08:00:31 #startmeeting openstack telemetry 08:00:32 Meeting started Thu May 23 08:00:31 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dangtrinhnt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 08:00:33 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 08:00:36 The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_telemetry' 08:01:26 mrunge, zhurong, joedavis, hyang, witek, shaoman are you here for the meeting? 08:01:39 morning 08:02:14 witek, hi :) 08:02:31 hi 08:02:36 hi 08:02:46 I'm looking for Tobias Urdin's IRC handle 08:02:57 anyone know it? 08:03:14 good question, I may remember it, when I see it 08:03:48 tobiao? 08:04:00 I guess, tobias-urdin 08:04:15 anyway 08:04:44 Hello.Is this channel strictly for meetings and discussions ? 08:04:46 https://launchpad.net/~tobias-urdin 08:04:58 tobias-urdin, as already said 08:05:37 m0zart89: it's not. but we're having a meeting right now. if you have a question, can that wait till after the meeting? 08:05:37 anyway, the focus of this meeting is "Cross-project discussion (e.g., monasca merged/integration/replacement) + roadmap of Telemetry in Train" 08:05:58 mrunge: of course ;) 08:06:12 m0zart89, :) in about 1 hour, we're free :) 08:06:52 Please look at the meeting agenda #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/telemetry-meeting-agenda 08:07:10 I have added a URL to Monasca publisher review to the agenda 08:07:40 oh, you moved it, it's OK 08:07:58 witek, yes, I would like to discuss a little bit about our roadmap before moving forward 08:08:04 #topic Telemetry roadmap 08:08:28 #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/telemetry-train-roadmap 08:08:58 joadavis had helped us put together several options 08:09:35 A: Try to maintain current course, Increase community involvement and communication 08:09:42 B: Gather new feature requirements, dedicate a team to implementing them 08:09:48 C: Work with each OpenStack project to provide its own telemetry data 08:09:57 D: Define an end of life for the Telemetry project, tell the community to switch to Prometheus 08:10:07 E: Fold Telemetry in to the Monasca project => I could expect an optimistic future for this proposal but after 2-3 more cycles 08:11:48 I think C adds real value to OpenStack 08:11:49 In this morning session, we agreed that a mix of A,B,C could be a doable solution. D would need a solid proof that Prometheus can replace Telemetry. E. Is also a good option but would be in 2-3 cycles since many people depends on Telemetry 08:12:02 witek, I think so too 08:12:41 Any comments? 08:13:03 regarding E, I think it should be a free choice for companies to decide which approach they want to choose 08:13:44 I'd think, we should keep the community honest and talk about deprecation 08:14:33 regarding to D: I don't see a feature parity there yet 08:15:32 +1 08:16:46 other thoughts? 08:17:06 what is your opinion dangtrinhnt ? 08:17:12 witek, monasca seems more flexible and give users more choice so I think it's inevitable to use monasca. 08:17:54 Looking at what Monasca offers so far, I would want to design a future for Billing and Monitoring. 08:18:25 do you really want to dive into billing? 08:18:35 there used to be a project for that 08:18:54 and everyone else tried to avoid it like hell 08:19:15 Cloud Kitty you mean? 08:19:18 right 08:19:33 there was a single company behind it, iirc 08:19:55 lxkong and adriant are mostly use ceilometer for their billing system 08:19:59 tobias-urdin, hi 08:20:12 with regards to merging monasca and telemetry: which community is larger? 08:20:20 hi o/ sorry if i missed the beginning, been working nightshift 08:20:26 i.e. maybe it'd make sense to merge monasca into telemetry? 08:21:05 mrunge, I would love to here some stats of monasca from witek 08:21:35 stats are all public, you can look them up at stackalytics 08:21:42 But like I said, It would be in 2-3 more cycles. 08:21:56 we have Fujitsu, SUSE, StackHPC and NEC on board 08:22:40 so currently, they are all active contributors? 08:23:11 yes, these are companies actively contributing 08:23:15 great 08:23:45 looking at the stats, telemetry is about twice as big? 08:24:16 hmm, that is derailing here and doesn't lead anywhere, let's table that 08:24:50 mrunge: I think Telemetry's mission never had been to provide operational monitoring 08:25:14 with sampling rates of 15s and below 08:25:16 but right now Telemetry only has a couple active contributors like shaoman, lxkong, zhurong and myself (mostly review and merge code) 08:25:27 witek, true 08:25:53 right witek. /me is looking more for sampling rates in 1s intervals 08:26:09 or below 08:27:41 okie, regarding the merge, how about wait until the end of Train? 08:27:41 im somewhat conflated on treating monitoring and metrics collection as the same thing, we explicitly kept away from monasca to not provide monitoring and only collect metrics 08:27:48 to skip deploying eight more services, and skipping java 08:28:04 dangtrinhnt: coming back to your idea, I'd be happy to help working on such design 08:28:17 right. we don't do monasca either 08:29:16 witek, great thanks, let's start an etherpad and see what could be done. 08:29:28 tobias-urdin, makes sense, I would skip java 08:30:07 on Java topic, we planned for this cycle to work on removing the last Java component 08:30:17 thresholding engine 08:30:39 Let's put together a draft design if the two (telemetry, monasca) could be matched. 08:32:30 okie, anything else on this? 08:32:58 not from my side 08:33:23 not from me either 08:34:20 okie 08:35:33 That's great. I will draft a vision for Telemetry in Train (published to the docs) based on what we discussed here including mention the possibility or merging with Monasca 08:35:42 in the next couple days 08:35:52 next topic 08:35:53 ok, thank you dangtrinhnt 08:36:05 #topic Monasca publisher 08:36:17 #link https://review.opendev.org/#/c/562400/ 08:36:27 It has been a while 08:36:37 this is an old review we have tried to contribute over one year ago 08:36:54 it adds Monasca publisher to Ceilometer 08:37:13 and allows pushing Ceilometer measurements to Monasca API 08:37:37 I don't see any reason not to merge it. 08:37:55 great, that's what I wanted to check on 08:38:18 So please resolve the merge conflicts and let us review it again. 08:38:20 the last PS is from October, so I think it should be revisited again 08:38:42 great, we'll update you on this 08:38:46 Okie, thanks. 08:39:28 mrunge, any comment? 08:40:28 uhm, regarding the publisher? nope 08:40:39 okie 08:41:07 Do you have anything else to discuss today? 08:41:54 uhm, I still have a pile of openstack emails to read, so I probably skipped the announcement for this meeting so far 08:42:08 are we going to have this meeting in this time slot regularly? 08:42:42 what about the idea of new instrumentation code for OpenStack projects? 08:42:43 Yes, for now 08:42:53 Idea C from your list 08:43:04 dangtrinhnt: thank you, sounds good to me. 08:43:45 I would rather document integration or exposing of metrics for other projects 08:44:01 i.e. document, how to send metrics to the metrics subsystem 08:44:12 witek, I'm ok with that and would combine it with A and B. 08:44:46 #topic Any other things 08:44:57 mrunge, +1 08:45:35 mrunge: +1 from what i understood it telemetry never wanted to build ceilometer with this polling mechanism to work around projects not exposing metrics 08:45:47 * mrunge nods 08:45:56 when it first started, would be interesting to know the optimal end result if it started from the beginning now 08:46:02 I've been contacted e.g by the manila team on exactly that question 08:46:28 ceilometer has a bad name for being slooooow 08:46:46 any idea how one reliably would solve the push of metrics instead of polling? while polling is resource intensive it somewhat reliable on what it does 08:46:46 :) 08:47:07 I'd have ideas :) 08:47:13 please don't say use existing message buss (rabbitmq) :D 08:47:20 * mrunge nods 08:47:31 nope. do not use rabbit 08:48:05 I would also like to see a message mesh instead of a single bus 08:48:31 shouldn't every service instrument their own code and expose it in the standardized way? 08:48:53 witek we're talking about different things 08:48:57 i'll just out; im for any A,B,C approach, we use it primaryly for billing and autoscaling, gnocchi for storage and have invested a lot of time to have a third party integrate their billing engine with gnocchi API 08:49:39 i heard some mention on octavia metrics, we have a simple one that collects usage, i can clean that up and push upstream 08:49:49 that sounds like you invested some effort, tobias-urdin 08:50:09 kudos! 08:50:25 tobias-urdin, great 08:52:17 Since we only have less than 10m left, I will put your question on the agenda for the next meeting and maybe open a discussion on the ML 08:52:20 so, any immediate actions for now? 08:52:45 or a plan what to do next wrt telemetry here? 08:53:43 I don't have any idea for now. So let bring that up to the ML. 08:53:59 if you talking about what tobias-urdin just asked 08:55:00 I haven't seen any question from tobias-urdin, did I miss that? 08:55:20 ah, about the metric polling/pushing 08:55:28 No I meant next steps for us to move forward here (with train) 08:55:39 ah! got you 08:56:54 what about pushing metrics via amqp to something presenting it to a component to pick it up? 08:57:12 i.e. you'd be moving the load off the collectors 08:57:47 isn't this what Monasca is doing right now? 08:57:57 s/amqp/kafka 08:58:22 Okie, for Train I wouldn't expect big design/architecture or changes. 08:59:18 So next steps are: 08:59:23 the C approach is interesting to say the least, A and B more realistic. Then there is probably a lot of things that Monasca and Telemetry could work togther on 08:59:47 sorry dangtrinhnt, go on :) 09:00:10 1. Focus on community engament via ML, meeting, events 09:00:21 2. Fix existing bugs, documents 09:01:13 3. Designing the vision for Telemetry for the next 2-3 cycles (e.g., monasca work together) 09:01:30 Yeah, basically what tobias-urdin said. 09:01:50 Is that clear enought? 09:01:52 okie, time up 09:02:09 yupp 09:02:14 thank you, dangtrinhnt 09:02:16 thanks dangtrinhnt 09:02:18 yes, thanks for clearing everything up dangtrinhnt! 09:03:10 okie, thanks everyone for the meeting 09:03:13 #endmeeting