16:03:46 <sridhar_ram> #startmeeting tacker
16:03:47 <openstack> Meeting started Thu Sep  3 16:03:46 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is sridhar_ram. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:03:48 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
16:03:51 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'tacker'
16:03:58 <sridhar_ram> #chair bobh
16:03:59 <openstack> Current chairs: bobh sridhar_ram
16:04:05 <sridhar_ram> s3wong here ?
16:04:18 <sridhar_ram> #topic Announcements
16:04:18 <vkss> hi
16:04:37 <sridhar_ram> Agenda #link  https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Tacker#Meeting_Sep_3.2C_2015
16:05:16 <sridhar_ram> if any last minute items .. please speak up now
16:05:33 <bobh> looks good
16:05:51 <sridhar_ram> Switch over to master is now complete..!
16:05:58 <sridhar_ram> See #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/073447.html
16:06:23 <sridhar_ram> Follow latest install instruction for master based tacker - #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Tacker/Installation
16:07:01 <sridhar_ram> As discussed in the midcycle .. Tacker dev process is getting documented in this review #link https://review.openstack.org/219012
16:07:28 <sridhar_ram> Please review when you get a chance ...!
16:08:02 <sripriya> sridhar_ram: what happens to the patchsets in flight which are being tested with kilo branch
16:08:53 <sridhar_ram> sripriya: unfortunately .. they need to be retest w/ latest master based tacker
16:09:09 <sripriya> sridhar_ram: ok
16:09:21 <sridhar_ram> sripriya: there is no other way around .. hopefully this is one-time pain that we never need to visit again
16:09:37 <sripriya> sridhar_ram: agree
16:10:13 <sridhar_ram> Folks - don't trip yourself using your existing tree .. it is worth a switch to a clean master based devstack
16:10:34 <sridhar_ram> lets move on..
16:10:47 <s3wong> hello
16:10:50 <sridhar_ram> s3wong: hi, morning... good timing
16:11:02 <sridhar_ram> #topic Experiment Features
16:11:15 <sridhar_ram> #topic Experimental Features
16:12:46 <sridhar_ram> We are entering a phase we will be trying new areas to expand to the intended scope of Tacker ..
16:12:56 <sridhar_ram> ... to be the ETSI MANO NFVO + VNFM ..
16:13:51 <sridhar_ram> obviously the areas in the NFVO space are still evolving fast - both in the standards side and in the dependent components ..
16:14:27 <sridhar_ram> One thought is to allow these new features enough space to incubate within Tacker
16:14:49 <sridhar_ram> The proposal I've is to follow the origin neutron's experimental feature model
16:15:10 <vkss> but not much work there
16:15:31 <sridhar_ram> neutron advanced services like fwaas, vpnaas, etc were once experimental before they graduate into mainstream features
16:15:52 <sridhar_ram> vkss: sorry, I didn't get it... what you mean ?
16:16:39 <sridhar_ram> I'm proposing the following two new experimental features - (a) SFC (b) NFVO...
16:16:52 <vkss> the advanced services there are very basic
16:16:59 <vkss> ok
16:17:17 <bobh> sridhar_ram: Is there a link that describes the neutron model?
16:17:21 <sridhar_ram> we can allow these feature to evolve as experimental features .. which means we don't guarantee backward compatibility
16:18:40 <sridhar_ram> bobh: I don't remember they are explicitly written down .. I'll try look if such a thing exists
16:19:22 <sridhar_ram> vkss: yeah, they kinda look basic now.. but once it was outside the original basic l2 + l3 boundary of neutron...
16:19:24 <vkss> sridhar_ram, how u re proposing to start with?
16:19:25 <s3wong> bobh, sridhar_ram: it was done via documentation (Neutron official APIs)
16:20:12 <s3wong> once they were split into their own repo, Neutron --- being integrated release --- do NOT put FWaaS, LBaaSv2 and VPNaaS as part of the integrated release list of libraries
16:21:03 <sridhar_ram> I'm open for ideas .. I'm of the opinion we need to create these new features within tacker repo itself .. just mark in the documentation, like s3wong said, that these are deemed 'experimental'
16:21:28 <s3wong> sridhar_ram: I am NOT advocating creating separate repo. Tacker isn't big enough to do that yet
16:21:34 <s3wong> I am just stating how
16:21:54 <s3wong> 'experimental' was handled back in Neutron old days, and how it is much more refined on the new day
16:22:03 <vkss> i have work on fwaas also can help with vpnaas
16:22:18 <sridhar_ram> s3wong: agree, we still need the code base to evolve in the correct way ...
16:22:34 <vkss> but we need to work on details how to intergrate with tacker
16:23:25 <bobh> s3wong: so these would be additional API calls that are documented as experimental
16:23:43 <sridhar_ram> vkss: sorry if I got this wrong, it is not about Tacker integrating w/ fwaas or vpnaas ... it is just about the development model for new bleeding edge features\
16:24:00 <s3wong> bobh: well, technically we don't have any release process and release document, so it is up to how we want to define 'experimental'
16:24:34 <vkss> sridhar_ram, ok will talk to u after meeting
16:24:35 <bobh> s3wong: right - just trying to avoid the inevitable "this used to work and now it doesn't"
16:24:44 <s3wong> bobh: and since we are also technically not an OpenStack big tent project, release management doesn't really care to give us a fixed guideline :-)
16:25:01 <sridhar_ram> bobh: s3wong: I think documentation is a fine way to communicate this..
16:25:05 <bobh> s3wong: :-)  There are benefits to being outside the tent
16:25:30 <sridhar_ram> s3wong: agree, however we need to operator we are indeed a proper project under the governance tent :)
16:25:38 <sridhar_ram> s/operator/operate/
16:26:37 <sridhar_ram> first feature we can try this approach could be what Tim Rozet has done for SFC ...
16:26:52 <s3wong> sridhar_ram: yeah, I believe 'experimental' back in Neutron old days is just documentation (though I could be wrong -- but I never saw anything in code that mark anything experiemental
16:27:00 <sridhar_ram> we need to enable such "relevant" experiments in Tacker .. for us to trive
16:27:43 <vishwanathj> sridhar_ram, +1
16:28:07 <sridhar_ram> vishwanathj: thanks
16:28:39 <sridhar_ram> any further thoughts on this ... ?
16:29:11 <bobh> documentation of the capabilites would be good to have
16:29:21 <bobh> but I know it's still very early
16:29:37 <bobh> so not much to go on
16:30:05 <sridhar_ram> bobh: yeah, we need to catchup on the docs ...
16:30:14 <sripriya_> +1
16:30:36 <sridhar_ram> sripriya: in fact MANO api work needs to end up in docs.openstack.org
16:31:17 <sripriya_> sridhar_ram: agree, it is a pending task as part of work items in api spec
16:31:40 <sridhar_ram> bobh: point taken, we can make sure to communicate these features as experimental until we have something in the docs..
16:31:57 <sridhar_ram> in fact we have a devref in the source tree mentioning them as such
16:32:05 <sridhar_ram> *we can have
16:32:51 <sridhar_ram> anyway I'll send an email to ML for any further comments .. we can continue further thoughts over in that thread
16:33:06 <sridhar_ram> lets move on..
16:33:29 <sridhar_ram> #topic Tacker-SFC
16:33:38 <sridhar_ram> trozet: ping
16:34:18 <sridhar_ram> I can provide a quick update on this...
16:34:37 <sridhar_ram> some of the Tacker members attended the last OPNFV-SFC meeting
16:35:14 <sridhar_ram> we discussed how we can bring in what Tim has experimented in his github to do Tacker --> ODL-SFC
16:35:36 <sridhar_ram> Tim is willing to contribute that back into tacker repo
16:36:08 <sridhar_ram> I expect a tacker-spec from Tim .. and we should plan to review / guide that effort as one of the first experimental features in Tacker
16:36:32 <bobh> sounds like a good plan
16:36:49 <sridhar_ram> bobh: thanks
16:37:18 <sripriya_> sridhar_ram: i will look out for the spec and help with that
16:37:32 <sridhar_ram> sripriya_: cool, thanks
16:39:04 <sridhar_ram> we need to guide that effort such that the SFC APIs are generic enough (it need not be perfect - remember it is experimental ;-) .. and the implementation proposal should gel well with the rest of the Tacker codebase (perhaps as a proper tacker extension)
16:39:25 <sridhar_ram> BTW, for some understandable (!) reasons, SFC invokes lots of strong opinions...
16:40:20 <sridhar_ram> But I would suggest we bias ourselves to get "something" done... rather than going in circles
16:41:21 <sridhar_ram> once the spec lands ... we should plan to have Tim join this call for further questtions..
16:41:29 <sridhar_ram> anything else on SFC ?
16:42:18 <sridhar_ram> #topic Liberty Release Plans
16:42:46 <sridhar_ram> team - we need to zero in on a date for Liberty Release ...
16:43:19 <sridhar_ram> I'm looking for inputs from Prasanth (for auto-scaling), Bob (for monitoring) and Sripriya (for MANO api + basic unit-test f/w)
16:44:36 <sridhar_ram> would, say Sept 25th, be a good date for your efforts to wrap up..
16:44:46 <bobh> That should work
16:44:55 <sripriya_> sridhar_ram: ack
16:45:36 <sridhar_ram> prashantD: how abt you ?
16:45:49 <sridhar_ram> bobh: sripriya_: thanks
16:46:41 <sridhar_ram> alright - lets go w/ Sept 25th .. which means you need to wrap few days before that ;-)
16:47:30 <sridhar_ram> Here we go .. we now have a release page for Tacker #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Tacker/Releases
16:48:14 <sridhar_ram> any other question on the release ?
16:48:39 <sridhar_ram> lets open the floor for gen discussion...
16:48:53 <sridhar_ram> #topic Bugs / Reviews / Open Discussion
16:49:34 <sridhar_ram> if you've something to discuss on Tacker .. please bring up
16:49:44 <bobh> Quick question on PyCharm - anyone using it behind an HTTTP proxy and connecting to github?  It claims to work when I test the proxy settings but fails to pull from github
16:49:59 <bobh> if I'm outside of the corporate network it works fine
16:50:38 <sridhar_ram> bobh: heavily use pycharm, but never used its git integration features
16:51:00 <bobh> sridhar_ram: so you run git from command line and import the project into PyCharm?
16:51:12 <sridhar_ram> bobh: yep
16:51:55 <sridhar_ram> back to tacker .. just an Fyi, tosca-parse is now a separate component available outside heat-translator
16:52:03 <sridhar_ram> #link https://github.com/openstack/tosca-parser
16:52:47 <sridhar_ram> I'm planning to look into this .. we need tosca-nfv parser to switch over at some point
16:53:17 <sridhar_ram> anything else? .. we can wrap up early if not
16:54:05 <sridhar_ram> lets wrap .. thanks folks
16:54:10 <sridhar_ram> #endmeeting