:23
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eranrom2. Do this Wed-Fri where both you and Takashi are very busy with other projects08:23
eranromSeems to me that option 1 is better. What do you think?08:24
eranromWe may not be allocated with a room, but I believe we can manage08:24
kota_1 seems ok. And try 2 if we have to consider about swift upstream.08:25
kota_and 3. make a feedback ''08:26
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eranromkota_: In 2, Do you mean if we have storlet related issues that are related to Swift?08:26
kota_to enable to attend more than one projects08:26
kota_eranrom: yes08:26
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takashi_talking about my situation, I have some topics in nova and cinder, which I should join discussion about.08:27
kota_in Wed-Fri?08:27
takashi_kota_: maybe08:27
eranromtakashi_: Does this mean that you are also in favor of option 1?08:27
kota_ok, so 1 seems to work well at this time.08:27
takashi_so if we have session in Wed-Fri, it is difficult to fix the timeframe when we have room, because there are no available schedule about nova and cinder08:28
takashi_so if we have Wed-Fri, it works better for me to let us allocate in swift session, which is expected to have relatively long timeframe,08:29
takashi_because we can choose the meeting schedule ad-hocly, based on the chaning situation.08:29
takashi_but I don't have any big topics in Mon-Tue, so still 1 works fine for me08:30
eranromok, so lets make it Mon-Tue unofficial (perhaps we need only one day) and then come with feedback08:30
eranromThere is one more thing I forgot to mention (which may not be relevant given that we chose the unofficial 'path') and that is08:31
eranromWeneed to be official so that we can get allocated room08:31
eranromI was told that rooms are being kept for us (Wed-Fri) under the assumption that we will be official by Feb.08:32
eranromI do not see a reason why that would not happen08:32
eranromanything else on this topic?08:34
takashi_eranrom: just a little. maybe there are not so many things already decided about ptg scheduling.08:35
takashi_eranrom: so another possible option is that we basically ask rooms for ptg, and then discuss about the desired schedule, which works well for us, with tc, ptls(john) or other foundation members08:36
eranromtakashi_: I have asked ttx if we could have rooms Mon/Tue. He replied that he is keeping rooms for us (assuming we get official by Feb.), but these would be only Wed-Fri08:37
takashi_eranrom: do we have a room for all Wed-Fri? or have a room for limited timeframe in Wed-Fri.08:38
eranromtakashi_: My understanding is that its for all Wed-Fri08:39
eranromI can validate this.08:39
eranromDoes this make you think that option 2 is better?08:40
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takashi_eranrom: will think a little more later. Can I ask you to available time long, currently expected?08:41
takashi_because we have another big items around installation/packaging work...08:41
eranromok, we can continue this afterwards in #openstack-storlets08:42
takashi_I mean, I'd like to confirm that they are really proposing whole Wed-Fri08:42
takashi_eranrom: yes08:42
eranromtakashi_: will do.08:42
takashi_eranrom: thx08:42
eranromtopic: installation/packaging work08:42
eranrom#topic: installation/packaging work08:42
eranrom#topic installation/packaging work08:42
takashi_I suppose that kota_ should do that08:43
eranrom:-) right08:43
kota_#topic: installation/packaging work08:43
*** openstack changes topic to ": installation/packaging work (Meeting topic: openstack-storlets)"08:43
takashi_because he started this meeting08:43
eranromThanks! :-)08:43
kota_i didn't know the rule though08:43
eranromkota_: no worries, it just makes it easier to browse the logs afterwards08:44
kota_#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/370332/08:44
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eranromtakashi_: Do you want to take over?08:44
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kota_takashi_: ?08:45
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takashi_so currently I finally make package patch pass gate job, making it dependent on eranrom's devstack patch08:45
kota_yeah, that's awesome08:45
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takashi_I'd like to discuss about two things today08:46
takashi_1) Is there anything remaining about devstack patch?08:46
takashi_2) What should be done before merging packaging patch08:46
takashi_for 1, basically I'd like to ask kota_'s opinion08:47
kota_i think 1 is for eranrome?08:47
kota_i'm seeing eranrom has updated the devstack patch.08:47
eranromRight. For 1, I have uploaded a new patch yesterday, addressing some of Kota's remarks.08:48
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eranromIts ok from Jenkins P.O.V. but I still need to tests the 'dev' flavour.08:48
eranromAfter validating this, I would be happy to get that merged.08:48
kota_k, and in parallel, I will review again the changes.08:49
takashi_eranrom: so you mean that it is better to wait for your testing, right?08:49
kota_maybe in Thu or Fri in this week.08:49
eranromright, I will do so today, and ping you once done08:49
kota_thx eranrom08:49
takashi_eranrom: thanks. I'll review again, and test by myself, if possible08:49
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eranromtakashi_: kota_: great, thanks. Let me ping you before you review / test as I might need an additional patch for that,08:50
eranromthat is an updated patch08:50
takashi_eranrom: After you fix you patch, I'll rebase my patch on your update. I think it does not require so much effort08:50
kota_for item 2, i think my concerns can be almostly in follow-up08:51
takashi_kota_: ok08:51
kota_but still only item i'd like to make further work is 'describing how we can install/deploy in the new package'08:51
kota_takashi_: you had written already some notes in commit message08:52
kota_but still not describe concretely that yet, right?08:52
takashi_kota_: you are right08:52
kota_I'm recently getting how it works via reviewing08:52
kota_maybe, in the new package, we need a couple of commands08:52
kota_do ./install_lib.sh08:53
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kota_and do python setup.py install08:53
takashi_kota_: yes08:53
kota_that seems awesomely progressed rather than ansible script. How easy to deply!!!08:53
kota_but I'd like to add the docs for anyone.08:53
kota_hopefully, I'd like to make it into one script but that can be in follow up08:54
kota_takashi_: does it make you sense?08:54
takashi_kota_: yes, but some thoughts from my side08:55
takashi_talking about doc, currently we have manual installation guide, which follows all procedure executed by ansible.08:55
takashi_and I don't know whether we should keep current thing, considering current discussion for splitting ansible script08:56
takashi_The other thing is that for python package, which I think storlets should be designed as, I think we do not wrap 'python setup.py'.08:57
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takashi_but all things can be discussed in follow-up, if you are ok about them. just recording my thought08:57
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eranromI think we need to wrap up. Do you want to move to #openstack-storlets?08:58
takashi_eranrom: yes, though I don't have so long time08:58
kota_for the first item, we could say 1. installation 2.deploy whole parts including swift as different clearly. IMO08:58
kota_yeah, we should move08:58
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kota_#endmeeting openstack-storlests08:58
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"08:58
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 08:58:58 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)08:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_storlets/2016/openstack_storlets.2016-11-22-08.05.html08:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_storlets/2016/openstack_storlets.2016-11-22-08.05.txt08:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_storlets/2016/openstack_storlets.2016-11-22-08.05.log.html08:59
yuval#startmeeting Karbor09:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 09:00:39 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is yuval. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.09:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.09:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Karbor)"09:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'karbor'09:00
yuvalHey everybody09:00
yuvalWho is here for the Karbor meeting?09:01
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leon_wangyuval: hi09:02
xiangxinyonggood morning09:02
yuvalSaggi couldn't make it to the meeting09:02
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yuval#topic Ocata Progress09:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Ocata Progress (Meeting topic: Karbor)"09:03
yuvalRight, so as you might have seen, we have bugs assigned to Ocata: https://launchpad.net/karbor/+milestone/ocata09:03
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yuvalalmost 3009:04
yuvalPlease take a look if you can take a bug and assign it to yourself09:04
yuvalwe have many bugs without carriers09:04
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yuvalwe have bugs assigned to WeAreFormalGroup, yizhihui, chenhuayi, which I haven't seen in a while09:05
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xiangxinyonghi yuval09:06
yinwei_computerWeAreFormalGroup may couldn't fix his bug09:06
yuvalIf you are an assignee to a bug, and think you can not handle in Ocata, unassign yourself from it09:06
xiangxinyongI have already solved this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/karbor/+bug/161353109:06
openstackLaunchpad bug 1613531 in Karbor "Fix Scheduled Operation Creation failed" [Medium,In progress] - Assigned to edison xiang (xiang-edison)09:06
yuvalyinwei_computer: please tell him to unassign himself09:06
xiangxinyongbut the status in launchpad is not chagned09:06
yinwei_computerbtw, let's see if some bugs have already been fixed09:06
yuvalWe have some bugs/missing features which might be a bit time consuming09:07
yuvalsuch as create a plan edit/update in dashboard09:08
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yuvalright, so after meeting please take 10 minutes to pass over the bug list09:09
zengchengot it.09:09
yuvalOcata MS2 (which we are not bound to, since we are independent release) is in 12/1209:10
yuval#topic Open Discussion09:11
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Karbor)"09:11
yuvalNothing else on the agenda today09:11
yuvalSo: open discussion09:11
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xiangxinyongyuval: if the bugs are resovled, we should specify which kind of status in the launchpad?09:12
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xiangxinyongConfirmed or Fix Released?09:12
yuvalfix committed09:13
yuvalfix released is when we release on Ocata09:13
leon_wangyuval: hi, i have set a patch for a bug but somehow i cannot git review it.09:13
zengchenabout 'https://bugs.launchpad.net/karbor/+bug/1566793', last time ,i submit a spec, but yuval said there is a new spec in keystone to solve this kind of bugs. but that spec is assgined to Ocata, and have some patch not merged. so, do we wait keystone?09:13
openstackLaunchpad bug 1566793 in Karbor "authenticate in protection service client" [High,Triaged]09:13
leon_wang: (09:13
yuvalleon_wang: is it a technical issue? if yes, please ping me in #openstack-karbor after meeting09:14
yuvalxiangxinyong: ok?09:14
leon_wangyuval: i guess it is.09:14
yuvalzengchen: what is the status of the keystone spec?09:14
xiangxinyongyuval: understood. :)09:14
zengchenyuval:the spec is merged, but the corresponding patches are not all merged.09:15
zengchenyuval:and i don't know if there are more patch not submitted.09:15
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yuvalzengchen: but the api is set09:16
yuvalzengchen: I believe it is safe to assume it will be merged until Ocata release09:16
yuvalzengchen: have you read the spec? does it fit our needs?09:16
zengchenyuval:i have read. it can work.09:17
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zengchenyuval:we can start work on it, but there is some difficulty on test, because keystone has not finished its all work.09:18
yuvalzengchen: seems like the keystone patch is almost complete: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/382098/09:18
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yuvalzengchen: you can also +1 it if you think it is ok09:18
yinwei_computerplus, I have committed a spec for replication support in smaug. Not sure if there's any idea about it?09:19
zengchenyuval:I will read its patches. so, i will start to work on our bug.09:19
yuvalyinwei_computer: replication will be in Pike, not Ocata09:20
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yinwei_computeryes, I know that09:20
yuvalyinwei_computer: myself and Saggi will try to get it, but we first want to push the bugs for Ocata09:20
yinwei_computergot it09:20
zengchenyuval:there are some patches not merged. https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/allow-expired,n,z09:21
yinwei_computeris there any problem if we start to work it on cinder tiramisu?09:21
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yuvalyinwei_computer: sorry, not sure I understand09:21
yinwei_computerwe prepare the patch, but we don't merge it to Pike09:21
yuvalyinwei_computer: are you speaking about the cinder spec or the karbor spec?09:22
yinwei_computerI mean, smaug replication relates to cinder tiramisu patch09:22
yinwei_computersince cinder tiramisu hasn't merged yet09:22
yinwei_computeris it possible for us to work on karbor replication in advance?09:23
yuvalyinwei_computer: yes, tiramisu is targeted to pike as well ( https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229722/ )09:23
yuvalyinwei_computer: yes, and we should be part of the cinder tiramisu effort09:23
yinwei_computerso my question is, is it possible for us to prepare the feature in advance?09:24
yuvalyinwei_computer: yes, we should definitely think about how relication fits inside karbor, regardless of the tiramisu09:25
yinwei_computerthanks, that answers my question09:25
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yuvalyinwei_computer: :)09:26
yuvalanything else?09:26
yinwei_computerso pls. take a look at my patch when you are free, let's talk about in details later09:26
yuvalyinwei_computer: great09:26
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yuvalRight, thank you all09:28
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"09:28
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 09:28:11 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)09:28
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-22-09.00.html09:28
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-22-09.00.txt09:28
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-22-09.00.log.html09:28
leon_wangyuval: thanks you.09:28
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yanyanhu#startmeeting senlin13:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 13:00:11 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is yanyanhu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.13:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.13:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: senlin)"13:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'senlin'13:00
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yanyanhuhi, xinhui, xuefeng, haiwei13:00
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yanyanhulets wait for a while for other attenders13:01
yanyanhuhi, Qiming13:01
yanyanhuok, lets start13:02
yanyanhuhere is the agenda13:02
yanyanhuplease feel free to add items13:02
yanyanhu#topic ocata work items13:02
*** openstack changes topic to "ocata work items (Meeting topic: senlin)"13:02
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yanyanhuocata workitems13:02
yanyanhuocata-1 has been released in last week13:02
yanyanhuso now we are working for ocata-213:03
yanyanhuperformance test, no progress13:03
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yanyanhuimprove tempest API test. since the versioned request support is almost done, will consider to resume this work13:04
yanyanhuthe basic idea is adding verifcation of exception message13:04
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yanyanhunext one13:05
yanyanhuHA support13:05
yanyanhuhi, Qiming, xinhui, your turn13:05
Qimingno update from me13:05
yanyanhulixinhui, and you?13:06
yanyanhuI noticed this bug is marked as won't fix13:06
openstackLaunchpad bug 1548774 in senlin "LBaas V2: operating_status of 'dead' member is always online with Healthmonitor" [Undecided,New]13:06
yanyanhuthe bug report about lbaas13:06
lixinhuiI will propose a BP this week13:06
Qimingyes, I challenged that decision13:06
yanyanhuQiming, I think you have asked armando13:06
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yanyanhulixinhui, great13:07
Qiminglixinhui, bp about?13:07
lixinhuito ocativia13:07
lixinhuino matter what is the result13:07
lixinhuiwe should try13:07
yanyanhubtw, the following patch is abandon for no update in last 4 weeks13:08
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yanyanhulixinhui, you may want to restore it if needed :)13:08
lixinhuiI know this13:08
lixinhuibut totally different resolution13:08
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yanyanhuso you will reuse this patch or propose a new one?13:09
lixinhuiPropose a new one13:09
Qimingwhile we are keeping an eye on the LB service13:09
QimingI'm wondering if we should look for some alternatives13:09
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yanyanhuQiming, you mean some loadbalancers outside openstack?13:10
yanyanhue.g. hardware based ones13:10
Qimingthe reason we are investigating and even try making things right with LB is for health check13:10
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Qimingusers will decide whether they will use neutron-lbaas or not13:11
Qimingby alternative, I mean some 'ping', 'http get' requests sent to the cluster nodes13:11
yanyanhuI see13:11
yanyanhuas poller for health check13:12
Qimingit is a little bit different from what LB is doing, because what we will be doing is from the management network13:12
QimingLB can do it from guest network13:12
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yanyanhuguest network, you mean?13:13
Qimingtenant network13:13
yanyanhudata plane?13:14
yanyanhuI see13:14
Qimingif we decide to do this, I'd suggest we start a new service process for this13:14
yanyanhuif so, we may need to find a way to make senlin hm reach to tenant network13:14
Qimingpoller will consume a lot of cpu cycles I believe13:14
yanyanhuQiming, yes, that makes sense13:15
Qiminghaving health manager configured into the tenant network is an option though13:15
yanyanhucurrently, all senlin components are running in management network13:15
Qimingall VMs should be reachable from management network13:15
Qimingthat is a safe assumption I think13:16
Qimingor else, ceilometer cannot work, heat cannot work ...13:16
yanyanhuQiming, yes, just we need a graceful and scalable way to support it13:16
QimingI never worry about management network reachability13:16
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yanyanhufor if there are lots of vms in a huge cluster, ping them one by one could be a big problem13:16
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Qimingif you have a larget scale cluster, you will highly likely prolong the interval between two polling operations13:17
Qimingbecause the base is large, the crashes of one or two VM should be solved, but it won't be that urgent13:18
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yanyanhuanyway, we hope lbaas can provide us some help here13:18
Qimingthere won't be a decent solution for this, even for listeners, you still have to process a lot of events13:19
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yanyanhuif not, we may consider plan B to support status check by ourselves13:19
haiwei_tacker is using ping13:19
yanyanhuhope xinhui's work can help to solve this issue :)13:19
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yanyanhuhaiwei_, any detail about how they support it?13:20
Qimingping can be used, but ping won't prove you that the service is still working13:20
lixinhuicould you point us to the code, haiwei_13:20
haiwei_just ping the vm, not anything special13:20
yanyanhuhaiwei_, do they perform the ping operation periodically?13:21
yanyanhuor it is triggered by some events13:21
haiwei_you are quick13:21
haiwei_that is13:22
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Qimingand a native ping: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/tacker/tree/tacker/vnfm/monitor_drivers/ping/ping.py13:22
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lixinhuithanks, Qiming13:22
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yanyanhugreat. we can refer to it13:23
haiwei_seems not periodically, yanyanhu13:23
yanyanhuhaiwei_, ok13:23
Qiminglooks like this is how it is invoked: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/tacker/tree/tacker/vnfm/monitor.py#n9613:23
yanyanhuperiodical ping could cause huge overhead as Qiming said13:23
Qimingit is doing periodical pings13:23
yanyanhuoops, I saw check_intvl13:24
Qimingdefault 10 secons13:24
yanyanhuthe logic is not complicated13:24
yanyanhuso may need some evaluations here13:24
yanyanhuonce we decide to apply similar design13:25
Qimingcode is easy, design is the difficult part13:25
haiwei_not test this yet, don't know if it works or not13:25
yanyanhuI see13:25
yanyanhuQiming, +113:25
yanyanhuok, lets wait for xinhui's work in lbaas before going along this way13:26
Qimingthe other side of the HA solution is about usage scenarios I think13:27
Qimingneed some tutorials from xinhui some day on mistral13:27
QimingNOT today13:27
yanyanhuQiming, sure, also looking forward to it13:27
yanyanhumaybe we can get a lecture from xinhui someday :)13:28
QimingI can pay for the lunchbox13:28
yanyanhuhaha, I can pay for beverage13:28
lixinhuihope so:)13:28
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yanyanhuok, lets decide it offline after the meeting :)13:28
haiwei_a small senlin meetup13:28
yanyanhuhaiwei_, yep :)13:28
Qiminghaiwei_, can call in and provide some music as background13:29
yanyanhuoh, right, for we won't appear in ptg13:29
elynn: D13:29
yanyanhua meetingup may be needed for us13:29
haiwei_my boss asked me today about senlin ptg13:29
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yanyanhuhaiwei_, we don't have plan to join it :( and also for we are marked as single-vendor now13:30
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yanyanhuso one mission in this cycle is adding our diversity :)13:30
haiwei_I know it, yanyanhu, so I just smiled to him13:30
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Qimingthe reason we were "awarded" that label is review statistics13:30
yanyanhuhope more contribution especially code review from you guys who are not ibmer :P13:30
Qiming90% reviews are from IBM13:30
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Qimingwe have been improving quickly recently13:31
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yanyanhuyep, especially thanks XueFengLiu lvdongbin and also Ruijie_ :)13:32
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yanyanhulets spend more effort here :)13:32
yanyanhuok, we can talk about meetup later13:32
Ruijie_no problem :)13:32
yanyanhuso lets move on?13:33
Qimingibm reviews: 68% now13:33
Qimingibm commits: 41%13:33
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yanyanhuok, next item, document13:34
Qimingvery happy to see fresh blood in the team13:34
yanyanhuno progress I think13:34
yanyanhuQiming, definitely :)13:34
Qimingyes, skip that please, :(13:34
yanyanhuversioned request support13:34
yanyanhualmost done13:34
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yanyanhuwith the effort from all the team13:34
Qimingem, one problem though13:34
yanyanhuhopefully it can be finished in one or two weeks13:35
Qimingno patch has been referencing this BP13:35
yanyanhu...that's true13:35
Qimingalthough we may have a few dozens of patches working on this13:35
yanyanhudidn't notice this issue before13:35
QimingI'll mark it ... "Good Progress", if no objections13:35
Qimingit was my fault, I didn't do this, so ...13:36
yanyanhuyou built the basement :)13:36
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Qimingand the habit of not referencing the bp13:36
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yanyanhuok, next one13:37
yanyanhucontainer profile13:37
yanyanhuhaiwei_, any new progress?13:37
haiwei_no much progress , yanyanhu13:37
yanyanhuso, next one13:37
QimingI think the dependency handling work is good13:38
yanyanhuI believe Qiming did lots of work here13:38
Qimingyes, quite some code written and deleted locally13:38
QimingI believe the design (not written out anywhere) is 70%13:38
Qimingthe last mile is about generalization about cluster/node actions13:39
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yanyanhugeneralization, you mean?13:39
yanyanhuthe format? or the timing that generate event13:39
Qimingextract generic parameters/properties while ensuring important data can be presented to users, that is ... a big puzzle for me13:40
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yanyanhuI see13:40
Qimingthe format, do we want a ClusterScaleOutActionPayload and a ClusterResizeActionPayload, or we stop at ClusterActionPayload13:40
yanyanhumyself prefer the last one :)13:41
Qiminghave been playing with different options recently13:41
Qimingyes, me too13:41
Qimingthen that payload have to be very expressive, capable of delivering the event details for all actions13:41
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yanyanhuso the generalization is very important13:42
Qimingnotification object, when serialized ...13:42
Qimingwill be something like this: http://paste.openstack.org/show/590069/13:42
yanyanhuwow, looks great13:43
Qimingline 33 in that paste will only appear when something wrong happens13:43
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yanyanhuI see13:44
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yanyanhuso it will be empty when everything is good13:44
Qimingstill working on the line 44 part, trying to get the most interesting properties from all action types, while keeping the structure concise13:44
Qimingyou know ... exception is an ObjectField with nullable=True13:44
yanyanhuah, right13:45
Qimingthe lin 19 part will be replace by a 'node' dict when dealing with nodes13:45
yanyanhuthe structure looks good13:46
yanyanhuthanks for this great work, Qiming :)13:46
Qimingother things to be settled is about event_type, which isn't a big issue13:46
haiwei_what about the event log file?13:47
haiwei_there will be a output file, right?13:47
Qimingcurrently we focus on database and message backend (aka. driver)13:48
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yanyanhuhaiwei_, file will be an option13:48
Qimingif there are requirements, we can quickly add a new driver, dumping  these into a JSON file, for example13:48
haiwei_got it13:49
yanyanhuQiming, the target milestone of basic support is ocata-2?13:49
Qimingjust leave it there and see if I can work my ass off13:49
yanyanhugreat, just take your time :)13:49
Qimingwill propose a postpone if I figured I cannot finish it by o-213:49
yanyanhugreat, this will be a very important feature we will include in o release13:50
yanyanhuso those are all items in the list13:50
yanyanhuany more you guys are working on?13:51
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yanyanhu#topic open discussion13:51
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yanyanhuok, open discussion now13:51
yanyanhuany topic you want to discuss?13:52
Qimingif there are still some bandwidth from team, I'd propose we work on improving container cluster support13:52
Qiminghaiwei has done a great job, but it is still a starting point13:52
XueFengLiugood idea13:53
yanyanhuhope we can have at least one case that can be successfully run based on senlin container cluster13:53
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Qimingmy dreamed goal is: start a container cluster using a single senlin command, which will be load-balanced, auto-scalable and health managed13:53
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Qimingtoo ambitious ?13:54
yanyanhuhonestly, a little bit :P13:54
yanyanhuat least for this cycle, it is13:54
elynna little bit, but we should be there13:55
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QimingI didn't say the goal is for this cycle, :D13:55
Qimingbut we have to work on it13:55
yanyanhuhaha, understand13:55
Qimingthat will be a great show of senlin's capability13:56
yanyanhuyes, definitely13:56
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Qimingbeen looking at spark architecture recently, as a beginner13:56
yanyanhuQiming, :)13:57
Qimingwhen comparing its low-level architecture, we only miss the scheduling part13:57
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yanyanhusince we are not a scheduler actually13:57
yanyanhusenlin is more like an engine13:57
Qimingwe don't have one13:57
Qimingeven a simple one13:58
yanyanhumaybe placement policy can help to address this issue13:58
Qimingthat has been a blocking factor for haiwei I believe13:58
Qimingyes, for most short-lived containers, it is just a placement decision13:58
Qimingyou won't migrate them around13:58
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yanyanhuok, time is almost over. lets move back to senlin channel13:59
Qimingaren't containers designed to be short-lived?13:59
Qiminga big question13:59
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yanyanhuQiming, yes, it is :)13:59
yanyanhuin most case13:59
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yanyanhuok, we can have further discussion later13:59
yanyanhuthanks all you guys for joinging14:00
yanyanhuhave a good night14:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"14:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 14:00:12 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)14:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-22-13.00.html14:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-22-13.00.txt14:00
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openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-22-13.00.log.html14:00
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jlibosva#startmeeting networking14:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 14:00:33 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is jlibosva. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.14:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'networking'14:00
jlibosvaHello everybody!14:00
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jlibosva#topic Announcements14:01
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jlibosvaThe Liberty EOL is approaching fast.14:01
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jlibosvastable/liberty branches will be removed some time next week14:01
ihrachysI think liberty is CVE only and I haven't heard of any CVEs lately14:01
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jlibosvaWhich means all patches in stable/liberty branch that won't get merged will be abandoned.14:02
ajoand those at this moment can only be CVE related14:02
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jlibosvaWith regarding to Stadium, there were actions taken based on the assessments14:03
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jlibosvaSome projects were retired14:03
jlibosvaSpecifically vpnaas, l2gw and onos: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/392010/214:03
jlibosvaThere is still an ongoing review of assessment summary: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/389397/14:03
jlibosvaPlease, have a look14:04
jlibosvaAnd if you want to protest, now is your chance :)14:04
jlibosvaon the review ofc ;)14:04
jlibosvaNext announcement is14:04
jlibosvaWe're out from Ocata-1 milestone, yay!14:05
ajo[#    ]14:05
jlibosvaanybody has anything else to announce?14:05
ihrachysPTG registration is open14:05
ihrachysI hope folks will join us in Atlanta ;)14:06
jlibosvaihrachys: thanks!14:06
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jlibosvaI have a feeling I'll be thanking you often today :)14:06
jlibosvaPlease register and come :)14:06
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jlibosvaanything else I forgot?14:07
* jlibosva enjoys the silence14:07
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jlibosvaso since we're out from ocata-114:07
jlibosvawe should now focus on14:07
jlibosva#topic Blueprints14:07
*** openstack changes topic to "Blueprints (Meeting topic: networking)"14:07
jlibosva#link https://launchpad.net/neutron/+milestone/ocata-214:08
jlibosvaIs anybody blocked by anything with his work on BP?14:08
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jlibosvaAny important patches that lack reviews?14:08
jlibosvaall good? any patches that have way too many reviews? :-P14:09
bodenBP = spec?14:09
jlibosvaboden: yes14:09
bodenI could use some eyes on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/308973/14:09
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jlibosvaboden: so you're gonna take over that? good :) thanks14:10
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electrocucarachawell, I don't have a review but I have a critical bug to take a look14:10
ihrachyselectrocucaracha: there will be a bugs section I believe14:10
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electrocucarachaihrachys: jlibosva ok, I'll wait14:10
jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: you'll get the stage soon ;)14:11
jlibosvaso please anybody interested in healthcheck, please take a look at boden's spec14:11
jlibosvayou can also take a look, if you're not interested14:11
jlibosva#topic OVO/no API downtime14:12
*** openstack changes topic to "OVO/no API downtime (Meeting topic: networking)"14:12
jlibosvaWe have a patch on review that forbids contract migrations for Ocata14:12
jlibosva#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/400239/14:12
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jlibosvaI recommend to take a look at the patch and remember to not use contract migrations now on14:12
ihrachysyeah, I think armax wanted everyone to at least be aware that's happening :)14:13
jlibosvaihrachys: anything else you want to update?14:13
jlibosvakorzen: ^^14:13
ihrachysjlibosva: sure14:13
ihrachysI have a spec describing online upgrades in some short way: https://review.openstack.org/38668514:13
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ihrachysas for OVO work, I am looking at the topic that should capture most patches14:14
ihrachys#link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/neutron+branch:master+topic:bp/adopt-oslo-versioned-objects-for-db14:14
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ihrachysI believe there is nothing specific to point out here, most of patches are doing same thing for different models/objects.14:14
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ihrachyswe need more review eyes on those, even if not +214:15
ihrachysthere is also korzen's patch that documents objects usage in neutron scope: https://review.openstack.org/33651814:15
ihrachyswould be nice to see folks from outside the upgrades subteam to chime in14:16
korzenyes, please review and after receiving couple of reviews I will update the docs14:16
ihrachysyour reviews would be valuable since the intent there is to make it more clear for those NOT involved in the OVO effort14:16
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electrocucarachakorzen wrote a document about the OVO in this patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/336518/14:16
ihrachyselectrocucaracha: ...and that's the patch I linked, yes ;)14:17
ihrachysjlibosva: I think that's it14:17
jlibosvaI encourage everyone to look at OVO patches, it's interesting and fun ;)14:17
jlibosvaihrachys: thanks for update14:17
* electrocucaracha didn't noticed about the ihrachys previous line14:17
ihrachysjlibosva: but is it really?14:17
jlibosvaihrachys: it IS14:17
jlibosvaok, let's move on14:17
jlibosva#topic Bugs and gate failures14:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and gate failures (Meeting topic: networking)"14:17
mlavalleihrachys, korzen, electrocucaracha: great that a doc is being put together about OVO. I'll take a look14:17
jlibosvamlavalle: good :) thanks14:18
jlibosvaThis is gonna be a rich topic14:18
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jlibosvaLet's update on a gate status first14:18
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jlibosvaGate doesn't like us these days and refuses to cooperate. :(14:18
jlibosvaCurrently there is a huuuge queue of jobs in gate queue14:18
jlibosvaI believe most of you have noticed14:18
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jlibosvaThere is a workaround fix for one of issues that is reported here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder/+bug/164211114:19
openstackLaunchpad bug 1642111 in devstack "create lvm volume from snapshot fails with "device-mapper: reload ioctl on (252:4) failed: Invalid argument"" [Critical,In progress] - Assigned to Matt Riedemann (mriedem)14:19
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jlibosvaIt's been merged by now14:19
jlibosvaSo let's hope it will improve our situation14:19
jlibosvaWe also experienced some issues with rally jobs14:20
ihrachysjlibosva: there is also rally thing?14:20
ihrachysok, nevermind14:20
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jlibosvaihrachys: oh, right, the rally thing ;)14:20
* ihrachys hides14:20
jlibosvaOnce https://review.openstack.org/#/c/400183 and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/399752 get merged, it will hopefully get even better14:20
ajodon't recheck rally until that's merged14:20
ihrachysI believe the last one is not strictly needed to fix gate14:21
jlibosvagood point14:21
ajosave CO2 to earth14:21
jlibosvaand osic to patches14:21
ihrachysit's a good patch reducing the breakage area for rally jobs but it's safe to recheck without it after other two patches are in14:21
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jlibosvaas you can see, the python-heatclient one is close to be merged, all our prayers should now go to jobs running on this patch14:22
jlibosvaI also reported a bug that keeps failing on grenade multinode jobs14:22
jlibosva#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/164348514:22
openstackLaunchpad bug 1643485 in neutron "Stable Newton grenade multinode jobs fail with "Failed to connect to the host via ssh: Host key verification failed."" [Critical,New]14:22
jlibosvaIt's likely an infra issue though, so far it lacks any movement14:23
jlibosvaIf anybody has experience with infra and is willing to help, that would be really great14:23
ihrachysI think infra folks were mentioning some image rebuild that should have fixed it?14:23
jlibosvaIt blocks a bit our effort to move to Xenial on Newton branch, which is due to 6th Dec I believe14:23
ihrachysI don't know if that rebuild happened, or that it fixed though.14:24
ajohost verification failed?, it means the remote host has a different key in known_hostS?14:24
jlibosvaI haven't heard anything from infra folks, I'll try to reach out to them after the meeting as NA folks should be connected14:24
ajohow can that be? :?14:24
ihrachysajo: well maybe ssh is broken on base ubuntu xenial images14:24
ihrachysI think it affects just multinode14:25
jlibosvayep, it seems so14:25
jlibosvaanybody observed any other gate issues?14:25
reedip_I think maybe the ssh is not enabled on xenial by default14:25
ajoreedip_ hmm, not probably that, otherwise it'd fail to connect at all14:26
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reedip_I installed xenial and had to install openssh-server  explicitly14:26
reedip_ajo , ok ..14:26
jlibosvareedip_: feel free to comment on the LP bug, I think any piece of information can become handy14:26
ihrachysajo: yea. also I believe in logs, some ssh connections before the failure work for the node14:26
ajoyeah, and it works before:14:27
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ajoI wonder why doesn't it work on the grenad connection14:28
jlibosvawe can discuss that on the LP, I think deeper troubleshooting is required14:28
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jlibosvaany other issues that are worth to be mentioned?14:28
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jlibosvaLet's move to bugs14:29
jlibosvaLast week was bug deputy electrocucaracha14:29
jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: stage is yours now :)14:29
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electrocucarachawell, the only opened critical bug that I have without and assigned is this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/164348514:30
openstackLaunchpad bug 1643485 in neutron "Stable Newton grenade multinode jobs fail with "Failed to connect to the host via ssh: Host key verification failed."" [Critical,New]14:30
jlibosvait gains popularity, good :)14:30
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electrocucarachaI haven't be able to see any other patch having similar errors14:30
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jlibosvait looks like all newer patches to Newton branch are affected: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/project:openstack/neutron+branch:stable/newton+status:open14:32
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ihrachysyeap :(14:32
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jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: so beside this, no other bugs that are worth mentioning?14:32
electrocucarachathere is another that could be potentially critical but we need more information from kolla guys https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/164348514:33
openstackLaunchpad bug 1643485 in neutron "Stable Newton grenade multinode jobs fail with "Failed to connect to the host via ssh: Host key verification failed."" [Critical,New]14:33
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jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: that's the same one :)14:33
openstackLaunchpad bug 1642303 in neutron "neutron multiple external flat networks fails" [Undecided,Incomplete]14:33
electrocucarachasorry, wrong link14:33
electrocucarachabut we still need more info14:33
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jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: does it affect kolla jobs only?14:33
electrocucarachajlibosva: it seems to14:34
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jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: thanks for your service :) You can hand over the badge to kevinbenton who is a bug deputy for this week I believe14:35
electrocucarachaall yours kevinbenton14:35
jlibosvaI don't see anybody for the next week14:35
jlibosvaDo we have any volunteers here?14:35
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ihrachysI can do it14:36
jlibosvaihrachys: you're the winner! you were the first!14:36
jlibosvaThanks :)14:36
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* ihrachys is so happy14:36
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jlibosva#info ihrachys is bug deputy for week starting Nov 28th14:37
jlibosvaihrachys: are you gonna update wiki page?14:37
ihrachysI will.14:37
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jlibosvaanybody wants to raise any other bug?14:37
haleybhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/161123 has seemed to resurface14:38
openstackLaunchpad bug 161123 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "gnewsense installation crashed with exit code -11" [Undecided,Invalid]14:38
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haleybhmm, that's not it14:38
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openstackLaunchpad bug 1611237 in neutron "Restart neutron-openvswitch-agent get ERROR "Switch connection timeout"" [High,In progress] - Assigned to IWAMOTO Toshihiro (iwamoto)14:38
haleybprocps-ng issue we thought was fixed14:39
jlibosvahaleyb: thanks for raising it14:39
ihrachysoh we have a fix, nice14:39
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haleybihrachys: we do?  i know iwamoto was looking last night when it came up14:39
ihrachyshaleyb: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/400581/14:40
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* haleyb looks at bug14:40
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ihrachysthat said, I don't think it answers the question why 'ps' tool logs that warning14:41
ihrachysbut that's a good start14:41
haleybi think ps needs to catch SIGTERM as well14:41
ihrachysI think they do catch it (the last time I checked their code they did have a huge state machine to catch different signals, even exotic)14:41
jlibosvaIt seems the bug is actively being worked14:42
haleybthe git repo doesn't have SIGTERM :(14:42
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ihrachysyeah I guess we can follow up in gerrit14:42
jlibosvahaleyb: thanks for bringing this up14:42
jlibosvaany other bugs?14:42
liuyulongmlavalle, kevinbenton, hi guys, around? This bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/161004514:42
openstackLaunchpad bug 1610045 in neutron "API: floating IP updating with {} change its association" [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to LIU Yulong (dragon889)14:42
jlibosvaliuyulong: how critical is that?14:43
mlavalleliuyulong: I added a point in the open agenda at the end of the meeting14:43
jlibosvaok, let's discuss that in open agenda then14:43
jlibosva#topic Docs14:43
*** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: networking)"14:43
jlibosvaAnybody has any updates here?14:43
jlibosvaI saw on wikipage this link, it seems it's quite old though but I'll just leave it here :)14:44
jlibosva#link  http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-July/099012.html14:44
jlibosvaSam-I-Am: hello14:44
jlibosvaSam-I-Am: stage is yours14:44
Sam-I-Amthe routed networks patch merged14:44
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Sam-I-Amjust need to backport it to newton14:44
Sam-I-Amthe vlan-aware patch is close to being ready14:44
Sam-I-Amaside from that, not much going on14:45
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Sam-I-Amkeep on submitting patches :)14:45
jlibosvaSam-I-Am: thanks for update14:45
jlibosvaI think we can move on14:45
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korzena link to above?14:45
Sam-I-Amone sec14:45
jlibosvatrunk ^^14:46
korzenok thanks14:46
jlibosvarouted networks ^^14:46
Sam-I-Amyou had them quicker than me14:46
korzennice, thanks :)14:46
Sam-I-Am7am meeting and not caffeinated yet...14:46
jlibosvaSam-I-Am: I'm getting nervous that we're short on time :D14:47
jlibosva#topic Transition to OSC14:47
*** openstack changes topic to "Transition to OSC (Meeting topic: networking)"14:47
jlibosvartheis: do you want to give any updates if you're already here?14:47
ihrachyshasn't he moved on? I think amotoki was to take over the effort?14:47
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jlibosvaoh, didn't know14:48
jlibosvaSeems amotoki is not here14:48
jlibosvaI think we can jump to another topic if noone has anything to update on OSC14:48
reedip_I think rtheis was working on some of the items14:48
ihrachysjlibosva: +14:48
jlibosva#topic Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring14:48
*** openstack changes topic to "Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring (Meeting topic: networking)"14:49
jlibosvaThere are some patches that should possibly be highlighted, seems like most of them are already close to merge14:49
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jlibosva#link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:plugin-directory14:49
jlibosvaHenryG: do you have any other updates?14:49
ihrachysyeap folks, if you don't adopt your project to the change in time, your gates are going to break14:49
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bodenMore details on how we plan to roll changes out here: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/331338/   add your input soon if you have any please14:50
ihrachysboden: I was very helpful and found a typo!14:51
bodenI can add a few neutron-lib things.. since I don’t see HenryG14:51
* jlibosva thinks that HenryG just pretends he's not here, I was him sending patches couple of minutes back14:51
jlibosvaah :)14:51
bodenHenryG: go ahead.. I was just pretending to be you14:51
HenryGIf we can agree on https://review.openstack.org/331338 that would be nice14:52
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ihrachysI am fine with the wording14:53
ihrachysI would merge if others feel like that's good14:53
HenryGOther than that we need reviews and more rehoming patches14:53
jlibosvaHenryG: boden thanks for updates and bringing up the patch14:53
HenryGAnd spread the word to keep an eye on this link:14:54
jlibosva#link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+message:%22NeutronLibImpact%2214:54
jlibosvaHenryG: thanks, do you have anything else?14:54
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hichiharaapi-ref haven't completed. Please update if you are Owner of their patches14:55
jlibosvahichihara: thanks for bringing this up14:55
jlibosvaplease folks have a look at those links14:55
jlibosvawe're running out of time, so14:56
jlibosva#topic Floating IP update with empty request body14:56
*** openstack changes topic to "Floating IP update with empty request body (Meeting topic: networking)"14:56
mlavalleReviewing this patchset a couple of days ago: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/351487/14:56
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liuyulongIf passed an empty `{}` data dict to the floating IP update API,14:57
liuyulongthe floating IP will be dissociated from its port.14:57
liuyulongIMHO, that's the problem.14:57
jlibosva#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/351487/14:57
jlibosva#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/161004514:57
openstackLaunchpad bug 1610045 in neutron "API: floating IP updating with {} change its association" [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to LIU Yulong (dragon889)14:57
ihrachysliuyulong: strictly speaking, that's an API change14:58
liuyulongNeutron client use `{port_id: null}` to dissociate it.14:58
liuyulongihrachys, yes14:58
mlavallethere is also a patchset that was merged by kevinbenton recently to preserve th current behavior14:58
mlavalle#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/353804/14:58
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mlavalleSo I think that before changing the API behavior, we need to reach an community agreement14:59
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ihrachysright. I think it's better to keep current behaviour. I don't see why it's critical to change it now.14:59
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mlavalleso my goal today is to bring this issue to the attention of the team14:59
hichiharaihrachys: +114:59
jlibosvamlavalle: thanks14:59
jlibosvamaybe the discussion can continue on LP14:59
ihrachysif we would have a way to evolve API (microversions?) we could consider the change14:59
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jlibosvawe're out of time15:00
liuyulongok, move to LP15:00
jlibosvawe can also continue discussing this topic on IRC channel15:00
jlibosvathanks everyone for stopping bye15:00
* ihrachys stops damned bye15:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"15:01
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 15:01:06 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)15:01
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-22-14.00.html15:01
* ihrachys waves good by15:01
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-22-14.00.txt15:01
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-22-14.00.log.html15:01
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sripriya#startmeeting tacker16:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 16:00:12 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is sripriya. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.16:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tacker'16:00
sripriyahello tackers16:00
sripriya#topic Roll Call16:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:00
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sripriyatbh janki marchetti diga hi!16:01
tung_doanHi all16:01
sripriyatung_doan: hi16:01
marchettihi all16:01
marchettibtw, this is mike_m, i lost my nick16:01
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sripriyamarchetti: it took me some time to figure out :-)16:02
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sripriya#chair tbh16:03
openstackCurrent chairs: sripriya tbh16:03
sripriyalets get started16:03
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sripriya#topic agenda16:03
*** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:03
sripriya#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Tacker#Meeting_Nov_22nd.2C_201616:03
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sripriyawe can quickly go through the patches and then talk about the ocata spec16:04
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sripriyasince diga and marchetti are also here we can touch upon pecan update and multi vim support16:04
sripriya#topic Tacker dsvm gate failure16:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Tacker dsvm gate failure (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:05
sripriyas3wong: hi16:05
sripriyaas you have observed, tacker dsvm job is broken and hence all patches are failing16:05
digasripriya: yes, we should discuss on that16:05
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sripriyathis is due to mysql versions we are using on the gate16:06
sripriyaaodh folks helped us identify this error since this error was specifically seen for aodh mysql installation16:06
sripriyawe use mysql 5.5 version on gate with ubuntu trusty16:07
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sripriyawe need to move to 5.6 to update all our jobs to ubuntu-xenial16:07
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sripriyai will work with infra teams to update our tacker jobs to use xenial as a priority16:08
manikanta_Hi All16:08
sripriyathis is a heads up to all of us that if we are using mysql 5.5 version in your development, please upgrade to 5.6 version16:08
sripriyamanikanta_: hello16:09
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sripriyaany questions or thoughts team?16:09
sripriyadiga: did you have something to share?16:11
digasripriya: My base API framework is ready16:11
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sripriyadiga: we will get to it, we are 1st knocking off the agenda items in meeting wiki16:12
digasripriya: I want to push it under tacker16:12
sripriyanext topic16:12
sripriya#topic Adding status field in VNFD16:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Adding status field in VNFD (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:12
sripriyahere is the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/373157/16:12
manikanta_Regarding review comments on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/373157/ , instead of displaying the constant VNFD status as ACTIVE or NA16:13
sripriyamanikanta_: i know you wanted to discuss more on this patch with rest of folks, take it away16:13
manikanta_is it better we have a status field in VNFD object ?16:13
manikanta_gongysh suggested this, Need inputs from others as well ?16:13
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tbhwhether it is "state" or "status" I don't think the end user is not using that info for any purpose16:15
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sripriyamanikanta_: interesting, till now we have treated only VNF as the entity going through different life cycle management states, VNFD is more of a static catalog from which VNF is created16:15
manikanta_state or status here refers to proper onboarding of the VNFD in catlogue, IMO16:16
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tbhare we using VNFD status like enable/disable? I mean enabled are the ones from which launch VNF?16:16
sripriyamanikanta_: tbh it also doesnt make sense to display status as N/A for VNFD16:16
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jankiIMO, status of vnfd is not much used16:16
tbhsripriya, yes16:16
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manikanta_So everytime, We assue that the state of VNFD is ACTIVE ?? in all case ?16:17
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sripriyajanki: i think the patch is dealing with VNFD events and not to the end user16:17
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jankisripriya, manikanta_ VNFD is not a running entity that it will have stages. once created, it is static siting in db16:18
tbhsripriya, yes eventually logs for the user? and is there any other event for VNFD?16:18
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sripriyaso when an user queries VNFD events, even though the actual VNFD entries we do not maintain any status, we need to keep this consistent with VNFD events16:18
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sripriyatbh: we also access the specific VNFD events through Horizon right?16:19
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tbhsripriya, yes we can access16:19
sripriyamanikanta_: i don't know if ACTIVE can be used since it is easier to confuse with VNF status ACTIVE16:19
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jankiwe can use "created"16:20
jankior uploaded16:20
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sripriyaor onboarded?16:21
jankior onboarded - this goes with horizon term too16:21
manikanta_janki: sripriya : How about onboarded16:21
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jankisripriya, same thoughts :)16:21
sripriyasince we onboard VNFD and deploy VNF16:21
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sripriyado we agree with onboarded then?16:21
manikanta_sripriya: +1 from myside16:21
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sripriyacool, manikanta_ please update the patch with the comments16:22
jankiwill this state be displayed on CLI and horizon too?16:22
manikanta_sripriya, janki tbh : Thanks for the inputs16:22
sripriyajanki: yes16:22
sripriyanext topic,16:22
manikanta_sripriya, : Will update the same and respond to gongysh16:22
sripriya#topic Fix hard coded VDU in alarm monitor16:22
*** openstack changes topic to "Fix hard coded VDU in alarm monitor (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:22
sripriyatung_doan: where do we stand as of now for this patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/382479/16:23
tung_doansripriya: thanks.. my patch is almost done.. just need reviews..16:23
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tung_doansripriya: just one concern and need disucss with you guys...16:24
sripriyatung_doan: was there any dependent patches that needed to be reviewed before we review this?16:24
sripriyatung_doan: sure please16:24
tung_doansripriya: regarding to scaling use case, when we support both scaling in/out...16:24
tung_doansripriya: alarm format need to know specific scaling action (in/out)16:25
tung_doansripriya: but they are not shown in tosca-template16:25
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sripriyatung_doan: okay16:25
tung_doansripriya: that why i need to parse to get scaling in/out16:25
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tung_doansripriya: does it make sense?16:26
sripriyatung_doan: can you share a sample tosca template16:26
sripriyatung_doan: it is easier to understand that way16:26
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tung_doansripriya: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/382479/17/samples/tosca-templates/vnfd/tosca-vnfd-alarm-scale.yaml16:26
sripriyatung_doan: i think till now it was assumed it would always be a scale out operation16:27
tung_doansripriya: yes.. but new patch was fixed this.16:27
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sripriyatung_doan: so right now you point to the same scaling policy in both cases?16:28
tung_doansripriya: right.. but it will be parsed.. like this: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/382479/17/doc/source/devref/alarm_monitoring_usage_guide.rst@13616:29
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tung_doansripriya: just look in alarm url16:29
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tung_doansripriya: we have SP1-in and Sp-out for scaling-in and scaling-out16:30
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sripriyatung_doan: ok so we need specific policies based on alarm triggers16:31
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tung_doansripriya: that's right16:31
sripriyatung_doan: so what is the current implementation with your patch?16:31
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tung_doansripriya: i already tested.. scaling in/out supported, fixed VDU hardcoded was done using metadata16:32
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tung_doansripriya: almost items for alarm RFE were done16:32
sripriyatung_doan: i see that you apply the scaling policy based on the operator specified in alarm policy16:33
sripriyatung_doan: we may be missing some edge cases here, but let us get this version out and later work on enhancing it16:34
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tung_doansripriya: ok.. thanks16:34
tung_doansripriya:also, please show me your suggestion if possible, thanks16:34
sripriyateam, please review this patch , we need to get this in to newton and make a stable release, kindly provide your comments or leave your +1s16:35
sripriyatung_doan: will take a closer look at the patch today16:35
sripriyatung_doan: was there any other patch related to this topic?16:35
tung_doansripriya: i already mentioned to you about scaling stucks in PENDING_SCALING_STATE16:36
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sripriyatung_doan: is this for the scale_in?16:37
tung_doansripriya: i will look into that later..16:37
sripriyatung_doan: okay16:37
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sripriyamoving on16:37
sripriya#topic VNF Container spec16:37
*** openstack changes topic to "VNF Container spec (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:37
tung_doansripriya: right. actually heat fixed this16:37
sripriyajanki: take it away16:37
sripriya#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/397233/16:37
sripriyatung_doan: ack16:37
tung_doansripriya: so we can leverage it16:37
jankisripriya,  I have replied to the comments16:37
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jankiI am thinking of calling magnum apis directly instead of going via heat16:38
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jankiwe can also directly supply dockerfile for vnf creation16:38
sripriyajanki: help me understand, when we discussed at the design summit, we talked about zun for container life cycle management16:38
jankiin similar lines to supporting HOT template for vnf creation16:39
jankisripriya, yes zun is the best approach.16:39
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janki since zun is not fully ready, going with magnum for the first iteration16:39
sripriyajanki: so does magnum also support container creation?16:40
sripriyajanki: magnum is supposed to manage COEs right?16:40
digasripriya: yes, its COE16:40
jankisripriya, yes magum is to manage COE. but it does create containers in bay and then manage the bay16:40
jankitbh correct me if i am worng here16:41
digasripriya: I think we should go with magnum16:41
digajanki: now bay called as cluster16:41
sripriyajanki: i guess those are specific container platform commands and not openstack api commands16:41
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jankisripriya, i think there are openstack commands too. need to check on this16:43
digasripriya: no, all the commands are openstack apis16:43
sripriyajanki: diga : okay and this is through magnum?16:43
jankisripriya, yes16:43
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digasripriya: yes16:43
tbhsripriya, janki I feel magnum won't serve the purpose for the following reasons ... 1)It will launch the containers in the nova instance, which will be extra overhead 2)sometimes if we want to scale out the NF, it may launch new nova instance(if the existing VMs serving COE is out of capacity), so again introducing VM problems here 3)If we choose magnum, we need to select COE first and develop those specific yaml files16:43
jankitbh +1. but this is for the first iteration I am proposing16:44
sripriyatbh: thanks for the info16:44
sripriyajanki: tbh: how about zun?16:44
sripriyai did not see any REST api docs of the project, i may be missing something16:45
tbhjanki, even in the first iteration if we consider magnum, and then in future if we want to move to zun, we need to change lot of codebase which is undesirable16:45
digatbh: I dont agree with you, we dont need to launch nova instance when we want to scale, that;s the reason cluster part comes into picture16:45
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digatbh: COE files are already there, we just want to reuse16:45
jankizun is not fully ready. last I heard, they were writing a scheduler for spawning containers16:45
sripriyajanki: okay16:45
tbhdiga, cluster can come into picture inside the bay like pod kind of thing, or more of nova instances in single bay16:45
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tbhdiga, at some of point of time, we have to launch new VM again16:46
digatbh: bay is collection of nova instances16:46
jankiinstead of waiting for zun and siting idle, lets start with some POC kind of work and get things in discussion/improvement16:46
jankisripriya, tbh ^16:46
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tbhdiga, yes, it is also limited I feel16:46
digatbh: I dont think, I have written some part of COE two release before16:47
tbhdiga, same here :)16:47
digatbh: it works well, & tested on coreos & fedora-atomic16:47
sripriyatbh: janki: diga: let us introduce magnum as the 1st container support and later introduce zun as a 2nd support16:48
jankisripriya, +116:48
tbhsripriya, janki I feel either go with zun or heat docker plugin(if not deprecated). or tacker own apis for container16:48
digasripriya: +1 but I dont know when zun will get stable, I think not for this release at least16:49
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sripriyatbh: that is also a good point, does heat directly interface with docker?16:49
digaheat has docker plugin implemented16:49
jankiI am also emphasising on using method 3 of spec - Directly pass in Dockerfile to create a VNF. This would bypass16:49
janki   tosca-parser, Heat and call Magnum APIs directly.16:49
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jankitbh sripriya heat-docker is deprecated/removed16:50
tbhsripriya, but I don't think magnum will be sufficient, even in the case of SFC16:50
sripriyatbh: my only concern for direct interface is we dont want to own too much of this logic in tacker since that is not the main goal for the orchestrator and may have challenges when we integrate with other VIMs16:50
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digajanki: I would like you to cover all this point in the spec16:50
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sripriyatbh: we are still in a nascent stage for this :-)16:50
jankidiga all the points are covered16:50
digasripriya: +116:50
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digasripriya: any how we need, third layer to manage orchestration16:51
jankiwriting APIs in tacker would be like duplicating some portion of zun16:51
tbhsripriya, but my concern, we have to completely move to new project if we choose magnum16:51
sripriyaalright, some good thoughts here, let us continue to iterate the spec based on this comments16:51
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sripriyatbh: tacker already has started to interact with multiple projects for many cloud functionalities16:52
tbhsripriya, yes, but here I mean pick one project for one or two cycles is not good I think16:53
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sripriyatbh: i do not think we will remove one and add a new one16:53
sripriyatbh: they can evolve in parallel16:53
sripriyatbh: what do you think?16:53
jankisripriya, tbh we can have this feature as a techpreview and keep on improving over the coming releases16:54
tbhsripriya, I am thinking for magnum, it may happen :)16:54
sripriyatbh: please add your thoughts on the spec and we can discuss on gerrit16:54
tbhsripriya, sure16:54
sripriyawe have 2 more specs to touch upon quickly16:54
sripriya#topic vmware vim support16:55
*** openstack changes topic to "vmware vim support (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:55
sripriyamarchetti: are you planning to create a spec for supporting vmware as a VIM?16:55
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marchettiI'm still trying to figure out what is needed.  It may be that VIO is the best option.16:56
marchettiVIO == Vmware Integrated OpenStack16:56
marchettiIf that is the option, then technically speaking it should already be supported16:56
sripriyamarchetti: if you need some information from Tacker perspective, someone can tag with you for this spec16:56
marchettisripriya: ok thanks16:57
sripriyamarchetti: right16:57
sripriyamarchetti: let us discuss more on this in tacker channel after the meeting16:57
marchettisripriya: ok16:57
sripriya#topic pecan framework16:57
*** openstack changes topic to "pecan framework (Meeting topic: tacker)"16:57
sripriyadiga: do you have a spec created for this?16:57
digaAlready pushed16:58
sripriyalink please?16:58
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diga1 min16:58
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sripriyaplease add the cores to the spec and feel free to ping folks on tacker channel16:58
digasripriya: sure16:59
sripriyateam, please review this spec and provide your thoughts16:59
sripriyatime is up team16:59
sripriyathanks for attending!16:59
digasripriya: about pecan code, can I create one folder under tacker16:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"16:59
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 16:59:41 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)16:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-22-16.00.html16:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-22-16.00.txt16:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-22-16.00.log.html16:59
sripriyadiga: let us discuss on tacker channle16:59
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digasripriya: yes16:59
igordcard#startmeeting network_common_flow_classifier17:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 17:00:22 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is igordcard. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.17:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'network_common_flow_classifier'17:00
igordcardhi all17:00
igordcardlet's wait 3 minutes to improve the chances of everyone being around17:00
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* njohnston lurks17:01
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davidshanjohnston: How are you?17:02
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igordcard#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Neutron/CommonFlowClassifier#Discussion_Topic_22_November_201617:03
igordcardI'll start with the OVS Flow Manager today17:03
igordcard#topic OVS Flow Manager: new patch available at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/323963/17:03
*** openstack changes topic to "OVS Flow Manager: new patch available at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/323963/ (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:03
igordcard#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/323963/17:03
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davidshaReviews are appreciated!17:04
igordcard;) I'm hoping to have a look at it, been a while since the last time I checked it17:04
igordcarddo you want to discuss something about the flow manager in general?17:05
njohnston  /msg davidsha Doing all right, not allowed to work on OpenStack as much now... which makes me sad.17:05
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davidshaigordcard: There isn't much really, that patch is basically a new version of the flow manager divorced from the agent extensions API17:06
igordcardkeep the code and the reviews flowing!17:09
igordcardmoving on...17:09
igordcardcommon classification framework17:10
igordcard#topic We have converged to Approach 2 at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/333993/17:10
*** openstack changes topic to "We have converged to Approach 2 at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/333993/ (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:10
igordcard#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/33399317:10
igordcardat the summit meeting we converged to approach 217:11
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igordcardas such, I've now deleted approach 1 and 3 from the spec so we can focus on improving approach 217:11
davidshaigordcard: cool, I was reading over it earlier and left a couple of comments.17:12
igordcardhowever, we were still uncertain about whether a an API for users should be provided as well, i.e. to define classifications as resources17:12
igordcard#topic Should this approach include a user-facing API?17:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Should this approach include a user-facing API? (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:12
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ralonsohCan you elaborate this question?17:13
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ralonsohuser-facing API?17:13
ralonsohSorry if this is irrelevant17:13
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njohnstonBy "user" do you mean "thing that consumes flow classifier" or "tenant"?17:14
igordcardralonsoh: whether classifications should be tenant API resources, or simply definitions in code that can be reused and extended by neutron projects17:14
igordcardnjohnston: tenant17:14
ralonsohigorcard: thanks17:14
njohnstonI vote the latter; if multiple things use flow classified then a tenant could get confused17:15
igordcardralonsoh: nothing is irrelevant :)17:15
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igordcardthe latter is developer-friendly, while the former tries to be user-friendly as well, in an attempt to have users define their own classifications (within the scope of what the framework supports at a certain release)17:16
davidshaBy the later you mean API extensions through Mixins? The former would need to be a service plugin correct?17:16
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njohnstonLet's say FWaaS and SFC both use the classifier. I would rather have them define things in FWaaS and SFC and have those manage the classifier behind them.17:18
njohnstonAs an example17:18
davidshanjohnston: that's the plan, the hope is it's all back end agnostic. This is just deciding weather the extensions consume to individual values or a reference to a classifier resource to extract values from.17:19
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igordcardnjohnston: In the tenant API approach, FWaaS and SFC can still manage the classifier but the classification definition would come from an ID, essentially17:20
igordcarddavidsha: right17:20
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davidshawith the later you could keep reusing the same classifiers across multiple extensions.17:21
davidshalater for what I said*17:22
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davidsha"a reference to a classifier resource to extract values from."17:22
igordcardfor the sake of clarity, let's call the approach with the API resources "resource-based" and the one without API "definition-based"17:23
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igordcardI also recommend a distinction between classification and classifier, if you agree17:24
davidshaSure, but I'm prone to mixing them up :P17:25
igordcardclassification as whatever refers to a traffic classification/kind, and classifier as the component that evaluate the classification of the traffic17:25
njohnstonI am fine with either, as long as: if a tenant wants to modify an existing resource it is never ambiguous the use that resource is being put to. So they don't change an SFC-consumed classification when they meant to change an FWaaS-consumed classification.17:25
njohnstonJust because this is uncommonly abstract of a thing for a tenant to have to deal with. Abstraction makes sense for developers, not for many customers.17:26
davidshanjohnston: That's a good point, but it would be similar to modifying QoS Rules then, they would need to define a new classification for the single instance they want to change.17:27
igordcardnjohnston: a fair concern.. I would vote for a non-updatable classification resource17:27
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igordcardlet me echo davidsha's question17:30
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davidshaFrom the Summit?17:31
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igordcardhow would we do the definition-based approach? though mixins applied to each neutron extension that wants to supports classifications?17:32
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davidshaIt was to add mixin classes to neutron-lib or neutron classifier and just have extensions include them in their service plugins and extend their backends.17:32
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davidshathe problem with it is that long detailed classifications would need to be repeated for all the extensions that needed it enabled, it also has the extensions database classes extending to hold all the possible classifications17:35
igordcardright, the different projects would mirror the classifications structures within their local tables17:37
igordcardso every project would have to sync immediately with new versions of the classifications structures?17:38
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davidshaigordcard: not if the classification types were broken into different mixins17:39
njohnston If there is a case for new version upgrades, would they be versioned?17:39
igordcarddavidsha: I see.. but then it would be a "mixin spaghetti"17:41
davidshanjohnston: They would probably need to be, but the idea is that the different types would be static.17:41
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davidshayou have a mixin for IPv4, IPv6, NSH, etc...17:42
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igordcardalright, we have a good deal of info here to help us decide on the spec, I'm moving to the next topic now (still related) while we have time17:45
igordcard#topic Completing the spec and starting the code17:45
*** openstack changes topic to "Completing the spec and starting the code (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:45
igordcardwhat do both approaches have in common?17:46
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igordcardcan we start working on openstack/neutron-classifier to provide the foundation for classification, either exposed as resources or not?17:46
davidshaigordcard: almost nothing, resource based requires a service plugin and definition based requires mixins17:46
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igordcardI will update the spec to clarify the resource-based approach and will add my understanding of the definition-based approach17:48
igordcardwill greatly appreciate feedback njohnston davidsha17:48
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igordcardand ralonsoh17:49
igordcardalso feel free to submit a patchset providing more info njohnston17:49
igordcardwe can then attempt to converge to an approach, in gerrit17:49
igordcardalright, moving on..17:50
igordcard#topic Repo: new repo or neutron-classifier repo?17:50
*** openstack changes topic to "Repo: new repo or neutron-classifier repo? (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:50
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davidshaJust stick to neutron-classifier is my vote17:51
njohnstonwhat would be the advantage of a new repo?17:52
igordcardI expect most of it would have to be rewritten, in either approach17:52
igordcardso starting freshing is potentially cleaner, but reusing the neutron-classifier keeps the ecosystem less fragmented17:53
igordcardI'm voting to stay on neutron-classifier as well17:53
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njohnstonwill this end up being packaged into a separate pypi module, like neutron-lib?17:54
davidshanjohnston: don't think there is an advantage, presumably yes.17:55
davidshanjohnston: but the service plugin approach would make it like any other extension.17:56
* njohnston thinks staying with neutron-classifier is wiser17:56
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igordcardwhich raises the issue of dependency between projects17:57
igordcardmoving on...17:57
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igordcard#topic Open discussion17:57
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:57
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igordcard* between extensions17:57
igordcardanything else we need to discuss?17:58
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davidshadon't think there is enough time unfortunately.17:58
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igordcardnext meeting is expected in 2 weeks, but until then get your thoughts onto the spec!17:59
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igordcardthanks everybody, cya all17:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"17:59
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 17:59:42 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)17:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2016/network_common_flow_classifier.2016-11-22-17.00.html17:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2016/network_common_flow_classifier.2016-11-22-17.00.txt17:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2016/network_common_flow_classifier.2016-11-22-17.00.log.html17:59
davidshathanks, bye!17:59
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lbragstad#startmeeting keystone18:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 18:00:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is lbragstad. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.18:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.18:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'keystone'18:00
lbragstadamakarov, ayoung, bknudson, breton, browne, chrisplo, crinkle, davechen, dolphm, dstanek, edmondsw, edtubill, gagehugo, gyee, henrynash, hrybacki, jamielennox, jaugustine, jgrassler, knikolla, lbragstad, kbaikov, ktychkova, morgan, nisha, nkinder, notmorgan, raildo, ravelar, rderose, rodrigods, roxanaghe, samueldmq, shaleh, srwilkers, stevemar, topol, StefanPaetowJisc18:00
lbragstad#agenda https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting18:00
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lbragstad#link agenda https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting18:00
* crinkle not really around18:00
* stevemar is also not really around, but in a different place thank crinkle18:01
stevemarthanks lbragstad ;)18:01
lbragstadstevemar np18:01
ayounglbragstad, So I'd really like to get the RBAC spec in to Ocata18:02
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lbragstadayoung cool - let's talk about it at the end of the meeting - since we have a quick agenda anyway18:03
ayounglbragstad, first item is specs.18:03
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ayoung    Announcements [stevemar]18:03
ayoung    Next milestone is Ocata-2 -- Week of Dec 12-16 -- This is also spec freeze week, specs must merge by then!18:03
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lbragstadayoung looks like a request for reviews - but we can talk about18:04
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lbragstad#optic Announcements18:04
lbragstad#topic Announcements18:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:04
lbragstadNext milestone is Ocata-2 -- Week of Dec 12-16 -- This is also spec freeze week, specs must merge by then!18:05
lbragstadalso - looks like we18:05
lbragstadare going to stick with the etherpad format for the meeting18:05
lbragstadat least according to the current responses - https://goo.gl/forms/Gs4lZxgktRzlwHAn218:05
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lbragstadReminder that we have the policy meeting tomorrow18:06
lbragstad#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/398500/ merged18:06
lbragstadso there should be an ical published http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/ by EOD18:06
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lbragstadayoung can we breeze through breton's topic before the RBAC spec since it was on the agenda last week and we didn't get to it?18:07
lbragstadayoung htanks18:07
lbragstad#topic Request id chaining in keystoneclient18:07
*** openstack changes topic to "Request id chaining in keystoneclient (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:07
lbragstadbreton you're up18:07
bretonthere was that spec with request-id chaining18:08
bretonthe idea was to send the same request-id to all services18:08
bretonso that actions could be tracked18:08
ayoungwe have a plan in place to fix?18:08
bretonit was a cross-project spec and there was a huge discussion18:08
lbragstadbreton is there a link to the spec?18:08
bretonand, apparently, it was  broken in ksc for ~2 major releases18:09
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bretonlbragstad: http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/openstack-specs/specs/return-request-id.html18:09
ayoungand...since everything starts with a keystone token, people thought the request ID should come from Keystone, but since  token can be used on multiple requests, even the auditID is not an appropriate value18:09
bretonlbragstad: i couldn't find the spec for reusing request-id though18:09
morgan_ayoung: i remember this18:09
ayoungand we can't trust the client to generate it as they could fake it out18:09
morgan_ayoung: the convo went in a lot of circles for that18:09
morgan_we have to pick *something* to trust18:10
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ayoungand we don't know, after the token is requested, what the right place to generate the request ID is18:10
bretonwe removed the last bits of this broken request-id thing in  https://review.openstack.org/#/c/396260/18:10
lbragstadso a request ID needs to be a combination of the token + operation?18:10
morgan_honestly, i think the client can generate it just fine.18:10
ayoungseems like it has to be in keystonemiddleware, and passed down the reuqest hierarchy.  But...hmmm18:10
bretonand released yesterday after some discussion18:10
morgan_it's better to have a request-id than not.18:10
ayoungthere is no way to prevent a bad actore from faking the ID18:10
bretonsomeone should bring it back to keystoneclient18:10
morgan_ayoung: ++18:11
bretoni am not sure that it works in other clients though.18:11
ayoungI wonder if this could be piggybacked with jamielennoxs service token approach18:11
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morgan_ayoung: possibly18:11
ayoungit seems that the request ID should be generated at the edge,  so if a service is calling another service, we trust it to generate the ID and pass it along18:11
bretonplease review https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/return-request-id-to-caller+project:openstack/python-keystoneclient that should bring it back.18:11
ayoungbreton, kill it18:12
morgan_breton: i would rather see it in KSA than ksc in this case18:12
ayoungit is not a keystoneclient problem to solve.  It might be keystonemiddleware, though18:12
bretonayoung: done18:12
morgan_keystoneclient is the wrong place regardless18:12
ayoungmight need KSA support, but I think it is middleware18:12
morgan_the way i see it, ksa supports it18:12
morgan_ksm uses it18:12
bretonuses it?18:12
bretonfor what?18:12
morgan_uses/makes use of the support18:12
ayoungbreton, to pass it on18:12
ayoungin a trusted manner18:12
morgan_what ayoung said.18:13
bretonit is not auth thing18:13
morgan_but keystoneauth *is* the session for a given set of requests18:13
ayoungso...what we are really talking about here is an audit trail, but the ability to distinguish between two different requests using the same token18:13
ayoungothewise, the token audit ID is sufficient18:13
ayoungbreton, it is an Audit thing18:13
bretonright now it is in all python-*client, not sure if it works18:13
morgan_let it be part of the session object(s) that are passed around internally18:13
ayoungso...to do it right (overdesign) we would do something like this:18:14
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ayoungfirst service that gets the request geneerates and ID and signes  it (yeah PKI again...this is athought experiment, not reality, bear with me)18:14
ayoungand then each service in the chain adds its own signature to it.18:14
morgan_even if we started with audit id. that is a step in the right direction (just don't reference the audit-id as the audit-id, so if we want t change/enhance it we can)18:14
ayoungugh...not even that signing thing works.18:15
ayoungThe problem is that we have to treat services like Trove and Sahara as untrusted services18:15
lbragstadayoung the request id would change every time it hits a new service, wouldn't it?18:15
ayoungor add some other service outthere that is not under the big tent, and you get the same idea18:15
morgan_so simple solution18:16
morgan_lets start with the audit id. or a UUID seeded from the audit-id18:16
morgan_now we have at least *some* level of tracking.18:16
ayounglbragstad, does it?  I would not think that would be useful, but the id still then needs to be linked to the endpoint, or a hacked endpoint could modify18:16
morgan_or audit_id+timestamp if request_id is none18:16
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ayoungI thought the idea of a request id, though, was to track the request across multiple services18:16
morgan_(seeded into uuid)18:16
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bretonrequest-id thing was cross-project. Before killing it and discussing something new we should talk to other projects.18:16
ayoungaudit_id+timestamp is pretty good18:17
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ayoungbreton, I come to praise audit id, not to bury it18:17
ayoungmorgan_, I think that is it18:17
ayoungaudit_id + timestamp18:17
ayoungthe worst a service could do then is munge the timestamp18:17
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ayoungany other service can confirm that the audit_id on the token matches...18:18
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ayoungbreton, would that work?  request ID = (token['audi'id'], timestamp_of_initial_request)18:18
morgan_ayoung: uuid.uuid5(audit_id, timestamp) (timestamp is namespace)18:18
morgan_ayoung: or something like that18:18
bretonayoung: no idea :)18:19
ayoungmorgan_, sha256?18:19
morgan_it's sha118:19
morgan_but that is sufficient for a request_id18:19
ayoungmorgan_, it can always be a calculated value, so long as we capture the original request time18:19
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morgan_i'd rather populate a uuid (strings are easier to suss out in longs) if we're doing it.18:19
morgan_but impl detail aside18:20
ayoungso...original request timesamp now becomes an additional header?18:20
morgan_audit_id + timestamp_of_request_at_edge18:20
ayoungmorgan_, sha256 as a string.  Lets avoid any crypto discussion18:20
morgan_ayoung: sure. or make it all the same header18:20
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morgan_OpenStack-Request-Id: <calc_string>, <timestamp>18:21
ayoungmorgan_, we need the initial time in order to confirm the hash.18:21
morgan_if you want to re-calc it you can18:21
ayoungbreton, is that enough to go on?  We don't need to design it all here, but you should be able to take that and run.  Hit me or morgan_ up for ?s in #keystone if needs be18:21
morgan_split is cheap in python and any other lang (maybe excluding C)18:21
morgan_ayoung: ++18:21
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morgan_and this can be encoded in keystoneauth (support for it) so it just exists18:22
lbragstadbreton does that help?18:22
ayoung#action breton to spec out new request id format based on token audit ID and timestamp of original request18:22
morgan_since we are trying to get sessions to be passed in from middleware and reused when talking to subsequent services for the request18:23
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bretonplease comment on https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/return-request-id-to-caller+project:openstack/python-keystoneclient too18:24
bretonso that the person doesn't work on them any more18:24
lbragstadalright - moving on18:25
bretoni was actually trying to notify people about the request-id thing :p18:25
lbragstad#topic PCI lockout and recovery18:25
*** openstack changes topic to "PCI lockout and recovery (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:25
lbragstadgagehugo you're up18:25
gagehugoI saw people responded already18:25
gagehugobut basically, I was looking at this later yesterday: https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/164164518:25
openstackLaunchpad bug 1641645 in OpenStack Identity (keystone) "PCI: a locked out user must ask an admin to unlock their account" [Wishlist,Opinion] - Assigned to Gage Hugo (gagehugo)18:25
ayoungbreton, use that new -2 you have to stop any really bad decisions in their tracks18:25
ayoungjust, be nice when you do it18:26
ayounggagehugo, so...I would think a domain admin yes, but a locked account cannot be fixed by a user themself18:26
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morgan_a locked out account is just that.18:26
gagehugoyeah, I think the title should probably have been more specific about expired password users vs locked out18:26
morgan_locked out18:26
gagehugounless both are considered "locked out"18:27
ayoungexpired password should be resettable by the user.  And that is a code/logic error, I bet18:27
morgan_expired password is something valid to address. some systems require admin intervention on that front18:27
morgan_some dont18:27
lbragstadmorgan_ ++18:27
gagehugomorgan_ yeah18:27
morgan_we would need to re-work the password self-change i think18:27
ayoungdon't check the expiry when the user calls that API, and let it be called (only?) with basic auth18:27
ayoungBasic-Auth middleware18:27
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morgan_but i am 100% ok with keystone supporting self-service change of expired password18:28
morgan_ayoung: does self-service password change require a token?18:28
morgan_if it does...18:28
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ayoungmorgan_, it does18:28
morgan_then that is something we would need to address18:28
ayoungmorgan_, the only operation in openstack that does not require a token it to get a token18:28
morgan_it would need to support a tokenless-mode18:28
ayoungtokenless with x509 works18:28
gagehugoI left a comment about that on the bug listing, it was why I was concerned about what direction to take with it18:28
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morgan_it should be fine to make self-service password change not require a token18:29
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ayoungthe API takes the old Password in the body of the request?18:29
gagehugoyou also need to know the user_id I believe18:29
dstanekthe expirationlogic was modeled after how other orgs handle the situation (we just dont' implement the grace period)18:30
morgan_dstanek: and i think it's fine as is.18:30
rderoseallow users to change when their password expires? we discussed this during development and the decision was that once a password expires, it requires a admin password reset.18:30
gagehugodstanek I've worked in places that handle it either way18:30
morgan_rderose: i've seen it both ways18:30
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morgan_rderose: i don't feelw e need to change it.18:30
dstanekgagehugo: we didn't want to make it infinitely configurable so we opted for the most secure route18:31
rderosemorgan_ true18:31
morgan_but fwiw, i would be 100% ok with self-service change to work for expired passwords18:31
gagehugodstanek I'm fine either way18:31
morgan_since we can lock an account independantly18:31
morgan_we don't require a password or password expiry to change it18:31
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morgan_it also could allow an admin to force a password change on next login18:31
morgan_here is your temp password, use this api and change it18:31
morgan_since the password is "expired" to start18:32
* dstanek just gave his last 2cents away before vacation brain sets in18:32
morgan_looking at active directory style setup (and some LDAP impls)18:32
morgan_there is definite use for forcing a password change so the user doesn't need to tell the admin the real password -- and the admin *cant* know it because the change is required18:32
ayoungSo... to do that would, I think, require a different Paste Pipeline18:33
morgan_ayoung: no, we explicitly exempt some apis18:33
dstaneki don't think admins need to know the old password, that's just self-service18:33
morgan_aka no enforcement18:33
morgan_dstanek: right, but in the case of admin-password set you're implicitly telling the admin a password to use18:33
ayounggagehugo, is that enough for you to go on?18:34
morgan_often orgs have an admin set a temp password that must be changed18:34
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lbragstadno enforcement and a very specific case that someone's password is expired18:34
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ayoungFix just the expired case, make it skip the token request...that will require a change in Keystoneclient, too18:34
morgan_ayoung: hm. yes minor change to ksc18:34
ayoungand...do we have a way to get that URL to the end user without a token?18:34
gagehugoayoung kinda? it's still a question of whether or not to change it18:34
dstanekwe actually talked about forced-reset and i think the concensus was that it was bad enough that we added PCI features to the keystone IdP that we didn't want to have any extras. the advice was to use a real IdP18:34
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gagehugobut right now just requiring an admin to do it works18:34
ayounggagehugo, yes, change only the reset-password case, and only on expired, not locked18:35
dstanekPCI was to be the bare minimum as opposed to a base for building an IdP18:35
gagehugoayoung ok18:35
morgan_like i said, don't feel we need to change it18:35
morgan_it just has a real use case if we do18:35
gagehugocould we add a config option to disable users resetting their own passwords when expired? If whoever doesn't want that option?18:36
morgan_ayoung: well, the auth request could return the URL for password change if password is expired (regardless of the value of the password)18:36
dstanekmorgan_: if we do change it then it would mean y'all were right and is was too slippery a slope18:36
morgan_dstanek: i think we've already hit that slope18:36
morgan_dstanek: we implemented basic PCI-DSS support18:36
ayoungmorgan_, I like that. Very rest.18:36
* dstanek hi fives morgan_18:36
ayoungTHat slope has snow on it18:37
ayoungand it is forming moguls18:37
morgan_ayoung: nah, sierra cement...and it's iced over18:37
morgan_the avalanche started a few thousand feet above you..18:37
ayoungfrozen moguls18:37
morgan_you have no avalanche gear...18:37
ayoungon Telemark skis18:37
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ayoungI have Avalanche gear.  I might be the only one that does18:37
ayoungprobe and beacon and collapsable shovel18:37
ayoungnext topic18:38
dstanekayoung: probably18:38
lbragstadgagehugo want to take point on updating the bug with the discussion here?18:38
gagehugowill do18:38
lbragstadminus avalanche talk18:38
lbragstadgagehugo cool -thanks18:38
lbragstad#topic RBAC specification18:38
*** openstack changes topic to "RBAC specification (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:38
lbragstadgo ayoung go!18:38
ayoungOK... RBAC18:39
ayoungso I want this spec in18:39
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ayoungjust the Keystone piece of it18:39
ayoungand just the REST api to start18:39
* morgan_ read that as "The Keystone Price"18:39
ayoung#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391624/18:39
morgan_and i wondered when we entered the game of thrones18:39
ayoungthere are details to work out,  so, should I split the spec into toe pieces and only putthe REST part in the first piece, and then the second is enforcement18:40
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ayoungenforcement is going to be done based on the REST API, and in middleware first, although the "RBAC during the token validation" has struck some interest and could still be done as a second piece18:41
lbragstadayoung what specifically is the REST part?18:41
lbragstadbecause i was thinking the REST part was the enforcement part...18:41
ayounglbragstad, upload and fetch of mpping from URL patterns to roles18:41
lbragstadayoung so the enforcement part would include the changes to the token validation api18:42
ayoungyou need a management interface before you can have enforcement18:42
lbragstadthat's what you mean?18:42
ayounglbragstad, and in fact, I am right now thinking that enforcement would be done in keystonemiddleware.  Then, if e do the -enforce -during token validation" we would reuse the middleware code inside of Keystone18:42
ayoungso there is a natural ordering:18:42
ayoung1. management API18:42
ayoung2. Enforce in middleware (leaves caching alone)18:43
ayoung3.  enforce in token API (optional, depends on 2)18:43
lbragstadand 3 would break caching... right?18:43
ayoungIt means that once the API is working for management, there will be follow on changes to middleware.18:43
ayounglbragstad, right18:44
ayounglbragstad, and I can make that its own spec, so we can judge it separately18:44
lbragstadso - right now policy has two places that it gets information from18:44
lbragstad1.) the policy file18:44
lbragstad2.) keystone's token response18:44
lbragstadintroducing the management api essentially puts both of those pieces of information into keystone, right?18:45
ayoung3) the service itself18:45
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ayounglbragstad, so yes18:45
ayounglbragstad, as the new mechanism skips the service specific attributes18:45
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lbragstadhave other projects thought about this? I assume this would need a migration18:46
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lbragstador do they have an opinion?18:46
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ayoungthere  is a migration path, but to start, there would be no impact18:48
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ayoungit would be disabled by default. People could then enable it to test it out18:48
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ayoungas all good things should be;  sportsmanlike18:48
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ayoungbut we can probably pregenerate all the URL pattern mappings based on the API specs for the other projects, and just assign them the Memeber role18:49
ayoungso long as admin implies member, that will continue to work as is18:49
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lbragstadso - if a policy changes for a project, they have to update the policy as it is stored in keystone.18:50
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ayounglbragstad, don't call it policy18:50
lbragstadis there a way to bootstrap this in keystone?18:50
ayoungyes, there is a way:18:50
ayoungone thing I have not done yet, and that nedsto be better clarified in the spec is how to specify a default rule if there is no match18:50
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ayoungwe could then load up just the defaults on a per service basis.  We could even generate those automatically based on the service catalog if we wanted18:51
morgan_ayoung: that is probably the best bet18:51
morgan_the per-serivce basis that is18:51
ayoungSo, lets get the management API spec approaved (I'll split it later today) and we can continue to work through the implementation details18:52
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ayoungeveryone OK with this approach?18:52
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lbragstaddoes anyone have reservations?18:52
lbragstadwe can take the time to go through this in the policy meeting tomrrow too18:53
lbragstadif people have more questions18:53
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lbragstadthinrichs isn't here is he?18:55
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lbragstador edmondsw18:55
lbragstadayoung would you be available to field questions at tomorrow's meeting if people have them?18:56
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ayoungyes I will18:57
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lbragstadthinrichs, edmondsw, ruan, all seem to have a bunch of feedback on policy - so having their input would be nice18:57
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lbragstadanything else?18:57
lbragstadwe have two minutes left?18:57
lbragstadalright - let's call it a minute early18:58
lbragstadthanks for coming!18:58
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"18:58
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 18:58:45 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)18:58
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-22-18.00.html18:58
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-22-18.00.txt18:58
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-22-18.00.log.html18:58
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fungiinfra team, assemble!19:00
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fungithis week's topics proposed by zaro and jeblair19:00
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fungii'm woefully underprepared this week so won't be churning through the boilerplate at my usual clip, but the agenda is pretty light19:01
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fungii'll go ahead and start, and others can catch up from scrollback19:02
fungi#startmeeting infra19:02
openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 19:02:40 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.19:02
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)"19:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'infra'19:02
fungi#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting19:02
fungi#topic Announcements19:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: infra)"19:02
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fungi#info Our "Ocata Cycle" [2048R/0x8B1B03FD54E2AC07] signing key is now in production. Thanks to all who attested to it!19:03
fungiwe should probably also announce the upcoming xenial job change for improved visibility19:04
fungi#info REMINDER: Remaining master and stable/newton jobs will be switched from ubuntu-trusty to ubuntu-xenial nodes on December 6.19:04
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fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106906.html19:05
fungii won't bother doing an info for the gerrit maintenance since people would only have an hour to see it in the minutes before we take gerrit down19:05
fungias always, feel free to hit me up with announcements you want included in future meetings19:05
fungi#topic Actions from last meeting19:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)"19:05
fungihere is where i publicly shame myself again19:06
fungi#action fungi send summit session summary to infra ml19:06
fungiit's still being edited :/19:06
fungipabelanger un-wip "Force gate-{name}-pep8-{node} to build needed wheels" change19:06
jeblairfungi: you didn't say which summit ;)19:06
fungithat happened, right?19:06
fungijeblair: touché!19:06
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AJaegerit happened, yes19:07
fungithere we are19:07
fungi#link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/project-config/tree/jenkins/jobs/python-jobs.yaml#n10619:07
fungiso all standard gate-{name}-pep8 job runs now happen without our custom pre-built wheel mirrors19:08
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fungithanks pabelanger!19:08
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fungiclarkb pabelanger work on replacing translate-dev.openstack.org with xenial server running newer zanata release19:08
fungii saw some of that going on19:08
clarkbthats in progress https://review.openstack.org/#/c/399789/ is next19:09
fungithe change to allow translate-dev01.o.o just merged righth?19:09
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clarkbhoping to get that in then boot a replacement today19:09
fungi#link https://review.openstack.org/39978919:09
fungithanks for working on that19:09
clarkb#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zanata-dev-xenial-update19:09
clarkbis the rough plan outline19:09
fungioh, right, pabelanger is busy with openstackday montreal which explains why he's so quiet ;)19:10
mordredoh right. canada19:10
* clarkb wonders if those events are strategically timed to keep muricans out19:10
clarkbapparnetly there si an openstack day paris this week too19:10
fungii mean, i would do it that way if i were them19:10
SotKclarkb: yeah, that is today too19:10
mordredfungi: ++19:10
fungiianw send maintenance announcement for project rename19:11
fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/107379.html19:11
fungiwe'll be working on that right after the tc meeting today19:11
fungiclarkb is picking up the pieces from my incomplete patch to fix the renames playbook19:11
clarkbI am about to push a new patchset19:12
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fungiso here's hoping this time around sees fewer hangups than i ran into last time19:12
clarkbwould be great if people that grok ansible better than I could review it after the meeting19:12
fungithanks ianw and clarkb for working on this19:12
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ianwnot sure i do, but will take a look...19:12
clarkband pushed19:12
fungiand yeah, i grok so little ansible that i had a jolly time testing that playbook on the last rename19:13
clarkb#link https://review.openstack.org/36506719:13
clarkbmordred: ^ hint hint :P19:13
fungiokay, i think that's it for our action items from last week19:13
mordredif only rcarillocruz wasn't watching spongebob19:13
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fungiyou mean if only you _were_ watching spongebob, right?19:14
fungi#topic Specs approval19:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval (Meeting topic: infra)"19:14
fungiwe have a couple of these up19:14
fungi#topic Specs approval: PROPOSED [priority] Gerrit 2.13 Upgrade (zaro)19:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED [priority] Gerrit 2.13 Upgrade (zaro) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:14
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fungi#link https://review.openstack.org/388190 Spec for upgrading gerrit from 2.11.x to 2.13.x19:15
zaroanybody interested in this?19:15
fungii think i linked the wrong second change to make it a priority effort, just a sec19:15
fungiahh, yep, here19:16
fungi#link https://review.openstack.org/388202 add gerrit-upgrade to priority efforts query19:16
fungilooks like AJaeger and jhesketh have already given the spec a once-over19:17
* AJaeger just commented again. I wonder what kind of cool features we get...19:18
AJaegerSo far I'm neutral ;)19:18
zaromany, many.. :)19:18
clarkbI will be happy if the GC bug goes away19:18
clarkbs/GC/memory leak that leads to GC/19:18
funginot falling behind on gerrit releases is the biggest "feature" i'm interested in, honestly19:18
AJaegerfor that one alone I would update ;)19:18
zarobut i don't remember them all off the top of my head19:18
fungibut yes, the supposed fix for our gc woes is very high on my interest list too19:18
zaroi think topic submission was in 2.1219:19
AJaegerzaro: If you have one or two really noteworthy or the bug fix, feel free to add it. Or link to the announcements...19:19
clarkbI know its not in this release but I saw a thread on email ingestion on the gerrit mailing list19:19
clarkbjeblair: ^19:19
zaroyeah, that pretty cool!19:19
fungii guess one procedural question for those here... should i still be putting specs up for council vote until 19:00 utc thursday, or with it being a national holiday in lots of countries should i give it until sometime next week? Maybe up until 15:00 utc tuesday?19:19
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zaroAJaeger: i have a few up already, topic is gerrit-upgrade19:20
zaro#link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+topic:gerrit-upgrade19:20
clarkbfungi: ++ to delaying this week19:20
jeblairclarkb: oh neat, i'll look that up19:20
clarkbI personally have a ton of stuff to do for infra and at home its, short week doesn't mean less work just less time to get it done :)19:20
fungii'm leaning toward having specs approved early-ish in the day tuesday to give people time to review but still an opportunity for me to have them merge before the next meeting19:21
jeblairfungi: wfm19:21
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zaroi've already done some testing with 2.13 and it's looking good so far19:21
AJaegerzaro: great!19:21
fungi#info The "Gerrit 2.13 Upgrade" spec is open for Infra Council vote until 15:00 UTC Tuesday, November 29.19:22
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fungi#info The "add gerrit-upgrade to priority efforts query" change is open for Infra Council vote until 15:00 UTC Tuesday, November 29.19:22
zarojeblair: you might also want to take a look at Robo comments feature that google guys are working on19:22
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mordredzaro: is there a link where one could read about that?19:23
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zaromordred: #link https://gerrit.googlesource.com/summit/2016/+/HEAD/index.md19:25
zaro"robot comments"19:25
fungiasimov would be proud19:25
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fungiso it sounds like the "toggle ci" effect we're doing?19:26
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zarojeblair: batch plugin might be good fit with zuul19:27
fungioh, but also the generated fixes idea is interesting19:27
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zaro#link https://gerrit.googlesource.com/plugins/batch/19:27
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zarofungi: toggle ci is sorta independent and it's already in. but will not be availbe until 2.1419:28
fungioh, cool19:28
fungiokay, anything else we need to cover on this in the meeting instead of in review?19:28
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zaroi would like people to review changes to get all things install on zuul-dev.o.o like schedular, launcher, nodepoole etc..19:29
zarothat is to get a dev env to test gerrit-zuul-nodepool integration19:30
clarkbzaro: do they all use a common topic? I am guessing there is a topic in the spec19:30
zaroi think i'll need help getting those working19:30
zaroclarkb: topic is gerrit-upgrade19:30
fungi#info In addition to the specs changes, please review open Gerrit/Puppet changes under topic:gerrit-upgrade19:30
fungithanks, zaro!19:31
zarook. i think that's it for me19:31
fungi#topic Specs approval: PROPOSED Zuul v3: Add section on secrets (jeblair)19:31
*** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED Zuul v3: Add section on secrets (jeblair) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:31
fungi#link https://review.openstack.org/386281 Zuul v3: Add section on secrets19:31
zarosick kid at home so gotta run for now..19:31
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jeblairi think this is fairly well reviewed, so it's ready for formal voting19:33
fungii guess there's not too much to say on this spec... it's been out there for a while, so... yeah19:33
mordredjeblair: also - I swear those two looked the same to me19:33
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jeblairit doesn't really go in a different direction or anything, it's just very detailed and complicated and worth close examination19:33
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fungiwe talked through much of it in the barcelona infra devroom on friday19:33
jeblairmordred: yeah, base64 is fun that way :)19:33
jeblair4 characters are different19:34
jeblairi guess the rest is base64 padding, etc19:34
fungi#info The "Zuul v3: Add section on secrets" spec addition is open for Infra Council vote until 15:00 UTC Tuesday, November 29.19:34
fungii'm eager to see what others think about it19:35
fungibut yeah, we already have 4 rollcall votes on it19:35
fungianything else, jeblair?19:35
jeblairfungi: nope!19:36
fungi#topic Priority Efforts: Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (jeblair)19:36
*** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts: Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (jeblair) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:36
fungisomething something production rollout something19:36
fungii take it we're close then19:36
jeblairwe're ready to start running the new zookeeper based builder in parallel19:37
jeblairbasically, as soon as we can get the puppet changes for it19:37
jeblairi would have said this week19:37
fungipesky feast-oriented holidays19:37
jeblairbut apparently everyone is conferencing or spongebobing or something19:37
clarkbnodepoold won't make use of those images until we do an explicit change of the code/config there, but this allows us to see how the builder does in the real world before using it19:37
jeblairso that might be pushing it.  but i'm still going to work on it :)19:37
jeblairclarkb: that's correct19:37
jeblairwe can run this as long as we want without interfering with the prod setup19:38
jeblairand then, when we're ready, we can switch nodepoold to use it19:38
clarkbjeblair: one thing that occurred to me with that19:38
fungido we have puppetry in place to deploy from the feature branch, or is this stuff that's all merged down to master?19:38
jeblairfungi: we'll deploy the builder from the feature branch19:38
fungiokay, cool19:38
clarkbis maybe we can put apache in front of the image files too and see how it does (since we aren't using it for prod prod yet)19:38
jeblair(there's already revision arguments in puppet-nodepool)19:39
clarkbsince a common request is for people to get our images and that allows us to fairly easily check if that has an impact on the service without impacting the service19:39
jeblairwe'll be deploying this and running it on a new host19:39
fungiamusing abbrev.19:40
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fungiohai! is't a pabelanger19:40
jeblairand i intend to keep running the separate builder on that after it's in prod19:40
jeblairclarkb: and i think that will work out well with your idea of serving images19:40
jeblairwe can use a longer name if folks want; pabelanger seemed to prefer the shorter one :)19:40
fungiwe have zm and zl, so whatev.19:41
jeblair"nib" would also be a good option ;)19:41
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jeblairtoo bad no one is here to advocate for that one.  :(19:41
jeblairi guess we'll go with nb19:41
fungiit's one of my favorite black sabbath songs19:42
fungiif that counts19:42
jeblairfungi: for something, yes19:42
fungigiven n and d are adjacent on a qwerty layout, i can see some finger memory confusion between nib and dib19:42
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jeblairanyway, unless there are any concerns... i guess that's about it for this?19:43
fungioh, wait, they're not ;)19:43
ianwi guess builder01.nodepool.openstack.org would be a pita19:43
clarkbjeblair: oh! yes one last thing, I would recommend an ssd volume19:43
jeblairclarkb: oh, interesting...19:43
clarkbI think I went with not ssd when I expanded the volume and I think that may be related to some of the slowness in building19:44
fungii wouldn't mind creative use of subdomains (we already do it for infra-cloud), but i'm not here to bikeshed on naming things19:44
pabelanger+1 for ssd19:44
clarkbjeblair: dib is very io bound so ya19:44
fungiright, we had it on sata, then switched to ssd for a while but didn't see much improvement at the time, then switched back to sata and since then have added a lot more elements/images19:45
fungiso worth trying again19:45
jeblairhrm, i'm actually a little surprised by that19:46
jeblairlooks like we have 1T of space for that19:46
fungiwhat's the max ssd volume size we can set up?19:47
jeblairso we're saying we want 1T of ssd space?19:47
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clarkbjeblair: yes I think so (we have been getting closer to that 1TB too)19:47
fungimaybe time to revisit adding a control plane server in vexhost (they claim high-performance ceph backend)19:47
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clarkba big issue is we end up with at least 3 copies of a 20GB image during building in order to do conversions and such19:48
jeblaircacti says we push 15MBps and 3000iops19:48
clarkbso we need a fair bit of breathing room just to do a build19:48
fungiwe did say we should consider them first for i/o-bound uses19:48
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jeblairthe 3k iops is a shorter peak19:48
pabelangerfungi: Ya, would be interesting to test19:48
fungido we need to cover anything else on the push to production for this?19:51
jeblairi'd like to make sure we really want the 1tb ssd volume19:51
fungiyep, i'm with you on that19:51
fungii'm not even sure rackspace will let us make one, so we'd need to spread an lv over several if not19:52
clarkbI think not ssd will continue to work19:52
jeblairwhat kind of time difference are we talking about here?19:52
clarkbjeblair: currently builds run from 1100UTC to ~1700 UTC iirc19:52
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fungibut if the question is what kind of speedup should we expect, i don't think we know19:53
funginot even ballpark19:53
pabelangermaybe we should consider doing a benchmark between the 2 options?19:53
clarkbI expect we can trim an hour or so off with an ssd (but I haven't tested that on rax just based on my local io performance)19:53
fungiplaying with rackspace, looks like the sata volume size range is 75-1024gb and ssd is 50-1024gb so i guess it's possible without splitting19:54
fungii think they used to limit ssd to 300 or something, but have apparently upped it if so19:55
jeblairyeah, it's about 4x as expensive, so i hesitate to ask unless we need it19:55
jeblairwe can also have more than one builder19:55
fungishort-term benchmarking seems like a reasonable compromise if someone has the time and interest to do it19:55
jeblair(that's less than 2x as expensive :)19:55
fungialso, yes, that19:56
mordredyay for conversions19:56
jeblair(more than one builder means more than one uploader too)19:56
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pabelanger2 builders would be interested to test too19:56
pabelangermore uploaders is awesome aswell19:56
mordredalthough it also means less re-use of cache - but if it's taking us 6 hours to build an image, I'm guessing somehting is going poorly with caching anyway19:56
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fungiwe're about out of time. i'm going to move to open discussion for the last few minutes but we can keep talking about this too19:57
jeblairmordred: 6 hours to build all the images19:57
mordredjeblair: yah19:57
mordredsorry - that's what I meant19:57
fungi#topic Open discussion19:57
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)"19:57
jeblairi think i'd like to start with sata, and switch if someone does a benchmark that suggests we'd get a noticable improvement19:57
fungiso anyway, let's plan to deploy on sata and someone who wants to can test ssd for comparison19:57
fungiyeah, that19:57
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jeblair(or possibly just add an 02 if we feel like it)19:58
mordredjeblair: wfm19:58
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EmilienMpabelanger: can we work on gem mirror anytime soon? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/253616/19:58
jeblairfungi: you convinced me19:58
clarkbmordred: the problem is mostly how much data we write19:58
fungiit's reasonably trivial to switch back and forth between sata and ssd too, we just lose the warm cache unless we bother to rsync them19:58
clarkbmordred: so cache works fine but then we spend 20 minutes doing an image copy19:58
clarkbthen we make several images copies19:58
clarkbadds up19:58
EmilienMpabelanger: it's not high prio, so we can postpone it again19:58
EmilienMpabelanger: I tried to build a local gem mirror at home, it took me 500 GB to download (and my ISP to block my account in the meantime) - we might need some space20:00
fungiwe're out of time--thanks everyone!20:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"20:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 20:00:12 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)20:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-22-19.02.html20:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-22-19.02.txt20:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-22-19.02.log.html20:00
dhellmannhi, folks20:00
fungitake it away, dhellmann!20:00
dhellmannwho’s here for the TC Meeting?20:00
dhellmanncourtesy ping: dims, dtroyer, emilienm, flaper87, fungi, johnthetubaguy, mtreinish, thingee, mordred, sdague, stevemar, ttx20:00
dhellmannthanks, fungi20:00
fungittx: sends his regrets20:00
fungisays he's confirmed he'll be busy conferencing20:00
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EmilienMflaper87 too iirc20:01
dhellmannI cound 7, let's give it another minute20:01
dhellmannactually, 7 is quorum, so let's go ahead20:01
dhellmann#startmeeting tc20:01
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openstackMeeting started Tue Nov 22 20:01:43 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is dhellmann. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.20:01
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openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)"20:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tc'20:01
dhellmann(remember to use #info #idea and #link liberally to make for a more readable summary)20:01
dhellmann#info ttx is on the road this week and asked dhellmann to act as chair for today20:01
dhellmann#link our agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee20:01
dhellmann#topic Rearrange presentation of Principles20:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Rearrange presentation of Principles (Meeting topic: tc)"20:02
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/39478620:02
dhellmannThis one is a pretty straightforward change of the order of the principles list.20:02
dhellmannThere were some wording changes in an earlier draft, but those were moved to a follow-up (which we will discuss next).20:02
dhellmannDoes anyone have any comments to raise?20:02
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dhellmannI think everyone present has voted +1 already20:02
johnthetubaguyno concerns here20:03
dimsdhellmann : +120:03
fungii hadn't, but have now. was waiting to see some other comments addressed last week20:03
dhellmannI don't have approval rights, so we'll just cast votes today and let ttx approve when he's back online20:03
dhellmannah, sorry, fungi & dims, I missed that you hadn't voted20:03
dhellmannlet's move on then if there's no discussion20:03
dhellmann#topic Prefer voluntary participation20:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Prefer voluntary participation (Meeting topic: tc)"20:04
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/39854020:04
dhellmannThis patch updates the “Participation is Voluntary” principle to try to improve on how it states the original spirit.20:04
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dhellmannthere's some additional discussion of even more alternate wording suggestion20:04
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dhellmannjohnthetubaguy : were you suggesting that the other change you link (which we'll discuss next) should be taken instead of or in addition to this one?20:05
johnthetubaguyI was unclear, sorry20:05
dhellmannI may also just be undercaffeinated20:06
johnthetubaguyI meant the next change fixes ending on a positive note20:06
johnthetubaguybut I also like improving the current wording20:06
dtroyerendign the document… in my comment I was referring to ending the paragraph (in re Eoghan's suggested alternative)20:06
dhellmanndtroyer : yes, that makes sense.20:07
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dhellmannit seems like we think this is an improvement, even though it could be improved further20:07
johnthetubaguyoops, yeah the document20:07
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fungieverything could always be improved further20:07
* mordred is perfect the way he is20:08
fungiincremental improvement is fine20:08
* fungi incrementally improves mordred20:08
mordredooh. tingly!20:08
dhellmannyes, I agree with incremental changes, though I'd like to not have an update to this paragraph every week :-)20:08
dhellmannright, then, moving on to the next one20:08
dhellmann#topic We value clear, friendly and open communication20:08
*** openstack changes topic to "We value clear, friendly and open communication (Meeting topic: tc)"20:08
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dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/36559020:08
dhellmannthis is flaper87's but since he's not here,  I'll try to introduce it20:08
dhellmannThis change is an updated version of the proposal adding “assume good faith” and focuses more on the reason and on the goal of clear communication than on trying to tell people what assumptions to make.20:09
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dhellmannI think that makes it more of a principle and less of a CoC-esque instruction20:09
dtroyerI am good with it as-is20:10
fungiyeah, this version is great20:10
johnthetubaguyI like what we are trying to say here, and this feels like a good way to say it20:10
johnthetubaguyi.e. +120:10
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dhellmannI was going to say we might want to move it up earlier in the list, but johnthetubaguy's point about this ending on a positive note is good, too20:11
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sigmavirusYeah, this is better written than the last iteration20:11
fungiyeah, i hadn't thought about that, but is a great point20:11
sigmavirusIt also more clearly communicates what I understood Flavio's point to be20:11
mordredI like that we say we value people who are not native english speakers20:11
dhellmannmordred : ++20:11
fungii like that we say we value people, period ;)20:11
EmilienMmordred: even frenchies?20:11
dhellmannfungi : ++20:12
dhellmannEmilienM : especially!20:12
lbragstadmordred ++20:12
mordredEmilienM: I didn't say _all_ non-native english speakers :)20:12
dhellmannwe should move on before EmilienM throws a baguette at mordred20:12
EmilienMnext tc meeting is in french20:12
* mordred eyes EmilienM and ttx with skeptical eyes20:12
dhellmannwe were doing so well with the agreement...20:12
sigmavirusEmilienM: only if you can tolerate my terrible Google Translations ;)20:12
EmilienMsigmavirus: welcome to my life20:12
dhellmannalright, le moving on20:12
dhellmann#topic Update Python CTI for 3.520:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Update Python CTI for 3.5 (Meeting topic: tc)"20:12
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/39750120:13
dhellmannfungi, do you want to introduce this one?20:13
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fungiin short, with the move to ubuntu xenial for stable/newton and later, we no longer have python 3.4 available on our worker images20:13
fungi3.5 is what comes standard20:13
fungiso this is just a simple patch to update the ctg to that effect20:14
dhellmannthat all seems very straightforward, and it's a good idea for our policies to reflect our reality20:14
fungiwe could, alternatively, not specify a specific py3k version, to avoid future churn20:14
fungibut this was the more trivial option20:14
dhellmannI get the question quite a lot, so I like writing it down, but it doesn't have to be here20:14
dtroyerevery 2 years isn't too much load20:14
EmilienMfungi: can we just specify "latest version" or something more generic?20:15
fungii'm open to that as well20:15
dhellmannEmilienM : 3.6 is due out soon (it's in beta now), but it won't be in distros for a bit20:15
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dhellmannso I think being specific removes confusion20:15
fungithough that mighth confuse people into thinking they should be going out of their way to test 3.6 on ubuntu lts that lacks it, yeah20:15
EmilienMyeah, until it lands in ubuntu/redhat it might takes a while. So hardcoding it makes sense20:15
EmilienMas he requires manual verification to see if it's in distro20:16
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mordredwe're going to get to python 3.7 before 2.7 is fully dead aren't we?20:16
dhellmannthat seems likely20:16
* mordred hangs his head20:16
fungianyway, the patch seems to have support, so i'm cool moving on unless there are any questions20:17
* dhellmann makes a note to update the python 3 goal for pike20:17
dhellmannI agree20:17
dhellmann#topic Acknowledge nominal prerequisites for tests20:17
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/39750220:17
dhellmannfungi, this one is yours, too20:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Acknowledge nominal prerequisites for tests (Meeting topic: tc)"20:17
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fungithis one's a little less straightforward20:17
fungiit came up when i was helping work through some swift testing needs20:17
fungiapparently their extended attribute support depends on using xfs20:18
fungiand to avoid lots of mocking out the fs, they want to have an xfs partition available when running unit tests20:18
dhellmannthat seems reasonable -- I'd expect them to need it for functional tests anyway20:18
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fungiin reflection, we already make similar concessions for projects needing, e.g., particular databases preconfigured20:19
fungito run unit testing20:19
johnthetubaguyseems fair to be pragmatic about that kind of thing20:19
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dhellmannyes, I don't see any real issue with this20:20
fungiso in an effort to stem future questions about non-straightforward unit test prerequisites, i thought it would be a good idea to acknowledge them in the ctg and advise that they be clearly documented20:20
dhellmannbeing flexible is good20:20
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johnthetubaguyI like the clearly documented part, seems a good prompt to do the right thing20:20
dhellmannthe documentation requirement is a good idea20:20
fungiwe (infra0 have some ideas as to how to make these similar for teams to document and integrate with our test infrastructure in a more consistent manner in the future, but i'll let the people working on that plan introduce it on the ml once they're ready20:21
fungier, s/similar/easier./20:21
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dhellmannI think I saw a post from ajaeger about a setup script that some jobs would look for20:21
fungiit'l be compatible with this phrasing in the ctg at a minimum, anyway20:21
johnthetubaguygood call20:22
fungiyeah, that's what i was referring to, so i guess he's sent that in the past few minutes20:22
dhellmann#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/107784.html20:22
dhellmannany questions about this, or shall we move on?20:22
fungiwe've done similar things to simplify system package setup for tests in a way that's consistent between developer experience and ci system, so that's the goal20:22
fungiand yeah, nothing else from me on this20:23
dhellmannthe next topic may involve a bit more discussion, so let's move on and we can come back if there are questions20:23
dhellmann#topic Review of Ocata goal acknowledgements20:23
dhellmann(a bit of an info dump coming)20:23
*** openstack changes topic to "Review of Ocata goal acknowledgements (Meeting topic: tc)"20:23
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dhellmannPart of the goal process is for us to look through the acknowledgement responses.20:23
dhellmannThe deadline set was the first milestone, which was last week.20:23
dhellmannResponses that have been reviewed and approved are on the goal document:20:24
dhellmann#link http://governance.openstack.org/goals/ocata/remove-incubated-oslo-code.html20:24
dhellmannThere are still some waiting to merge under the house rules:20:24
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/project:openstack/governance+topic:+goal-remove-incubated-oslo-code+is:open20:24
dims#link note from Andreas - http://markmail.org/message/akl7bkq2xuyr33dw20:24
dhellmannAnd we have some projects that have not yet acknowledged the goal20:24
dhellmann#info 17 of 57 teams have not yet acknowledged the community goal20:24
dhellmann#info those teams are Community App Catalog, I18n, OpenStack Charms, OpenStack UX, OpenStackSalt,20:24
dhellmann#info Packaging-deb, Packaging-rpm, Quality Assurance, RefStack, Stable Branch Maintenance,20:24
dhellmann#info dragonflow, fuel, karbor, kuryr, magnum, tacker, watcher20:24
dhellmannThe overall response rate is a little disappointing, but some of the projects on this list aren’t surprising since several are much less active this cycle than in the past.20:24
dhellmann#info 17 projects had work to do to complete the goal20:24
dhellmann#info 1 team with work to do (as listed in the goal) has not yet responded: karbor (formerly smaug)20:24
dhellmannThat response rate is better, but I’d like to get to 100%.20:24
dhellmannI have contacted the PTLs of all teams who did not respond to prompt them to do so.20:24
dhellmannDoes anyone have any comments on the process or our status so far?20:25
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dimsdhellmann : how many teams had not responded?20:25
mordreddhellmann: so - some of tehose projects are ones that removing oslo incubator code doesn't make sense for20:25
dhellmann17 did not respond, but only 1 of those had work to do20:25
dhellmannmordred : yes, that's true. However, the process is that all teams acknowledge all goals.20:26
dhellmannbecause this is about communication20:26
fungiwanted to personally thank dhellmann for proposing the patches to fix this in storyboard and python-storyboardclient (infra's only matches). 3 of 4 changes for that have merged now, the last one just needs some reviewing20:26
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dhellmannfungi : I'm glad to help. I know the storyboard team is stretched thin with other work, and that provided a good example patch for some other projects.20:27
gordcdhellmann: i'll try mentioning above to karbor/dragonflow/kuryr. hopefully they look at internal mail more frequently.20:27
dhellmannI should thank those of you who have helped review the acknowledgements, too. Esp. stevemar20:27
dhellmanngordc : thanks, that would help. Yesterday I emailed all of the PTLs for the projects that haven't responded.20:28
fungione case for the current process where all teams need to ack a goal is that it's always _possible_ something got overlooked in assessing whether they are or aren't impacted20:28
fungiso it gives them the ability to confirm/deny20:28
dhellmannfungi : exactly. I don't want the TC to make assumptions about impact on teams one way or another.20:28
dhellmannthe next step in the process is for teams to do the work to meet the goal. Quite a few are done already, or have patches in progress.20:29
fungii can even see it not being within the tc's direct purview to put together lists of who's impacted (though perhaps it falls under expectations for whoever proposes the goal)20:29
dhellmannyeah, when the goals were originally proposed one piece of feedback was that we should try to provide *some* insight into expected impact20:30
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dhellmannfor this goal I included a list of the official repos that had incubated code remaining20:30
dhellmannfor python 3, haypo has done a lot of good analysis so the document summarizes that and refers to the wiki page for more detail20:31
dhellmannif there are no other comments or questions, I think we can call the review done20:31
johnthetubaguyI am happy its causing the right discussions to happen20:32
dhellmannI would appreciate some help tracking down the PTLs for teams who haven't responded, yet, so if you have some time to assist please let me know20:32
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dhellmannjohnthetubaguy : ++20:32
johnthetubaguydhellmann: I can take magnum as a start20:32
dhellmannjohnthetubaguy : thanks20:32
dtroyerdhellmann: I just posted https://review.openstack.org/400954 for the UX team20:33
dhellmanndtroyer : thanks20:33
fungii'll get up with Community App Catalog20:33
dhellmannfungi : thanks20:33
EmilienMdhellmann: i'll take some time too20:34
dhellmannEmilienM : great, thanks, just pick from the list and let me know20:34
EmilienMdhellmann: get in touch with PTLs who haven't responded yet20:34
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dhellmannsome of the teams look fairly inactive, so we may want to review those project teams in a more general way20:35
dhellmannbut that can wait20:35
* johnthetubaguy nods20:35
dhellmannalright, let's talk about Octavia then20:36
dhellmann#topic Add project Octavia to OpenStack big-tent (initial discussion)20:36
*** openstack changes topic to "Add project Octavia to OpenStack big-tent (initial discussion) (Meeting topic: tc)"20:36
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/31305620:36
dhellmannlast week we approved the change to move several neutron projects to the legacy list20:36
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/39201020:36
dhellmannthis new patch moves some of the lbaas repositories to a new team, which is already maintaining the Octavia project20:36
dhellmannfollowing our usual practice, we’ll spend more than one meeting discussing adding a new team referring to the list of requirements20:36
dhellmann#link http://governance.openstack.org/reference/new-projects-requirements.html20:36
dhellmanndougwig, are you here today?20:36
* dhellmann should have pinged him before the meeting20:37
johnsomI am here20:37
dhellmannah, johnsom, great20:37
dougwigOn pto, but my phone just buzzed. :)20:37
dhellmanndougwig : I think we have it covered, go back to PTO :-)20:37
dhellmannjohnsom: maybe you can start the discussion by introducing the scope of Octavia, how it relates to Neutron, and giving a little of the background behind this change?20:37
johnsomSure, currently Octavia is an open source reference driver for neutron-lbaas.20:38
johnsomIt was build with the expectation that we could dis-entangle the neutron-lbaas code from neutron proper and accomplish our goals via the API.20:39
dhellmannthat's a separate API from neutron's?20:39
johnsomWe started discussions about this at the Paris summit.20:39
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dougwigCore teams between neutron-lbaas and Octavia are the same, and do not overlap neutron except myself and armax.20:40
johnsomToday Octavia has it's own API process, but it is consumed by neutron-lbaas.  We are currently working to move the API component of neutron-lbaas out of neutron and implementing it in the Octavia API process.20:40
dhellmannthe specs linked from this patch have some implementation details20:40
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/310805/3/specs/newton/kill-neutron-lbaas.rst20:40
dhellmann#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/310667/3/specs/version1/n-lbaas-api-parity.rst20:40
dougwigOctavia is a separate API server, and closely mimics neutron lbaas v2. Part of this split is making them exact, and including a proxy in neutronnso users are not affected.20:41
johnsomThis "lbaas-merge" work started in newton20:41
EmilienMjohnsom: how backward compatibility will be ensured between neutron & octavia if you move it out?20:41
dhellmanndougwig : how long do you anticipate maintaining that proxy? a standard deprecation period, or longer?20:41
dougwigAPI tests still run against neutron server, will also run against Octavia and the future proxy.20:42
johnsomEmilienM via the proxy that will remain in neutron for some time.  Our plan is to allow a simple endpoint change and the API will be the same.20:42
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johnthetubaguyto me, it seems Octavia have basically been operating as a separate (but co-operating) team for a bit now, it seems right to update the projects file to reflect that20:42
EmilienMjohnsom: excellent from operator point of view, ++20:42
dougwigMy intention was to maintain it longer than 2 cycles if it's not a maintenance burden.20:42
dhellmannjohnthetubaguy : that's the impression I'm getting, too20:42
* fungi notes dougwig is setting a bad example for how to do pto20:42
dougwigI've always been bad at pto20:42
dougwigjohnthetubaguy: correct.20:43
EmilienMjohnthetubaguy: +120:43
dhellmannas a release manager, I’m a little concerned about the timing, since we’re past the first milestone for this cycle. Though Octavia uses the cycle-with-intermediary model so it isn’t technically “late” for any releases.20:44
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dhellmannI also don't think that's a reason to hold up progress20:44
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dhellmannreviewing the list of criteria for new projects, I'm not spotting any obvious issues with how Octavia is developed or being integrated20:46
dhellmanndoes anyone have any concerns to raise this week, assuming we'll have another discussion about this application next week?20:46
dhellmannjohnsom : does Octavia need to remove any incubated oslo code?20:46
johnsomNo, we have completed that20:47
dhellmannok, good20:47
johnthetubaguyI guess that is technically already reported in the neutron report?20:47
johnsomWe didn't push a patch because currently we fall under neutron.20:47
dtroyerWhat is Octavia's py3 status?20:47
dhellmannah, right20:47
dhellmanndtroyer : good question20:47
johnsomdtroyer we support 3.4 and 3.5 with gates20:48
dhellmanngood answer :-)20:48
johnsomWe try to "do the right thing"...  grin20:48
dimsjohnsom dougwig : any trademark concerns? (would octavia have to be renamed?)20:48
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dimss/would/that would/20:49
dougwigNo, Stephen trademarked Octavia for openstack20:49
dimscool thanks dougwig20:49
johnsomThere is a trademark already and I was told it was already transferred to the foundation20:49
fungii see you have two repos under neutron's octavia deliverable right now, but would be splitting them into separate deliverables under the new team. any concerns there?20:49
johnthetubaguyis that the dashboard split out bit?20:50
EmilienMjohnsom: I remember octavia had a specific parameter for oslo_messaging/topic (not part of oslo_messaging iiuc). Is it still the case?20:50
johnsomCurrently there are three repositories: neutron-lbaas, octavia, and neutron-lbaas-dashboard.20:50
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dhellmannyeah, it looks like one repo per deliverable now. From the release team's perspective I think that's fine. If we run into issues with our release tooling, we can work through it.20:50
fungithe tags seem to have conveyed consistently in the split of openstack/octavia and openstack/neutron-lbaas-dashboard into separate deliverables, yeah20:50
EmilienMjohnsom: random question, because I tested octavia, with the puppet-octavia module we wrote a few months ago :)20:51
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johnsomEmilienM Yes, there is a messaging topic used inside Octavia via oslo messaging.20:52
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johnsomIt is used between our API process and the controller-worker process20:52
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fungioh, though i notice the openstack/neutron-lbaas-dashboard repo belongs to a octavia-dashboard deliverable now. is there an expectation that the repo will get renamed to that in the future?20:52
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dimsseeing all these questions...they don't feel like show stoppers :) so johnsom and dougwig have my support for doing this20:53
johnsomYes, I think to limit future confusion we will want to rename away from "neutron"20:53
dhellmannfungi : good question. I think we can change the deliverable name in the repo without renaming the repo, right?20:53
johnthetubaguydims: +120:53
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dhellmannthat would give us time to schedule a repo rename when it's convenient20:53
dougwigRename would be cleaner, but we are open.20:53
dhellmanndims : +120:53
dhellmanndougwig : oh, a rename is fine, it's just a matter of not holding up releases or other work until that's done20:53
EmilienMdims: same thing. +1 to have it in the big tent20:54
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dougwigNot urgent for pacts, I'd think20:54
fungiyeah, the deliverable name is arbitrary, i was mostly just curious if there was a repo rename in the future20:54
dougwigOcata.  Autocorrect.20:54
dougwigfungi: likely yes.20:54
* dhellmann was wondering20:54
dhellmannalright, as I said, I expect ttx to put this on the agenda again for next week for final discussion and voting20:55
* mordred thinks pacts is now the secret codename for ocata20:55
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dhellmannso far I'm not seeing any real issues, but we're not running with the full tc for this meeting so keep an eye on review comments20:55
dhellmannand we have a few minutes left for20:55
dhellmann#topic Open discussion20:55
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: tc)"20:55
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mordredI'd like to say thanks to the octavia team for sticking with it through _several_ organizational approach shifts20:56
mordredthat's some good patience20:56
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* johnthetubaguy nods20:56
dougwigWe'll be rewriting in go soon.20:57
mordredthank god20:57
* dougwig hides20:57
johnthetubaguydougwig: heh20:57
* fungi wondered when that was coming ;)20:57
mordredI was worried it was going to be too easy for you20:57
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* johnsom notes that dougwig does not speak for the whole Octavia team.20:57
dhellmanndougwig : comments like that are why we have 2 discussions for most of these applications ;-)20:57
dougwigjohnsom: oh, traitor !20:57
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dougwigJk, of course.20:58
dhellmannwith that I think we're finished for today20:58
dhellmannthank you, everyone!20:58
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dimsnice work dhellmann !20:58
EmilienMdhellmann: thx for chairing today, next time in french like we said20:59
dhellmannEmilienM : ++20:59
fungithanks dhellmann!20:59
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EmilienMdougwig: enjoy vacations now!20:59
johnthetubaguymerci buckets20:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"21:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Nov 22 21:00:03 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)21:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-22-20.01.html21:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-22-20.01.txt21:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-22-20.01.log.html21:00
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johnthetubaguy... thats the British school system french for you21:00
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dhellmannjohnthetubaguy : we got that here in the southern us, too21:01
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