Wednesday, 2018-09-26

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openstackgerritSam Morrison proposed openstack/swift master: s3 secret caching  https://review.openstack.org/60352905:13
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openstackgerritMerged openstack/swift master: Clean up comment about 404s leaking out during COPYs  https://review.openstack.org/53598114:39
openstackgerritMerged openstack/swift master: Allow kmip_keymaster to be configured in proxy-server.conf  https://review.openstack.org/60493714:39
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openstackgerritThiago da Silva proposed openstack/swift master: update 1space url in associated projects  https://review.openstack.org/60546715:55
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notmynamegood morning16:44
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timburkeso, can we follow through on the "In the future, the ability to use pickle serialization will be removed." threat from https://github.com/openstack/swift/commit/e1ff51c ?17:01
timburke'cause i want to be able to reason more easily about the types we get when loading from memcache17:02
notmynametimburke: I don't know. that was only 6 years ago... ;-)17:03
notmynametimburke: or to say the same thing in different words, "yes! kill it with fire!"17:04
notmynameas long as we leave the ability to read the pickled data, and just remove the ability to write it, we should be ok. maybe we'd need a read-and-type-normalize thing so we always get consistent types in memcache17:05
timburkeso we've got a flag to go switch from "read and write pickle" to "read and write json, but be willing to read pickle" to "only read and write json" -- and i want just that last one17:08
timburkeit doesn't count as killing it with fire if we still have the config option, even if we remove one of the possible values :-P17:08
notmynametimburke: yeah, I mean remove the config option, but I personally have data in a swift cluster that I wrote circa 2012 or before that I'd still like to have access to ;-)17:10
timburkenotmyname: the question is, do you still have data in your memcache that you wrote circa 2012 that you'd still like access to?17:11
notmynamevery unlikely :-)17:12
notmynameoh, wait. did I misread/misremember? I was thinking about the metadata serialization format17:12
notmynameif it's just memcache, yeah, about 48 hours should be plenty17:12
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claygzaitcev: timburke: bumped into this (again) while lamenting how crappy py2's super method is -> http://python-future.org/faq.html#what-is-the-relationship-between-future-and-six20:33
zaitcevclayg: interesting, considering that bytes is a built-in type in py27 (as an alias to str). They probably ask to have every b'' literal using future.bytes('foo').20:36
claygi'm not sure about that20:38
timburkei keep going back and forth on six. sometimes i like it, other times i just want to embrace the fact that writing py2/3 compliant programs amounts to a comparatively simple form of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyglot_(computing)20:42
zaitcevI think we're not limited by six in our project.20:44
zaitcevThe problem I'm seeing is mostly the Unicode and tracking of what's encoded and what's not, what library uses what arguments, and what's the on-disk formats are. That's what makes Swift difficult to port. An the sheer size.20:45
zaitcevSo, swapping six for a more awesome package isn't going to help us much. Maybe fractionally. But it's only IMHO.20:46
timburkeagreed. and the idiocy that is WSGI on py320:46
zaitcevYes, PEP-333/-3333 is somewhat problematic.20:47
timburkei think i've said this before, but i don't think i've ever been so concerned about the types of variables before when writing python20:50
kota_good morning20:55
mattoliverauMorning20:58
kota_mattoliverau: o/20:58
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notmynameswift team meeting time21:00
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notmynamemy "any filesystem as long as it's xfs" was a play on the henry ford quote of "any color you want as long as it's black"21:43
notmynameand that made me look up if he actually said that. turns out, he did! but it's a more interesting story21:43
notmynamehttp://oplaunch.com/blog/2015/04/30/the-truth-about-any-color-so-long-as-it-is-black/21:44
notmynamethere are some really interesting comments on sales and marketing vs engineering in there21:44
notmynamehttps://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Swift/PriorityReviews updated22:18
DHEI looked at ZFS as an alternative that wouldn't require an auditor (or a much simpler one). I think I mentioned this before. Unfortunately it doesn't scale well in certain scenarios which is pretty much where Swift likes to sit...22:31
notmynameDHE: yeah, that sounds similar to what I've heard from other people too22:34
DHEZFS makes a lot of design decisions that are good for data reliability but bad for overhead. Making a pool per-disk in a 60-disk chassis also makes me feel highly uncomfortable. :)22:35
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notmynameI had a home zfs file server for years and years. it's a good system. just, like you said, sits in a different place than swift does22:36
DHEI'm looking at a design that would replace multiple ZFS boxes with a swift cluster. So I was looking at ZFS initially and then that idea just went up in smoke as I learned more.22:37
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mattoliveraumorning23:17
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