| tonyb | For that discussion: http://paste.openstack.org/show/727002 | 00:13 |
|---|---|---|
| tonyb | Trove has a candidate but they don't count as a ATC: https://review.openstack.org/587333 | 00:14 |
| tonyb | I excluded Security based on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/586896/ | 00:15 |
| tonyb | The 2 elections are underway | 00:15 |
| * tonyb isn't sure if y'all need an email or of that's enough data to start the discussion | 00:16 | |
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| dhellmann | tonyb : an email to the -dev list to make all of that official would be a good idea | 00:22 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: Okay. | 00:23 |
| tonyb | dhellmann: done. | 00:32 |
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| phillid | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 01:39 |
| phillid | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 01:39 |
| phillid | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 01:39 |
| phillid | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 01:39 |
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| montag45120 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 01:43 |
| montag45120 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 01:43 |
| montag45120 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 01:44 |
| montag45120 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 01:44 |
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| tacocat25 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 01:51 |
| tacocat25 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 01:51 |
| tacocat25 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 01:51 |
| tacocat25 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 01:51 |
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| smaudet | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 02:01 |
| smaudet | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 02:01 |
| smaudet | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 02:01 |
| smaudet | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 02:01 |
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| hogepodge | smcginnis: RefStack doesn't really have a dev team for the client or server any more (aside from me right now). There are some ancillary projects being developed by a team at RedHat that falls under the project, but I don't think it should really qualify as an official project any more. | 02:21 |
| hogepodge | It's still important, it just doesn't meet the minimum requirements. | 02:21 |
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| FireFly16 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 02:32 |
| FireFly16 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 02:32 |
| FireFly16 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 02:32 |
| FireFly16 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 02:32 |
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| grumble210 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 02:38 |
| grumble210 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 02:38 |
| grumble210 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 02:38 |
| grumble210 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 02:38 |
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| Lumpi16 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 02:42 |
| Lumpi16 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 02:42 |
| Lumpi16 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 02:43 |
| Lumpi16 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 02:43 |
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| genera13 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 02:51 |
| genera13 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 02:51 |
| genera13 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 02:51 |
| genera13 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 02:51 |
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| tsp6 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 03:02 |
| tsp6 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 03:03 |
| tsp6 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 03:03 |
| tsp6 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 03:03 |
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| BranchPredictor4 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 03:06 |
| BranchPredictor4 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 03:06 |
| BranchPredictor4 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 03:06 |
| BranchPredictor4 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 03:06 |
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| wols13 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 03:07 |
| wols13 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 03:08 |
| wols13 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 03:08 |
| wols13 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 03:08 |
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| sins- | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 03:43 |
| sins- | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 03:44 |
| sins- | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 03:44 |
| sins- | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 03:44 |
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| Tux23 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 04:02 |
| Tux23 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 04:02 |
| Tux23 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 04:02 |
| Tux23 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 04:03 |
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| scas | so... oftc. | 04:11 |
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| scas | barring that, +r should be set | 04:22 |
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| k6ka29 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 05:09 |
| k6ka29 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 05:09 |
| k6ka29 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 05:09 |
| k6ka29 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 05:09 |
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| KDDLB | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 06:10 |
| KDDLB | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 06:10 |
| KDDLB | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 06:10 |
| KDDLB | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 06:10 |
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| RyanKnack15 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 06:16 |
| RyanKnack15 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 06:16 |
| RyanKnack15 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 06:16 |
| RyanKnack15 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 06:16 |
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| programmerq18 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 06:21 |
| programmerq18 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 06:21 |
| programmerq18 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 06:21 |
| programmerq18 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 06:21 |
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| foxcookie | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 06:48 |
| foxcookie | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 06:48 |
| foxcookie | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 06:48 |
| foxcookie | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 06:48 |
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| annieslmaos | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 07:34 |
| annieslmaos | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 07:34 |
| annieslmaos | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 07:34 |
| annieslmaos | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 07:34 |
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| openstackgerrit | Nguyen Hai proposed openstack/project-team-guide master: Follow the new PTI for document build https://review.openstack.org/587707 | 07:46 |
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| __idiot__ | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 07:58 |
| __idiot__ | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 07:58 |
| __idiot__ | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 07:59 |
| __idiot__ | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 07:59 |
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| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ttx | 08:32 | |
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| cyberzeus28 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 09:49 |
| cyberzeus28 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 09:49 |
| cyberzeus28 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 09:49 |
| cyberzeus28 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 09:49 |
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| cdent | I think we're going to want to +r everything, which is sad, but perhaps needed | 10:15 |
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| the_madman1 | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 10:21 |
| the_madman1 | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 10:21 |
| the_madman1 | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 10:21 |
| the_madman1 | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 10:21 |
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| cdent | ttx, ianw : given we're relatively small and focused in here maybe we should +r this channel? | 10:24 |
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| evil | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 10:25 |
| evil | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 10:25 |
| evil | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 10:25 |
| evil | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 10:25 |
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| barbietoss | With our IRC ad service you can reach a global audience of entrepreneurs and fentanyl addicts with extraordinary engagement rates! https://williampitcock.com/ | 10:26 |
| barbietoss | I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard https://bryanostergaard.com/ | 10:26 |
| barbietoss | Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Freenodegate | 10:26 |
| barbietoss | A fascinating blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout https://MattSTrout.com/ | 10:26 |
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| ianw | cdent: done and noted in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/freenode-plus-r-08-2018 for now | 10:28 |
| cdent | thanks ianw | 10:30 |
| cdent | ianw: may as well do #openstack-placement too, same reasoning, please and thank you | 10:31 |
| ianw | done | 10:33 |
| ianw | this isn't the first time; i sent an email to openstack-dev as i didn't want to unilaterally change such an important communication mechanism | 10:34 |
| cdent | Yeah, it's a delicate balance | 10:35 |
| ianw | but we should probably consider policy to have +r on channels, and redirect non-registered users to a catch-all channel some good samaritans watch and help people who are genuine | 10:35 |
| cdent | My tin foil hate conspiracy theorist wants to think these spammers are paid for by slack | 10:35 |
| cdent | that's a good idea | 10:36 |
| cdent | s/hate/hat/ (but hate works too) | 10:36 |
| ianw | like i didn't want to touch #openstack-meeting because i figure that's probably a channel that gets a lot of very periodic users | 10:37 |
| ianw | but is also annoyingly the one you want logged the most :) | 10:37 |
| cdent | yeah | 10:38 |
| jroll | I think the catch-all channel would get real real busy :/ | 11:33 |
| jroll | does +r mute people that are not registered and in the channel at the time it's set? I see nobody was kicked here | 11:34 |
| jroll | (or in -placement) | 11:34 |
| cdent | I _think_ it is only checked when people try to join | 11:43 |
| jroll | another friend confirms it does, but gives a decent error | 11:46 |
| jroll | owait, now he says it does not | 11:53 |
| TheJulia | I think redirecting unregistered users forces registration which raises the bar to being a knowledgeable and regular user of freenode itself... which I think is a huge mistake because it applies a filter on our primary day to day communication method. Spammers are annnoying, but the right thing really seem s to be is to delegate ops privileges so some users can kick/ban spammers out if necessary. | 12:17 |
| jroll | TheJulia: based on the volume and the contents, I think it's worth it in the short term | 12:20 |
| TheJulia | I agree short term response makes sense, since banning bot spewing irc spam does get old | 12:22 |
| jroll | I love that we already have a suggestion in email to move to slack | 12:22 |
| TheJulia | Spammers have been around for over twenty years, the tool still works as long as we don't block out legitimate people | 12:24 |
| jroll | yeah | 12:25 |
| jroll | I don't think anyone is suggesting +r as a permanent measure | 12:25 |
| jroll | it would be nice to add Sigyn to all of our channels, if that's possible | 12:30 |
| * TheJulia will need to look some of those up... since the flags she barely remembers from 20+ years ago have chnaed. | 12:31 | |
| * TheJulia needs a coffee IV first | 12:31 | |
| jroll | +r is only allow registered users to join. unregistered users that are already there can still talk | 12:32 |
| TheJulia | yeah, knew that one | 12:33 |
| TheJulia | Interesting, either irccloud buffering is being weird, or we had a messsage come in from a user that was not present. I know there is a flag for that :) | 12:34 |
| TheJulia | Then again, I opened irccloud last night and had an extra hour of messages I never saw :\ | 12:34 |
| smcginnis | I haven't noticed any since Ian changed it. | 12:34 |
| cdent | maybe this will finally kill IRC ;) | 12:35 |
| TheJulia | for me it was the ironic channel around 8:21 | 12:35 |
| TheJulia | cdent: lol | 12:35 |
| smcginnis | cdent: Finally done in by the slack cabal! | 12:36 |
| cdent | no, no, this is the death of chat entirely | 12:36 |
| cdent | my evil plan finally comes to fruition | 12:36 |
| smcginnis | :) | 12:36 |
| * cdent he said while chatting | 12:36 | |
| jroll | TheJulia: if 8:21 EST, that person did join, I kicked fairly quickly, blame irccloud | 12:36 |
| smcginnis | Finally done in by the mailing list cabal. | 12:36 |
| cdent | you have no idea | 12:37 |
| TheJulia | jroll: ugh, irccloud then :( | 12:37 |
| TheJulia | lol | 12:38 |
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| scas | sigh. my email buffer has turned into a wall of text yet again | 14:04 |
| scas | prompted by the slack suggestion, but i do have a certain perspective | 14:05 |
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| smcginnis | Looks like dhellmann should be the new Freezer PTL - http://stackalytics.com/?module=freezer-group&metric=commits | 14:14 |
| smcginnis | :) | 14:14 |
| TheJulia | heh | 14:14 |
| smcginnis | hogepodge: Thanks for the feedback on RefStack. Do you think we should switch that to a SIG? | 14:15 |
| smcginnis | hogepodge: I can probably help get that process going if so. | 14:15 |
| scas | my thoughts on chat and open communities is reading more like something i need to dump to a markdown file and not an email reply. my perspective comes from two decades of being in and around the irc extension of open source communities | 14:24 |
| TheJulia | Some of the projects, I can't help but wonder if they are just in maintenance, or maybe perhaps time to re-evaluate if there is a need or void that is being filled.. and if there are users if we have enough data. | 14:24 |
| TheJulia | scas: why not then? ;) | 14:25 |
| smcginnis | Searchlight I think is defintely "maintenance mode". Or I prefer "code complete" since maintenance mode has some negative connotations for me due to past experience. | 14:26 |
| scas | maintenance mode is subjective | 14:26 |
| smcginnis | Probably the same for one or two other ones. | 14:26 |
| scas | chef can be considered such, but i imported 2 cookbooks, and took in support for a new service from a non-core contributor | 14:26 |
| scas | it's just that it doesn't expand too often, not for lack of want | 14:27 |
| smcginnis | That's the tricky part - differentiating between low activity and just nothing major to be done. | 14:27 |
| TheJulia | code complete just sounds like nothing will be added ever again... and maybe someone one day finds it and it solves their problem so they add new functionality. :\ | 14:27 |
| scas | if you look at contributor engagement, one could peg it as being in maintenance mode | 14:27 |
| TheJulia | but yeah, maintenance connotation as well is bad | 14:27 |
| scas | if you call it code complete, that would be a misnomer, too | 14:27 |
| smcginnis | Feature complete? | 14:28 |
| scas | i don't have coverage for all core services at this point. i used to tout that, but not today | 14:28 |
| TheJulia | we should avoid this pit of despair talking about the differences of the two statements.... it just goes down hill :\ | 14:28 |
| smcginnis | TheJulia: True | 14:28 |
| scas | indeed | 14:28 |
| TheJulia | I do kind of like feature complete, fwiw | 14:28 |
| scas | that would be the closest suitable term | 14:29 |
| scas | at least for chef's situation | 14:29 |
| scas | it's not my intent to bring any despair to things. if i don't say anything, the lack of engagement at certain layers becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy | 14:32 |
| smcginnis | It doesn't have any implications that new features couldn't be added in the future, just that all current planned features are done. | 14:32 |
| TheJulia | I guess in ironic, we have a few things like that. No active work really needed, they fit the need... that doesn't prevent us from picking it back up and pushing it along. Perhaps projects could have a maintenance contact or something to at least act as the occasional $human part of $required_process | 14:33 |
| TheJulia | Some other designation other than PTL might be good in those cases. Or we should consider process changes | 14:34 |
| scas | smcginnis: of course. doing the due diligence and defining it in the glossary would need to be done, for the pendantry of it | 14:34 |
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| scas | in chef, the unmaintained cookbooks aren't dead, simply without demand to dedicate the time and effort to refactor to modern times. if there was demand, the maintenance status would, of course, have to be reevaluated | 14:36 |
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| dhellmann | smcginnis : what's our process for finalizing goal selection? | 15:03 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: I suppose we should think about whether we need more process around that, but I think our process so far has just been socializing on the ML and in this channel, then getting enough votes on the proposed goals to accept them. | 15:09 |
| smcginnis | mriedem: Were you going to update that upgrade-checker goal I started? | 15:09 |
| mriedem | someday | 15:09 |
| smcginnis | I think the py3 one is in good shape, so we can probably go ahead with that one. | 15:09 |
| smcginnis | And if we get the upgrade-checker one updated, that should be in good shape. | 15:10 |
| mriedem | between reverse engineering starlingx diffs and my kid breaking her arm on monday night, it's been a busy week | 15:10 |
| smcginnis | From IRC and ML discussions, there weren't any strong opinions on other goals, nor negative sentiments on this one. | 15:10 |
| dtroyer | mriedem: don't lose hope… the patch files are coming... | 15:10 |
| smcginnis | mriedem: Oh no! Poor kid. I hope she's getting plenty of ice cream. | 15:11 |
| mriedem | she's bored as hell | 15:11 |
| smcginnis | Had to happen in the middle of summer. | 15:12 |
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| dhellmann | smcginnis : ok, so the python3 goal has enough votes and is old enough. I can go ahead and approve that today, then | 15:40 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: Great, it will be good to have one of them through. | 15:41 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: I'll see if I can update the upgrade-checker one later. Or bug mriedem_afk enough to get him to do it. | 15:41 |
| dhellmann | tc-members: now's your last chance to +1 the python3 goal in https://review.openstack.org/#/c/575933/ while I see about lunch | 15:41 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis : sounds good | 15:41 |
| smcginnis | mriedem_afk: If your daughter is really bored, you can teach her how you amend commits. :P | 15:41 |
| -openstackstatus- NOTICE: Due to ongoing spam, all OpenStack-related channels now require authentication with nickserv. If an unauthenticated user joins a channel, they will be forwarded to #openstack-unregistered with a message about the problem and folks to help with any questions (volunteers welcome!). | 15:49 | |
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| openstackgerrit | Doug Hellmann proposed openstack/governance master: teach check-review-status to report verification failures https://review.openstack.org/587879 | 16:37 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: write up the python3-first goal https://review.openstack.org/575933 | 16:39 |
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| openstackgerrit | Doug Hellmann proposed openstack/governance master: update link from python3-first goal to storyboard https://review.openstack.org/587916 | 16:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Doug Hellmann proposed openstack/governance master: update link from python3-first goal to storyboard https://review.openstack.org/587916 | 17:11 |
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| tosky | dhellmann: hi, I saw the new stories about python 3; but some projects already had python3 tasks, what should we do? | 18:39 |
| dhellmann | tosky : these tasks are specifically for tracking the goal work. So if you have other tasks that are related to other python 3 work, you should keep those. | 18:40 |
| tosky | ack | 18:40 |
| dhellmann | EmilienM , cdent: ianychoi's change to the PTI for translation seems a bit stuck. Since you are the liaisons to that team, maybe you can help out? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/572559/ | 18:43 |
| EmilienM | yex | 18:43 |
| EmilienM | oops | 18:43 |
| EmilienM | yes | 18:43 |
| dhellmann | I'm not sure exactly what the goal is there, or what work would need to be done to make a PTI change practical. | 18:43 |
| tosky | just to be sure: the goal only mentions python 3.6, but it does not say anything about whether we should keep python 3.5 jobs as well or replace them; is there some decision about this? | 18:45 |
| dhellmann | tosky : not yet, no | 18:46 |
| tosky | oki | 18:46 |
| dhellmann | I don't think we'll have a "goal" to drop py35 when the time comes, but we may announce when it's OK to do so | 18:46 |
| tosky | so for a while we will have py35 or py36, ok | 18:47 |
| tosky | I guess I can start adding them | 18:47 |
| tosky | or I will see a wave of mass-sent reviews that will add them anyway | 18:47 |
| dhellmann | tosky : please wait to start making any configuration changes. Part of the goal is going to be moving a lot of the zuul settings in-tree, and we have some tools to do that in a consistent way for all projects. | 18:48 |
| dhellmann | we also still need to test all of that, which I'm going to be doing with the oslo repos this week (likely this weekend, due to the number of patches) | 18:49 |
| tosky | dhellmann: ok, no problem, but which settings are going to move in-tree which are not moved already? | 18:49 |
| tosky | the template definition for py35 check+gate jobs? | 18:49 |
| dhellmann | tosky : I can't answer that question precisely without knowing which repo, but it will be 99% of the job settings. | 18:50 |
| tosky | ok, I'm curious :) | 18:50 |
| tosky | I will wait for the patches | 18:50 |
| dhellmann | anything that runs on multiple branches | 18:50 |
| dhellmann | or has a branch specifier other than master | 18:50 |
| dhellmann | tosky : here's a sample patch from a previous test round: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/581526/1 | 18:51 |
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| zaneb | tosky: "We do not plan to update the minimum version of python 3 we support as part of this goal. Projects already running python 3.5 jobs should continue to do so." | 19:04 |
| tbarron | dhellmann: smcginnis w.r.t. stein python3 goal https://review.openstack.org/#/c/575933 cinder and manila have drivers for storage back ends that | 19:38 |
| tbarron | dhellmann: smcginnis are covered by 3rd part CI jobs | 19:38 |
| tbarron | dhellmann: smcginnis - are these in scope for python3 goal in stein? | 19:39 |
| tbarron | dhellmann: smcginnis - I'm not saying they should *not* be, just that there's more friction involved. | 19:39 |
| mnaser | dhellmann: should we come up with some sort of process/discussion time for the tc to figure out leaderless projects all together? | 19:45 |
| mnaser | i don't want to say the word meeting ;) but i think it's at least necessary so we can all chime in | 19:45 |
| tosky | zaneb: thanks; I guess I should read more; I suspect nothing will change even outside that goal | 19:49 |
| smcginnis | tbarron: That is a good point. | 20:02 |
| smcginnis | tbarron: I think I will add that to the Cinder planning etherpad that we should ask that third party CIs all switch to py3. | 20:03 |
| smcginnis | tbarron: And then we probably at least need to track in a wiki or somewhere which ones have switched over. | 20:03 |
| smcginnis | tbarron: I don't think it is a blocker for the goal, but at least being able to say most vendor drivers are validated to work would be a really good thing to have. | 20:03 |
| tbarron | smcginnis: makes sense | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis , tbarron : yes, that's reasonable. Either adding py3 or switching to py3 would be good. We're reaching a point where distros are going to want to be able to deploy with py3 and drivers are going to be part of that | 20:39 |
| smcginnis | We've casually mentioned in the past that they should run their CIs with py3, but I think we need to start taking a firmer stance with that. | 20:43 |
| dhellmann | it seems like third-party CI falls under the already mentioned functional test jobs, but I could update the goal document to mention them explicitly if you think it's worth it | 20:44 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: I would be afraid of that being the reason for not being able to call the goal complete if there's one or two vendors that don't respond to updating their CI. | 20:45 |
| dhellmann | hmm | 20:45 |
| smcginnis | We want them to, but if they don't do it and aren't engaged, that will sort itself out in the long run I think. | 20:46 |
| dhellmann | the goal says "there are functional test jobs running under python 3". We already revised it so that it doesn't say all jobs. | 20:46 |
| tbarron | smcginnis: you've got about 80 drivers and we have close to 30 ... | 20:46 |
| smcginnis | We should probably publish which CI's we know to be using py3 so potential consumers can find that info. | 20:46 |
| tbarron | smcginnis: yeah, that's what I'm thinking, track it and make the info available | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | it would be good to finish that driver support matrix work thingee started a while back | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | support for python3 could be a feature in the matrix | 20:47 |
| tbarron | yup | 20:47 |
| tbarron | tested support | 20:47 |
| smcginnis | Yep, that patch is close to landing. I was thinking that too, we can add a column there to show py3 support for the driver. | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | yeah | 20:48 |
| tbarron | in gate | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | Push that thing even further of the page. | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | s/of/off/ | 20:48 |
| tbarron | smcginnis: just need a small font and squinty eyes | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | maybe one of you could summarize all of this on the ML thread where I announced that the goal patch was approved? | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: You don't happen to know an easy way to pivot a docutils table? | 20:48 |
| tbarron | heh | 20:48 |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: I have it on the next Cinder meeting agenda to discuss. If Jay is good with this, I'll follow that up with a ML post. | 20:49 |
| dhellmann | I usually use a list-table and that's enough like yaml that you could probably script it, but I don't know for a regular table | 20:49 |
| dhellmann | smcginnis : sounds good, thank you | 20:49 |
| tbarron | smcginnis: and manila meeting is tomorrow so i'll shoot you a status afterwards | 20:49 |
| * tbarron doesn't anticipate any objections | 20:50 | |
| smcginnis | dhellmann: Looking at the support_matrix code, it doesn't look too hard to have a flag to switch horizontal and vertical, but it would be a lot of duplication. | 20:50 |
| dhellmann | oh, right, those tables are being generated | 20:50 |
| smcginnis | Would probably be easier to write some sort of transformer that would take the generated output and transpose the columns and tables before it is handed off to the rst parser. | 20:51 |
| smcginnis | *columns and rows | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | why not just change the code once so the table is generated differently for everyone? | 20:51 |
| smcginnis | tbarron: Cool, let me know if any concerns are raised. | 20:51 |
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| clarkb | fwiw third party CI is traditionally the realm of "test the things that are imporatnt to you particularly if we can't test them upstream" that may mean python2 remains relevant to those users | 21:07 |
| clarkb | but we likely aren't going to respect -1's fromCIs using python2 when python2 is no longer supported | 21:07 |
| dhellmann | yeah, hence my suggestion to either add or switch | 21:07 |
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| fungi | i too would rather not have updating third-party ci as a requirement for goal completion, merely a very strong recommendation (and an excuse for services to mark those nonconforming drivers unsupported if they want) | 21:59 |
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| ianychoi | EmilienM, dhellmann : sorry for my stuck on the review. IMO the stack was mainly because I mixed I18n and Docs things (and this made myself messed up on my thinking). Last week I discussed with I18n and Docs team PTLs and I will submit into two divided patches by trying to address comments. | 23:55 |
| EmilienM | ianychoi: sounds good | 23:55 |
| ianychoi | EmilienM, thanks a lot for being a liaison! :) | 23:56 |
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