21:29:53 <ShillaSaebi> #startmeeting ops_guide 21:29:54 <openstack> Meeting started Thu May 5 21:29:53 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ShillaSaebi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 21:29:55 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 21:29:57 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'ops_guide' 21:29:59 <ShillaSaebi> hi everyone 21:30:04 <ShillaSaebi> sorry about the confusion earlier 21:30:11 <DevonBoatwright> Hello! 21:30:13 <ShillaSaebi> anyone here from the ops guide/arch guide group 21:30:16 <ShillaSaebi> hi DevonBoatwright 21:31:16 <DevonBoatwright> Is it just us? 21:31:36 <ShillaSaebi> im not sure 21:31:36 <shaunom> Its very quiet. 21:31:38 <ShillaSaebi> anyone else here? 21:31:41 <ShillaSaebi> hi shaunom 21:31:58 <shaunom> Hi ShillSaebi 21:31:58 <ShillaSaebi> anyone else here for the ops/arch guide meeting? 21:33:43 <ShillaSaebi> ok looks like its the 3 of us 21:33:48 <ShillaSaebi> lets go ahead and get started 21:34:44 <ShillaSaebi> #topic Summit debrief 21:34:52 <ShillaSaebi> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/austin-docs-newtonplan 21:34:57 <ShillaSaebi> these are the deliverables for Newton 21:35:01 <ShillaSaebi> you can see the ops/arch guide section at the top 21:35:09 <ShillaSaebi> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/AUS-ops-Docs-ops-guide 21:36:06 <ShillaSaebi> So the RST conversion has been completed and the ops-guide has been migrated to openstack-manuals 21:36:41 <ShillaSaebi> we should establish a list of operator tasks #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-arch-tasks 21:38:38 <rstarmer> OpsGuid discussion? Sorry I joined late, I've got poor connectivity this week. 21:38:38 <shaunom> So we have started a review for the blueprint arch-guide-restructure https://review.openstack.org/#/c/311998/ 21:39:17 <rstarmer> shaunom: there's a lot to review, I hope to be able to get through it this week :) 21:39:35 <ShillaSaebi> hello yes 21:39:41 <ShillaSaebi> thanks for joining 21:40:12 <ShillaSaebi> We're also looking for volunteers to to identify outdated content or content to be removed... 21:40:23 <ShillaSaebi> Feedback can be added to #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-guide-reorg 21:40:41 <ShillaSaebi> I hope to carve some time out next week to work on some of this stuff 21:41:10 <DevonBoatwright> I can help with that, too 21:42:21 <ShillaSaebi> awesome! thanks @DevonBoatwright 21:42:26 <rstarmer> during the summit we discussed trying to get to a "task focused" view of operations, possibly with tags to correlate data into the chapters that Shaun and Darren pulled together during the friday meetup at the summit. 21:42:56 <ShillaSaebi> DarrenC is currently in an internal meeting but should be joining here in a couple of minutes 21:44:20 <shaunom> I am busy with and update that explains the chapter structure a little better, will hopefully provide more clarity. 21:44:55 <shaunom> I would like to discuss the tagging idea further. 21:45:06 <rstarmer> shaunom: I'm happy to review as you get something together. I'm finding I have about an hour these days to try to contribute. 21:46:29 <ShillaSaebi> ditto 21:46:31 <shaunom> rstarmer: Thats great, I have had a fair bit of airline time to think during the last week. 21:46:38 <ShillaSaebi> nice 21:46:51 <rstarmer> tagging is something that I still feel can be useful, especially if we can define a set of obvious tags for things. even if there's no real support in the web ui (as there was apparently at one point for tags at the project level), it would be useful as a piece of the backend to pull topics into multiple "example" streams. 21:47:05 <shaunom> +1 21:48:15 <ShillaSaebi> +1 21:48:42 <darrenc> hi everyone 21:48:58 <ShillaSaebi> hi darrenc 21:48:59 * darrenc reads backwards 21:48:59 <ShillaSaebi> welcome! 21:49:58 <darrenc> sorry, can you explain what you mean by tagging? 21:50:45 <shaunom> The basic idea is to associate information across the various guides by utilising a searchable tagging mechanism. 21:51:01 <rstarmer> what shaunom: said :) 21:51:19 <ShillaSaebi> yeah and that was to replace the TOC right? 21:51:24 <ShillaSaebi> or would it be in addition to it 21:51:26 <rstarmer> even if we can't search for tags, they could be useful for grouping task based chunks into topic areas 21:51:43 <rstarmer> yeah, and there might be a hierarchy that comes out of that 21:51:44 <shaunom> IMO it wouldn't replace the TOC 21:51:53 <shaunom> but support it. 21:52:14 <rstarmer> for example, you could have solution tags, that might be equivalent to a TOC, and then task area tags, that woudl fit under a solution 21:52:39 <rstarmer> e.g. public vs. private solutions, and compute scale vs. multi-hypervisor support tags as part of the compute domain 21:52:54 <ShillaSaebi> ok 21:52:59 <ShillaSaebi> yeah that makes sense 21:53:01 <darrenc> yep ok 21:53:03 <ShillaSaebi> +1 21:53:05 <rstarmer> I agre, you'd still want a general table of contents, basically waht's in the etherpad ATM. 21:53:57 <shaunom> yup 21:54:00 <ShillaSaebi> ok 21:54:01 <rstarmer> if someone wants to describe an operational task, e.g adding logging to compute instances, that might get a public, and private tag, along with a compute tag, and a hypervisor specific tag, like kvm or vmware. 21:54:12 <rstarmer> and a logging tag. 21:55:15 <rstarmer> then someone interested in logging would be able to search for (or we might have to do some fancy work on the backend baring a seacrh process) to look at all the logging related tasks, and at somepoint, if filtering system was in place, if someone determined something was only useful for private vs. public clouds, you could exclude tasks that were likely not useful for a particular operating type 21:55:48 <ShillaSaebi> ok 21:56:24 <ShillaSaebi> i like the way this is going 21:56:47 <darrenc> right, so we would have a bunch of meta tags in our source files 21:56:54 <ShillaSaebi> ok 21:56:57 <rstarmer> initially, I'd just suggest we incorporate a tag strucutre, based initially on the TOC to each task that gets creatd, we can see if there's already enough flexability in the only documentation presentation engine to do specific search/filtering capabilites. 21:57:01 <rstarmer> yep 21:57:23 <shaunom> +1 21:58:43 <darrenc> We would need to talk to Andeas Jaeger or Christian about that 21:59:04 <ShillaSaebi> ok 21:59:25 <shaunom> Should we start a etherpad on the topic? 21:59:42 <ShillaSaebi> sure we can do that 21:59:48 <darrenc> yep 22:00:34 <shaunom> https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/docs-tagging 22:01:20 <ShillaSaebi> cool thanks! 22:03:11 <ShillaSaebi> once we get some content in here, we can send this off to Andreas and Christian for approval? 22:03:15 <ShillaSaebi> or should we do it beforehand 22:03:52 <darrenc> I think gather our thoughts on the etherpad, then mention it on the docs mailing list 22:03:58 <ShillaSaebi> ok 22:04:01 <ShillaSaebi> we can do that 22:04:42 <darrenc> If we get consensus on this, then we or Andreas can draft a spec to implement changes 22:05:37 <ShillaSaebi> awesome 22:05:41 <darrenc> I don't think we'll get anyone opposing this 22:05:55 <shaunom> I am in Germany for the next two weeks, so I can also try and touchbase with him in his timezone. 22:06:02 <ShillaSaebi> oh sweet 22:07:25 <shaunom> On a different point, and coming back to the TOC for the arch guide. 22:07:51 <shaunom> I am going to push another patch to the review with a bit more explanation base on the feedback so far. 22:08:01 <shaunom> Are the any questions I can answer now? 22:08:15 <shaunom> *there 22:08:23 <ShillaSaebi> i cant think of any as of right now 22:08:32 <DevonBoatwright> No questions from me 22:08:59 <darrenc> none from me 22:09:55 <ShillaSaebi> awesome 22:10:00 <ShillaSaebi> is there anything else anyone wants to bring up 22:10:35 <shaunom> not from me 22:10:59 <darrenc> did we discuss finding other ops volunteers to help with the ops guide? 22:11:34 <darrenc> I think put the call out on the ops mailing list 22:11:45 <ShillaSaebi> yeah we need to 22:11:54 <ShillaSaebi> so DevonBoatwright and I have tried in the past 22:11:56 <ShillaSaebi> anyone else want to give it a shot? heh 22:12:02 <ShillaSaebi> might have better luck 22:12:53 <DevonBoatwright> Yea, no one really answered it, did they? :( 22:13:01 <ShillaSaebi> nope 22:13:02 <ShillaSaebi> heh 22:13:19 <shaunom> I can try asking internally, but no promises. 22:13:39 <darrenc> another thing we discussed at summit was attending the ops meetings 22:15:02 <darrenc> It would be a good opportunity find volunteers 22:15:05 <darrenc> to* 22:16:09 <ShillaSaebi> ok 22:16:17 <ShillaSaebi> i can add it to our cal and try to join 22:16:54 <ShillaSaebi> ok anything else anyone wants to bring up for this week? 22:16:54 <darrenc> yep, sounds good 22:17:00 <DevonBoatwright> I don't mind joining, too 22:17:34 <darrenc> well, I'm not clear on what our approach with the ops-guide should be? 22:17:41 <ShillaSaebi> awesome thanks @DevonBoatwright 22:17:54 <ShillaSaebi> I think we were suppose to go through the ops and arch guide to find duplicate info 22:18:04 <ShillaSaebi> and then also identify outdated info 22:20:15 <darrenc> Ok, so perhaps we ask for volunteers on the mailing list for help 22:20:29 <darrenc> and everyone can jot their thoughts in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-guide-reorg 22:20:58 <ShillaSaebi> awesome 22:21:07 <ShillaSaebi> hopefully we'll get some volunteers! 22:21:07 <darrenc> and we can look at the etherpad at our next meeting 22:21:22 <ShillaSaebi> we have some others too that are willing to help 22:21:25 <ShillaSaebi> Vic and Nate 22:21:36 <ShillaSaebi> but I sent them the wrong cal invite from the ics file 22:21:39 <ShillaSaebi> my bad :\ 22:21:45 <DevonBoatwright> lol 22:21:45 <ShillaSaebi> so hopefully that wont happen for the next wknd 22:21:45 <darrenc> and then create bugs or work items list for all the changes 22:21:49 <ShillaSaebi> yes 22:22:55 <darrenc> Ok, I'll send a message on the ops and docs mailing list 22:24:48 <DevonBoatwright> ok, I have an appt so I need to leave. 22:25:32 <ShillaSaebi> ok cool sounds good 22:25:34 <ShillaSaebi> well we are about out of time 22:25:37 <ShillaSaebi> thanks everyone for joining 22:25:40 <DevonBoatwright> See yall. 22:25:43 <DevonBoatwright> Thanks Shilla! 22:25:48 <rstarmer> thanks! 22:25:50 <shaunom> Thanks 22:25:50 <ShillaSaebi> thanks all! 22:25:51 <darrenc> thanks 22:25:54 <ShillaSaebi> #endmeeting