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| doug-fish | Hi translation community! Has there been any discussion yet on continuing to translate stable/liberty beyond the release, with the idea of having more/corrected translations in the first fix? | 14:11 |
|---|---|---|
| doug-fish | clarkb: fungi does ^ create any problems from an infra perspective? | 14:18 |
| clarkb | no the liberty jobs can keep running. likely stable release managers are who you need to convince | 14:19 |
| doug-fish | ah good to know | 14:19 |
| fungi | yeah, they'll be the ones who have to approve the patches | 14:19 |
| doug-fish | is there a stable release community/channel? | 14:20 |
| doug-fish | I don't look forward to going out to each project to engage people. | 14:20 |
| doug-fish | Maybe the ML | 14:20 |
| clarkb | also I think AJaeger and Daisy may have discussed this a bit on the ml already | 14:21 |
| doug-fish | clarkb: ah cool - I'll go back and review. Thanks! | 14:21 |
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| doug-fish | sounds like this discussion has already been covered in the ml | 14:43 |
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| Daisy | pleia2: there ? | 17:15 |
| clarkb | Daisy she may be traveling | 17:15 |
| clarkb | whats up? | 17:15 |
| Daisy | ok. | 17:15 |
| Daisy | I got her email, so I thought she might be online. | 17:16 |
| Daisy | I don't know the reason but it seems like version merging doesn't work. | 17:16 |
| Daisy | I sent an email to pleia2 and you just now. | 17:16 |
| pleia2 | Daisy: I'm on a call, but trying to catch up with email too | 17:16 |
| pleia2 | Daisy: I'm wondering if AJaeger over in #openstack-infra might be good to chat with about this too, he has more experience with the UI | 17:17 |
| pleia2 | I'll see if he's around and can join here | 17:17 |
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| AJaeger | hi | 17:18 |
| Daisy | Hi, AJaeger | 17:18 |
| Daisy | It seems like version merging doesn't work . | 17:18 |
| AJaeger | let me read backscroll on eavesdrop... | 17:18 |
| Daisy | I merged the stable-liberty version into master version, nothing happens. | 17:18 |
| Daisy | So I want to check if there are any errors in the back end. | 17:19 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: which project? | 17:19 |
| Daisy | Any one | 17:19 |
| Daisy | You could try keystone. You could try nova too. | 17:19 |
| * AJaeger can't check errors but let me test nova myself now... | 17:19 | |
| AJaeger | I'll be back in 10 mins... | 17:20 |
| pleia2 | Daisy: doing this on translate.openstack.org, not -dev, right? | 17:20 |
| Daisy | I remember when I did merge before, there will be a progress bar. | 17:20 |
| Daisy | pleia2: Yes, I'm using translate.openstack.org now. | 17:20 |
| Daisy | ha, Horizon works correct. | 17:23 |
| Daisy | so it should not be a server error, I guess. | 17:24 |
| AJaeger | I tried nova and merge did not work ;( | 17:25 |
| AJaeger | Comparing German: I have 100 % translated files in stable-liberty but 5 % in master ;( | 17:25 |
| pleia2 | 17:25:06,261Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-1) merge translations start: from nova:master to nova:master | 17:26 |
| pleia2 | 17:25:06,264Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-1) merge translation end: from nova:master to nova:master, 2.574 ms | 17:26 |
| pleia2 | not sure if that's related | 17:26 |
| pleia2 | but I'm not seeing errors in the logs | 17:26 |
| Daisy | I think they are related. | 17:26 |
| AJaeger | that is fast... | 17:27 |
| pleia2 | AJaeger: how many minutes ago did you attempt with nova? | 17:27 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: if you try with Horizon, you will see the differences. | 17:27 |
| pleia2 | (so many logs) | 17:27 |
| AJaeger | I just tried it again, so that might have been mine... | 17:27 |
| pleia2 | there are some errors at 17:23 UTC | 17:27 |
| pleia2 | (4 minutes ago) | 17:28 |
| AJaeger | might have been my first try, pleia2 | 17:28 |
| pleia2 | 17:23:37,137Z ERROR [org.jboss.seam.transaction.SynchronizationRegistry] (pool-5-thread-7) Exception processing transaction Synchronization after completion: java.lang.NullPointerException: Null keys are not supported! | 17:29 |
| pleia2 | that's the main error it bumps into | 17:29 |
| pleia2 | whatever that means \o/ | 17:30 |
| pleia2 | 17:23:40,561Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-7) merge translation end: from horizon:stable-liberty to horizon:master, 33.08 s | 17:31 |
| pleia2 | so that seems to be when it's successful | 17:31 |
| pleia2 | but I'm not seeing similar log lines for nova | 17:31 |
| AJaeger | pleia2: could you send an email to the Zanata devs? Or is one of them around here? | 17:31 |
| Daisy | Yes, Horizon merging last 33s, and nova merging last 2.5ms. | 17:31 |
| AJaeger | Far too quick for nova ;) | 17:32 |
| pleia2 | yeah, so if I grep through the logs for "stable-liberty" there are none associated with nova | 17:33 |
| pleia2 | there's general noise about users doing things from earlier in the day, but no "merge translation" messages | 17:33 |
| pleia2 | the ones I pasted above were "from nova:master to nova:master" | 17:33 |
| Daisy | :) | 17:35 |
| pleia2 | I'll loop camunoz into the email that Daisy already sent (Alex Eng was already included) | 17:35 |
| Daisy | Interesting | 17:35 |
| AJaeger | Daisy, did you talk with the stable team regarding keeping liberty open? | 17:36 |
| Daisy | I create an empty version in Cinder named as test, and merge from stable-liberty to master, I see the merge starts, I see the progress bar. | 17:36 |
| Daisy | Without that empty version in Cinder, when I tried to merge from stable-liberty to master, nothing happen. | 17:37 |
| AJaeger | interesting... | 17:37 |
| Daisy | I guess, there might be some errors with their UI. | 17:37 |
| Daisy | Let me try with Nov. | 17:37 |
| Daisy | nova | 17:37 |
| AJaeger | let the Zanata folks figure it out instead of working around it IMHO. | 17:37 |
| pleia2 | 17:35:48,254Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-8) merge translation end: from cinder:stable-liberty to cinder:master, 12.36 s | 17:38 |
| Daisy | pleia2's information "from nova:master to nova:master" give me some hints. | 17:38 |
| pleia2 | did that work? | 17:38 |
| pleia2 | someone was merging cinder, looks like | 17:38 |
| Daisy | I merged cinder. | 17:39 |
| Daisy | I'm merging nova now. | 17:39 |
| Daisy | It starts. | 17:39 |
| Daisy | I think we figured it out. | 17:39 |
| pleia2 | oh? | 17:40 |
| pleia2 | 17:39:07,590Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-1) merge translations start: from nova:stable-liberty to nova:master | 17:40 |
| Daisy | nova is merged. | 17:40 |
| pleia2 | 17:40:00,830Z INFO [org.zanata.service.impl.MergeTranslationsServiceImpl] (pool-5-thread-1) merge translation end: from nova:stable-liberty to nova:master, 53.24 s | 17:40 |
| pleia2 | what was the problem? | 17:40 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: you could take a look now. | 17:40 |
| Daisy | pleia2: I think there must be a bug with their UI. If there are only two versions, stable-liberty and master, the UI will not pass correct parameter to the back end. From the log message, it is said: from nova:master to nova: master. | 17:41 |
| AJaeger | no difference for German ;( | 17:41 |
| AJaeger | I take that back. | 17:42 |
| Daisy | If I add an empty version, and I select the dropdown list, the UI will pass the correct parameters to the back end. | 17:42 |
| AJaeger | German is updated now - 96 to 100 %, so looks fine. | 17:42 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: that should help the zanata team reproduce! | 17:42 |
| Daisy | Yes, Japanese translations look fine too. | 17:43 |
| * AJaeger bows to Ms Sherlock Daisy | 17:43 | |
| pleia2 | great, I'll loop in Carlos with that email and send them a link to this channel log so they can see the process | 17:43 |
| Daisy | Thank you, pleia2 and AJaeger. | 17:43 |
| pleia2 | you're welcome, nice work | 17:48 |
| AJaeger | Thank you, Daisy ! | 17:48 |
| AJaeger | pleia2, Daisy, doug-fish: While I have you here: | 17:48 |
| AJaeger | I wrote up a new proposal based on the private discussion Daisy and I had regarding how to continue with Liberty. | 17:49 |
| AJaeger | It's at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Translations/Infrastructure#New_proposal | 17:49 |
| AJaeger | Daisy, does that reflect what you proposed? | 17:49 |
| Daisy | reading it | 17:49 |
| doug-fish | AJaeger: I think new proposal step 3 has a typo | 17:50 |
| doug-fish | master branch is made writable, right? | 17:50 |
| doug-fish | no sorry | 17:50 |
| doug-fish | I'm wrong | 17:50 |
| doug-fish | please ignore. :-) | 17:50 |
| doug-fish | AJaeger: does step 8 mean EOL for the branch? | 17:51 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: in step 8, "the stable branch in Zanata is closed" means deleting it ? | 17:52 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: yes, deleting it. doug-fish I mean: Last release by team. EOL is done by infra team and might be a few days or weeks later... | 17:53 |
| doug-fish | AJaeger: understood - thanks | 17:53 |
| doug-fish | so this proposal allows for translating stable branches throughout the lifetime of the related code | 17:54 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: yes, that's what Daisy proposed | 17:55 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: I'm for closing earlier but I'm open to experiment with this and see how it works out. | 17:55 |
| AJaeger | But Daisy needs to get buy-in from stable-maint team first, so having a proposal will help with discussing. | 17:55 |
| doug-fish | I like keeping it open for a time, but up until near EOL seems a long time | 17:56 |
| AJaeger | pleia2 and myself need to know what to do on the infrastructure side | 17:56 |
| doug-fish | yes, I was thinking about their process https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StableBranch | 17:56 |
| Daisy | I don't know if it is reasonable "after the RC2 merge, there is no copying from stable branch to master done. " I think copies might be necessary under some special cases. | 17:56 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: What about "no automatic" - if translators request it, we can do it. But they have to ask... | 17:56 |
| doug-fish | I poked a couple of them privately and I understand that they still tend to rubber stamp stuff proposed from the bots | 17:56 |
| doug-fish | like requirements updates | 17:56 |
| AJaeger | Daisy, what do you think keeping stable/liberty open until RC1 of Mitaka instead? That means two branches in parallel only | 17:57 |
| doug-fish | AJaeger: that seems short | 17:57 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: yes, the bots needs a +2A, we want some review. But normally it's a single +2 and not two. | 17:57 |
| doug-fish | oh RC1 | 17:57 |
| doug-fish | I was thinking M1 | 17:57 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: that means half a year - so until End of March! | 17:58 |
| doug-fish | yeah | 17:58 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: yes, no automatic happen, or actually, my requirement is : no happen in batch to all languages. I hope I could select language while merging. I know Zanata doesn't support it. | 17:58 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: but we could use "no automatic". | 17:58 |
| AJaeger | Ok, let me update... | 17:58 |
| doug-fish | is there any way to enforce a policy where only serious translation issues would be fixed beyond 6 months? | 17:58 |
| doug-fish | something like the stable policy for code | 17:58 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: what do you think of the half year? | 17:58 |
| doug-fish | s/enforce/encourage | 17:59 |
| pleia2 | hehe | 17:59 |
| AJaeger | Please reload the page, I updated a bit... | 18:00 |
| AJaeger | Daisy, I named it a proposal so that the complete i18n team can review it - and you can review with stable maint team... | 18:00 |
| Daisy | ok. I will do that, AJaeger. | 18:00 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: Create a feature request for zanata ;) | 18:00 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: what timeframe to write? I fear we have too many branches at one point and therefore would limit it for now... | 18:01 |
| Daisy | AJaeger and doug-fish: could you give me some reference page of stable maint team ? I'd like to understand their work. Then I could think about how to collaborate with them. | 18:02 |
| doug-fish | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StableBranch | 18:02 |
| Daisy | thank you, doug-fish | 18:02 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: doug-fish quoted it above: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StableBranch | 18:02 |
| doug-fish | sure np | 18:02 |
| doug-fish | I have to move rooms - back shortly! | 18:02 |
| * AJaeger was to slow... | 18:02 | |
| AJaeger | thanks, doug-fish | 18:02 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: I didn't understand: what timeframe to write? I fear we have too many branches at one point and therefore would limit it for now... | 18:03 |
| Daisy | Write what ? | 18:03 |
| Daisy | limit what for now ? | 18:03 |
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| AJaeger | Daisy: the discussion between doug-fish and myself. He suggested that translating until EOL of the branch is a long time. | 18:05 |
| AJaeger | So, we discussed doing it until the rlease of the next version. Please reload and see my alternative | 18:05 |
| AJaeger | "Briefly before RC1 of next stable release is cut, the stable branch in Zanata is closed. So, there is always a single stable branch (latest release) and the master to translate on." | 18:05 |
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| Daisy | It looks like reasonable. | 18:06 |
| Daisy | It seems reasonable. I don't have objections. | 18:06 |
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| AJaeger | Daisy: Ok, then I remove the alternative and let's continue on the mailing list... | 18:07 |
| doug-fi__ | I'm back - my apologies if this was covered while I was out ... | 18:07 |
| doug-fi__ | on Note that stable branches will only be created for repositories that have already at least *one* translation of the main file. Repositories with only translated log files or with no translations at all are not branched. We consider a file translated if at least 75 per cent of its messages are translated. | 18:07 |
| doug-fi__ | how critical is that? | 18:07 |
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| doug-fi__ | I have some naive hope that some projects might get translated that aren't yet | 18:08 |
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| AJaeger | doug-fi__: two issues: A project that has only log translations, is not really translated. So, I don't want to add jobs for that one | 18:09 |
| doug-fish | sure - that makes sense to me as well | 18:10 |
| AJaeger | the other point is: branch and master diverge, so if they have little translation in stable, they have a lot to do keep both translated in a similar way. | 18:10 |
| * doug-fish thinking | 18:11 | |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: I'm not strict on this case. If a translation-team translates project X on master and wants to translate then stable as well, I would be fine with setting up zanata and infra jobs for that. | 18:11 |
| AJaeger | But I don't want to do it proactively, there're too many manual steps involved... | 18:11 |
| doug-fish | cool - that's what I was hoping for. I'm not sure that can really happen | 18:11 |
| doug-fish | ok yes, I understand now. Thanks! | 18:11 |
| AJaeger | Great | 18:13 |
| Daisy | AJaeger: sorry for my slow reading speed. What are the differences of your suggestion and doug-fish's suggestion: "until the rlease of the next version" vs. "before RC1 of next stable release is cut". Are they the same ? | 18:14 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: depends how you interpret it, it's basically the same. | 18:15 |
| Daisy | OK. Thank you. | 18:15 |
| doug-fish | agreed | 18:15 |
| Daisy | AJaeger and doug-fish: I have to go to sleep now. Let's continue the discussion in ML. | 18:15 |
| Daisy | Thank you very much for your help. | 18:16 |
| doug-fish | good night Daisy! thanks for staying up late to chat with us! | 18:16 |
| Daisy | doug-fish: my pleasure. | 18:16 |
| AJaeger | Daisy: good night! Thanks for a great discussion and I'm glad that we solved parts of the copy puzzle! | 18:16 |
| Daisy | Thank you, AJaeger. | 18:17 |
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| * AJaeger just made an initial patch for the project team guide to document translations very briefly. See https://review.openstack.org/#/c/232144/ | 18:40 | |
| * AJaeger discussed separetly with Daisy, she will fill in the rest ;) | 18:41 | |
| AJaeger | doug-fish, pleia2 reviews are welcome! | 18:41 |
| pleia2 | AJaeger: oh lovely | 18:41 |
| AJaeger | pleia2: dhellmann asked for a brief information and I volunteered myself for the technical part... | 18:42 |
| pleia2 | :) | 18:43 |
| pleia2 | AJaeger: ah good, you caught the link issue, was looking at rendered doc and was just going to mention it | 18:51 |
| AJaeger | thanks | 18:51 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: yes, we upload after each merge - using a post job. | 18:57 |
| doug-fish | cool! | 18:57 |
| doug-fish | is that new? | 18:57 |
| AJaeger | I have never seen it different - so this is the case over a year (or two) at least now... | 18:58 |
| doug-fish | not new | 18:58 |
| AJaeger | yep | 18:58 |
| doug-fish | I must be mixing up some other process. Thanks for the clarification! | 18:58 |
| AJaeger | the import - from translation server to repo - is done once a day. But that's not new either | 18:59 |
| AJaeger | pleia2: updated document up | 18:59 |
| pleia2 | AJaeger: thanks, reviewed :) | 19:00 |
| doug-fish | Please excuse my silliness, but this is stuck in my head after talking about stable releases: "Always two there are, a master and stable". | 19:01 |
| doug-fish | That's a near-yoda quote :-) | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | ;9 | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | pleia2, doug-fish: What about | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | "Translation start by default on the master branch. The i18n team | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | creates stable branches for certain projects once a stable branch is | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | created in git, and then translations are done on the stable branch on | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | the translation server as well and synced with the stable git branch. | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | " | 19:01 |
| AJaeger | is that better? The process is to fresh for me going into much more details... | 19:02 |
| AJaeger | shall I push taht version? | 19:03 |
| pleia2 | I like yoda | 19:06 |
| pleia2 | but that one's fine too :) | 19:06 |
| AJaeger | pushed it now so that it can be reviewed again in context... | 19:07 |
| AJaeger | enough fun for today, I'll sign off slowly as well... | 19:14 |
| pleia2 | thanks AJaeger | 19:17 |
| doug-fish | AJaeger: yeah I think your suggestion captures it | 20:00 |
| doug-fish | (sorry - was in a meeting) | 20:00 |
| AJaeger | doug-fish: no problem - and glad to hear... | 20:02 |
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