20:01:17 #startmeeting tc 20:01:17 Meeting started Mon Oct 12 20:01:17 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is flaper87. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 20:01:18 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 20:01:20 The meeting name has been set to 'tc' 20:01:28 yay 20:01:37 o/ 20:01:41 I don't have a courtesy-ping list for this meeting so, I hope everyone is around 20:01:43 :D 20:01:49 I know sdague was interested 20:01:50 sdague: jaypipes 20:01:58 I know those two 20:02:02 and maybe lifeless? 20:02:06 o/ 20:02:08 ttx: in case you're awake 20:02:10 flaper87: you could just ping everyone in case 20:02:26 o/ 20:02:32 reviewing from bottom up as we speak 20:02:46 ttx: mind using the courtesy ping list from the tc? 20:02:48 courtesy ping for jeblair, russellb, annegentle, markmcclain, dtroyer 20:02:53 just in case others are around 20:02:54 dhellmann: thanks 20:03:01 #topic Agenda 20:03:02 I think that's everyone who hasn't already poked their head up or been mentioned 20:03:07 #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mitaka-cross-project-session-planning 20:03:10 * jeblair pokes 20:03:12 hey, I'm here. I'm on the etherpad commenting.. 20:03:21 That's pretty much our agenda. Lets try to go through as many as we can 20:03:26 Hello. I'm here too. 20:03:30 I've added them in order of submission 20:03:41 unless I messed that up 20:03:53 #topic Role assignments for service users 20:03:57 ok, so for folks that haven't commented on the etherpad yet, I'd say that's where you should be doing things. Do we want to give folks sort of 20 minutes to get through the list 20:04:20 flaper87: I don't think walking through 27 items on irc is going to really work, we should get people to comment in etherpad and cull first 20:04:25 almost done 20:04:34 sdague: I'd appreciate that, but I feel selfish for saying it.. 20:04:36 o/ 20:04:58 yeah, flaper87 how about if we try to identify anything we can cut as a first pass? 20:05:10 or the other way, anything we think is critical 20:05:23 dhellmann: ok, I'm good with that. First time running this meeting s open to suggestions and corrections 20:05:27 sdague: ^ 20:05:42 well, I'm always open to that but you get my point 20:06:02 #topic Fast-Track topics 20:06:15 Any topics in particular you'd like to fast-track? 20:07:03 the deprecation one 20:07:14 service catalog, too 20:07:19 that came out of the TC meeting, so seems like a thing we should definitely land 20:07:27 flaper87: 18 and 8 and the deprecation one 20:07:35 ==27 20:07:35 27 20:07:41 gah 20:07:48 17 is what I meant 20:07:50 Service catalog got some good votes (1) 20:07:55 8, 17 and 27 20:08:02 I'd also like the themes discssion, #19, but that seems to have tepid support 20:08:11 are we sure everything that was on the etherpad got moved here ? 20:08:14 and *something* about defcore, we had 2 I think we can combine 20:08:16 o/ sorry I'm late 20:08:23 I'd like to see #2 in as well 20:08:24 ttx: everything in odsreg is here 20:08:37 ttx: is there something missing? 20:08:45 jaypipes: (I agree wholeheartedly with you on 8 btw - I'm on it) 20:09:05 sdague: I mean the original submission etherpad 20:09:13 So, we have #2 and #8 that are very similar 20:09:15 ttx: I have no idea 20:09:23 ttx: isn't this the same pad? 20:09:25 I think I was out the week that all went down 20:09:30 dhellmann: it is not 20:09:36 flaper87: 2 and 18 you mean? 20:09:44 mordred: yes, sorry 20:09:49 dhellmann: this is effectively an export of odsreg 20:09:51 * ttx checks logs 20:09:57 oh, this is the only etherpad I have a link to 20:10:02 which was a pretty manual process, so lets never do this again :) 20:10:04 this is the same etherpad 20:10:12 flaper87: oh, ok 20:10:13 ok, focus 20:10:17 so far I have 20:10:19 yes, i'd like to combine 2 and 18 and fast-track that 20:10:30 jeblair: ++ 20:10:32 2, 8, 18, 27 20:10:36 we might want to pick sessions for double-slots too 20:10:37 we can combine 2 and 18 20:10:51 so, I'd go with the first one that was submitted and work on that 20:10:59 if we combine 2 and 18 who has the baton on moderator for it? 20:10:59 mordred: jeblair dhellmann preferences? 20:11:17 flaper87: I'm making notes about this near line 18 20:11:25 dhellmann: thanks 20:11:34 flaper87: I can moderate that, with mark's input 20:11:44 flaper87: i think dhellmann should mod, and should coordinate with mvoelker to see his things are included 20:11:50 or, what dhellmann just said :) 20:11:54 jeblair: :D 20:11:57 ok, sold! 20:12:03 yeah, I'd want mark's content as the first 5 minutes to frame the discussion, I think 20:12:33 I'd like to see #23 as well 20:12:46 I think we should fast-track that one 20:12:51 That'd be documentation 20:13:00 I added a Nack list, as there are a couple that seem pretty clear we drop 20:13:14 16 - rocky withdrew it 20:13:39 7 - chungg said he couldn't run it any more 20:13:40 * markmcclain lurks 20:13:41 flaper87: 23 seems pretty good but only has +1 votes so far 20:14:30 yeah, i'd like to have it but it doesn't seem like fast-track material to me 20:14:38 :D 20:15:02 ttx: are you proposing rolling 22 into 23? 20:15:03 oh and 19 20:15:32 I think that one could also be fast-tracked 20:15:54 sdague: I think I can touch on the important points in #22 in #23 instead. I kind of agree that a full session about pain points is likely to be counterproductive 20:15:55 we 2 several on roles and policy, can we take that group and sort through those? #1 & #12 20:16:03 how close are people feeling towards scoring all the ones they care about? is another 5 minutes good enough for that? 20:16:14 I'm done with scoring 20:16:34 dhellmann: ++ Can you (or someone else) help with pinging these folks? 20:16:51 Any objections on #19 ? 20:16:58 flaper87: pinging? 20:17:01 nope 20:17:07 dhellmann: honestly, I don't know. It's one of those places there was a lot of going around this last cycle, and honestly if they need 2 sessions it might be better than other things on there 20:17:23 dhellmann: I thnk 1 and 12 are a bit different 20:17:31 dhellmann: I thought you meant you wanted to ask them to work together. nevermind 20:17:33 sdague: sure, I wasn't necessarily saying combine just that we look at them as a theme 20:17:45 dhellmann: misunderstood you, keep going :) 20:17:46 yah. as a theme for sure - I thnk they're complimentary brian topics 20:17:54 dhellmann: yeh, I'd say put them back to back 20:18:23 6 is another candidate nack, it's super vague, and people scored it badly 20:18:23 sdague: did you happen to talk to ayoung about the scope change on 12? 20:18:37 sdague: ++ 20:18:37 dhellmann: I did not directly talk to him about it 20:19:06 sdague: ++ nack'd it 20:19:12 ok, who needs more time for scoring? 20:19:18 We can abandon #22 and I can touch on the very few points that matter there on #23 instead 20:19:21 otherwise I'm going to start doing maths 20:19:25 i'm good. 20:19:32 ttx: added to the nacks list 20:19:35 jaypipes: ? 20:19:41 annegentle: ? 20:19:53 I could reword it a bit. I want to touch on helping people keep up with the dev news 20:20:13 but that can live in #23 20:20:19 sdague: still scoring, ya 20:20:27 sdague: yeah, 2 more minutes please. 20:20:34 (i'm on 22) 20:21:11 ok I'll start at the top with stuff you've voted on 20:21:25 also, whoever is yellow, you need to add your name to your scores 20:21:34 a yellow +1 showed up on #3 20:21:38 sdague, flaper87: i started a list of things we should put in the ops session hole at the top 20:21:45 ttx: while we wait, a procedural note: if we're going to use odsreg next time, we need to hook it up to send comments as email so we can get feedback from proposers 20:22:13 dhellmann, ttx: if we do, i can make that happen. piece of cake. 20:22:21 jeblair: awesome, thanks! 20:22:32 I think #10 is also good for fast-track 20:22:32 it also needs real data export 20:22:47 because manually doing the sqlite dumps to get it back into the etherpad was pretty gorpy 20:22:52 jeblair: great, I think that would be an improvement 20:23:15 almost there, sorry for the delay I'm off today with kids 20:23:18 I proposed a more catch-all title for #23 now that we abandoned #22 20:23:46 ttx: thanks 20:24:33 ding! 20:24:35 done :) 20:24:58 we have 21 slots, btw. So far we've 5 sessions 20:24:59 so with the 5 nacks we already have less than we have slots. 20:25:09 ttx: :) 20:25:16 and 27 submissions total 20:25:17 is there anything that would benefit from a double session ? 20:25:19 flaper87: nice work 20:25:20 :) 20:25:31 we've nacked 5 and we've merged a couple of them 20:25:32 annegentle: thanks :D 20:25:33 dhellmann: rescope to .... 20:25:35 ttx: the DLM one. 20:25:48 jaypipes: ++ 20:25:51 ++ 20:26:01 jaypipes: ++ 20:26:07 ok noted 20:26:09 that'll require some serious talking and bike-shedding 20:26:15 heh 20:26:30 anything else ? 20:26:35 I wonder if DefCore 20:26:38 but I'm not sure 20:26:40 dhellmann: ? 20:26:55 service catalog TNG maybe 20:26:55 sdague: catching up, sorry 20:27:09 DefCore prolly 20:27:12 dhellmann: yeh, you were typing in the etherpad 20:27:21 on the dynamic policy one 20:27:21 flaper87: I'm missing context 20:27:23 * annegentle catches up on dlm 20:27:28 and it sort of ends mid sentence 20:27:30 dhellmann: double slotes for the DefCore session 20:27:32 slots* 20:27:35 sdague: yeah, I was trying to listen to ayound at the same time, I finished it 20:27:53 flaper87: I don't think we need 2 sessions 20:27:59 dhellmann: ok 20:28:11 ttx: service catalog tng would be good to hammer on 20:28:18 if we have time, I'm guessing 20:28:27 flaper87: the point there is to start the engagement and establish lines of communication, and we should timebox that 20:28:48 dhellmann: sounds good! 20:30:25 ttx: the only other one I think *might* need 2 slots is the future of multinode testing one. 20:30:37 mordred: ++ 20:30:52 I think the Service Catalog will also require some time 20:30:57 jaypipes: I'm not sure there is 2 sessions worth in there 20:31:02 for multinode testing 20:31:07 at least for the next cycle 20:31:13 sdague: no? ok, I trust your judgment on that. 20:31:15 mordred: well, at one point it will be, should we have this session or a double-slot on that one 20:31:33 ok, so 2 double-slot candidates 20:31:41 also, I'm adding the service catalog one to the Approvals, it has 16 voes 20:32:32 ok, how about we reorder them by score 20:32:36 ok, do we want to try slotting some of the top ranked ones at this point ? 20:32:51 ok, so far we have 8 slots occupied (counting double sessions) 20:33:07 sdague: ok, let's do that 20:33:10 sdague: I was doing that already 20:33:14 * jaypipes thinks the performance working group kickoff session is important to have in the cross-project track. 20:33:16 I mean, getting the obvious ones ups 20:33:20 flaper87: no, I mean on the schedule 20:33:26 sdague: oh, ok 20:33:28 sorry 20:33:29 flaper87: I think 8 should go early, and 21 should go before 5 20:33:30 sounds good 20:33:56 mordred: yup yup! 20:34:26 FY 20:34:29 #link http://mitakadesignsummit.sched.org/overview/type/cross+project+workshops#.VhwYzc-1RZI 20:34:34 so, now we get into the fun 20:34:36 how about we NACK all the negative scores 20:34:48 flaper87: there is a chunk at the bottom of the etherpad with bullet list for slots 20:35:21 so I'm going to put 27 in one of the 2pm slots 20:35:31 flaper87, sdague: i found 5 things that i thought would be good for the 2pm slots; listed at top of etherpad 20:35:46 flaper87, sdague: i think 3 of them are stronger than the other 2 20:35:58 oh. booo. I want to be in 27 and 21 and both want to be at 2pm 20:36:17 I propose we NACK 15 13 and 9 as having negative scores 20:36:26 ttx +1 20:36:29 mordred: only 3 of them can be, so we have choices there 20:36:36 * mordred agrees with jebliar about 21 not being in 2pm - makes his personal schedule better 20:36:56 yeh, I wouldn't put 21 at 2 20:37:04 ++ for 21 at 2 20:37:05 because the ops we get that talk aren't those ops 20:37:21 so I don't think it's useful crossover 20:37:33 I think we could have #8 after #27 20:37:37 so basically we NACKed enough to have our two double slots now 20:37:43 and approve everything else 20:37:43 5 at 2pm sounds good 20:37:44 it's likely that many folks attending that one would want to stick around 20:37:55 and we need 2 slots 20:38:19 * ttx adds room capacity to the equation 20:38:30 sdague: 3 vs 20 for a 2pm? 20:38:30 ttx: are they all the same size? 20:38:37 you wish 20:38:40 lol 20:38:44 what's special about 2:00? is that the ops track hole? 20:38:48 dhellmann: yse 20:38:54 jeblair: I think 3 20:38:59 20 is more dev focussed 20:39:15 sdague: cool, we agree on 27/3/5 :) 20:39:17 though it means I can't go to 3 20:39:24 but, oh well 20:39:27 yeh 20:39:27 sdague: added capacity to the bottom of etherpad 20:39:31 sdague: :( 20:39:44 I think 5 should be at 2 20:39:54 ttx: thanks, that helps 20:40:00 flaper87: yep, but not 21 20:40:40 sdague: agreed! 20:40:57 so selfishly I'd like 17 in the pre lunch block in one of those rooms 20:41:03 so. I striked out all the ones on the NACK list. Anything you think we should NOT have ? 20:41:17 anything else * 20:41:24 it probably doesn't need the A room if we think there will be a bigger topic 20:41:55 next on the NACK kill list would be #4 with 0 votes 20:42:23 * ttx votes and kills it too 20:42:30 ttx: nicely done 20:42:40 I think we should have #8 in Track A after #27 20:42:43 ok, so flaper87 suggested 8 to follow 27 in the same room 20:42:44 jeblair: you can vote nd save it ! 20:42:45 flaper87: do it 20:43:08 ttx: nope, that didn't happen 20:43:29 I'm fine with 17 in the pre-lunch slot 20:43:41 probably on Track B, though 20:43:49 flaper87: ok, lets do it 20:44:04 I'll let you type 20:44:46 Ok, what about the defcore one? 20:44:49 sdague: should we just approve eveythign else ? We have enough NACKed to have one extra slot at this stage 20:44:52 I thin that deserves track A 20:44:58 dhellmann: any preference on the slot ? 20:45:02 ttx: yeh, I think so 20:45:16 ttx: ++ for approving everything else 20:45:21 we have enough slots 20:45:38 flaper87: for #2? 20:45:55 dhellmann: yes 20:46:05 I think A or B, early in the day since I expect it will have an impact on other discussions 20:46:08 sdague: then we can discuss what we do of the extra slot 20:46:25 flaper87: actually, I guess all of these are before project discussions so the time doesn't matter so much 20:46:45 ttx: sleep 20:46:55 so 1 and 12 should go back to back, so do them in the 2:50 B block? 20:46:59 dhellmann: ok, I'd do B pre-lunch for now 20:47:07 unless someone disagrees 20:47:16 erm, I meant A 20:47:30 B pre-lunch is taken already 20:48:01 sdague: ++ 20:48:11 Of mine I think 23 and 24 can live in the small room (C). I'd say 11 and 21 needs at least the B room 20:48:12 ok, those are on 20:48:33 flaper87: I stuck themes earlier, but that can move to another room if we need the space for something else 20:48:36 ttx do you have proposed timeblocks 20:48:44 dhellmann: aewsome 20:48:49 and +1 for having 19 early in the day 20:48:54 ttx given that you are an exclusive lock 20:49:21 argh, that will be a difficult one. Let me try 20:50:22 sdague: do you think "service catalogs" might should be a "theme for the mitaka cycle?" 20:50:24 python 3 in C first thing? 20:50:28 sdague: do we have the right people available for 3 in the 2pm slot? I worry that it's going to be a topic that wants to make progress and will not have humans in the room 20:50:33 jeblair: it might be 20:50:40 (it just hit me) 20:50:44 I added #10 to track C at 2:50 20:50:49 mordred: how about we stick more stuff on and then horse trade? 20:50:51 sdague: (if so, hopefully someone can advocate for it since they collide) 20:50:53 sdague: kk 20:51:00 jeblair: yeh, I think that can happen by proxy 20:51:01 and it goes back to back w/ the openstack way 20:51:13 sdague: cool 20:51:39 flaper87: I think I've copied all of the unscheduled titles down near the bottom of the page 20:51:54 dhellmann: super helpful, thanks! 20:51:58 sdague: I placed them 20:52:26 ok, I put python 3 on the early block in C 20:52:29 anyone else being moderators on multiple sessions ? 20:52:32 sdague: ++ 20:52:41 sdague: ++ 20:52:51 ttx: I think I have 2, defcore and themes 20:53:17 sdague: 11 could move on room A 20:53:25 if we don't have a better candidate for that 20:53:27 I've put 26 track C last in the day 20:53:28 so, we have keystone federation, multinode testing, and upgrades? 20:53:33 not sure about the capacity for that one 20:53:42 multinode testing can be in room C 20:53:47 but I assumed track C would be enoug and I'd rather have keystone federation on B 20:54:12 ttx if 11 moved to room A, I'd put the live upgrades bit in B in that slot 20:54:26 sdague: done 20:55:00 B is fully booked so I've put 25 in C 20:55:06 sdague: oh, btw. 20:55:17 so that's it right? as there was a free slot? 20:55:25 now stare and horse trade? 20:55:45 sdague: after 3:40pm the ops only have woring sessions, not fishbowls, so we should put ops-related things there if they don't fit teh 2pm slot 20:55:45 I wonder if we should move Keystone to track A 20:55:49 ttx: I want to rearrange all of your sessions :) 20:55:58 that could/should have more attendance 20:56:04 mordred: wait I just added a constrinat 20:56:07 constraint 20:56:35 mordred: so, originally you wanted to move 3 20:56:38 any thoughts on moving Keystone's session? Or do we prefer to keep that slot free just in case? 20:56:52 (6 mins left) 20:56:57 sdague: I did and do 20:57:00 flaper87: yeh, put keystone in the last A block 20:57:12 that's going to probably need bigger than C 20:57:20 sdague: I kinda feel like you should be in 3 20:57:58 flaper87: no, don't move the test one 20:58:02 ttx: and I'd like to swap 21 and 24 - because 21 feels like a scoping setup for later conversations 20:58:07 sdague: oh, sorry 20:58:09 but I'm just talking out loud 20:58:28 sdague: I thought about giving that track an early end of the day but I guess you're booked on both 20:58:55 mordred: +1 for swapping those 20:59:00 mordred: it's tricky they are not in the same room 20:59:26 mordred: so if we put 3 in the 4:40 block, I could probably be in it 20:59:39 so bump it to 4:40 in C 20:59:46 then I vote we do that 21:00:02 hmm, I won't be able to attend but maybe dims can 21:00:02 I guess that means that 21 could be in the 2 block 21:00:10 mmh, but I think 3 should use some ops love 21:00:23 flaper87: the ops get quieter later in the day 21:00:29 we could also strategically leave the 2pm hole empty in order to funnel more people to 27 or 5 21:00:30 so I don't know 21:00:39 jeblair: ++ 21:00:45 yeh, honestly, leaving the 2 slot empty seems reasonable 21:01:03 although I really want to be in 27 and 5 21:01:06 but *shrug* 21:01:14 I think they're both in the right place 21:01:20 I'll just bounce between 21:01:23 sdague: yeah but dunno, I don't like to make those assumptions 21:01:24 OK I'll need to drop 21:01:30 we're done folks! 21:01:35 ttx: goodnight! 21:01:42 I added my constraints, in case you want to move things around 21:01:43 Thank you all and sorry for all the mess 21:01:44 ok, so... we should inform all the proposers of their slots 21:01:55 I think we did great :P 21:01:58 because they might have conflicts 21:02:03 flaper87, sdague: ++ 21:02:13 so we can do last minute shuffle before stamping it good at tc meeting tomorrow 21:02:26 flaper87: can you handle that, as it's almost daytime for you now :) 21:02:28 sdague: yeah, mind doing that? An early email would be great and I won't be able to send one until later today 21:02:30 lol 21:02:33 ok 21:02:35 nice work, I think it's good content 21:02:36 I'll do it 21:02:39 :D 21:02:41 flaper87: I'm done for the day :) 21:02:42 Thank you all 21:02:46 thanks folks 21:02:48 #endmeeting