16:00:08 <hongbin> #startmeeting containers
16:00:08 <openstack> Meeting started Tue May  3 16:00:08 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:09 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
16:00:11 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'containers'
16:00:16 <hongbin> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Containers#Agenda_for_2016-05-03_1600_UTC Today's agenda
16:00:21 <hongbin> #topic Roll Call
16:00:28 <muralia_> o/
16:00:37 <sheel> hi
16:00:37 <rpothier> o/
16:00:40 <tango> Ton Ngo
16:00:44 <madhuri> o/
16:00:48 <eghobo> o/
16:02:20 <hongbin> Thanks for joining the meeting muralia_ sheel rpothier tango madhuri eghobo
16:02:29 <dane_leblanc_> o/
16:02:39 <Kuwagata> o/
16:02:41 <juggler> o/
16:02:58 <muralia_> hi everyone
16:03:01 <hongbin> Thanks for joining the meeting dane_leblanc_ Kuwagata juggler
16:03:17 <hongbin> #topic Announcements
16:03:25 <hongbin> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-April/093548.html Austin design summit summary
16:03:41 <hongbin> The design summit finished
16:03:57 <hongbin> We made several important decisions
16:04:15 <hongbin> If you are not able to attend the summit, you can read the note (link above)
16:04:45 <madhuri> Thanks hongbin for collaborating all the details
16:04:48 <adrian_otto> o/
16:05:11 <hongbin> Any comment for the design summit?
16:05:38 <hongbin> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/311476/ Magnum is going to change its mission statement
16:06:03 <hongbin> I am going to cover that in a topic later
16:06:14 <hongbin> #topic Review Action Items
16:06:21 <hongbin> 1. hongbin revisit the unfinished mitaka blueprints (DONE)
16:06:27 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/magnum/newton List of blueprints for Newton
16:06:45 <hongbin> That is the intial list of BPs for Newton
16:06:56 <hongbin> We have a topic later to refine the list
16:07:16 <hongbin> Any general comments for the Review Action Items?
16:07:47 <hongbin> #topic Essential Blueprints Review
16:07:52 <hongbin> SKIP until next meeting
16:08:10 <hongbin> Since most people just come back from the summit, we skip this topic
16:08:28 <tcammann_> hello
16:08:31 <hongbin> Starting from the next week, we would have the owner of hte essential BPs to give us a status update
16:08:39 <hongbin> tcammann_: hey
16:08:51 <hongbin> #topic Magnum UI Subteam Update (bradjones)
16:08:59 <hongbin> Both Brad and Shuu Mutou are on vacation this week. I update you on behalf of Shu.
16:09:08 <hongbin> According to decision that Magnum becomes COE as a Service, Magnum-UI should delete "Container" panel.
16:09:11 <vilobhmm111> hongbin : sounds like a good plan. Thanks for updating the blueprint with the action needed for them
16:09:28 <hongbin> vilobhmm111: my pleasure
16:09:48 <hongbin> Any comment for the update from Magnum UI team?
16:10:04 <vilobhmm111> hongbin : +1 makes sense since our direction will be more geared towards COE as a service
16:10:10 <vilobhmm111> for the UI
16:10:17 <hongbin> yes
16:10:46 <hongbin> #topic Other blueprints/Bugs/Reviews/Ideas
16:10:51 <hongbin> 1. Refine Magnum mission statement
16:10:56 <hongbin> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/311476/ The proposal
16:11:01 <hongbin> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/magnum-mission-statement Etherpad for collaborating Magnum mission statement
16:11:26 <hongbin> I will pause for a few minutes for everyone to have a look on the etherpad
16:11:39 <spn> o/
16:11:41 <hongbin> https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/magnum-mission-statement
16:12:18 <hongbin> There are several good comments and suggestion there
16:12:59 <hongbin> We need to review two things
16:13:07 <hongbin> 1. The service name of Magnum
16:13:14 <hongbin> 2. The mission statement of Magnum
16:16:08 <hongbin> For the service name, there are two popular choices
16:16:21 <hongbin> 1. Container Cluster Management Service
16:16:31 <hongbin> 2. COE Management Service
16:16:38 <hongbin> Let's debate these two choices
16:16:43 <hongbin> Comments?
16:17:02 <madhuri> 2 is more appropiate but it is long name.
16:17:11 <vilobhmm111> I would prefer #2 as from the revised mission
16:17:31 <adrian_otto> I don't like COE in the name, as only those who know what Magnum is know what a COE is.
16:17:36 <tango> Is COE a common terminology?
16:17:44 <tango> I keep having to explain what it is
16:17:46 <adrian_otto> so the acronym should be expanded.
16:18:01 <muralia_> I like 1. we do manage the cluster, not just the COE.
16:18:02 <adrian_otto> COE was coned by this group. It's not widely known.
16:18:02 <hongbin> adrian_otto: We have the full name there
16:18:09 <adrian_otto> s/coned/coined/
16:18:11 <madhuri> So why not go with #1
16:18:13 <sheel> +1 for 1
16:18:21 <muralia_> +1 for 1.
16:18:30 <hongbin> My concern for #1 is that it might cause confusion
16:18:31 <adrian_otto> my preference is #1, but I don't strongly oppose the #2
16:18:35 <hongbin> between Magnum and COEs
16:18:53 <adrian_otto> magnum manages the cluster the COE runs on. The COE manages the application components.
16:19:13 <adrian_otto> I tried to convey that in the service description, but it's hard in just a few words.
16:19:36 <tango> So cluster refers to the infrastructure, while COE refers to the management software ?
16:19:46 <adrian_otto> tango: yes, sir.
16:19:50 <tango> cluster is also an overloaded word, unfortunately
16:19:54 <spn> container management service ?
16:20:03 <vilobhmm111> tango : +1
16:20:05 <juggler> spn that's what I was thinking...
16:20:10 <adrian_otto> spn: that's a step more ambiguous
16:20:13 <spn> :)
16:20:21 <juggler> is CMS too simplistic? :)
16:20:27 <Kuwagata> +1 for #1
16:20:30 <hongbin> Yes, it is hard to say what "container cluster" refer to
16:20:46 <hongbin> It might refer to a set of container hosts, or a set of containers
16:20:55 <tango> "container infrastructure" ?
16:21:08 <adrian_otto> keep in mind that we can elaborate on the name on the project wiki page.
16:21:15 <hongbin> #3 Container infrastructure management service
16:21:20 <juggler> Container Infrastructure Management Service - CIMS .. hmm
16:21:24 <adrian_otto> which is where the public lands first to find out about the project.
16:21:55 <hongbin> adrian_otto: Yes, it is
16:21:56 <adrian_otto> the public is not looking at the projects.yaml file. That's for the OpenStack contributors, and participants in our governance process.
16:22:22 <hongbin> That is true
16:22:41 <hongbin> Want a vote on the service name?
16:22:46 <madhuri> Let's have a vote hongbin
16:22:58 <adrian_otto> so the choice today needs to be accurate, but it's okay if it requires additional reading to get a perfectly clear picture of our purpose.
16:23:40 <hongbin> Then, let decide the name by a vote
16:23:44 <sheel> #3 sounds more closer to purpose
16:23:53 <hongbin> There are 3 choices
16:24:04 <hongbin> #1 Container Cluster Management Service
16:24:20 <hongbin> #2 Container Orchestration Engine managment Service
16:24:30 <hongbin> #3 Container infrastructure management Service
16:24:35 <hongbin> #startvote
16:24:35 <openstack> Unable to parse vote topic and options.
16:24:48 <hongbin> #startvote Magnum service name? 1, 2, 3
16:24:49 <openstack> Begin voting on: Magnum service name? Valid vote options are 1, 2, 3.
16:24:50 <openstack> Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
16:25:00 <hongbin> #vote 2
16:25:05 <spn> #vote 1
16:25:05 <muralia_> #vote 1
16:25:06 <adrian_otto> #vote 1
16:25:07 <tcammann_> 3
16:25:09 <sheel> #vote 3
16:25:17 <Kuwagata> #vote 1
16:25:17 <madhuri> #vote 3
16:25:19 <tango> #vote 3
16:25:19 <tcammann_> #vote 3
16:25:21 <dane_leblanc_> #vote 1
16:25:25 <coreyob> #vote 1
16:25:39 <juggler> #vote 3
16:26:07 <hongbin> I will close the vote in a few seconds
16:26:12 <hongbin> Last minutes vote?
16:26:17 <eghobo> #vote 2
16:26:34 <vilobhmm111> #vote3
16:26:49 <hongbin> any more vote?
16:27:01 <hongbin> #endvote
16:27:02 <openstack> Voted on "Magnum service name?" Results are
16:27:03 <openstack> 1 (6): coreyob, adrian_otto, dane_leblanc_, Kuwagata, spn, muralia_
16:27:04 <openstack> 3 (5): juggler, tcammann_, sheel, tango, madhuri
16:27:05 <openstack> 2 (2): hongbin, eghobo
16:27:20 <hongbin> The majority for #1
16:27:25 <hongbin> But I have to count the core votes
16:27:26 <sheel> results are not accurate
16:27:30 <madhuri> There's a tie between 1 and 3
16:27:37 <sheel> i can see more votes for 3
16:27:39 <sheel> :)
16:27:55 <hongbin> Yes, vilobhmm111 's vote is not counted
16:27:59 <madhuri> vilobhmm111 voted for 3
16:28:18 <sheel> tcammann_:  sheel  madhuri  tango  juggler  vilobhmm111
16:28:25 <hongbin> However, I need to count the votes from cores. Non-core votes are for reference
16:28:41 <sheel> hah!
16:28:44 <muralia_> :)
16:28:45 <hongbin> #3 have 4 cores
16:28:53 <hongbin> #1 has 2 core
16:29:01 <hongbin> #2 has 2 cores
16:29:07 <vilobhmm111> hongbin : that should not be the case imho; everyone's vote should matter !
16:29:08 <hongbin> So, the decision is #3
16:29:42 <adrian_otto> ok, I will update the review today in accordance with that selection.
16:29:56 <hongbin> vilobhmm111: But we should not have all people to vote, otherwise, there will be too many people in the next vote
16:30:02 <hongbin> adrian_otto: thx
16:30:05 <sheel> vilobhmm111:  your opinon is counted, though indirectly...
16:30:09 <tcammann_> I don't think this is a big deal either way, we are all clear on our direction now regardless of the crazy acronym we choose :)
16:30:28 <adrian_otto> tcammann_: exactly
16:30:33 <tango> tcammann_ +1
16:30:34 <adrian_otto> none of those choices were bad
16:30:42 <vilobhmm111> hongbin : sure thats f9
16:30:47 <hongbin> OK, any concern for this topic
16:31:09 <juggler> CIMS is a tad easier to say that CCMS, IMHO :)
16:31:14 <juggler> than
16:31:25 <sheel> exactly
16:31:44 <hongbin> 2. Review the list of Newton blueprint
16:31:53 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/magnum/newton
16:32:32 <hongbin> That is the initial list of BP for Newton
16:32:51 <hongbin> If you have BPs that needed to be included, please let me know
16:33:04 <muralia_> I was going to add a new blueprint for HEAT template versioning, but after the summit discussion, I think it can be rolled up into the COE driver spec. What do you all of you think?
16:33:05 <juggler> I think adrian_otto might have a spotty Internet connection..
16:33:29 <hongbin> muralia_: It looks majority agree not to version the Heat template
16:33:47 <hongbin> muralia_: If that is confirmed, then the Heat template version is not needed
16:34:21 <muralia_> yes. that is the decision. i'll include some details in the COE driver spec.
16:34:39 <hongbin> muralia_: thx
16:35:01 <hongbin> In the list, there are 4 essential BPs
16:35:19 <hongbin> 1. Ironic support
16:35:23 <hongbin> 2. Installation guide
16:35:25 <hongbin> 3. User guide
16:35:29 <hongbin> 4. Bay driver
16:35:41 <hongbin> Any other BPs that you think are essential as well?
16:35:53 <muralia_> async apis
16:36:21 <hongbin> muralia_: ack.
16:36:34 <hongbin> For the aysnc APIs, what are others opinions?
16:36:44 <hongbin> It should be essential?
16:36:56 <hongbin> (Right now, it is high)
16:37:31 <madhuri> High io
16:37:32 <hongbin> No objection?
16:37:37 <madhuri> imo*
16:37:46 <hongbin> madhuri: ack
16:38:11 <hongbin> muralia_: I think it should stay as high as well
16:38:28 <muralia_> sure. i how about a new blueprint for freezing the api to version 1.0
16:38:29 <hongbin> muralia_: It doesn't seem to be the feature that we cannot miss
16:38:39 <hongbin> muralia_: thanks
16:38:56 <hongbin> Any other comment for the Newton BPs?
16:39:26 <hongbin> #topic Open Discussion
16:40:20 <hongbin> sheel: I think you have a topic to bring up?
16:40:36 <tango> Do we need to choose the mission statement?  We only chose the name so far
16:40:41 <sheel> hongbin: it was about https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/container-management-service
16:41:18 <sheel> hongbin:  I saw one mail for it.. so could we discuss on it about what is going to be in this ?
16:41:35 <hongbin> tango: my bad. We can continue the work in the etherpad or in the review
16:42:00 <tango> ok
16:42:03 <hongbin> tango: I think either proposed statement is good
16:42:14 <hongbin> tango: But that is for me only
16:42:33 <hongbin> sheel: Yes I can
16:42:43 <sheel> hongbin:  actually i was interested in this
16:42:57 <hongbin> sheel: In the Magnum design summit, we decided to push out /container endpoint to a new project
16:43:19 <hongbin> sheel: Magnum won't focus on container anymore
16:43:20 <sheel> ok
16:43:39 <hongbin> sheel: Container Management will potentially go to a new project
16:43:52 <hongbin> sheel: Anything specific you want to ask?
16:44:04 <sheel> hongbin:  ok, so it would be like moving existing code to new project under /container
16:44:06 <sheel> right?
16:44:37 <spn> is there a name for the new project?
16:44:41 <hongbin> sheel: No really, but move some functionalities out (that is my understanding)
16:44:53 <hongbin> spn: Not yet
16:44:55 <sheel> hongbin:  yep right, I mean same...
16:44:59 <sheel> :)
16:45:57 <sheel> hongbin: ok, updated name in etherpad
16:46:20 <hongbin> If no other topic, I would have the team to revisit the choice of mission statement
16:46:54 <hongbin> There are 3 mission statements there
16:47:28 <hongbin> # 1 The one proposed by Adrian Otto
16:47:34 <hongbin> #2 alternative 1
16:47:40 <hongbin> #3 alternative 2
16:48:04 <vilobhmm111> link : https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/magnum-mission-statement
16:48:04 <hongbin> You could vote either mission statement if you want
16:48:15 <hongbin> vilobhmm111: thx
16:48:19 <vilobhmm111> np
16:49:31 <hongbin> Any other topic to discuss?
16:50:35 <juggler> are we voting here or on the etherpad or holding the vote?
16:50:44 <juggler> er postponing the vote
16:51:13 <hongbin> juggler: Maybe postponsing the vote (if a vote is needed)
16:51:30 <hongbin> OK. Let's wrap up.
16:51:39 <hongbin> Thanks everyone for joining the meeting
16:51:56 <hongbin> Our next team meeting will be at next Tuesday at the same time
16:52:03 <hongbin> #endmeeting