16:05:18 <Sam-I-Am> #startmeeting docinstallteam
16:05:18 <openstack> Meeting started Tue Feb  9 16:05:18 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is Sam-I-Am. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:05:20 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
16:05:22 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'docinstallteam'
16:05:32 <bswartz> It's important to me that we get a manila install guide into Mitaka
16:05:46 <Sam-I-Am> we'll talk about it in a bit
16:06:05 <Sam-I-Am> #topic updates for mitaka
16:06:35 <Sam-I-Am> the spec hasn't been approved yet. please review if you get a chance.
16:06:38 <Sam-I-Am> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/274231/
16:06:48 <Sam-I-Am> keep in mind that it only covers updates for existing services
16:07:31 <Sam-I-Am> #topic testing mitaka
16:07:59 <Sam-I-Am> looks like ubuntu has milestone 1 packages out in the cloud-archive ppa. not terribly useful yet. i'd wait until at least milestone 3.
16:08:20 <Sam-I-Am> rdo packages from trunk, so those are up for testing anytime and probably getting close to milestone 3
16:08:36 <Sam-I-Am> i havent looked at suse
16:08:56 <Sam-I-Am> #topic new services for mitaka
16:09:13 <Sam-I-Am> this would be you, bswartz
16:09:20 <bswartz> okay
16:09:22 <Sam-I-Am> i see a blueprint, but not a spec
16:09:52 <bswartz> yes there is a BP and a proposed change
16:09:59 <bswartz> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+spec/create-manila-install-guide
16:10:04 <bswartz> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/273724/
16:10:08 <Sam-I-Am> i found those
16:10:17 <bswartz> both of these occured without my knowledge
16:10:33 <bswartz> I'm not sure who Denis Cavalcante is
16:10:48 <bswartz> but I want to help ensure this lands
16:10:59 <bswartz> so I'm asking what do I need to do?
16:11:07 <bswartz> what deadlines exist for this change?
16:11:32 <Sam-I-Am> generally speaking, we need everything for mitaka tested prior to release
16:11:38 <bswartz> if a spec is needed, what should it look like? (I haven't read any documentation specs before)
16:11:41 <Sam-I-Am> this includes existing and new services
16:12:16 <Sam-I-Am> the spec just says you want to add a service, explains any required architectural changes, limitations, etc.
16:12:38 <Sam-I-Am> for example, if manila requires that we add/change the install guide architecture, its a bigger deal than a service that just works
16:13:00 <bswartz> yes I don't believe we should require any large changes like that
16:13:14 <bswartz> manila very much fits in the mold of cinder
16:13:24 <Sam-I-Am> this patch contains a 'share node'
16:13:32 <Sam-I-Am> which it piggybacks on the compute node, which we can't do
16:13:45 <Sam-I-Am> unless the reference architecture for manila deploys share nodes on compute nodes
16:13:56 <bswartz> where do you see that?
16:14:03 <Sam-I-Am> https://review.openstack.org/#/c/273724/2/doc/install-guide/source/manila-share-install.rst
16:14:07 <Sam-I-Am> this is why we have specs...
16:14:26 <Sam-I-Am> so this stuff gets discussed before someone goes through the effort of writing the patch
16:14:34 <bswartz> yeah, as I said this whole thing was a surprise to me
16:14:54 <Sam-I-Am> i've heard on and off about it, but thought i'd see a spec before a patch
16:14:58 <Sam-I-Am> the bp isnt approved either
16:15:16 <Sam-I-Am> the content is here, so i'm not going to -2 it, but we'll need to address the problems
16:15:28 <bswartz> I entered the Mitaka release believing that any install guide documentation would need to be somewhere other than the "official" install guide, due to an email thread where loquacities basically said that
16:15:48 <Sam-I-Am> i think i was around for that thread
16:16:18 <bswartz> I prefer the approach dencaval seems to be taking
16:16:24 <bswartz> but I haven't yet spoken to him
16:16:32 <bswartz> so I guess I need to sync up with him first
16:16:42 <bswartz> and help him address these issues or work on them myself
16:17:08 <bswartz> to answer your earlier question about the "share node"
16:17:23 <bswartz> I think he's just referring to the node on which the services are installed
16:17:25 <Sam-I-Am> the qualifications for something going into the official install guide are generally these - a) does it work on a minimal amount of hw? b) do all distros package it? c) can we fully test it prior to release?
16:17:31 <bswartz> it would be no different than cinder
16:17:50 <Sam-I-Am> we do have a cinder storage node, so maybe we can re-use that for the share node?
16:17:59 <bswartz> yes I think so
16:18:10 <Sam-I-Am> thats something to consider
16:18:31 <bswartz> what does the install guide test procedure look like?
16:18:33 <Sam-I-Am> usually the big hold up for new services is all distros including packages, followed by sufficient testing on all of them
16:18:47 <bswartz> some reads the doc and manually performs all the operations?
16:18:55 <Sam-I-Am> follow the guide to the point where you can install/use your service, try the instructions for your service.
16:18:57 <bswartz> /some/someone/
16:18:58 <Sam-I-Am> yeah
16:18:59 <Sam-I-Am> its all manual
16:19:06 <Sam-I-Am> because thats what our audience does
16:19:13 <bswartz> of course
16:19:43 <Sam-I-Am> so my guess is manila becomes an optional service that references the cinder storage node bits, or something
16:19:50 <bswartz> okay well my next step will be to sync up with dencaval
16:19:55 <Sam-I-Am> yep
16:20:14 <Sam-I-Am> a spec would be nice for tracking purposes
16:20:25 <bswartz> can you link the repo for that spec?
16:21:01 <Sam-I-Am> #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/docs-specs/
16:21:02 <Sam-I-Am> and
16:21:18 <Sam-I-Am> #link https://github.com/openstack/docs-specs
16:21:26 <bswartz> thanks
16:22:04 <Sam-I-Am> i can help with that too
16:22:12 <Sam-I-Am> you can take a look at some of the existing install guide spec in there
16:22:25 <bswartz> yes that's what I'm doing
16:23:12 <bswartz> I'll find out from dencaval how much help he needs and I'm happy to write the spec if it would help (even though it's a backwards process)
16:23:54 <bswartz> that's all I had
16:23:57 <Sam-I-Am> usually its not backwards :)
16:24:17 <bswartz> yes i mean backwards in this case
16:24:26 <bswartz> spec should have come first
16:24:37 <Sam-I-Am> yeah. i'm not going to hold this patch up because of the spec.
16:24:47 <Sam-I-Am> i'd just like it there for tracking and historical purposes
16:25:57 <bswartz> okay anything else I should know about?
16:26:13 <bswartz> what is the deadline for the change to merge?
16:26:49 <Sam-I-Am> well, we can test the patch before the majority of it merges
16:26:57 <Sam-I-Am> then tweak later as newer versions of packages come out
16:27:16 <Sam-I-Am> so i'd say we want the main patch to merge between milestone 3 and rc 1
16:27:27 <bswartz> k
16:27:30 <Sam-I-Am> which implies it can be tested on ubuntu, rh, and suse
16:27:54 <bswartz> and you'd do testing with m-3 versions of the packages?
16:28:12 <Sam-I-Am> thats where i like to start because its feature freeze
16:28:12 <bswartz> or earlier versions work just as well?
16:28:16 <Sam-I-Am> things mostly work by then
16:28:17 <bswartz> k
16:28:25 <Sam-I-Am> depends on how involved you are with the project
16:28:34 <Sam-I-Am> if you think m1 or m2 works sufficiently, then use it
16:29:06 <bswartz> well I'm the PTL for Manila, but not directly involved with packaging or docs
16:29:15 <bswartz> so I'll have to ping some people
16:29:28 <Sam-I-Am> we track testing here - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/MitakaDocTesting
16:29:44 <Sam-I-Am> we'll need to add row for manila
16:29:47 <bswartz> broken link?
16:30:04 <bswartz> there's nothing on that page
16:30:05 <Sam-I-Am> wat
16:30:10 <Sam-I-Am> i submitted that last week
16:30:11 <Sam-I-Am> sigh
16:30:13 <Sam-I-Am> i hate wikis
16:30:33 <Sam-I-Am> https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/MitakaDocTesting
16:30:43 <bswartz> better!
16:31:30 <bswartz> okay thanks
16:32:20 <Sam-I-Am> yeah, so thats how we track stuff
16:32:39 <Sam-I-Am> it should be all green within 1-2 weeks after all distros release final packages
16:32:48 <Sam-I-Am> which is sometimes a couple of weeks after actual release
16:33:05 <Sam-I-Am> so we don't end up freezing the guide until maybe a month or so after release to facilitate updates without backports
16:33:13 <bswartz> I see
16:34:41 <Sam-I-Am> yep
16:34:49 <Sam-I-Am> anything else for manila?
16:35:09 <bswartz> nope
16:35:14 <Sam-I-Am> cool
16:35:18 <Sam-I-Am> glad we could chat
16:35:29 <bswartz> yes thank you
16:35:42 <Sam-I-Am> guess we can call the meeting since no one else is here
16:35:53 <bswartz> alright
16:36:02 <Sam-I-Am> thanks
16:36:04 <bswartz> it's lunch time here anyways
16:36:07 <Sam-I-Am> #endmeeting