18:00:17 <gouthamr> #startmeeting tc
18:00:17 <opendevmeet> Meeting started Tue Mar 18 18:00:17 2025 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is gouthamr. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:00:17 <opendevmeet> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
18:00:17 <opendevmeet> The meeting name has been set to 'tc'
18:00:26 <gouthamr> Welcome to the weekly meeting of the OpenStack Technical Committee. A reminder that this meeting is held under the OpenInfra Code of Conduct available at https://openinfra.dev/legal/code-of-conduct.
18:00:30 <gouthamr> Today's meeting agenda can be found at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee
18:00:34 <gouthamr> #topic Roll Call
18:00:37 <cardoe> o/
18:00:38 <noonedeadpunk> o/
18:00:42 <mnasiadka> o/
18:00:47 <gmann> o/
18:00:49 <gtema> o/
18:01:23 <frickler> \o
18:01:52 <bauzas> \o
18:02:48 <gouthamr> courtesy ping: spotz[m]
18:04:55 <gouthamr> thank you all for joining; nearly full house today.. lets get started
18:05:02 <gouthamr> #topic Last Week's AIs
18:05:17 <spotz[m]> o/
18:06:04 <gouthamr> i think we didn't take any concrete AIs, but we have a couple of hanging threads
18:06:14 <gouthamr> 1) Operator Engagement on Mailing Lists
18:06:30 <gouthamr> s/lists/list
18:07:47 <gouthamr> i think post this discussion, we were recalling fungi's email regarding merging openstack-operators with openstack-discuss and shutting down openstack-operators
18:08:16 <gouthamr> the tl;dr version was that there was a lot of cross posting between the lists and splintering of conversations
18:08:42 <gouthamr> and the rest of the thread went off into a different issue iiuc
18:09:30 <gouthamr> #link https://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-operators/2018-August/015768.html ([Openstack-operators] [all] Bringing the community together (combine the lists!))
18:09:54 <fungi> note that mailing list thread was also a continuation of forum sessions from months prior
18:10:11 <cardoe> despite being an operator (at least I think I qualify?) I don't follow that list.
18:10:13 <fungi> where we'd first socialized the idea with the various parties affected
18:10:26 <fungi> cardoe: it hasn't existed since 2019
18:10:46 <fungi> or late 2018 really
18:11:11 <gouthamr> ack, so i wonder if the operators who had this feedback were not participating then, or if they're recaliberating based on how things have worked so far
18:11:45 <fungi> or they're unfamiliar with the fact that it used to be the case but don't realize the drawbacks that caused us to not continue doing so
18:11:48 <fungi> chesterton's fence
18:12:02 <gouthamr> yeah
18:12:09 * gouthamr looks up chesterton's fence
18:12:44 * gouthamr :D wow
18:13:35 <mnasiadka> I personally think the argument that operators are afraid to ask questions on openstack-discuss is a bit untrue - I see a lot of people asking questions about openstack-ansible or kolla-ansible based deployments recently (although I think I see more of them on Reddit)
18:15:38 <bauzas> I wonder how many people know that they can be notified differently with the tags
18:15:45 <gouthamr> hmm, another thing being "developers" don't care about (some of) their problems, and they're sometimes only looking for feedback from fellow operators
18:15:54 <bauzas> and everytime I see an email without a tag, bah
18:15:55 <fungi> i would argue that there are more operator questions on openstack-discuss these days than developer discussion
18:16:28 <bauzas> at least for nova, the ML is the only medium when we ask operators about some solution we would do
18:16:45 <bauzas> (for example, a deprecation or a virt driver modification)
18:17:02 <bauzas> so if operators don't read the ML, huh
18:18:24 <gouthamr> yeah, concerning - there's an operators discussion at the PTG
18:18:54 <gouthamr> i can add this topic there, and suggest that the TC is looking to understand their concerns
18:20:11 <gouthamr> #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/apr2025-ptg-os-operators (os-operators PTG Etherpad)
18:20:20 <spotz[m]> Back in the day we got more interaction from the Twitter account but Chris decided to close it. Not that I’d posted anything in awhile
18:21:05 <gouthamr> ack
18:21:29 <gouthamr> lets revisit this after we've understood what the issues are
18:21:43 <gouthamr> thanks for sharing the context
18:22:27 <gouthamr> the only other AI that i see is the follow up on the OIF board discussions
18:22:59 <gouthamr> this happened after our meeting, and am assuming everyone caught up on it
18:23:57 <gouthamr> #link https://openinfra.org/blog/openinfra-linux-foundation-collaboration (jbryce's blog post)
18:24:20 <gouthamr> #link https://lists.openinfra.org/archives/list/foundation@lists.openinfra.org/thread/577NQIACCIXR72GVWEKTHWF54BHF7ZRG/ (Recap of the March OIF Board Meeting)
18:24:37 <gouthamr> anything else to be said/shared wrt this?
18:25:11 <gouthamr> per that update, i think all community members that are foundation members should receive an invitation to vote to ratify this decision of the board
18:25:22 <gouthamr> "sometime in April"
18:26:42 <gouthamr> that's all the hanging threads we had last week, which i'm terming AIs :)
18:26:42 <gouthamr> was anyone else tracking anything else?
18:28:35 <gouthamr> #topic TC Vice-chair
18:28:49 <gouthamr> ^ just an announcement that we've made the change, and ty for +1s:
18:28:55 <gouthamr> #link https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/944174 (Add 2025.2 TC chair and vice-chair)
18:29:06 <gouthamr> thanks for volunteering noonedeadpunk!
18:29:22 <noonedeadpunk> I forgot to vote though :D
18:29:35 <gouthamr> haha, i merged it before you could -1
18:29:56 <noonedeadpunk> but my pleasure:)
18:30:01 <spotz[m]> Hehe
18:30:16 <gouthamr> :)
18:30:16 <fungi> you've been press-ganged into service
18:30:25 <gouthamr> #topic TC Meeting times poll
18:31:16 <gouthamr> we've polled for meeting time conformance/convenience at the start of TC terms
18:31:52 <noonedeadpunk> should we maybe start if someboidy not ok with current time?
18:32:07 <gouthamr> good point
18:32:14 <gtema> I am not ok
18:32:18 <gtema> as always was
18:32:23 <gouthamr> the US DST shift happened two weeks ago, and the EU one is in 1 week
18:32:30 <noonedeadpunk> ++ then let's make a poll
18:32:45 <gouthamr> #link https://framadate.org/os-tc-2025-2
18:33:02 <frickler> I'm also not happy with the current time fwiw
18:33:20 <gouthamr> can you please pick from teh options in the poll, as to when you would like to start this one hour meeting
18:33:39 <noonedeadpunk> gtema: it's still high chance we end up with a very simmilar timeframe, as EU/US is impossible to match and make everybody happy :(
18:33:40 <gouthamr> ignore the specific dates, and think of the typical days of the week
18:33:56 <bauzas> that usual meeting time is for me a bit difficult to attend, unless I have chips and beers
18:34:00 <gouthamr> and please keep the daylight savings changes in your time zones
18:34:10 <gouthamr> haha, i'd petition for some budget for that bauzas
18:34:15 <gtema> noonedeadpunk - strongly disagree. Finding good EU/US is very easy
18:34:30 <gtema> we have multiple meetings a week in friendly time for everyone
18:34:51 <bauzas> I'm already packed during the golden hour, ie. 4pm-5pm UTC
18:35:05 <bauzas> so there is no easy win for me
18:35:49 <frickler> so add in another option: stop doing synchronous(sp?) meetings completely
18:35:52 <bauzas> I'd maybe vote for no change due to the other large number of meetings I have on 4-6pm UTC days
18:36:29 <noonedeadpunk> I'm not particulary happy about time as well, but it's easy to attend and no conflicts at least
18:36:56 <spotz[m]> Ok day matters date doesn’t?
18:37:14 <gouthamr> i love async work, buuuuut, i think this meeting acts as a good check point to make progress and connect with everyone
18:37:20 <frickler> spotz[m]: day of week only, yes
18:38:14 <spotz[m]> I have this blocked so don’t mind keeping.
18:38:30 <fungi> challenges settling on a convenient time for everyone was one of the reasons we opted to stop holding weekly meetings when i was on the tc
18:38:39 <spotz[m]> I have to pour through the calendar to move it
18:39:09 <gmann> Even TC does not need to hold meeting as per mandatory requirement but no meeting can impact on TC working or slow down its activeness.
18:39:34 <noonedeadpunk> we're not particulary fast even now tbh
18:39:50 <fungi> (we held office hours, but full tc member attendance was not expected)
18:39:54 <noonedeadpunk> but it could become way worse, sure
18:39:58 <gmann> Main idea behind increasing the frequency of meeting  (form monthly meeting to weekly) to speed up the TC work and provide fast decision/progress to community ask/need
18:40:14 <gmann> noonedeadpunk: we used to be :)
18:40:48 <gouthamr> gmann: dunno if you mean, we were way worse, or if we were particularly fast..
18:40:50 <gmann> I am not how many of us or future TC can be online/available to discuss the things
18:41:12 <bauzas> I can't just fill the framadate now, I need to compare with all my other lovely meetings
18:41:22 <gouthamr> sure take your time, bauzas
18:41:29 <fungi> back then we observed that holding meetings every week encouraged us to wait until the meeting to discuss or review things, and so not having those meetings resulted in speeding some things up because people didn't feel compelled to sit on them waiting for a meeting
18:41:36 <gouthamr> i'll need an answer to collate by next week
18:41:36 <gmann> I mean having meeting and weekly is one of the important part where we make fast decision
18:41:51 <gouthamr> ++
18:42:11 <gmann> if we think of stopping meeting we should first come up with the better alternate to continue TC speed/activeness etc
18:42:31 <mnasiadka> Luckily I don't have millions of meetings in the shared EU/US slot - so I'm happy with sort of anything, but I feel frickler/gtema/others that current slot is 7pm EU time, and after DST switch it's going to be 8pm
18:42:46 <gtema> pings are working very good fwiw
18:42:48 <gouthamr> yeah, even advancing by an hour can make a difference
18:43:12 <gmann> gtema: it does some time but not a collective gathering of discussion among all TC members
18:43:20 <bauzas> honestly I would even propose a late-EU meeting
18:43:29 <noonedeadpunk> yeah, actually moving an hour before to keep same time witrh DSST makes sense indeed
18:43:48 <gmann> it is hard to expect every TC members to be online/available at random time considering we all work from different TZ
18:43:55 <gouthamr> +1
18:43:58 <bauzas> this would be easier for me to juggle like when it was at 9pm UTC
18:44:26 <spotz[m]> That’s what we do for CentOS board  Bauzaun
18:45:05 <spotz[m]> Bah typo, but yeah late means EU folks dinner with family
18:45:27 <frickler> how did you get german into your auto-correct? ;)
18:45:47 <gtema> looooool
18:46:06 <gouthamr> i'll let you think about this and answer the poll.. lets catch up on the results next week
18:46:15 <gouthamr> #topic A check on gate health
18:46:23 <spotz[m]> I switch to German keyboard and get stuck
18:46:48 * bauzas googles Bauzaun
18:47:17 <gtema> construction site fence
18:47:25 <fungi> not health-related specifically, but we added a new rackspace flex region in nodepool (dfw3), which has doubled the quota for flex nodes from 32 to 64, and we've heard tell of a third region coming online soon too
18:47:44 <gouthamr> nice ++
18:47:48 <frickler> gate is borked for kolla currently due to a bug in neutron, fix is dealing with gate issues, too
18:48:32 <frickler> #link https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/neutron/+/944763
18:49:07 <frickler> otherwise most release related patches I watched went mostly fine
18:49:14 <gmann> other thing to note: doc job is migrated to Noble (running on python 3.12) on Friday and we had 3 project failing (a few of them fixed in advance of migration). out of those 3 projects, kolla-ansible fix is not merged. and rest all merged.
18:49:16 <gmann> #link https://lists.openstack.org/archives/list/openstack-discuss@lists.openstack.org/thread/JOMDY26TCW7OX3NXRGOYQCIDXNNJ4E25/
18:49:26 <fungi> openstack-helm is presumably broken on master for the moment too, since i just helped them merge the openstack-helm-infra repo into it an hour or two ago, but they're aware and working on it
18:49:45 <frickler> k-a docs fix is also blocked by the neutron issue
18:49:47 <gmann> I am also monitoring doc job failure if that is related to Noble migration but not seeing any other as of now
18:49:49 <gmann> #link https://zuul.openstack.org/builds?job_name=openstack-tox-docs&branch=master&result=FAILURE&skip=0
18:49:55 <gmann> frickler: yeah
18:50:02 <mnasiadka> kolla-ansible fix is not merged, because we're waiting for the Neutron fix (and then daily container build job) - once we're back in business we'll merge the doc fix
18:50:12 <gmann> yeah, thanks
18:50:20 <gouthamr> the neutron fix will require an RC2?
18:50:54 <frickler> I'd think so, yes. though kolla is still consuming neutron for master for now
18:51:41 <mnasiadka> but we can switch after Neutron merges backport of the fix in 2025.1
18:52:40 <gouthamr> ack, good to see the RC1 window pass by with relatively less fire fighting.. thanks for the hard work on the releases, and the CI changes
18:53:19 <gouthamr> gmann: ty for the update on the noble transition bits too! nice that we didn't need to revert to jammy
18:53:30 <gouthamr> anything else for $topic?
18:54:43 <gouthamr> #topic PTG Planning
18:55:07 <gouthamr> i booked some slots: https://ptg.opendev.org/ptg.html
18:55:26 <gouthamr> ^ the same amount of time as last time, and the same hours
18:56:20 <gouthamr> but, i was ranting in #opendev-events that we've some project slots on all days, for all four hours :D
18:56:46 <gouthamr> so it'll be hard to get everyone participating
18:57:03 <mnasiadka> I might not be able to join PTG sessions - I'll be in NZ timezone at that time
18:57:16 <gouthamr> ah, ack, hopefully vacationing!
18:57:46 <mnasiadka> half-vacation (first work, then vacation) ;-)
18:58:22 <spotz[m]> Yeah I’m here next week then out for Kubecon and PTO during the PTG
18:59:25 <gouthamr> TC meeting slots:
18:59:25 <gouthamr> Monday/7th Apr: 1300-1500 UTC
18:59:25 <gouthamr> Friday/11th Apr: 1500 to 1700 UTC
18:59:25 <gouthamr> differences from last time: there was a diversity-wg meeting at 1300 UTC on Monday and we met 1400-1600 UTC on Monday
18:59:55 <gouthamr> based on the topics we add to the etherpad, i can request some more time:
19:00:05 <gouthamr> #link https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/apr2025-ptg-os-tc (TC PTG Etherpad)
19:00:14 <gouthamr> ack spotz[m]
19:01:10 <gouthamr> alright, we've reached the end of the hour
19:01:20 <gouthamr> no time for Open Discussion
19:01:29 <gouthamr> but did anyone want to add anything to the minutes here?
19:02:36 <gouthamr> thank you all for attending, and for the lively discussion. Please do look for some changes that need review here:
19:02:43 <gouthamr> #link https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/governance+status:open (Open Governance Changes)
19:03:06 <gouthamr> #endmeeting