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| Zara | moooorning | 08:01 |
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| Zara | oh, we could still do with eyes on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/361423/. I thought it had gone in, sory! | 09:25 |
| Zara | *sorry | 09:25 |
| Zara | I'm so confused, I thought I sent a patch to system config for the thing I mentioned there, but can't find it | 09:41 |
| * SotK fails to reproduce the weird worklist positions and lengths in the complex priorities patch | 09:42 | |
| Zara | huh | 09:42 |
| Zara | I'll see if I can do it with a fresh one, then | 09:42 |
| Zara | I finally reproduced it, still not sure how exactly it happens | 09:53 |
| Zara | I finally got it when I made the worklist private and deleted and added the same task to/from it various times | 09:53 |
| Zara | so still not sure what thing caused it | 09:53 |
| SotK | some investigation has uncovered that it is caused by tasks which belonged to now-deleted stories | 10:12 |
| Zara | \o/ that shouldn't happen too much | 10:13 |
| Zara | I haven't been able to reproduce it with normal behaviour | 10:13 |
| SotK | we mustn't be filtering them out on the api side when getting a list of worklists like we do when getting a single worklist | 10:13 |
| Zara | okay. I can make a story for it, I think we're okay to merge the patch if that's the only time when the totals will be thrown off | 10:13 |
| Zara | esp since really the answer is to not let people add those tasks to worklists to begin with... | 10:14 |
| SotK | the problem arises mainly when someone deletes a story whose tasks are in a worklist already I think | 10:14 |
| persia | Where "make private" counts as "deletion" for folk without access? | 10:15 |
| SotK | not currently, since private things are correctly filtered out (which is what the correct behaviour for deletion would be too) | 10:17 |
| persia | Then I don't understand how it was triggered when Zara "made the worklist private and deleted and added the same task to/from it various times" | 10:18 |
| persia | But if some of the issue is understood, then the rest can be solved later :) | 10:19 |
| Zara | that one then worked, I think the total just hadn't updated properly | 10:19 |
| Zara | shall we press the big red merge button? | 10:27 |
| persia | pretty please? | 10:27 |
| pedroalvarez | "the pretty big red merge button" ? | 10:29 |
| persia | Speaking of merge buttons, there's also at least one patch to the python client that looks ready (which I thought was held over Friday for Friday-related reasons) | 10:33 |
| SotK | this one? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/366238/ | 10:33 |
| persia | I was thinking of 365704 | 10:34 |
| Zara | hah, I don't publicise my own patches as much as others'... | 10:34 |
| persia | 366238 still needed a review, last I looked. | 10:34 |
| SotK | yeah, 365704 does look ready | 10:34 |
| SotK | sorry I missed it | 10:34 |
| * SotK was waiting for Zara to respond to persia before reviewing 366238 | 10:35 | |
| Zara | oh, sorry, I figured I'd do that in a followup patch | 10:35 |
| Zara | since I'm not sure exactly how to phrase it yet | 10:35 |
| Zara | and rather not delay it while I think about it | 10:36 |
| SotK | that is fine by me | 10:36 |
| persia | I'm fine with a follow-up (hence my review score), but maybe good to be clear about intent in cases like this. | 10:36 |
| Zara | yeah, sorry, should have mentioned that in review. | 10:37 |
| Zara | *I should have mentioned htat | 10:37 |
| Zara | in case it looked like I was telling you off xD | 10:37 |
| Zara | *I should have mentioned that | 10:38 |
| Zara | therrrrre we go | 10:38 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack-infra/python-storyboardclient: Note importance of using https url instead of http https://review.openstack.org/365704 | 10:38 |
| * persia imagines Zara in a special bubble of spacetime, physically displaced at least 60° from it's native timezone | 10:39 | |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack-infra/storyboard-webclient: Complex priorities UI in stories https://review.openstack.org/312666 | 10:40 |
| Zara | :) | 10:40 |
| pedroalvarez | wow, happy monday | 10:40 |
| Zara | I often write a series of things, while thinking about something else, and then look up later... | 10:40 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack-infra/python-storyboardclient: Make dev the default StoryBoard instance https://review.openstack.org/366238 | 10:42 |
| Zara | \o/ | 10:43 |
| Zara | pedroalvarez: heh, I was very slow on fri so I did some review at the weekend to make up. | 10:44 |
| Zara | so normally I'd be testing stuff at this point, or making a new thing | 10:44 |
| pedroalvarez | hah | 10:44 |
| Zara | also I totally just wanted to troll persia by doing complex priorities at the end | 10:45 |
| persia | Complex Priorities has long been one of the most exciting potentials of StoryBoard. I'm delighted to see it land. Now comes the exciting part: how will people use it? | 10:52 |
| Zara | I intend to send out a mail once it's had a little time for us to check for/ fix any last-minute glaring bugs. | 10:55 |
| Zara | as a general 'this is what this is for, this is why' | 10:55 |
| persia | Makes sense. I think the upcoming bugsquash effort will probably expose a few issues and/or uses. | 11:01 |
| Zara | yep. I wondered about sending the mail to explain it beforehand, but based on past experience, it won't be ready to draw mass attention to it. | 11:02 |
| Zara | so hopefully I can use the bugsquash to refine the explanation | 11:02 |
| Zara | also will give a heads-up about layout change... | 11:03 |
| persia | Yep | 11:16 |
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| Zara | decided to update system config docs before I forgot | 12:20 |
| Zara | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/368797/ | 12:20 |
| persia | I would have expected that to be stacked above 361423 | 12:27 |
| Zara | I don't think it depends on it but it's not as useful without it. | 12:29 |
| persia | I agree it doesn't depend (or it would conflict), but I also think it isn't as useful without it, hence why I would have expected it to be stacked. | 12:40 |
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| Zara | hm, I'm not sure there's a way to stack things without it being interpreted as depending. I intend to treat it like it's stacked (ie: prioritize gathering reviews for zaro's first) | 13:03 |
| pedroalvarez | I can't find the UI change for complex priorities | 13:05 |
| persia | I believe there isn't a way to stack without it being interpreted as depending, indeed. | 13:06 |
| persia | pedroalvarez: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/storyboard-webclient/commit/?id=c43d2b3d4533218c5ad1b91cf8dab26165bff186 | 13:06 |
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| persia | pedroalvarez: If you mean, you don't see anything, then that's because you aren't subscribed to any worklists for which a task in the story you are examining has been added. | 13:07 |
| pedroalvarez | oh, that could be it | 13:08 |
| pedroalvarez | ta da :) | 13:08 |
| Zara | :D | 13:09 |
| pedroalvarez | nice | 13:09 |
| persia | That's actually one of the things I like best about this implementation: it is hidden by default, to avoid confusing folk, but exposes itself once people start to get interested in worklists. | 13:09 |
| pedroalvarez | Have we ever got to a conclusion about subscribing users to the things they have created automatically? | 13:10 |
| Zara | I think the status of that is 'we'd like it to be implemented, it's not implemented yet' | 13:11 |
| pedroalvarez | ok :) | 13:12 |
| persia | In my mind, the ideal implementation is to autosubscribe, so the user can safely unsubscribe later, if anyone is motivated to do that. | 13:12 |
| pedroalvarez | in my mind the implementation included a check box in user settings | 13:13 |
| Zara | (also, re: hidden by default, nice to know all that discussion paid off! :)) | 13:13 |
| * pedroalvarez <- the bikeshedding discussion provider | 13:13 | |
| Zara | hm, I'd rather not bother with a checkbox; most of the time if someone makes a story, they'll care about it | 13:13 |
| Zara | and it adds another config setting that can break | 13:13 |
| * pedroalvarez nods | 13:14 | |
| Zara | as long as they can unsubscribe, I think it covers all our bases. | 13:14 |
| persia | And if they really want to unsubscribe, there's a UI for that. | 13:14 |
| persia | In general, when it comes to preferences, my opinion is that the software should pick the sensible thing every time there is a decision to be made, and provide a UI that lets the user adjust that later, if they like. | 13:15 |
| pedroalvarez | I was just thinking about possible cases where (for example) managers where in charge of creating stories, tasks, worklists | 13:15 |
| persia | I would accept a later revision that allowed a user to select if they were autosubscribed, but I think a first pass is much simpler. | 13:15 |
| pedroalvarez | yup, I agree | 13:16 |
| persia | pedroalvarez: Those managers would very much want to be subscribed, or they would have no sensible way to monitor the activities of staff. | 13:16 |
| persia | At a very high level, I beleive all stories should be created by stakeholders, all worklists by maangers, and all tasks by developers. | 13:16 |
| persia | But until I see lots of usage of a multidimensional priority issue tracker in the wild, I remain a bit uncertain. | 13:17 |
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| persia | The explanation being that the stakeholders know what they want, so they are the only people qualified to document what should happen. The developers understand how the software works, so they are the only ones qualified to document how to achieve the goal, and the managers have staff that can be allocated to work on things, so they are the only ones that can sensibly set priorities. | 13:19 |
| persia | (some people may fit into more than one of these categories, of course) | 13:20 |
| Zara | yeah, plus priority of stories sounds more managerial, but priority of tasks can depend on technical considerations. | 13:24 |
| Zara | so in that case, a manager's signing off on priority rather than coming up with it. | 13:25 |
| Zara | and stories-as-bugs is where folks other than stakeholders may want to make a note (since it's normal to stumble across bugs while developing that you might want to note for later, to help someone out when they come to try to fix them, but which aren't relevant to the task you're currently working on) | 13:26 |
| Zara | tracker-as-documentation vs tracker-as-todo-list, I guess. | 13:27 |
| persia | If you use something enough to find a bug, you're a stakeholder | 13:28 |
| Zara | fair enough | 13:28 |
| persia | And if you care about the order of things being done and how resources are assigned, you're a manager | 13:28 |
| persia | (people can wear many hats) | 13:28 |
| persia | I apologise if I wasn't clear enough in my original statement that I expected most people to have multiple roles. | 13:28 |
| Zara | well on the latter point we disagree; I figure you're a manager if you have the power to affect the order of things being done and how resources are assigned. | 13:29 |
| persia | I like to believe in a world where developers are given enough autonomy to avoid performing tasks in the incorrect order. | 13:30 |
| persia | But, as with many of my delusions, it may be that reality disappoints. | 13:30 |
| Zara | by latter point I mean 'if you care about...' | 13:30 |
| Zara | since I think there's a distinction between caring about it and having power to change it | 13:30 |
| persia | Ah, I see what you mean. Yes, I accept your semantics. | 13:31 |
| Zara | \o/ | 13:31 |
| persia | Actually, your semantics should be applied to all three roles. | 13:31 |
| persia | Someone is a stakeholder because they have the power to assert that a feature exist, or describe a behaviour, not just because they find something they don't like. | 13:31 |
| persia | For some projects, anyone on the planet may submit a story, but this doesn't mean they will do so. | 13:32 |
| persia | and those that don't aren't stakeholders, regardless of how much they care about the colour of that widget in the lower left. | 13:32 |
| Zara | yup | 13:32 |
| persia | It's my rose-coloured glasses getting in the way again: I forget about the potential for people to have opinoins and not be able to exercise them. | 13:33 |
| Zara | I can see arguments over details but I agree with the general principle. | 13:33 |
| Zara | even if it's not as strict as 'stakeholder or not', could be: 'stakeholder potentially worth paying attention to or not' | 13:34 |
| Zara | etc etc | 13:34 |
| persia | We'll have to see how people use things and what they do, and then maybe we'll be qualified to have opinions :) | 13:34 |
| Zara | :P | 13:35 |
| persia | Yep, and the set of stakeholders worth attending may vary by manager, etc. | 13:35 |
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| openstackgerrit | Adam Coldrick proposed openstack-infra/storyboard: Allow permissions to be set for teams on stories https://review.openstack.org/368917 | 15:20 |
| Zara | yay | 15:21 |
| Zara | getting a 500 with the stories list page | 15:59 |
| Zara | http://paste.openstack.org/show/572370/ | 16:01 |
| Zara | (with that patch, not just in general) | 16:01 |
| Zara | only seems to happen on stories list so far | 16:30 |
| Zara | well, lists pages, just not detail pages | 16:31 |
| Zara | so same thing happens with projects and project groups | 16:31 |
| Zara | also it just took me about 3 years to type 'groups' with all the letters in the right order | 16:31 |
| Zara | I wish this error were more informative. | 16:38 |
| persia | AttributeError usually means trying to select something that doesn't exist. I suspect the change to models.py: do you get a different error if you revert only that line of change? | 16:44 |
| Zara | it looks like it's trying to get id when there's only stories_id, but not sure yet | 16:48 |
| persia | Line 320 of models.py suggests stories.id is a thing. | 16:51 |
| persia | unless I am misunderstanding more than usual | 16:51 |
| Zara | I don't know much yet. | 16:55 |
| Zara | this is the code that's running to display the error: def __getattr__(self, key): | 16:55 |
| Zara | try: | 16:55 |
| Zara | return self._data[key] | 16:55 |
| Zara | except KeyError: | 16:55 |
| Zara | so I just tried printing out some of the things there | 16:55 |
| Zara | raise AttributeError(key) | 16:55 |
| SotK | I don't think I changed anything to break project lists o.O | 16:56 |
| Zara | and it said self._data = {'stories_id': Column('stories_id', Integer(), table=<filtered_stories>, primary_key=True, nullable=False)} | 16:56 |
| Zara | ah, not project lists, but lists of stories in projects | 16:56 |
| SotK | aha | 16:56 |
| Zara | so the project list will work but not the story list items in a project | 16:56 |
| Zara | so yeah, for the above, the key is just 'id' | 16:56 |
| Zara | and I figure there's no key there called 'id' | 16:56 |
| * SotK will investigate when he is no longer mobile | 16:56 | |
| Zara | heh | 16:57 |
| SotK | there should always be an id, very weird | 16:57 |
| Zara | (if I print `self, key` I get ['filtered_stories.stories_id'] id ) | 16:58 |
| persia | I wonder if this error exists anytime there are no visible stories in a project. | 17:00 |
| persia | (because the subquery would have no results, etc.) | 17:00 |
| Zara | ugh, been staring at this blankly for a while | 17:32 |
| Zara | I thiiink it's when it tries to get task statuses (since it calls getattr there, with the story summary) mayyyybe it wants tasks to have a team id | 17:42 |
| Zara | zzz, I'm not making any progress on it, anyway, so heading off. 'night! | 17:44 |
| SotK | its caused by the fact that I return a union of two queries instead of just one from filter_private_stories | 18:53 |
| SotK | I think that causes the subquery to be returned with column titles prefixed by "$tablename_" | 18:55 |
| openstackgerrit | Adam Coldrick proposed openstack-infra/storyboard: Allow permissions to be set for teams on stories https://review.openstack.org/368917 | 18:55 |
| Zara | \o/ will take a look tomorrow | 19:14 |
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