17:02:07 <dtantsur> #startmeeting ironic
17:02:09 <openstack> Meeting started Mon Sep  4 17:02:07 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is dtantsur. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:02:10 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
17:02:12 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'ironic'
17:02:15 <vdrok> o/
17:02:16 <kaifeng> o/
17:02:18 <dtantsur> anyway :) hi all!
17:02:27 <yuriyz> o/
17:02:34 <dtantsur> our agenda as usual can be found at
17:02:36 <dtantsur> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Ironic
17:02:42 <rpioso> o/
17:02:46 <dtantsur> #topic Announcements / Reminder
17:02:56 <dtantsur> well, the most important one is
17:03:06 <dtantsur> #info PTG in Denver starts in one week
17:03:23 <dtantsur> our schedule has not changed since the previous meeting:
17:03:25 <dtantsur> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ironic-queens-ptg
17:03:38 <vdrok> btw do we have some arrivals info somewhere?
17:03:39 <dtantsur> I guess, if it stays the same by the end of this meeting, we can call it final
17:03:46 <dtantsur> vdrok: no
17:03:52 <dtantsur> only attendees list
17:04:18 <dtantsur> and I need to revive a hangouts chat
17:04:41 <dtantsur> I have started creating etherpads for sections. I'll copy the current comments there when I'm done
17:04:57 <TheJulia> o/
17:05:12 <TheJulia> (sorry, delayed slightly, my phone rang moments before the meeting)
17:05:12 <dtantsur> anything else to announce? heads-up about the dinner TheJulia?
17:06:03 <TheJulia> I sent an email to the mailing list with a possibility. Please check it out, and give me feedback today if possible. http://coloradopubco.com/stapleton-caseys/
17:06:15 <dtantsur> thanks!
17:06:32 <rpioso> TheJulia: ty!
17:06:37 <vdrok> thanks!
17:06:46 <dtantsur> there are a few things of interest next Mon-Tue
17:07:38 <dtantsur> #info at 4pm on Monday (Denver time) we will have a x-project session with Kolla
17:07:44 <dtantsur> and cinder
17:08:13 <ricardoas> o/
17:08:16 <dtantsur> there is also a request from the RefStack and Interop WG to chat with ironic and cinder about testing them standalone
17:08:27 <dtantsur> I'm not aware of details in both cases, just whatever is on the ML
17:09:04 <dtantsur> the skip-level room may be interesting. I think our resource class changes will make skip level upgrades impossible :)
17:09:07 <dtantsur> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/queens-PTG-skip-level-upgrades
17:09:14 <dtantsur> I think Bob and Ruby are planning to go there
17:09:28 <dtantsur> I'll be mostly in the API SIG room on Monday morning, I think
17:09:35 <vdrok> I might attend the upgrades as well
17:09:42 <dtantsur> anything else interesting to bring up wrt the PTG?
17:09:50 <TheJulia> dtantsur: happy to chat with refstack and interop wgs about standalone testing
17:10:04 <dtantsur> TheJulia: nice! I've asked them to book a specific timeslot - see the ML
17:10:12 <TheJulia> dtantsur: thanks!
17:11:14 <dtantsur> I'm not aware of anything network-related planned. anyone? vdrok?
17:11:34 <vdrok> nope I don't think we have anything for x-project
17:12:08 <dtantsur> anyone checking the docs room?
17:13:08 <TheJulia> I can if schedule permits
17:13:20 <dtantsur> ok :) I don't think we need anything of them, just in case
17:13:32 <milan> reduce the red color ;)
17:13:33 <vdrok> looking at https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/docs-i18n-ptg-queens, dunno if we need to
17:14:02 * TheJulia wonders if jokes could be made about zombie movies then...
17:14:05 <vdrok> oh maybe regarding the stable branch docs
17:14:16 * TheJulia only even mentions it because it seems like zombie tv show marathon day in the states.
17:14:22 <dtantsur> lol @ zombie movies
17:14:35 <vdrok> but it conflicts with this kolla things on monday
17:14:37 <dtantsur> vdrok: well, it's not critical either, right?
17:14:41 <vdrok> yup
17:15:04 <dtantsur> okay, anything else to announce? anything wrt the PTG?
17:15:33 <dtantsur> #topic Review subteam status reports (capped at ten minutes)
17:15:44 <dtantsur> we don't have much, and everything we have is at
17:15:46 <dtantsur> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IronicWhiteBoard
17:15:53 <dtantsur> line 118
17:16:21 <dtantsur> TheJulia: do we have a BFV meeting on Thu?
17:17:04 <TheJulia> Yes, Intending to run one
17:17:20 <dtantsur> okie. I'll have to run quite soon, I think
17:17:23 <TheJulia> I kind of expect attendence to be light because people will begin traveling
17:17:38 <dtantsur> yeah I won't be traveling, but busy anyway
17:17:47 <TheJulia> Yeah
17:18:10 <dtantsur> mmm, forgot: vdrok did you want to start a spreadsheet with arrival/departure times and hotels? please feel free to :)
17:18:34 <vdrok> dtantsur: spreadsheet or etherpad? :)
17:18:56 <dtantsur> vdrok: as you wish, we can reuse the main PTG etherpad
17:19:02 <vdrok> ++ ok
17:21:02 <dtantsur> everyone done with the statuses? there does not seem to be much
17:21:09 <vdrok> doesn't look like any of priorities merged, and not many updates for the subteams
17:21:35 <dtantsur> yeah, I was mostly finishing docs and doing urgent personal errands
17:22:02 <dtantsur> #topic Deciding on priorities for the coming week
17:22:05 <dtantsur> speaking of which ^^^
17:22:12 <vdrok> keeping the same? :)
17:22:21 <dtantsur> I would leave it as it is, but move "review specs" to the top
17:22:26 <milan> add inspector ;)
17:22:31 <TheJulia> spec reviews ++
17:22:35 <dtantsur> I'd appreciate folks review as many specs as it's possible before the PTG
17:22:38 <yuriyz> +1 for specs review
17:22:45 <dtantsur> then we'll have much more common context
17:23:11 <dtantsur> otherwise, leaving the list as it is?
17:23:36 <vdrok> yup
17:23:37 <dtantsur> ah, inspector. it's hard to make it a priority, given that the majority of people here do not know it any well
17:23:46 <dtantsur> which is something to discuss at the PTG, btw
17:24:31 <milan> would maybe encourage people to review it  if it was in the list ;)
17:24:37 <dtantsur> I doubt it
17:24:43 <milan> lol
17:24:50 <dtantsur> especially the HA patches: they require a lot of context
17:24:52 <TheJulia> If there is a specific item... maybe :)
17:25:04 <dtantsur> TheJulia: we'll have an HA discussion at the PTG, it may give folks more context
17:25:07 * dtantsur is sad milan cannot go
17:25:12 <TheJulia> :(
17:25:22 * milan just needs a +2 from dtantsur
17:25:23 <milan> ;)
17:25:28 <milan> yeah
17:25:33 <dtantsur> hehe, I'll try getting to it this week
17:25:41 <vdrok> milan: I  can give you one, for some cookies
17:25:53 * milan sad cause a lot tech stuff going to be discussed there
17:25:57 <dtantsur> lol. bribing in a recorded channel, c'mon!
17:26:05 <vdrok> :D
17:26:06 <TheJulia> dtantsur: but they are all recorded!
17:26:08 <dtantsur> #topic Open discussion
17:26:12 <dtantsur> TheJulia: ooops :)
17:26:13 <milan> vdrok ack :D
17:26:24 <dtantsur> okay, the floor is open
17:26:47 <milan> make Fridays Inspector days? :)
17:27:09 * milan quits ranting about it :)
17:27:13 <dtantsur> I'm all for suggestions on how to make inspector more interesting for the broader team
17:27:33 <dtantsur> I'm pretty sure some folks (quick glance at bifrost crew) use it without reviewing too much
17:27:34 <TheJulia> I'll be around on friday all day if anyone wants to discuss bifrost in great detail. I've started on some of the work to refactor the library usage so we can actually move forward and support other things like... portgroups, and volumes *grin*
17:27:34 <wanyen> dtantsur,   I have a few questions regarding custom resource class and standard resource class
17:28:12 <dtantsur> wanyen: you can try
17:28:16 <wanyen> does Nova allow multiple custom resource classes today?
17:28:29 <vdrok> yup I think so
17:28:33 <dtantsur> wanyen: multiple custom resource classes for what?
17:28:39 <dtantsur> in general - yes, for ironic - no
17:29:39 <wanyen> dtansur, if nova allows multiple resource classes in general, any issues for Ironic to support multiple custom rsc classes?
17:29:53 <dtantsur> wanyen: yes, the same issues I mentioned every time we talked about it
17:30:04 <dtantsur> if we have two classes, how to track consumption?
17:30:31 <dtantsur> if I have R1 and R2 on a node, but the instance consumed only R1, how does nova know that R2 is also consumed?
17:30:51 <dtantsur> this is a cornerstone of all problems with the previous approach to the scheduling
17:31:02 <TheJulia> :(
17:31:06 <dtantsur> if we solve it, we can probably have many resource classes
17:31:25 * TheJulia ponders
17:32:10 <TheJulia> I'm sure we could solve it, but I suspect we would have to make some major changes to the virt driver
17:32:23 <dtantsur> s/virt driver/placement engine/
17:32:26 <dtantsur> that's the problem ^^^^
17:32:30 <TheJulia> well, both really
17:32:33 <wanyen> dtantsur, as long as ironic virt driver can consume all the rsc classes when placing an instance on a node, then the residual rsc issue is solved.  right?
17:32:57 <TheJulia> wanyen: but it is not the virt driver, it is the placement engine
17:32:57 <dtantsur> wanyen: yes, except that the virt driver cannot consume anything. it's no longer handling consumptions. the placement engine does.
17:33:14 <dtantsur> so we need a way to tell the placement engine: this hypervisor is "all-or-nothing"
17:33:23 <dtantsur> it's not impossible, but it's a call for Nova folks, not for us
17:33:23 <vdrok> wanyen: yes, but this is not how it was designed. it was designed to consume what was requested.
17:33:38 <dtantsur> hence I've been pointing Nisha and you to Nova folks all this time. have you talked to them?
17:34:09 <wanyen> dtanstsur, I thought you have made changes to the virt driver to consume all rsc.
17:34:41 <dtantsur> we have a temporary hack to simulate it more or less. it does not always work, and it is going away.
17:34:56 <dtantsur> in queens virt drivers won't be able to hack consumption of resources, whether we like it or not
17:35:08 * milan suspects the more classes the more issues
17:35:20 <dtantsur> we need to have allocations reflecting the nature of bare metal
17:35:23 * TheJulia suspects milan is correct there
17:35:31 <dtantsur> which is something virt drivers do not have control over
17:35:37 <wanyen> dtantsur, perhaps a trait to indicate that this rsc class is "Ironic"., so Nova will know that it needs to consume all rsc?
17:35:54 <TheJulia> wanyen: That would be a question for the nova folks
17:36:00 <dtantsur> wanyen: perhaps, but this is not something anyone here can decide.
17:36:16 <dtantsur> wanyen: you can start with talking to jaypipes on #openstack-nova or stopping by their IRC meeting
17:36:40 <dtantsur> the nova-scheduler meeting is at 2pm UTC every Monday
17:36:59 <dtantsur> an ML thread could also help, I guess. maybe even both: first the ML, then the meeting
17:37:09 <wanyen> dtantsur, ok.  Just want to get some input from Ironic.
17:37:40 <dtantsur> got it. so my input personally is: I'm cool with it, as long as nova can handle it in a clean way, without hacks in virt drivers.
17:37:41 <TheJulia> wanyen: it would also be good to detail your perceived use case(s) to help readers have context.
17:38:58 <wanyen> in terms of the rsc class rules supported in inspector, I think we need to expand it so the oob inspection can support it.
17:39:22 <dtantsur> wanyen: this is something we can do. the only caveat is to agree on a single inventory format.
17:39:41 <dtantsur> which probably should be the existing IPA format..
17:40:03 <dtantsur> and then, of course, to agree on the rules API. I'd of course vote for existing ironic-inspector API to be moved as it is to ironic :)
17:40:22 <dtantsur> this is something someone should write a spec on, I think
17:40:28 <TheJulia> Agreed
17:40:34 <wanyen> dtansur: great!  looking fwrd to add this support in oob inspection.
17:41:09 <TheJulia> Except, wouldn't we need nova resource classes to be sorted first?
17:41:14 <milan> there's just the inspector&resource classes in the PTG topics, maybe worth adding a Nova X-session?
17:41:38 <dtantsur> milan: wanyen won't be on the PTG
17:41:49 <dtantsur> TheJulia: nope, there are not related
17:41:56 <milan> ironic of me to suggest it too
17:42:24 <dtantsur> TheJulia: if we have inspection rules similar to inspector's, using one number of resource classes will be easier
17:42:29 <dtantsur> s/one/any/
17:42:31 <wanyen> milan, I won't be a t PTG.  That's why I am discussing it in this IRC.
17:42:43 * milan really wishes not to be missing this particular PTG
17:42:54 <milan> wanyen, I see
17:43:09 <TheJulia> I guess I'm not grasping something between the two topics, I guess I'll just have to wait until we are at the ptg next week to try and further grasp where my disconnect is
17:44:17 <dtantsur> the plan I propose is: 1. talk to nova folks about consumption of bare metal resources, 2. get a spec written on moving inspection rules to ironic
17:44:45 <dtantsur> I won't have time for either, so it's up to you :)
17:44:48 <TheJulia> Sounds like a good plan
17:45:04 <milan> dtantsur, I'm cool with inspector being engulfed by ironic if I get Ironic core vote in exchange :P
17:45:16 <dtantsur> look at this guy ^^^ :D
17:45:25 <milan> ;)
17:45:27 <dtantsur> milan: what about doing some reviews to achieve the same result? ;)
17:45:37 <milan> hehe yeah :D
17:46:26 <vdrok> and now everyone will think how corrupted ironic is :D
17:46:35 <milan> lol
17:46:52 <dtantsur> btw, we have a topic proposed for the ptg: "inspection and resource classes"
17:47:19 <dtantsur> if we can get a spec before the ptg, we can take a look at it (with whoever goes there, I mean)
17:47:46 <dtantsur> ok. anything else?
17:48:09 <TheJulia> I have nothing, aside from coffee to drink and code to write
17:48:19 <dtantsur> not so bad
17:48:38 <dtantsur> let's give TheJulia 12 more minutes to enjoy these great things :)
17:48:44 <TheJulia> lol
17:48:45 <dtantsur> thanks all, see you in a week
17:48:47 <vdrok> thanks!
17:48:52 <milan> o/ :)
17:48:54 <vdrok> \o
17:48:56 <TheJulia> See everyone soon!
17:48:57 <etingof> \o
17:48:57 <rpioso> Looking forward to it!
17:49:01 <dtantsur> #endmeeting