17:00:32 <gouthamr> #startmeeting tc
17:00:32 <opendevmeet> Meeting started Tue Apr 29 17:00:32 2025 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is gouthamr. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:00:32 <opendevmeet> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
17:00:32 <opendevmeet> The meeting name has been set to 'tc'
17:00:47 <gouthamr> Welcome to the weekly meeting of the OpenStack Technical Committee. A reminder that this meeting is held under the OpenInfra Code of Conduct available at https://openinfra.dev/legal/code-of-conduct.
17:00:52 <gouthamr> Today's meeting agenda can be found at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee
17:00:56 <gouthamr> #topic Roll Call
17:01:09 <frickler> \o
17:01:13 <spotz[m]> \o/
17:01:27 <gmaan> o/
17:01:58 <gouthamr> noted absence: g t e m a
17:03:29 <gouthamr> courtesy ping: bauzas cardoe noonedeadpunk mnasiadka
17:03:37 <bauzas> here
17:04:36 <mnasiadka> o/
17:05:23 <gouthamr> thank you all for joining, lets get started
17:05:30 <gouthamr> #topic Last week's AIs
17:05:51 <gouthamr> 1) Skyline build reproducibility
17:06:01 <gouthamr> the progress here has been s l o w
17:07:06 <gouthamr> fungi and wu_wenixang__ confirmed that the core reviewers were on the ML and we stated that we'd prefer discussing the SBOM issue on the original ML post.. i'll bump it up this week
17:07:53 <gouthamr> 2) Grenade test job update/progress
17:07:53 <gouthamr> gmaan: was there anything new that happened this week?
17:08:19 <cardoe> o/
17:08:31 <frickler> shouldn't that topic be finished for this cycle?
17:08:43 <cardoe> Guess I should have come in quietly in the back.
17:08:58 <fungi> yeah, i'm on a conference call right now but happy to talk about sbom stuff async later
17:09:06 <frickler> cardoe: just sit down now ;)
17:09:08 * gouthamr hands cardoe the tardy slip :D
17:09:19 <gmaan> sorry, for late response
17:09:32 <gmaan> nothing news from me on grenade things
17:09:51 <spotz[m]> Hey I've forgotten until the last 10 minutes so...:)
17:09:58 <gmaan> but I think all grenade jobs are setup correctly. I will check heat/ironic/manila one today if anything needed
17:09:58 <cardoe> So skyline is a bit similar IMHO to some of the other container bits I've wanted to bring up.
17:10:53 <gouthamr> gmaan: ack, to recap: we made branch changes on grenade itself, and the test jobs we setup should automatically start testing E-->F, and SLURP jobs needn't run on master, temporarily
17:11:42 <gouthamr> is that correct?
17:11:45 <gmaan> gouthamr: yes, SLUPR can be run as voting or non voting but up to projects. by default i added to run as voting and project can opt it out if needed
17:12:27 <gouthamr> ++ thank you..
17:12:32 <gmaan> continue running SLURP (N-2 -> N) upgrade helps to avoid or at least know what all breaking things coming up for next SLURP
17:12:46 <gouthamr> ack
17:13:12 <gouthamr> 3) VMT resolution
17:13:15 <gouthamr> #link https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/944817
17:13:36 <gouthamr> last call for reviews on this one, there was a change posted last week which pushed out the merge timeline for it
17:14:04 <gouthamr> so if you had a RC +1 prior, please do check the latest patchset.. if you've already done that, thank you :)
17:14:17 <fungi> JayF: is the other regularly active vmt member who hasn't +1'd the latest patchset
17:15:23 <gouthamr> ty, next AI is to begin working on the changes suggested.. starting with TC liaisons
17:15:49 <gouthamr> bauzas indicated that he'd like to be a TC liaison, i can be one too.. in my copious free time :)
17:16:22 <gouthamr> is there any other TC member that wants to be a liaison instead?
17:16:45 <JayF> +1 in spirit 😄
17:17:17 <spotz[m]> hehe
17:17:42 <bauzas> bear with me ;-)
17:17:47 <fungi> note that it should be sufficient to just document it somewhere (could even be in the liaisons wiki) so that vmt members know who to reach out to if we're having trouble getting anything from the project leaders
17:18:02 <gouthamr> yeah, that's where i was thinking
17:18:18 <fungi> doesn't need to be super formal, just need to know where we should look
17:20:09 <gouthamr> okay, ty bauzas++ you're it, i'll update the wiki once the resolution merges.. we can chat about the rest of the changes here or in #openstack-security
17:20:41 <gouthamr> 4) Move PTG AIs to tracker
17:20:59 <noonedeadpunk> o/
17:21:02 <gouthamr> i'm a slacker here, some of them are there.. others, including unassigned ones don't figure here
17:21:16 <gouthamr> will move them and bug folks appropriately..
17:22:08 <gouthamr> 5) Chat with ianychoi/seongsoo to clarify i18n team’s requests and concerns, chat with rosmaita about the  openstack.weblate.cloud 's context/history
17:22:49 <gouthamr> ^ this is ongoing in private, unfortunately, because some payments etc are being discussed
17:23:37 <gouthamr> but i can give you a summary: we identified the limits in the hosted weblate, and are exploring what options exist
17:24:34 <gouthamr> do we pay more as we complete the migration, if yes, how much? (we = openinfra foundation)
17:24:34 <gouthamr> who do we work with to get any unadvertised offers to reduce said payment
17:26:19 <gouthamr> in parallel, i18n SIG members are looking to reduce "source strings" that count towards this limit - on how/why, we'll need to pick their brains on the subject
17:26:30 <noonedeadpunk> that would be really nice to figure out sooner then later
17:26:51 <noonedeadpunk> as we are already doing transition for a while and it feels that we're running out of time overall
17:27:36 <spotz[m]> Speaking of translation, docs has an issue to add tags in. I've been holding off on it as I know there have been concerns with the team not being able to keep up. And I don't mean that in a bad way but can't think of better wording for more tags then translations
17:27:41 <gouthamr> true, i can press on this need.. from what i know, the SIG lacks members, so if you are willing to help, or know anyone that is, it might help spread the load!
17:27:57 <noonedeadpunk> (not saying that some things would be nice to add for translation, but we don;t to reduce amount of things to migrate)
17:27:58 <gouthamr> spotz[m]: oh, what tags?
17:28:39 <spotz[m]> Let me look I was trying to keep those as unread
17:28:56 <gouthamr> ty
17:29:03 <gouthamr> alright, that's all the AIs i was tracking
17:29:07 <gouthamr> does anyone else have any?
17:29:46 <spotz[m]> This might be it https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/openstack-manuals/+/947059?usp=email
17:30:15 <spotz[m]> No I thought it was .po files this is .py
17:30:30 <spotz[m]> Still looking
17:30:34 <gouthamr> okay..
17:30:38 <gouthamr> #topic Affiliation changes
17:30:56 <gouthamr> gmaan: i'll put you on the spot for an announcement
17:31:28 <gmaan> yeah
17:31:52 <gmaan> I would like to share about my affiliation change. I joined Redhat yeaterday.
17:31:53 <spotz[m]> Maybe I imagined it:)
17:32:02 <frickler> spotz[m]: were you referring to https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/openstack-manuals/+/947180 vs. https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/openstack-manuals/+/947256 ?
17:32:25 <frickler> gmaan: congrats
17:32:43 <gmaan> as we have org diversity requirement, I would like gouthamr to check those and let me know next step if any change needed for my term
17:33:13 <spotz[m]> frickler: you rock, yes!
17:33:14 <gouthamr> gmaan: congratulations and welcome to Red Hat, you broke the internet with the nick and email changes at the same time :D
17:33:27 <gmaan> frickler: thanks
17:33:44 <fungi> i want to say as of the last tc election there could have been one more rh employee without exceeding 50%, but good to double-check that
17:33:44 <gouthamr> fortunately, no.. we are still in compliance with the TC's diversity requirement
17:34:11 <gmaan> yeah, as I changed my email id so though of changing the irc nick etc. but sorry for breaking the scripts. I thought changing primary email in gerrit will work fine
17:34:12 <spotz[m]> Welcome gmaan
17:34:17 <gmaan> spotz[m]: thanks
17:34:32 <gmaan> hope all fixed now.
17:34:52 <gmaan> oh no, this still not merged
17:34:54 <gmaan> #link https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/948354
17:35:04 <gmaan> after this release tooling will be fine
17:35:25 <gouthamr> bauzas, spotz[m], gmaan and myself are affiliated with Red Hat; and that's 44.4% of the TC
17:36:20 <frickler> gmaan: you still need to switch to a new .com domain ;)
17:36:31 <gouthamr> or maybe .ai
17:36:47 <spotz[m]> I thought .ai was going away?
17:37:11 <gmaan> frickler: I just subscribed to old one 1 week before so I will continue that for a year and see if I can get new one :)
17:37:43 <gouthamr> :P jokes aside
17:37:47 <gmaan> do not want to waste my $40 :P
17:38:19 <gouthamr> a gentle reminder to everyone to please keep their affiliation data on OIF Foundation profiles up to date
17:39:10 <gouthamr> you'd probably also update x/stackalytics if you care to..
17:39:57 <gouthamr> that's all there was to $topic
17:40:13 <fungi> affiliation changes in the openinfra foundation profiles should get picked up automatically by openstack.biterg.io (though it's down at the moment due to an intersection of scheduled maintenance and mass power outages in spain)
17:40:13 <gouthamr> #topic Activity of SIG groups
17:40:26 <gouthamr> ack fungi
17:40:58 <gouthamr> noonedeadpunk: you added this topic, and seeded a couple of questions to the meeting:
17:41:04 <gouthamr> 1) How do we track if SIG is active or not
17:41:10 <gouthamr> 2) How we can enable interested people to get into SIG to continue maintenance if SIG is inactive
17:41:19 <gouthamr> was this motivated by any examples?
17:41:39 <gouthamr> #link https://governance.openstack.org/sigs/
17:41:41 <noonedeadpunk> ah, yes, I did last week
17:41:50 <frickler> iiuc the ansible sig?
17:42:03 <noonedeadpunk> So eventually the folk came to osa channel seeking for help with ansible-collections-openstack sig
17:42:09 <noonedeadpunk> yes
17:42:10 <gouthamr> ah, you were trying to reach sshnaidm
17:42:23 <noonedeadpunk> well, not specifically
17:42:43 <noonedeadpunk> so the thing is that there quite some contributions coming to the repo
17:42:50 <noonedeadpunk> but really no review activity
17:42:56 <fungi> i've gotten recent questions about whether the scientific sig is still active too
17:43:15 <noonedeadpunk> with that - there's no really established proicess of adding new members to the sig
17:43:22 <gouthamr> very much, i think :) were you able to direct the enquiries, fungi?
17:43:31 <gouthamr> noonedeadpunk: yes
17:43:38 <fungi> i pointed folks to the list of chairs for the sig, but i think they're all (or almost all) gone from the community now
17:43:53 <noonedeadpunk> so even if there're interested parties to step in with maintenance - they don't have much chance
17:44:26 <fungi> yeah, that's the problem with sigs going inactive is the chairs are the only points of contact in many cases, and once they're gone it's unclear how newcomers can get involvd
17:44:46 <gouthamr> fungi: i pleasantly discovered that the scientific SIG was celebrating its 10th anniversary and is quite active, except they're not like an openstack project team and don't talk a ton on OFTC
17:44:53 <noonedeadpunk> yeah, right
17:44:58 <gouthamr> fungi: here's their Slack: https://join.slack.com/t/os-scientific-sig/shared_invite/zt-34akzhxia-J4DDSoGY0wLnh9aoNxqqlA
17:45:04 <fungi> oh cool, thanks!
17:45:10 <bauzas> ya the main issue is that they don't use IRC
17:45:15 <fungi> i'll pass that along
17:45:20 <bauzas> again a slack issue
17:45:51 <opendevreview> Merged openstack/governance master: Updating Ghanshyam email/irc name  https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/948354
17:45:58 <fungi> there was also discussion about whether we can get the scientific sig and large-scale sig connected to one another, since there seems to be some overlap in interests for the hpc space in particular
17:45:58 * gouthamr imagines that headshake
17:46:40 <fungi> (hpc now being considered synonymous with ai)
17:46:43 <noonedeadpunk> but I wonder if ansible sig is a little bit more unique in terms of having a deliverable
17:47:01 <fungi> the tact sig has a lot of git repos, the security sig has some too
17:47:11 <noonedeadpunk> ok, yes, right
17:47:14 <spotz[m]> They were one of the groups Julia refered to from conversations at OpenInfra Days NA
17:47:19 <gmaan> in past, we used to check SIG meeting happening or not but that should not be the criteria to consider them as inactive
17:47:22 <fungi> the packaging sig did" i don't know whether they still do though
17:47:59 <gouthamr> fungi: sometimes, foundation staff - like yourself/ttx/helena/aprice/diablo_rojo/jimmymcarthur seem to know how to find people.. but, its an unsustainable way to connect with people, i agree
17:48:22 <noonedeadpunk> I think the main pain point - if how to get new members onboarded if chair is not active more or less
17:48:32 <gouthamr> noonedeadpunk: we have a list: https://governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/sig-repos.html
17:48:57 <gmaan> I see 'k8s' 'Hardware Vendor' 'First contact' 'cloud research' 'automation' and maybe few more have no activities?
17:48:59 <fungi> yeah, people were asking other foundation staff members about the scientific sig, and they asked me
17:49:12 <noonedeadpunk> https://opendev.org/openstack/ansible-plugin-container-connection this looks completely abandoned
17:49:38 <noonedeadpunk> but also it looks like osa related under ansible sig....
17:49:41 <spotz[m]> I'll also say we're about to announce RDO Epoxy, but we desperately need packagers if there is going to be a Flamingo
17:50:21 <spotz[m]> Or I should say RPMs
17:50:33 <gmaan> I think we should initiate the separate email about each SIG which we do not find activity or no response from listed chairs.
17:50:45 <mnasiadka> Well, Scientific SIG is alive - if there’s any need for relaying information - I can help. But I agree we should have some process in place for having a responsive chair or current contact details.
17:51:06 <gmaan> that at least can refresh the chair list if SIG still needed or to more moved to 'advisory' or 'completed' status
17:51:13 <fungi> spotz[m]: i thought rdo had said they were moving to just slurp releases?
17:52:12 <spotz[m]> The 2 engineers who were packaging moved to new roles:( We've talked about it in meetings but no one but us went to them
17:52:49 <gouthamr> so teh questions remain, i think it'd be useful if there was a proposal
17:52:56 <noonedeadpunk> I can recall Neil saying smth about help, but not sure
17:53:16 <spotz[m]> He came to one meeting
17:53:16 <gouthamr> noonedeadpunk: have you had any thoughts around changing the situation and answering the two questions you posed?
17:53:39 <noonedeadpunk> no, not really. Pretty much the reason I raised as I had lack of good ideas
17:53:54 <noonedeadpunk> And I'd say I was trying to think about these for some time now
17:54:03 <mnasiadka> Kolla basically uses only a couple of packages from RDO build deps - I can check which ones… if RDO is going to disappear…
17:54:24 <noonedeadpunk> osa uses a whole distro path based on rdo fwiw
17:54:53 <gouthamr> okay, that looks like a tangent that we shouldn't go into..
17:55:08 <gouthamr> i mean, please discuss RDO challenges as a separate topic for next week if you'd like
17:55:13 <noonedeadpunk> ++
17:55:21 <fungi> though osa and kolla also support other distros, if sticking with a particular deployment tool is more important to users than sticking with a particular distro
17:55:28 <spotz[m]> We can talk afte
17:55:32 <noonedeadpunk> so I guess I wanted to raise that and gather opinions on possible solutions
17:55:45 <noonedeadpunk> I can do a writing part and combine thoughts together
17:55:56 <gouthamr> we could try to update stale info, to begin with
17:56:05 <noonedeadpunk> but I struggle to find solution on myself, so was hoping on some collaborative effort :)
17:56:17 <gouthamr> and probably add links if they're missing on "how do i join this SIG"
17:56:46 <gouthamr> its a big problem that we can chip away in small pieces
17:57:11 <spotz[m]> Could do quarterly updates, or updates when we have elections?
17:57:52 <noonedeadpunk> what is more tricky, is that not each sig are equal somehow
17:58:02 <noonedeadpunk> as one do have deliverables, while others do not
17:58:03 <gouthamr> spotz[m]: yes, and probably an initial push now to fix stale info.. if it helps, we can have folks join TC meetings with short updates: "Meet SIG X, and know their updates"
17:58:24 <gmaan> yeah but having active and up to dated list of chairs is helpful
17:58:31 <noonedeadpunk> indeed
17:58:41 <bauzas> agreed
17:58:49 <noonedeadpunk> but how chairs are assigned?
17:58:56 <gouthamr> ++ lets work on that part first; ty for bringing this concern, noonedeadpunk
17:58:58 <noonedeadpunk> as they are not taking part in elections?
17:59:15 <noonedeadpunk> so maybe we need to add SIG chair to elections?
17:59:28 <gmaan> who ever volunteer is added in that list
17:59:32 <noonedeadpunk> which would highlight a) activity b) if it's relevant?
17:59:32 <gouthamr> no, https://governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/comparison-of-official-group-structures.html
17:59:40 <fungi> at least in the sigs i'm involved in, anyone who wants to volunteer to be a chair can. i'm the sole chair of two sigs right now and have repeatedly stated for years that i's appreciate volunteers to help or relieve me entirely
17:59:41 <gmaan> it is more of up to SIG members to agree on the chair
17:59:42 <spotz[m]> No but we ask the SiGs and WG for ATC suggestions, admitedly we've been bad on that for years
18:00:16 <spotz[m]> We used to send thm to TOm if that answers how bad we've been:)
18:00:36 <gmaan> like we do for DPL, having a reset and checks for up to dated list is no harm
18:00:38 <gouthamr> i wouldn't put the process of elections on short/long term groups like this
18:00:53 <gmaan> yeah. election are not needed as such
18:00:53 <noonedeadpunk> `which are not directly responsible for producing components of the “OpenStack” software release` -> does ansible SIG really goes under this criteria specifically?
18:01:09 <gouthamr> "SIGs can own git repositories and produce software, but that software will be considered add-on software to the main “OpenStack” software releases. "
18:01:14 <gmaan> and 'reset' can be just check them via email, irc etc
18:01:35 <bauzas> time check, I need to leave
18:01:38 <gouthamr> yes
18:01:48 <gouthamr> we're a bit over, apologies
18:01:53 <gouthamr> let's end this meeting here
18:01:55 <fungi> are the repositories that the ansible sig manages official deliverables of openstack? shouldn't be possible governance wise
18:01:57 <noonedeadpunk> yeah, right, sorry :)
18:02:02 <gouthamr> sorry, but some topics will be pushed to next week
18:02:12 <gouthamr> which is a Video+IRC meeting
18:02:18 <gouthamr> i'll share details as usual
18:02:29 <gouthamr> anything else to add to the minutes today?
18:02:35 <noonedeadpunk> fungi: it's where things get nasty
18:02:46 <noonedeadpunk> I'll add after the end:)
18:03:22 <gouthamr> thanks everyone
18:03:24 <gouthamr> #endmeeting