15:59:36 <gibi> #startmeeting nova 15:59:36 <opendevmeet> Meeting started Tue Jun 21 15:59:36 2022 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is gibi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:59:36 <opendevmeet> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 15:59:36 <opendevmeet> The meeting name has been set to 'nova' 15:59:41 <gibi> chair gibi bauzas 15:59:44 <gibi> #chair gibi bauzas 15:59:44 <opendevmeet> Current chairs: bauzas gibi 16:00:01 <gibi> lets wait a bit before we start 16:02:06 <elodilles> o/ 16:02:36 <gibi> OK, lets get started 16:02:48 <gibi> bauzas asked me to run this as he might be late a bit 16:02:51 <gibi> #topic Bugs (stuck/critical) 16:03:01 <gibi> #info One critical bug 16:03:07 <gibi> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1979047 Centos 9 Stream bug failure 16:03:22 <gibi> the centos 9 steam job is made non-voting on Friday to unblock the gate 16:04:52 <gibi> there is some info from tripleooo about the same issue, they pinned libvirt version 16:04:59 <gibi> should we try to do the same? 16:06:48 <elodilles> good question o:) is there any other option? :-o 16:06:57 <gibi> keep it non voting forever? 16:07:04 <gibi> :) 16:07:04 <elodilles> :S 16:07:40 <gibi> we would need somebody who care about this job to propose a fix 16:08:00 <gibi> I don't see a long line of volunteers 16:08:01 <gibi> so moving on 16:08:12 <gibi> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?search=Search&field.status=New 12 new untriaged bugs (-2 since the last meeting) 16:08:13 <elodilles> i mean, does it make any difference to pin libvirt compared to keep the job non-voting ? 16:08:33 <artom> Looks like a libvirt fix is being released, based on https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2092856 16:08:39 <gibi> elodilles: if we keep non-voting and the libvirt issue is fixed the job will start being green again 16:08:47 <artom> So maybe just wait for that to land in CS9, and make the job voting again? 16:08:56 <gibi> artom: yepp, we can do that 16:09:09 <Uggla> o/ 16:09:20 <elodilles> ack, then that is the best option for now 16:09:28 <gibi> ack, seems like we do that as that is easy 16:09:50 <gibi> so untriaged bug backlog looks healthy thanks melwitt for the triages 16:10:14 <gibi> #info If you are interested add yourself in the team bug roster if you want to help https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/nova-bug-triage-roster 16:10:22 <gibi> next the baton goes to bauzas 16:10:29 <gibi> I will ping him when he is back 16:10:34 <gibi> let's assume he took it :) 16:10:41 <gibi> #info Next bug baton is passed to bauzas 16:10:50 <gibi> any other bug you would like to discuss? 16:11:16 <artom> Not me? Cool then 16:11:42 <gibi> I think bauzas rescheduled himself as he missed having the baton during the summit 16:12:00 <gibi> (I'm following bauzas agend from the wiki :) 16:12:07 <artom> For once it's not my job to figure out the "overwatch" rotation :P 16:12:15 <artom> (Sorry for leaking downstream) 16:12:32 <gibi> anyhow I don't see any bugs raised so moving on 16:12:35 <gibi> #topic Gate status 16:12:40 <gibi> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?field.tag=gate-failure Nova gate bugs 16:12:46 <gibi> #link https://zuul.openstack.org/builds?project=openstack%2Fplacement&pipeline=periodic-weekly Placement periodic job status 16:12:57 <gibi> looks green 16:13:07 <gibi> #link https://zuul.opendev.org/t/openstack/builds?job_name=nova-emulation&pipeline=periodic-weekly&skip=0 Emulation periodic job runs 16:13:18 <gibi> green too 16:13:25 <gibi> #info Please look at the gate failures and file a bug report with the gate-failure tag. 16:13:29 <gibi> #info STOP DOING BLIND RECHECKS aka. 'recheck' https://docs.openstack.org/project-team-guide/testing.html#how-to-handle-test-failures 16:13:35 <gibi> we had two gate blockers on Friday 16:13:42 <gibi> the one with the libvirt issue from above 16:13:56 <gibi> and another with a tempest test case failure 16:14:19 <gibi> the tempest failure was fixed by https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/tempest/+/846345/3 16:14:27 <gibi> so the gate should be OK now 16:14:36 <gibi> but honestly I haven't checked the results today 16:15:29 <gibi> I quickly checked the master gate is not blocked 16:15:42 <gibi> any gate issue we need to discuss here? 16:16:51 <gibi> #topic Release Planning 16:16:57 <gibi> #link https://releases.openstack.org/zed/schedule.html 16:17:02 <gibi> #info Zed-2 is in 3.5 weeks 16:17:07 <gibi> #startvote Spec review day on July 5th ? (yes/no) 16:17:07 <opendevmeet> Begin voting on: Spec review day on July 5th ? Valid vote options are , yes, no, . 16:17:07 <opendevmeet> Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. 16:17:26 <gibi> #vote yes 16:17:59 <Uggla> #vote yes 16:18:48 <gibi> others? 16:19:13 <elodilles> #vote yes 16:19:50 <elodilles> (though my vote really does not count i guess o:)) 16:20:02 <sean-k-mooney> #vote yes 16:20:25 <sean-k-mooney> i think i can do the 5th but folks form the us may be off 16:20:44 <gibi> hangover from 4th of July? 16:20:53 <sean-k-mooney> perhaps :) 16:21:21 <sean-k-mooney> i think if there are no objections however the 5th shoudl be fine 16:21:21 <elodilles> :) 16:21:51 <gibi> #endvote 16:21:51 <opendevmeet> Voted on "Spec review day on July 5th ?" Results are 16:21:51 <opendevmeet> yes (4): Uggla, sean-k-mooney, gibi, elodilles 16:22:18 <gibi> #action bauzas to send out a note to the ML about the spec review day on 5th of July 16:22:35 <gibi> #topic Review priorities 16:22:42 <gibi> #link https://review.opendev.org/q/status:open+(project:openstack/nova+OR+project:openstack/placement+OR+project:openstack/os-traits+OR+project:openstack/os-resource-classes+OR+project:openstack/os-vif+OR+project:openstack/python-novaclient+OR+project:openstack/osc-placement)+label:Review-Priority%252B1 16:22:59 <gibi> #link https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/project-config/+/837595 Gerrit policy for Review-prio contributors flag. New proposal there, please vote. 16:23:03 <gibi> #link https://docs.openstack.org/nova/latest/contributor/process.html#what-the-review-priority-label-in-gerrit-are-use-for Documentation we already have 16:23:26 <gibi> anything to raise about review priority? 16:24:19 <gibi> #topic Stable Branches 16:24:24 <gibi> elodilles: 16:24:26 <gibi> your turn 16:24:44 <elodilles> #info gates are mostly not blocked 16:24:56 <elodilles> #info stable/train is blocked - melwitt's fix: https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/844530/ 16:25:04 <elodilles> #info stable branch status / gate failures tracking etherpad: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/nova-stable-branch-ci 16:25:13 <elodilles> release patches proposed (yoga, xena, wallaby): https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/releases+is:open+intopic:nova 16:25:27 <elodilles> the release patches are on the way now 16:25:34 <gibi> \o/ 16:25:58 <elodilles> (sorry i've re-used last week's lines as there are not that much news o:)) 16:26:36 <gibi> elodilles: thanks 16:26:41 <elodilles> np 16:26:43 <gibi> anything else about stable? 16:26:51 <elodilles> nothing from me 16:28:03 <gibi> #topic Open discussion 16:28:10 <gibi> (artom) Can we revisit stable func test backport policy? Specific patch stack: https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/791480/1 Previously we didn't want to backport func test infrastructure because it just offloads the backport debt onto whoever is doing backport for older than train releases. Some time has passed now, are there still operators running < stable/train and needing backports? 16:28:16 <gibi> https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/r.ea2e9bd003ed5aed5e25cd8393cf9362 indicates a majority of "train or older", but how many are on the "older" half of that? 16:29:02 <artom> Bringing this up again because at this point there are 3 separate bugfixes depending on those test refactor patches 16:29:08 <artom> But basically $topic :) 16:29:28 <gibi> personally I'm OK to bring back any test refactors to stable branches 16:30:17 <artom> IIRC last time we talked about this, elodilles was worried that anyone backporting to rocky and older would get the "refactor" debt unloaded onto them 16:30:35 <elodilles> IF there are enough reviewers then maybe it could be OK, though it's best to keep things on the safe side and backport less risky things 16:31:11 <artom> Are func test refactors really risky though? 16:31:14 <sean-k-mooney> well test code is less risky in general since it does not affect the runing code 16:31:27 <elodilles> artom: yepp, if we backport mass amount of functional test refactors, then it makes the backport harder for older branches 16:31:27 <gibi> it does not risk the production code, it risk the CI stability 16:31:36 <sean-k-mooney> and in some cases are not actully installed with the production code 16:32:11 <artom> elodilles, yep, agreed on that. So in practice, bauzas and gibi were at summit, is anyone still doing backports for < stable/train? 16:32:18 * elodilles agrees with gibi 16:32:34 <artom> As in, Red Hat will have to care about stable/train for a long time 16:32:46 <sean-k-mooney> :( 16:32:53 <gibi> I tend to propose backports to stable/pike while I were in E/// 16:32:54 <sean-k-mooney> its true but :( 16:32:55 <artom> Yeah, sad face indeed 16:33:16 <gibi> I assume E/// still uses stable/pike 16:33:24 <gibi> but I don't think we will see much backports there 16:33:48 <elodilles> i see that there are less and less backports pushed toward old branches, though if we make it harder for developers, then it will not help the situation as well 16:33:56 <artom> gibi, elodilles, so I can buy the gate stability argument for integration tests, but when was the last time we had an issue with func tests that wasn't about versions of things like tox? 16:34:20 <sean-k-mooney> elodilles: well right now its hard to backprot to train because once you get past about victoria you are missing the helpers 16:34:25 <gibi> we have still open a bug where nova funct test leaks notifications between tests :) 16:34:26 <elodilles> gibi: unfortunately my pike patches are hanging there without reviews, so.... o:) 16:34:34 <gibi> elodilles: I know :) 16:34:56 <gibi> artom: so func test could be problematic 16:35:11 <gibi> as they run eventlets 16:35:26 <gibi> and sometimes depends on extrenal things like sysfs :) 16:35:44 <gibi> still I think we should backport func test infra 16:35:53 * sean-k-mooney notes we have backported some of the helpers downstream already 16:36:27 <sean-k-mooney> its the integrated_helpers that are most useful 16:37:05 <artom> gibi, I feel like sysfs should be poisoned in func tests... 16:37:15 <gibi> artom: I have a patch 16:37:26 <gibi> https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/844627 16:37:40 <sean-k-mooney> artom: for the most part its mocked already modulo bugs 16:37:56 <sean-k-mooney> but yes the poison is also good to do 16:38:31 <gibi> does anyone here strongly disagree to backport func test infra? 16:38:36 <elodilles> also note, i'm not completely against backporting func test refactors, but i still think it is best to keep it in a low level and we should not backport massive refactors :/ 16:39:12 <gibi> elodilles: it is a tradeoff, either you take the risk by backporting the refactor or take the risk when you backport a fix that needs to be changed due to the missing refactor 16:39:13 * artom would not consider https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/791480/1 massive 16:39:33 <gibi> artom: 3 lines! come on! :) 16:39:33 <sean-k-mooney> well or we drop the functest on backport 16:39:43 <elodilles> if a refactor breaks something then we don't have the bandwidth to keep it maintained i think. stable should be stable :( 16:39:45 <artom> The one on top is a bit bigger ^_^ 16:39:46 <gibi> I strongly against droping the func test on backport 16:39:56 <artom> elodilles, so that was the crux of my argument 16:40:09 <artom> Red Hat *will* maintain stable/train for literally years, we have no choice 16:40:28 <sean-k-mooney> well at least 2.5 more 16:40:29 <artom> But we don't want to inflict pain on anyone maintaining older than stable/train 16:40:38 <artom> So: do those folks... well, exist? :) 16:41:01 <artom> At Summit, what release did operators say they were on? 16:41:05 <sean-k-mooney> technially we still maintain queens downstream too for a while more 16:41:42 <sean-k-mooney> but i would prefer to have the backports of the func infra as that makes backporting simpelr in the long run 16:41:45 <gibi> artom: there were no specifics other than what is in the etherpad 16:42:01 <artom> So only "train or older" with no info if it's train... or older :( 16:42:43 <elodilles> should have been added 'train' + 'stein and older' :D 16:43:24 <artom> Yeah :S 16:43:35 * artom checks stable/rocky backports: https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/nova+branch:stable/rocky 16:44:34 <artom> So compared to stable/train, there are 4 patches last updated this year, compared to train's ~50 16:44:53 <elodilles> why not https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/nova+branch:stable/stein ? 16:45:04 <artom> Because I suck at alphabet :P 16:45:09 <elodilles> o:) 16:45:36 <artom> Seems to be mostly Felix and Vlad Gusev... 16:45:50 <artom> But similar level of involvement drop-off 16:46:21 <elodilles> a bit more patch but without reviews, yes :/ 16:46:24 <gibi> so what if we say, func infra backport are OK to stable/train as there are maintainers there but not further backwards 16:46:44 <gibi> due to lack of maintainers 16:47:04 <elodilles> gibi: that is good for RH but not really helps to encourage backporting for older branches 16:47:26 <sean-k-mooney> well even train is in em now right 16:47:34 <artom> I think elodilles's point is that if we rewrite the fixes to not need func test refactors *before* train, it helps maintainers of older branches, such as they are 16:47:48 <sean-k-mooney> given the peopel we have its hard to keep maintianing older branches 16:47:57 <keerthi> can some one help on review this https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/define-max-volume-limit-at-flavor ? 16:47:58 <sean-k-mooney> train is 5 releases old currently 16:48:03 <artom> If we backport func test refactors, we're offloading that rewriting work onto whoever is still working with rocky and older 16:48:14 <gibi> keerthi: we are in a meeting right now 16:49:04 <artom> OTOH, why would it be wrong of facilitating the work of the majority? 16:49:10 <gibi> so we say no func test backport as it there is no maintainers but also we say if we dont backport func infra then we dont have maintaniers, this is contradiction now 16:49:12 <sean-k-mooney> keerthi: we can proably discuss it after the meeting or when we are done with this topic 16:49:31 <keerthi> sure Sean, I will wait for it 16:50:23 <elodilles> anyway, i have said my preference, and i'm only one of the stable maintainers o:) 16:50:52 <gibi> either we don't have stein maintainers and then I don't feel back about not helping them, or we have maintainers and the I would ask them to backport the func refactor from train to stein 16:51:01 <gibi> s/back/bad/ 16:51:45 <gibi> and I would help them by backporting the refactor up until train 16:51:56 <gibi> that would be a win-win 16:52:00 <artom> gibi, hard to argue with that 16:52:37 <gibi> elodilles: would you be -1 on a func infra backport to stable/train? 16:52:45 <gibi> (or even -2?) 16:53:01 <elodilles> 'func infra'? 16:53:12 <gibi> functional test infrastructure backport 16:53:30 <artom> As opposed to infrastructure that's really grooooovey :D 16:53:31 <gibi> like the one artom linked above 16:53:54 <elodilles> so you mean zuul jobs change? 16:54:06 <elodilles> (i've lost in the links :)) 16:54:11 <artom> No, stuff like https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/791481/1 16:54:14 <artom> For example 16:54:38 <gibi> elodilles: changes that are not adding a bugfix but refactoring the functional test infrastrucutre 16:54:49 <gibi> like backporting helpers from newer branches 16:54:51 <artom> I mean, if https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/751364 is allowed... 16:54:53 * bauzas waves super super late 16:54:59 <bauzas> sorry, it took longer than expected :( 16:55:10 <artom> And https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/751363/3 16:55:28 <artom> Honestly, with those last 2, we've set the precedent that func test refactors are fair game 16:55:46 <sean-k-mooney> artom: wasnt the main issue with the backport you did that you skipped ussui by the way 16:56:01 <artom> sean-k-mooney, that's a different series, and I fixed that 16:56:07 <sean-k-mooney> oh ok 16:56:12 <sean-k-mooney> nevermind then 16:56:24 <gibi> we are running out of time and still had on point on the agenda 16:56:39 <elodilles> artom: we did backport simple&small func test refactors in the past 16:57:33 <elodilles> gibi: if we are waiting for my vote: as i said, i'd prefer not, but not against :) 16:57:50 <elodilles> so no -2 from me 16:57:57 <gibi> OK, so if you are not blocking such backport then we are done 16:58:06 <gibi> artom: anything else? 16:58:13 <bauzas> so, MHO is that we should be picky if needed 16:58:33 <elodilles> bauzas: +2 16:58:34 <bauzas> anyway, time flies 16:58:53 <gibi> sure still proper review on those patches but not blanket -2 16:59:02 <bauzas> my other point can be deferred to next week 16:59:02 <artom> gibi, nope, I'm coming away from this with the understanding that func test refactors are fair game if they help make the fixes cleaner and easier to backport (and increase confidence in the reproducer test) 16:59:10 <gibi> ack 16:59:21 <gibi> moving on then 16:59:22 <gibi> (bauzas) Opportunities for low-hanging-fruits, anyone ? (only if we have time left) 16:59:31 <gibi> 40 secs :) 16:59:32 <bauzas> no time, let's punt to next week 16:59:36 <gibi> ack 16:59:46 <gibi> any last minute issue to raise today? 16:59:50 <bauzas> tl;dr: think about how to help on-off contributors like interns 17:00:10 <gibi> #endmeeting