Friday, 2018-09-21

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ekcs#startmeeting congressteammeeting02:35
openstackMeeting started Fri Sep 21 02:35:31 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is ekcs. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.02:35
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akhil_jainekcs: Hi!02:36
ekcshi akhil_jain !02:36
ekcsbeen a while. how’s it been?02:36
akhil_jainNothing much, how was PTG?02:37
ekcsit went well!02:37
ekcstoday’s topics here as usual:
ekcsfeel free to add your topics if any.02:38
ekcsptg went pretty well. there wasn’t a dedicated congress session. but the self-healing SIG sessions were quite relevant.02:42
ekcslot’s of productive discussion over how to get more and better ops feedback on self-healing work, including congress.02:43
ekcslooking to work more closely with ops meetup team.02:43
ekcsI also floated a sketch of a new architecture for congress centered around an off-the-shelf document store rather than a integrated policy engine. quite helpful feedback.02:44
ekcsmore information on the session here:
ekcsthe separate ops sessions were also useful for general understanding of the problems and use cases that are high priority.02:45
ekcsany comments or questions on PTG?02:47
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ekcsok moving on then.02:49
ekcs#topic monasca webhook02:50
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ekcsakhil_jain: is there anything you’d like to discuss on that front?02:50
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akhil_jainekcs: as disccused earlier. My team members working in tacker are busy in PTG today, hopefully next week, they will be here in weekly irc meeting to give us briefing on whole usecase02:52
ekcsakhil_jain: got it sounds great =) just wanted to ask in case you need time to discuss anything.02:54
akhil_jainAlso I will push tacker driver with WIP soon02:55
ekcsok moving on then.02:55
ekcs#topic meeting time02:55
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ekcsI haven’t had a chance to email the ML. but I will today.02:56
ekcsafter talking to akhil_jain and masahito, I thikn i’m going to propose Friday02:57
ekcs1.5 hours later than current time.02:57
ekcsonce every two weeks.02:57
ekcssee if we get any additional feedback on ML (probbaly not). then if no objections I’ll announce new time.02:59
ekcsand update meeting registry.02:59
ekcsany thoughts or comments for now?02:59
akhil_jainnot from my side03:00
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ekcsok! i don’t see any other topics on the etherpad. shall we call it for today?03:01
akhil_jainyes, sure03:01
ekcsalrite have a great weekend!03:02
akhil_jainthank you and to you too03:02
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openstackMeeting ended Fri Sep 21 03:02:49 2018 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)03:02
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smcginnis#startmeeting releaseteam15:00
openstackMeeting started Fri Sep 21 15:00:06 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is smcginnis. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:00
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smcginnisPing dhellmann, ttx, annabelleB15:00
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smcginnisWow, everyone is punctual today.15:00
smcginnis#link Agenda15:00
smcginnisLine 3115:01
smcginnis#topic Backlog discussion from the PTG15:01
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smcginnis#link!/project_group/73 Backlog15:01
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smcginnisWe started going through ^ at the PTG but ran out of time.15:01
ttxor steam15:01
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ttxchoo choo15:02
smcginnisA little of both.15:02
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smcginnisDid we leave off on stable deliverables or external releases?15:02
evrardjpcan we take elements on that storyboard freely?15:02
* fungi was not punctual :(15:02
smcginnisfungi: Close enough. ;)15:02
ttxsmcginnis: we stopped at stable15:03
smcginnisevrardjp: If there is anything on there you would like to work on, feel free to grab it.15:03
ttxjudging by lastupdated date15:03
* smcginnis notes ttx is much more observant today than himself15:03
ttxTrack externally-released deliverables is still on my lap15:04
smcginnis#link!/story/2002624 Track externally-released deliverables15:04
ttxI have a plan15:04
smcginnisOK, anything you need input on? Or shall we move on?15:04
ttxnope alls et15:04
smcginnis#link!/story/2001936 Reno traceback when no release between 2 tags15:05
ttxwill comment so that it's updated15:05
smcginnisttx: Thanks15:05
smcginnisdhellmann: Is the reno issue something you have any chance to look at?15:05
dhellmannI haven't. It looks like I asked a question with no response.15:06
smcginnisAh, see that now.15:06
dhellmannI suspect there's an issue using --earliest-version and --version together15:06
dhellmannthat first option isn't needed if the second is used15:06
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dhellmannmaybe the fix is to make those mutually exclusive15:06
smcginnisSo keep around as a low priority thing to checkout out some day?15:07
evrardjpdhellmann: +115:07
evrardjpsmcginnis: agreed too15:07
smcginnis#link!/story/2001935 cache file needs to contain all branches15:07
smcginnisAnother reno one.15:07
dhellmannthat's in process and also a low priority15:08
dhellmannthat has to do with building the cache file for release notes for a package15:08
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smcginnisPatch up for it too, just with some issues yet.15:08
smcginnisSo in the works at least.15:08
smcginnis#link!/story/2001921 enhance version check for xstatic packages15:08
smcginnisWe had some issues in our validation for these.15:09
dhellmannthat's done15:09
dhellmannI added the details to the story15:09
smcginnisOK, I was thinking this was something already addressed.15:09
smcginnisLast one...15:09
dhellmannyou fixed it :-(15:10
dhellmannI mean :-)15:10
* elbragstad walks in late15:10
smcginnis#link!/story/2001881 Create a new-deliverable command15:10
smcginnisSeems like another low priority one.15:10
dhellmannwe've been doing OK with creating the stub files by copying existing ones for now15:10
smcginnisSince these are fairly infrequent and easy enough to do through the time honored copy/paste method.15:10
ttxit's not the last one, here comes page 215:10
dhellmannyeah, I see 35 open items on my list15:11
smcginnisI need to get used to the SB layout. Was expecting something on the bottom of the list to indicate more.15:11
* ttx clicks to see all 35 in one list15:11
dhellmannadd information about ptls and liaisions to the releases repo15:11
fungismcginnis: sounds like a good storyboard feature request15:11
smcginnisfungi: Not going to say I can implement it? :)15:12
armstrongHave we fully switched to storyboard?15:12
evrardjpI don't understand this one15:12
ttxdhellmann: I think that should be rolled together with the "manifest" idea15:12
evrardjpwhat's the goal?15:12
smcginnisarmstrong: For the releases repo we have. Not all projects though.15:12
dhellmannttx: yeah, I think the stuff we talked about at the ptg replaces this15:12
ttxevrardjp: basically have a log of who was handling that release ?15:12
smcginnisevrardjp: Yeah, I added this, but now I can't recall the full context.15:12
fungismcginnis: you can certainly add a story to openstack-infra/storyboard-webclient requesting it though15:12
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fungiso we don't forget15:13
dhellmannI'm going to close this story as obsolete15:13
dhellmanndo we have another one for the mainfest thing?15:13
ttxalthough we did not create a story to track the master plan yet15:13
smcginnisDon't we need something similar for the changes we were dicussing in Denver?15:13
dhellmannso maybe we should rewrite this one15:13
evrardjpyeah because without the "master" plan, this is very obfuscated :p15:14
ttxthe creation date would be misleading15:14
dhellmannso I'll close this one and someone will open another?15:14
ttxyes, I'll create the new one15:15
smcginnisSame basic concept though, just evolved over time. Not sure if the creation date would be an issue.15:15
smcginnisEither way works.15:15
ttxwhile you go down the list15:15
smcginnis#link!/story/2001848 New project checklist15:15
smcginnisI'll keep this one. There have been enough things pop up here and there for things that would be good to capture in something like this.15:15
dhellmannI think we still need this15:15
smcginnis#link!/story/2001846 Add verify library to process15:16
dhellmannafter the ptg this one also feels obsolete15:16
smcginnisNot sure if this one is really an issue anymore15:16
dhellmannthis one does mention automatically tagging so we could reuse it15:16
smcginnisSure, let's hold on to this a bit yet.15:17
smcginnis#link!/story/2001845 Document policy on adding new deliverables to existing series15:17
smcginnisIIRC, the idea here was they can add to independent but not the series since these weren't actually a part of it at the time?15:18
evrardjpwe kinda had that in OSA when a repo was renamed15:18
smcginnisRenames I think are fine. It's when something unofficial becomes official and they want to add pre-official releases I think.15:19
evrardjpso it's better be precise in the scope we are talking about here?15:19
smcginnisI'll add some notes so we remember. We should keep this one.15:19
ttxStein release process evolution15:20
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ttxLast task is actually one of the first to do... I miss task ordering!15:21
smcginnis#link!/story/2001806 Support StoryBoard in release tooling15:22
fungistill on my to do list for sure, but if someone else is eager to do it instead i'm happy to hand it over15:22
smcginnisThis one is actually to do with updating statuses.15:22
ttxthat one has been on my plate forever15:22
ttxStill planning to do it if I ever manage to free up enough time15:22
smcginnisAnd doesn't seem like something we can break down into smaller steps to farm out.15:22
smcginnisImportant to get to eventually.15:22
ttxit's a bit hard, due to the learning curve15:23
ttxso I would definitely keep it15:23
ttxwill comment15:23
smcginnis#link!/story/2001802 Add commmand to setup for travis environment15:23
fungii _think_ it's just a matter of importing python-storyboardclient and then mimicking what we do for lp15:23
smcginnisAnother reno enhancement.15:23
fungi(wrt 2001806)15:23
dhellmannyeah, very low priority15:23
ttxoh, it;s assigned to you now! I know why I did not do it now15:23
smcginnisSure, that's why. ;)15:24
dhellmannthat would be used by folks outside of the openstack community15:24
* dhellmann makes a note of ttx's task management approach15:24
smcginnisUseful for travis users for sure.15:24
smcginnis#link!/story/2001738 Support multiple --series arguments in list-deliverables15:25
smcginnisSeems like a low priority but useful thing too.15:25
smcginnisNo reason the command can't be run multiple times though.15:25
smcginnisAny thoughts on this one?15:25
dhellmannseems like a good opportunity for someone to learn that code15:26
ttxlet's keep it in case people look for easy ways in15:26
dhellmannand a very low priority15:26
smcginnis*cough* evrardjp *cough*15:26
ttxtagging low-hanging-fruit maybe ?15:26
smcginnis#link!/story/2001692 Generate update emails for unreleased changes15:27
evrardjpsmcginnis: :)15:27
smcginnisThis one looks useful too.15:28
smcginnisNothing critical by any means, but I think it would help raise awareness for teams of stable stuff sitting out there.15:28
dhellmannmaybe we can get elod to help out there15:28
smcginnisYeah, another good task to dig into things.15:28
smcginnisNot really a low-hanging-fruit though with some of the complexity of some of the steps involved.15:29
smcginnisBut not too difficult either.15:29
smcginnisdhellmann: Leave it assigned to you for now?15:29
dhellmannI removed my name, but can pick it up if we need it done15:29
dhellmannthe scripting is 90% done, so it's just the job and email sending that might be a challenge15:29
smcginnisOK, works for me.15:30
smcginnis#link!/story/2001690 Support release announcement emails to other mailing lists15:30
smcginnisStill needed?15:30
smcginnisLooks like maybe needs some input from fungi too.15:31
ttxlow prio but yes I would say15:31
dhellmannthat was a thing I wanted for stevedore and some other libs15:31
dhellmannI think it's useful, but low priority15:31
evrardjpsecrets are well documented on zuul ci docs nowadays15:31
smcginnisYeah, for reno, cliff, stevedore, etc, could be really useful.15:31
smcginnis#link!/story/2001689 Ability to list a version on releases.o.o wihtout linking to artifact15:32
evrardjpsmcginnis: what's the limit? Which libs will be announced or not?15:32
fungiwhy were we thinking we needed to authenticate smtp from those?15:32
ttxI think we need that one15:32
smcginnisevrardjp: I think just as needed when we find a deliverable that would be useful to announce to other communities.15:32
fungiwe send to the release-announce list from job nodes currently without issue15:33
dhellmannfungi : because we would be sending email to lists not on
dhellmannmaybe that's not really an issue then?15:33
fungiahh, got it15:33
smcginnisfungi: Any issues sending to a ML on or something like that?15:33
fungiyeah, i have a feeling this is more a story about setting up an authenticated smarthost for jobs to send e-mail through15:33
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fungimaybe we should only build that when we discover we need it15:34
fungii'll add a comment now15:34
smcginnisfungi: Thanks15:34
smcginnisFor listing on releases.o.o, looks like that was closed at one point.15:35
smcginnisDo we still want to get that?15:35
smcginnisI don't think it's really been an issue.15:35
fungiit does say "should the need arise" on building a smarthost for these15:35
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smcginnisdhellmann: That's assigned to you right now. Thoughts?15:36
dhellmannI think we've been linking to things that don't exist?15:37
dhellmannor do we go through and remove those links?15:37
dhellmannI guess we cleaned up some at the end of rocky, didn't we?15:37
smcginnisNot sure honestly.15:38
dhellmannI'm OK with closing this and reopening it or making another one if we remember why we care about this15:38
smcginnisLooks like that happened once before. :)15:38
dhellmannyeah, I had to turn comments on to see that15:38
smcginnisMaybe that's a sign that it's not really a big deal if we keep forgetting why we wanted it.15:39
dhellmannI guess the question is whether we care that we link to missing artifacts15:39
smcginnisLet's mark it invalid again. If it comes up again we can capture the full reasoning behind it.15:39
dhellmannand it seems like it hasn't been a huge issue15:39
smcginnis#link!/story/2001673 Announce job fails if diff-start does not exist15:40
dhellmannwe probably ought to fix this one15:41
smcginnisLooks like a useful error handling thing to fix.15:41
smcginnisUpdated the tag to stein.15:41
smcginnis#link!/story/1748164 Reno doesn't scale15:41
smcginnisAh, issues seen in nova.15:41
dhellmannthey should just make fewer code changes ;-)15:41
dhellmannthere are ways to configure the release notes build to not see the problem, and I think we did some of that15:42
dhellmannwe could always work to make the code faster, of course15:42
smcginnisLooks like you added a useful workaround in the comments.15:42
dhellmannyeah, I think the task here is to document that better15:42
smcginnisNo response, but come to think of it, does StoryBoard email notifications on comments?15:43
dhellmannit does15:43
fungiif you're subscribed15:43
* dhellmann has many many comment emails from storyboard15:43
smcginnisI don't think I've ever received one, so no idea if anythign I've added has had questions or updates.15:43
dhellmannah, I think you have to tell it you want to receive email15:43
fungiand if you don't disable story comments in your preferences15:43
smcginnisWouldn't I be subscribed to stories I've added by default?15:43
fungiyeah, check your user prefs in the webclient15:43
dhellmannyou have to "enable notification emails" globally too15:43
smcginnisOK, I'll check that after the meeting.15:44
fungiahh, right, we don't enable it by default15:44
smcginnisHmm, seems like a questionable default.15:44
smcginnisAnyway, keep the reno scaling issue I guess.15:44
fungiwe might consider adding it as a configurable default and changing it for new accounts or something15:44
smcginnis#link!/story/1748162 Tags at teh base of a stable branch get picked up twice15:44
smcginnisLooks like an issue when stable hasn't been tagged yet?15:45
dhellmannthe tag at the base of a branch is on 2 branches15:46
dhellmannI think this is not a bug15:46
smcginnisClose it?15:46
dhellmannyeah, I just did15:47
smcginnis#link!/story/1748159 Empty configuration files cause exception15:47
smcginnisLooks like an opportunity to make reno a little more robust.15:47
dhellmannyeah, that's a real bug15:47
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smcginnis#link!/story/1748158 earliest_version doesn't work with version from stable branch15:48
smcginnisdhellmann: Looks like you've provided some feedback there. Not a bug?15:49
smcginnis#link!/story/1734950 Support rst format not wrapped in yaml15:49
smcginnisFor reno15:49
smcginnisLooks like a good low priority enhancement.15:50
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dhellmannalthough now that I understand why someone asked for this I think it's probably a very very low priority15:50
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smcginnis#link!/story/1728128 issue with repos that have checked in empty directories15:50
smcginnisI didn't realize git would allow this either.15:50
smcginnisAnother low prio robustness opportunity15:51
dhellmannyeah, I think that's a relatively new thing15:51
smcginnis#link!/story/1712069 reno does not support git submodule15:51
smcginnisGood :D15:51
fungiwow, empty dirs in a git repo?!?15:51
ttxI bet all the others are the reno wishlist backlog15:51
smcginnisLooking like it.15:51
ttxshoudl we switch to putting things on a board ?15:52
ttxI want to have an idea of must-have/should-have/good-to-have15:52
ttxand see if we have assignees for the first two15:52
smcginnisYeah, we're running out of time again, so let's switch to that.15:52
smcginnis#link!/board/64 Task board15:52
smcginnisIsn't there a way that SB can automatically pull these into a board?15:53
* ttx cleans up completed items15:54
dhellmannwe could set up a board with query-based worklists but we left this one manual because you can't really mix automatic and manual15:54
dhellmannthe board doesn't let you add items to a worklist if they are already in another worklist, so as soon as you have a list that shows the backlog automatically you have to set up the other lists using automated criteria, too15:55
ttxalso do we really want a "done" list ? I know it provides sensory satisfaction but...15:55
ttxmaybe I'll just clean it up15:55
smcginnisCan't we have To Do automatic for any openstack/release tasks, then manually move them to In Progress?15:55
smcginnisttx: Yeah, I've always questioned Done items unless there's a follow-up reporting kind of need.15:55
ttxsmcginnis: the idea was to select a subset of tasks for the Stein plan15:56
smcginnisDo All The Things15:56
* ttx empties the list but keeps it15:56
dhellmannsmcginnis : no, that's what I was trying to explain. If we set up a todo list as automatic, the board will not let you move items from that list to the other lists15:56
smcginnisThat would be a good enhancement.15:57
smcginnisWell, we're almost out of time. Should we defer this and talk about the last topic quick?15:57
dhellmannit's a validation rule that tries to prevent you from adding something to todo and done manually, but it doesn't ignore the automatic lists15:57
ttxI'm adding what I have on my bucket15:58
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smcginnis#topic Release changes15:58
*** openstack changes topic to "Release changes (Meeting topic: releaseteam)"15:58
smcginnisSince we only have a couple minutes...15:58
fungidhellmann: one option would be to make story-based lanes which use specific tags in their queries and then control which lane(s) they appear in by changing the tags on them15:58
smcginnis#link Proposed changes drafts15:58
smcginnisfungi: That's kind of what I was thinking. We have things tagged Stein.15:58
dhellmannfungi : yeah, it just seemed easier to manually add things to the todo list, then drag them into the other columns15:58
dhellmannthat way we have a backlog and a list of things we said we'd do this cycle15:59
smcginnisPlease take a pass through the email drafts.15:59
smcginnisShould I send this early next week?15:59
smcginnisThough... I'm traveling Mon-Thur.15:59
smcginnisBut I should have time to send it out.15:59
dhellmannone of us could send it if you would rather15:59
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dhellmannbut yeah, I think we should start talking about this asap16:00
smcginnisI agree.16:00
ttxAt least email 116:00
smcginnisI can send it, just want to make sure we are responsive if folks raise questions and concerns.16:00
dhellmannI'll be around next week16:00
ttxand Email 3 probably16:00
smcginnisYeah, just the first email to start.16:00
dhellmannwhy wait for #2?16:01
ttxdhellmann: avoid input overload ?16:01
smcginnisDo we want to get feedback on #1 first before going too deep?16:01
dhellmannok, that makes sense16:01
dhellmannmaybe #2 the week after16:01
smcginnisOver time.16:01
smcginnisIf folks could take another look over the weekend and polish, I can send it early next week.16:01
smcginnisThanks everyone!16:02
fungithanks smcginnis!16:02
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:02
openstackMeeting ended Fri Sep 21 16:02:14 2018 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:02
openstackMinutes (text):
smcginnisAnd thanks all for sticking around.16:02
dhellmannsmcginnis : the emails look good to me16:02
smcginnisBug scrub is never fun, but necessary.16:02
fungicleanliness is next to buglessness?16:03
* ttx continues to populate board with the stories he signed up for16:03
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