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| abhishekk | #startmeeting glance | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| openstack | Meeting started Thu Apr 9 14:00:01 2020 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is abhishekk. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'glance' | 14:00 |
| abhishekk | #topic roll call | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:00 | |
| abhishekk | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-team-meeting-agenda | 14:00 |
| abhishekk | o/ | 14:00 |
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| jokke_ | o/ | 14:01 |
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| abhishekk | looks like two of us | 14:02 |
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| abhishekk | wait for 2-3 minutes for rosmaita and smcginnis | 14:02 |
| jokke_ | yeah | 14:02 |
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| rosmaita | sorry, wasn't paying attention | 14:03 |
| abhishekk | no problem, lets start | 14:03 |
| abhishekk | #topic Updates | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Updates (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:03 | |
| abhishekk | I have created PTG etherpad, | 14:03 |
| abhishekk | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/Glance-Victoria-PTG-planning | 14:03 |
| abhishekk | Will publish it to openstack-discuss mailing list as well | 14:04 |
| abhishekk | Likely virtual PTG will be scheduled to start one week before from actual dates (not sure yet) | 14:04 |
| abhishekk | Feel free to add topics to PTG for discussion | 14:04 |
| abhishekk | Moving ahead | 14:05 |
| abhishekk | #topic release/periodic jobs update | 14:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "release/periodic jobs update (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:05 | |
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| smcginnis | o/ | 14:05 |
| abhishekk | This is Ussuri milestone 3 release week | 14:05 |
| abhishekk | smcginnis, o/ | 14:05 |
| abhishekk | We still have couple of specs open | 14:05 |
| abhishekk | 1. checksum computation | 14:06 |
| abhishekk | 2. deprecate admin role | 14:06 |
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| abhishekk | IMO we should move deprecate admin role to next cycle | 14:07 |
| abhishekk | what is your opinion about the same | 14:07 |
| rosmaita | would rather deprecate now so we can remove next cycle | 14:07 |
| smcginnis | If it's not a lot of work to just add the deprecation message, I think we should get it done. | 14:08 |
| rosmaita | i think i already have patch up for that | 14:08 |
| abhishekk | rosmaita, have you seen jokke_ comment on the specs | 14:08 |
| rosmaita | no | 14:08 |
| abhishekk | this is the link of etherpad with important patches, https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-ussuri-important_patches | 14:09 |
| abhishekk | jokke_, smcginnis I would like to have your views on checksum computation specs | 14:10 |
| rosmaita | i don't understand jokke_'s comment | 14:10 |
| abhishekk | #link https://review.opendev.org/708761 | 14:10 |
| rosmaita | because if we change the default value, we need to give warning about that as well | 14:10 |
| rosmaita | and i think my release note addresses that? | 14:11 |
| rosmaita | https://review.opendev.org/#/c/716078/ | 14:11 |
| abhishekk | jokke_, rosmaita, smcginnis as per our glance-specs standard I can not get specs in unless every core voted +2 on it | 14:12 |
| jokke_ | What I'm saying is that while not under Embargo this is valid security concern and we should address is asap, not just make a note an expect deployers to act on it | 14:12 |
| jokke_ | all I'm saying | 14:12 |
| jokke_ | it's not like CVE worthy but definitely something we could do much better for our users | 14:13 |
| abhishekk | Tomorrow will be holiday and most of the people will be on leave on Monday due to Easter, so I would like to have this decision made by today | 14:13 |
| rosmaita | well, in the default config, you don't see any difference at all | 14:14 |
| jokke_ | I can't remember if it's still the case but iirc Glance treated project admin as admin in this regard | 14:14 |
| rosmaita | it depends on how you make someone a "project admin" | 14:15 |
| rosmaita | besides, i talked about this in public at the denver ptg | 14:15 |
| rosmaita | or summit, rather | 14:15 |
| rosmaita | there's even a slide making this exact point | 14:15 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: indeed ... so how changing the default value based on this issue would not change anything? | 14:16 |
| rosmaita | so is your point that we should both deprecate *and* change the default value? | 14:17 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: yes, like I said we should do both so we address the current issue while we deprecate this | 14:18 |
| jokke_ | act now, not next cycle | 14:18 |
| jokke_ | and that way we can give a cycle more for removal if there's suddenly lots of people depending on this and needing time for it | 14:18 |
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| jokke_ | but that all can be figured out after we have fixed the current "admin" overloading and informed that this is been deprecated | 14:19 |
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| rosmaita | so is your proposal: ussuri change default value, victoria deprecate option, wallaby remove option ? | 14:21 |
| abhishekk | sorry, laptop restarted suddenly | 14:21 |
| abhishekk | rosmaita, IMO he is saying deprecate and change the default value now, and remove in wallaby | 14:22 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: that or change defaul & deprecate ussuri; remove V if no hard push from the operator community else remove W | 14:22 |
| rosmaita | there's not going to be a hard push from operator community, the only things i have heard about this is that it messes up policy configuration | 14:23 |
| jokke_ | either way is fine by me as long as we change that default value and address it now as it has been talked in public way too much | 14:23 |
| smcginnis | It will likely be 2-3 years before operators give any feedback, unfortunately. | 14:23 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: that's great, we still need to initialize that discussion in the mailing list and give room for those voices as per the deprecation policy | 14:24 |
| jokke_ | smcginnis: that fine as well as long as we give them the opportunity so we actually follow the policy we assert on ;) | 14:24 |
| abhishekk | rosmaita, how much efforts are required to change the default value? | 14:24 |
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| rosmaita | not much | 14:25 |
| rosmaita | just have to change the value and revise the release note | 14:25 |
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| abhishekk | we should do it then | 14:25 |
| rosmaita | but i strongly feel that we must deprecate in ussuri | 14:26 |
| rosmaita | or this will be another one of those never ending deprecations | 14:26 |
| rosmaita | i will also need to revise spec, i guess | 14:26 |
| abhishekk | smcginnis, can I post m3 release patch on Tuesday/Wednesday | 14:26 |
| abhishekk | we still have 3/4 patches to get in, then config refresh patch | 14:27 |
| abhishekk | looking at the gate, it will easily take 3-4 days for the same | 14:27 |
| abhishekk | jokke_, kindly look checksum computation specs as well | 14:28 |
| jokke_ | abhishekk: perhaps we should tag m-3 (or skip it) and make sure these gets into RC-1 ... not like we have any feature work going in | 14:28 |
| smcginnis | Yeah, we can wait for RC1 if we want. | 14:28 |
| abhishekk | can we skip m-3? | 14:29 |
| smcginnis | Client lib needs to be released, but there is no requirement to do milestone releases for services anymore. | 14:29 |
| abhishekk | cool | 14:29 |
| jokke_ | so the checksum deprecation I'm much more worried about. As I feel that might end up being on of those never removed deprecations as I'm pretty sure tempest is gating on checksums | 14:29 |
| smcginnis | Only if we think someone might pick up those beta releases for testing. | 14:29 |
| abhishekk | We already have released python-glanceclient | 14:30 |
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| rosmaita | jokke_: see if this describes what you want: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/714626/2/specs/ussuri/approved/glance/spec-lite-deprecate-admin_role.rst | 14:30 |
| abhishekk | This is my action plan | 14:32 |
| abhishekk | 1. Get important patch, https://review.opendev.org/#/c/718367/ in today | 14:32 |
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| jokke_ | rosmaita: +2 on the deprecate admin role spec | 14:32 |
| abhishekk | 2. Submit config refresh patch | 14:32 |
| abhishekk | 3. Tag m-3 on monnday | 14:32 |
| abhishekk | File FFE for checksum and deprecate admin role (if required) and get them in rc-1 | 14:33 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: and if we don't have security bug for it, lets open public one so we can actually backport it and already get it out for those who are now looking into deploying steing or train | 14:33 |
| abhishekk | rosmaita, jokke_ smcginnis does it makes sense? | 14:34 |
| jokke_ | -g | 14:34 |
| rosmaita | so jokke_ your concern about the checksum, that would *not* be a reason to deprecate it in ussuri, is that right? | 14:35 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: I just want to make sure we can actually remove it before marking it deprecated. (preferably get rid of the tempest test and depend the deprecation on that removal) | 14:35 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: we have too many of these things just hanging because we make a decision and then QA just cockblocks us | 14:36 |
| rosmaita | well, this is a security concern | 14:37 |
| rosmaita | two things here: | 14:37 |
| rosmaita | (1) no change in the api or the response | 14:37 |
| rosmaita | (2) if you are actually validating the download, you need to use the secure method | 14:37 |
| rosmaita | so i think we can get this one through tempest, i can patch anything using checksum to validate to use multihash | 14:38 |
| rosmaita | but i think we need to deprecate first so they know we are serious | 14:38 |
| abhishekk | I second this | 14:38 |
| jokke_ | I thought that would have been the case with the default visibility as well and how well that went | 14:39 |
| jokke_ | or registry | 14:39 |
| smcginnis | We need to either submit patches to tempest, or at least announce on the ML so they know about the change. | 14:39 |
| jokke_ | smcginnis: what we need is commitment from them to agree it can be removed | 14:40 |
| rosmaita | it's not being removed | 14:40 |
| rosmaita | it's just not being populated any more | 14:40 |
| smcginnis | Honestly, if something isn't in refstack, they can't dictate to this team what stays or goes. | 14:40 |
| jokke_ | smcginnis: only way that statement is true is to drop tempest gating ... we've seen it too many times by now | 14:41 |
| jokke_ | as we have no way to force anything into tempest and they are in our gate | 14:41 |
| smcginnis | Well, that's my point with submitting patches to tempest. If we change something there, it doesn't just impact glance code. | 14:42 |
| jokke_ | so they very much do dictate what we can do | 14:42 |
| rosmaita | i think this is going to be different | 14:42 |
| smcginnis | Yeah | 14:42 |
| rosmaita | everyone thinks that download validation == security | 14:42 |
| rosmaita | and md5 == really bad | 14:42 |
| rosmaita | plus, we aren't modifying the image response | 14:42 |
| rosmaita | so no breaking | 14:43 |
| rosmaita | and multihash has been available since rocky | 14:43 |
| rosmaita | and has been used in glanceclient since rocky (second release) | 14:43 |
| rosmaita | so whereas the visibilility thing was kind of difficult to explain | 14:44 |
| rosmaita | this is pretty straightforward | 14:44 |
| abhishekk | I think we have discussed this when we have agreed on drafting the specs of checksum deprecation, and sounds straight forward | 14:44 |
| rosmaita | but the big thing here, is no telcos will use glance pretty soon | 14:44 |
| rosmaita | because they want no md5 anywhere | 14:45 |
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| smcginnis | And with federally mandated things like FIPS, they may not be allowed to even if they want to. | 14:45 |
| abhishekk | Last 15 minutes, | 14:46 |
| rosmaita | anyway, i think we need the deprecation clock started on this one right away | 14:46 |
| rosmaita | i.e., in ussuri | 14:46 |
| rosmaita | and much as it sucks, we can fight it out in victoria | 14:46 |
| rosmaita | but i don't think there will be much fight on this one | 14:47 |
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| abhishekk | +1 | 14:47 |
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| rosmaita | this is the actual deprecation note i am proposing: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/718147/1/releasenotes/notes/deprecate-checksum-a602853403e1c4a8.yaml | 14:48 |
| abhishekk | jokke_, we should do it now | 14:48 |
| jokke_ | So how I see this is, we have 3 options: 1) we deprecate, we potentially fight with qa for next 3 years to get rid of it and might buy us some user time as it's deprecated 2) we change the tempest tests to make sure it's not blocked, and then we deprecate and get rid of it or 3) (possibly as outcome of 1 but we could do it right away) we get security bug opened about it based on any gov policies | 14:49 |
| jokke_ | like FIPS preventing it's usage as unsecure and get rid of it right away | 14:49 |
| jokke_ | I'd prefer either 2) or 3) but I just have no iterest to fight the 1) route through | 14:49 |
| rosmaita | well, deprecating it now is consistent with security bug | 14:50 |
| jokke_ | some clients might have missed this: 16:49 < jokke_> like FIPS preventing it's usage as unsecure and get rid of it right away | 14:50 |
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| rosmaita | i don't see any reason *not* to deprecate now | 14:51 |
| jokke_ | rosmaita: nope, if we take the security bug route, we can get rid of it in Ussuri and even backport it, deprecating it now will be earliest V which means that the telcos will be stuck with md5 until like 2025 unless we later on backport the removal through a bug | 14:51 |
| jokke_ | so what I'm saying is, we can either get rid of it without even worryig about deprecation if there is F.E. gov policy mandating us to do so. Or we might end up stuck with it for non-determined time | 14:52 |
| abhishekk | last 8 minutes, we can continue discussion on it #openstack-glance channel | 14:53 |
| abhishekk | Moving ahead | 14:53 |
| abhishekk | #topic glance-specs victoria patch | 14:53 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "glance-specs victoria patch (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:53 | |
| abhishekk | I have created glance-specs patch for victoria | 14:54 |
| abhishekk | please have a look at it so we can start adding specs for victoria | 14:54 |
| abhishekk | #topic Open discussion | 14:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:54 | |
| abhishekk | jokke_, https://review.opendev.org/718367 | 14:55 |
| abhishekk | have a look at it | 14:55 |
| smcginnis | Nothing from me. | 14:55 |
| abhishekk | as per docs we expect bool values for all-stores and allow-failure, so We are rejecting requests if it is not bool | 14:55 |
| jokke_ | is the client actually sending JSON bool or did I mess that up? | 14:57 |
| abhishekk | jokke_, fixed client yesterday | 14:57 |
| abhishekk | now it is sending JSON bool | 14:57 |
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| abhishekk | last two minutes | 14:58 |
| jokke_ | I thought that might have been the case | 14:59 |
| abhishekk | time is up, switching back to openstack-glance for further discussion | 14:59 |
| abhishekk | thank you all | 15:00 |
| abhishekk | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Apr 9 15:00:12 2020 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-04-09-14.00.html | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-04-09-14.00.txt | 15:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2020/glance.2020-04-09-14.00.log.html | 15:00 |
| gagehugo | #startmeeting security | 15:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Apr 9 15:04:18 2020 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is gagehugo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: security)" | 15:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'security' | 15:04 |
| gagehugo | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/security-agenda agenda | 15:04 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 15:04 |
| fungi | aloha, y'all | 15:04 |
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| gagehugo | hopefully everyone is staying safe and not getting cabin fever | 15:05 |
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| fungi | i was already a hermit | 15:06 |
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| gagehugo | now most of us are, at least in practice | 15:07 |
| fungi | heh, indeed | 15:07 |
| fungi | recluses at the very least | 15:07 |
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| gagehugo | #topic Weekly Updates | 15:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Weekly Updates (Meeting topic: security)" | 15:08 | |
| gagehugo | Changing it up a bit, since we usually just discuss any new happenings | 15:08 |
| gagehugo | Last week was pretty quiet | 15:08 |
| gagehugo | I saw the mailing list email last night | 15:09 |
| gagehugo | about storyboard | 15:09 |
| gagehugo | thanks for replying to that fungi | 15:09 |
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| fungi | you bet, i followed up a few minutes ago as well, and i'll take a look at his story shortly | 15:09 |
| gagehugo | should i be getting storyboard email notifications? | 15:10 |
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| gagehugo | otherwise I haven't seen anything | 15:14 |
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| gagehugo | fungi: any updates from you? | 15:16 |
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| fungi | nah, that's pretty much it. as for notifications, you have to turn them on, but there's also a bug right now we're investigating where private status breaks the e-mail notification codepath | 15:18 |
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| gagehugo | ah ok | 15:20 |
| gagehugo | I'll look at it | 15:20 |
| gagehugo | fungi: thanks, stay safe | 15:20 |
| gagehugo | #endmeeting | 15:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 15:20 | |
| fungi | you tooW | 15:20 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Apr 9 15:20:46 2020 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:20 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/security/2020/security.2020-04-09-15.04.html | 15:20 |
| fungi | er, too | 15:20 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/security/2020/security.2020-04-09-15.04.txt | 15:20 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/security/2020/security.2020-04-09-15.04.log.html | 15:20 |
| fungi | thanks gagehugo! | 15:20 |
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