Wednesday, 2014-03-19

flwangkgriffs: ping00:04
kgriffsflwang: pong00:04
flwangkgriffs: so what's the result of graduation?00:05
flwangkgriffs: i didn't found it from the chat log00:05
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kgriffssorry, could you repeat? I had a connection blip00:06
flwang(08:05:24 AM) flwang: kgriffs: so what's the result of graduation?00:07
flwang(08:05:51 AM) flwang: kgriffs: i didn't found it from the chat log00:07
kgriffsflwang: ah, so the vote has been postponed one week00:07
kgriffsthree things to address00:08
kgriffs1. Should marconi even be a data-plane API, or simply provision things like RabbitMQ?00:08
flwangkgriffs: listening to see what i can do :)00:08
kgriffsI responded to that on the ML00:08
kgriffsflwang: honestly, that is an old discussion, but we have new TC members who are asking00:09
kgriffsfair enough00:09
kgriffs2. Should the TC allow Falcon?00:09
kgriffsdoug is concerned that the evaluation was slanted, in spite of our best efforts to mitigate bias.00:09
kgriffsto be fair, the only way to avoid that would be to have another team do the eval, I suppose. But that isn't what the TC asked for when we were incubated, and we did the best we could00:10
kgriffs3. The tempest tests are "in the wrong place"00:10
flwangfor #2, maybe Glance is a place we can leverage00:11
flwanglet me find a link, one sec00:11
kgriffsmeaning, we have functional tests that run with tox, but they should probably be moved. This came from a misunderstanding between malini and something sdague said in00:11
kgriffs#openstack-qa a while back00:11
flwangkgriffs: as for #3, does that mean we should move some functional test cases into tempest?00:14
kgriffsflwang: possibly. I think that would be the quickest way to get a +1 from sdague00:17
flwangkgriffs: yep, IMHO, I don't think #3 should be a blocker for the graduation :(00:17
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flwangkgriffs: at least, we can improve it later00:18
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kgriffsflwang: pardon my ignorance, but does glance server images directly through its API? I've never used glance directly.00:21
flwangkgriffs: I would say yes00:26
flwangkgriffs: user create/consume the images with rest api00:28
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vkmckgriffs, Have a moment for a quick question?01:47
kgriffsvkmc: sure01:47
vkmckgriffs, I'm working on my proposal for this GSoC project
vkmckgriffs, And I'm trying to decide wheter to suggest NoSQL or SQL storage engines01:50
kgriffshmm, what we most need are things like Redis01:51
vkmckgriffs, At first, I was convinced about proposing a NoSQL solution... but now I'm not sure what will be more suitable for Marconi01:51
kgriffsvkmc: I think a NewSQL driver may be interesting01:51
vkmcOh that's new for me01:52
kgriffsbut as far as SQL goes, it would only be interesting if it has a compelling advantage over the SQLAlchemy driver01:52
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vkmcCool... that's a good point to mention in the proposal01:52
kgriffsvkmc: VelocityDB is one01:52
vkmcSo, Redis in which category falls? NoSQL, right?01:53
kgriffsyep, nosql01:53
vkmcSo... if we already have Mongo, why we want another NoSQL solution? (that's the point I'm trying to highlight)01:54
kgriffsvkmc: different characterstics01:54
vkmcI know there are many differences among NoSQL solutions01:54
kgriffsso, Redis would be really fast but you couldn't store as many messages, and we might have to relax some guarantees01:54
kgriffsthere are always tradeoffs01:55
vkmcOf course, computer sciences is about tradeoffs  :)01:55
kgriffsI used to have a list of nosql dbs but not sure where it went01:56
kgriffsI'm sure google knows.01:56
vkmcI made one... for my proposal01:56
vkmcI included Swift, RethinkDB, CouchDB... and some more01:56
vkmcBut... I was re-reading it again and I noticed that I don't mention why I choose NoSQL over SQL01:57
vkmcSo I was trying to clear that up01:57
kgriffsah, right - sorry, I'm multitasking. :p02:00
vkmcSure :) Np02:00
kgriffsthat looks like a pretty good list.02:00
kgriffshaving more drivers will help us tease out what parts of the API are hard to map02:01
vkmcYeah, I also thought that by providing support for multiple storage backends will increase Marconi's flexibility and scalability02:01
vkmcBut... the NoSQL vs SQL (and know I'll consider NewSQL) decision got me confused02:02
kgriffsoh, also we are thinking about introducing a queue "flavor" feature, so a user could choose a different back end depending on their use case02:03
vkmcMaybe just mentioning that a NoSQL alternative would fit the project better could do the trick... I don't want to sound vague though02:03
vkmcOh that's really cool02:03
vkmcWell, I'll do some thinking in that direction :)02:06
vkmcThanks kgriffs!02:06
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vkmcTtyt :)03:03
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flwang1flaper87: morning :)07:20
flaper87flwang1: morning07:26
flwang1flaper87: are you ready to answer some questions from China? :D07:27
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flaper87flwang1: shooooooot07:31
flaper87flwang1: that was easy07:35
flaper87This chinese questions make no noise07:35
flwang1flaper87: sorry for the late response07:52
flwang1flaper87: so by default, we're using sqlite for our sqlalchemy test, correct?07:53
flwang1flaper87: but in my local test, I found seems our unit test  code is trying to use the system's marconi config, does that work as designed?07:57
flwang1flaper87: around?08:18
flaper87flwang1: mmhh, yeah, It tries to get your local config08:25
flaper87flwang1: we have an environment variable that could be used to specify other config paths08:25
flwang1flaper87: it doesn't make sense.08:25
flaper87but I think it tries to get your config either way08:25
flaper87flwang1: agreed08:25
flaper87that should be change08:25
flaper87it should read the configs JUST when explicitly specified08:25
flwang1because now i'm running into some problem about this :)08:26
flwang1I specify mysql in my local config, but I didn't create Marconi schema in mysql. then I will run into problems during run tox08:27
flaper87flwang1: erm, mmh, erm, mmh08:27
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flwang1something about can't connect to the mysql server08:27
flaper87flwang1: yeah, that needs to be fixed08:27
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flwang1flaper87: ok, I will file a bug08:28
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flwang1flaper87: another question is coming when you are available :D08:32
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flwangflaper87: back?09:52
flaper87flwang: hey10:03
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flwangflaper87: we're providing the marconi config sample with marconi.conf10:19
flwangflaper87: and I saw the config entry log_file and log_dir, so are they using?10:19
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flaper87flwang: yeah, that's all openstack/common/log10:22
flwangflaper87: hmm... in my local env, I have below config files10:23
flwanglogging.conf  marconi.conf  marconi-proxy.conf  marconi-queues.conf10:24
flaper87you just need marconi.conf10:24
flaper87the other ones are old10:24
flwangflaper87: I see10:24
flwangflaper87: but what I want to raise is if there is a conf marconi-queues.conf10:25
flwangflaper87: then the log will be written to the file configured in marconi-queues.conf10:25
flwangflaper87: so do you think it's an issue, or I should remove the old conf and assume everything is ok :D10:25
flaper87ah wait a second10:26
flaper87the right file is marconi-queues.conf10:26
flaper87I think10:26
flaper87now I'm confused10:26
flaper87yeah, prog is marconi-queues10:26
flaper87so it should be marconi-queues.conf10:27
flaper87does it read marconi.conf as well?10:27
flwangflaper87: I think sometimes10:29
flwangflaper87: TBH, it's really bad to see this :(10:29
flaper87flwang: so, this has historical reasons, FWIW10:29
flwangflaper87: so I think they are messed, but I can't figure out when and where10:29
flwangflaper87: what I can tell is seems we are printing log to the path we defined in marconi_queues.conf, and read some others entries from the marconi.conf, such as storage driver, etc10:31
flwangflaper87: i understand there are historical reasons10:31
flaper87flwang: try getting rid of marconi.conf and see if marconi-queues.conf is correctly read10:31
flaper87The config generated used marconi.conf so, I think it's marconi.conf10:31
flaper87but I remember discussing this with the guys10:31
flaper87and the reason to have marconi-queues.conf is that well.. it's the queues service config file10:32
flwangflaper87: hold on10:32
flwangflaper87: did you mean we need both the two?10:32
flaper87flwang: nope, I mean, we shouldn't need both and the right one should be marconi-queues.conf10:33
flaper87so, pls, double check this is indeed an issue10:33
flwangflaper87: yes, i'm10:33
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flwangflaper87: I think there are some problems, though I don't want to admit :D10:33
flwangflaper87: and, why we place the sample conf under /etc and named it as marconi.conf.sample10:34
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flwangflaper87: and everybody told me i should use the marconi.conf, that's the big confusion for me NOW10:35
flwangflaper87: anyway, I will dig into this10:35
flwangflaper87: btw, do we need a sample file for marconi-proxy.conf under marconi/etc? just curious why there isn't10:38
ekarlsois marconi gonna graduate or ?10:38
flwangekarlso: the vote is postponed after 1 week, AFAIK10:40
flwangflaper87: can you help check if there is the marconi_queues.conf under your local folder?10:40
flaper87flwang: who told you I've a local config folder that actually works ?10:41
flaper87flwang: marconi-proxy is old stuff10:41
flaper87it was removed10:41
flwangflaper87: haha, my son10:41
flaper87flwang: your son is smart :D10:42
flwangflaper87: i have given his English name as MARCONI,haha10:42
flaper87flwang: so, what's your son's name?10:42
flaper87flwang: btw, it should be marconi-queues.conf (with - not _)10:42
flwangi know10:43
flwangjust typo10:43
flaper87ah ok10:43
* flaper87 STFU10:43
flwangnow his name is Marconi Wang, i mean english name10:43
flwangbut I need the approval from his mom :)10:43
flaper87awesome :D10:45
flwangflaper87: pls tell me if there is a marconi-queues.conf under you local folder :D10:45
flaper87flwang: I just have marconi.conf.bck :D10:47
flaper87which is even more confusing10:47
flaper87flwang: I can help you digging into this if you want10:47
flwangflaper87: i got some bad smell TBH :)10:48
flwangflaper87: let me report what i have observed10:48
flwang1. I think the root cause is we should update the prog10:52
flwang2. in my local env, I need the both file to start, maybe it's caused my bad storage config10:52
flwangflaper87: 3. I have opened a bug
flwangflaper87: hope i'm wrong10:53
flaper87flwang: prog shouldn't be changed10:54
flaper87it has to be marconi-queues10:54
flaper87because we'll have marconi-notification at some point10:54
flaper87I'll dig into this10:54
flwangso can you share me what's your local config?10:55
flaper87flwang: I'm serious, I don't have one. I just have that old .bck file10:56
flaper87flwang: FWIW, this is how config files are discovered:
flwangflaper87: kill me, pls10:56
flaper87flwang: here's your answer:
flaper87so, it's not messed up, that's just how it works10:57
flaper87marconi.conf helps grouping config that are common in other services10:57
flwangi see, let me verify that again, thanks for pointing that10:57
flaper87then you have service specific configs like marconi-queues.conf etc10:58
flaper87flwang: np10:58
flwangflaper87: so back to my previous question10:58
flwang(06:32:56 PM) flwang: flaper87: did you mean we need both the two?10:58
flwang(06:33:19 PM) flaper87: flwang: nope, I mean, we shouldn't need both and the right one should be marconi-queues.conf10:58
flaper87flwang: yeah, my bad :P10:59
flaper87we *don't* need both but we can use both10:59
* flaper87 should know these things10:59
flwangI don't think it's accurate11:00
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flaper87flwang: why ?11:00
flaper87flwang: it makes sense to me11:00
flaper87We should improve the documentation, though11:00
flaper87there you go, we have a low-hanging-fruit for OPW applicants11:00
flwangflaper87: haha, let me ask more questions11:01
flwangflaper87: so what's the recommend way?11:02
flaper87flwang: The recommended way is using openstack-queues.conf11:03
flaper87I'd say11:04
flwangflaper87: hmm... but in the past, seems we're recommending the new comer using marconi.conf and as you see, we put a sample with that name11:05
flwangand which was renamed from marconi-queues.conf.sample, IIRC11:05
flwangflaper87: but yes, given the marconi-notification is coming, I'm on your side :D11:05
flaper87once marconi-notification gets here the recommended way will be:11:06
flwangplace common conf under marconi.conf11:06
flaper87- Put whatever is common between those services in marconi.conf and the specific configs in marconi-$service.conf11:06
flwangplace specific conf under separated marconi-xxx.conf11:06
flwangglad to see we're on the same page :D11:07
flwangok, I will leverage the bug to track the document improvement11:07
flwangreally appreciate your time to make this more clear11:07
flaper87my pleasure11:08
flaper87thank you for noticing that11:08
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flwangflaper87: welcome, you know, i'm still new for this cute project11:13
flwangflaper87: so I'd like dig every corners :D11:13
flaper87flwang: pls do, there are obscure things in it :D11:16
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alcabreraGood morning, all. :)12:13
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flwangalcabrera: hey, how's going o?12:21
alcabreraflwang: hey! Things are going well this morning. I'm in for some car maintenance, so I'm hanging out in a Toyota lounge while catching up on morning reading.12:22
alcabreraflwang: how about you?12:22
flwangalcabrera: just had a discussion about marconi.conf, you can look it at here if you're interested in12:23
flwangalcabrera: in a short, we discussed if we need both marconi.conf and marconi-queues.conf12:23
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flwangand what's the relationship12:24
flwangand how to handle them for now and the future12:24
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flwangalcabrera: given the marconi-notification.conf is coming :)12:24
alcabreravkmc: hey!12:25
alcabreraflwang: lemme catch up on this. :)12:25
flwangvkmc: morning12:26
alcabreraflwang: I'm in agreement with the view that we should have marconi-queues.conf and (eventually) marconi-notifications.conf12:27
alcabreragiven how oslo.config works12:27
alcabreraotherwise, I'd say, marconi/queues.conf and marconi/notifications.conf12:27
alcabreravkmc: how are you? :)12:27
flwangalcabrera: yep, obviously, we need to document this config to avoid confusion12:28
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vkmcalcabrera, flwang o/12:30
vkmcalcabrera, I'm fine, thanks for asking. And you?12:32
vkmc+1 to Toyota and their wifi haha12:32
alcabreravkmc: heh, yes wifi. :D12:32
alcabreraI love places that provide it.12:32
alcabreraIt makes almost no sense not to provide it, as a business12:33
alcabrerabut yes.12:33
alcabreraI'm well!12:33
alcabreraThings are looking up this morning. :)12:33
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vkmcThat's great to hear12:35
flwangalcabrera: i'm working on signed messages, any thoughts when you see this at a glance? :)12:36
vkmcI'm finishing my proposal while looking for a good restructured text editor... Gist is not working since yesterday12:36
vkmcI had to expect that, when you get near a deadline usually things stop working12:37
* flaper87 reads backlog12:38
flaper87alcabrera: didn't we have queues.conf at some point?12:39
flaper87we probably just considered it but never did it12:39
alcabreravkmc: I use a combination of emacs w/ pandoc for RsT editing. I compile the RsT => PDF to make sure it matches what I expect, and emacs + flycheck flags me on silly syntax errors while I edit.12:41
flwangflaper87: besides, given we're ^dropping^ the term of 'queue', do we need the marconi-queues.conf anymore? or we need a better name for this file?12:41
alcabreraflwang: signed messages? Adding some integrity/autheticity checks to messages? :)12:41
alcabreraflaper87: Maybe. I've lost track, tbh. :P12:41
flwangalcabrera: exactly12:42
flwangflaper87: any suggestion on the signed messages idea? I'd like to steal some thoughts from you guys :D12:43
alcabreraflwang: awesome! sounds like an interesting feature.12:43
vkmcalcabrera, Thanks, I'll check it now12:43
flaper87flwang: the signed messages idea sounds amazing. I'm not sure I'm in the right mind-set to discuss it in depth right now but I definitely want to be part of that discussion12:44
flwangflaper87: alcabrera: I will definitely make sure you guys will be involved :D12:45
flwangflaper87: and TBH, I have proposed the 'signed images' idea for Glance as well ;012:46
flwangflaper87: I believe there are some common area ;)12:46
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kgriffshey everyone13:19
alcabrerahola, kgriffs. o/13:19
flwangkgriffs: morning13:20
flaper87kgriffs: hey hey13:23
flaper87good morning13:23
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sriram1good morning :)13:24
openstackgerritJon Bernard proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Include full license text
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jbernardflaper87: thanks :)13:41
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flaper87jbernard: thank YOU!13:45
mpanettaMorning all13:48
flaper87jbernard: the gate failed13:48
alcabrerampanetta: good morning!13:49
jbernardflaper87: it hates me13:49
mpanettaHow goes alcabrera?13:49
flaper87jbernard: who doesn't?13:49
* flaper87 hides and runs away13:50
jbernardflaper87: i know, right!13:50
alcabrerampanetta: alright. Toyota wifi is *good enough* to keep me temporarily happy. :)13:50
mpanettaalcabrera: Is it slow?13:51
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alcabrerampanetta: a bit. I'm seeing 128 - 256 Kbps.13:52
alcabrerait's also a little flaky.13:52
alcabreraIt's dropped me once in an hour.13:53
flaper87alcabrera: do you have wifi in your car?13:53
* flaper87 assumes alcabrera owns a Toyota13:53
alcabreraflaper87: I have a Toyota car, but I'm at the shop at the moment. The Toyota center has wifi.13:54
alcabreracar-as-wifi-hot-spot would be pretty cool13:54
mpanettaOh man car wifi would rock13:55
flaper87I've been dreaming with that13:55
flaper87Well, it's not that placing a umts hotspot somewhere in the car is hard to do13:55
alcabrerainternet infrastructure isn't quite open or distributed enough to make that work, I think. At least in the USA. :P13:57
alcabreragonna be a bit longer - the fellow who is performing maintenance on my vehicle told me they're going to need to do a tire change. :)13:58
alcabreranew tires - first tire change in four years. This'll be interesting.13:58
flaper87alcabrera: that's what they say before pimping your ride!13:58
alcabreraI won't even recognize my car when I get back to it13:59
alcabrerasuddenly, green => purple, sedan-ish => 2-door, gasoline => electric, wallet-full => wallet-empty13:59
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kgriffsbe back in a little while14:18
jbernardflaper87: flake8 is unhappy about the license file, but its not clear to me why the others do not have this problem14:21
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alcabreramalini: hey! :D14:23
malinicatching up the conv above14:24
maliniI still dont think it is a case of misunderstanding14:24
maliniwrt tests being in the wrong place14:24
malini'they' cant seem to decide what they want14:24
flaper87jbernard: mmh, not sure, TBH. Prpobably the headers in our python files are not correct?14:26
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mpanettamornin malini14:41
maliniGood Morning mpanetta !14:42
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flaper87balajiiyer: ping15:36
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kgriffsmalini: what do you think about moving tests to meet the tempest req?17:05
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malinikgriffs: it is easy to do..But I want us to have a discussion with the broader community before doing that17:39
kgriffsmalini: ok. I see we have two options. (1) just move the tests, (2) argue that they don't belong there.17:39
malinikgriffs: I am not talking abt arguing.It is a discussion that needs to happen17:40
kgriffs(1) may be cause the least friction, but I get that there is the question of whether we are incurring technical debt to appease politics17:40
maliniwe cannot ping pong between the project & tempest - if somebody gets a diff idea later on17:40
kgriffsoic. OK, so we need to get them to say "do X or Y" and we will just do thaty17:40
maliniyes..I want the requirements to be listed down clearly17:41
kgriffsif that is fair, do you think that the community will get the impression we are happy to do X, as soon as X is defined?17:41
malinikgriffs: see my pm17:43
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openstackgerritJon Bernard proposed a change to openstack/marconi: Update license headers on select source files
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jbernard^ that fixes the gate failures on my previous patch18:51
kgriffscool, thanks!18:53
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kgriffsmalini: I'd love to get your review on this:
kgriffsthanks. :)19:12
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kgriffseveryone, FYI I submitted the governance patch as requested in the graduation review:
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kgriffsfolks, I was up pretty late last night, so I am going to clock out a bit earlier than usual today. Catch everyone tomorrow!20:40
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