16:00:35 <sgordon_> #startmeeting nfv 16:00:35 <openstack> Meeting started Thu Sep 4 16:00:35 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sgordon_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 16:00:36 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 16:00:38 <bauzas> ohai - aloha - morning - bonjour - guten tag - \o 16:00:38 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'nfv' 16:00:48 <sgordon_> !topic roll call 16:00:49 <openstack> sgordon_: Error: "topic" is not a valid command. 16:00:54 <sgordon_> #topic roll call 16:00:57 <sgordon_> whoops :) 16:01:02 <bauzas> ohai - aloha - morning - bonjour - guten tag - \o 16:01:04 <sgordon_> who is here for the nfv meeting? 16:01:13 <cloudon> hi 16:01:31 <sgordon_> expecting to be short/quick today as i expect a lot of people are dealing with feature freeze related work 16:01:44 <lukego> Howdy 16:01:50 <sgordon_> hi luke 16:02:00 <sgordon_> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nfv-meeting-agenda 16:02:16 <sgordon_> #topic review action items 16:02:26 <sgordon_> so russell scored two action items last week 16:02:48 <sgordon_> one on clarification of FeatureProposalFreeze wiki, which i am unclear on - possibly still outstanding 16:02:56 <sgordon_> the other was related to the NUMA I/O scheduling 16:03:08 <sgordon_> now as ndipanov appears to be requesting an FFE for the base NUMA work 16:03:18 <sgordon_> i am not sure where this one stands, maybe jchapman can update 16:03:28 <danpb> FYI on NUMA FFE 16:03:30 <jchapman> sgordon, he 16:03:32 <jchapman> hi 16:03:40 <danpb> it has sufficient core sponsors but the questions are around testing 16:03:59 <danpb> i think it would be helpful if anyone were able to step forward and publically say they are going to test this before release 16:04:23 <sgordon_> #info Base NUMA functionality will require an FFE, has sponsors but needs testing commitment 16:04:25 <danpb> (say it in response to the email requesting NUMA FFE ) 16:04:44 <sgordon_> right 16:04:56 <danpb> the pushback we're seeing against NUMA is all related to level of testing 16:05:05 <danpb> so anything to mitigate that is useful 16:05:15 <sgordon_> #info need a lucky volunteer to test NUMA functionality before release 16:05:28 <adrian-hoban> danpb: We will test the NUMA functionality 16:05:42 <danpb> oh and they need to say this on the mail within the next 24 hrs 16:05:52 <sgordon_> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-September/044878.html 16:06:16 <sgordon_> and specifically: 16:06:18 <sgordon_> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-September/044906.html 16:06:50 <sgordon_> adrian-hoban, indeed - i think the key is to have a documented commitment on list as to how this will happen 16:07:41 <adrian-hoban> danpb: sgordon: We will reply to the mail saying what we intend to test 16:07:49 <sgordon_> anyone else with a particular interest in this feature that would be interested would be welcome as well 16:07:51 <danpb> adrian-hoban: thanks 16:07:59 <sgordon_> e.g. providers etc. 16:08:15 <sgordon_> we kind of skipped right into this 16:08:17 <sgordon_> but 16:08:20 <sgordon_> #topic juno status 16:08:34 <sgordon_> obviously we have hit feature freeze, i have seen the NUMA FFE request we just discussed 16:08:41 <sgordon_> looks like one was also just filed for SR-IOV 16:08:56 <sgordon_> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-September/044923.html 16:09:00 <danpb> yes, SR-IOV FFE got a positive reception in nova meeting too 16:09:11 <sgordon_> #info SR-IOV FFE proposed and received positive reception in nova meeting 16:09:35 <nidpanov> here now too 16:09:37 <sgordon_> #info two cores so far signed up for SR-IOV FFE 16:10:03 <adrian-hoban> That's good news 16:10:25 <sgordon_> so, those are the two ones i can see already related to work this group has been tracking 16:10:42 <sgordon_> does anyone from this group have plans to submit additional FFE requests? 16:10:58 <nidpanov> danpb, sorry to go back - missed your comment about numa testing - so the issues were mostly due to me mentioning it in the email, and HP already kind of signed up to test it as well iiuc 16:11:24 <sgordon_> nidpanov, i think it is probably necessary to confirm with Paul that was the intent of his email 16:11:32 <jchapman> we are not lookign for FFE for I/O (PCIe) Based NUMA Schedulin :( 16:11:37 <sgordon_> it seemed somewhat unclear to me 16:11:48 <nidpanov> sgordon_, hence my response 16:11:55 <sgordon_> ack 16:12:06 <sgordon_> jchapman, understoof 16:12:10 <nidpanov> jchapman, is that because of the NUMA delay or? 16:12:25 <jchapman> nidpanov, that and no core dev reviews 16:12:36 <nidpanov> jchapman, :( 16:12:45 <nidpanov> I had my hands full 16:12:45 <sgordon_> #info I/OC (PCIe) Based Numa Scheduling FFE not being requested due to issues with base NUMA functionality and lack of interested core sponsors 16:13:01 <jchapman> nidpanov, ye i guessed you guys were busy 16:13:09 <danpb> realistically the only stuff that's going to get approved FFE is stuff that already had a +A and was in the gate at time of freeze 16:13:22 <nidpanov> if that 16:13:22 <cloudon> lukego, is your accel data plane stuff going to make it? 16:13:22 <sgordon_> yeah understood 16:13:30 <danpb> so yeah, i'm afraid I/O PCI numa scheduling would loose on that count even if proposed 16:13:39 <adrian-hoban> The I/O Numa scheduling will be re-targeted at Kilo now 16:13:46 <sgordon_> yes 16:13:50 <jchapman> yep 16:14:01 <lukego> cloudon: ‘fraid not. Neutron core asked me to develop it more out of tree first, and then Nova wouldn’t take the VIF until Neutron code is accepted. 16:14:04 <sgordon_> hopefully the desire to come up with a way to preload designs for summit will go somewhere useful... 16:14:46 <lukego> cloudon: at least within this NFV group those of us interested in userspace virtio-net seem to be on the same page and on track to share code going forward, which I think is the most important thing 16:14:51 <cloudon> lukego: shame - are you hopeful for Kilo? 16:15:00 <bauzas> sgordon_: yeah, at least we need to see what will be the new format for the Design Summit 16:15:51 <sgordon_> soooo 16:15:57 <sgordon_> one other thing i wanted to quickly mention 16:16:03 <sgordon_> #topic other discussion 16:16:05 <sgordon_> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-September/044614.html 16:16:07 <lukego> cloudon: I am hopeful but it does depend on the success of initiatives in Neutron and Nova to accommodate more drivers/features 16:16:23 <cloudon> lukego: understand - good luck 16:16:31 <sgordon_> itai put together a very well thought out email on some of our current issues and attempting to frame discussion about where we go from here 16:16:45 <lukego> cloudon: on the list we also discuss the possibility of sharing a mech driver instead of having a separate snabb vs. ovdk vs. etc ones, which I suspect would resolve the Neutron core concerns (which are roughly “too many drivers”) 16:16:47 <sgordon_> i havent had a chance to fully consider and respond yet but i would encourage others to also review 16:17:39 <cloudon> sgordon: +1 - on first read looked very sensible 16:18:06 <adrian-hoban> +1 on that note. Nicely written Itai 16:19:02 <sgordon_> does anyone have anything else they would like to discuss this week? i would probably prefer to close down asap and let those dealing with FFE items get back to it 16:19:14 <adrian-hoban> Itai: One thing to consider is the focus on the wiki... I think we need to broaden horizons in getting the info you suggest out to the community. 16:19:20 <sgordon_> and discuss some of the medium to long term issues/goals starting next week 16:19:32 <sgordon_> incl. kilo planning 16:19:58 <sgordon_> even the wiki needs to be broken up and organized a little imo 16:20:35 <cloudon> sgordon: quick question on Paris summit - see you +adrian-hoban are giving a telco strategies track talk on this group - congrats on getting selected & what's your plan/do you need further stuff from this group? 16:20:54 <sgordon_> cloudon, good question - we're not really sure yet :) 16:21:22 <sgordon_> cloudon, the idea we had discussed was to try and present some use cases, what's there today, and more importantly what's not 16:21:29 <cloudon> sgordon: lucky you have two months then :) 16:21:39 <sgordon_> but we will be trying to flesh out further 16:21:58 <sgordon_> obviously wrt juno we made some progress but not as much as we would like 16:22:21 <sgordon_> which is obviously not ideal but also provides us with some good examples of solid proposals that exist but ultimately did not get implemented 16:23:54 <cloudon> sgordon: cool - if you want any help on use cases etc. am happy to assist 16:24:50 <adrian-hoban> cloudon: Thanks! Also, alank co-presenting too. 16:26:05 <bauzas> sgordon_: do you think we should try to promote NFV work to developers too ? 16:26:19 <sgordon_> bauzas, of course - but that is a challenging thing 16:26:24 <bauzas> sgordon_: I'm also concerned about the coding and reviewing bandwidth 16:26:37 <sgordon_> bauzas, design summit proposals need to be framed around specific goals 16:26:53 <sgordon_> bauzas, yes - in the context of nova i expect that to be a hot topic in general 16:26:58 <sgordon_> bauzas, not an nfv specific issue 16:27:12 <bauzas> sgordon_: lemme check if it's in the nova priorities for the summit 16:27:21 <sgordon_> (contributors interested in nfv need to contribute to this discussion to help the project move forward though or we're all in the log jam togetjer) 16:27:36 <bauzas> sgordon_: there is an etherpad and I don't remember having seen the NFV stuff to be debated 16:28:09 <bauzas> there 16:28:22 <bauzas> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-nova-summit-topics Proposals for Nova Kilo Summit 16:28:48 <bauzas> sgordon_: can't see NFV in there ^ 16:28:59 <sgordon_> bauzas, this is the thing though 16:29:09 <sgordon_> bauzas, proposing "let's talk about nfv" in there will get nacked 16:29:18 <sgordon_> bauzas, needs to be about specific issues or proposals 16:29:19 <bauzas> I don't know for Neutron but I assume there will be the same etherpad 16:29:25 <sgordon_> so for instance wrt ci 16:29:28 <bauzas> sgordon_: indeed 16:29:33 <sgordon_> newer libvirt versions is probably relevant for nfv 16:29:40 <bauzas> sgordon_: but can't see a related topic to that either 16:29:43 <sgordon_> (esp since some of the nfv features are now getting push back on testing) 16:29:49 <sgordon_> related to what? 16:29:58 <bauzas> related to the nfv usecases 16:30:02 <sgordon_> scheduler split in there is another one 16:30:38 <sgordon_> bauzas, so the backstory here is there were several such proposals for atlanta 16:30:56 <sgordon_> all were rejected with clear guidance that sessions need to have a very specific goals/proposals 16:31:02 <bauzas> got it 16:31:10 <adrian-hoban> resource tracker seems to be covered 16:31:31 <sgordon_> getting time allocated generically to NFV in the track will be very difficult, similar for HPC or other user story type things 16:31:37 <bauzas> I just want to make sure that the next Juno developments will be covered and agreed there :) 16:31:38 <sgordon_> adrian-hoban, right 16:31:54 <sgordon_> key is to focus on what we specifically want to achieve for kilo 16:32:01 <sgordon_> and ensure where necessary that is covered in there 16:32:11 <sgordon_> the scheduler / RT / ERT discussion is a great example 16:32:12 <danpb> also note that if you propose a topic for a session 16:32:16 <bauzas> +1 - and I just add: make sure it's covered in the design talks 16:32:20 <adrian-hoban> Is there a deadline on getting items into the lists? 16:32:21 <sgordon_> as a lot of features are running into issues on that front 16:32:35 <danpb> it will be expected that the topic has already had a spec proposed or some other detailed discussions or write up 16:32:56 <danpb> they're very unlikely to approve sessions for topics where this is the first time anyone has heard of the topic 16:33:01 <bauzas> sgordon_: the scheduler/RT thing will probably be highly debated, don't know if we will have time to cover extra things in there 16:33:14 <bauzas> danpb: +1 16:33:37 <adrian-hoban> danpb: Ok, but is there an order in which things need to happen? E.g. add to the list, release bp? 16:33:50 <danpb> the goal is that the sessions will focus on resolving actual problems that need f2f time 16:33:59 <danpb> rather than just presenting new ideas 16:34:50 <danpb> also i hope there will be more unscheduled time for ad-hoc discussions which will be an avenue to bring up any other items which are relevant 16:35:20 <adrian-hoban> danpb: Is this a living doc for the next few weeks? Perhaps up until the bp submission window closes? 16:35:27 <sgordon_> adrian-hoban, let me see if i can find mikal's email 16:36:48 <sgordon_> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-August/044196.html 16:36:53 <sgordon_> no date afaict 16:37:17 <sgordon_> let me bump the thread now and ask that question... 16:37:34 <adrian-hoban> sgordon: Thx 16:38:52 <sgordon_> im going to close up the meeting for now 16:38:56 <sgordon_> thanks all for the discussion 16:39:11 <sgordon_> let's see what michael says wrt that list and when it is going to be finalized 16:39:14 <bauzas> sgordon_: thanks 16:39:27 <sgordon_> i expect it will be a while yet while the dust settles on j-3 and the first RCs but we will see 16:39:30 <sgordon_> #endmeeting