15:01:10 <serverascode> #startmeeting operators_telco_nfv
15:01:11 <openstack> Meeting started Wed Jun 28 15:01:10 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is serverascode. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:01:12 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
15:01:14 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'operators_telco_nfv'
15:01:20 <serverascode> hi all :)
15:01:26 <shintaro> hi serverascode
15:01:26 <ad_rien_> o/
15:01:31 <ad_rien_> hi serverascode
15:01:37 <ad_rien_> hi shintaro
15:01:53 <shintaro> hi ad_rien
15:02:10 <serverascode> ok I'll just give it another minute or so and we can get started
15:03:02 <serverascode> #topic What to do with this working group?
15:03:18 <serverascode> ok so the only thing I have on the agenda is what to do with this owrking group
15:03:34 <serverascode> we just haven't quite ever got the attendance of openstack operators doing nfv work
15:03:39 <serverascode> which isn't necessarily a bad thing
15:03:41 <serverascode> we gave it a shot
15:03:50 <shintaro> I think it is valuable to have a place to discuss about NFV topics
15:04:17 <shintaro> just we need more attendance, I agree
15:04:26 <serverascode> shintaro: sure, but the original idea was for operators, and they just don't really come to these kind of meetings
15:04:33 <PerfectChaos> Hi all
15:04:36 <ad_rien_> Maybe a last tentative can consist in contacting the OpenSTack Foundation (Ildiko for instance)
15:04:38 <serverascode> we can do something else, but I don't think the orig idea is quite owrking out
15:04:52 <ad_rien_> in order to ask whether telcos want to join/participate/contribute to this WG.
15:05:23 <ad_rien_> It seems telcos invest a lot in OpenNFV
15:05:28 <serverascode> my initial thought was to perhaps move to being a subgroup of LCOO
15:05:38 <shintaro> There use to be many telco ppl in the summmit
15:05:47 <ad_rien_> so maybe knowing the position of the OpenStack foundation regarding that point can be valuable
15:06:00 <serverascode> ad_rien_ good piont
15:06:10 <serverascode> also the whole change working groups into SIGS is going on too
15:06:21 <shintaro> I know LCOO has AT&T, Orange, NTT at least
15:06:48 <ad_rien_> serverascode:  I saw a couple of exchanges but not sure I got the whole idea of SIGs yets
15:06:55 <ad_rien_> s/yets/yet sorry
15:07:10 <shintaro> me neither
15:07:21 <serverascode> I don't completely understand it either, but my impression is that they want to rebrand working gruops as SIGS
15:07:30 <ad_rien_> I mean SIG is just another way to entitle a WG (i.e. a group of persons that are common interests)
15:07:33 <serverascode> and I don't know what that would end up looking like
15:08:18 <serverascode> do people think having a meeitng like this is worthwhile? but perhaps under different conditions?
15:08:20 <shintaro> What I heard in the forum was SIGs are focused on one topic and after finishing the goal, they finish the SIG
15:08:20 <ad_rien_> More generally, I get the feeling that the issue of attracting recurrent people in WGs is a shared issue?
15:08:32 <ad_rien_> ok
15:08:41 <ad_rien_> shintaro: I heard that also
15:09:28 <ad_rien_> once again, I think we can make an email to the OpenStack foundation to ask whether they have also seen that trends
15:09:36 <ad_rien_> (or if it is just related to some WGs)
15:10:05 <ad_rien_> The performance meetings are less dynamic/efficient/fruitful that what we used to have for the last two cycles
15:10:10 <ad_rien_> for instance
15:10:20 <serverascode> ad_rien_ so you think an email to the foundation to find out what to do with working groups?
15:10:32 <ad_rien_> I also took part to the Large Scale meeting last week
15:10:36 <ad_rien_> we were three
15:10:42 <ad_rien_> not minutes
15:10:51 <ad_rien_> not sure what will be the outputs of those meetings
15:11:08 <ad_rien_> I can be wrong but I have the feeling that several meetings can be merged to have more fruitful exchanges
15:11:20 <ad_rien_> i.e. less meetings but more effective ones
15:11:22 <serverascode> ad_rien_ I have that feeling too
15:11:46 <shintaro> agree, too
15:11:49 <ad_rien_> s/not minutes/no minute (once again sorry for typos)
15:12:18 <ad_rien_> so we can write an email to Thierry, Marc, Jonathan, Ildiko just to get their feelings.
15:12:36 <ad_rien_> Once we get their feedbacks and according to their answers we can send an email on the dev mailing list?
15:12:52 <serverascode> ok I like that idea
15:12:56 <serverascode> who wants to take that on?
15:12:58 <serverascode> :)
15:13:03 <ad_rien_> I can do it
15:13:07 <shintaro> cross WG meeting isn't happening yet. I wonder hat happened.
15:13:34 <ad_rien_> (I mean I plan to have an informal meeting with ttx to deal with all those questions, including the cross wg meeting Shintaro is highlighting)
15:13:55 <ad_rien_> we can use the next slot and invite TTX
15:14:05 <ad_rien_> or we can iterate by mail and I can put you in CC
15:14:06 <ad_rien_> ?
15:14:21 <serverascode> so ask him to come to the next occurance of this meeting?
15:14:51 <ad_rien_> yes, this can be the solution (keeping in mind that we are going to start the vacation period). Maybe the attendance/contributors issue is just related to general WGs.
15:15:09 <ad_rien_> Are Core component WGs still active?
15:15:12 <serverascode> hmm, perhaps email would be better
15:15:47 <ad_rien_> According to the dev mailing It seems that there is still lot of traffic/discussions/...
15:16:24 <ad_rien_> From our side (FEMDC WG), we have defined two (three) activities and things are moving forward, slowly but forward...
15:16:49 <ad_rien_> but the same, with more particpants we can do better stuff
15:17:31 <shintaro> LCOO is starting to push several items forward, too, but yes it would be better if we have more people
15:17:49 <serverascode> ok, I think this is good timing to make some changes
15:17:51 <ad_rien_> This cross meeting is really something that can help us to move forward
15:17:56 <serverascode> I think it would be best to start some kind of email exchange
15:18:04 <serverascode> and not try to get people to a meeting
15:18:57 <ad_rien_> It would be great to get more information from jamey
15:19:01 <shintaro> I think jamemcc should have some idea
15:19:20 <serverascode> he mentioned he would be here today but doesn't seem to have quite made it
15:20:14 <serverascode> so are we suggesting that the upcoming (?) cross wg meeitng is a good place to discuss this topic as well?
15:20:27 <shintaro> +1
15:20:53 <serverascode> ok, and we don't quite have all the details on that yet, is that right? I haven't seen anything but haven't been paying great attention
15:21:37 <ad_rien_> same from my side
15:22:03 <serverascode> ok, so I guess our first step is to get some information on that meeting :)
15:22:25 <serverascode> and I suppose the vacation times will get in the way a bit too
15:22:28 <ad_rien_> jamemcc:  ?
15:22:39 <ad_rien_> are you online?
15:24:01 <serverascode> ok, so lets do this: 1) we will find out more information about the upcomming cross-wg meeting and 2) if that is not working out we will start some kind of email thread on how to make some changes to improve attendance and communication, perhaps by merging some meetings
15:24:39 <serverascode> does that make sense?
15:24:41 <shintaro> +1
15:24:45 <ad_rien_> I can send a first informal email to TTX just to have his feedback
15:24:59 <serverascode> ok that's a good idea too
15:24:59 <ad_rien_> putting you (serverascode) and shintaro in CC
15:25:07 <serverascode> cool
15:25:10 <shintaro> thanks
15:25:12 <serverascode> I think that is a good start :)
15:25:29 <serverascode> anyone have anything else to discuss? thoughts? ideas?
15:25:56 <serverascode> otherwise I have no other topics and we can end the meeting
15:26:01 <ad_rien_> Just let him know that we gonna probably stop the WG due to the lack of attendance and we have the feeling that this is an issue that appears in several WGs (at least the one we are used to participate in)
15:26:10 <ad_rien_> no
15:26:17 <ad_rien_> from my side
15:26:27 <ad_rien_> It would be a pitty to stop this WG
15:26:28 <serverascode> also, thank you all for coming to these meetings, I really appreciate your time :)
15:26:29 <ad_rien_> once agin
15:26:38 <shintaro> I'm ok, thank you
15:27:00 <ad_rien_> I mean we all know that NFV is an important use-case
15:27:09 <ad_rien_> maybe there is another point that we should consider
15:27:18 <ad_rien_> solutions like kubernetes?
15:27:19 <serverascode> ad_rien_ I don't think we'll completely stop it, just change it into something that works and ha the right mission
15:27:25 <serverascode> *has the right mission
15:27:33 <shintaro> BTW I'm planning to attend OpsMeetup in Mexico and I found one session proposal for NFV
15:27:46 <serverascode> yeah I put that in :)
15:27:48 <ad_rien_> yes… but LCCO is also targetting extreme testing etc....
15:28:12 <ad_rien_> I attended several workshops/events/conferences during the three last weeks
15:28:31 <shintaro> +1 serverascode :0
15:28:37 <shintaro> :)
15:28:48 <ad_rien_> Some people argued that OpenStack does not allow to deal with containers and thus is probably not the best player for NFV use-cases
15:29:17 <ad_rien_> the other aspect is that ESTI considers OpenStack just as a simple VIM (Virtual Infrastructure Manager) and wants to reimplement the wheel on top of OpenStack
15:29:25 <ad_rien_> i.e. they use OpenStack as libvirt
15:29:30 <ad_rien_> i.e. start/shutdown a VM
15:29:45 <ad_rien_> and all the advanced features is down at higher level on top of OpenStack
15:29:53 <shintaro> yes, more effort are put on higher layer like ONAP
15:30:02 <ad_rien_> yes… but if you dive into details
15:30:18 <ad_rien_> you will see that they have to reimplement a lot of mechanisms that is already available at low levels...
15:30:22 <ad_rien_> too weird...
15:30:39 <serverascode> yeah my impression is that kuberentes works best on top of IaaS like OpenStack
15:30:45 <ad_rien_> because the higher level should deal with regions, load balancing, HA ….
15:30:59 <ad_rien_> ok I wil write an email to TTX
15:31:07 <serverascode> awesome
15:31:15 <serverascode> ok thanks for attending all :)
15:31:19 <serverascode> I will end the meeting
15:31:20 <shintaro> thank you!
15:31:35 <serverascode> #endmeeting