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| openstackgerrit | Akihiro Motoki proposed openstack/releases master: Release horizon 17.2.0 (ussuri) https://review.opendev.org/701672 | 07:16 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Release python-octaviaclient 2.0.0 https://review.opendev.org/701449 | 10:51 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Release OpenStack-Ansible Stein https://review.opendev.org/699978 | 11:00 |
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| openstackgerrit | Mark Goddard proposed openstack/releases master: Release Kayobe 7.0.0 for Train https://review.opendev.org/701724 | 13:11 |
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| openstackgerrit | Akihiro Motoki proposed openstack/releases master: Release horizon 18.0.0 (ussuri) https://review.opendev.org/701672 | 14:00 |
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| armstrong | Hello | 15:23 |
| armstrong | meeting time changed? | 15:23 |
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| smcginnis | A few more minutes. | 15:57 |
| armstrong | ok | 15:58 |
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| smcginnis | #startmeeting releaseteam | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Jan 9 16:00:10 2020 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is smcginnis. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'releaseteam' | 16:00 |
| smcginnis | Ping list: ttx armstrong diablo_rojo, diablo_rojo_phon | 16:00 |
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| evrardjp | o/ | 16:00 |
| hberaud | o/ | 16:00 |
| diablo_rojo_phon | O/ | 16:00 |
| evrardjp | look who is back from holidays! me \o/ | 16:00 |
| armstrong | o/ | 16:01 |
| smcginnis | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ussuri-relmgt-tracking Agenda | 16:01 |
| evrardjp | L225 | 16:02 |
| ttx | o/ | 16:02 |
| * evrardjp guesses | 16:02 | |
| smcginnis | #topic Remaining ussuri-1 refresh | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Remaining ussuri-1 refresh (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:02 | |
| smcginnis | #link https://review.opendev.org/#/c/698508/ | 16:02 |
| smcginnis | hberaud: Do you know if your concern has been addressed there? ^ | 16:03 |
| * hberaud take a look | 16:04 | |
| smcginnis | Oh, sorry. Actual comment was from dtantsur | 16:04 |
| dtantsur | what have I done? :) | 16:04 |
| hberaud | yep the reno is still missing | 16:04 |
| hberaud | dtantsur: ^^ | 16:05 |
| dtantsur | ah | 16:05 |
| smcginnis | This is just milestone 1. What does everyone think? Should we just abandon this one and pick it up at milestone 2? | 16:05 |
| dtantsur | mordred: ^^^ | 16:05 |
| hberaud | I think we can go ahead to catch error ASAP | 16:06 |
| smcginnis | hberaud: You mean go ahead with getting this released now so we can catch errors sooner? | 16:06 |
| hberaud | yes | 16:06 |
| evrardjp | and have the next release have the reno? | 16:06 |
| smcginnis | That makes sense to me. Finding out if there are issues with it sooner rather than later is better. | 16:06 |
| evrardjp | that sounds okay to me | 16:06 |
| hberaud | IMHO it's more safer | 16:07 |
| smcginnis | It would be great if we can quick get a reno added, but not the end of the world. | 16:07 |
| hberaud | smcginnis: sure | 16:07 |
| smcginnis | I've removed my -1 on there. Would be great if the team can ack if they think it's good to go ahead with it now. | 16:07 |
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| dtantsur | I'm -0 on releasing anything so major without a reno.. | 16:08 |
| smcginnis | Is there one proposed yet? | 16:08 |
| smcginnis | I haven't had a chance to look. | 16:08 |
| evrardjp | dtantsur: that's why we hope to have a reno patch soon merged so we can bump the sha and release ? :D | 16:08 |
| dtantsur | I haven't looked, I'm not following o-c-c closely | 16:08 |
| dtantsur | I can prepare one if nobody else wants to | 16:09 |
| smcginnis | That would be great! | 16:09 |
| evrardjp | that would be awesome! | 16:09 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: haha | 16:09 |
| smcginnis | Hopefully that can get through ASAP and we can get this released after the sha gets updated. | 16:09 |
| smcginnis | Let's plan on that then. dtantsur, if you happen to remember, please let me know the patch adding the reno so I can review/watch it. | 16:10 |
| smcginnis | #topic Validate countdown email content | 16:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Validate countdown email content (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:10 | |
| smcginnis | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/relmgmt-weekly-emails | 16:10 |
| evrardjp | or ping in this channel so other people can also vote | 16:10 |
| smcginnis | ++ | 16:11 |
| smcginnis | Line 87 in the countdown etherpad. | 16:11 |
| * smcginnis reads | 16:11 | |
| evrardjp | I read mid-milestone2 can't find anything to say more. It looks good | 16:11 |
| ttx | OK, I'll turn it into process tomorrow | 16:12 |
| smcginnis | Yep, content looks good to me. | 16:12 |
| smcginnis | #topic False positive tests | 16:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "False positive tests (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:13 | |
| dtantsur | smcginnis: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/701761/ | 16:13 |
| smcginnis | #link https://review.opendev.org/#/c/698845/1 | 16:13 |
| smcginnis | dtantsur: Thanks! | 16:13 |
| smcginnis | I think we only have a check for all repos in later releases. | 16:14 |
| smcginnis | So if one release contains, for example, three repos, then all subsequent releases need to contain all three. | 16:14 |
| ttx | hmm | 16:15 |
| ttx | does it sound like something we should add? | 16:15 |
| ttx | It's a bit hard to spot | 16:15 |
| smcginnis | Since some teams need to release some of their repos separately, I don't think we have any kind of reconciliation with the governance data. | 16:15 |
| ttx | The gov/rel consistency check I'm workign on will catch it | 16:15 |
| ttx | but it's a periodic check, not immediate | 16:16 |
| smcginnis | How will that work if a team has some c-w-i deliverables and some c-w-rc? | 16:16 |
| *** slaweq has quit IRC | 16:17 | |
| evrardjp | wasn't that a problem for OSA in some stable branches? | 16:17 |
| ttx | those would be separate files right | 16:18 |
| smcginnis | evrardjp: Maybe | 16:18 |
| evrardjp | because some things were split out into different deliverables in governance | 16:18 |
| smcginnis | ttx: Yes. So just looking at the governance data, how do we tell if something is missing or just not released separately? | 16:18 |
| evrardjp | so inside a cycle, some have disappeared to move somewhere else | 16:18 |
| ttx | governance defines deliverables | 16:18 |
| evrardjp | some repo could have moved to a different deliverable :p | 16:19 |
| smcginnis | Or deliverables added or removed mid-cycle. | 16:19 |
| evrardjp | before m2 I guess but after m1 indeed | 16:19 |
| ttx | Like governance says A contains a1 and a2... we could check that A.yaml contanis a1 and a2 | 16:19 |
| smcginnis | We can try it out. If it works in this consistency check, maybe we can extend that into our validate job. | 16:19 |
| ttx | but yeah, stable branches would not work | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | ttx: well governance is not stable branched | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | :) | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | you said it ! :p | 16:20 |
| ttx | BUT stable used to be master once | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | oh I see, you think it's fine forward | 16:20 |
| ttx | and we have a check to check that later releases are ok | 16:20 |
| smcginnis | I suppose we could start tagging governance. :) | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: I thought of that multiple times tbh. | 16:20 |
| evrardjp | would simplify releases... | 16:21 |
| ttx | So if we just used governance to check that initial master releases are OK, it would propagate | 16:21 |
| smcginnis | It's something at least. | 16:21 |
| ttx | I can have a look at what it would take | 16:21 |
| ttx | probably not that difficult | 16:21 |
| ttx | ok next | 16:22 |
| ttx | just not today (or this month really) | 16:23 |
| smcginnis | Yeah... | 16:23 |
| smcginnis | #topic cliff issue postmortem | 16:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "cliff issue postmortem (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:23 | |
| smcginnis | Worthy of its own topic. :) | 16:23 |
| smcginnis | I haven't had a chance to try to triage what happened here. | 16:23 |
| ttx | same thing... is that something we could/should have caught | 16:23 |
| ttx | maybe we can postpone discussion then | 16:23 |
| smcginnis | Somehow the automation picked up a very old commit for cliff. | 16:23 |
| ttx | until somone has a look and can explain it | 16:23 |
| ttx | it's not urgent... just whenever a probem slips through we should have a look and see if we could avoid it in the future | 16:24 |
| smcginnis | For now at least, let's make sure we are extra careful reviewing those automated milestone patches. | 16:24 |
| smcginnis | Definitely. I don't like not knowing how something like that happened when the script should be pulling the latest from HEAD. | 16:24 |
| ttx | do you have a link? | 16:24 |
| smcginnis | To the cliff release patch? | 16:24 |
| ttx | yeah | 16:25 |
| smcginnis | https://review.opendev.org/#/c/698485/ | 16:25 |
| evrardjp | is that the right link? | 16:25 |
| smcginnis | Oddly, list-changes shows what changed between 2.11.0 and that. | 16:25 |
| ttx | hmm we should definitely check the WHY before doing milestone2 autoreleases | 16:26 |
| evrardjp | oh my bad | 16:26 |
| smcginnis | When it should have been since 2.16.0 | 16:26 |
| ttx | who can have a look in the next 4 weeks? | 16:26 |
| ttx | (hint: not me) | 16:26 |
| smcginnis | It would have been a good clue looking at the "Release will NOT include" section. | 16:26 |
| smcginnis | I will try to. | 16:26 |
| ttx | no point in using meeting time to further investigate | 16:27 |
| smcginnis | #topic "Decentralizing release approvals" thread and resulting TODOs | 16:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to ""Decentralizing release approvals" thread and resulting TODOs (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:27 | |
| ttx | yeah so there was this thread | 16:27 |
| ttx | where some speed-up solutions were proposed | 16:27 |
| ttx | first one is easy | 16:28 |
| ttx | going back to single-approval of releases changes | 16:28 |
| ttx | Waiting for two +2s can take some time | 16:28 |
| ttx | especially when the proposer is Sean or me | 16:28 |
| evrardjp | previous topic makes me think two approvals could (but no certainty) have helped | 16:28 |
| ttx | It's obviously a trade-off | 16:29 |
| evrardjp | yup but it's one in a x | 16:29 |
| ttx | more reviewers means we catch more things, but delays releases | 16:29 |
| smcginnis | Maybe for those auto-patches we keep the two +2's. | 16:29 |
| smcginnis | As much as we can. | 16:29 |
| evrardjp | I would be inclined to trust the auto-patches more, so I am sad here :p | 16:29 |
| evrardjp | haha | 16:29 |
| smcginnis | Yeah, very true. Very sadly true. | 16:29 |
| ttx | I think single-approval is the right tradeoff | 16:30 |
| ttx | between two reviews and no review at all | 16:30 |
| smcginnis | Once we get root cause, maybe that will explain things sufficiently to not have to worry about more than 1 +2 on those. | 16:30 |
| evrardjp | As long as it doesnt' prevent people to onboard releases. | 16:30 |
| smcginnis | I agree. For the most part, our automation is good at catching most issues. | 16:30 |
| ttx | there will be more errors yes, but also less frustration due to delays | 16:30 |
| evrardjp | I think that's what matters | 16:30 |
| smcginnis | So a single human review checking things like semver rules is probably enough in most cases. | 16:31 |
| evrardjp | when projects do follow them... ahem.. :p | 16:31 |
| ttx | The second proposal is around stable releases | 16:31 |
| ttx | not waiting for a Monday to pass | 16:31 |
| ttx | At this point the Monday does not help | 16:31 |
| evrardjp | so wait, what's the difference? a day? | 16:31 |
| ttx | since we don;t really get stable reviews by waiting | 16:31 |
| smcginnis | For single +2, should we try +2 first, wait a bit to give someone else a chance, then +A after some set amount of delay? Or just go for it? | 16:32 |
| smcginnis | Yeah, the Monday stable review day hasn't been working for quite awhile now I think. | 16:32 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: +1 | 16:32 |
| ttx | smcginnis: I'd just go for it if you're comfortable with it | 16:32 |
| evrardjp | ttx: doesn't that apply for all votes? :p | 16:32 |
| ttx | if you're not sure, just do not w+1 | 16:32 |
| smcginnis | Stable review in general. I've been thinking maybe those are just the ones where we require two +2's so we get more eyes on watching for stable policy issues. | 16:32 |
| smcginnis | ttx: ++ | 16:33 |
| ttx | that would be fair | 16:33 |
| evrardjp | yeah I think stable should keep the 2x+2 rule | 16:33 |
| smcginnis | There's some "specialized" knowledge with stable, but nothing that much more that normal release team folks shouldn't be able to handle. | 16:33 |
| ttx | So... master = single-approval OK, can wait for more in case of doubt | 16:33 |
| ttx | stable = 2x +2s needed, no wait | 16:34 |
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| ttx | let's see how that goes | 16:34 |
| smcginnis | That sounds like a good plan to me. | 16:34 |
| evrardjp | yeah, and in doubt don't +2 just +1 ? | 16:34 |
| smcginnis | We can always course correct down the road if we find it's causing issues. | 16:34 |
| evrardjp | that's what I have been doing for now | 16:34 |
| ttx | +2 in case of "yes but could use a second opinion" | 16:34 |
| evrardjp | yup | 16:34 |
| ttx | +2 w+1 in case of "I'm pretty sure this is good" | 16:35 |
| ttx | Like when an experienced liaison submits it | 16:35 |
| evrardjp | that's my rule :) | 16:35 |
| smcginnis | These all seem reasonable to me. | 16:35 |
| evrardjp | seems to work so far, I didn't break the world | 16:35 |
| evrardjp | (yet) | 16:35 |
| smcginnis | ;) | 16:35 |
| ttx | smcginnis: maybe close the thread by saying we've relaxed the rules to speed up release processing, let's see how that goes? | 16:35 |
| smcginnis | #agreed Current releases only require 1 +2 and can be approved if comfortable. Stable reviews should have two from any release manager. | 16:36 |
| smcginnis | Will do. | 16:36 |
| ttx | Note that it's also valid for all those patches from me that you have +2ed and nobody else reviewed :P | 16:36 |
| smcginnis | Subtle hint? :) | 16:36 |
| ttx | subtle is my middle name | 16:36 |
| evrardjp | haha | 16:37 |
| diablo_rojo_phon | Haha | 16:37 |
| smcginnis | #topic Dropping cycle-automatic for tempest plugins | 16:37 |
| evrardjp | ptl is different, you know that smcginnis has all the rights in the world for releases. | 16:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Dropping cycle-automatic for tempest plugins (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:37 | |
| ttx | "you are so subtle" said noone to me ever | 16:37 |
| evrardjp | ttx: oh really? | 16:37 |
| evrardjp | :p | 16:37 |
| evrardjp | anyway | 16:37 |
| smcginnis | I think I added this topic, though it was weeks (years) ago. | 16:37 |
| ttx | a lot of people say "you are so devilishly crafty" | 16:38 |
| smcginnis | hehe | 16:38 |
| ttx | yeah, what's that about | 16:38 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: ofc. You want also to say it was last decade? | 16:38 |
| smcginnis | With c-a release model, we originally conceived of that for things like tempest plugins that had not previously been released. | 16:38 |
| ttx | like cycle-automatic was designed for tempest plugins | 16:38 |
| smcginnis | With the idea that we just needed to get them tagged at the end of a cycle to have a way to track the version that goes with a given version of tempest. | 16:39 |
| ttx | well c-a was mostly to make sure there would be a end release for those oft-overlooked things | 16:39 |
| smcginnis | To know what is expected to work as tempest evolves. | 16:39 |
| smcginnis | Yeah, that too. | 16:39 |
| ttx | so why on Earth would you stop doing that? | 16:39 |
| smcginnis | We originally had validation in place to make sure there weren't multiple releases, IIRC. | 16:39 |
| ttx | ah, that sounds silly | 16:40 |
| *** slaweq has quit IRC | 16:40 | |
| smcginnis | But now it turns out teams, and some downstream consumers like Red Hat, want multiple releases throughout the cycle. | 16:40 |
| smcginnis | Making them look a lot more like cycle-with-intermediary. | 16:40 |
| johnsom | Octavia is in that camp. We have had requests for "more often than once a release" tags. | 16:41 |
| smcginnis | Since we now have been doing more final c-w-i automatically proposed releases, do we need cycle-automatic, or do we just include those things in our final checks for c-w-i that have outstanding commits to release? | 16:41 |
| smcginnis | johnsom: Thanks, good to know that. | 16:41 |
| ttx | hmm | 16:41 |
| ttx | c-w-i would not do a final release at the very end | 16:42 |
| smcginnis | Or, we keep cycle-automatic, we treat it just like we treat c-w-i, but no matter what we always do a final release at the end of the cycle. | 16:42 |
| smcginnis | I guess that last one is really what we've been doing now. | 16:43 |
| ttx | yeah c-a = c-wi + final release | 16:43 |
| evrardjp | cycle-automatic doesn't prevent more releases , does it ? | 16:43 |
| ttx | no | 16:43 |
| smcginnis | Originally it did, but then folks had $reasons for wanting intermediate releases. | 16:43 |
| ttx | + No stable branch will be automatically created. | 16:43 |
| ttx | https://releases.openstack.org/reference/release_models.html#cycle-automatic | 16:43 |
| ttx | The “cycle-automatic” model is used by specific technical deliverables that need to be automatically released once at the end of a cycle. Those may, optionally, also be released in the middle of the cycle. Those do not need a stable branch created. This may be applied only to “tempest-plugin” or “other” deliverables. | 16:44 |
| ttx | I feel like that's a clear definition | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | OK, that is clear enough. So I guess we are good then. | 16:44 |
| tosky | thanks :) | 16:44 |
| armstrong | @ttx best math equation: c-a = c-wi + final release | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | :) | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | #topic AOB | 16:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: releaseteam)" | 16:45 | |
| smcginnis | Anything else to discuss today? | 16:45 |
| ttx | final release = wi-a | 16:45 |
| evrardjp | smcginnis: nope | 16:45 |
| smcginnis | I do have a patch I think we should get through: | 16:46 |
| smcginnis | https://review.opendev.org/#/c/700221/ | 16:46 |
| smcginnis | Our release announcements have bad links right now because of that. | 16:46 |
| * ttx will apply new rules | 16:46 | |
| ttx | :boom: | 16:46 |
| smcginnis | Thank | 16:46 |
| smcginnis | s | 16:47 |
| smcginnis | :0 | 16:47 |
| evrardjp | wow | 16:47 |
| evrardjp | wouldn't that be a rpoblem for a bunch of automation? | 16:47 |
| smcginnis | I think it depends on the context that the job is run. | 16:47 |
| evrardjp | oh I see | 16:47 |
| smcginnis | Like our list-changes output includes an example of the release announcement, and I think it was fine there. | 16:47 |
| smcginnis | Because in that case we call it differently and pass in the name or something. It's a little fuzzy now since I've swapped out that part. | 16:48 |
| evrardjp | tarball/null does look good though :p | 16:48 |
| smcginnis | The issue started because of an infra change I think that would clear the remote information. | 16:48 |
| smcginnis | So suddenly we would extract "null" instead of the repo name. | 16:48 |
| smcginnis | OK, if we don't have anything else, let's move along. | 16:49 |
| smcginnis | Thanks everyone! | 16:49 |
| evrardjp | thanks smcginnis and others! | 16:49 |
| smcginnis | #endmeeting | 16:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Release Managers office - Come here to discuss how to release OpenStack components - Logged at http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-release/" | 16:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Jan 9 16:49:38 2020 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/releaseteam/2020/releaseteam.2020-01-09-16.00.html | 16:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/releaseteam/2020/releaseteam.2020-01-09-16.00.txt | 16:49 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/releaseteam/2020/releaseteam.2020-01-09-16.00.log.html | 16:49 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Fix library shortname identification in announce script https://review.opendev.org/700221 | 17:02 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Release oslo.messaging 9.5.1 for Stein https://review.opendev.org/701080 | 17:31 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sean McGinnis proposed openstack/releases master: Address review comments for make_missing_releases https://review.opendev.org/701788 | 17:57 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Introduce 'abandoned' release model https://review.opendev.org/699732 | 18:03 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Release Kayobe 7.0.0 for Train https://review.opendev.org/701724 | 18:06 |
| openstackgerrit | Sean McGinnis proposed openstack/releases master: Add tools/bulk_review.sh and get-contacts https://review.opendev.org/652566 | 18:18 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Release horizon 18.0.0 (ussuri) https://review.opendev.org/701672 | 18:38 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Oslo stein releases for 2020-01-07 https://review.opendev.org/701415 | 18:41 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sean McGinnis proposed openstack/releases master: Release os-client-config for Ussuri milestone 1 https://review.opendev.org/698508 | 20:10 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/releases master: Oslo Rocky releases for 2020-01-07 https://review.opendev.org/701454 | 20:22 |
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