Wednesday, 2014-05-21

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Haomenghello, tripleo team00:07
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cd-undercloud************** overcloud complete status=1 ************00:08
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Haomengone question, who know the default password for the seed vm which is created by devtest.sh ?00:08
greghaynesIt adds your ssh key for root (so ssh as root to it)00:08
Haomengyes, but I want to login with its console by virt-manager00:09
Haomengok, let me ssh and change, thankyou00:09
Haomengand how can I get seed's ip address?00:10
greghaynesit should end up at 192.0.2.1 once its done bootstrapping00:10
Haomengok00:11
Haomengthk00:11
Haomengshould I add some bridge for the vm, I can not ping 192.0.2.1 from the host os00:12
greghaynesHaomeng: If you check out devtest_seed.sh you should see where we ip route replace ...00:14
Haomenggreghaynes: ok, let me check the scripts00:15
Haomenggreghaynes: thank you00:15
greghaynesnp00:15
Haomenggreghaynes: :)00:16
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openstackgerritTim Potter proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Add DIB_DEBOOTSTRAP_EXTRA_ARGS environment variable  https://review.openstack.org/9251701:46
SpamapSok, stopped tripleo-cd .. it's just proving once more that automation is impossible until we fix updates in Heat01:49
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bnemecstevebaker: You just missed me earlier. :-)02:37
bnemecStill around?02:37
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-specs: Fixes an inconsistency in section capitalization  https://review.openstack.org/9444302:44
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stevebakerbnemec: yo02:52
bnemecstevebaker: Hey02:52
stevebakerbnemec: I wonder if you had any ideas re my selinux woes in the scrollback02:53
bnemecstevebaker: Not really.  I haven't tried building with selinux enabled in a long time, and the only places I see us disabling it we write to /etc/selinux/config so it should be showing up there too.03:00
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untriaged-botUntriaged bugs so far:03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131876703:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1318767 in tripleo "apache element SSL cert check fails" [Undecided,New]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131744603:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317446 in tripleo "Whitespace in SSLCertificate param causes jq error" [Undecided,In progress]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131497803:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1314978 in tripleo "Cloud vm not pingable after overcloud upgrade " [Undecided,New]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/131902703:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1319027 in diskimage-builder "dib install packages not document in the command help" [Undecided,New]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131535503:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1315355 in tripleo "Upgrade of overcloud failed with "Connection to neutron failed: Maximum attempts reached"" [Undecided,New]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131705603:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317056 in tripleo "Guest VM FS corruption after compute host reboot" [Critical,New]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/131871703:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1318717 in diskimage-builder "image with rhel element can't be built if DIB_RHSM_* variables aren't set" [Undecided,In progress]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131667503:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1316675 in tripleo "Saving a devtest VM results in error" [Undecided,In progress]03:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/132009003:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1320090 in tripleo "pxe_ephemeral_format': u'ext4 left on nodes after deploys deleted" [Undecided,New]03:00
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stevebakerbnemec: ah well, permissive works for me for now. That will do03:28
bnemecstevebaker: Cool.  When rwsu gets selinux working for everything we should have better test coverage of this stuff. :-)03:29
stevebakerok03:29
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StevenKlifeless: Once more with feeling, https://review.openstack.org/9378903:40
lifelesswhat feeling :P03:43
lifelessStevenK: done :)03:44
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StevenK:-/03:47
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StevenKlifeless: Thoughts on http://paste.openstack.org/show/8103103:52
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tchaypoStevenK: I'd prefer to be consistent with the units - either say 600 seconds or 10 minutes both times04:05
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StevenKtchaypo: So 10 minutes (600 seconds) in the REST, or drop the seconds entirely?04:08
tchaypoI'd drop one unit entirely; and since one of them has already dropped seconds...04:08
tchaypounless the commandline uses 600, in which case it's probably clearer to say "600 seconds" so that idiots like me don't waste time staring at the line wondering why the 10 is missing and what the 600 means04:09
* tchaypo gives 10 items of contradictory advice before breakfast04:09
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StevenKlifeless, tchaypo: http://paste.openstack.org/show/8103404:10
tchaypo+!04:10
openstackgerritSteve Kowalik proposed a change to openstack/os-cloud-config: Loop for 600 seconds during user creation  https://review.openstack.org/9378904:14
lifelessStevenK: works for me04:15
StevenKlifeless: Then can haz +2 ?04:16
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tchaypo*facepalm*04:17
lifelesshmm greghaynes / bnemec / SpamapS around/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/90890/04:17
lifelessStevenK: after CI :)04:18
tchaypoSo early in the thread on the meeting time change we talked about alternating 1900UTC Tuesday and 2100UTC Wednesday... but when we switched to talking about 0700UTC no-one mentioned a day04:18
* bnemec is not here, please leave a message :-)04:19
bnemeclifeless: http://logs.openstack.org/90/90890/10/check-tripleo/check-tripleo-ironic-seed-precise/a9c2972/console.html#_2014-05-20_18_03_30_219 looks like a legit failure related to the change, doesn't it?04:19
tchayposo bugger it, I choose 0700Wednesday, because that means the meetings are always on my wedndsay04:20
lifelessbnemec: oh nuts04:20
lifelessbnemec: it looked green when I eyeballed this morning04:20
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Split keystone away from heat collector  https://review.openstack.org/9452304:20
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Add dogpile cache to keystone abstraction layer  https://review.openstack.org/9452404:20
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Make keystone.Keystone.client lazy-load  https://review.openstack.org/9452504:20
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Cache auth_ref from keystoneclient  https://review.openstack.org/9452604:20
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Make heat the default collection method  https://review.openstack.org/9452704:20
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SpamapSitch scratched04:21
lifeless\o/04:22
bnemecIt's sleepy time here.  Catch you all tomorrow.04:22
* bnemec &04:22
StevenKlifeless: I'm not certain if non-released versions of os-cloud-config are even checked during CI -- and incubator doesn't make use of any of the scripts yet04:22
lifelessthey aren't yet; we need to finish derekh's sketchin that direction04:23
lifelessstevebaker was looking at it I believe04:23
stevebakerevery os-*-config except os-cloud-config04:24
StevenKstevebaker: Heh04:24
tchaypolifeless: stevenk - have udpated wiki with new meeting times, can you check?04:24
* tchaypo goes to gate04:24
StevenKtchaypo: Oh, Brisbane?04:25
StevenK"Scheduled for Dec 10, 2013, 19:00 UTC"04:25
StevenKReeeeeeeealy04:25
StevenKSo is this week the 0700Z or the 1900Z?04:27
lifelesstchaypo: so that looks fine - but! perhaps render out the date/weeks combos so folk can easily see ?04:27
lifelessthis week was the 1900z04:27
StevenKRight, so I don't have to care about attending until next Wednesday04:27
tchaypoIndeed.04:29
tchaypolifeless: Once ttx has updated the (g|i)cal I'll add a pointer to that04:30
tchaypoStevenK: Yep. This is my pointless day trip, then my trip up and back this weekend will get me back to gold a few weeks before a bunch of credits expire and make it difficult to achieve04:32
StevenKAdditional Status credits required by 31 Jan 2015 to retain Silver: 1004:34
StevenKGAH04:34
tchaypolifeless: I was looking at the rationalise-ui etherpad and pondering turning it into a spec; but the spec template doesn't really fit things that aren't a specific feature04:34
tchaypoIs there some other place that makes sense for this? Maybe we should add a HACKING and out style notes like "prefer parameters over shared state" to it?04:35
tchaypoStevenK: Well the good news is, you're going to make it...04:35
StevenKSo damn hard to get Gold on Qantas if you only fly Econonmy04:36
tchaypo5 trips like the one we just did will do it on virgin, but you only need 4 to retain04:37
StevenK110 status credits for SYD->SJC->SYD ; 130 status credits for SYD->ATL->SYD04:38
tchaypoWhich is why I'm doing this weeks status run; once I get there i should be able to keep it easily, but if I don't get it now I'll always be just too far away to manage04:38
StevenKSYD->CDG->SYD is probably ~12004:39
StevenKSYD->RDU->SYD is probably also 13004:39
StevenKSYD->ADL->SYD is like 2004:39
tchaypoI'm not going to waste time looking that up in QF, since they deliberately obfuscate their tables04:40
StevenKOh, SYD->BNE->SYD is also probably 20, but that still leaves me 170 short04:41
tchaypoOkay, boarding04:41
StevenKAKL probably gives me 4004:41
StevenKQantas is making it very hard to love them04:41
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tchaypoNawww ;)04:51
tchaypoFwiw you might want to check out koru or krisflyer, they both earn on VA too but have better networks.04:51
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StevenKBlah, forgot -c to devtest :-(05:35
StevenKIn other news, I think I have register-nodes ported to using ironicclient05:36
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xuhaiweii can ssh seedcloud, but can't ssh undercloud, what can be the reason?05:50
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xuhaiweiI can't even ping undercloud05:50
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SpamapSxuhaiwei: usually undercloud is routed through seed (assuming you're doing devtest)06:14
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xuhaiweiSpamapS: undercloud should be sshed from host, right?06:15
xuhaiweii am doing devtest06:15
xuhaiweiSpamapS: I can see the route table of seed, there is 192.0.2.006:16
SpamapSxuhaiwei: yes, so that should work06:18
xuhaiweiSpamapS: and after source undercloudrc, the 'nova list' command doesn't work06:18
SpamapSxuhaiwei: perhaps undercloud didn't get an address from the seed?06:18
xuhaiweiI ran 'nova list' in the seed, and the undercloud instance is running, and has a IP 192.0.2.306:19
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SpamapSxuhaiwei: but did you look at the console, and see that it actually got that IP via DHCP?06:28
GheRiveromorning all06:30
marioso/06:37
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xuhaiweiSpamapS: I succeeded in ssh undercloud yesterday, but today can't ssh it again.06:51
SpamapSxuhaiwei: did the console of the undercloud show the correct network address?06:53
xuhaiweiyes06:53
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SpamapSxuhaiwei: If you have kept the 'stackuser' element in the elements list, you can login at the console with 'stack/stack' ... that should allow you to debug the networking a bit.06:55
rpodolyakamorning tripleo06:55
xuhaiweiSpamapS: thank you06:59
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Clean up heat env file code (overcloud)  https://review.openstack.org/9098307:10
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Make heat the default collection method  https://review.openstack.org/9452707:11
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lifelesstchaypo: the feature could be 'here are new design guidelines'07:14
lifelesstchaypo: with remedial work identified07:14
tchaypoA-ha.07:17
tchaypoI think I can make that fit the template without too much folding/spindling07:18
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openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Make heat the default collection method  https://review.openstack.org/9452707:25
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Cache auth_ref from keystoneclient  https://review.openstack.org/9452607:25
SpamapSinteresting.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYZ2GzYAw_Q  .. chef at facebook .. 16:38 he gets into the "how to delete something forever from all boxes" problem that we solve by using images.07:28
lifelessSpamapS: /mnt/state is still a hole for that07:29
SpamapSlifeless: state is hard.. right?07:29
SpamapS:)07:29
SpamapSlifeless: actually they basically did the same thing as we do by pwning the config file w/ o-a-c and adding passthrough07:30
jprovaznlifeless, Hi, when you have a minute, could you please check this thread http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-May/034915.html ?07:32
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lifelessjprovazn: sure, I can add my 2c07:46
jprovaznlifeless, awesome, thanks07:46
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xuhaiweiI destroyed undercloud, and ran devtest_undercloud again, but failed with this error log: install: cannot stat '/opt/stack/ceilometer/etc/ceilometer/sources.json': No such file or directory08:03
openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Use json equality rather than raw text  https://review.openstack.org/9454808:03
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derekh_lifeless: I'm going to reconfrim now that images can be built with 8G VM's , then set about getting us back down to 8G flavors, any idea what order it should happen? add new flavor then submit reduced mem requirement to nodepool config08:24
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SpamapSderekh_: your change to fall back to disk for some things fixed 8G vms08:35
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tuskar-ui: Use oslo.sphinx theme for docs  https://review.openstack.org/9133008:37
lifelessderekh_: add flavor, change ndoepool config08:39
lifelessderekh_: yes08:39
* SpamapS decides sleep is imminent08:39
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SpamapSlifeless: https://review.openstack.org/94527 <-- no more streaming WARNING's in os-collect-config.log .. btw08:41
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openstackgerritColeman Corrigan proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Tidy base image by removing /var/log files  https://review.openstack.org/9283908:43
derekh_lifeless: SpamapS cool, will go about getting that sorted now,08:47
derekh_lifeless: missed the irc meeting, local openstack meetup was on tripleo so went to it,08:48
derekh_lifeless: had a look at logs, will sort out a spec for ci08:48
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Export seed ip instead of gateway ip.  https://review.openstack.org/9355309:09
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Export seed ip instead of gateway ip for keygen.  https://review.openstack.org/9421909:09
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Make a separation between --heat-env  https://review.openstack.org/9309109:09
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Move to software-config for the undercloud.  https://review.openstack.org/9331909:09
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Add passthrough configuration glue.  https://review.openstack.org/9181009:09
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Separate Heat BM and VM configs for Nova-BM.  https://review.openstack.org/9003309:10
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Choose whether to deploy/update using heat.  https://review.openstack.org/9234409:10
openstackgerritjan grant proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Tidy up SuSE kernel selection  https://review.openstack.org/9074809:11
openstackgerritjan grant proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Parameterise PXE kernel and initrd selection  https://review.openstack.org/8339009:11
lifelessWALL OF PATCHES09:11
lifelessand with that, gnight09:11
openstackgerritMichael Kerrin proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Enable cinder.conf passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9455709:12
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add elements to user image via TEST_IMAGE_DIB_EXTRA_ARGS  https://review.openstack.org/8273909:14
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openstackgerritRadomir Dopieralski proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add oslosphinx to the requirements.txt  https://review.openstack.org/9456109:29
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openstackgerritRadomir Dopieralski proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add oslosphinx to the requirements.txt  https://review.openstack.org/9456109:38
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: MySQL element - correct os-svc-restart arguments  https://review.openstack.org/9017909:47
openstackgerritRadomir Dopieralski proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add oslosphinx to the requirements.txt  https://review.openstack.org/9456109:49
jangAnyone care to make newer rabbit work? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/92815/09:51
jangthere's also the otehr series of rabbit patches: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/91861/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/92204/09:52
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Choose whether to deploy/update using heat.  https://review.openstack.org/9234409:52
jprovaznjang, looking09:53
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Choose whether to deploy/update using heat.  https://review.openstack.org/9234409:53
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Make a separation between --heat-env  https://review.openstack.org/9309109:53
GheRiverojang: looking09:56
openstackgerritStuart McLaren proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Glance: Enable passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9456709:59
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dshulyakjprovazn: hi, take a look pls https://review.openstack.org/#/c/93580/, after this is merged we can add haproxy element to image and test everything else on ci10:02
jprovazndshulyak, will do - I guess it's needed to make sure there is at elast one listen block10:04
dshulyakjprovazn: yes10:05
jprovazndshulyak, hm, having stats always enabled to everybody (=with known user/pass) might be an issue10:08
jprovaznback in 30m10:08
dshulyakjprovazn: it will listen only on private network ip10:09
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openstackgerritStuart McLaren proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Glance: Enable passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9456710:39
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derekh_anybody else having trouble running devtest on fedora https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=109984710:52
uvirtbotderekh_: Error: Could not parse XML returned by bugzilla.redhat.com: HTTP Error 404: Not Found10:52
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openstackgerritJames Slagle proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: TripleO and Docker  https://review.openstack.org/9458611:42
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openstackgerritJan Provaznik proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Add parameters for setting up keystone keys/certs  https://review.openstack.org/9459111:51
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openstackgerritStuart McLaren proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Glance: Enable passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9456712:11
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openstackgerritJames Slagle proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: TripleO and Docker  https://review.openstack.org/9458612:21
lsmolaslagle: hello, could I have a quick question about elements?12:22
slaglelsmola: sure12:23
lsmolaslagle: do you think this is a valid way how to propose 2 configuration files, for Undercloud and Overcloud https://review.openstack.org/#/c/94398/12:23
lsmolaslagle: ?12:24
lsmolaslagle: for Overcloud the best would be to take it from the Ceilometer repo, for Undercloud I would like to define it, though I didn't see this approach anywhere12:25
lsmolaslagle: also for production, people will want to modify this pipeline.yaml, what should be the approach, when configuration is complex yaml file?12:26
slaglelsmola: i would split it up into two elements instead of having the template diverge like that12:28
slaglelsmola: ceilometer-undercloud-config and ceilometer-overcloud-config12:28
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lsmolaslagle: hm, right, that sounds like a reasonable thing to do12:28
lsmolaslagle: any idea how to make it configurable for users?12:30
openstackgerritGiulio Fidente proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Ensure dib-run-parts profiling works with py3 and py2  https://review.openstack.org/9429212:30
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slaglelsmola: make a template that repeates for each sources/sinks specified in the input12:35
slaglelsmola: in fact, if you need that, that might the best thing to do12:35
slaglethen just document in the setup for the undercloud/overcloud12:36
lsmolaslagle: hm, might be a hard thing to do as the pipeline is pretty free form12:36
lsmolaslagle: ok, will try to come up with something, for now, the static definition should be enough12:37
slaglelsmola: sure, but the structure of the yaml doc is always the same isn't it?]12:37
lsmolaslagle: thank you12:37
lsmolaslagle: yeah it should be12:38
openstackgerritJames Slagle proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: TripleO and Docker  https://review.openstack.org/9458612:39
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openstackgerritAna Krivokapic proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add performance charts to node details page  https://review.openstack.org/8641312:44
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openstackgerritLorcan Browne proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Add check_mk swift proxy diagnostic  https://review.openstack.org/9460712:49
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openstackgerritJan Provaznik proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Templatize keystone ssl keys/certs  https://review.openstack.org/9460912:59
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Adding Swift proxy-server memcache metadata  https://review.openstack.org/8631313:06
lsmolaslagle: hm, could it be that overcloud pipeline.yaml will be added by this https://github.com/openstack/tripleo-image-elements/blob/master/elements/ceilometer/install.d/68-ceilometer#L713:10
lsmolaslagle: and for undercloud it would be overwrote by the os-apply-config?13:10
lsmolaslagle: if the ceilometer-undercloud-config will depend on Ceilometer element, it should overwrite the pipeline yaml, right?13:11
lsmolaslagle: next step would be config that would be configurable by json, so you can overwrite the default one with whatever13:12
openstackgerritTzu-Mainn Chen proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Supporting all Heat parameter types  https://review.openstack.org/9078813:21
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Clean up heat env file code (undercloud)  https://review.openstack.org/9307213:36
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openstackgerritAna Krivokapic proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add performance charts to node details page  https://review.openstack.org/8641313:39
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Move to software-config for the undercloud.  https://review.openstack.org/9331913:47
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Export seed ip instead of gateway ip for keygen.  https://review.openstack.org/9421913:47
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Export seed ip instead of gateway ip.  https://review.openstack.org/9355313:47
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Make a separation between --heat-env  https://review.openstack.org/9309113:47
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Choose whether to deploy/update using heat.  https://review.openstack.org/9234413:47
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Add passthrough configuration glue.  https://review.openstack.org/9181013:47
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openstackgerritTzu-Mainn Chen proposed a change to openstack/tuskar-ui: Remove unused node table template  https://review.openstack.org/9462313:55
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tuskar-ui: Add performance charts to node details page  https://review.openstack.org/8641314:05
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tuskar-ui: Supporting all Heat parameter types  https://review.openstack.org/9078814:07
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Separate Heat BM and VM configs for Nova-BM.  https://review.openstack.org/9003314:08
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openstackgerritFlint Calvin proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Value of metering_secret needs to get set in /etc/ceilometer/ceilometer.conf.  https://review.openstack.org/9420114:18
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tuskar-ui: Remove unused node table template  https://review.openstack.org/9462314:23
openstackgerritDerek Higgins proposed a change to openstack-infra/tripleo-ci: Name logs tarball after the instance name  https://review.openstack.org/9463114:28
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KiallAnyone able to +A this simple change? 3x +2's but no +A ;) https://review.openstack.org/#/c/9303114:37
openstackgerritErik Colnick proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Enable neutron.conf passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9345114:38
openstackgerritPhil Neal proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Fix missing Ceilometer password in overcloud deployment  https://review.openstack.org/9463314:40
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openstackgerritLadislav Smola proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Ceilometer Config element for custom pipeline  https://review.openstack.org/9463414:45
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bnemecKiall: It hasn't passed CI yet.14:47
Kiallbeecee: Humm, I thought those jobs were just broken TBH ;) Let me retrigger them14:48
Kiallah14:48
openstackgerritLadislav Smola proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Adding Undecloud ceilometer config element  https://review.openstack.org/9463714:48
KiallJan retriggered them earlier14:48
KiallI missed that14:49
bnemecKiall: Yep, CI is kind of a mess right now (> 24 hour wait time last I checked), but if we approve patches that haven't passed we'll end up making things worse.14:50
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openstackgerritLadislav Smola proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Adding Undecloud ceilometer config element  https://review.openstack.org/9463714:53
bnemecCrud, filtering out WIP actually made our review stats worse. :-(14:59
bnemechttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/94640/14:59
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untriaged-botUntriaged bugs so far:15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/132156415:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/132156315:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321564 in diskimage-builder "Add vmedia boot support in ramdisk element " [Undecided,New]15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131876715:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321563 in diskimage-builder "Add support in ramdisk element to fetch IP from dhcp" [Undecided,New]15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131744615:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1318767 in tripleo "apache element SSL cert check fails" [Undecided,New]15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131497815:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317446 in tripleo "Whitespace in SSLCertificate param causes jq error" [Undecided,In progress]15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/131902715:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131535515:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/132178415:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131705615:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131667515:01
uvirtbotuntriaged-bot: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out15:01
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/132009015:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1319027 in diskimage-builder "dib install packages not document in the command help" [Undecided,New]15:01
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1315355 in tripleo "Upgrade of overcloud failed with "Connection to neutron failed: Maximum attempts reached"" [Undecided,New]15:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321784 in tripleo "Updates to overcloud deploy script breaks Ceilometer service startup" [Undecided,In progress]15:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317056 in tripleo "Guest VM FS corruption after compute host reboot" [Critical,New]15:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1316675 in tripleo "Saving a devtest VM results in error" [Undecided,In progress]15:01
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1320090 in tripleo "pxe_ephemeral_format': u'ext4 left on nodes after deploys deleted" [Undecided,New]15:01
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openstackgerritMichael Kerrin proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Enable cinder.conf passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9455715:14
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derekh_lifeless: SpamapS: CI update - ZUUL queue length == 9915:17
derekh_We've only being using R2 for the last few days (10 testenvs), not enough to keep up, patch in place to increase this too 18 https://review.openstack.org/#/c/94558/15:17
derekh_new 8G flavors created on boh clouds15:18
derekh_*both15:18
derekh_nodepool thought it was at capacity with R1 (it thought it had 40 nodes running), probably due to a R1 api timeout when deleting nodes15:18
derekh_fungi manually deleted one of them from nodepool the see if it started being used again15:19
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openstackgerritRoman Podoliaka proposed a change to openstack/tuskar: Don't display passwords when listing overclouds  https://review.openstack.org/9464815:25
dshulyakdoes anybody tried to use galera in production cluster with full master/master support ?15:26
dshulyakgreghaynes, jprovazn ^^15:26
dshulyaki mean read and write from any node in cluster15:27
openstackgerritDmitry Shulyak proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Make horizon port configurable  https://review.openstack.org/9108915:27
openstackgerritDmitry Shulyak proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Allow services ports configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9255015:29
openstackgerritJiri Stransky proposed a change to openstack/tuskar: Temporary fix for SQLite compatibility  https://review.openstack.org/9465115:32
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openstackgerritErik Colnick proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Enable additional neutron passthrough configuration  https://review.openstack.org/9348215:39
ccorriganderekh_:   any suggestions on how to deal with the uglyness around nova_bm exceptions for ironic ?15:40
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ccorriganshoudl os-apply-config be returning a default for invalid keys ?15:41
ccorrigancatching the failure of os-apply-config --key nova.baremetal.db  with a || seems to be just hackery15:42
derekh_ccorrigan: I was going to suggest adding if [ -n os-apply-config --key nova.baremetal --type dsn --key-default '' ] around the function to test if it exists15:42
derekh_ccorrigan: but your right it should probably return the default15:42
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Properly default MysqlInnodbBufferPoolSize (undercloud)  https://review.openstack.org/9307316:00
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jprovazndshulyak, I tried read/write in A/A, replication worked fine16:07
openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Move to software-config for the undercloud.  https://review.openstack.org/9331916:07
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Add passthrough configuration glue.  https://review.openstack.org/9181016:08
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ccorriganderekh_: so two issues here then, stub out should have been with a traversable rather than a string, and os-apply-config should catch TypeErrors when trying to traverse a string  - agree ?16:13
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openstackgerritGhe Rivero proposed a change to openstack/diskimage-builder: Initial cirros element  https://review.openstack.org/9466416:22
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openstackgerritGhe Rivero proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: WIP- kill rabbit before restarting it.  https://review.openstack.org/9363716:25
openstackgerritOpenStack Proposal Bot proposed a change to openstack/os-cloud-config: Updated from global requirements  https://review.openstack.org/9325316:27
greghaynesdshulyak: yes, I did a simple test in a/a16:31
openstackgerritGerry Drudy proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Configure passthrough in proxy-server.conf  https://review.openstack.org/9262816:31
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TheJuliaHi16:32
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dshulyakgreghaynes: by simple you mean created vm with flavor, etc ?16:33
greghaynesdshulyak: Not sure what you mean by that - I just hand made a heat template, started multiple control nodes, and added some rows to the db16:33
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Move to software-config for the undercloud.  https://review.openstack.org/9331916:36
dshulyakgreghaynes: i mean creating openstack resources and verifying that information is valid on multiple controllers16:37
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openstackgerritNicholas Randon proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Add passthrough configuration glue.  https://review.openstack.org/9181016:41
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greghaynesdshulyak: ah. Well I did boot multi node control node and got to CREATE_COMPLETE - although that is not nearly 'verifying' the cluster16:48
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vinshYeah.. you still have to "tail -f /var/log/*/*" and resolve error 1-100 :)17:06
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greghaynesexactly!17:15
greghaynesIt boots - ship it!17:15
vinsh!17:17
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openstackgerritDan Prince proposed a change to openstack-infra/tripleo-ci: Download the fedora base image from a good URL  https://review.openstack.org/9305817:26
openstackgerritGregory Haynes proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Add os-is-bootstrap-host element and script  https://review.openstack.org/8643517:27
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openstackgerritGregory Haynes proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Allow multiple binds per service in haproxy  https://review.openstack.org/8992517:33
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vinshInteresting.. that your readme cuts out the readme I had merged.. https://review.openstack.org/#/c/89925/9/elements/haproxy/README.md17:39
vinshhttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/89925/9/elements/haproxy/README.md17:39
vinshgreghaynes, ^17:39
vinshmaybe my addition isn't needed?17:40
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greghaynesvinsh: what change of yours are you referring to?17:40
vinshbad paste. sorry17:40
vinshhttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/93121/3/elements/haproxy/README.md17:40
greghaynesvinsh: ah, it must be re-baseable17:41
vinshah ya. makes sense.17:42
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vinshwhy does jenkins check a review everytime someone +1's it?17:43
vinshdon't see the point.17:43
greghaynesit shouldnt17:43
vinshalways does... https://review.openstack.org/#/c/89925/917:43
vinshI gave a +1.. it goes and verifies again17:43
greghaynesvinsh: I think thats just phase lag from my recently uploaded patch set17:44
vinshnothing to see here :)17:44
greghayneshehe17:44
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vinshgreghaynes, one more thing.. I was wondering.  Are you focused on scaling control nodes.. in a manner in which they are all the same.. besides one being master?  I know that on our side we want one to be a "mgmt" control node.. and the others to be general control nodes17:48
vinshSome service.. like celiometer might just run on mgmt.. and not the other controls17:49
vinshbaby steps first probably.17:49
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greghaynesvinsh: Not sure exactly what you mean - Ideally services are either a/a or a/p but on all control nodes....17:52
greghaynesI did get the impression that celiometer might not play way being on more than one node when at the summit, I was kind of punting on that for now17:53
* vinsh pm's17:53
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openstackgerritDan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Name disable-requiretty files uniquely  https://review.openstack.org/9468618:03
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openstackgerritDan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Name disable-requiretty files uniquely  https://review.openstack.org/9468618:04
openstackgerritEd Bak proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Run the overcloud with an SSL enabled public IP  https://review.openstack.org/8509818:05
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petertoftAny takers for another +2 on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/91625/ ?18:21
greghaynesneeds to pass overcloud :(18:21
petertoftOk (I'm kinda new here …)18:22
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greghaynesso the check-tripleo-* comment left by jenkins, everything that doesnt have (non voting) after it needs to succeeed18:23
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greghayneshuh, the comment about triple bracing on your patchset 3 is something I was totally unaware of18:25
greghaynessince we double brace all over18:26
greghaynespetertoft: ok, told it to rerun tests, if you notice tests pass before you get a +A ping and ill change to a +A18:28
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peoplemergegreghaynes: how do you interpret the output from petertoft's build?  http://logs.openstack.org/25/91625/3/check-tripleo/check-tripleo-overcloud-f20/9d44625/console.html which ends with exit 1 from tar: file changed as we read it18:31
peoplemergeTho not sure why or even if tar should care18:32
greghaynesI think thats SEB (someone elses bug)18:32
greghaynesand I am pretty sure that has been fixed18:33
greghaynesI believe it was a CI issue a while ago and was failing all the tests (woo fun)18:34
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SpamapSHm, I see stuff running on R1 now18:37
SpamapShopefully that will help the queue flush18:37
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peoplemergegreghaynes: yeah... so about that... mine https://review.openstack.org/#/c/93998/ bailed a second time on overcloud18:42
greghaynesthat one succeeded (the fedora is non voting)18:42
greghayneswhich is awesome considering its a yum change ;)18:43
greghayneshrm, I wonder if some recent changes mean we need to up our memory size defaults per node...18:44
greghaynesim getting cannot allocate memory errors on undercloud with a fresh devtest18:44
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lifelessdshulyak_: yes, master-master works fine I'm told as long as the inter-key stride and offset is configured (or auto configured) correctly18:52
peoplemergegreghaynes: Do I understand correctly that this change is ready for another reviewer?  :)18:52
lifelessI was speaking with jay pipes about that18:52
greghaynespeoplemerge: yerp18:53
openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/tripleo-heat-templates: Use vip address where controller0 was used for endpoints  https://review.openstack.org/9415718:53
mordredoh look, it's a petertoft !18:56
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lifelessjcoufal: hi :) - reminider - mail the dev list about mid cycle meetup options :)18:59
SpamapShttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Rte20eScfc <-- some blow hard talking about TripleO at the summit.19:03
clarkbhey I know that guy19:03
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greghaynesYou know its a real eng. talk because it has the token openstack 3 box image19:10
SpamapSgreghaynes: and the token ridiculously complex service diagram19:13
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nealphGheRivero: looks like a merged change broke overcloud ceilometer integration...can you take a look at fix in https://review.openstack.org/#/c/94633/ and +2 if appropriate?19:41
openstackgerritDan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Add unit test to enforce unique file names.  https://review.openstack.org/9470519:42
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openstackgerritDan Prince proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-image-elements: Fix a pep8 error in tempest/tests2skip.py  https://review.openstack.org/9470819:45
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openstackgerritA change was merged to openstack/diskimage-builder: `set -u` doesn't permit bash arrays to test -n  https://review.openstack.org/9399820:21
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bnemecrbrady: Was http://paste.openstack.org/show/81091/ the error you and Derek were seeing on Fedora?20:23
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rbradybnemec: nope.20:24
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bnemecrbrady: Hrm, okay.20:27
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jcoufallifeless: hey :) I am keeping it on my mind, just need to communicate the options with some other people who are on vacation this week. I will send introductory mail during next week20:32
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tchaypojcoufal: if you could arrange for the state to switch to Pacific time for the duration of the mid-cycle, in order to lessen the jet lag experienced by people from the other side of the world, that'd be great ;)20:40
openstackgerritJay Dobies proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: Initial spec for the Tuskar Juno REST API changes  https://review.openstack.org/9472020:41
lifelessjcoufal: cool20:41
jcoufaltchaypo: will see what we can do :)20:41
openstackgerritJay Dobies proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: WIP: Initial spec for the Tuskar Juno REST API changes  https://review.openstack.org/9472020:42
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tchaypoSo before summit, I was starting to get confused about the relationship between tripleo and devtest.sh; but at summit, I think I figured out that TripleO is a collection of tools, devtest.sh is a "serving suggestion" showing how those tools could be utilised20:44
tchaypotuskar (and presumably helion and rdo, neither of which I've looked at yet) are more refined metatools that use the some underlying tools as devtest.sh, but in a way that's intended to be comprehensible to people who haven't dedicated weeks of their life to understanding tripleo20:45
tchaypodoes that sound right?20:46
bnemectchaypo: helion and rdo are HP and Red Hat's OpenStack distributions - they might include tripleo/tuskar, but they don't replace them.20:51
adam_ghas anyone seen devtest_undercloud.sh failing like this? http://paste.openstack.org/show/81101/20:51
bnemecadam_g: Yes, lots. :-)20:52
bnemecadam_g: You need a newer version of t-i-e.20:52
adam_gbnemec, ah! thanks20:52
bnemec(I think, safest just to pull down latest everything)20:52
ccrouchtchaypo: RDO is just a packaging of openstack for fedora/centos20:53
ccrouchfor RDO it is Instack that is a "more refined metatool that use the some underlying tools as devtest.sh"20:53
ccrouchhttp://openstack.redhat.com/Deploying_RDO_using_Instack20:53
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untriaged-botUntriaged bugs so far:21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/132156421:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/132156321:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321564 in diskimage-builder "Add vmedia boot support in ramdisk element " [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131876721:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321563 in diskimage-builder "Add support in ramdisk element to fetch IP from dhcp" [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131744621:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1318767 in tripleo "apache element SSL cert check fails" [Undecided,New]21:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317446 in tripleo "Whitespace in SSLCertificate param causes jq error" [Undecided,In progress]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131497821:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1314978 in tripleo "Cloud vm not pingable after overcloud upgrade " [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/+bug/131902721:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1319027 in diskimage-builder "dib install packages not document in the command help" [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131535521:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1315355 in tripleo "Upgrade of overcloud failed with "Connection to neutron failed: Maximum attempts reached"" [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131705621:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config/+bug/132182721:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1317056 in tripleo "Guest VM FS corruption after compute host reboot" [Critical,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/131667521:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1321827 in os-apply-config "os-apply-config fails with  TypeError: string indices must be integers  when traversing strings " [Undecided,New]21:00
untriaged-bothttps://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/132009021:00
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1316675 in tripleo "Saving a devtest VM results in error" [Undecided,In progress]21:00
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1320090 in tripleo "pxe_ephemeral_format': u'ext4 left on nodes after deploys deleted" [Undecided,New]21:00
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greghayneshrm, so do others here run 64bit devtest with only 2gb ram nodes?21:08
greghaynesI was getting couldnt allocate mem errors when I tried this... which is worrysome since its our default21:09
janggreghaynes: I found I cuold for a while, but more and more wound up on the undercloud (and on the control backplane in the overcloud)21:10
jang3GB seemed to be a bare minimum.21:10
* greghaynes makes review for changing this in our docs21:10
jangagain, it's one of those things that pushes out the required memory, if you're going for fidelity (of bittedness) in a test rig.21:11
greghaynesYep...21:11
greghaynesThink its probably best option though :/21:11
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openstackgerritGregory Haynes proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Increase recommended 64bit settings to 3gb ram  https://review.openstack.org/9472721:15
tchaypothanks ccrouch bnemec21:15
tchayposo we probably don't expect anyone to ever use devtest.sh as a production deployment tool; we expect it to be something people look at to see how the tools work together, then modify to their own needs?21:16
greghaynesNo one would use devstack in production21:17
greghaynesever21:17
tchaypodevtest. not devstack :p21:18
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ccrouchgreghaynes: you clearly havent seen the latest user survey ;-)21:21
ccrouchhttp://www.slideshare.net/ryan-lane/openstack-atlanta-user-survey/1821:21
greghayneshehe, yeaaa21:22
greghaynesthus the analogie :)21:22
ccrouch:-)21:22
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giulivoccrouch, I was surprised by that as well by the fact that everyone seems to use LVM for volumes when it doesn't actually provide for any kind of failover21:29
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rbradyccrouch: slide 2521:40
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ccrouch"easy automation" that must be us :-)21:42
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rbradyccrouch: love the contrast between "not a lot" and "it pays my salary"21:44
openstackgerritPhil Neal proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-incubator: Add Swift roles required to poll for Swift usage  https://review.openstack.org/9473021:45
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tchaypookay, we now have a thread where the participants are jay, james, and james22:05
bnemec18 people are using qemu in production???22:05
tchaypoplease can we have more name diversity?22:05
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tchaypoafter changing my password last week, I'm almost back to thepoint where I can type it without thinking about it. woo!22:28
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SpamapSheh22:57
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SpamapS| memory_mb            | 1836844 |22:57
SpamapS| memory_mb_used       | 2054144 |22:57
SpamapS| free_ram_mb          | -217300 |22:57
openstackgerritGregory Haynes proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: WIP: Leader Election  https://review.openstack.org/9473922:58
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tchaypooooh23:03
greghaynesJust getting started23:03
greghaynesso dont get too excited23:03
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SpamapS:)23:06
vinshIt comes with free AOL cds. +123:08
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giulivolet me ask you something, off topic but ... you guys are all for the mechanical keyboards or is someone with us who enjoys the slim keys?23:10
vinshI'm kinesis Advantage Pro LF all the way.23:10
* bkero Model M23:10
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vinshnot slim :)23:10
clarkbbkero: I really should try the model M again23:10
bkeroclarkb: twenty years of secretaries and typists with arthritis and carpal tunnel don't lie!23:11
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openstackgerritClint 'SpamapS' Byrum proposed a change to openstack/os-collect-config: Make heat the default collection method  https://review.openstack.org/9452723:11
greghaynesbkero would chime in with a model M comment23:11
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bkeroProblem? :323:12
giulivobkero, but you know, it's too high and too wide23:12
greghaynesI do a kinesis at home23:12
greghaynesI like23:12
giulivoto the point where I get wrist pain and the mouse is too far from keys23:12
giulivoso what is all the talking about the model m I don't know23:13
giulivomaybe it makes you type faster but ... is that really what matters?23:13
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vinshget a demo of a kinesis advantage... you can place the mouse very close to it23:14
vinshno keypad in the way23:14
vinshand it pronates(sp?) your wrist the proper amount.23:14
clarkbbnemec: question about 90281. Why are you not running the same set of jobs as dib?23:14
clarkbbnemec: seems like if it is being split it should work with those jobs too?23:14
clarkbgiulivo: the key weight is amazing23:15
clarkbwhich is also part of the healt issue23:15
giulivo:P23:15
clarkbI also like the key spacing23:15
clarkbI find most keyboards haev terrible spacing23:15
clarkbwhich bothers my wrists more23:15
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bkerogiulivo: For me it's about confidence. There is great feedback from key presses. Most consider the activation force is a bit on the heavy side, but the feel of springs buckling is unlike any mechanical or rubber-dome switches23:22
tchaypoI personally don't find the model m that amazing. the key weight is lovely, but it still has my wrists rotated all wrong, and i find that a lot more uncomfortable23:22
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tchaypoI've been using a microsoft naturaltouch for years; I've just switched to an MS Ergonomic Sculpt at home, or a GoldTouch Go!2 when I'm travelling23:25
tchaypoalthough actually now that I'm home I've found I'm still using the Goldtouch23:25
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openstackgerritGregory Haynes proposed a change to openstack/tripleo-specs: WIP: Leader Election  https://review.openstack.org/9473923:31
tchaypogreghaynes: i love your handwavy TODO23:35
greghaynes"MAGIC"23:35
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greghaynesI need to actually set up a test cluster to verify my idea23:36
greghaynesbefore writing that23:36
greghaynesbut worst case I think starting etcd using the current method and everything else based on real leader election is better than our current state - centralizes that process to one place23:37
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tchaypoyeah, so we only have this problem with etcd rather than having it for rabbitmq+galera+others23:40
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SpamapSetcd is magic23:48
SpamapSbecause its go23:48
SpamapSand go is magic23:48
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greghaynesproof by go-magic transitivity23:51
tchaypoI'm unconvinced about go.23:52
tchaypoerlang would convince me23:52
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SpamapStchaypo: you are just too attached to your non-local returns23:53
StevenKif err != nil {  every 3 lines23:54
StevenKJust like perror() and C23:55
tchaypospeaking of non-local returns23:55
tchaypoit's time for me to head into the office to see what bundle of joy awaits me in the mailroom23:55
StevenKHeh23:55
SpamapSWell23:57
SpamapSthe idea is that you wouldn't have it every 3 lines23:57
SpamapSbut that you would encapsulate your code a bit more. :)23:57

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