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| ekcs | #startmeeting congressteammeeting | 04:04 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Fri Jun 28 04:04:45 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ekcs. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 04:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 04:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: congressteammeeting)" | 04:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'congressteammeeting' | 04:04 |
| ekcs | hello! topics go here as usual: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/congress-meeting-topics | 04:06 |
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| akhil_jain | Hi, ekcs | 04:08 |
| ekcs | hello akhil_jain ! how’s it been? | 04:08 |
| ekcs | and hello imsurit ! if you’re here to join the meeting, welcome! | 04:08 |
| akhil_jain | Everything good, what about you? | 04:08 |
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| ekcs | im alright too! | 04:11 |
| ekcs | a little bit of a stressful week but reasonably productive = ) | 04:12 |
| ekcs | ok I guess we’ll dive in then. | 04:12 |
| ekcs | #topic intelligent overprovisioning for high availability | 04:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "intelligent overprovisioning for high availability (Meeting topic: congressteammeeting)" | 04:13 | |
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| ekcs | I just want to give a quick update to this use case I’ve been working on. | 04:14 |
| ekcs | it’s mentioned in our talks in the denver summit, but I’m working on formalizing it for the self-healing SIG | 04:15 |
| ekcs | and also fleshing out all the reference deployment setup. | 04:15 |
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| ekcs | the concept is to use predictive analytics (maybe monasca-analytics) to warn of possible failures. and based on those failure severetiy, likelihood, and the load on the affected services, decide how much to overprovision to guard against service disruption/degradation if the failure occurs. | 04:17 |
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| ekcs | so something like monasca analytics would provide the predictive data, and something like congress would combine with other data to make provisioning decisions. | 04:18 |
| ekcs | one difficulty right now is to find someone who is familiar with the predictive piece to drive that. but currently i’m working on the congress side. | 04:19 |
| akhil_jain | it sounds interesting | 04:20 |
| ekcs | the numerical aggregations and calculations in the postgres engine for congress has been very helpful. will update as I progress. | 04:20 |
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| akhil_jain | are you docuenting it in self healing sig ? | 04:20 |
| ekcs | yea I think it makes sense to document for self healing SIG and also auto-scaling SIG. | 04:21 |
| akhil_jain | is patch up? | 04:22 |
| ekcs | but also if I can find a monasca-analytics person or someone who is familiar with predictive analytics it may make sense to submit a talk for shanghai. | 04:22 |
| ekcs | no not yet. will add you to review when I submit a patch though. | 04:22 |
| akhil_jain | ok thanks | 04:22 |
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| ekcs | is that something you’d be interested in collaborating on for a presentation? | 04:23 |
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| akhil_jain | donot know of any such person, but i can be one by studying, | 04:23 |
| akhil_jain | always ready:D | 04:23 |
| ekcs | haha ok well we can talk more about level of interest and work. | 04:24 |
| akhil_jain | or maybe asking witek can help here | 04:24 |
| ekcs | anyway that’s all the uupdate from me on that topic. | 04:25 |
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| akhil_jain | ok great, thanks for updating | 04:25 |
| ekcs | ok moving on then. | 04:26 |
| ekcs | #topic summit presentations | 04:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "summit presentations (Meeting topic: congressteammeeting)" | 04:26 | |
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| ekcs | on the same line of thought, just want to see if there are any ideas or discussions around talks or forums for the summit | 04:27 |
| ekcs | or it’s something we can discuss more over email if they come up. | 04:29 |
| akhil_jain | I am not sure about the way we can add idea of prometheus-openstack monitoring, I have written down rough abstract, will share it with you over mail by tomorrow | 04:30 |
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| ekcs | ok great! | 04:30 |
| ekcs | ok moving on then. | 04:31 |
| ekcs | #topic open discussion | 04:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: congressteammeeting)" | 04:31 | |
| ekcs | not sure if we have anything else to talk about right now. | 04:31 |
| akhil_jain | yea, nothing from my side | 04:32 |
| ekcs | ok nothing for me either. I guess we can end then! | 04:32 |
| akhil_jain | ok, later then | 04:33 |
| ekcs | happy friday and have a great weekend! | 04:33 |
| akhil_jain | Thanks and same to you, Bye! | 04:34 |
| ekcs | bye | 04:34 |
| ekcs | #endmeeting | 04:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 04:34 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Fri Jun 28 04:34:30 2019 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 04:34 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2019/congressteammeeting.2019-06-28-04.04.html | 04:34 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2019/congressteammeeting.2019-06-28-04.04.txt | 04:34 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2019/congressteammeeting.2019-06-28-04.04.log.html | 04:34 |
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| mlavalle | #startmeeting neutron_drivers | 14:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Fri Jun 28 14:00:04 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mlavalle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_drivers)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_drivers' | 14:00 |
| slaweq | hi | 14:00 |
| mlavalle | boden: to optimize your time, we are talkijg about https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1832758 | 14:00 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1832758 in neutron "[RFE] Allow/deny custom ethertypes in security groups" [Wishlist,New] | 14:00 |
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| ralonsoh | hi | 14:01 |
| mlavalle | the question that we have is whether NSX allows other ethertypes in security groups? | 14:01 |
| njohnston | o/ | 14:01 |
| mlavalle | i.e. can you say in a security group rule that non ip traffic is enabled? or is non ip trafiic enabled by deafult in NSX? | 14:02 |
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| boden | mlavalle I would have to dig.. I didn't write much of that code, I mainly just maintain the gate and some bugs | 14:03 |
| njohnston | boden: Common examples would be InfiniBand or FCoE | 14:03 |
| boden | mlavalle can we propose the question in the bug and I will ask the dev team to look | 14:03 |
| mlavalle | boden: yeah, don't dig too much. Just ask your devs to look at the RFE and give their opinion | 14:04 |
| haleyb | hi | 14:04 |
| boden | mlavalle will do... I could guess here, but better to let them peek since they know the deep details of the integration | 14:04 |
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| mlavalle | boden: that's all I wanted to ask, in case you need to take care of your parental duties. you afe also welcome to stay :-) | 14:05 |
| mlavalle | #topic RFEs | 14:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RFEs (Meeting topic: neutron_drivers)" | 14:06 | |
| mlavalle | ok, we have quorum | 14:06 |
| mlavalle | Let's go back to https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1832758 | 14:07 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1832758 in neutron "[RFE] Allow/deny custom ethertypes in security groups" [Wishlist,New] | 14:07 |
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| njohnston | Thank you all for getting started talking about this last week while I was on PTO | 14:07 |
| njohnston | glad to get the ball rolling | 14:08 |
| mlavalle | Let me try to summarize last week's discussion: | 14:08 |
| mlavalle | 1) The team seemed to agree that we have to allow other ethertypes beyond IP | 14:09 |
| mlavalle | 2) We got bogged down on the transition from the current situation to the new one | 14:09 |
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| mlavalle | whether just to allow those ethertypes by default or requiring explicit rules to enable them | 14:10 |
| mlavalle | is that a good summary? | 14:10 |
| slaweq | IMO yes | 14:11 |
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| slaweq | and we should think about some solution which will be backportable to stable releases IMHO | 14:11 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: Sounds right based on my reading of the transcript | 14:11 |
| haleyb | +1 | 14:11 |
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| njohnston | Regarding allowing the ethertypes by default, I think this should be treated like IP traffic: default deny, allow only with exception. | 14:12 |
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| mlavalle | njohnston: that was also my position | 14:13 |
| mlavalle | but the rest of the team seemed to be inclined towards allowing them by default | 14:13 |
| mlavalle | at least that was my take away after reading the log last night | 14:14 |
| njohnston | If a bank or governmental institution, for example, wants to lock down their network completely then saying "You're locked down unless a hacker uses a custom ethertype, then he can exfiltrate data freely" is not a good answer | 14:14 |
| slaweq | +1 | 14:14 |
| mlavalle | agree | 14:15 |
| mlavalle | I think that is the crux of the discussion | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | the user should be locked down / secure by default | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | the flip side of the coin is that deployments using custom ethertypes under hybrid fw will have to enable them explicitely when migration to ovs fw | 14:19 |
| mlavalle | right? | 14:19 |
| amotoki | sorry for late. I second "deny" by default. we see different behaviors in iptables-hybrid and ovs-fw at least. it sounds better to have an explicit rule when close the gap. I think it allows users to be aware of what happens. | 14:19 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: yes, which would be an improvement on the current situation where they are broken without recourse for a fix | 14:19 |
| amotoki | mlavalle: agree | 14:19 |
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| mlavalle | ok, so are we ready to approve implementing: | 14:20 |
| mlavalle | 1) custom ethertypes in security groups | 14:20 |
| mlavalle | 2) with deny as the default bahavior? | 14:21 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: Yes. Additionally I think some documentation to help operators sample traffic looking for custom ethertypes so they can see what is actually in use befor ethey migrate would be a good way to help the pain of a transition from iptables to ovsfw | 14:22 |
| mlavalle | documentation at a minimum.... ideally some tool | 14:22 |
| slaweq | one question: what about iptables driver? Will we also implement blocking such custom ethertypes in it? | 14:23 |
| haleyb | my internet connection is going down, so i'll put in a preemptive +1 on Nate's back-portable solution | 14:24 |
| njohnston | would it make sense to consider that as a separate RFE once this one is implemented, and pull the security team into the discussion at that time | 14:24 |
| njohnston | ? | 14:24 |
| amotoki | one idea on iptables driver is to define explicit rules to allow such traffic and block to drip them. | 14:24 |
| haleyb | amotoki: it would be an ebtables-type driver, so would be more work in the hybrid case | 14:25 |
| amotoki | this RFE is about ovs-fw behaviro. we can tackle how to close the gap between ovs-fw and iptable drivers in another RFE. | 14:25 |
| slaweq | I agree that it may be separate RFE, but I would just want to not forget about it :) | 14:26 |
| njohnston | amotoki: +1 | 14:26 |
| amotoki | haleyb: yes, I learned that last week. it would need more work and it might be moree complicated. | 14:26 |
| mlavalle | here's what I propose. approve the RFE.... | 14:27 |
| slaweq | because if we will have something like: ovs-fw blocks such traffic by default, iptables always allows this traffic (which is also now) - this sounds a bit like CVE for me even | 14:27 |
| mlavalle | and start a disucssion right away with the security team | 14:27 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: +1 | 14:27 |
| mlavalle | slaweq: it is CVE | 14:27 |
| amotoki | at least OSSN (openstack security notice) is worth mentioned. | 14:28 |
| mlavalle | and that is why we have to start discussing with the security team | 14:28 |
| slaweq | ok | 14:28 |
| mlavalle | because our deployer have a hole there and I bet most of them don't even realize it | 14:28 |
| mlavalle | deployers^^^^ | 14:28 |
| njohnston | I'd like to talk a little about how we address this in master vs. stable | 14:29 |
| njohnston | I'd like to propose - and get the drivers blessing - that we create an RFE and figure out the API changes, DB changes, etc. to create this as a proper API extension for the security groups API for master. But that seems too much to backport to old releases, per our backports policy. | 14:30 |
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| njohnston | So I would like to address this with a minimalistic change that just uses an ovs agent config option to define the permitted ethertypes, as a way to address the situation in stable with a light touch. I started on such an approach here: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/667207/ | 14:31 |
| mlavalle | ahh, I saw that patch. Now I understand | 14:32 |
| njohnston | (this is what haleyb was referring to earlier) | 14:32 |
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| mlavalle | it never comes into master | 14:33 |
| mlavalle | starts in stable/steain | 14:34 |
| mlavalle | it makes sense to me | 14:34 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: precisely | 14:34 |
| njohnston | Since this is CVE territory I think something we can have out there for existing customers soon is a good thing, plus it addresses the "sideways regression" for customers going from iptables_hybrid to ovsfw and having their Infiniband application break. | 14:34 |
| slaweq | njohnston: but as this is only for Stein and older, are You sure that proper fix with API changes will be ready for Train for sure? | 14:35 |
| ralonsoh | agree with slaweq, this patch can be merged in master and then, if the feature is implemented, removed | 14:36 |
| slaweq | maybe that would be "safer" solution | 14:36 |
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| njohnston | OK, I'd be very open to that | 14:36 |
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| mlavalle | sounds sensible to me | 14:37 |
| mlavalle | amotoki, haleyb: what do you think? | 14:38 |
| * njohnston wonders if we lost haleyb | 14:39 | |
| mlavalle | probably | 14:40 |
| -amotoki- was disconnected for a while during train under ground | 14:40 | |
| amotoki | I followed the discussion and it makes sense to me. | 14:40 |
| mlavalle | cool | 14:41 |
| mlavalle | we have an agreement | 14:41 |
| mlavalle | I will document this discussion in the RFE and mark it approved | 14:41 |
| mlavalle | that was the only RFE we had for today | 14:42 |
| njohnston | All right. I will take my code on stable/stein and propose it for master, adding TODO statements to remove when we have a full implementation... and then I'll get a spec going for the full change | 14:42 |
| mlavalle | but before leaving, I have two questions for the team | 14:42 |
| mlavalle | 1) Last night I was looking at the RFE, just freshly submitted: https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1834174 | 14:43 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1834174 in neutron "[RFE] Add support for IPoIB interface driver" [Wishlist,New] - Assigned to Adrian Chiris (adrian.chiris) | 14:43 |
| mlavalle | but given the previous ethertypes disucssion, do we need infiniband drivers? | 14:43 |
| mlavalle | deployers are connecting infiniband fabrics in their OpenStack systems, right? | 14:44 |
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| mlavalle | at least the RH folks know of one, as far as I can glean out | 14:44 |
| njohnston | In the case I know about, the application is using the infiniband protocol natively (I believe, would want to confirm it) | 14:45 |
| slaweq | I don't know IB but for me it looks like proposal for new dhcp/L3 driver that dhcp/router namespace can be connected that way | 14:45 |
| mlavalle | ok, please leave some comments there if you have time | 14:46 |
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| njohnston | but infiniband can also be implemented in hardware so perhaps this is to create ports on an interface that is an infiniband network interface rather than an ethernet one | 14:46 |
| * njohnston will comment | 14:46 | |
| mlavalle | 2) Thursday of Next week is July 4th, Independence Day in the USA. I am taking Friday 5th off and I suspect haleyb and njohnston might do the same | 14:47 |
| ralonsoh | I'll do the same!! | 14:47 |
| * slaweq is sad that he will have to be at work :( | 14:48 | |
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| mlavalle | so it might be slaweq, amotoki and yamamoto only attending the meeting | 14:48 |
| * njohnston offers July 4th as a holiday for anyone who is sorting out their issues with Britain | 14:49 | |
| mlavalle | do you want to have it anyway or do you want to cancel? | 14:49 |
| amotoki | canceling the meeting sounds good to. we can spend reviewing others :) | 14:49 |
| amotoki | *good to me* | 14:49 |
| slaweq | yes, I think that we can cancel it | 14:49 |
| mlavalle | cool | 14:49 |
| mlavalle | I'll send a notice to the ML | 14:50 |
| mlavalle | That's all for today team | 14:50 |
| njohnston | thank you all very much | 14:50 |
| mlavalle | Great discussion, btw | 14:50 |
| slaweq | thank You all | 14:50 |
| ralonsoh | bye! | 14:50 |
| slaweq | have a great weekend :) | 14:50 |
| slaweq | o/ | 14:50 |
| mlavalle | have a great weekend! | 14:50 |
| mlavalle | #endmeeting | 14:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 14:51 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Fri Jun 28 14:51:01 2019 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:51 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-06-28-14.00.html | 14:51 |
| amotoki | the meeting will end before I get off the train :) yay | 14:51 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-06-28-14.00.txt | 14:51 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-06-28-14.00.log.html | 14:51 |
| mlavalle | amotoki: that's good! | 14:51 |
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