| *** sdague has quit IRC | 00:06 | |
| *** hongbin has quit IRC | 00:18 | |
| *** ttx has quit IRC | 01:21 | |
| *** ttx_ has joined #openstack-tc | 01:21 | |
| *** ttx_ has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** notmyname has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** smcginnis has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** tonyb has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mordred has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mrhillsman has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** samueldmq has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dhellmann has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** stevemar has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** harlowja has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** kmalloc has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** knikolla has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** evrardjp has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** zaneb has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dklyle has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** EmilienM has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dtroyer has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dtantsur|afk has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** tdasilva has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** chandankumar has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** openstackgerrit has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dims has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** ianw has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** flwang has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mriedem has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mwhahaha has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** fungi has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** johnsom has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** TheJulia has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** DuncanT has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** johnthetubaguy has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mfedosin has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dirk has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** ChanServ has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mtreinish has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** gcb has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** alex_xu has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** med_ has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** SamYaple has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** lbragstad has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** jbryce has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** ildikov has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** rosmaita has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** mugsie has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** persia has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** cmurphy has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** andreaf has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** kumarmn has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** lukebrowning_ has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** flaper87 has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** dmsimard has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** amrith has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** pabelanger has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** ttx_ has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** kumarmn has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** flwang has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** rosmaita has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** samueldmq has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** lukebrowning_ has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dmsimard has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** zaneb has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mriedem has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mtreinish has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** gcb has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mwhahaha has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** fungi has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** johnsom has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dklyle has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** lbragstad has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** flaper87 has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dhellmann has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** amrith has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** openstackgerrit has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** EmilienM has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dtroyer has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** stevemar has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mrhillsman has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mordred has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** tonyb has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** smcginnis has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** notmyname has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dims has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** harlowja has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** kmalloc has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** ianw has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** TheJulia has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** knikolla has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dtantsur|afk has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mugsie has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** alex_xu has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** evrardjp has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** jbryce has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** persia has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** med_ has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** DuncanT has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** johnthetubaguy has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** SamYaple has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** mfedosin has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** dirk has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** andreaf has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** pabelanger has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** ildikov has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** tdasilva has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** cmurphy has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** chandankumar has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** ChanServ has joined #openstack-tc | 01:28 | |
| *** barjavel.freenode.net sets mode: +o ChanServ | 01:28 | |
| *** mriedem has quit IRC | 02:00 | |
| *** mriedem has joined #openstack-tc | 02:15 | |
| *** gcb has quit IRC | 03:58 | |
| *** gcb has joined #openstack-tc | 03:59 | |
| *** gcb has quit IRC | 04:04 | |
| *** gcb has joined #openstack-tc | 04:04 | |
| *** mriedem has quit IRC | 04:05 | |
| openstackgerrit | Dai Dang Van proposed openstack/governance master: Mark Searchlight policy in code as done https://review.openstack.org/520286 | 04:11 |
|---|---|---|
| *** rosmaita has quit IRC | 05:55 | |
| *** ttx_ is now known as ttx | 07:56 | |
| *** gcb has quit IRC | 08:54 | |
| *** jpich has joined #openstack-tc | 09:06 | |
| *** gcb has joined #openstack-tc | 10:18 | |
| *** sdague has joined #openstack-tc | 10:36 | |
| fungi | another appointment this morning, but hopefully will be back in time for office hour today | 12:43 |
| *** rosmaita has joined #openstack-tc | 13:18 | |
| *** mriedem has joined #openstack-tc | 13:51 | |
| *** kumarmn has quit IRC | 14:06 | |
| *** kumarmn has joined #openstack-tc | 14:06 | |
| *** kumarmn has quit IRC | 14:10 | |
| *** kumarmn has joined #openstack-tc | 14:26 | |
| fungi | tc-members: office hour if anyone's sufficiently recovered from summiting | 15:00 |
| ttx | ohai | 15:00 |
| smcginnis | Slept great last night. :) | 15:00 |
| EmilienM | o/ | 15:00 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 15:01 |
| ttx | First topic I had: should we move our office hours time now that we switched off DST? | 15:01 |
| ttx | This one in particular is a bit early for west coast | 15:01 |
| ttx | while it's supposed to cover them | 15:02 |
| amrith | ./ | 15:02 |
| dhellmann | +0 -- it conflicts with an internal meeting I attend sometimes, but I can manage if others don't want to shift it | 15:02 |
| smcginnis | Current time is fine with me, but would be open to moving it a little later. No conflicts at least. | 15:02 |
| fungi | the only other thing i have on my schedule anywhere close to this time is the security team meeting at 17:00z which i usually make an attempt to attend | 15:03 |
| ttx | selection bias in that sample | 15:03 |
| fungi | indeed! | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 15:03 |
| ttx | mostly interested in EmilienM dtroyer... | 15:03 |
| ttx | who else on west coast | 15:04 |
| ttx | Probably simpler to start a thread | 15:04 |
| ttx | or a doodle | 15:05 |
| ttx | or both | 15:05 |
| fungi | however, if we push thursday office hour to 16:00z i'd rather not move it again in 6 months | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | go with a doodle | 15:05 |
| ttx | I'll do that | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | fungi: ++ | 15:05 |
| fungi | stable utc meeting times are more important in my opinion | 15:05 |
| ttx | unfortunately my dinner time is linked to local TZ, not utc | 15:05 |
| EmilienM | no conflict, I start my days at 6am anyway | 15:06 |
| EmilienM | and it's 7 here | 15:06 |
| * dhellmann looks askance at EmilienM | 15:06 | |
| smcginnis | fungi: ++ | 15:06 |
| * flaper87 starts his days at 6am too and he's not even in the west coast | 15:06 | |
| flaper87 | difference is, EmilienM does it for a good reason, I'm just weird | 15:07 |
| ttx | My second topic was about the TC more formally selecting election officials so that their delegation of power is more explicit | 15:07 |
| ttx | That was a request of the current officials | 15:07 |
| smcginnis | Is there a concern with the wrong people being election officials? | 15:07 |
| EmilienM | flaper87: you're weird. | 15:07 |
| dhellmann | do we need to be more "formal" or just do it earlier? | 15:07 |
| ttx | smcginnis: it's more of a way to include them in some form of governance | 15:07 |
| ttx | dhellmann: both | 15:08 |
| ttx | I'll propose something around making the election officials a workgroup of the TC | 15:08 |
| dhellmann | I wonder if the UC would be interested in some stable election team, too? maybe we want to set them up as a sig? | 15:08 |
| ttx | ah hm | 15:08 |
| dhellmann | but yeah, at least a wg | 15:08 |
| * dhellmann didn't mean to sow confusion | 15:09 | |
| ttx | let's do it first | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | sure | 15:09 |
| smcginnis | Smells a bit of bureaucracy, but if there is a concern, I'm fine with making it a formal thing. | 15:09 |
| ttx | ok, will propose something along those lines | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis : sometimes bureaucracy removes ambiguity in a way that builds trust | 15:10 |
| fungi | from the conversations i was present for, i got the impression it was less about formality and more about continuity | 15:10 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I see you've been watching a video | 15:10 |
| dhellmann | ttx: busted | 15:10 |
| flaper87 | ttx: dhellmann lol | 15:10 |
| * flaper87 watched it too | 15:10 | |
| ttx | dhellmann: it's good, but basically in OpenStack we avoided the floating by building up front, because I knew what would happen without it | 15:11 |
| dhellmann | fungi : good point. a wg feels like a good starting point, since it's the only thing we have other than project teams for designated "long term" groups | 15:11 |
| dhellmann | ttx: yeah, I thought it was interesting how they ran into all of the problems we tried to preempt | 15:12 |
| ttx | so I think the story as presented is more a sign that they didn't have enough open source community experience :) | 15:12 |
| fungi | and the current election officials are starting to get more involved in maintaining the tooling used for elections too, since we now have apis in gerrit and the foundation member system which make it possible for someone who isn't on the infra team or foundation staff to query the necessary data | 15:12 |
| dhellmann | not that surprising, given the source, but I think they're learning | 15:12 |
| ttx | dhellmann: well, I kike that it serves as a reminder of what happens if you don't set up governance/bureaucracy | 15:13 |
| ttx | like* | 15:13 |
| flaper87 | so, what would this formalization of election officials would look like? | 15:13 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ++, it's a good counter point to an argument against structure | 15:13 |
| flaper87 | am a bit confused about what the expected result is | 15:13 |
| fungi | i still need to watch that video. this week has been entirely about catching up on deferred appointments for me | 15:14 |
| ttx | flaper87: I will add a page to track working groups on governance.o.o and track then as such | 15:14 |
| ttx | then -> the election official | 15:14 |
| ttx | s | 15:14 |
| * ttx is still very much in jet lag | 15:14 | |
| dhellmann | it sounded like they wanted to know they would be approved to be election officials for more than 1 election in advance so they could improve the tools | 15:14 |
| fungi | pretty much that, yes | 15:15 |
| fungi | and a little more autonomy in recruiting other election officials | 15:15 |
| dhellmann | if we have people willing to do that, I think we should encourage them, and writing down the fact that we're doing that is part of the transparency I would expect around elections | 15:15 |
| *** kumarmn_ has joined #openstack-tc | 15:15 | |
| smcginnis | What is this video everyone | 15:15 |
| smcginnis | s referring to | 15:15 |
| fungi | smcginnis: it's linked in scrollback, just a sec | 15:16 |
| ttx | ok, that's all I had. I've been running through the etherpads to collect actions from forum | 15:16 |
| *** kumarmn has quit IRC | 15:16 | |
| ttx | Is anyone planning to post a summary of the first contact -> contributor experience SIG session ? | 15:17 |
| fungi | smcginnis: or i thought it was... now i need to go find where i saw it | 15:17 |
| ttx | on the ml | 15:17 |
| ttx | https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Apw_fuTEhyA | 15:17 |
| dhellmann | I would expect the session leader to do that. Who was the leader for that one? | 15:17 |
| smcginnis | fungi, ttx: Thanks! | 15:17 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis , fungi : ML thread is http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2017-November/124609.html please respond there if you have comments to share | 15:17 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I think the original moderator wasn't present and I may have run the session in his palce | 15:19 |
| ttx | place | 15:19 |
| ttx | I can post the followup | 15:19 |
| dhellmann | ah | 15:19 |
| ttx | diablo_rojo being on vacation | 15:19 |
| fungi | in addition to missing the moderator, the session attendees were mostly just the tc | 15:20 |
| ttx | dhellmann: we need to "finalize" the top-5 list too, how is the latest addition going ? | 15:20 |
| dhellmann | I haven't done anything with that. Did we want to go ahead with the champions and stewards item, or wait for the lts thing to settle down in case we want to ask for help there? | 15:22 |
| * ttx considers renaming the list the "top help wanted" instead of top 5 and say that it shoyuld not have more than 5 items | 15:22 | |
| fungi | openstack classifieds, help wanted column | 15:23 |
| smcginnis | I actually like the idea of a help wanted board. | 15:23 |
| fungi | the infra team already maintains one, to organize its unassigned specs | 15:24 |
| ttx | it's a bit orthogonal though | 15:24 |
| smcginnis | True. | 15:24 |
| fungi | but yeah, for this it's more of an opportunity for the tc to attempt to divine the "top <n>" places the community is in most dire need of help | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | ttx: +1 on the rename of the list, fwiw. | 15:25 |
| dhellmann | I'm not sure how much we want to dilute the effect of this curated list by letting it grow really long | 15:25 |
| ttx | ok, I'll do that | 15:25 |
| ttx | maximum 5 items | 15:25 |
| dhellmann | k | 15:25 |
| fungi | agreed on short, and 5 is good as an upper limit | 15:25 |
| dhellmann | I could update the existing champions/stewards proposal, but the feedback on that was trending towards "it's too vague" and I can definitely see that | 15:27 |
| smcginnis | That was kind of my feel on it. | 15:27 |
| ttx | yeah, and we kept Glance on the list mostly as a way to get to 5 | 15:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | dhellmann: I keep struggling where we put the "its important but too vague" ideas, so people can run with some of them | 15:28 |
| dhellmann | it's hard to say exactly what is needed, though, until we don't have anyone to do something that's critical and we can't do it and it's too late to recruit | 15:28 |
| dhellmann | I feel a bit like we're saying we want to go back to some golden age when contributors had more leeway in where they spent their time | 15:28 |
| smcginnis | Glance probably still good to have on there. The PTL is currently having some non-work issues that may pull him away for awhile. | 15:29 |
| dhellmann | and I'm not sure that was ever really the case | 15:29 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: ++ I think very few actually have that leeway. | 15:29 |
| dhellmann | yeah, I thought we kept glance because while things were improving we hadn't really recruited *new* contributors | 15:29 |
| fungi | i agree wrt stewards, it's likely people _want_ to do that but simply can't find the time to commit to it | 15:29 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis : right, so that's what we're asking for, which is by definition vague | 15:29 |
| smcginnis | Glance has improved slightly, but I would not consider it fully healthy. | 15:30 |
| flaper87 | smcginnis: ++ | 15:30 |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Rename 'top-5 help wanted' to 'top help wanted' https://review.openstack.org/520619 | 15:30 |
| *** hongbin has joined #openstack-tc | 15:30 | |
| smcginnis | It's kind of like saying we need more code reviewers. I've been saying that every time I get in front of people but I haven't really seen that improve. | 15:31 |
| smcginnis | So I'm just not sure saying we need more stewards is going to suddenly get people to decide to do it. | 15:31 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 15:31 |
| dhellmann | maybe we need to focus that down to goal champions | 15:32 |
| smcginnis | That's at least a little more specific. | 15:32 |
| dhellmann | we can describe that role in a little more detail | 15:32 |
| dhellmann | I'll try that | 15:34 |
| *** marst has joined #openstack-tc | 15:36 | |
| johnthetubaguy | dhellmann: is it worth writing it to a manager, saying what the value is in allowing people to do that thing | 15:36 |
| johnthetubaguy | a bit like that "i want to go to summit" letter | 15:36 |
| dhellmann | maybe? | 15:37 |
| dhellmann | I'll have to think about how to express it that way | 15:37 |
| dhellmann | do you think the current text doesn't express the value clearly enough? I thought the issue was with expressing what we were actually asking for | 15:38 |
| ttx | ok, office hour thread posted | 15:38 |
| dhellmann | like we were lacking details for someone who did want to volunteer | 15:38 |
| fungi | thanks ttx | 15:38 |
| ttx | linking to a framadate at https://framadate.org/MqRvvppNGX4hL3cz | 15:38 |
| johnthetubaguy | I should go re-read that again... and comment on there | 15:42 |
| dhellmann | johnthetubaguy : that would be good. I'll try to rework it later today or tomorrow | 15:43 |
| TheJulia | Going back (since my brain has been elsewhere writing $words) to timing, I'm okay with this time even though I'll soon be living in the pacific timezone. | 15:49 |
| dims | TheJulia : nice writeup on mogan :) thanks! | 15:53 |
| TheJulia | I do agree that it is good to try and convey value of contributing but at the same time the context into what needs to be conveyed so it can be understood what the commitment is. | 15:55 |
| TheJulia | dims: If you mean the ironic write-up, I don't even remember those words at this point. Too much writing.... | 15:56 |
| * dtroyer timezone fail here…and i US Central so not too early as-is | 15:56 | |
| dims | TheJulia : the abstention one in mogan governance | 15:56 |
| TheJulia | Ahh, yeah, that is the recent $words, I still have more words to write elsewhere this morning. :( | 15:57 |
| dims | i hear ya :) | 15:57 |
| *** openstackgerrit has quit IRC | 16:03 | |
| johnthetubaguy | Yeah, +1 the thank you on that write up, just went through those bits | 16:11 |
| *** openstackgerrit has joined #openstack-tc | 17:05 | |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Rename 'top-5 help wanted' to 'top help wanted' https://review.openstack.org/520619 | 17:05 |
| EmilienM | for those who were in the stable policy feedback session in Sydney, I pushed a patch to remove the tag for Kolla: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/519685/ - more feedback is welcome. Thanks | 17:08 |
| *** dklyle has quit IRC | 18:05 | |
| *** david-lyle has joined #openstack-tc | 18:14 | |
| *** david-lyle is now known as dklyle | 18:36 | |
| pabelanger | dhellmann: ttx: left a comment on 520619, when I say 'top help wanted' aloud, it doesn't ring well with my ears. It could just be me :) maybe something long the lines of community help wanted or even help wanted | 18:40 |
| dhellmann | pabelanger : yeah, we need to work on the name | 18:42 |
| *** jpich has quit IRC | 19:13 | |
| *** notmyname has quit IRC | 19:46 | |
| *** notmyname has joined #openstack-tc | 19:49 | |
| *** lbragstad has quit IRC | 21:00 | |
| *** notmyname has quit IRC | 21:11 | |
| *** notmyname has joined #openstack-tc | 21:16 | |
| *** mriedem has quit IRC | 23:22 | |
| *** marst has quit IRC | 23:30 | |
| *** kumarmn_ has quit IRC | 23:49 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.3 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!