20:00:54 <ildikov> #startmeeting openstack_upstream_institute
20:00:55 <openstack> Meeting started Mon May 15 20:00:54 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is ildikov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:00:56 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
20:00:58 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_upstream_institute'
20:01:18 <jungleboyj> o/
20:01:20 <ildikov> in case anyone's around for a chat :)
20:01:27 <spotz> Hey!
20:01:51 * jungleboyj waves at spotz
20:02:11 <ildikov> spotz: jungleboyj: hi :)
20:02:47 <jungleboyj> ildikov: Back on Hungarian time yet?
20:02:47 <spotz> Everyone have a safe flight back?
20:03:00 <ildikov> jungleboyj: no, flying out tomorrow evening local time
20:03:24 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Yep, went pretty smooth.  Slept again.  Then spent all day and Friday and Saturday trying to catch up on sleep.
20:03:34 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Ah, ok.  Have a safe trip.
20:03:41 <ildikov> jungleboyj: tnx :)
20:04:31 <ildikov> ok I think we can get into the meeting
20:04:49 <ildikov> #topic Announcements
20:05:19 <ildikov> Thanks everyone who came and helped out during those one and a half days!!!
20:05:22 <skelso> o/
20:05:49 <ildikov> It started a bit chaotic, but we handled it pretty well as a group I think
20:06:11 <ildikov> So kudos to everyone and thanks for all the work with the prep and on site!
20:06:12 <jungleboyj> ildikov: +2  Glad I could be there and feel very good about the result.
20:06:36 <ildikov> jungleboyj: +1 :)
20:07:08 <ildikov> I hope everyone from the mentors had a good time and hopefully we can improve the training further for Sydney
20:07:30 <diablo_rojo_phon> Hello :)
20:07:32 <vkmc> o/
20:07:34 <ildikov> #info we had 43 people showing up on Saturday and 34 on Sunday
20:07:34 <vkmc> hey
20:07:37 <jungleboyj> :-)
20:07:53 <ildikov> vkmc: diablo_rojo_phon: hey girls :)
20:08:06 <diablo_rojo_phon> :)
20:09:04 <ildikov> so we had less people than in Barcelona, but overall we had a good attendance
20:09:08 <jungleboyj> I wonder why we had fewer people on Sunday.  Felt like we had more.
20:09:26 <jungleboyj> It was a more engaged group than Barcelona.
20:09:31 <ildikov> jungleboyj: I felt that way too, most probably because we had a bit more mentors than on Saturday
20:09:32 <spotz> Wow I'm surprised with less on Sunday, there seemed like a lot of new faces
20:09:46 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Yep.
20:10:03 <spotz> I wonder if people just didn't sign in?
20:10:05 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Some of that may have been they were more vocal and comfortable approaching us?
20:10:08 <ildikov> and the round tables can easily give the impression of having more people than with the theatre style seating
20:10:16 <spotz> jungleboyj: maybe
20:10:48 <diablo_rojo_phon> spotz: we had people at the door basically the whole time both days I think.
20:11:02 <diablo_rojo_phon> And I tried to catch people that snuck in when the door wasn't manned.
20:11:07 <diablo_rojo_phon> Idk though.
20:11:11 <jungleboyj> Interesting.
20:11:49 <ildikov> I don't know either, especially as we changed the room setup it's really hard to tell
20:11:55 <diablo_rojo_phon> We can add a question to the survey asking if they didn't attend both days and why not if they didn't.
20:12:03 <jungleboyj> I saw people from the education though actively participating in sessions at the summit so that is good.
20:12:09 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo_phon:  +2
20:12:15 <ildikov> the next mission is to keep at least some of the people around
20:12:15 <spotz> I think that would be good feedback diablo_rojo_phon
20:12:38 <diablo_rojo_phon> Easy enough to add.
20:12:43 <ildikov> there are also a few workshops of the OpenStack Academy on Sunday and I think people might checked in to those as well
20:12:52 <ildikov> diablo_rojo_phon: +1
20:13:19 <ildikov> diablo_rojo_phon: should we jump into the feedback part of the agenda?
20:13:38 <diablo_rojo_phon> Sure.
20:13:42 <ildikov> #topic Attendee Survey
20:14:03 <ildikov> we sent out a survey to the students in Barcelona and we plan that this time as well
20:14:16 <ildikov> #link https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/upstream_training_feedback_survey
20:14:36 <ildikov> so feedback from you for the feedback survey would be pretty great :)
20:14:47 <diablo_rojo_phon> That and links to the slides and reminder of the 101 channel
20:15:06 <diablo_rojo_phon> I have some tweks to make based on slide deck name changes
20:15:26 <diablo_rojo_phon> And I will add the thing about attendance and why
20:15:28 <ildikov> our idea was basically trying to get some feedback for each block while requiring only a minimal amount of typing which might increase the willingness to fill it out
20:16:10 <ildikov> diablo_rojo_phon: sounds good, tnx
20:16:35 <jungleboyj> Yeah, the module names need to be updated.
20:16:59 <jungleboyj> I was going to ask about a text input on how to improve individual sections but that would go against the minimal typing thing.  ;-)
20:17:43 <jungleboyj> Jenkins -> OpenStack Project Status & Zuul
20:17:45 <ildikov> jungleboyj: we got only a few replies after Barcelona, so we might try to encourage people for that in the general what to improve and what to keep sections
20:17:59 <ildikov> but wouldn't add it to every block
20:18:15 <diablo_rojo_phon> Yeah I can change the phrasing  around things.
20:18:38 <jungleboyj> Ok, yeah, maybe text input at the bottom that solicities input on individual sections if they wish to do so.
20:19:06 <spotz> I like the survey
20:19:21 <diablo_rojo_phon> Can do.
20:19:28 <diablo_rojo_phon> Thanks spotz :)
20:19:43 <spotz> One question though, who determines the more important and less important content? Us or them?:)
20:19:44 <jungleboyj> Agreed.  Otherwise I like that is is easy and simple.
20:20:15 <vkmc> survey looks good!
20:20:25 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Good question.  :-)
20:20:31 <ildikov> spotz: I think we would like to understand what they feel as important
20:20:54 <diablo_rojo_phon> ildikov: +1
20:21:07 <spotz> ildikov: I don't think we ask them that though unless I missed it. I'll double check
20:21:13 <ildikov> spotz: and then we can tweak the material and how we present things to make other parts look important as well :)
20:21:13 <jungleboyj> 'How much time was spent covering the content that was important to you.'
20:21:17 <jungleboyj> Then ask what that was?
20:21:32 <jungleboyj> Could we do that?
20:21:40 <vkmc> jungleboyj++
20:21:50 <vkmc> yeah, we want to know what they consider more/less important
20:21:58 <spotz> We kinda have to, nothing above it seems to say hi I'm important:)
20:22:26 <jungleboyj> Might be implied by their other answers but I think those are the most important questions.
20:22:34 <ildikov> I think last time those who took the effort to give an answer there clarified it mostly
20:22:44 <jungleboyj> Good catch spotz I had glossed over that.
20:22:51 <ildikov> but we can add an extra field and ask it explicitely
20:23:04 <jungleboyj> ildikov: ++
20:23:06 <ildikov> until we don't add too many extra questions it should be good
20:23:12 <vkmc> ildikov++
20:23:39 <ildikov> as if the survey looks too much effort it will remain an open tab on their browser which will eventually get closed without submitting it...
20:23:40 <diablo_rojo_phon> Hahaha yeah. I will make the changes and then I'll have you all review one more time.
20:23:41 <vkmc> less/more important can be replied in one word... I think that people is more hesitant to reply if answers require more writing
20:23:57 <ildikov> vkmc: +1
20:24:02 <diablo_rojo_phon> I'll drop it in the upstream-institute channel when I'm done.
20:24:03 <jungleboyj> vkmc:  ++
20:24:04 <spotz> hey any chance of getting a drop down so they can just select?
20:24:19 <ildikov> diablo_rojo_phon: coolio, thank you!
20:24:22 <vkmc> spotz++
20:24:37 <vkmc> I like the dropdown idea
20:24:42 <diablo_rojo_phon> spotz: I can do radio buttons
20:25:09 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo_phon:  Can they do multiple selections with Radio Buttons?
20:25:10 <spotz> diablo_rojo_phon: That would work, just so they can select what they thing is more and less easily
20:25:18 <spotz> then answer
20:26:21 <vkmc> nope, radio buttons should be one selection
20:26:36 <diablo_rojo_phon> jungleboyj no, radio buttons are single selection. Let me see if I can do checkboxes
20:26:57 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo_phon:  That would be good.
20:27:34 <jungleboyj> Can we say that it looks like it will take 5 minutes or less to do the survey in the note sent out?  ;-)
20:27:42 <diablo_rojo> Turns out formstack can actually do dropdowns.
20:27:53 <diablo_rojo> jungleboyj, yep :) I can add that wording to the email.
20:28:28 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Ok.  Thanks.  Assuming it is still accurate.  Which I think it is.
20:29:49 <diablo_rojo> We didnt do the sanbox section right?
20:29:52 <diablo_rojo> *sandbox
20:29:55 <ildikov> jungleboyj: we just need to also keep it look like doable in less than 5 minutes :)
20:30:06 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Correct.
20:30:07 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: no
20:30:24 <diablo_rojo> Cool
20:31:09 <vkmc> we can put as a header... "estimated completion time: 5 minutes"
20:31:14 <vkmc> that will convince them
20:31:24 <smcginnis> hah
20:31:24 <vkmc> right? :D
20:31:35 <ildikov> vkmc: hmm :)
20:31:40 <ildikov> smcginnis: hi :)
20:31:46 <jungleboyj> vkmc:  If we can put your trustworthy face next to it, maybe.  ;-)
20:31:46 <smcginnis> o/
20:32:05 <ildikov> smcginnis: we're chatting about this survey: https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/upstream_training_feedback_survey
20:32:07 <vkmc> jungleboyj, me? haha
20:32:11 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, did we skip the OS as a Software and OS as a Community sections too?
20:32:14 <vkmc> they will trust because we are upstream university!
20:32:22 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  No, we did those.
20:32:22 <smcginnis> ildikov: Thanks. I've been lurking for a bit. :)
20:32:24 <ildikov> smcginnis: we want to send this out to the students asking for feedback about the training
20:32:25 <vkmc> s/university/institute/g
20:32:28 <diablo_rojo> jungleboyj, thanks
20:32:30 <ildikov> smcginnis: haha, ok :)
20:32:31 <diablo_rojo> couldnt remember
20:32:43 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  You were out at that time I think.
20:32:55 <diablo_rojo> Might have been still trying to get tables
20:33:02 <jungleboyj> :-)
20:33:11 <jungleboyj> Fires fires, everywhere.
20:33:11 <spotz> heheh
20:33:26 <diablo_rojo> jungleboyj, day one that was the case
20:33:29 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: I ran through those first ones quickly as part of the intro block
20:33:58 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: I think we can skip the introduction question though
20:34:14 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: no matter what people say we need to introduce ourselves anyhow :)
20:34:16 <jungleboyj> ildikov: ++ that shortens things up.
20:34:31 <jungleboyj> I also felt like the way we handled that was much better.
20:34:59 <diablo_rojo> Almost done making changes. few more min
20:35:03 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: we had the Metrics one this time
20:35:17 <ildikov> jungleboyj: +1
20:36:18 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: we can have the OS as Software and as Community one question maybe as they are short intro blocks
20:36:28 <ildikov> so we can have the survey look shorter still
20:36:50 <jungleboyj> ildikov: ++
20:37:06 <jungleboyj> So just collapse the first section into one question?
20:37:34 <smcginnis> That makes sense to me.
20:37:36 <ildikov> jungleboyj: remove the Introduction and collapse the remaining two
20:38:00 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Right, I think that makes sense.
20:38:01 <ildikov> jungleboyj: if there were no exercises we could even skip that part, but we do, so let's see what people think about that
20:38:12 <jungleboyj> ++
20:38:51 <ildikov> anything else for the survey?
20:39:47 <jungleboyj> We'll see how it looks now.  :-)
20:40:22 <diablo_rojo> refresh and you should see the updates
20:41:18 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: can the drop down list fixed to show the very helpful option by default? :)
20:41:37 <diablo_rojo> Ha ha I have to go through and reorder the options but yes I can do that
20:41:54 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: if you think it makes sense
20:42:29 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Yeah ... lets flip the order.  ;-)
20:42:32 <ildikov> I don't want to influence people, but they might get more into constructive mode if they see the more positive option first
20:43:00 <ildikov> it didn't matter with the radio buttons as you could see all of them at the same time anyway
20:43:13 <vkmc> this is a nit but... "Which modules do you feel were more unimportant?*" s/more unimportant/less important/g
20:43:29 <smcginnis> vkmc: +1
20:43:35 <diablo_rojo> This is tedious AF lol
20:43:52 <diablo_rojo> vkmc, oops I can fix that
20:44:01 <smcginnis> Can we default all the drop down responses to "Helpful" or "NA"?
20:44:35 <smcginnis> Just thinking if they get there and then decide they don't really care, if they just hit submit there will be a few as Very Helpful and a bunch as Not Helpful.
20:44:47 <smcginnis> Safer to have a more neutral default response maybe?
20:45:02 <ildikov> smcginnis: yeah, makes sense
20:45:18 <vkmc> smcginnis++
20:45:19 <diablo_rojo> smcginnis, suuuuure right after I get done changing every one of them ;)
20:45:43 <vkmc> diablo_rojo, <3
20:45:57 <ildikov> :)
20:46:02 <ildikov> ok, we have 15 minutes left from the meeting
20:46:07 <jungleboyj> So, We don't have a 1 to 1 match between the modules on the web page and the Helpful/Not Helpful list.  Is that on purpose?
20:46:19 <smcginnis> diablo_rojo: (｡◕‿◕｡)
20:46:26 <diablo_rojo> smcginnis, :P
20:46:32 <diablo_rojo> @!
20:46:39 <smcginnis> No bot for you!
20:46:40 <diablo_rojo> Oh sad the bot isnt here?
20:46:43 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Yeah, I was just wishing we had that in here.
20:47:01 <ildikov> let's finish the survey on the channel and get into a bit of a retrospective in case there are more comments we could'should add to the etherpad
20:47:01 <jungleboyj> (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
20:47:04 <spotz> heheh
20:47:04 <jungleboyj> There you go.
20:47:19 <diablo_rojo> ┻━┻ ︵ヽ(`Д´)ﾉ︵ ┻━┻
20:47:37 <ildikov> Monday meetings rock! :)
20:47:40 * jungleboyj would like to see that.
20:47:41 <smcginnis> What have I done? :)
20:47:53 <jungleboyj> smcginnis: Watch out.
20:47:59 <ildikov> smcginnis: it wasn't you, it was me :)
20:48:03 <smcginnis> hah
20:48:05 <diablo_rojo> smcginnis, you are making me change something I just spent ten min changing ;)
20:48:20 <diablo_rojo> smcginnis, ildikov I blame you both ;)
20:48:29 <smcginnis> hehe
20:48:44 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: you can blame me any time
20:48:46 <ildikov> :)
20:48:56 <ildikov> ok, let's retrospect
20:49:46 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: or maybe the non-attendee survey idea first
20:50:15 <smcginnis> It would be great to know why some weren't able to attend.
20:50:41 <jungleboyj> smcginnis:  ++
20:51:07 <spotz> ++
20:51:40 <ildikov> sometimes I feel like asking the opposite TBH :)
20:51:53 <ildikov> but we can send out a quick email and ask why they finally didn't come
20:51:53 <diablo_rojo> I would guess it is mostly because people didnt realize it was the weekend before and their companies wouldnt fund the weekend before too
20:52:02 <mrhillsman> ^
20:52:08 <ildikov> I have a few responses who couldn't figure out travel
20:52:13 <diablo_rojo> Not sure we have enough to ask to warrant a whole survey
20:52:34 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: I would only send a mail with one question
20:52:42 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, +1
20:52:43 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: I can draft it after the meeting
20:53:16 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  I think that makes sense if it is a small number.
20:53:56 <ildikov> jungleboyj: 20-ish people
20:54:15 <ildikov> we just don't have that much to ask about why they didn't come
20:54:41 <ildikov> they only thing we can do better is visualizing and advertising it better it's the weekend before
20:55:10 <ildikov> although when people signed up it was with the right date in the agenda, so I'm not sure how much we can help
20:55:34 <ildikov> we surely need to fix the graphics on the web that shows the main activities during the event as that diagram shows only Sunday
20:55:41 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, +1
20:55:44 <ildikov> I will bring it up to the team
20:56:03 * diablo_rojo finished updating the survey again..
20:56:10 <jungleboyj> ildikov: Sounds good.  Lets e-mail and see what we get.
20:56:22 <vkmc> diablo_rojo++
20:56:52 * jungleboyj refreshes
20:56:53 <spotz> Maybe social media?
20:57:17 <smcginnis> 3 minutes
20:57:21 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: looks good, tnx
20:57:24 <ildikov> smcginnis: tnx
20:57:49 <spotz> Do we want to ask which day they attend? Sat, Sun, or both?
20:58:10 <jungleboyj> (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
20:58:14 <diablo_rojo> spotz, I dont think we will really do anything with that info
20:58:21 <diablo_rojo> but I can add it if you think its important
20:58:31 <diablo_rojo> We are already asking them a LOT
20:58:38 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: +1
20:58:41 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  +1
20:58:47 <ildikov> let's focus on the content more
20:59:03 <spotz> I'd be curious if we lost them due to content, we could just changte the did you attend both days to which days did you attend with 2 responses
20:59:05 <diablo_rojo> Honestly I am feeling like we can take out the how helpfuls.. since we have the importance stuff
20:59:07 <ildikov> the bigger issue is that they don't stick around even f we can get them in the room for two days
20:59:18 <ildikov> but let's figure it out on the channel and/or next week
20:59:24 <diablo_rojo> spotz, I think they can add that in the short answer asking why they didnt go to both
20:59:32 <spotz> ok
20:59:43 <diablo_rojo> Good question though :)
21:00:19 <ildikov> ok let's move to the channel, time's up :)
21:00:28 <ildikov> #endmeeting