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| mestery | russellb: Good morning! So, to get networking-ovn workign with stable/liberty required this patch: https://github.com/mestery/networking-ovn/commit/2d5fdf40f4afc0c5bb92a78640139342b697e73d | 14:19 |
|---|---|---|
| mestery | russellb: I am thinking about a stable/liberty branch of networkign-ovn, though I don't want it ... | 14:19 |
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| russellb | mestery: if that's all it is, what about a variant that can be applied to master? | 14:20 |
| mestery | russellb: I'd like that much better I think | 14:20 |
| russellb | either automatically discover what's needed, or just a config option ... | 14:21 |
| mestery | regXboi: This is about your patch here https://github.com/mestery/networking-ovn/commit/2d5fdf40f4afc0c5bb92a78640139342b697e73d | 14:21 |
| russellb | i mean, it's cruft | 14:21 |
| mestery | Cool | 14:21 |
| russellb | but a separate branch to maintain sounds like more work | 14:21 |
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| mestery | Well, also, the master patch is out for backport to stable/liberty too | 14:21 |
| mestery | I mean, the neutron patch which caused the change | 14:21 |
| russellb | re: the branch, if that ends up best, i'm OK if you're the maintainer :-p | 14:21 |
| mestery | +1000, I want to avoid a separate branch | 14:21 |
| * regXboi blinks owlishly | 14:21 | |
| * Sam-I-Am wakes up | 14:21 | |
| * russellb naps | 14:21 | |
| mestery | lol | 14:21 |
| regXboi | what if we do something hideous like wrap that statement in a try and if it fails, faill back to the old topics? | 14:22 |
| mestery | That is hideous, but would be along hte lines of what russellb was suggesting | 14:22 |
| regXboi | I *think* the key change is just from topics.PLUGIN to topics.REPORT | 14:23 |
| regXboi | and all the rest is cruft :) | 14:23 |
| regXboi | sigh - brb folks | 14:23 |
| regXboi | back | 14:24 |
| * regXboi listens to the sounds of construction | 14:24 | |
| Sam-I-Am | so... | 14:24 |
| regXboi | so... have we reached agreement on going hideous or not :) ? | 14:24 |
| regXboi | Sam-I-Am: oom | 14:24 |
| Sam-I-Am | is this taking stable/liberty neutron code and putting ovn on top of it? | 14:25 |
| regXboi | Sam-I-Am: that it is | 14:25 |
| Sam-I-Am | building ovs from source? | 14:25 |
| regXboi | Sam-I-Am: I did it that way | 14:25 |
| regXboi | others might have done something different | 14:25 |
| Sam-I-Am | sort of have to, since none of the distros package master ovs | 14:25 |
| Sam-I-Am | are you packaging it, or just tarball? | 14:26 |
| regXboi | that, and the networking-ovn devstack plugin does it auto magic | 14:26 |
| regXboi | neither: ^^^^ | 14:26 |
| Sam-I-Am | so is this devstack or a real install? | 14:26 |
| regXboi | right now this is devstack | 14:26 |
| Sam-I-Am | oh, ok | 14:26 |
| Sam-I-Am | you got me all excited for a moment | 14:26 |
| regXboi | calm down, the beer isn't flowing yet | 14:26 |
| regXboi | :) | 14:26 |
| Sam-I-Am | at this point it needs to be coffee :) | 14:28 |
| russellb | Sam-I-Am: i can build you a package if you want one :-p | 14:29 |
| russellb | you can build debs or rpms from the git tree :) | 14:30 |
| Sam-I-Am | russellb: yeah... i know :) | 14:30 |
| Sam-I-Am | russellb: tl;dr, packages play a significant role in the adoption of projects because they lower the barrier of entry | 14:30 |
| russellb | i do not disagree | 14:31 |
| Sam-I-Am | neutron is packaged, ovs can be packaged... which leaves networking-ovn | 14:31 |
| russellb | woah now | 14:31 |
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| Sam-I-Am | question is how long will it take distros to package ovn | 14:33 |
| russellb | it'll fall into place | 14:33 |
| russellb | well, i mean, the packaging work is done, it's a matter of ovs releases getting out | 14:34 |
| Sam-I-Am | packaging for ovn is done? | 14:34 |
| russellb | rdo will have latest ovs as soon as it's released | 14:34 |
| russellb | yes | 14:34 |
| russellb | not networking-ovn, but ovn itself | 14:34 |
| Sam-I-Am | oh, yeah... the part of ovs | 14:34 |
| russellb | i just put networking-ovn packaging on my todo | 14:34 |
| russellb | it's trivial | 14:34 |
| Sam-I-Am | yeah, it seems easy enough | 14:35 |
| Sam-I-Am | i can write up the scenario docs without package names | 14:35 |
| russellb | packaging a small python thing like this is pretty cookie cutter | 14:35 |
| Sam-I-Am | yep | 14:36 |
| russellb | maybe i can get ovs/ovn and networking-ovn into rdo's delorean (that builds master packages regularly) | 14:36 |
| Sam-I-Am | delorean should be quick, but it does not build for stable releases | 14:36 |
| Sam-I-Am | so for mitaka packages would need to be in a more official place | 14:36 |
| russellb | stable not really relevant this minute | 14:36 |
| russellb | but yeah, i get it | 14:37 |
| Sam-I-Am | thats sort of what i figured... lots of things not done yet. just thinking ahead. | 14:37 |
| mestery | russellb: I'm reading the routed network specs again now, and the new version seems to tie it very tightly to multi-segment networks ... which are in the ML2 plugin. | 14:37 |
| * russellb nods | 14:37 | |
| mestery | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225384/14/specs/mitaka/booting-vms-to-routed-networks.rst | 14:37 |
| mestery | Trying to understand what that means for us now | 14:37 |
| Sam-I-Am | i need to get the ubuntu people on board soon-ish | 14:37 |
| Sam-I-Am | they dont move quickly | 14:37 |
| russellb | mestery: hrm, i read the latest, but maybe i glossed over some stuff | 14:37 |
| russellb | mestery: i think anything tied to ML2 should be -1 | 14:37 |
| mestery | The multi-segment support in ML2 is critical to this new version | 14:37 |
| mestery | YEs | 14:37 |
| mestery | I'm saying that in my review now | 14:38 |
| russellb | cool thanks | 14:38 |
| mestery | russellb: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Neutron/ML2#Multi-Segment_Networks | 14:38 |
| russellb | mestery: speaking of rally, have you looked at our rally job results? | 14:38 |
| mestery | I wrote that code 2 years ago :) | 14:38 |
| * regXboi continues to watch the gate | 14:38 | |
| mestery | russellb: I have not, what do they show? | 14:38 |
| russellb | i have no idea how meaningful the results are, but the numbers are lower than ml2+ovs, heh | 14:38 |
| russellb | regXboi the gatekeeper? | 14:39 |
| russellb | no, that's zuul. | 14:39 |
| regXboi | russellb: I was talking to mestery about doing a low level look at the networking-ovn code execution times vis a vis L3 | 14:39 |
| regXboi | extending that to include ml2 would probably be feasible | 14:40 |
| regXboi | if folks think its worthwhile | 14:40 |
| russellb | regXboi: i'd love any help starting to get performance or scale info | 14:41 |
| russellb | whatever you think is interesting | 14:41 |
| russellb | we just need to find bottlenecks so we know where best to invest dev time | 14:41 |
| regXboi | russellb: ack | 14:41 |
| russellb | also, for anyone interested, reminder: OVN meeting is today in a few hours | 14:41 |
| regXboi | calendar ics link? | 14:42 |
| *** russellb changes topic to "http://docs.openstack.org/developer/networking-ovn/ -=- OVN meeting Thursdays 10:15am Pacific / 1:15pm Eastern #openvswitch -=- Tempest health: http://goo.gl/9MaBJC" | 14:42 | |
| russellb | sorry, no calendar link | 14:42 |
| regXboi | no worries, I can add that to my calendar and carry it forward | 14:42 |
| russellb | i haven't created an openstack meeting yet, as it has been valuable to co-locate with the ovs devs | 14:43 |
| regXboi | russellb: no worries - I've got that on my calendar so I should be able to wander in | 14:44 |
| russellb | cool | 14:44 |
| * regXboi dances - the unit test jobs are fixed in the gate | 14:44 | |
| russellb | yay | 14:44 |
| regXboi | now to open the recheck sluices | 14:44 |
| regXboi | mestery: just to confirm - your multinode ovn is running straight compute devstack everywhere *but* the controller, which is set up for networking-ovn? | 14:53 |
| mestery | regXboi: Look here https://github.com/mestery/networking-ovn/tree/sl-liberty | 14:54 |
| mestery | The Vagrant setup runs compute on all nodes *Except* the ovsdb-server node which is running ovsdb-server and ovn-northd | 14:54 |
| mestery | So, compute on control node as well | 14:54 |
| mestery | That's easy enough to change though | 14:54 |
| regXboi | yeah: I was going to leave my controller as just controller+ovsdb | 14:55 |
| mestery | regXboi: I suggest running a separate node with the DB and ovn-northd | 14:55 |
| mestery | That is what got me to a stable system | 14:55 |
| mestery | Either that, orm ove your q-dhcp somewhere else | 14:55 |
| regXboi | mestery - I'm not going to scale past 100 at this point - is it really that necessary? | 14:55 |
| mestery | Ah | 14:55 |
| mestery | Well, then, yeah, you're fine | 14:55 |
| mestery | :) | 14:55 |
| Sam-I-Am | russellb: whats the time frame for rolling out 2.5? | 14:59 |
| russellb | unknown, "soonish" | 14:59 |
| russellb | relies heavily on internal vmware QA ... | 14:59 |
| russellb | so not the clearest of visibility | 14:59 |
| Sam-I-Am | interesting | 14:59 |
| * mestery wonders who's booked their Austin hotel yet | 15:03 | |
| mestery | Thinking JW Marriott, looks like conference things there and the Hilton downtown | 15:03 |
| Sam-I-Am | i have not even thought about it | 15:05 |
| Sam-I-Am | although it probably should be a thing | 15:05 |
| mestery | Yes | 15:05 |
| Sam-I-Am | russellb: who wrote ovn-architecture.7 ? | 15:05 |
| mestery | Looks like either the JW Marriott (which is super nice) or hte Hilton | 15:05 |
| mestery | Both within 2 blocks of the convetion center | 15:05 |
| russellb | Sam-I-Am: mainly Ben Pfaff | 15:06 |
| russellb | others have contributed some | 15:06 |
| Sam-I-Am | thats what i thought. he's damn good at writing. | 15:06 |
| Sam-I-Am | me likey | 15:06 |
| russellb | he's done a lot of academic papers, too | 15:06 |
| Mic22 | Guys my vote probably doesn't count but if you want to gain adoption or even more testing you should definatelly target liberty in the main branch. Also because the development semms to be really active and maintaining this activity in multiple branches risk to become a nightmare. | 15:10 |
| Sam-I-Am | Mic22: backporting should be considered once ovn is feature-complete and stable | 15:12 |
| mestery | At this point, having a branch would be more of a pain than useful | 15:12 |
| mestery | So if we can get even a hack in that enables networking-ovn in master and stable/liberty, that would be best. | 15:13 |
| Sam-I-Am | too many neutron things are released without significant vetting, or documentation.... which leads to FUD in the community :/ | 15:13 |
| Mic22 | "feature-complete and stable": it would be better ofc but is it really in a schedule that don't make this unuseful? I mean this is less useful if Mitaka come out stable before | 15:15 |
| Mic22 | don't you think? | 15:15 |
| Sam-I-Am | complex things pushed for release just to make schedules never works | 15:17 |
| Mic22 | Your decision ofc but speeking from my point of view (a company poit of view) OVN can already be a fit into a lot of deployments even without being feature complete. This can lead to a lot more testing that usually speed things up. | 15:22 |
| Mic22 | I agree that push things just to release is stupid but whoever has a liberty deployment now will probably upgrade to Mitaka so maintaining liberty after mitaka is out seems to me a little bit "work for noone" | 15:24 |
| Mic22 | but still is just my idea | 15:24 |
| Sam-I-Am | its not clear-cut | 15:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | the key is having good documentation for what does and doesn't work | 15:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | then making sure whatever a user needs to change down the road to enable the last set of features doesn't require re-deploying everything from scratch | 15:28 |
| Sam-I-Am | imo, the audience we want to adopt ovn has high expectations given prior experiences with neutron | 15:32 |
| Mic22 | that's the point neutron can be a pain in the ass and OVN is making this a lot more simple and a lot more stable | 15:36 |
| Mic22 | giving out this feeling will lead to have a lot more people testing, trying failing and giving new ideas | 15:37 |
| Sam-I-Am | yes, but right now some of the big advantages of ovn don't work ... like the built-in agents that replace L3/DHCP etc | 15:37 |
| russellb | our tempest reliability seems to have taken a hit .... | 15:37 |
| Sam-I-Am | using a built-in L3 agent that includes redundancy and performance increases is a *big* deal | 15:38 |
| Sam-I-Am | russellb: howso? | 15:38 |
| russellb | just seeing failures more regularly | 15:38 |
| Sam-I-Am | anything in particular or just transient? | 15:39 |
| russellb | transient | 15:39 |
| Mic22 | true but that's already a lot compared to the plain neutron with L2 agents, ovs agents, etc... that crash and fuckup not every day but a lot of times. Or just a single fail that can lead to a downtime of a minute in the whole network. | 15:40 |
| Mic22 | This stuff is for example the main reason why in my company we are still not using neutron | 15:41 |
| Sam-I-Am | ovs is still going to be fun when it breaks | 15:42 |
| Sam-I-Am | hence why a lot of operators adopt neutron+linuxbridge | 15:42 |
| Sam-I-Am | seeing ovn being tested at some level of scale before release is a really great thing | 15:43 |
| Sam-I-Am | i hate to repeat the story of DVR... | 15:43 |
| Mic22 | yes but how do you want to gain this tests when the only possible senario of testing is devstack? | 15:44 |
| regXboi | russelb: what's the patch to fix devstack blowing chunks on tox? | 15:46 |
| regXboi | er russellb: ^^^^^ | 15:46 |
| * russellb was not aware of any chunks being blown | 15:46 | |
| Sam-I-Am | me neither | 15:47 |
| Sam-I-Am | is your devstack drunk? | 15:47 |
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| regXboi | Sam-I-Am: i'm looking at stack failing because of recursion blow up when installing tox | 15:48 |
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| russellb | Mic22: http://openvswitch.org/pipermail/dev/2016-January/064484.html | 16:03 |
| russellb | and kind of related: http://openvswitch.org/pipermail/dev/2016-January/064485.html | 16:04 |
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| mestery | russellb: Checkout kevinbenton's comments replying to mine on routed networks | 16:27 |
| mestery | To me, routed networks adds segments to neutron's logical model | 16:27 |
| mestery | Thus, it's more than just ML2 like he's claiming | 16:27 |
| mestery | Maybe I'm wrong, circling with carl_baldwin on it now :) | 16:27 |
| russellb | cool | 16:27 |
| russellb | about to grab lunch, but will read up this afternoon | 16:28 |
| mestery | enjoy lunch! | 16:28 |
| Mic22 | russelb: very good now mistakes are fixed, have a good lunch! | 16:29 |
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| regXboi | sigh | 17:06 |
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| regXboi | mestery: I'm going to try and restack on master rather than stable/liberty | 17:06 |
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| regXboi | Sam-I-Am: moo - what's failing on my stack is tox --notest -efull | 17:18 |
| regXboi | I thought we had this fixed, but this stable/liberty stack appears to not know about it | 17:18 |
| Sam-I-Am | patch not backported? | 17:21 |
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| russellb | ovn meeting in 5 minutes | 18:08 |
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| Sam-I-Am | russellb: i really need some input from OVS people regarding the note in the networking guide about version requirements | 18:09 |
| Sam-I-Am | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/267728/ | 18:09 |
| Sam-I-Am | the backport is getting a -1 now | 18:10 |
| Sam-I-Am | there's 2 bugs, one for openstack-manuals, and one in devstack... regarding roughly the same thing. | 18:10 |
| russellb | ok | 18:10 |
| Sam-I-Am | the bugs in question are in the comments on this review | 18:11 |
| regXboi | russellb: here or in #openvswitch? | 18:14 |
| Sam-I-Am | probably #openvswitch | 18:15 |
| regXboi | yeah, I'm not seeing traffic in either place | 18:15 |
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| mestery | Question for folks: Is the tenant tunnel type configurable in OVN, or is GENEVE all we've got? | 19:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | geneve or stt? | 19:27 |
| mestery | that's it? | 19:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | vxlan can't carry the metadata iirc | 19:27 |
| mestery | I know that | 19:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | so its only there for vtep | 19:27 |
| mestery | So, STT does work? | 19:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | the docs says its there... :) | 19:27 |
| mestery | coolio | 19:27 |
| Sam-I-Am | i havent tried it | 19:28 |
| Sam-I-Am | docs say it might perform better in some cases | 19:28 |
| mestery | stt is much sexier | 19:28 |
| mestery | :) | 19:28 |
| azbiswas | ovs-vsctl --no-wait set open_vswitch . external-ids:ovn-encap-type="geneve" | 19:28 |
| azbiswas | That's how the ovn-controller determines encap | 19:28 |
| * mestery needs to try this with STT | 19:29 | |
| * Sam-I-Am makes notes for docs | 19:29 | |
| Sam-I-Am | it'll be a bit different setting things via ovs-vsctl instead of config files | 19:29 |
| Sam-I-Am | like provider nets | 19:30 |
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| russellb | mestery: Sam-I-Am yes STT is supported, in theory, but i'm not sure anyone ever tests it | 19:50 |
| mestery | thanks russellb | 19:51 |
| russellb | vxlan comes up in requests sometimes, mainly around "what about older hardware that doesn't have geneve offload yet" | 19:52 |
| russellb | vxlan-gpe and nsh support is in progress for OVS. it seems like we could use that in theory to be able to support vxlan for OVN | 19:52 |
| russellb | but that's a ways off, if at all | 19:53 |
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| Guest89435 | mestery: unless you're going through a firewall ;) | 20:02 |
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| * arosen device that does state tracking. | 20:03 | |
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| flaviof | mestery hey! | 20:32 |
| mestery | flaviof: Hey my friend! | 20:32 |
| flaviof | mestery wrt to stt, you will need "Linux OVS tree", right? | 20:32 |
| flaviof | not in linux upstream... | 20:32 |
| mestery | I guess so yes | 20:32 |
| flaviof | mestery ack, just learning from my gurus as i 'listen'. | 20:33 |
| mestery | :) | 20:33 |
| * flaviof found a nice table of what is supported where in the ovs faq (https://github.com/openvswitch/ovs/blob/master/FAQ.md) | 20:35 | |
| mestery | Sweet, thanks flaviof! | 20:41 |
| flaviof | np! | 20:41 |
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