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| shintaro | hi | 14:01 |
|---|---|---|
| smcginnis | o/ | 14:01 |
| mihalis68 | o/ | 14:01 |
| mihalis68 | #startmeeting Ops Meetup Team | 14:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 28 14:01:59 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mihalis68. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Ops Meetup Team)" | 14:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ops_meetup_team' | 14:02 |
| mrhillsman | o/ | 14:02 |
| mihalis68 | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-meetups-team | 14:02 |
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| mihalis68 | formative agenda and attendees list in that link | 14:02 |
| emccormick | o/ | 14:02 |
| mihalis68 | hi all | 14:03 |
| med_ | \o | 14:03 |
| shintaro | hi | 14:03 |
| mihalis68 | I haven't had time to prepare a very detailed agenda. | 14:03 |
| mihalis68 | Do people want to self-report on their actions? | 14:03 |
| mihalis68 | I see I didn't action myself, but I did take the topic of co-location to the mailing list | 14:04 |
| emccormick | I missed last week, so I had none unless someone volunteered me | 14:04 |
| mihalis68 | and for an older topic, the OpsGuide is ready to be announced with a blog which I'm helping out with (it's up on the openstack wiki already) | 14:04 |
| shintaro | I've updated the Tokyo agenda planning etherpad and spreadsheet skeleton so please everyone check it | 14:04 |
| mihalis68 | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/OpsGuide | 14:05 |
| shintaro | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/TYO-ops-meetup-2018 | 14:05 |
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| mihalis68 | shintaro I see you contacted the foundation about the use of eventbrite funds, thanks | 14:05 |
| mihalis68 | did everyone see the thread about co-location on the mailing list? | 14:05 |
| shintaro | yes we will get OpsMeetups logo in few weeks | 14:06 |
| emccormick | yeah. It kinda went quiet though | 14:06 |
| emccormick | I tried to stay out of it to start with. Perhaps we should stoke the flames again. | 14:06 |
| mihalis68 | any other comments on previous actions? | 14:06 |
| mihalis68 | #topic actions | 14:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "actions (Meeting topic: Ops Meetup Team)" | 14:07 | |
| mihalis68 | all previous actions appear complete | 14:07 |
| mihalis68 | #topic Tokyo | 14:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tokyo (Meeting topic: Ops Meetup Team)" | 14:07 | |
| mihalis68 | what's to be done still for tokyo? | 14:07 |
| mihalis68 | I recall that breakfast+coffee is open for sponsorship, as well as swag, is that right? | 14:07 |
| mihalis68 | and also the evening event venue is not yet locked in | 14:08 |
| shintaro | yes. I'm asking if the Foundation can provide Tshirts | 14:08 |
| smcginnis | Could someone add the Eventbright registration link to the etherpad? I know I have it somewhere, but might be good to have it in there. | 14:08 |
| emccormick | yeah | 14:08 |
| emccormick | https://www.eventbrite.com/e/openstack-ops-midcycle-tokyo-tickets-39089912982 | 14:09 |
| smcginnis | emccormick: Thanks! | 14:09 |
| shintaro | added to the etherpad | 14:10 |
| shintaro | 7 people have registered as of yesterday. | 14:11 |
| smcginnis | I'll probably register today. | 14:11 |
| mihalis68 | cool, thanks. I see the link in our agenda for today and on the tokyo planning page | 14:11 |
| emccormick | We're already at 20% of what we had 2 weeks before MEX so good start :D | 14:12 |
| mihalis68 | are the event planning team for Tokyo ready to talk about precise cost figures for breakfast+coffee? | 14:12 |
| mihalis68 | as I can ask for my company to pick that up, but only when it's a firm quota | 14:13 |
| mihalis68 | quote I mean | 14:13 |
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| mihalis68 | maybe I can work on that offline with shintaro (i.e. via email) | 14:13 |
| shintaro | I'll create sponsor prospectus as edger did in Mexico | 14:13 |
| mihalis68 | ok good, thanks! | 14:14 |
| mihalis68 | will you ask for swag and social-event sponsors too? | 14:14 |
| shintaro | Foundation may be able to provide swag (T-shirt) | 14:14 |
| mihalis68 | #action shintaro to provide sponsor prospectus for Tokyo sponsorship opportunities | 14:14 |
| mihalis68 | I hope we can manage some items in western sizes. A real 2X for example | 14:15 |
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| mihalis68 | we had a problem with some in-house swag such that a hoodie marked 2X was a tight squeeze even for my arms :| | 14:16 |
| mihalis68 | i'm sure I'm not alone in mostly liking the t-shirts, as opposed to knick-knacks | 14:16 |
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| mihalis68 | any news about the social event for Tokyo? | 14:17 |
| shintaro | no update on the event venue. | 14:17 |
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| mihalis68 | Ok, so I think the biggest priority going forward is that and the technical agenda | 14:18 |
| mihalis68 | I added some +1s to topics on your ether pad. I assume that's what you're after to assess interest? | 14:18 |
| mihalis68 | One thing we might do is scrape the topics from Mexico and see which ones were popular sessions. Thoughts? | 14:19 |
| shintaro | thank you. we still need input from the community so I'll email the ML once the track idea is good with this team | 14:19 |
| emccormick | I generally tend to cherry pick like that. Hence the top 4 that are there already ;) | 14:19 |
| smcginnis | mihalis68: Good idea. | 14:19 |
| emccormick | If you had favorites from other meetups that you'd like to see continued, by all means put them in | 14:19 |
| mihalis68 | #action shintaro to stir things up on the mailing to get participation in the technical agenda planning for tokyo | 14:19 |
| shintaro | I will also add the popular topics from the past Meetups | 14:20 |
| mihalis68 | openstack LTS releases was so "popular" in mexico we didn't finish and instead ran out of time during a fierce debate | 14:20 |
| mihalis68 | ok great! | 14:20 |
| mihalis68 | #action shintaro to bring forward "greatest hits" topics from previous sessions | 14:20 |
| mihalis68 | I'll also look at the mexico stuff and try to remember which ones were "live wire" sessions | 14:21 |
| smcginnis | If there's anything I can contribute for Cinder, TC, or general | 14:21 |
| smcginnis | "dev input" let me know. | 14:21 |
| mihalis68 | thanks sean! | 14:22 |
| mihalis68 | ok, feels like tokyo is moving nicely. | 14:22 |
| mihalis68 | #topic possible co-location of ops meetups with PTG | 14:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "possible co-location of ops meetups with PTG (Meeting topic: Ops Meetup Team)" | 14:22 | |
| mihalis68 | It seems to me that Thierry was against | 14:23 |
| mihalis68 | https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/2H9PAX4A/ttx | 14:24 |
| med_ | agreed, he's protecting his time and his agenda. | 14:24 |
| mihalis68 | I hope it's not a breach of protocol to extract his message this way. It is a public and archived mailing list after all | 14:24 |
| med_ | rather, the dev's time and his dev agenda | 14:24 |
| med_ | no, should be totally fine | 14:25 |
| smcginnis | The feeling I got from a lot of past PTG attendees was they already have a hard time managing their schedule and they are afraid of making that worse. | 14:25 |
| smcginnis | And losing focused dev time. | 14:25 |
| VW | hey guys - sorry I'm late | 14:26 |
| smcginnis | I forget, did we discuss having it post-Summit? Since those are 3-4 days, might be easier to piggy back on that event instead. | 14:26 |
| med_ | welcome VW | 14:26 |
| mihalis68 | hi vw! | 14:27 |
| med_ | smcginnis, the Forum at the summit is more or less an Ops event already (by design) so I'm not sure I follow your suggestion. | 14:27 |
| mrhillsman | post-summit could be interesting but possibly that same, "after x days my brain" | 14:27 |
| mihalis68 | I don't recall the idea of drafting behind the main event, however the event we're talking about is traditionally mid-way between them | 14:27 |
| med_ | a different type of event right after/adjoined? | 14:27 |
| mihalis68 | although as pointed out last week, it is no longer "mid-cycle" since the cycle now starts at PTG | 14:28 |
| VW | well, one of the things we talked about in the session at the last summit was an ideal output of midcycle sessions would be submissions for sessions at the next summit | 14:28 |
| VW | or at least folks tasked to do so | 14:28 |
| VW | so, putting it right after the summit might make that tricky | 14:28 |
| mihalis68 | yeah, agreed for my part | 14:29 |
| mihalis68 | I think there are a couple of propositions I was confusing last week. My potential attendance at PTG (especially the first 2 days) and "official co-location" | 14:29 |
| mihalis68 | I quite agree that the former is likely to work. I'm sure I'd be welcome to attend the first couple of days and work on dev/operator common goals | 14:30 |
| smcginnis | med_: Yeah, thinking the Forum would be the combined dev/ops discussions. Ideally pre-Forum/Summit have a day or two of focused ops sessions just to share the war stories and come up with a few key points to bring into the Forum. | 14:30 |
| mihalis68 | but "official co-location" of ops meetups and PTG seems dead in the water to me | 14:30 |
| smcginnis | mihalis68: I think you are right. | 14:31 |
| mihalis68 | if I put my meetups team member hat on, I can't invite the operator community to PTG, we're not really welcome en masse | 14:31 |
| mihalis68 | I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts on this | 14:32 |
| VW | I would say it's probably that we aren't as effective en masse there versus not welcome, but yeah | 14:32 |
| emccormick | Yeah, it pretty much violates my non-interference rule. | 14:32 |
| smcginnis | To be clear, ops-focused folks are welcome at the PTG to provide input during the design discussions. It just can't turn into a mini-Forum. | 14:32 |
| shintaro | PTG is not for ops, I agree | 14:32 |
| emccormick | I want to do it, but I also don't want to disrupt and cause angst among devs. | 14:32 |
| mihalis68 | I accept VWs refinement but I think it amounts to the same thing | 14:33 |
| mihalis68 | co-location seems dead. Agreed? | 14:33 |
| mrhillsman | it is just a matter of what you are discussing as lbragstad mentioned last week | 14:33 |
| mihalis68 | Please object if you don't agree | 14:33 |
| mihalis68 | or at least official co-location as I'm calling it | 14:33 |
| emccormick | +1 dead | 14:33 |
| emccormick | sad but true | 14:34 |
| mihalis68 | #agreed "official co-location" of ops meetups and PTG appears to be at least inefficient and possibly unwelcome | 14:34 |
| med_ | so my point has been the nature of PTG would have to change/expand for it to succeed. | 14:34 |
| mihalis68 | individual operators attending PTG is still fine | 14:34 |
| mihalis68 | yes I agree entirey | 14:34 |
| mihalis68 | +1 med if they expanded the definition, I'd reconsider my vote on this | 14:35 |
| med_ | well, I think we'd have to lobby for it (even more so) to change the definition and I'm not seeing the momentum here to do that, so fait accompli | 14:36 |
| emccormick | So with this topic banked for the time being...do we discuss region rotation schedule and proposal solicitation? | 14:36 |
| mihalis68 | this leads to the conclusion that we should try for an ops-focused event between vancouver and the summit after | 14:36 |
| smcginnis | Probably August/September again. | 14:36 |
| mihalis68 | yes I think we are back to an intended north american event in the second "slot" of 2018 | 14:36 |
| emccormick | *nod* | 14:36 |
| mihalis68 | and perhaps attempting to bring in openstack logistics assistance earlier in the process | 14:37 |
| med_ | +1 | 14:37 |
| shintaro | +1 | 14:37 |
| mihalis68 | so we should invite hosting offers! | 14:37 |
| emccormick | +1 | 14:38 |
| VW | yes | 14:38 |
| VW | we need to put the call out for potential hosts | 14:38 |
| mihalis68 | is anyone itching to do this? If not I can request that | 14:38 |
| VW | I'll draft a note | 14:39 |
| VW | you'be been doing the lion's share of emailing | 14:39 |
| VW | we have an etherpad template for them to fill out, don't we? | 14:39 |
| mihalis68 | #action VW to issue the official request for hosts for slot 2 meet up in 2018, on behalf of Ops Meetups Team | 14:39 |
| mihalis68 | yes, it's ... somewhere. I will dig it out | 14:39 |
| mihalis68 | I'll get that to you today | 14:39 |
| mihalis68 | I think it would be great coming from VW | 14:40 |
| VW | perfect - thanks mihalis68 | 14:40 |
| mihalis68 | wow lots of progress | 14:40 |
| mihalis68 | I want to make another plea for feedback on the newly converted Ops Guide | 14:40 |
| mihalis68 | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OpsGuide | 14:41 |
| * med_ takes an action to review it | 14:41 | |
| mihalis68 | as I briefly alluded to, I'm helping with a log submission for super user which will announce this | 14:41 |
| shintaro | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-meetup-venue-discuss-1st-2018 | 14:41 |
| mihalis68 | and then I suppose there should be a task to check and modernize it | 14:41 |
| mihalis68 | thanks Shintaro! | 14:41 |
| mihalis68 | the conversion was content-neutral (i.e. if the openstack CLI commands were dated, they still are, for example) | 14:42 |
| mihalis68 | and I think that would be a separate team | 14:42 |
| mihalis68 | ops docs team | 14:42 |
| mihalis68 | thoughts? | 14:42 |
| mihalis68 | rationale: documentation is a LOT of work and involves lots of trivia e.g. spacing spelling etc. Would completely clutter this meeting I feel | 14:43 |
| mihalis68 | well, I'd be on that team (I think i recall volunteering, effectively, in mexico city) | 14:44 |
| mihalis68 | #action med_ to review ops guide | 14:44 |
| smcginnis | Docs can always use more eyes and more contributors. | 14:44 |
| mihalis68 | thanks! | 14:44 |
| mihalis68 | yeah | 14:45 |
| emccormick | I would participate as well. | 14:45 |
| mihalis68 | ok great. | 14:45 |
| emccormick | I think for the start though, it would be nice to get a larger group to look it over and either fix issues or report them. | 14:45 |
| emccormick | we could have a core team, but it shouldn't be so restrictive as other project teams. | 14:46 |
| mihalis68 | yep. to start with feedback can be addressed to me if you like (email on agenda) | 14:46 |
| emccormick | I think that's why the docs team struggles to keep people. | 14:46 |
| mihalis68 | as a practical matter, I have wiki edit privileges and so can definitely wade in and fix the doc | 14:46 |
| mihalis68 | note that so far the wiki version is as-converted from the source | 14:47 |
| VW | my ride is here - have to run | 14:47 |
| mihalis68 | if we need any large scale changes, we still have a one-time option of going back, editing in source and reconverting | 14:47 |
| VW | send me that info mihalis68 and I'll get a note out | 14:47 |
| mihalis68 | thanks VW! | 14:47 |
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| mihalis68 | will do | 14:47 |
| mihalis68 | once the wiki is being edited in place, however, it will have to be edited that way forever after | 14:47 |
| emccormick | It was suggested to use something like this | 14:47 |
| emccormick | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/QueensDocTesting | 14:47 |
| emccormick | to do reviewing. | 14:48 |
| emccormick | That way work isn't duplicated so much | 14:48 |
| emccormick | it was also suggested to use Launchpad to file bugs | 14:48 |
| mihalis68 | I'm not sure about that last idea | 14:48 |
| mihalis68 | this document was ejected from the codebase due to lack of updates | 14:48 |
| emccormick | not talking about the full workflow. Just a standalone launchpad | 14:49 |
| mihalis68 | ah ok. that sounds fine if we can build one (no idea) | 14:49 |
| emccormick | basically a place for people who see things broken to report problems. It could be something more simple *shrug* | 14:49 |
| mihalis68 | I was just thinking aloud that the openstack docs team, having shed this doc, don't want to see bug reports for it, I would think | 14:49 |
| emccormick | I don't know how, but I can ask around | 14:49 |
| emccormick | yeah they won't | 14:49 |
| emccormick | it'd be our new "team" such as it is | 14:50 |
| mihalis68 | #action emccormick to investigate a launchpad just for ops docs, starting with OpsGuide | 14:50 |
| mihalis68 | thanks! | 14:50 |
| mihalis68 | one thing we need to start thinking about: our "ops mid-cycle meetup" events are no longer mid-cycle | 14:51 |
| mihalis68 | so what are they for? | 14:51 |
| med_ | as VW said, maybe they are for planning what to say/advocate at the Forum | 14:52 |
| mihalis68 | we can all answer that, of course, but when we invite people from the wider operator community, some who haven't been before, I think we should try to have a good definition of these events for those people | 14:52 |
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| med_ | ^ discussed in Sydney I think | 14:52 |
| mihalis68 | unfortunately I wasn't there | 14:52 |
| med_ | also, for catching up on best practices and pain points | 14:52 |
| med_ | then converting ^ into Forum actions | 14:52 |
| mihalis68 | someone want to take a crack at redefining the mission of mid-cycles? | 14:52 |
| mihalis68 | if nothing else, if we don't fix nomenclature, it appears we're not even paying attention | 14:53 |
| med_ | but also clearly to have some focus on a tech/need such as shintaro has a track for in Tokyo | 14:53 |
| med_ | I won't take an action but I'll noodle it a bit and if I come up with a strawman I'll mail it out. | 14:54 |
| mihalis68 | ok. I'll put it on the agenda for next week and we can pick up this debate then | 14:54 |
| med_ | seems like we can have a more transparent/obvious short name, description fo rthis. | 14:54 |
| med_ | +1 | 14:54 |
| mihalis68 | <insert inspiration here> | 14:55 |
| mihalis68 | any other business, or we can close 5 minutes early | 14:55 |
| med_ | fyi, I will be afk next tues meeting. | 14:56 |
| med_ | so if I come up with something it will hit the ML. | 14:56 |
| mihalis68 | works for me! Thanks!! | 14:56 |
| mihalis68 | last call | 14:56 |
| mihalis68 | #endmeeting | 14:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion of topics related to operating Openstack infrastructures at scale | Mailing list: http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-operators | Logs: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/" | 14:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 28 14:56:46 2017 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ops_meetup_team/2017/ops_meetup_team.2017-11-28-14.01.html | 14:56 |
| mihalis68 | thanks all | 14:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ops_meetup_team/2017/ops_meetup_team.2017-11-28-14.01.txt | 14:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ops_meetup_team/2017/ops_meetup_team.2017-11-28-14.01.log.html | 14:56 |
| shintaro | thank you | 14:56 |
| smcginnis | Thanks everyone. | 14:57 |
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| med_ | likewise thanks | 14:59 |
| mihalis68 | I think I shared the wrong link for the ops guide :| | 15:08 |
| mihalis68 | this is the one : https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OpsGuide | 15:08 |
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| mihalis68 | hosting offer selection ether pad for slot 2, 2018 : https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-meetup-venue-discuss-2nd-2018 | 15:24 |
| mihalis68 | I will mail this to VW now | 15:25 |
| VW | got it mihalis68 | 15:26 |
| VW | thanks! | 15:26 |
| mihalis68 | cool. It's in your inbox too, now. I cc:Ed the team also | 15:27 |
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| VW | perfect. I'll work on getting something out today/tomorrow | 15:28 |
| mihalis68 | I also mailed out the minutes links and declared official co-location dead | 15:30 |
| mihalis68 | considered emailing ttx and telling him it's dead :) | 15:31 |
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| mgagne | anyone still using "old" stacktach? (not v3) | 19:31 |
| mgagne | we found that the event field is too short for some events such as compute.instance.live_migration.rollback.dest.start | 19:32 |
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