#openstack-meeting log

03:00:02 <hongbin> #startmeeting zun
03:00:03 <openstack> Meeting started Tue Sep 13 03:00:02 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
03:00:04 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
03:00:07 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'zun'
03:00:08 <hongbin> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2016-09-13_0300_UTC Today's agenda
03:00:12 <hongbin> #topic Roll Call
03:00:17 <Namrata> Namrata
03:00:19 <mkrai> Madhuri Kumari
03:00:24 <shubhams> shubham
03:00:32 <Vivek_> Vivek Jain
03:00:33 <haiwei> haiwei, hi
03:01:10 <hongbin> Thanks for joining the meeting Namrata mkrai shubhams Vivek_ haiwei
03:01:32 <hongbin> Pause a few more seconds for potential participants
03:01:54 <hongbin> btw, yanyanhu cannot attend this meeting, he is travelling this week
03:02:21 <hongbin> ok, let's start
03:02:24 <hongbin> #topic Announcements
03:02:29 <hongbin> 1. The zun-ui repo was created (thanks Shu)
03:02:35 <hongbin> #link https://github.com/openstack/zun-ui
03:02:47 <hongbin> 2. sudipto shared an apporach to bootstrap Zun development environment
03:02:48 <mkrai> Yay!! Thanks Shu
03:02:52 <hongbin> #link https://github.com/sudswas/zun-docker
03:03:05 <hongbin> shu-mutou: thx
03:03:26 <hongbin> any comments regarding to the annoucement?
03:03:50 <mkrai> Thanks sudipto
03:03:59 <hongbin> sudipto: just mentioned your work :)
03:04:07 <sudipto> hongbin, mkrai thanks! Sorry joined late.
03:04:29 <sudipto> that work needs a lot of work still. But i think i will finish automating everything with docker-compose by end of this week
03:04:42 <mkrai> hongbin, Can we add this to guide?
03:04:53 <hongbin> mkrai: if you want
03:04:57 <shubhams> sudipto : are there any dependencies or prerequisite for this to work ?
03:05:10 <sudipto> shubhams, just to have docker installed.
03:05:19 <sudipto> wherever you are trying this.
03:05:24 <shubhams> sudipto : cool , great work!
03:05:41 <mkrai> I think its good to add it.
03:05:52 <hongbin> mkrai: sure
03:06:01 <hongbin> #topic Review Action Items
03:06:07 <hongbin> 1. Create a bug to disable devstack job if a patch is a spec or doc change (DONE)
03:06:12 <hongbin> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/zun/+bug/1622244
03:06:14 <openstack> Launchpad bug 1622244 in Zun "Diable devstack job for a doc-only change" [Undecided,New] - Assigned to prameswar (prameswar)
03:06:19 <hongbin> 2. hongbin help shu-mutou to create a new repo for ui (DONE by Shu)
03:06:26 <hongbin> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/366489/
03:06:39 <hongbin> That is all for AIs
03:06:50 <hongbin> #topic Nova integration (Namrata)
03:06:55 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/nova-integration The BP
03:06:59 <hongbin> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-containers-nova-integration The etherpad
03:07:20 <hongbin> Namrata: ^^
03:07:27 <Namrata> yes
03:07:36 <Namrata> The updated patch is up for reviw
03:08:11 <hongbin> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/354553/
03:08:43 <adisky> hi
03:08:55 <hongbin> Namrata: i have another proposal which might touch a little about nova
03:09:20 <hongbin> adisky: hey, thanks for joining
03:09:28 <adisky> :)
03:09:31 <hongbin> Namrata: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/365754/
03:09:31 <Namrata> okay .whats the proposal
03:10:38 <hongbin> Namrata: i guess your proposal will depends on the decision of the other proposal
03:10:54 <hongbin> Namrata: we will discuss the network proposal later
03:10:59 <Namrata> okay sure
03:11:21 <hongbin> Any other comment regarding to the nova integration spec?
03:11:27 <Namrata> no
03:11:45 <shu-mutou> (^^)/ sorry, I'm late.
03:12:02 <hongbin> shu-mutou: hey, np. thanks for coming
03:12:07 <hongbin> #topic Support interactive mode
03:12:13 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-interactive-mode
03:12:29 <hongbin> i will explain this bp a bit
03:12:48 <hongbin> in docker, there is an interacive mode: docker run -it ubuntu /bin/bash
03:13:09 <hongbin> the bp is about doing something similar in zun
03:13:42 <hongbin> for example, zun run --image ubuntu --interactive
03:13:42 <sudipto> hongbin, waiting for your assessment on how we will do it :)
03:14:05 <hongbin> sudipto: i haven
03:14:14 <hongbin> sudipto: i haven't investigate on it yet
03:14:15 <sudipto> given the zun run can happen from anywhere
03:14:41 <sudipto> Ok i feel at this time, that it's not possible to do.
03:14:47 <hongbin> just want to get feedback on whether this is a good idea
03:15:01 <hongbin> sudipto: why?
03:15:12 <sudipto> you can't launch an interactive session just like docker does by running this command from a remote machine
03:15:30 <sudipto> you could do so via VNC - but that won't probably replicate the exact same behavior/
03:15:31 <sudipto> ?
03:15:47 <hongbin> sudipto: but swarm did that
03:15:51 <sudipto> docker does it by attaching a serial console to the process locally
03:16:10 <sudipto> ok - then i am least knowledged, i should find out how swarm did it.
03:16:40 <hongbin> yes, that is part of the job of the bp owner (if someone interest to take the bp)
03:16:54 <mkrai> I like the idea, but yes we have to look at the implementation details
03:17:37 <sudipto> I will do the investigation
03:17:50 <hongbin> sudipto: thx
03:18:13 <hongbin> sudipto: i just wanted to ask if there is a volunteer to take the work :)
03:18:30 <sudipto> hongbin, yeah i can take it and let you know if this is conclusive.
03:19:03 <hongbin> ok, then we can wait for sudipto to do an initial investigation, then re-discuss it at the next meeting
03:19:11 <sudipto> Sure thing.
03:19:26 <hongbin> #topic Container image store
03:19:32 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/glance-integration
03:19:38 <hongbin> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-container-image
03:19:57 <hongbin> we discussed this at the last meeting
03:20:50 <hongbin> at the last meeting, we discuss a solution:
03:21:14 <hongbin> solution 1: pull image from glance first, if miss, pull from docker hub
03:21:33 <hongbin> then, somebody proposal an alternative solution
03:22:02 <hongbin> solution 2: define a list of repo to pull images, and support it as configurable values
03:22:34 <hongbin> for example, there is config like ['dockerhub', 'glance'], then image will be pulled form docker hub first
03:22:59 <hongbin> finally, the glance ptl suggested to leverage the location feature from glance
03:23:15 <hongbin> solution 3: leverage location feature from glance
03:23:35 <mkrai> What is that location feature?
03:23:38 <hongbin> hopefully, i summarize everything correctly
03:24:01 <hongbin> mkrai: i don't know it in details, here is the general idea
03:24:17 <hongbin> mkrai: glance image has an attribute called "locations"
03:24:37 <hongbin> mkrai: it defines a list of locations to pull the glance image
03:24:53 <hongbin> mkrai: for example [swift://...., http://...]
03:25:23 <mkrai> So it can pull from docker hub also?
03:25:25 <hongbin> mkrai: also, glance has a configure called location strategy
03:25:51 <hongbin> mkrai: the location strategy will decide how to pull the image based on a location list
03:26:19 <hongbin> mkrai: re. docker hub, we needs a backend for glance to support docker hub
03:27:26 <hongbin> so, if we choose solution #3, the first thing we needs to do is to contribute a patch to glance to support docker hub as a backend
03:27:44 <mkrai> Ok got it. If glance can support all possible solutions, then it better to go with #3
03:27:50 <shubhams> hongbin : we will provide the user of zun api to provide the link location or it will be internally managed by zun ?
03:28:27 <mkrai> Then we have only one solution which will be easy to maintain
03:28:35 <hongbin> shubhams: i think it will internally defined by operators
03:29:10 <hongbin> shubhams: users just needs to specify the name of hte image, then zun / glance will decide how to pull it
03:29:26 <mkrai> hongbin, is anyone working on this bp?
03:29:50 <hongbin> mkrai: as far as i know, nobody is working on that so far
03:29:58 <mkrai> Ok I will take it
03:30:26 <shubhams> hongbin : what if as an operator I want to access image from a specific repo (local or remote whatever)
03:30:30 <mkrai> Do we have all this information on etherpad or anywhere?
03:30:49 <hongbin> mkrai: assigned it to you
03:30:49 <shubhams> mkrai : I can work on this with you
03:31:01 <mkrai> Thanks hongbin shubhams
03:32:00 <hongbin> shubhams: good question (what if as an operator I want to access image from a specific repo)
03:32:27 <hongbin> shubhams: frankly, i don't have a perfect answer for that
03:32:46 <hongbin> sudipto: what is your opinions?
03:33:08 <sudipto> i tend to believe the operator should have the flexibility
03:33:20 <shubhams> That was the reason, I proposed a "configure repo" kind of solution in last meeting
03:33:23 <sudipto> let's gather our thoughts on the ether pad?
03:33:30 <sudipto> and decide it eventually?
03:33:45 <shubhams> +1 sudipto for etherpad
03:33:50 <hongbin> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-container-image
03:34:05 <hongbin> this one is the old discussion
03:34:06 <sudipto> No one from the china team joined today?
03:34:12 <hongbin> want to reuse that one or create a new one?
03:34:18 <sudipto> (sorry if you had announced this before)
03:34:28 <hongbin> sudipto: yanyanhu is in travel this week
03:35:02 <sudipto> ok
03:35:14 <sudipto> wenzhi,
03:35:29 <hongbin> he didn't seem to be here today
03:35:33 <sudipto> ok...np
03:36:11 <hongbin> ok, all let's forward your input to the etherpad: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-container-image
03:36:21 <shubhams> hongbin : sure
03:36:50 <hongbin> the discussion in that etherpad might be outdated, remove it if you want
03:37:36 <hongbin> ok, next topic
03:37:37 <hongbin> #topic Container network
03:37:43 <hongbin> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/neutron-integration
03:37:48 <hongbin> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/365754/
03:38:07 <hongbin> we discussed this one at the previous meeting as well
03:38:17 <hongbin> let me do a recap
03:38:46 <hongbin> the proposal is about using nova to create a sandbox container
03:39:16 <hongbin> the sandbox container is an empty container, but with neutron ports attached (with network, ip)
03:39:56 <hongbin> all containers created in zun will go into sandbox containers
03:40:07 <hongbin> that is
03:40:19 <hongbin> in zun, create a container will do two things
03:40:27 <hongbin> 1. call nova to create a sandbox container
03:40:48 <hongbin> 2. have zun-compute to create a zun container, by using the namespace of the sandbox container
03:41:12 <hongbin> the point is to reuse nova to do the networking, scheduing, etc.
03:41:35 <hongbin> basically, the idea is to re-use everything in nova
03:41:57 <hongbin> however, containers are created by zun API
03:42:13 <hongbin> that is all
03:42:14 <mkrai> hongbin, How is this sandbox container created in nova?
03:42:15 <sudipto> and i had an objection towards it - because that makes us dependent on nova...however i would like to also get a sense of how much nova code is applicable as is for this work...
03:42:36 <sudipto> that is via the nova-docker driver i thought?
03:42:42 <sudipto> to answer mkrai
03:43:02 <mkrai> I have an objection using nova-docker as it is not maintained anymore
03:43:07 <hongbin> mkrai: that is something similar as how a instance is created in nova
03:43:39 <haiwei> hongbin, have a question, both the sandbox container and zun container will be created on  the same host(vm or baremetel)?
03:43:41 <hongbin> sudipto: the code to allocate IP address, securtiy group, firewall
03:44:17 <hongbin> haiwei: yes, they have to be in the same host
03:45:17 <hongbin> sudipto: want to listen to your opinions more, what are the disadvantages of depending on nova?
03:45:20 <haiwei> hongbin, so can zun takes over that sandbox container directly, not create a new one again
03:46:19 <sudipto> hongbin, depending on if we are using nova-docker - it has not future. IF we have problems with the nova code that we will use for containers - we are in trouble again.
03:46:30 <sudipto> Lest - if someone just wants to use zun - they will have to install nova as well
03:46:43 <hongbin> haiwei: i think no, zun will create another container in the namespace of the sandbox container
03:47:18 <hongbin> sudipto: i see
03:47:23 <mkrai> sudipto, I think it will be important to install nova anyhow, may be in future we would need it to run host for our containers
03:48:03 <sudipto> mkrai, run host means?
03:48:13 <mkrai> Personally I feel its ok to reuse nova code
03:48:36 <mkrai> sudipto, VMs where we run our containers
03:48:57 <hongbin> sudipto: to address your concern about dependency on nova, i revised the proposal as follow
03:49:17 <hongbin> sudipto: introduce a sandbox driver, where could have multiple implementation, and nova is hte default implementation
03:49:27 <hongbin> sudipto: would that address your concern?
03:49:50 <sudipto> hongbin, yeah that works :-)
03:50:03 <hongbin> cool
03:50:03 <sudipto> in the world of pluggable configurations - everything seems to fit in well :D
03:50:38 <sudipto> mkrai, running containers inside VMs doesn't mean our code has to dependent on the guy who creates the container IMHO.
03:50:49 <sudipto> but we are kinda settled on this now! Thanks!
03:51:28 <hongbin> any other question / concern about this proposal?
03:51:54 <mkrai> I will have a look at the spec
03:52:03 <mkrai> Thanks hongbin
03:52:21 <hongbin> mkrai: yes, i will revise the spec later
03:52:45 <hongbin> and discuss it again if there is any concern
03:52:59 <hongbin> ok, that's it for this topic
03:53:05 <hongbin> #topic Open Discussion
03:53:33 <hongbin> any other topic that needs to be discussed?
03:54:10 <hongbin> if nothing, let's end this meeting a little earlier
03:54:30 <haiwei> nope
03:54:30 <hongbin> thanks all for joining this meeting, the next meeting is next week the same time
03:54:37 <hongbin> #endmeeting